attn. Carl, here was my question

[Guest guest]

was:Mold Testing for Safety [was: Re: air purifier and cleaning house]

> >

> > Jack,

> >

> > What you say is true but my point is " can " infect and " will " infect do not

have the same prevalence. The number of non-infectious events is still huge

compared to infectious ones.

> >

> > ...snip

>

[Guest guest]

Jeannine, thanks for reposting this. Mold fragments are not intact

spores. They a pieces of spores and pieces of the hyphae that

make up the mold growth.

Only intact spores which are still viable will be able to grow a

mold plant and reproduce by developing spores.

Think about trees and how they reproduce. Only the seeds can

grow a new tree. Trying to do so by planting a leaf, a twig, a piece

of bark won't work. You need the seed. And then you need right

type of soil plus moisture.

Not all mold spores can live and reproduce inside the body.

Some species of Aspergillus can, however, which is why

aspergillosus is a big topic and not " cladispordosus " (made up

word because there is no such thing).

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

was:Mold Testing for Safety [was: Re: air purifier and cleaning house]

> >

> > Jack,

> >

> > What you say is true but my point is " can " infect and " will " infect do not

have the same prevalence. The number of non-infectious events is still huge

compared to infectious ones.

> >

> > ...snip

>

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[Guest guest]

I get what your saying Carl.

not that this relates but actually you can root a tree limb or a plant stem if

you cut it below the joint,it can root from the joint, use to be into all that

stuff pretty heavy.

>

> Jeannine, thanks for reposting this. Mold fragments are not intact

> spores. They a pieces of spores and pieces of the hyphae that

> make up the mold growth.

>

> Only intact spores which are still viable will be able to grow a

> mold plant and reproduce by developing spores.

>

> Think about trees and how they reproduce. Only the seeds can

> grow a new tree. Trying to do so by planting a leaf, a twig, a piece

> of bark won't work. You need the seed. And then you need right

> type of soil plus moisture.

>

> Not all mold spores can live and reproduce inside the body.

> Some species of Aspergillus can, however, which is why

> aspergillosus is a big topic and not " cladispordosus " (made up

> word because there is no such thing).

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>

[Guest guest]

You're right but not all trees or other plants will do so. Same for

mold. Perhaps some roots could continue to grow with sufficient

dampness and nutrients and then form a colony to generate

spores. I'm not familiar with this but maybe someone else is.

Also, because you said " fragments " I limited my response to

pieces of dessicated biomass.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

I get what your saying Carl.

not that this relates but actually you can root a tree limb or a plant stem if

you cut it below the joint,it can root from the joint, use to be into all that

stuff pretty heavy.

>

> Jeannine, thanks for reposting this. Mold fragments are not intact

> spores. They a pieces of spores and pieces of the hyphae that

> make up the mold growth.

>

> Only intact spores which are still viable will be able to grow a

> mold plant and reproduce by developing spores.

>

> Think about trees and how they reproduce. Only the seeds can

> grow a new tree. Trying to do so by planting a leaf, a twig, a piece

> of bark won't work. You need the seed. And then you need right

> type of soil plus moisture.

>

> Not all mold spores can live and reproduce inside the body.

> Some species of Aspergillus can, however, which is why

> aspergillosus is a big topic and not " cladispordosus " (made up

> word because there is no such thing).

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>

----------

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[Guest guest]

Carl you trigered a memory of something I read about phygocytosis and them not

being big enough so sometimes leave the roots,sprouts behind and I'm thinking

that was enough for possable regrowth.

so that may be a possablity.

>

> You're right but not all trees or other plants will do so. Same for

> mold. Perhaps some roots could continue to grow with sufficient

> dampness and nutrients and then form a colony to generate

> spores. I'm not familiar with this but maybe someone else is.

>

> Also, because you said " fragments " I limited my response to

> pieces of dessicated biomass.

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>

[Guest guest]

Carl, did a little looking, came across these, look interesting.

read a little on the first one, I think co-infection, probaly bacterial in WDB

might be one of the main reasons for colonization but I still think damage to

the sinus mucosa,airway, mucosal linings, and tissue damage play a big role in

colonization.

I really do think it's possable to have a fungal blood infection going on during

WDB exposures that our immune systems might deal with after vacating but some

who experience mucoal and tissue damage may be more prone to colonization, just

my thoughts.

Gene expression profiling of monocytes displaying herpes simplex virus 1 induced

dysregulation of antifungal defences

Despite the increasing number of clinical reports on polymicrobial infections,

little is known about the mutual interactions likely occurring among

co-infecting pathogens and about their synergistic or antagonistic effects.

Pathogen-to-pathogen interactions take place, directly and/or indirectly, and in

turn, whenever they disturb host cell functions they may exacerbate the outcome

of the infectious diseases

Because of their role as the first-line defence against fungi, any dysfunction

of macrophages is likely to be crucial in the evolution of mycoses.

By an in vitro model, we have previously shown that in the course of mixed

infections by viruses and fungi, viral infection of macrophages can alter their

antifungal response. In particular, the THP-1 monocytic cell line exposed in

vitro to HHV-6 (Cermelli et al., 2006) or HSV-1 (Cermelli et al., 2008), or to a

transmissible cytotoxic activity (Beretti et al., 2007), shows dysregulation of

antifungal defences. In all cases, phagocytosis of either Cryptococcus

neoformans or C. albicans is significantly increased, but killing of the

ingested fungi is markedly impaired, as proven by fungal survival and

replication inside the macrophages.

http://jmm.sgmjournals.org/cgi/content/full/58/10/1283

The Early Transcriptional Response of Human Granulocytes to

Infection with Candida albicans Is Not Essential for Killing but

Reflects Cellular Communications

http://iai.asm.org/cgi/reprint/75/3/1493.pdf

> >

> > You're right but not all trees or other plants will do so. Same for

> > mold. Perhaps some roots could continue to grow with sufficient

> > dampness and nutrients and then form a colony to generate

> > spores. I'm not familiar with this but maybe someone else is.

> >

> > Also, because you said " fragments " I limited my response to

> > pieces of dessicated biomass.

> >

> > Carl Grimes

> > Healthy Habitats LLC

> >

>

[Guest guest]

What happens inside the body (digestive, respiratory, organs,

skin, etc) can be very different from what happens outside the

body (in both the natural and the built environment). The same

principles of science apply but each environment and micro-

environment supports and limits a different mix of micro-

organisms and their interplay with the genetics.

We have to remember that inside the body is not mold free,

bacteria free, or virus free. It's not often even cancer free (of

individual cells, not of the tumors). The number of those

organisms in and on the body at all times is estimated to be 10

times the number of cells in our body.

As with the outdoor environment, there are all kinds of " things " all

the time. What determines which grows and which doesn't is the

specific environmental conditons at any particular time.

I know we all want certainty and order but it really isn't there. We

have patterns and trends. The way to manage the built

environment (indoors) is to keep it clean and dry.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

Carl you trigered a memory of something I read about phygocytosis and them not

being big enough so sometimes leave the roots,sprouts behind and I'm thinking

that was enough for possable regrowth.

so that may be a possablity.

>

> You're right but not all trees or other plants will do so. Same for

> mold. Perhaps some roots could continue to grow with sufficient

> dampness and nutrients and then form a colony to generate

> spores. I'm not familiar with this but maybe someone else is.

>

> Also, because you said " fragments " I limited my response to

> pieces of dessicated biomass.

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>

----------

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[Guest guest]

weren't we talking about the possablities of human fungal colonization?

>

> What happens inside the body (digestive, respiratory, organs,

> skin, etc) can be very different from what happens outside the

> body (in both the natural and the built environment). The same

> principles of science apply but each environment and micro-

> environment supports and limits a different mix of micro-

> organisms and their interplay with the genetics.

>

> We have to remember that inside the body is not mold free,

> bacteria free, or virus free. It's not often even cancer free (of

> individual cells, not of the tumors). The number of those

> organisms in and on the body at all times is estimated to be 10

> times the number of cells in our body.

>

> As with the outdoor environment, there are all kinds of " things " all

> the time. What determines which grows and which doesn't is the

> specific environmental conditons at any particular time.

>

> I know we all want certainty and order but it really isn't there. We

> have patterns and trends. The way to manage the built

> environment (indoors) is to keep it clean and dry.

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>

>...trimmed

[Guest guest]

You may also have been referring to a different process than

phagocytosis. This is the process with a phagocite engulfing a

bacteria. There is an excellent animation at:

http://highered.mcgraw-

hill.com/sites/0072495855/student_view0/chapter2/animation__p

hagocytosis.html

Which raises an interesting question for me. At the end the

animation shows digested bacteria " pieces " being expelled from

the phagocite but it doesn't say what it is or where it goes or how

the body may react to these waste products of the immune

system (sounds like Shoemaker territory).

Perhaps Dr Thrasher can address this.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

What happens inside the body (digestive, respiratory, organs,

skin, etc) can be very different from what happens outside the

body (in both the natural and the built environment). The same

principles of science apply but each environment and micro-

environment supports and limits a different mix of micro-

organisms and their interplay with the genetics.

We have to remember that inside the body is not mold free,

bacteria free, or virus free. It's not often even cancer free (of

individual cells, not of the tumors). The number of those

organisms in and on the body at all times is estimated to be 10

times the number of cells in our body.

As with the outdoor environment, there are all kinds of " things " all

the time. What determines which grows and which doesn't is the

specific environmental conditons at any particular time.

I know we all want certainty and order but it really isn't there. We

have patterns and trends. The way to manage the built

environment (indoors) is to keep it clean and dry.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

Carl you trigered a memory of something I read about phygocytosis and them not

being big enough so sometimes leave the roots,sprouts behind and I'm thinking

that was enough for possable regrowth.

so that may be a possablity.

>

> You're right but not all trees or other plants will do so. Same for

> mold. Perhaps some roots could continue to grow with sufficient

> dampness and nutrients and then form a colony to generate

> spores. I'm not familiar with this but maybe someone else is.

>

> Also, because you said " fragments " I limited my response to

> pieces of dessicated biomass.

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>

----------

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[Guest guest]

It's not always clear based on the types of responses to

discussions like this. For example, the specifics of biofilms differ

from inside to outside but the conversation usually mixes the two.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

weren't we talking about the possablities of human fungal colonization?

--- In , " Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...>

wrote:

>

> What happens inside the body (digestive, respiratory, organs,

> skin, etc) can be very different from what happens outside the

> body (in both the natural and the built environment). The same

> principles of science apply but each environment and micro-

> environment supports and limits a different mix of micro-

> organisms and their interplay with the genetics.

>

> We have to remember that inside the body is not mold free,

> bacteria free, or virus free. It's not often even cancer free (of

> individual cells, not of the tumors). The number of those

> organisms in and on the body at all times is estimated to be 10

> times the number of cells in our body.

>

> As with the outdoor environment, there are all kinds of " things " all

> the time. What determines which grows and which doesn't is the

> specific environmental conditons at any particular time.

>

> I know we all want certainty and order but it really isn't there. We

> have patterns and trends. The way to manage the built

> environment (indoors) is to keep it clean and dry.

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>

>...trimmed

----------

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[Guest guest]

yes Carl thats what I was thinking of, sorry.

>

> You may also have been referring to a different process than

> phagocytosis. This is the process with a phagocite engulfing a

> bacteria. There is an excellent animation at:

> http://highered.mcgraw-

> hill.com/sites/0072495855/student_view0/chapter2/animation__p

> hagocytosis.html

>

> Which raises an interesting question for me. At the end the

> animation shows digested bacteria " pieces " being expelled from

> the phagocite but it doesn't say what it is or where it goes or how

> the body may react to these waste products of the immune

> system (sounds like Shoemaker territory).

>

> Perhaps Dr Thrasher can address this.

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>