Books

[Guest guest]

>And yes, foot problems are another symptom of candida, I

>had foot odor problems but chalked it up to nylons & shoes not allowing my

feet

>to breathe - I didn't realize it, but my foot odor problem has been gone for

a

>couple of months now (I asked my husband about it this morning!!)

I didn't realize that foot odor was a symptom of candidiasis...I never had

really bad-smelling feet until this yeast thing started getting bad. No matter

how many times I wash the suckers, they still stink! It's nice to know what's

causing the odor!

Ali

foleyag@...

[Guest guest]

> Lynn Young wrote:

> Hi:

> I have been 'silent' for a while, reading everyone's posts but not

> saying much. It's been a hectic time, I've barely had time to read,

> let alone respond.

>

> I read with great interest and appreciation the many ideas, studies,

> reports and posts, and though I may not say much, it goes a long way

> to " listen in " on the list and feel not so alone in dealing with my

> daughter's arthritis.

>

> In one of the last mailings, someone mentioned a book written for

> laypeople, to understand gene manipulation. I have that one written

> down on my 'wish' list, but would like to know if anyone knows of

> other books in existence for understanding - again for us non-medical

> people - the basics of children's arthritis, the blood test results,

> what they mean, explanations of the way the various drugs work - or

> don't work? This list, the people on it, have contributed much to my

> understanding, but I still feel I'd like to know so much more - to be

> able to make better informed decisions regarding Mickey's health and

> care.

>

> Thanks,

> Lynn

> (Mickey's mom, 6yr old with systemic onset JIA [notice I've adopted

> the new international vernacular!]

Hi Lynn,

Here's a repost of a book recommendation from the past. Another good

book (specifically about JRA) is called Raising a Child With Arthritis.

The child in this book does not have systemic JRA though, so the

situations are somewhat different from what you or I are familiar with.

I don't see it on the bookshelf down here so it must be upstairs. I'm

sure you can find it at Amazon.com by the title. While you're there,

check for others like it. And if you see any other good ones, please do

let us know

~Georgina

http://www.coloradohealthnet.org/books/book_reviews.htm

Growing Up Strong: What Every Parent Should Know About Self-Concept In

Children With Long-Term Illnesses

by Burkett R. L. Company, Columbia, South Carolina, 1999.

Reviewed by Janet , M.I.L.S

One would think that all children should grow up strong and healthy.

However, as Burkett tells in her book, children with chronic health

conditions may not. Ms. Burkett is a pediatric nurse whose son has a

long-term illness. She provides a heartfelt, first hand understanding of

how chronically ill children are affected by their health conditions.

This is a primer to teach parents or family members how children may

perceive their illnesses. It describes ways in which children can learn

to look at their conditions in a positive light, albeit under difficult

circumstances. The book provides examples of how to explain illnesses,

medical tests and surgeries in terms that children can understand. Ms.

Burkett also describes how a child's illness can affect the other

children in the family. Her experiences will make other families realize

that they are not alone.

Growing Up Strong is easy reading because it is not filled with medical

or technical jargon. It is also non-disease specific so parents of

children with asthma, cancer, or other diagnoses will find the

information in this book helpful. Anyone who lives with a chronically

ill child will learn from Ms. Burkett's book.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

GROWING UP STRONG is a truly unique resource for parents of children

with long-term illnesses and the professionals who help to care for

these special kids! It is not specific to one particular illness or

condition, but looks at the challenges that are shared by all children

living with special health needs. Its pages are filled with information,

but perhaps more importantly, with practical suggestions on helping

children to grow positively through their own unique circumstances.

After reading this book, both parents and professionals will see

long-term illness in childhood in a whole new light.

GROWING UP STRONG is one of those rare books you wish would never end!

[Guest guest]

Lynn

hi

i have started calling the arthritis place here in atlanta to get any info

for teachers

so i will be prepared this comeing school year i think if the teachers took

time to

look for info they would better understand the children they teach

so every teacher gets the info who teaches melissa

also i think its good to write or print out any info and web sites for each

teacher

teachers HAVE to know how to use a COMPUTER i think or is the USA behind in

that to lololol theres so much info on here that teachers should know how

to use one i have learned more from being online than i have in years

Robbin

[Guest guest]

There are several on Amazon. I bought two, they arrived next day!

Lee

[Guest guest]

Thanks Lee.

I'll take a look at amazon later today

[Guest guest]

>> Anyone > interested in these aspectes of treatment might want to refer to

>>these books.

I would love to get a hold of Kelley's book: One Answer to Cancer but it is

not available to order. If anyone knows where I might get a copy, I would

really appreciate it.

[Guest guest]

Hi Moria,

Thanks for the letting us know about these great books. I am reading to

many to list:>) A good one is Enzyme Cure by Lee also Beyond Probiotics

and you can get that one out of your healthfood store......Tonya

[Guest guest]

Your Body's Many Cries for Water by F. Batmanghelidj, MD

Energy Medicine by Donna Eden, Feinstein

[Guest guest]

Elaine, here is information on the two books I've used. What part of the country do you live in (answer only if you don't mind. Just curious, no reason.)

Harper, AIH 5/00, 57

Here are the books I spoke of.  Others in the group also have recommended the first book, by Palmer.  Both are under $20, available through Amazon.com if you can't find them locally.  My child, now grown, has been ill for ten years, so I have some small idea of your pain.

Palmer, M.D:  "Guide to Hepatitis Liver Disease - What You Need to Know" ISBN 0-89529-922-4.  Written with the needs of the non-medical user in mind, but loaded with information.

J. Worman, M.D:  "Liver Disorders Sourcebook" ISBN 0-7373-0090-6.  This book has a more academic tone but is quite readable by non-professionals.

[Guest guest]

> Hi Everybody,

>

> I was just wondering if anybody knows if there is any books

covering Achondroplasia and Spinal Stenosis.

>

> Thanks

>

>

I don't have reference to any books specifically on the subject, but

here are 3 web links you might want to check out:

http://www.spinalstenosis.org/

http://www.spine-health.com/dir/spinsten.html

(Very Good - Requires Shockwave which will download automatically if

you don't already have it. This is an interactive page that explains

stenosis with diagrams and pictures. Shockwave takes about 10

minutes to download on a dial-up connection.)

http://thatsdandy.com/fischgrund.html

Hope these are helpful...

Maurice

[Guest guest]

Also add:

Facing Autism by Lyn Hamilton

Special Diets for Special Kids by

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Thank you, Thank you, thank you ALL! .keep them coming ..this is great!

----- Original Message -----

From: " Sovern " <meanna_iamme@...>

Also add:

Facing Autism by Lyn Hamilton

Special Diets for Special Kids by

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Pervasive Developmental Disorders: Finding a Diagnosis and Getting

Help by Mitzi Waltz

Excellent for someone who has just gotten the diagnosis- kindof like

PDD 101-

gives an overview of all the various treatments and theories out

there about autism- published February of 2000- doesn't really pass

judgement about any paticular treatment- but gives you a very

thorough description- really helped me pinpoint some areas to look

into- it was the first book I got when we received my son's diagnosis

over two years ago and it has been invaluable.

Kay

> Also add:

>

> Facing Autism by Lyn Hamilton

> Special Diets for Special Kids by

>

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

I don't know if this book has been mentioned yet, but it helped me to

understand the different terminology associated with autism and the various

therapies out there: " Children with Autism " edited by D. Powers.

>From: " kaydykes " <kaydykes@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: [ ] Re: Books

>Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 21:25:03 -0000

>

>

>Pervasive Developmental Disorders: Finding a Diagnosis and Getting

>Help by Mitzi Waltz

>

>Excellent for someone who has just gotten the diagnosis- kindof like

>PDD 101-

>gives an overview of all the various treatments and theories out

>there about autism- published February of 2000- doesn't really pass

>judgement about any paticular treatment- but gives you a very

>thorough description- really helped me pinpoint some areas to look

>into- it was the first book I got when we received my son's diagnosis

>over two years ago and it has been invaluable.

>Kay

>

>

> > Also add:

> >

> > Facing Autism by Lyn Hamilton

> > Special Diets for Special Kids by

> >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

At 04:22 PM 2/24/2002 -0500, you wrote:

>Thank you, Thank you, thank you ALL! .keep them coming ..this is great!

>

I've heard that the free book from Kirkman's (about gut issues and

austism) is really good. I haven't read it....

[Guest guest]

Hello Kendra:

Glad to hear that we did not scare you away. Here is an email written by

Moria that reviews the book. I hope that it proves beneficial to you.

In Christ's love and mine...Jen : )

From: Moria Merriweather <moriam@e...>

Date: Mon Nov 12, 2001 10:14 am

Subject: book review: Cave MD: What Your Doctor May NOT Tell

You About Children's Vaccinations

Dear listmates,

I promised that I would write up some comments on Dr. Cave's

book, and I'm overdue. I finished reading the 1st half of the

book a few weeks ago (maybe more). (I'll explain about

why I'm not reading the 2nd half later here.)

First, the book I'm talking about is:

What Your Doctor May NOT Tell You About Children's Vaccinations

Cave, MD, FAAFP with Deborah

For ISBN number etc:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0446677078/qid%3D999931913/002-428

602

4-4112064

(make sure you get that WHOLE url-- or use the BOOKMARK in the

BOOKMARKS section on the website-- goes to same place-- amazon.)

Second: you may forward this review elsewhere as you wish,

to individuals or lists. In case you do, I shall say here

that this review is being posted on the " autism treatment "

list, on groups. For infomation see:

These are my personal comments, and in no way represent anyone

else, or the list in general!

Dr. Cave is well known to many who read this list, but, in

case you don't know her, she is in practice along with Dr. Amy

Holmes, in Baton Rouge Louisiana. Their practice specializes in

kids with autism specturm disorders. Both do chelation of

heavy metals. A number of parents on this list see Dr. Amy

(who is called " Dr. Amy " not " Dr. Holmes " , as far as I have

heard.)

Okay, now about the content of the book:

It is NOT a general book about autism.

It is NOT about mercury chelation and how to do it.

It IS about vaccines, in detail.

It includes quite a lot about the connections between vaccines

and autism, mercury poisoning, and autoimmune diseases.

It is a FABULOUS introductory book for someone trying to understand

that there *could* be a connection between ASD and vaccinations.

It is a FABULOUS book to give to people concerned with ASD who

are NOT aware of any connection to vaccinations. It would also

serve well as a book to give to you family, your kids' teachers,

or other people in your life whom you would like to get some

idea about POSSIBILITY that there is a connection between

autism, mercury, and vaccines.

One of my main reactions to the book was to just feel relieved

and overjoyed to see the basic info spelled out. I think anyone

who has been through the mill with " skeptics " and has been in

the position of trying to explain how REASONABLE the mercury

- vaccine - autism connection is will experience some real joy

in reading the book. It is there in print, written by a doctor

fer-crying-out-loud, and everything in the book says that the

connection between vaccines and ASD/automimmune diseases is

both plausible and real. The book covers a lot of things

that make me smile: for example, there is a section called

" How to protect your child from mercury poisoning " . Gotta

love it. The whole book really takes the position that

ther are many risks with vaccinations, that the risks are

real, and that this should not go unquestioned. She

presents lots of evidence, and I like that the tone is

" not defensive " .

Here is " the lay of the land " : the book has 3 overall secions:

--Part one (several chapters): info on the history of vaccines,

how they work,

how they are tested, toxic ingredients, " the controversy

surrounging the use of mercury (thimerosal) in vaccines

and how concerned individuals are working to get it removed

from all vaccines " , and " the most common medical conditions

associated with vaccine use, including autism and other

neurological disorders such as learning disabilities and

attention deficit disorder; and autoimmune disorders, including

diabetes, asthma, rheumatoid arthritis, and others "

Each section has a little summary at the end called " Bottom

Line " . This would be good for people who just want the main

point very quickly. There are a number of little " sidebar "

stories in the book of real families with vaccine injuries,

some quite horrific (which I think is her point!)

--Part two: separate chapters on each of the mandated vaccines:

hep B, DTP/DTaP, Hib, polio, MMR and varicella (chicken pox).

" Each chapter explains the benefits and risks of the vaccine,

the disease(s) it is designed to prevent, the side effects,

who should and should not get the vaccine,... " There is also

a chapter on other vaccines (besides the mandated ones), and

a chapter on new vaccines under development.

--Also in Part 2: tools and resources; how to apply for exemption

from vaccination; checklist of questions to ask prior to

vaccination; VAERS, and a list of some organizations etc.

==============================================================

Now, in a bit more detail, here are some notes:

From Chapter 1 " bottom line " : " I am not suggesting that we

return to the days without vaccines. But we must seriously

address what appears to be an obvious link between the

epidemic of developmental delays, autoimmune diseases, and

the increasing number of mandatory vaccines. "

From Chapter 2: " Urnovitz, PhD, a microbiologist and

founder of the Chronic Illness Research Foundation in Berkeley,

California, argues that the federal government keeps insisting

that 'there's no scientific evidence to prove that vaccines

cause chronic diseases, but they won't fund any research in

that area either. If you don't look for something, you won't

find it.' "

A little note regarding Senator Dan Burton--- I knew that

he has a autistic grandson-- but learned that he " has

two grandchildren who had adverse reactions to vaccines.

His granddaughter nearly died after receiving a hepatitis

B vaccine, and her brother became autistic, he has stated,

after being injected with nine different vaccines on the

same day. "

In addition to lots of details about the problems with " multiple

dosing " , I like that Cave includes that multiple dosing is

a real problem for military veterans (who have often been

vaccinated a lot.) I think including other cases (like

adults in the military) is extremely useful- and helps ground

the ideas.

Likewise I appreciate that Cave refers to autism and

" other neurological disorders such as

learning disabilites and attention deficit disorder " . I'm glad

to see ADD, ADHD etc included. This seemed to carry through

the book.

Chapter 3 deals with mercury specifically. It includes info on

how " thimerosal-free " vaccines may still be MADE with mercury.

Here is another taste of her position: " Not until all vaccines

are thimerosal-free; not until all vaccines are adequately tested;

not until parents are made fully aware of all their options, and

their right to refuse vaccines; not until immunization schedules

are allowed to fit the uniqueness of the child rather than the

child being made to fit the chart will we begin to truly protect

the health of our children. "

She discusses lots of other stuff about mercury, of course.

I like that she includes mercury passed to developing babies

and in breastmilk, and other sources of mercury in addition

to vaccines. Again, I feel this puts things in a broader

(and appropriate) context.

There is a VERY general (and brief) description of mercury

screening and detox for kids with autism & other neurological

disorders (telling about what she does this in her practice).

" The neurological changes that occur in these children are

remarkable and are evident with each dose of the DMSA that we

give them. " This is VERY general-- again, this is NOT a

book about chelation.

Chapter 3 is where there is the section on " How to protect

your child from mercury poisoning " .

Chapter 4 " The Autism Debate " . Again, I appreciate that she

includes ADD, ADHD, dyslexia, and learning disorders in the

discussion. The famous " comparison chart " of symptoms of

autism and merc poisoning is on page 63- 64. Lots of stats

about autism, etc. Again, inclusion of mercury passed to

developing child--- that the mother's mercury status matters.

Info about a study done in which some women received " live "

viruses shortly after giving birth, and also breastfed

thier babies. Of 25 women who got live viruses shortly

after the birth, 20 children ASD, 3 children had allergies,

and one has cerebral palsy.

Again, some text about how she treats ASD kids, but not

in huge detail (it is a couple of pages). Again, I like

her " broad inclusive " approach to the mercury issue:

" I believe these children have been poisoned by mercury

from various sources, including directly through

injectins of vaccines (hepatitus B, DTP, and Hib) and

indirectly throught the placenta and breast milk through

the mother's diet (fish), amalgam fillings, environmental

exposure ... and for Rh negative mothers, the use of

Rho(D) ... "

From " bottom line " for chapter 4: " Autism is complex disorder,

and so, it appears, are the factors that may cause it. Whether

it's the MMR vaccine, the mercury in DTP/DTaP and hepatitis B,

the pertussis portion of DTP, a combination of all three, or

a factor yet to be uncovered, a link between vaccines and

autism seems to grow clearer and clearer as evidence mounts.

There is also an apparent association between asutism and

autoimmune disorders, as the majority of autistic children

also have gastointestinal problems, asthma, allergies or

other autoimmune diseases. "

Chapter 4: When the Body Attacks Itself: Autoimmune Disorders.

I learned a lot from reading this. I did not know that there

is a big connection between vaccination and autoimmunne

diseases. Info on studies of this. Section about GI disorders

and relation to vaccines and autism-- Wakefield's

work is discussed. Sections on diabetes, asthma and allergies,

arthritis, guilan-barre syndrome, sudden infant death

syndrome. Some of the studies cited about SIDS are really

horrifying. Here is one little snippet: a study of

" ... 103 children who had dies of SIDS. More than 2/3 of them

had received their DTP vaccination before they died: 6.5%

died within 12 hrs of vaccination, 13% within 24 hrs, 26%

within 3 days, and 37, 61, and 70% within 1, 2, and 3 weeks,

respectively. "

Part II of the book (also several chapters) is about

individual vaccines. I did not read the whole thing. It

became clear that my reading rate was slowing to a crawl

(because I'm not adequately interested) so I just gave

myself permission to skip it. I did skim some of it,

and I'm sure it is packed with great information. But,

with no kids, this was not relevant enough to me to keep

me glued to the page. This is a personal consideration,

not in anyway a deficincy of the book -- but it makes

for deficiency in my commentary on this!

Each chapter in this section is about a specific vaccine.

She covers all the mandated vaccines. Includes lots of

specific info on adverse reactions, risks (for that specific

vaccines) of having it or not having it, recommendations

etc. Also chapters on " other vaccines " , future vaccines,

and then several chapters on (what I would call) resources:

==========================================================

chapter 14: Parents, the Law, and Insurance Companies

chapter 15: What You Can Do to Ensure Your Child's Safety

chapter 16: The Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System

appendix: Medical Association and Related Organizations

Organizations and Web Sites Specifically Related

to Vaccines

Glossary

Suggested Reading list

=========================================================

Again, I love seeing topics covered such as " How to

reduce reactions to vaccinations " (this is a section

heading), and " Questions to ask yourself before your

child gets vaccinated " . There is also a 2-page summary

of Dr. Cave's recommendations about vaccinations

when to have them, when to wait, doing titers first, MMR

broken into 3 parts, etc.

Overall I love the book and really recommend it. I'd like

to see one in the waiting room of every pediatrician's

office. I'd like to see more than one copy at every

agency that deals with autism.

I believe Cave strikes a reasonable " balance " : she is not

opposed to all vaccines, she sounds rational, she cites

evidence. She also says that there is a connection to

ASD and to autoimmune diseases, that parents do NOT

have to have their kids vaccinated, etc. Her explanation

of legal exemptions to vaccines seems thorough enough,

but somehow struck me as not-adequately-enthusiastic.

I'm not sure why. Same with titer test as an alternative:

they are mentioned several places, but they didn't stand

out as much as I wanted them to.

Finally, a couple of little nits I find fault with.

1. on page 74, in general overview of how she treats ASD,

she says " The hair analysis usually shows several toxic

metals, including mercury, aluminum (both found in vaccines),

arsenic, lead, and tin. "

This will contribute to the INCORRECT idea that mercury

poisoning shows up in hair tests. IT USUALLY DOESN'T

except if there is recent exposure. While the coverage

of treatment is a VERY general overview, she contributes

to a wrong idea that is of critical importance, and also

misses an opportunity to warn people about mercury's

unwillingness to be easy to detect or measure.

2. On page 76, in discussing whether autism is " can be

cured " if mercury is removed, she makes a comparison

to adults with mercury poisoning, and says: " In adults

there have been some cases in which mercury removal

has resulted in a complete reversal of neurological

symptoms. However, in these cases the adults were poisoned

by mercury after their brain was fully developed.... "

I do not think this is known. The fact that someone

has mercury poisoning as an adult does NOT preclude their

having been poisoned as a child, or many times, or

for many years, or in gestation, or as an infant, etc.

I presume that people who are mercury toxic as adults

were problably also susceptible to posioning as children.

It is quite likely that many (or most) were also exposed

to mercury as children. And, it is rather difficult

to know the amount of such exposure for any individual,

let alone for a group or class of people.

In the grand scheme, this is a VERY small point, but

it is a issue to me personally, so I noticed it.

The points she is making here are valid points--- I'm just

touchy about the implication that adults who are poisoned

were NOT poisoned UNTIL adulthood. I don't think this

is important to the book at all, and it is an assumption

I've seen elsewhere too.

Final thought: I will be buying more copies of this book.

I hope you do too.

Sorry it took me so long to get this written up--

I'd better send it now!

best regards,

Moria

On 25 Feb 2002 14:33:07 -0800 Kendra888@... writes:

Hi everyone,

I just got the book " What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Children's

Vaccinations " by Cave from the school library... but it took

about 3 weeks to get here from another library and I only have a couple

weeks left on the researching aspect of my paper. I was wondering, if

people could recommend what sections of the book they found most helpful

or contained the most information? I know there are some that cover

different types of vaccines, but I thought that there might be a

particular chapter or topic that is covered that I should be sure to

read.. thanks!

Also, I noticed that someone mentioned the book " News from the Border " by

Jane Tayler McDonnell.. I have been looking for that book for a while now

and it seems to be out of print. Can you tell me how you were able to

obtain the book or if there is a particular library that has it?

Another good book that I just finished was " Breaking Through Autism's

Barriers " by Bill . He and his family are all wonderful people and

it is a very good father's perspective.

Take care,

Kendra

-----------------------------------

Visit the Student Center Network at

http://www.studentcenter.org

[Guest guest]

Hi Kendra, Nice to hear from you again (I believe I still owe you a reply

to last mail-- sorry, I'm a bad correspondent!)

As for the book, I think once you open it, it will be easy to choose:

-- the chapter about connection between vacinnes and ASD (chapter 4 or

chapter 3 and 4 if feeling ambitious)

-- maybe the chapter about automimmune diseases too. (chapter 5)

-- the chapter about MMR (chapter 10)

Good luck finishing your paper.

best wishes,

Moria

At 02:33 PM 2/25/2002 -0800, you wrote:

>Hi everyone,

>I just got the book " What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Children's

Vaccinations " by Cave from the school library... but it took

about 3 weeks to get here from another library and I only have a couple

weeks left on the researching aspect of my paper. I was wondering, if

people could recommend what sections of the book they found most helpful or

contained the most information? I know there are some that cover different

types of vaccines, but I thought that there might be a particular chapter

or topic that is covered that I should be sure to read.. thanks!

>Also, I noticed that someone mentioned the book " News from the Border " by

Jane Tayler McDonnell.. I have been looking for that book for a while now

and it seems to be out of print. Can you tell me how you were able to

obtain the book or if there is a particular library that has it?

>

>Another good book that I just finished was " Breaking Through Autism's

Barriers " by Bill . He and his family are all wonderful people and it

is a very good father's perspective.

>

>Take care,

>Kendra

[Guest guest]

Barb that must be an amazining joy you are feeling right now. When will the

book be out and what is the name of it?? Where can it be purchased, Vicki

[Guest guest]

biological treatments for autism and pdd " sorry if this was already

mentioned...has helped us alot! also Maurice's " Let Me Hear your

Voice " very inspiring...gives a good understanding of ABA therapy. Sharon

[Guest guest]

Thanks Barb , keep us updated for sure and congratulations!!!Vicki

[Guest guest]

Just a comment on the " books " topic. My son's book of poems will be out

this fall, through Kingsley Publishers. So, just a " head's up " for

anyone who wants a 21-year old's perspective on living with autism.

Barb

(who's pretty excited and proud!)

[ ] Books

>Hi everyone,

>I just got the book " What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Children's

Vaccinations " by Cave from the school library... but it took about

3 weeks to get here from another library and I only have a couple weeks left

on the researching aspect of my paper. I was wondering, if people could

recommend what sections of the book they found most helpful or contained the

most information? I know there are some that cover different types of

vaccines, but I thought that there might be a particular chapter or topic

that is covered that I should be sure to read.. thanks!

>Also, I noticed that someone mentioned the book " News from the Border " by

Jane Tayler McDonnell.. I have been looking for that book for a while now

and it seems to be out of print. Can you tell me how you were able to

obtain the book or if there is a particular library that has it?

>

>Another good book that I just finished was " Breaking Through Autism's

Barriers " by Bill . He and his family are all wonderful people and it

is a very good father's perspective.

>

>Take care,

>Kendra

>

>

>-----------------------------------

>Visit the Student Center Network at

>http://www.studentcenter.org

>

>

>=======================================================

>

[Guest guest]

Barb,

Wow! What will the title be? My son (7) recited his poem in school today!

JoAnne

Barb Romkema wrote:

> Just a comment on the " books " topic. My son's book of poems will be out

> this fall, through Kingsley Publishers. So, just a " head's up " for

> anyone who wants a 21-year old's perspective on living with autism.

> Barb

> (who's pretty excited and proud!)

> [ ] Books

>

> >Hi everyone,

> >I just got the book " What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Children's

> Vaccinations " by Cave from the school library... but it took about

> 3 weeks to get here from another library and I only have a couple weeks left

> on the researching aspect of my paper. I was wondering, if people could

> recommend what sections of the book they found most helpful or contained the

> most information? I know there are some that cover different types of

> vaccines, but I thought that there might be a particular chapter or topic

> that is covered that I should be sure to read.. thanks!

> >Also, I noticed that someone mentioned the book " News from the Border " by

> Jane Tayler McDonnell.. I have been looking for that book for a while now

> and it seems to be out of print. Can you tell me how you were able to

> obtain the book or if there is a particular library that has it?

> >

> >Another good book that I just finished was " Breaking Through Autism's

> Barriers " by Bill . He and his family are all wonderful people and it

> is a very good father's perspective.

> >

> >Take care,

> >Kendra

> >

> >

> >-----------------------------------

> >Visit the Student Center Network at

> >http://www.studentcenter.org

> >

> >

> >=======================================================

> >

[Guest guest]

I'll let you know when I have all the details. (Boy, will I let you

know!!!!) Sorry, it goes with being a parent, I guess.

Barb

Re: [ ] Books

>Barb that must be an amazining joy you are feeling right now. When will the

>book be out and what is the name of it?? Where can it be purchased, Vicki

>

>

>=======================================================

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks so much for the suggestions and the support Moria.. and no

problem about not replying to last mail.. you do enough for the list

already without feeling obligated to repond to me individually..

Take care,

Kendra

> >Hi everyone,

> >I just got the book " What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About

Children's

> Vaccinations " by Cave from the school library... but it

took

> about 3 weeks to get here from another library and I only have a

couple

> weeks left on the researching aspect of my paper. I was wondering,

if

> people could recommend what sections of the book they found most

helpful or

> contained the most information? I know there are some that cover

different

> types of vaccines, but I thought that there might be a particular

chapter

> or topic that is covered that I should be sure to read.. thanks!

> >Also, I noticed that someone mentioned the book " News from the

Border " by

> Jane Tayler McDonnell.. I have been looking for that book for a

while now

> and it seems to be out of print. Can you tell me how you were able

to

> obtain the book or if there is a particular library that has it?

> >

> >Another good book that I just finished was " Breaking Through

Autism's

> Barriers " by Bill . He and his family are all wonderful

people and it

> is a very good father's perspective.

> >

> >Take care,

> >Kendra

[Guest guest]

Jen,

Thanks so much for reposting this for my benefit.. it is just

wonderful.. thanks Moria for writing this review!!!

Take care,

Kendra

> Hello Kendra:

>

> Glad to hear that we did not scare you away. Here is an email

written by

> Moria that reviews the book. I hope that it proves beneficial to

you.

>

> In Christ's love and mine...Jen : )

>

> From: Moria Merriweather <moriam@e...>

> Date: Mon Nov 12, 2001 10:14 am

> Subject: book review: Cave MD: What Your Doctor May NOT

Tell

> You About Children's Vaccinations

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Dear listmates,

>

> I promised that I would write up some comments on Dr. Cave's

> book, and I'm overdue. I finished reading the 1st half of the

> book a few weeks ago (maybe more). (I'll explain about

> why I'm not reading the 2nd half later here.)

>

> First, the book I'm talking about is:

> What Your Doctor May NOT Tell You About Children's Vaccinations

> Cave, MD, FAAFP with Deborah

> For ISBN number etc:

> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0446677078/qid%

3D999931913/002-428

> 602

> 4-4112064

> (make sure you get that WHOLE url-- or use the BOOKMARK in the

> BOOKMARKS section on the website-- goes to same place-- amazon.)

>

> Second: you may forward this review elsewhere as you wish,

> to individuals or lists. In case you do, I shall say here

> that this review is being posted on the " autism treatment "

> list, on groups. For infomation see:

>

> These are my personal comments, and in no way represent anyone

> else, or the list in general!

>

> Dr. Cave is well known to many who read this list, but, in

> case you don't know her, she is in practice along with Dr. Amy

> Holmes, in Baton Rouge Louisiana. Their practice specializes in

> kids with autism specturm disorders. Both do chelation of

> heavy metals. A number of parents on this list see Dr. Amy

> (who is called " Dr. Amy " not " Dr. Holmes " , as far as I have

> heard.)

>

> Okay, now about the content of the book:

>

> It is NOT a general book about autism.

> It is NOT about mercury chelation and how to do it.

> It IS about vaccines, in detail.

> It includes quite a lot about the connections between vaccines

> and autism, mercury poisoning, and autoimmune diseases.

> It is a FABULOUS introductory book for someone trying to understand

> that there *could* be a connection between ASD and vaccinations.

> It is a FABULOUS book to give to people concerned with ASD who

> are NOT aware of any connection to vaccinations. It would also

> serve well as a book to give to you family, your kids' teachers,

> or other people in your life whom you would like to get some

> idea about POSSIBILITY that there is a connection between

> autism, mercury, and vaccines.

>

> One of my main reactions to the book was to just feel relieved

> and overjoyed to see the basic info spelled out. I think anyone

> who has been through the mill with " skeptics " and has been in

> the position of trying to explain how REASONABLE the mercury

> - vaccine - autism connection is will experience some real joy

> in reading the book. It is there in print, written by a doctor

> fer-crying-out-loud, and everything in the book says that the

> connection between vaccines and ASD/automimmune diseases is

> both plausible and real. The book covers a lot of things

> that make me smile: for example, there is a section called

> " How to protect your child from mercury poisoning " . Gotta

> love it. The whole book really takes the position that

> ther are many risks with vaccinations, that the risks are

> real, and that this should not go unquestioned. She

> presents lots of evidence, and I like that the tone is

> " not defensive " .

>

> Here is " the lay of the land " : the book has 3 overall secions:

>

> --Part one (several chapters): info on the history of vaccines,

> how they work,

> how they are tested, toxic ingredients, " the controversy

> surrounging the use of mercury (thimerosal) in vaccines

> and how concerned individuals are working to get it removed

> from all vaccines " , and " the most common medical conditions

> associated with vaccine use, including autism and other

> neurological disorders such as learning disabilities and

> attention deficit disorder; and autoimmune disorders, including

> diabetes, asthma, rheumatoid arthritis, and others "

>

> Each section has a little summary at the end called " Bottom

> Line " . This would be good for people who just want the main

> point very quickly. There are a number of little " sidebar "

> stories in the book of real families with vaccine injuries,

> some quite horrific (which I think is her point!)

>

> --Part two: separate chapters on each of the mandated vaccines:

> hep B, DTP/DTaP, Hib, polio, MMR and varicella (chicken pox).

> " Each chapter explains the benefits and risks of the vaccine,

> the disease(s) it is designed to prevent, the side effects,

> who should and should not get the vaccine,... " There is also

> a chapter on other vaccines (besides the mandated ones), and

> a chapter on new vaccines under development.

>

> --Also in Part 2: tools and resources; how to apply for exemption

> from vaccination; checklist of questions to ask prior to

> vaccination; VAERS, and a list of some organizations etc.

> ==============================================================

>

> Now, in a bit more detail, here are some notes:

>

> From Chapter 1 " bottom line " : " I am not suggesting that we

> return to the days without vaccines. But we must seriously

> address what appears to be an obvious link between the

> epidemic of developmental delays, autoimmune diseases, and

> the increasing number of mandatory vaccines. "

>

> From Chapter 2: " Urnovitz, PhD, a microbiologist and

> founder of the Chronic Illness Research Foundation in Berkeley,

> California, argues that the federal government keeps insisting

> that 'there's no scientific evidence to prove that vaccines

> cause chronic diseases, but they won't fund any research in

> that area either. If you don't look for something, you won't

> find it.' "

>

> A little note regarding Senator Dan Burton--- I knew that

> he has a autistic grandson-- but learned that he " has

> two grandchildren who had adverse reactions to vaccines.

> His granddaughter nearly died after receiving a hepatitis

> B vaccine, and her brother became autistic, he has stated,

> after being injected with nine different vaccines on the

> same day. "

>

> In addition to lots of details about the problems with " multiple

> dosing " , I like that Cave includes that multiple dosing is

> a real problem for military veterans (who have often been

> vaccinated a lot.) I think including other cases (like

> adults in the military) is extremely useful- and helps ground

> the ideas.

>

> Likewise I appreciate that Cave refers to autism and

> " other neurological disorders such as

> learning disabilites and attention deficit disorder " . I'm glad

> to see ADD, ADHD etc included. This seemed to carry through

> the book.

>

> Chapter 3 deals with mercury specifically. It includes info on

> how " thimerosal-free " vaccines may still be MADE with mercury.

> Here is another taste of her position: " Not until all vaccines

> are thimerosal-free; not until all vaccines are adequately tested;

> not until parents are made fully aware of all their options, and

> their right to refuse vaccines; not until immunization schedules

> are allowed to fit the uniqueness of the child rather than the

> child being made to fit the chart will we begin to truly protect

> the health of our children. "

>

> She discusses lots of other stuff about mercury, of course.

> I like that she includes mercury passed to developing babies

> and in breastmilk, and other sources of mercury in addition

> to vaccines. Again, I feel this puts things in a broader

> (and appropriate) context.

>

> There is a VERY general (and brief) description of mercury

> screening and detox for kids with autism & other neurological

> disorders (telling about what she does this in her practice).

> " The neurological changes that occur in these children are

> remarkable and are evident with each dose of the DMSA that we

> give them. " This is VERY general-- again, this is NOT a

> book about chelation.

>

> Chapter 3 is where there is the section on " How to protect

> your child from mercury poisoning " .

>

> Chapter 4 " The Autism Debate " . Again, I appreciate that she

> includes ADD, ADHD, dyslexia, and learning disorders in the

> discussion. The famous " comparison chart " of symptoms of

> autism and merc poisoning is on page 63- 64. Lots of stats

> about autism, etc. Again, inclusion of mercury passed to

> developing child--- that the mother's mercury status matters.

> Info about a study done in which some women received " live "

> viruses shortly after giving birth, and also breastfed

> thier babies. Of 25 women who got live viruses shortly

> after the birth, 20 children ASD, 3 children had allergies,

> and one has cerebral palsy.

>

> Again, some text about how she treats ASD kids, but not

> in huge detail (it is a couple of pages). Again, I like

> her " broad inclusive " approach to the mercury issue:

> " I believe these children have been poisoned by mercury

> from various sources, including directly through

> injectins of vaccines (hepatitus B, DTP, and Hib) and

> indirectly throught the placenta and breast milk through

> the mother's diet (fish), amalgam fillings, environmental

> exposure ... and for Rh negative mothers, the use of

> Rho(D) ... "

>

>

> From " bottom line " for chapter 4: " Autism is complex disorder,

> and so, it appears, are the factors that may cause it. Whether

> it's the MMR vaccine, the mercury in DTP/DTaP and hepatitis B,

> the pertussis portion of DTP, a combination of all three, or

> a factor yet to be uncovered, a link between vaccines and

> autism seems to grow clearer and clearer as evidence mounts.

> There is also an apparent association between asutism and

> autoimmune disorders, as the majority of autistic children

> also have gastointestinal problems, asthma, allergies or

> other autoimmune diseases. "

>

> Chapter 4: When the Body Attacks Itself: Autoimmune Disorders.

> I learned a lot from reading this. I did not know that there

> is a big connection between vaccination and autoimmunne

> diseases. Info on studies of this. Section about GI disorders

> and relation to vaccines and autism-- Wakefield's

> work is discussed. Sections on diabetes, asthma and allergies,

> arthritis, guilan-barre syndrome, sudden infant death

> syndrome. Some of the studies cited about SIDS are really

> horrifying. Here is one little snippet: a study of

> " ... 103 children who had dies of SIDS. More than 2/3 of them

> had received their DTP vaccination before they died: 6.5%

> died within 12 hrs of vaccination, 13% within 24 hrs, 26%

> within 3 days, and 37, 61, and 70% within 1, 2, and 3 weeks,

> respectively. "

>

> Part II of the book (also several chapters) is about

> individual vaccines. I did not read the whole thing. It

> became clear that my reading rate was slowing to a crawl

> (because I'm not adequately interested) so I just gave

> myself permission to skip it. I did skim some of it,

> and I'm sure it is packed with great information. But,

> with no kids, this was not relevant enough to me to keep

> me glued to the page. This is a personal consideration,

> not in anyway a deficincy of the book -- but it makes

> for deficiency in my commentary on this!

>

> Each chapter in this section is about a specific vaccine.

> She covers all the mandated vaccines. Includes lots of

> specific info on adverse reactions, risks (for that specific

> vaccines) of having it or not having it, recommendations

> etc. Also chapters on " other vaccines " , future vaccines,

> and then several chapters on (what I would call) resources:

> ==========================================================

> chapter 14: Parents, the Law, and Insurance Companies

> chapter 15: What You Can Do to Ensure Your Child's Safety

> chapter 16: The Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System

> appendix: Medical Association and Related Organizations

> Organizations and Web Sites Specifically Related

> to Vaccines

> Glossary

> Suggested Reading list

> =========================================================

>

> Again, I love seeing topics covered such as " How to

> reduce reactions to vaccinations " (this is a section

> heading), and " Questions to ask yourself before your

> child gets vaccinated " . There is also a 2-page summary

> of Dr. Cave's recommendations about vaccinations

> when to have them, when to wait, doing titers first, MMR

> broken into 3 parts, etc.

>

> Overall I love the book and really recommend it. I'd like

> to see one in the waiting room of every pediatrician's

> office. I'd like to see more than one copy at every

> agency that deals with autism.

>

> I believe Cave strikes a reasonable " balance " : she is not

> opposed to all vaccines, she sounds rational, she cites

> evidence. She also says that there is a connection to

> ASD and to autoimmune diseases, that parents do NOT

> have to have their kids vaccinated, etc. Her explanation

> of legal exemptions to vaccines seems thorough enough,

> but somehow struck me as not-adequately-enthusiastic.

> I'm not sure why. Same with titer test as an alternative:

> they are mentioned several places, but they didn't stand

> out as much as I wanted them to.

>

> Finally, a couple of little nits I find fault with.

>

> 1. on page 74, in general overview of how she treats ASD,

> she says " The hair analysis usually shows several toxic

> metals, including mercury, aluminum (both found in vaccines),

> arsenic, lead, and tin. "

> This will contribute to the INCORRECT idea that mercury

> poisoning shows up in hair tests. IT USUALLY DOESN'T

> except if there is recent exposure. While the coverage

> of treatment is a VERY general overview, she contributes

> to a wrong idea that is of critical importance, and also

> misses an opportunity to warn people about mercury's

> unwillingness to be easy to detect or measure.

>

> 2. On page 76, in discussing whether autism is " can be

> cured " if mercury is removed, she makes a comparison

> to adults with mercury poisoning, and says: " In adults

> there have been some cases in which mercury removal

> has resulted in a complete reversal of neurological

> symptoms. However, in these cases the adults were poisoned

> by mercury after their brain was fully developed.... "

> I do not think this is known. The fact that someone

> has mercury poisoning as an adult does NOT preclude their

> having been poisoned as a child, or many times, or

> for many years, or in gestation, or as an infant, etc.

> I presume that people who are mercury toxic as adults

> were problably also susceptible to posioning as children.

> It is quite likely that many (or most) were also exposed

> to mercury as children. And, it is rather difficult

> to know the amount of such exposure for any individual,

> let alone for a group or class of people.

> In the grand scheme, this is a VERY small point, but

> it is a issue to me personally, so I noticed it.

> The points she is making here are valid points--- I'm just

> touchy about the implication that adults who are poisoned

> were NOT poisoned UNTIL adulthood. I don't think this

> is important to the book at all, and it is an assumption

> I've seen elsewhere too.

>

> Final thought: I will be buying more copies of this book.

> I hope you do too.

>

> Sorry it took me so long to get this written up--

> I'd better send it now!

> best regards,

> Moria

>

>

>

> On 25 Feb 2002 14:33:07 -0800 Kendra888@s... writes:

> Hi everyone,

> I just got the book " What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About

Children's

> Vaccinations " by Cave from the school library... but it

took

> about 3 weeks to get here from another library and I only have a

couple

> weeks left on the researching aspect of my paper. I was wondering,

if

> people could recommend what sections of the book they found most

helpful

> or contained the most information? I know there are some that cover

> different types of vaccines, but I thought that there might be a

> particular chapter or topic that is covered that I should be sure to

> read.. thanks!

> Also, I noticed that someone mentioned the book " News from the

Border " by

> Jane Tayler McDonnell.. I have been looking for that book for a

while now

> and it seems to be out of print. Can you tell me how you were able

to

> obtain the book or if there is a particular library that has it?

>

> Another good book that I just finished was " Breaking Through

Autism's

> Barriers " by Bill . He and his family are all wonderful

people and

> it is a very good father's perspective.

>

> Take care,

> Kendra

>

>

> -----------------------------------

> Visit the Student Center Network at

> http://www.studentcenter.org

>

>

>