e

[Guest guest]

I am so curious and I hope you do not mind my asking but you mentioned having had open heart surgery, did they do this when you still had implants? I am curious if they cut under them or how they go about operating on this area with implants there? Sorry don't mean to sound stupid, just curious? Did it leave any scaring? That is amazing that you have been through so much and are still around and as able to do things as you are, your an inspiration to us all and we are so happy you are here for us.

With love,

----- Original Message -----

From: e Rene

Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2002 8:01 AM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

,

There really is no answer as to what is more "evil"--bacteria or viruses. They can both be deadly, and it all depends on how our bodies respond to them. Staph is all over our skin. Just about everything we touch has Staph on it. And for this reason, our bodies have developed a natural immunity to it. Our bodies are also exposed to other bacteria and viruses daily, and again, our bodies can protect itself from severe infection. Think of all the public phones we use, the office phones we use, the public restrooms we use, our own bathrooms. They all contain microscopic bacteria and we are protected because we have a) been exposed to these bacteria and viruses so often; and are skin is intact, therefore not allowing any organisms entry into our bodies. Our skin is our largest organ in the body. It is our first line of defense against bacteria, molds, fungi, and viruses. If you were to go into a public restroom and touch the faucets to wash your hands, you are exposing yourself to thousands, if not millions, of bacteria and various viral strains. The difference is that the skin on your hands is intact, and therefore, the skin has provided an effective barrier against these "invaders."

Lets take this a step further. Say you turn on a faucet and you have a cut on your hand. That faucet was just used by someone who has a wound somewhere on their body. The wound is covered and not noticeable, and is clean. But this person's wound is colonized with Staph. They touch that faucet, and now you come along with a cut on your hand, and touch the same faucet. You've now introduced Staph into your body because your skin was not intact and was not an effective barrier.

Now, lets go a step further. Lets say you're completely healthy. Once that Staph enters your body, your body immediately sends lymphocytes to this area, and begins attacking the Staph. Your body is effective in attacking it because a) you're healthy; your body has a natural immunity, and the Staph didn't get too far into your body. But lets say that you're not healthy. Maybe you have an autoimmune disease, or you're fighting the flu, or you have a cold, or you're simply stressed out. That Staph enters your body and even though your body sends lymphocytes to attack it, the Staph is stronger because your body is taxed and simply cannot mount the fight it needs to protect itself. So, the Staph "wins" and in essence starts its travels deeper into your body, usually entering your bloodstream. Your body will continue to fight this, and eventually may be successful, and in the majority of the time, it is. But it may not be, and then you have a bacteria that goes from being relatively harmless to a potentially dangerous bacteria.

The reason bacteria, molds, fungi, viruses can make us so sick and debilitated is because it lives in our bloodstream, or finds a home in a wound or in wet, dark, moist areas, like the lungs, a overworked, fluid filled heart, the gut, or implants. It is simple microbiology that these organisms like moist, warm, dark places. Why do women get yeast infections? Because it's dark, warm, and moist. Why do surgical wounds get infected? Because they are dark, warm, and moist. Bacteria also can be aerobic or anaerobic. This means that they either need oxygen to live or they don't need oxygen to live. You can further subdivide bacteria into spore producing and non-spore producing.

Viruses are also not just simple "cold or flu" viruses. There are more than 500 viruses known to man, the majority of which don't cause disease, but some of which do and can be deadly. Take for instance, the AIDS virus. Enteroviruses. Adenoviruses. Herpes virus. AIDS is deadly. The human form of mad cow disease is deadly. A systemic herpes infection can be deadly. Cytomegalovirus can be deadly. I think that viruses can be looked at as more "severe" and "dangerous" if they are not treatable (obviously) or if they are hard to treat, such as the herpes virus. Viruses cannot be cured with antibiotics. At least we now have antivirals, but even they are not 100% effective, and the majority just put the virus in remission, or cause it to be dormant.

On the other hand, bacteria can and do kill. Infectious disease docs would be out of business if we didn't have to worry about bacteria (and viruses). Many surgeries wouldn't be done today if it weren't for infected wounds. I work in the recovery room, and we get an awful lot of surgeries for irrigation and debridement (I & D) of surgical wounds. I've also taken care of a man who was vacuuming one day, and cut himself on a piece of the vacuum. It wasn't a deep or big cut, more like a papercut. Yet, 3 days later, his hand was so swollen and painful, red and hot, that I had to go out to his house (I was an IV homecare nurse at the time) and start him on IV antibiotics. He had gone into the infectious disease doc and they had cultured some of the drng from the cut. It came back as Strep, the flesh eating bacteria. How in the world he got that in his wound we still don't know. But that infection spread up his arm so quick, that within 3 hrs after my leaving his house, he was in the ER and they were looking at having to amputate his arm! It turns out that the Strep was not receptive to the antibiotic the docs had put him on. But this is just an example of how deadly and severe bacterial infections can be. And how quickly they can spread and infect your entire body (called sepsis).

I had open heart surgery, and within 2 wks after my surgery, I knew I had an infection brewing in my sternum. I was started on Rocephin (ceftriaxone), but it kept getting worse. I ended up in the ER one Sunday, with a fever of 104, pain so severe I could barely breathe, pus draining from my chest, even though the chest was closed. There was so much pus in there, that the pressure of the pus building up was causing my healed incision to break open and the pus was leaking through. Needless to say, the infection had coursed through my body so rapidly that I was diagnosed with sepsis and was put in the ICU with the docs wondering whether I'd make it out alive. I was on triple IV antibiotics, had a PICC line placed, and eventually was sent home to do home IV antibiotic therapy with Vancomycin for 6 wks, then I was on Levaquin orally for another 6 wks. Total course of antibiotic therapy to cure this infection: 15 wks.

Because I have been on so many antibiotics for so long (for legitimate infections), whenever I've cultured out any type of bacteria, and they do a sensitivity, just about every antibiotic that bacteria normally would respond to, I don't. Vanco, Levaquin, and Rifampin are the few remaining antibiotics that my body responds to. So, I have to hope and pray that I don't develop further resistance to these antibiotics.

Mold/fungi. These are even more dangerous because we are not typically exposed to these on a daily basis, and therefore, our bodies are not used to responding to them and fighting them. Molds and fungi can require atypical treatment and unless you are being treated by an infectious disease doc, the majority of docs don't understand molds/fungi and how to treat them. So, they can be even more dangerous.

I hope this clears up some of your confusion about bacteria/viruses/molds/fungi. It is confusing, and everyone is different in the way they respond to these invaders. Some people will go a lifetime without ever experiencing a major infection even though they more than likely have been exposed to hundreds of different strains of bacteria and viruses. Other people can simply touch a faucet and become extremely ill. Also, with the advent of antibacterial everything--soaps especially, we are developing further resistant strains of bacteria. Just because something is antibacterial doesn't mean it is a good thing all the time. These antibacterial products are just allowing bacteria and viruses to mutate and develop new strains that are resistant to the antibiotics we currently have. However, the main thing to remember, is that everyone responds differently to an insult to the body. What your body may pass off as "no big deal", my body may become deathly ill and I may end up in the hospital fighting for my life.

e

----- Original Message -----

From: DanzButterflies@...

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 9:45 AM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

Dear ,

To answer your questions. My husband is German, his family is here as well, my daughter's only living grandparents...but mostly we returned to Germany because of stable work in his occupation, we were struggling in the U.S. This is my second time living in Germany, we've been here since Feb 27, 2001...so that will be a year next month. Last time we lived here together for 14 months.

I too have concerns about having implants removed in a foreign country, but I try to reassure myself that it's probably not as bad as I worry and if the doctor is fluent in English - then I can get my questions answered without being too worried about misunderstanding (hopefully).

The milk question: of course only as of recent I have thought about it. But what comes to mind at her 6-8 month point...prior to introducing her to foods outside of breastmilk her skin was absolutely fine. Then around 6 months I started to introduce some soft foods, although she was only semi-interested. But she loved pudding!! :-), applesauce, I would try offering her a variety of soft foods...Anyhow, by 8 months she had such as bad spot on her arm it was slightly bleeding. Before it got to that point, we went to a dermatologist, who did next to nothing, told us we'd have to live with it and gave us a prescription for cortisone. He also said to keep it moisturized. Well when looking for ointment, I would read the ingredients, I don't know if I read it somewhere (probably?) or it was my common sense that thought alcohol in cream cannot be good for dry, scaly skin. Everything contained the alcohol it seemed...so we went to a health food store and asked for something all natural. After speaking with the owner of the healthfood store, he told me to be wary of cortisone as it contains steroids and has a tendency to suppress the outbreaks only to have a more intensive outbreak later (he said it in different words of course). I kept this in mind and would only put the cortisone on - pretty much during the night when the itching is the worse and reduced it to only nights that itching was intense and at my wit's end to figure this out.

Something I don't understand is if bacteria is in our body already and it gets into and out of the saline implant and our bodies either cope or don't cope with the bacteria in our body already then I'm a little confused how it's going to be more worse - if it's in both places already. I have a lot of questions concerning some of the logic of the osmosis explanation. I'm not saying it's not true or anything, I just have yet to completely comprehend it. And I wonder how much bacteria we ingest through eating, drinking, breathing, touching, etc. It also seems to be from what little I know that viruses seem to be the bigger of the 2 evils. This past year my husband, daughter and self got extremely ill from eating something. They don't just provide refrigerators here or kitchens in general (rarely) in German apartments, and we went without a fridge for a month :-(. It was awful having to go grocery shopping every other day, since we couldn't 'keep' any kind of refrigerated food, and we ate out alot :-)...but that's what got us sick.

I wasn't happy with the idea that she would live with this...I researched online and found a few mothers who spoke of milk allergies (although food allergies can be controversial to in that arena - imagine that, some people have no common sense :-) anyway...I went to another more local healthfood store in search of cod liver oil and/or flax seed oil as I read on a few sites including Dr. Anrew Weil's site that it can help and again the owner gave me very important information. So I started giving her the cod liver oil and about that same time was doing trial and error with the food. When it was extremely bad to the point it blood was visible, but not really bleeding was when I withdrew all foods for until she was better...within 2 weeks her skin had improved tremendously....her skin was healing...I think I went another 2 weeks before introducing food again...it had all but completely healed...mild dry area where she was having the problem on her right inside forearm. Then hesitantly I began introducing foods excluding certain things such as wheat, corn and/or meat products. She started to get worse again....when I removed all dairy products from her diet, she improved again. However, not perfectly not 100%....then I removed almost all dairy from my diet....then she improved more. I think if it weren't for the fact that I have a tiny little milk in my coffee, it would probably be gone. But that's not going to happen, it's the one treat that helps me keep my sanity...and not worth the stress for me to stop it completely. I would hope that she weans soon. Sorry, but it's something I grappled over and that's the way it is. I don't do many other things that most parents do and realize I am not perfect and can only do so much. So if anyone wants to criticize me over this flaw, then so be it.

I am so very sorry that you experienced a horrible outcome from the implants. Thank you for your message and I hope your health improves dramatically.

Sincerely,

----- Original Message -----

From: Heer

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 4:09 PM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

I am curious about your situation, how long and how come you live in Germany? I am just wondering if I missed something while I was away.

I would be concerned about removing implants in a foreign country but there must be someone there who could do it, hopefully you will find someone.

Have you considered that your daughters allergies to milk and other little problems you mentioned might be a reaction from the breast milk? Just a thought, also I can tell you I had saline implants only 18 months and they came out fine, except the water in them had turned to a viscous gel and yellow, I am still awaiting the results of the analyzing, however I was extremely ill from these implants, almost right away, within 3 months I had achene's and then went on to develop more problems, including dizziness, numbness in my toes and fingers, fatigue, restlessness, depression, anxiety, chronic pain, and constant sore throats, and upset stomachs.

I am better now after a little over a year, but still have some health issues that I am working on, I am just so grateful to have come as far as I have, it was and is allot of hard work, and sometimes I know I should be eating better, but I am allot healthier than I was and I felt like I was on my death bed with implants.

God bless you and your family,

Love,

----- Original Message -----

From: DanzButterflies@...

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 6:33 AM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

Dear Patty,

Thank you tremendously for this referral, I look forward to hearing from someone soon.

Sincerely,

----- Original Message -----

From: Patty

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 7:11 AM

Subject: Fw: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

,Here was my reply from Ilena on a contact for you in Europe...you should behearing from someone soon if you haven't already.Take care and let us know what kind of help you get over there!Love,Patty----- Original Message -----From: "ilena rose" <ilena@...>>> I'll send this to Cosima and also give her MarLou in Hollands' # ... sheis> also very helpful.>>> One good piece of news ... the MTV Saline piece with Kristy is being> rebroadcast twice this week!>> YEAH!