e

[Guest guest]

Hi e,

Now do you understand why I've said you are a rarity? And why I've grown to admire you? You're good people e and don't ever think otherwise. If your book is half as good as your previous messages, then it will help more people than you can imagine. Follow your heart and you won't go wrong.

What your saying is true and I know it to be, first hand. Not just because of what's been done to me, but also my husband, and my father. So don't give up. We all have a purpose in this life and I believe you have found yours.

Love and Hugs............

e Rene <e_Rene@...> wrote:

Polio vaccine IS very dangerous, and if I had to be vaccinated against it now, or had a child to vaccinate, I would probably choose not to get it for myself or my child. There is an excellent book that was published about 2-3 yrs ago about the hx of the polio vaccine, mass polio vaccinations in places such as Africa and Europe, how part of the polio vaccine was derived from monkey blood, and how there were several contaminated batches of polio vaccine in the late 60's and early 70's. I can't remember the name of the book offhand, but I had it until I started travel nursing, then threw it away with the rest of my stuff. It is a very thick book, about 800 pgs long, and has on the cover a picture of a dirt road with no trees, and I believe someone is walking down the road. It doesn't just deal with polio, but with other epidemics for which there is no cure and which are very controversial, such as AIDS and how AIDS came about (lots of interesting theories, and no one really knows for sure), other controversial vaccines (meningitis, flu, chickenpox, tetanus, etc) and exposes previously "secret" stories about our flawed healthcare system and the flaws inherent in any mass production process, such as vaccines. It really is extremely interesting reading. I think it may be called "The Journey."

Even though people don't outright attack me on this board, I do feel that because I'm a RN with many yrs of varied nursing experience ranging from management to infectious disease, to critical care/ICU, to IV therapy, to homecare, to legal nurse consulting; that I do bare the brunt of peoples' malcontent with healthcare and its many flaws. I don't appreciate these "hidden" attacks, and everyone is allowed to express their opinion, as has been pointed out by many on this group. I like to know that I can provide some scientific explanations to certain things, or can express how certain issues and ideas are viewed as a RN actively practicing clinical nursing today. Or why things are done in healthcare a certain way. I like to know that I can provide some insight that otherwise you all may not have.

That said, I want you all to know that I disagree with the way our healthcare system is today. I think the way doctors practice medicine is atrocious. I think the working conditions that RN's and other healthcare providers have to endure is sickening. I think that medicine has gone way too far and crossed ethical and moral boundaries and limits. Hell, there are no limits anymore in medicine. And while I used to be so proud to be a part of the American healthcare system, I no longer am, and in fact, I'm ashamed of what medicine has become today. It's all about money and greed. Nothing matters but the almighty dollar. I remember when I first became a member of this group, I used to be so pro medicine and doctors and everything related to healthcare. No more. I say this not only as a RN seeing the atrocities that are committed on an unsuspecting public everyday, but as a pt and how the healthcare system has failed me.

At any rate, I want you all to know that I am currently working on a book about our so called "excellent" healthcare system. I am trying to expose it for all it's worth. I want the public to know that the system they think is so wonderful is ready to collapse. There are no nurses to fill the many jobs anymore; the typical hospital pt is much older and more ill than in previous yrs requiring more acute and/or critical care nursing. There are not enough hospitals with available beds to support our aging and increasingly ill population. The doctors recommend surgeries and procedures that are not only medically UNneccessary, but are dangerous as well. Everyday I hear rude comments made about pts by hospital management and administration and physicians, yet they turn around and tell them how wonderful they are and how "safe" they'll be while in the hospital. Yeah, right. Tell that to the RN who's been working for 18-20 hrs straight without a break. The list goes on and on........And I also feel that doctors unduly push certain things on us and because we have been brought up to respect and trust our doctor, we don't question him/her. This is our first big mistake.

Anyway, I hope to have the book done within the next couple of months, then hopefully will be able to get it published shortly thereafter. I am currently working with some publishing houses. In addition, I am going to submit parts of my expose to medical journals and submit it to "Glamour," "Cosmo," and also to the "New York Times." I am tired of being part of an establishment that lies, cheats, and steals from the very people who pay our (not nurses) salaries. I'm sure nothing will ever be done, but maybe some thought will go into (finally) changing our healthcare system, and stopping unethical doctors in their tracks. I may die an early death because of my CA, but I will die happy if I know that my story was made public and had some sort of impact.

I hope when this book comes out, that you all will buy a copy. I will keep you all updated on my progress.

e

----- Original Message -----

From: DanzButterflies@...

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 5:14 PM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

Patty,

Thanks for sharing your views. I agree with you...if you feel you must wait past 2 and by God, separate them...I cringe to say this....I just know that people are going to do it know matter what...once a belief system is infiltrated into the society, it is very difficult for people to fight the current even if it means their children will be harmed, they just can't accept it. Also, if they did accept it, it is difficult for many to cope with what they've injected into their children. Can you imagine? How hard it is for us to accept what some us have done to our own bodies, but to face the that we harmed our children. It already makes me feel awful about having implants and nursing, yet not completely awful for nursing...just that when I was young, I thought I would never have children and never even thought I would be nursing. Perhaps if young girls were more educated in their bodies and childbearing...they would have thoughts in another direction. I, too had measles and mumps on one side and my sister had both full - mumps and measles also. I read somewhere that by actually allowing the body to go through the diseases and develop its own antibodies that it strengthens the immune system.

I was reading on one of those sites I provided the links for that not all these diseases that kids are being injected with are that serious to warrant the deadly vaccine injection....it's very sad that we as a society. I also read somewhere (I'd have to go find it) something along the lines that the only Polio outbreaks in the U.S. since 1990 have been from vaccines. Not to mention, that vaccinated kids still continue to get the measles, etc.

Link for some vaccine facts:

http://www.access1.net/via/PROCHOICE/didyouknow.htm

Yep here's a reference to the Polio statement made above, although I believe different than the one I originally read, here they give a history of the Development of the Polio vaccine.

http://www.accessexcellence.org/AE/AEC/CC/polio.html

Please note that there are some egroups for vaccines (more than I can list here, following are a few I belong too) some very good information can be found in them.

Stopvaccines at stopvaccines/

Vaccineinfo at Vaccineinfo/

Vaccinations at Vaccinations/

---- Original Message -----

From: Patty

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 8:36 PM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

,

I am also one who believes vaccines are dangerous for children. I have posted about the dangers of vaccines before on this group, and the possible connection between the mercury based preservative, thimerosal, and the skyrocketing rates of autism in this country. I am with you...I do not vaccinate my children and I recommend for those that insist on doing so, at least to wait until the immune systems of the children have had a fighting chance to develop. That means waiting until past the age of 2. I believe the current system of injecting little babies with all kinds of foreign stuff is atrocious. Furthermore, I had both mumps and measles as a kid and I didn't think it was that bad! I think natural immunity to disease is much preferred to vaccination.

Patty

----- Original Message -----

From: DanzButterflies@...

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 9:09 AM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

Well, thanks...I guess it's so touchy with me. I have mixed feeling and thoughts about it. I go through such great extents to protect my daughter and now after 2 years I read about these type of concerns...it's a little late for me to just up and change the course, I can't reverse the past.. Besides, I still believe in my heart that was all I could do, plus I believe she benefited from the breastmilk rather than some manmade product called 'formula'. And to top it off I was not only encouraged by doctors, midwifes and the nurses, they told me it was ok. The concern at that time, was if my body could physically transport the milk to my baby...I had the incision around the nipple. I've had no trouble.

I didn't mean to sound to defensive, I've had a rough day. And this whole implant scare has put a lot of stress in my home. I got in a fight with my husband today over things like calling the doctor for me, then my daughter is fussing making it difficult to call doctors and someone on the board claims the vaccines are necessary for children and yet defends the cause of toxic implants in women. That gets me really confused about who to trust. I feel like I am in a panic and don't want to be scared into surgery. My husband managed to make 2 appointments today with English speaking plastic surgeons, so I'll need to make a list of pertinent questions. I know one of them I get a half hour for 40 Euros, the other one is 30 Euros - don't know how much time I get, but I want to be prepared.

I'm glad you are better, the stress alone without having them in must improve your health.

Love,

----- Original Message -----

From: Heer

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 5:38 PM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

I certainly am not going to criticize you on your child rearing for sure, so rest easy, I just would be concerned about breast feeding with implants, that is all, other than that I think that breast feeding is great, I am not sure I understand the whole issue of the bacteria connection either, hopefully when I get my implant analysis report back I will have a better idea of what went wrong there.

I am much better now so I think I am on the right track I certainly feel 100 times better now than I did with implants! Thank god they are gone,

More from me later I have to get to work,

Good to hear from you,

Love,

----- Original Message -----

From: DanzButterflies@...

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 9:11 AM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

Dear ,

To answer your questions. My husband is German, his family is here as well, my daughter's only living grandparents...but mostly we returned to Germany because of stable work in his occupation, we were struggling in the U.S. This is my second time living in Germany, we've been here since Feb 27, 2001...so that will be a year next month. Last time we lived here together for 14 months.

I too have concerns about having implants removed in a foreign country, but I try to reassure myself that it's probably not as bad as I worry and if the doctor is fluent in English - then I can get my questions answered without being too worried about misunderstanding (hopefully).

The milk question: of course only as of recent I have thought about it. But what comes to mind at her 6-8 month point...prior to introducing her to foods outside of breastmilk her skin was absolutely fine. Then around 6 months I started to introduce some soft foods, although she was only semi-interested. But she loved pudding!! :-), applesauce, I would try offering her a variety of soft foods...Anyhow, by 8 months she had such as bad spot on her arm it was slightly bleeding. Before it got to that point, we went to a dermatologist, who did next to nothing, told us we'd have to live with it and gave us a prescription for cortisone. He also said to keep it moisturized. Well when looking for ointment, I would read the ingredients, I don't know if I read it somewhere (probably?) or it was my common sense that thought alcohol in cream cannot be good for dry, scaly skin. Everything contained the alcohol it seemed...so we went to a health food store and asked for something all natural. After speaking with the owner of the healthfood store, he told me to be wary of cortisone as it contains steroids and has a tendency to suppress the outbreaks only to have a more intensive outbreak later (he said it in different words of course). I kept this in mind and would only put the cortisone on - pretty much during the night when the itching is the worse and reduced it to only nights that itching was intense and at my wit's end to figure this out.

Something I don't understand is if bacteria is in our body already and it gets into and out of the saline implant and our bodies either cope or don't cope with the bacteria in our body already then I'm a little confused how it's going to be more worse - if it's in both places already. I have a lot of questions concerning some of the logic of the osmosis explanation. I'm not saying it's not true or anything, I just have yet to completely comprehend it. And I wonder how much bacteria we ingest through eating, drinking, breathing, touching, etc. It also seems to be from what little I know that viruses seem to be the bigger of the 2 evils. This past year my husband, daughter and self got extremely ill from eating something. They don't just provide refrigerators here or kitchens in general (rarely) in German apartments, and we went without a fridge for a month :-(. It was awful having to go grocery shopping every other day, since we couldn't 'keep' any kind of refrigerated food, and we ate out alot :-)...but that's what got us sick.

I wasn't happy with the idea that she would live with this...I researched online and found a few mothers who spoke of milk allergies (although food allergies can be controversial to in that arena - imagine that, some people have no common sense :-) anyway...I went to another more local healthfood store in search of cod liver oil and/or flax seed oil as I read on a few sites including Dr. Anrew Weil's site that it can help and again the owner gave me very important information. So I started giving her the cod liver oil and about that same time was doing trial and error with the food. When it was extremely bad to the point it blood was visible, but not really bleeding was when I withdrew all foods for until she was better...within 2 weeks her skin had improved tremendously....her skin was healing...I think I went another 2 weeks before introducing food again...it had all but completely healed...mild dry area where she was having the problem on her right inside forearm. Then hesitantly I began introducing foods excluding certain things such as wheat, corn and/or meat products. She started to get worse again....when I removed all dairy products from her diet, she improved again. However, not perfectly not 100%....then I removed almost all dairy from my diet....then she improved more. I think if it weren't for the fact that I have a tiny little milk in my coffee, it would probably be gone. But that's not going to happen, it's the one treat that helps me keep my sanity...and not worth the stress for me to stop it completely. I would hope that she weans soon. Sorry, but it's something I grappled over and that's the way it is. I don't do many other things that most parents do and realize I am not perfect and can only do so much. So if anyone wants to criticize me over this flaw, then so be it.

I am so very sorry that you experienced a horrible outcome from the implants. Thank you for your message and I hope your health improves dramatically.

Sincerely,

----- Original Message -----

From: Heer

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 4:09 PM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

I am curious about your situation, how long and how come you live in Germany? I am just wondering if I missed something while I was away.

I would be concerned about removing implants in a foreign country but there must be someone there who could do it, hopefully you will find someone.

Have you considered that your daughters allergies to milk and other little problems you mentioned might be a reaction from the breast milk? Just a thought, also I can tell you I had saline implants only 18 months and they came out fine, except the water in them had turned to a viscous gel and yellow, I am still awaiting the results of the analyzing, however I was extremely ill from these implants, almost right away, within 3 months I had achene's and then went on to develop more problems, including dizziness, numbness in my toes and fingers, fatigue, restlessness, depression, anxiety, chronic pain, and constant sore throats, and upset stomachs.

I am better now after a little over a year, but still have some health issues that I am working on, I am just so grateful to have come as far as I have, it was and is allot of hard work, and sometimes I know I should be eating better, but I am allot healthier than I was and I felt like I was on my death bed with implants.

God bless you and your family,

Love,

----- Original Message -----

From: DanzButterflies@...

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 6:33 AM

Subject: Re: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

Dear Patty,

Thank you tremendously for this referral, I look forward to hearing from someone soon.

Sincerely,

----- Original Message -----

From: Patty

Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 7:11 AM

Subject: Fw: Fw: 10 year old saline implants

,Here was my reply from Ilena on a contact for you in Europe...you should behearing from someone soon if you haven't already.Take care and let us know what kind of help you get over there!Love,Patty----- Original Message -----From: "ilena rose" <ilena@...>>> I'll send this to Cosima and also give her MarLou in Hollands' # ... sheis> also very helpful.>>> One good piece of news ... the MTV Saline piece with Kristy is being> rebroadcast twice this week!>> YEAH!

[Guest guest]

I understand how you feel I can relate at times I get very upset and wonder also about why I am suffering with allot of pain, however I don't think that my situation now is related to the implants and once again I have been lied to by Dr's.

Please e I know that it seems so hard, but you are strong and you are so important to us that I beg of you to try to hang in there.

It can be very difficult but we must keep fighting it is so important and remember many women look up to you and value your opinion and educated insight.

Love,

----- Original Message -----

From: e Rene

Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 7:53 PM

Subject: Re: e

,

Thanks for your concern. I have thought of alternatives, but it is very difficult for me because I have a kitty. Many people would be willing to put me up until I found a new job, but then they find out I have a kitty, and they can't because they are either not animal people or are allergic to cats. I have been looking for places to rent for the past wk and while there are places, every single one of them I've contacted requires a credit check---even individuals renting a room.

, to be quite honest, I have no fight left in me. I am undergoing a bone marrow bx on Tues, and then major neck surgery on the 13th. I will find out my prognosis after Wed, my parents despise me and think I'm an embarrassment to them, and I am stuck in a career that I loathe with no other degree to fall back on. It couldn't get more hopeless. I have given up on everything. I know that this is not what the group needs to hear, but I've searched every avenue and looked at every option and alternative, and there is just no hope. The best I can hope for is that I get offered a job and can start fresh. However, the majority of employers base their decision to hire you on your credit history. Because my credit has been destroyed, I will likely never be offered a job. This is unfortunate, and I think unethical and immoral because just because my credit is bad doesn't mean that I am not a hard, dedicated worker/employee. If anything, my bad credit makes me want to work even harder to pay off existing debts (which I have decreased significantly) and to get my credit back on track. But try telling this to a perspective employer and it's like talking to a brick wall. 2 yrs ago, my credit was astounding and I could have anything I wanted. Now, because I've been so ill, everything I know and love is gone due to my credit. At any rate, I am just hoping for an early death from CA so that I can save myself from my own destructive death wishes.

Please forgive me for being so negative. There is just nothing left to live for.

e

----- Original Message -----

From: Heer

Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 2:28 PM

Subject: e

I meant to write to you sooner but I didn't have time to write a response that was appropriate for what you are going through.

I am very saddened by this news and your latest battles, I am sure to you they are very overwhelming. I know what it is like to be so poor and to have bad credit, in CA before I met my husband and when I was so sick I thought I would never be able to afford explant and never be able to afford the organic food I needed or the supplements or any kind of treatment to get well, I often times couldn't pay for certain things and had outstanding debts as well, I was forunate in that my parents had put my mobile home under their names so that I had a home, but many times I was so close to not being able to make the payments it was scary esp when I was so sick, I had no choice but to go to work as ill as I was, and I know you do this also.

however I managed to get by.

I have a couple of suggestions that maybe you may not have thought of to help your situation I am not completely clear on why you have to move, but with your career as an RN in a big hospital have you tried to find a room you could rent in someones home, maybe a collegue or someone you know, anyone that you might work with that would not be so inclined or concerned with credit reports?

There are usually always people looking to share rent on a home too, esp in the nursing field.

Have you thought about taking a travel assignment in the area, meaning maybe just a short distance from Denver?

Have you looked into a shelter where you stay temporarily until you have some money together?

There has to be someone who would let you stay with them for a short time. I am sure you are well liked by the people you work with, maybe someone from the area is on the support group or Ilenas or Lany's that could help.

Last, I would love to help any way I can if you tell me what you need, I am not saying I can work miracles or anything, but I do care and would like to be here for you as I have said many many times.

Please e no matter how hard it gets you cannot let it overcome you, you are strong and have weathered tougher storms than this.

I will pray for you and that things will be better soon. Please understand that you are well loved and respected by many, I realize that family is very important and I admit I am blessed with my family, but I do know what it feels like to be misubderstood by relatives and how hard it is.

Please e keep your chin up and try not to give up, attitude is everything for us with this hardship, it will keep you strong when you need to be if you remian positive even in the face of adversity. I know as I have been through many tough times that I thought would kill me but they didn't, you can come out on top too if you try.

Love and blessings,