RE: Health Canada Annex on Mould

April 4, 2007

Don,

Please ask Wei to explain to you how the EPA RMI works. The article you just attached has nothing to do with the EPA Relative Moldiness Index (RMI) and how well PCR testing of carpet dust correlates to sick buildings and sick people.

It has to do with biomarkers for human exposure.

Rosen, Ph.D.

www.Mold-Books.com

Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould> > > > > > Thank you, Jim, for posting this notice. It saves me the trouble> > > of posting it myself. > > > > > > It remains to be seen whether or not this notice results in an> > > increase in enquiries for mould home inspections. Time will tell!> > > > > > For the group, as noted in today's discussion, the most > interesting > > > part will be the last sentence: 'Further, in the absence of > > exposure > > > limits, results from tests for the presence of fungi in air > cannot >

> be > > > used to assess risks to the health of building occupants.' This > > topic > > > has been a subject of discussion on the various group message > > boards > > > for a while. I think that this straight-forward statement says it > > > best: microbial air sampling of any type is not recommended to > > > evaluate individual health risks. If it is used at all in an > > initial > > > building evaluation, it is intended strictly as a building > > evaluation > > > tool, to see if there may be 'hidden' mould not readily visible. > > Then> > > destructive sampling may be necessary to get at the 'hidden' > mould.> > > But the results of any air sampling are not an indication of > health> > > risks.> > > > > > All air sampling, no matter when or

where it is collected, no > > matter > > > what media or instrumentation used, is not an indication of the > > > health risks to the building occupants or the remediation firm's > > > employees. Period. Further,because the mere collection of air > > > samples, and the laboratory results of the air sampling > collected, > > > are often misinterpreted as a possible diagnostic tool for health > > > risks by the building occupants, as well as by the EC and the RC, > > the > > > use of air sampling should be limited to building evaluation. Any > > > microbial air sampling results presented should be accompanied by > > > caveat as to its limitations.> > > > > > Don> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> > ____________ __> > > Bored stiff? Loosen up... > > > Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.> > > http://games. yahoo.com/ games/front> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> ____________ __> > We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love > > (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.> > http://tv.yahoo. com/collections/ 265> >> > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _____________ __> Food fight?

Enjoy some healthy debate > in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q & A.> http://answers. yahoo.com/ dir/?link= list & sid= 396545367>

Never miss an email again!Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. Check it out.

April 4, 2007

Don,

Please ask Wei to explain to you how the EPA RMI works. The article you just attached has nothing to do with the EPA Relative Moldiness Index (RMI) and how well PCR testing of carpet dust correlates to sick buildings and sick people.

It has to do with biomarkers for human exposure.

Rosen, Ph.D.

www.Mold-Books.com

Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould> > > > > > Thank you, Jim, for posting this notice. It saves me the trouble> > > of posting it myself. > > > > > > It remains to be seen whether or not this notice results in an> > > increase in enquiries for mould home inspections. Time will tell!> > > > > > For the group, as noted in today's discussion, the most > interesting > > > part will be the last sentence: 'Further, in the absence of > > exposure > > > limits, results from tests for the presence of fungi in air > cannot >

> be > > > used to assess risks to the health of building occupants.' This > > topic > > > has been a subject of discussion on the various group message > > boards > > > for a while. I think that this straight-forward statement says it > > > best: microbial air sampling of any type is not recommended to > > > evaluate individual health risks. If it is used at all in an > > initial > > > building evaluation, it is intended strictly as a building > > evaluation > > > tool, to see if there may be 'hidden' mould not readily visible. > > Then> > > destructive sampling may be necessary to get at the 'hidden' > mould.> > > But the results of any air sampling are not an indication of > health> > > risks.> > > > > > All air sampling, no matter when or

where it is collected, no > > matter > > > what media or instrumentation used, is not an indication of the > > > health risks to the building occupants or the remediation firm's > > > employees. Period. Further,because the mere collection of air > > > samples, and the laboratory results of the air sampling > collected, > > > are often misinterpreted as a possible diagnostic tool for health > > > risks by the building occupants, as well as by the EC and the RC, > > the > > > use of air sampling should be limited to building evaluation. Any > > > microbial air sampling results presented should be accompanied by > > > caveat as to its limitations.> > > > > > Don> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> > ____________ __> > > Bored stiff? Loosen up... > > > Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.> > > http://games. yahoo.com/ games/front> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> ____________ __> > We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love > > (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.> > http://tv.yahoo. com/collections/ 265> >> > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _____________ __> Food fight?

Enjoy some healthy debate > in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q & A.> http://answers. yahoo.com/ dir/?link= list & sid= 396545367>

Never miss an email again!Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. Check it out.

April 4, 2007

" Jim H. White " wrote:

> I personally know that a toxic response to some molds is important

because I am often unable to work for days after doing IAQ

Investigations in some moldy houses. I cannot think clearly (see

Jarvis et al about people's response to some mycotoxins) and I am so

tired that I have trouble sitting up at the keyboard. Some deny this

because it has not been proven well enough to them and that is not

all that unreasonable. I do not have that option because of how

strongly I react and honesty will not let me deny my reactions, nor

others who react as I do.

>

> Jim H. White System Science Consulting

Naughty, naughty!

You're not listening to your wife!

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/iequality/message/10648

It only gets worse, you know.

-

April 5, 2007

:

As you note below, PCR analysis of carpet dust samples is what the

ERMI is about. NOT microbial air sampling, which was what Health

Canada is talking about. And the ERMI relates the PCR analyses of

carpet dust to the relative moldiness of a house, NOT to any adverse

health effects of the occupants. Other than those two (rather

important) points, I think we are in agreement!

I have read the article in its entirety, and this section that I

quote has to do with 'Exposure Assessment', specifically, as noted,

on qPCR analysis of air samples. As stated in the article: 'Even if

fungal and mold species can be identified more accurately in

the environment, there are as yet no reliable markers of human

exposure or dose for these and other biological agents; some efforts

are underway to assess exposure using chemical markers

or immunologic markers.'

I guess I should give up trying to explain this to you. It is

obvious that you will be going your way, and the rest of the world

(including USEPA, Health Canada, ACGIH, IOM, will be going

ours. Good luck!

Don

> > > >

> > > > Don,

> > > >

> > > > I have no doubt that if someone does not know what they are

> > > doing " tests for the presence of fungi in air cannot be used to

> > > assess risks to the health of building occupants. "

> > > >

> > > > However if you know what you are doing this is no doubt wrong.

> > > >

> > > > Many times I get calls from people whose doctor has said they

> are

> > > sick from mold exposure. I am asked to determine if there is

> > elevated

> > > levels of water damage indicators in the home or office that

> could

> > > correlate with the diagnosis. I do this ALL THE TIME.

> > > >

> > > > It takes a combination of air sampling and DNA analysis of

> carpet

> > > dust (like Steve Vesper is doing at the EPA). It is very easy

to

> > get

> > > a very good indication if the location is sick by such testing.

> > > >

> > > > Rosen, Ph.D.

> > > > www.Mold-Books. com

> > > >

> > > > Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould

> > > >

> > > > Thank you, Jim, for posting this notice. It saves me the

trouble

> > > > of posting it myself.

> > > >

> > > > It remains to be seen whether or not this notice results in an

> > > > increase in enquiries for mould home inspections. Time will

> tell!

> > > >

> > > > For the group, as noted in today's discussion, the most

> > interesting

> > > > part will be the last sentence: 'Further, in the absence of

> > > exposure

> > > > limits, results from tests for the presence of fungi in air

> > cannot

> > > be

> > > > used to assess risks to the health of building occupants.'

This

> > > topic

> > > > has been a subject of discussion on the various group message

> > > boards

> > > > for a while. I think that this straight-forward statement

says

> it

> > > > best: microbial air sampling of any type is not recommended

to

> > > > evaluate individual health risks. If it is used at all in an

> > > initial

> > > > building evaluation, it is intended strictly as a building

> > > evaluation

> > > > tool, to see if there may be 'hidden' mould not readily

> visible.

> > > Then

> > > > destructive sampling may be necessary to get at the 'hidden'

> > mould.

> > > > But the results of any air sampling are not an indication of

> > health

> > > > risks.

> > > >

> > > > All air sampling, no matter when or where it is collected, no

> > > matter

> > > > what media or instrumentation used, is not an indication of

the

> > > > health risks to the building occupants or the remediation

> firm's

> > > > employees. Period. Further,because the mere collection of air

> > > > samples, and the laboratory results of the air sampling

> > collected,

> > > > are often misinterpreted as a possible diagnostic tool for

> health

> > > > risks by the building occupants, as well as by the EC and the

> RC,

> > > the

> > > > use of air sampling should be limited to building evaluation.

> Any

> > > > microbial air sampling results presented should be

accompanied

> by

> > > > caveat as to its limitations.

> > > >

> > > > Don

> > > >

> > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

> > > ____________ __

> > > > Bored stiff? Loosen up...

> > > > Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.

> > > > http://games. yahoo.com/ games/front

> > > >

> > >

> > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

> > ____________ __

> > > We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love

> > > (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.

> > > http://tv.yahoo. com/collections/ 265

> > >

> >

> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

> ____________ __

> > Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate

> > in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q & A.

> > http://answers. yahoo.com/ dir/?link= list & sid= 396545367

> >

>

______________________________________________________________________

______________

> Be a PS3 game guru.

> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

Yahoo! Games.

> http://videogames.yahoo.com/platform?platform=120121

>

April 5, 2007

:

As you note below, PCR analysis of carpet dust samples is what the

ERMI is about. NOT microbial air sampling, which was what Health

Canada is talking about. And the ERMI relates the PCR analyses of

carpet dust to the relative moldiness of a house, NOT to any adverse

health effects of the occupants. Other than those two (rather

important) points, I think we are in agreement!

I have read the article in its entirety, and this section that I

quote has to do with 'Exposure Assessment', specifically, as noted,

on qPCR analysis of air samples. As stated in the article: 'Even if

fungal and mold species can be identified more accurately in

the environment, there are as yet no reliable markers of human

exposure or dose for these and other biological agents; some efforts

are underway to assess exposure using chemical markers

or immunologic markers.'

I guess I should give up trying to explain this to you. It is

obvious that you will be going your way, and the rest of the world

(including USEPA, Health Canada, ACGIH, IOM, will be going

ours. Good luck!

Don

> > > >

> > > > Don,

> > > >

> > > > I have no doubt that if someone does not know what they are

> > > doing " tests for the presence of fungi in air cannot be used to

> > > assess risks to the health of building occupants. "

> > > >

> > > > However if you know what you are doing this is no doubt wrong.

> > > >

> > > > Many times I get calls from people whose doctor has said they

> are

> > > sick from mold exposure. I am asked to determine if there is

> > elevated

> > > levels of water damage indicators in the home or office that

> could

> > > correlate with the diagnosis. I do this ALL THE TIME.

> > > >

> > > > It takes a combination of air sampling and DNA analysis of

> carpet

> > > dust (like Steve Vesper is doing at the EPA). It is very easy

to

> > get

> > > a very good indication if the location is sick by such testing.

> > > >

> > > > Rosen, Ph.D.

> > > > www.Mold-Books. com

> > > >

> > > > Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould

> > > >

> > > > Thank you, Jim, for posting this notice. It saves me the

trouble

> > > > of posting it myself.

> > > >

> > > > It remains to be seen whether or not this notice results in an

> > > > increase in enquiries for mould home inspections. Time will

> tell!

> > > >

> > > > For the group, as noted in today's discussion, the most

> > interesting

> > > > part will be the last sentence: 'Further, in the absence of

> > > exposure

> > > > limits, results from tests for the presence of fungi in air

> > cannot

> > > be

> > > > used to assess risks to the health of building occupants.'

This

> > > topic

> > > > has been a subject of discussion on the various group message

> > > boards

> > > > for a while. I think that this straight-forward statement

says

> it

> > > > best: microbial air sampling of any type is not recommended

to

> > > > evaluate individual health risks. If it is used at all in an

> > > initial

> > > > building evaluation, it is intended strictly as a building

> > > evaluation

> > > > tool, to see if there may be 'hidden' mould not readily

> visible.

> > > Then

> > > > destructive sampling may be necessary to get at the 'hidden'

> > mould.

> > > > But the results of any air sampling are not an indication of

> > health

> > > > risks.

> > > >

> > > > All air sampling, no matter when or where it is collected, no

> > > matter

> > > > what media or instrumentation used, is not an indication of

the

> > > > health risks to the building occupants or the remediation

> firm's

> > > > employees. Period. Further,because the mere collection of air

> > > > samples, and the laboratory results of the air sampling

> > collected,

> > > > are often misinterpreted as a possible diagnostic tool for

> health

> > > > risks by the building occupants, as well as by the EC and the

> RC,

> > > the

> > > > use of air sampling should be limited to building evaluation.

> Any

> > > > microbial air sampling results presented should be

accompanied

> by

> > > > caveat as to its limitations.

> > > >

> > > > Don

> > > >

> > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

> > > ____________ __

> > > > Bored stiff? Loosen up...

> > > > Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.

> > > > http://games. yahoo.com/ games/front

> > > >

> > >

> > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

> > ____________ __

> > > We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love

> > > (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.

> > > http://tv.yahoo. com/collections/ 265

> > >

> >

> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

> ____________ __

> > Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate

> > in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q & A.

> > http://answers. yahoo.com/ dir/?link= list & sid= 396545367

> >

>

______________________________________________________________________

______________

> Be a PS3 game guru.

> Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at

Yahoo! Games.

> http://videogames.yahoo.com/platform?platform=120121

>

April 5, 2007

When I put on personal protection my clients usually panic and do nothing and stay sick; it is an emotional thing. I take the exposure and document my reactions in my report, usually validation their problems.

It is what I believe I am meant to do; but it IS stupid.

Jim

Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould

"Jim H. White" wrote:> I personally know that a toxic response to some molds is important because I am often unable to work for days after doing IAQ Investigations in some moldy houses. I cannot think clearly (see Jarvis et al about people's response to some mycotoxins) and I am so tired that I have trouble sitting up at the keyboard. Some deny this because it has not been proven well enough to them and that is not all that unreasonable. I do not have that option because of how strongly I react and honesty will not let me deny my reactions, nor others who react as I do.> > Jim H. White System Science ConsultingNaughty, naughty!You're not listening to your wife!http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/iequality/message/10648It only gets worse, you know.-

April 5, 2007

When I put on personal protection my clients usually panic and do nothing and stay sick; it is an emotional thing. I take the exposure and document my reactions in my report, usually validation their problems.

It is what I believe I am meant to do; but it IS stupid.

Jim

Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould

"Jim H. White" wrote:> I personally know that a toxic response to some molds is important because I am often unable to work for days after doing IAQ Investigations in some moldy houses. I cannot think clearly (see Jarvis et al about people's response to some mycotoxins) and I am so tired that I have trouble sitting up at the keyboard. Some deny this because it has not been proven well enough to them and that is not all that unreasonable. I do not have that option because of how strongly I react and honesty will not let me deny my reactions, nor others who react as I do.> > Jim H. White System Science ConsultingNaughty, naughty!You're not listening to your wife!http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/iequality/message/10648It only gets worse, you know.-

April 5, 2007

Mold has a similar effect on me but not as strong. My daughter's reaction is similar to what you describe.

In any event, I take Cholestyramine (CSM) after going into moldy homes and am better the next day. Many of the remediators around here take CSM. CSM is a toxin binder and better than the activated charcoal recommended by the military for tricothecene poisoning.

Rosen, Ph.D.

www.Mold-Books.com

Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould

"Jim H. White" <systemsa@.. .> wrote:> I personally know that a toxic response to some molds is important because I am often unable to work for days after doing IAQ Investigations in some moldy houses. I cannot think clearly (see Jarvis et al about people's response to some mycotoxins) and I am so tired that I have trouble sitting up at the keyboard. Some deny this because it has not been proven well enough to them and that is not all that unreasonable. I do not have that option because of how strongly I react and honesty will not let me deny my reactions, nor others who react as I do.> > Jim H. White System Science ConsultingNaughty, naughty!You're not listening to your wife!http://health. groups.yahoo. com/group/ iequality/ message/10648It only gets worse, you

know.-

The fish are biting.

Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.

April 5, 2007

Mold has a similar effect on me but not as strong. My daughter's reaction is similar to what you describe.

In any event, I take Cholestyramine (CSM) after going into moldy homes and am better the next day. Many of the remediators around here take CSM. CSM is a toxin binder and better than the activated charcoal recommended by the military for tricothecene poisoning.

Rosen, Ph.D.

www.Mold-Books.com

Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould

"Jim H. White" <systemsa@.. .> wrote:> I personally know that a toxic response to some molds is important because I am often unable to work for days after doing IAQ Investigations in some moldy houses. I cannot think clearly (see Jarvis et al about people's response to some mycotoxins) and I am so tired that I have trouble sitting up at the keyboard. Some deny this because it has not been proven well enough to them and that is not all that unreasonable. I do not have that option because of how strongly I react and honesty will not let me deny my reactions, nor others who react as I do.> > Jim H. White System Science ConsultingNaughty, naughty!You're not listening to your wife!http://health. groups.yahoo. com/group/ iequality/ message/10648It only gets worse, you

know.-

The fish are biting.

Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.

April 5, 2007

" Jim H. White " wrote:

>

> When I put on personal protection my clients usually panic and do

nothing and stay sick; it is an emotional thing. I take the exposure

and document my reactions in my report, usually validation their

problems.

>

> It is what I believe I am meant to do; but it IS stupid.

> Jim

Well Jim, you might want to consider how ferociously angry your

wife will be when you " hit the wall " and become so reactive that

you " freeze up " if your neighbors were to stir up a spore plume, as

the " Quack with no name " accurately describes.

It's fascinating that it has been almost useless to try to warn

people how difficult it is to remain functional after the threshold

of Low MSH/Low ACTH is transcended and the hypothalamic activity

stays hypo.

It's so far beyond what people imagine that words do not

sufficiently impress potential PIR 5's with the severity what they

are facing.

As you've noted, people often take no action until there is no other

option but to crawl outside and sleep on the ground.

If you check the old messages on sickbuildings, you will see that

even the Quackman was resistant to heeding our harrowing tales of

mold woe, and of taking our advice regarding instant evacuation until

it became painfully obvious that there was no other choice, and is

now giving the very type of advice that he was formerly so reticent

to accept.

After warnings like ours, if should you join the ranks of

the " Extreme Responders " , I think your wife will definitely have a

few choice words regarding the perspicacity of your actions.

-

April 5, 2007

" Jim H. White " wrote:

>

> When I put on personal protection my clients usually panic and do

nothing and stay sick; it is an emotional thing. I take the exposure

and document my reactions in my report, usually validation their

problems.

>

> It is what I believe I am meant to do; but it IS stupid.

> Jim

Well Jim, you might want to consider how ferociously angry your

wife will be when you " hit the wall " and become so reactive that

you " freeze up " if your neighbors were to stir up a spore plume, as

the " Quack with no name " accurately describes.

It's fascinating that it has been almost useless to try to warn

people how difficult it is to remain functional after the threshold

of Low MSH/Low ACTH is transcended and the hypothalamic activity

stays hypo.

It's so far beyond what people imagine that words do not

sufficiently impress potential PIR 5's with the severity what they

are facing.

As you've noted, people often take no action until there is no other

option but to crawl outside and sleep on the ground.

If you check the old messages on sickbuildings, you will see that

even the Quackman was resistant to heeding our harrowing tales of

mold woe, and of taking our advice regarding instant evacuation until

it became painfully obvious that there was no other choice, and is

now giving the very type of advice that he was formerly so reticent

to accept.

After warnings like ours, if should you join the ranks of

the " Extreme Responders " , I think your wife will definitely have a

few choice words regarding the perspicacity of your actions.

-

April 5, 2007

Jim,

Dr. Marinkovich makes an anti-fungal nasal spray compound. Nizoral. Many people, including some real estate agents he treats, use it BEFORE they go into places that they think might have a mold problem. It's hard to say if it works or not, because if it does one does not get sick. And so how do you know you would have without it?

I know it is good stuff for after you have had an exposure. Because I use it occasionally after an exposure. It's similar to what ENT's Ponikau and Sherris use for fungal sinusitus. But it helps me with the brain fog and the feeling like somebody slipped me a mickey.

Sharon

When I put on personal protection my clients usually panic and do nothing and stay sick; it is an emotional thing. I take the exposure and document my reactions in my report, usually validation their problems.

It is what I believe I am meant to do; but it IS stupid.

Jim

See what's free at AOL.com.

April 8, 2007

" how well PCR testing of carpet dust correlates to sick buildings and

sick people. "

This is not new information. There are a german study of 4000 homes, a

large canadian study and a study in Minnesota that found this years

ago. They all concluded the same thing about carpet mold spore levels

and sick people at a certain spore level.

Why didn't the EPA use this same testing method of from these 3

published studies to drawn a relationship between cfu/g and PCR/gram?

Bob

April 9, 2007

Bob,

There have been several studies that compare PCR mold test to CFU mold tests. The studies conclude that the viable testing is not quantitative.

Rosen

www.Mold-Books.coc

Re: Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould

"how well PCR testing of carpet dust correlates to sick buildings and sick people."This is not new information. There are a german study of 4000 homes, a large canadian study and a study in Minnesota that found this years ago. They all concluded the same thing about carpet mold spore levels and sick people at a certain spore level.Why didn't the EPA use this same testing method of from these 3 published studies to drawn a relationship between cfu/g and PCR/gram?Bob

<fontfamily><param>Verdana</param><smaller><smaller>"how well PCRtesting of carpet dust correlates to sick buildings and sick people."This is not new information. There are a german study of 4000 homes,a large canadian study and a study in Minnesota that found this yearsago. They all concluded the same thing about carpet mold sporelevels and sick people at a certain spore level. Why didn't the EPA use this same testing method of from these 3published studies to drawn a relationship between cfu/g and PCR/gram?Bob</smaller></smaller></fontfamily>

Get your own web address. Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business.

April 9, 2007

,

Do you have the references? The ones I have read showed very high

variability of the PCR results.

There was no clear way to interpret these highly variable PCR results.

Did they mean there is more allergic material? That is not clear

because we do not know how much of a mold protein it takes to elicit an

effect. Or what particular part of a mold protein causes a reaction.

We are not even sure that the section of the mold DNA that PCR

replicates has any relation to the part that causes allergic reactions.

Clearly, PCR does not accurately measure infectivity risk, because this

requires viable mold spores.

Bob

April 9, 2007

Bob,

PCR does not look at mold protein. Just genetic material.

Viability of the mold spores is not a very useful number when determining if a house is a problem house or not.

Very few people get sick from mold infections unless they are immuno-compromised.

Dead mold or alive mold ... both have toxins and allergens. The toxins and allergens are what irritate and and make people sick.... not whether the spore is alive or dead.

What percent of a building's mold is viability versus dead is not generally a useful number for determing if a house is sick. Yes, if the mold spores are all viable then this indicates a more current problem ... perhaps an active problem. But generally total spores or total genetic material is what we are interested in.

Rosen, Ph.D.

www.Mold-Books.com

Re: Re: Health Canada Annex on Mould

,Do you have the references? The ones I have read showed very high variability of the PCR results.There was no clear way to interpret these highly variable PCR results. Did they mean there is more allergic material? That is not clear because we do not know how much of a mold protein it takes to elicit an effect. Or what particular part of a mold protein causes a reaction. We are not even sure that the section of the mold DNA that PCR replicates has any relation to the part that causes allergic reactions.Clearly, PCR does not accurately measure infectivity risk, because this requires viable mold spores.Bob

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