Re: Re: What can schools do when child is out for extended period?

[Guest guest]

hi!

 

For everyone who asked, we're in Illinois. Does the info below hold true for

IL? 

They have told me when shes ready they will provide a tutor (at home) for 5

weeks.  I have also asked numerous times if there was a cut off of sorts for

a child  who was out sick for an extended time.  Noone gave me a straight

answer. Of course I was and am still most concerned with the well being of

my dd.   Based on the severity of her symptoms and not fully understading what

was happening....I had no idea how to put a timeline on her recovery and still

dont.   

 She cannot do any work. Has major consentration problems, has trouble writing

and told me she has no desire to even read a book which was her favorite thing

in to do in the world for the last 2 years.  

 

I do agree the team approach is the best way to go in.  Thanks for the

suggested mind set.  I will try to not let past issues color this situation.

This is truly a whole different ball game-- Im not an expert on OCD but I do

know my child so I will listen to their plan with an open mind and go from

there. 

 

Will let everyone know how it turns out.

 

Thanks again Chris.  Your wisdom is much appreciated!

 

 

 

 

________________________________

To:

Sent: Monday, December 12, 2011 9:18 PM

Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

They can recommend placement (location) if they feel they can't meet her needs,

and I think place her there. First thought here - just calmly listen to what

they have to say, see what they offer, what this special school can offer, etc.

Volunteer to tour it. But you can say that you and her doctors feel she is not

ready to go back. But you're willing to see this special school now, as if she

can't return yet it may be the best place for her when she's ready..... So this

shows you are expecting her to return at some point and are being agreeable (vs

being seen as not working with the school). I'm sure you're used to this, with

another child with an IEP.

Hasn't she been getting homebound services any? If not, due to severity, then it

seems at this point in the year, she'd be held back anyway? I'm asking here, if

it's the case that she hasn't been able to do any schoolwork. I would think they

could just keep her on homebound if that is what she is currently getting. Our

handbook here in NC discusses homebound under " discipline " and says:

" Discipline and homebound instruction

(a) If a change of placement occurs under the discipline requirements of these

Policies, an LEA shall not assign a student to homebound

instruction without a determination by the student's IEP Team

that the homebound instruction is the least restrictive alternative

environment for that student. If it is determined that the homebound

instruction is the least restrictive alternative environment for the

student, the student's IEP team shall meet to determine the nature of

the homebound educational services to be provided to the student. In addition,

the continued appropriateness of the homebound

instruction shall be evaluated monthly by the designee or designees of the

student's IEP Team.

( " Educational services " means all of the following:

(1) The necessary instructional hours per week in the form and format as

determined by the child's IEP team and consistent with federal and State law.

The instruction shall be deliveredby appropriately qualified teachers to the

extent required by federal and State law, which requires a free appropriate

public education and the opportunity for a sound basic education.

(2) Related services including in the child's IEP.

(3) Behavior intervention services to the extent required above NC 1504-2.1 (d)

and (f).

© " Homebound instruction " means educational services provided to a student

outside the school setting. "

ALSO found the following:

" Children determined eligible for services under Part B must receive a program

of special education and related services in accordance with an individualized

education program (IEP) developed at a meeting of the child's IEP Team,

including school officials and the child's parents. 34 CFR §§300.320-300.324.

The IEP, which addresses the child's unique educational needs arising from the

child's disability also forms the basis for the child's placement decision. 34

CFR §300.116((2). Part B expresses a preference for placing children with

disabilities in regular classes with nondisabled children if the child with a

disability can be educated satisfactorily in the regular educational environment

with the use of supplementary aids and services. 34 CFR §300.114. Although

experience has demonstrated that many children with disabilities can be educated

satisfactorily in the regular classroom along with children without

disabilities, unless their IEP calls

for some other arrangement, IDEA also recognizes that the regular classroom may

not be the appropriate placement for some disabled children. Therefore, each

public agency must make available a continuum of alternative placements, or a

range of placement options, to meet the needs of children with disabilities for

special education and related services. The options on this continuum include

instruction in regular classes, special classes, special schools, home

instruction, and instruction in hospitals and institutions. 34 CFR §300.115 (a)

and ((1). Thus, the group responsible for making the placement decision, which

includes persons knowledgeable about the child and the child's parent, selects

the option on the continuum in which the child's IEP can be appropriately

implemented. 34 CFR §300.116(a)-(. "

HOPE this helps gives you some ideas for discussing your point of view of her

needs in their terms. I agree, the best thing for her right now is to get her

well, on her way to getting well.

There's some OCD school related information in our FILES section that you could

print out, but that is primarily for help when child is attending school.

Haven't read it lately, can't recall if it mentions anywhere about not being

able to attend. It goes with the info you will see on this site:

http://www.ocdeducationstation.org/role-of-school-personnel

There is also a book by Dr. that is recent, you can read more about it

here: http://ocdhandbook.com/ocdbasics/ But again, I think it is also more

regarding those attending school. It DOES have a section for transitioning back

to school after a long absence though.

I think the school is probably taking the steps required by them at this point,

and the goal is to meet her educational needs. I learned to try to think of us

as a *team* and we were working for helping succeed in getting his

education. Also learned " thank you " goes a long way, lol, and asking them what

their thoughts/suggestions are first, did they have any similar experience with

another student/how did they meet the need...and then getting to what *I*

wanted. And sometimes I was just at a loss as to how to accommodate him and I

really wanted them to come up with answers!

Keep us updated, will be interested to hear how the meeting goes. Quick thoughts

tonight, I remember the advocating days! 's 22 now!

>

Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some cut

off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who, what

agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?  My

experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as I

have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to

make them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

>  

> Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she just

take the grade next year if needed?  I have no idea how long this will take and

additional pressure from the school is just not what we need when we're just

trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

>  

> Any direction info would be most appreciated.  Thank so much!

>

>

[Guest guest]

Lorreta, hi!

 

I never even considered that OCD is an official disability. I guess we were all

hoping this could be resolved quickly but its not looking that way.

We're in IL so I will look on line for a Disability Advocacy program here. 

Thanks for the link to " knowing your rights " I will read/use the info.

Thank you for your input--its much appreciated!

________________________________

To:

Sent: Monday, December 12, 2011 9:23 PM

Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

Here is the other link I mentioned:

http://www.ocdeducationstation.org/role-of-school-personnel/understanding-the-la\

w-as-it-relates-to-students-with-ocd/

> >

> > Just wondering if anyone can provide some info on the role of public

school and child with OCD.  My dd has been out of school for almost 3 mos due

to debilitating sudden onset OCD symptoms and major depression.  Shes has

been on official medical leave from  but now school is taking about possible

having her go to a " special " school.  There will be a formal meeting this week

and Im not sure what to expect.  Can they kick her out if she doesnt get better

fast enough?  Both Phych Drs say she not ready to go back.  Im Also, pursuing

the Pandas aspect of OCD and she is now seeing specialist who wants us to try

steroids burst and not change meds or have her begin CBT/ERP.  (We were ready

to go begin an  extensive outpatient program before seeing new Dr. since  she

cannot even get dressed most days.)

> >  

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?  My

experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as I

have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to

make them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> >  

> > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed?  I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need

when we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> >  

> > Any direction info would be most appreciated.  Thank so much!

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I am not sure I agree with that. My dd was certainly ill much longer than 3

months even while being out of school. She wasn't even able to do her homebound

instruction for much of the 3 years she was out of school. For her, it was

essential to find the right med combo and that took a long time due to her

comorbid illnesses. Stormy

Sent from my iPad

>

>

>

> Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

It is a mental illness and a disability.

Sharon

________________________________

To: " " < >

Sent: Tuesday, December 13, 2011 11:22 AM

Subject: Re: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

Lorreta, hi!

 

I never even considered that OCD is an official disability. I guess we were all

hoping this could be resolved quickly but its not looking that way.

We're in IL so I will look on line for a Disability Advocacy program here. 

Thanks for the link to " knowing your rights " I will read/use the info.

Thank you for your input--its much appreciated!

________________________________

To:

Sent: Monday, December 12, 2011 9:23 PM

Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

Here is the other link I mentioned:

http://www.ocdeducationstation.org/role-of-school-personnel/understanding-the-la\

w-as-it-relates-to-students-with-ocd/

> >

> > Just wondering if anyone can provide some info on the role of public

school and child with OCD.  My dd has been out of school for almost 3 mos due

to debilitating sudden onset OCD symptoms and major depression.  Shes has

been on official medical leave from  but now school is taking about possible

having her go to a " special " school.  There will be a formal meeting this week

and Im not sure what to expect.  Can they kick her out if she doesnt get better

fast enough?  Both Phych Drs say she not ready to go back.  Im Also, pursuing

the Pandas aspect of OCD and she is now seeing specialist who wants us to try

steroids burst and not change meds or have her begin CBT/ERP.  (We were ready

to go begin an  extensive outpatient program before seeing new Dr. since  she

cannot even get dressed most days.)

> >  

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?  My

experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as I

have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to

make them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> >  

> > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed?  I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need

when we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> >  

> > Any direction info would be most appreciated.  Thank so much!

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I think there are cases, like my dd's, that are just very complicated, due to

comorbid diagnoses. We did what you suggested. My dd actually saw 3 home pdoc's

who were all in agreement on her diagnoses and treatment. Many, many med combos

were tried and she stayed very ill for a long time. She also did treatments at

multiple clinics. She also saw 2 pdoc's during her 60 day intensive inpatient

hospitalization, again in agreement. She is still on 5 meds for management and

it was a challenge to find the right ones. Even during inpatient when they got

the meds right and things were going well they decided to try removing 1 more

med and she went into mania again, and stayed until they got her Geodon to the

right dose again. My dd is a very successful college junior right now but that

is after quite a journey to get there. In my experience, it isn't always as easy

as you made it sound. Stormy

Sent from my iPad

> I think that the right doctor would recognize what's going on and would be

able to treat it appropriately. There are not a lotbof child psychiatrists who

deal with very I'll children and that is the problem. I am not only a mom of a

special kid, I am a nurse too and It isn't necessary for a child to be so ill

for that length of time....the practitioner should be adept at treating our

kids. If it does take that long, it can be attributed to poor diagnoses and

management in my opinion even though there are cases that are refractory. Adults

are not ill months and years on end when they're treated properly. It's not a

sign of poor parenting, just the system being inadequate. We have gone through

very difficult periods of waxing and waning symptoms and med side effects as

well, but not months or years without symptom relief. I don't think that you

find the answers with the opinion of one practitioner and that's why I suggested

another opinion and to follow your instincts.

>

> Bonnie

>

>

> >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Bonnie, hi!

 

It was sudden onset and very severe case. Debilitating-- and both phychologist

and phychiatrist said no school  or even school work at home until further

notice. We are looking into the PANDAS aspect and shes now being treated by a

pediatrician who has sucessfully treated PANDAS kids who  asked us to not

pursure CBT/ERP or increase her meds until hes done testing.  So now we're in

limbo waiting to see what course of treatment we should take and the school is

insisting we meet to go over all the issues. (Hoping to have a clearer picture

by the 1st of the year.)  Thats the point. I dont yet know where we are headed

only that its going to take more time.  Thats why I was asking for info from

all the OCD warriors who have traveled down this road before.  We saw the

phychiatrist a week ago and they said dd is still not ready and phych want

us to up the meds which I rather not until I know for sure its Not PANDAS as I

have read that PANDAS

kids do not do well on high doses antidepresents. 

Thank you for clarifiing who impliments the plan for going back to school.  I

can at leaset breathe a little easier knowing that the school cannot have final

say in the matter. 

 

My dd has occasional good days where she really misses her classmates and

teachers and wants to go back. . She was straigth A student, loved school,

the teachers, the kids.  So for her to have no interest or the desire to go

shows how much the OCD has taken from her.   I ultimately want whatever is

best for her.  Hopefully I wont have to pursue the legal aspect but I dont want

her in a school with violent kids either. Thanks for the great suggestions

about trying the school for a half day or so.  That makes perfect sense.  Im

very glad your son is doing better at his new school.    I appreciate your

advice and will check back with everyone.  Thanks again!

 

________________________________

To:

Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 1:05 PM

Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

IDEA is a federal law and so the laws are is the same in all states. I totally

agree with the idea that states and districts try to reinterpret them often in

their own interest.

First, the psychiatrist prescribes the amount of time on home instruction, not

the district as the district is not licensed to make a medical determination.

The school will naturally want to end the home instruction quickly, but it's not

completely their decision.

Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think it's

one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's another

to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

I want to tell you also that the right school is extremely important. My son was

placed in a therapeutic school and it was a nightmare. Anxious kids should not

be in environments where there is a lot of acting out. Kids with conduct

disorder, ODD, ect...have very different needs than anxious kids. The

psychiatric/psychological care he got there was substandard in my opinion, and

he got poor grades as well. This place was considered to be a good school?

Honestly, I think that a special education school with small class size and

caring teachers who can handle issues together with a class make up of mostly

kids like your dd can be a good place to get an education. You'll not find the

perfect place, but there are schools that you can work with and compromise won't

be so costly. I think we've found such a school and it has made a huge

difference.

Does your daughter want to go to school? That's something to consider as well.

I think the first step is to get a prescription from your psychiatrist for home

instruction for 1-2 months. Possibly get a second opinion for psychiatric

care...follow your instincts on this. Begin looking at private schools and make

sure that they let your dd spend a half day or two in class there....that helped

us pick out our present school. Tell her it won't be perfect, but to give it a

try. You'll be able to get a sense of whether or not she'll do OK there.

You must sign the IEP in order for your dd to be placed, and she cannot be

denied a public education. If you are being pushed, you might want to hire an

advocate or lawyer. After our fiasco at a therapeutic school, I hired a lawyer

who was not only a lawyer but also a spec Ed teacher. She grew up in our very

district as well. She pointed us toward the school we eventually picked. Having

a knowledgeable person on your side is worth every penny .

Feel free to e mail me if I can help you in any way.

Bonnie

> >

> Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level? 

My experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as

I have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to

make them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> >  

> > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed?  I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need

when we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> >  

> > Any direction info would be most appreciated.  Thank so much!

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Thank you Loretta-- I printed this out and will take it with me!

________________________________

To:

Sent: Tuesday, December 13, 2011 8:54 PM

Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

Here is another link that may be of use:

http://ocfoundation.org/ocdinkids/personnel/ocd_and_IEP.aspx

> > >

> > > Just wondering if anyone can provide some info on the role of public

school and child with OCD.  My dd has been out of school for almost 3 mos

due to debilitating sudden onset OCD symptoms and major depression. 

Shes has been on official medical leave from  but now school is taking

about possible having her go to a " special " school.  There will be a formal

meeting this week and Im not sure what to expect.  Can they kick her out if

she doesnt get better fast enough?  Both Phych Drs say she not ready to go

back.  Im Also, pursuing the Pandas aspect of OCD and she is now seeing

specialist who wants us to try steroids burst and not change meds or have her

begin CBT/ERP.  (We were ready to go begin an  extensive outpatient

program before seeing new Dr. since  she cannot even get dressed most days.)

> > >  

> > > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there

some cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so?

Who, what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal

level?  My experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been

amicable as I have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to

fight to make them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> > >  

> > > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed?  I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need

when we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> > >  

> > > Any direction info would be most appreciated.  Thank so much!

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Chris!  I will try to keep an open m ind and see what they suggest and

go from there as you suggest.

 

Thanks again!

________________________________

To:

Sent: Tuesday, December 13, 2011 5:54 PM

Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

had to dictate to me, I did the writing. Also read to him since OCD

affected him there too. Those were tiring times, I joked about having to go thru

middle school again. It was more interesting the 2nd time around, lol, so far as

my finding some subjects interesting. Also found it hard in some, e.g., some

chapter questions I was glad it wasn't my homework!

It was slow work, but we did little things over time for him to take back the

writing, some reading, etc. That was after his OCD seemed to be getting better

or at least settling down to less intense. He may fill in a few blanks (wasn't

erasing any more), circle something on a sheet.... I'd let him read a short

paragraph to me, I'd read 2 or 3 then he'd have a turn....

I think what I gave you in earlier post would pretty much apply anywhere.

Guessing. Some things like timelines may be different (e.g., homebound need

evaluated monthly). I would assume they'd do that with your daughter every 5

weeks.

Hang in there, it will get better down the road!

>

> hi!

>  

> For everyone who asked, we're in Illinois. Does the info below hold true for

IL? 

> They have told me when shes ready they will provide a tutor (at home) for 5

weeks.  I have also asked numerous times if there was a cut off of

sorts for a child  who was out sick for an extended time.  Noone gave me a

straight answer. Of course I was and am still most concerned with the well

being of my dd.   Based on the severity of her symptoms and not fully

understading what was happening....I had no idea how to put a timeline on her

recovery and still dont.   

>  She cannot do any work. Has major consentration problems, has trouble

writing and told me she has no desire to even read a book which was her favorite

thing in to do in the world for the last 2 years.  

>

[Guest guest]

My daughter has just recently had obsessive thoughts about a certain food ( a ho

ho ) that might make her threw up. What strategies do I use to help her get rid

of the thoughts? This is a new one for me

Sent from my iPhone

> Bonnie, hi!

>

> It was sudden onset and very severe case. Debilitating-- and both phychologist

and phychiatrist said no school or even school work at home until further

notice. We are looking into the PANDAS aspect and shes now being treated by a

pediatrician who has sucessfully treated PANDAS kids who asked us to not

pursure CBT/ERP or increase her meds until hes done testing. So now we're in

limbo waiting to see what course of treatment we should take and the school is

insisting we meet to go over all the issues. (Hoping to have a clearer picture

by the 1st of the year.) Thats the point. I dont yet know where we are headed

only that its going to take more time. Thats why I was asking for info from all

the OCD warriors who have traveled down this road before. We saw the

phychiatrist a week ago and they said dd is still not ready and phych want us to

up the meds which I rather not until I know for sure its Not PANDAS as I have

read that PANDAS

> kids do not do well on high doses antidepresents.

> Thank you for clarifiing who impliments the plan for going back to school. I

can at leaset breathe a little easier knowing that the school cannot have final

say in the matter.

>

> My dd has occasional good days where she really misses her classmates and

teachers and wants to go back. . She was straigth A student, loved school, the

teachers, the kids. So for her to have no interest or the desire to go shows

how much the OCD has taken from her. I ultimately want whatever is best for

her. Hopefully I wont have to pursue the legal aspect but I dont want her in a

school with violent kids either. Thanks for the great suggestions about trying

the school for a half day or so. That makes perfect sense. Im very glad your

son is doing better at his new school. I appreciate your advice and will

check back with everyone. Thanks again!

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To:

> Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 1:05 PM

> Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

>

>

>

> IDEA is a federal law and so the laws are is the same in all states. I totally

agree with the idea that states and districts try to reinterpret them often in

their own interest.

>

> First, the psychiatrist prescribes the amount of time on home instruction, not

the district as the district is not licensed to make a medical determination.

The school will naturally want to end the home instruction quickly, but it's not

completely their decision.

>

> Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

>

> I want to tell you also that the right school is extremely important. My son

was placed in a therapeutic school and it was a nightmare. Anxious kids should

not be in environments where there is a lot of acting out. Kids with conduct

disorder, ODD, ect...have very different needs than anxious kids. The

psychiatric/psychological care he got there was substandard in my opinion, and

he got poor grades as well. This place was considered to be a good school?

Honestly, I think that a special education school with small class size and

caring teachers who can handle issues together with a class make up of mostly

kids like your dd can be a good place to get an education. You'll not find the

perfect place, but there are schools that you can work with and compromise won't

be so costly. I think we've found such a school and it has made a huge

difference.

>

> Does your daughter want to go to school? That's something to consider as well.

>

> I think the first step is to get a prescription from your psychiatrist for

home instruction for 1-2 months. Possibly get a second opinion for psychiatric

care...follow your instincts on this. Begin looking at private schools and make

sure that they let your dd spend a half day or two in class there....that helped

us pick out our present school. Tell her it won't be perfect, but to give it a

try. You'll be able to get a sense of whether or not she'll do OK there.

>

> You must sign the IEP in order for your dd to be placed, and she cannot be

denied a public education. If you are being pushed, you might want to hire an

advocate or lawyer. After our fiasco at a therapeutic school, I hired a lawyer

who was not only a lawyer but also a spec Ed teacher. She grew up in our very

district as well. She pointed us toward the school we eventually picked. Having

a knowledgeable person on your side is worth every penny .

>

> Feel free to e mail me if I can help you in any way.

>

> Bonnie

>

>

> > >

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?Â

My experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as

I have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to makeÂ

them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> > > Â

> > > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed? I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need whenÂ

we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> > > Â

> > > Any direction info would be most appreciated. Thank so much!

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

I might be wrong about how to deal with that one, but no one needs to eat a ho

ho, ever.  I would tell her that she never, in her entire life, has to eat a ho

ho, especially if she thinks it would make her throw up.  I would also talk to

her about - what would happen if she did throw up?  It isnt that awful and she

would get through it and be ok.

Sharon

________________________________

To: " " < >

Cc: " " < >

Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 6:21 AM

Subject: Re: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

My daughter has just recently had obsessive thoughts about a certain food ( a ho

ho ) that might make her threw up. What strategies do I use to help her get rid

of the thoughts? This is a new one for me

Sent from my iPhone

> Bonnie, hi!

>

> It was sudden onset and very severe case. Debilitating-- and both phychologist

and phychiatrist said no school or even school work at home until further

notice. We are looking into the PANDAS aspect and shes now being treated by a

pediatrician who has sucessfully treated PANDAS kids who asked us to not

pursure CBT/ERP or increase her meds until hes done testing. So now we're in

limbo waiting to see what course of treatment we should take and the school is

insisting we meet to go over all the issues. (Hoping to have a clearer picture

by the 1st of the year.) Thats the point. I dont yet know where we are headed

only that its going to take more time. Thats why I was asking for info from all

the OCD warriors who have traveled down this road before. We saw the

phychiatrist a week ago and they said dd is still not ready and phych want us to

up the meds which I rather not until I know for sure its Not PANDAS as I have

read that PANDAS

> kids do not do well on high doses antidepresents.

> Thank you for clarifiing who impliments the plan for going back to school. I

can at leaset breathe a little easier knowing that the school cannot have final

say in the matter.

>

> My dd has occasional good days where she really misses her classmates and

teachers and wants to go back. . She was straigth A student, loved school, the

teachers, the kids. So for her to have no interest or the desire to go shows

how much the OCD has taken from her. I ultimately want whatever is best for

her. Hopefully I wont have to pursue the legal aspect but I dont want her in a

school with violent kids either. Thanks for the great suggestions about trying

the school for a half day or so. That makes perfect sense. Im very glad your

son is doing better at his new school. I appreciate your advice and will

check back with everyone. Thanks again!

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To:

> Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 1:05 PM

> Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

>

>

>

> IDEA is a federal law and so the laws are is the same in all states. I totally

agree with the idea that states and districts try to reinterpret them often in

their own interest.

>

> First, the psychiatrist prescribes the amount of time on home instruction, not

the district as the district is not licensed to make a medical determination.

The school will naturally want to end the home instruction quickly, but it's not

completely their decision.

>

> Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

>

> I want to tell you also that the right school is extremely important. My son

was placed in a therapeutic school and it was a nightmare. Anxious kids should

not be in environments where there is a lot of acting out. Kids with conduct

disorder, ODD, ect...have very different needs than anxious kids. The

psychiatric/psychological care he got there was substandard in my opinion, and

he got poor grades as well. This place was considered to be a good school?

Honestly, I think that a special education school with small class size and

caring teachers who can handle issues together with a class make up of mostly

kids like your dd can be a good place to get an education. You'll not find the

perfect place, but there are schools that you can work with and compromise won't

be so costly. I think we've found such a school and it has made a huge

difference.

>

> Does your daughter want to go to school? That's something to consider as well.

>

> I think the first step is to get a prescription from your psychiatrist for

home instruction for 1-2 months. Possibly get a second opinion for psychiatric

care...follow your instincts on this. Begin looking at private schools and make

sure that they let your dd spend a half day or two in class there....that helped

us pick out our present school. Tell her it won't be perfect, but to give it a

try. You'll be able to get a sense of whether or not she'll do OK there.

>

> You must sign the IEP in order for your dd to be placed, and she cannot be

denied a public education. If you are being pushed, you might want to hire an

advocate or lawyer. After our fiasco at a therapeutic school, I hired a lawyer

who was not only a lawyer but also a spec Ed teacher. She grew up in our very

district as well. She pointed us toward the school we eventually picked. Having

a knowledgeable person on your side is worth every penny .

>

> Feel free to e mail me if I can help you in any way.

>

> Bonnie

>

>

> > >

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?Â

My experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as

I have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to makeÂ

them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> > > Â

> > > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed? I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need whenÂ

we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> > > Â

> > > Any direction info would be most appreciated. Thank so much!

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

I might be wrong about how to deal with that one, but no one needs to eat a ho

ho, ever.  I would tell her that she never, in her entire life, has to eat a ho

ho, especially if she thinks it would make her throw up.  I would also talk to

her about - what would happen if she did throw up?  It isnt that awful and she

would get through it and be ok.

Sharon

________________________________

To: " " < >

Cc: " " < >

Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 6:21 AM

Subject: Re: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

My daughter has just recently had obsessive thoughts about a certain food ( a ho

ho ) that might make her threw up. What strategies do I use to help her get rid

of the thoughts? This is a new one for me

Sent from my iPhone

> Bonnie, hi!

>

> It was sudden onset and very severe case. Debilitating-- and both phychologist

and phychiatrist said no school or even school work at home until further

notice. We are looking into the PANDAS aspect and shes now being treated by a

pediatrician who has sucessfully treated PANDAS kids who asked us to not

pursure CBT/ERP or increase her meds until hes done testing. So now we're in

limbo waiting to see what course of treatment we should take and the school is

insisting we meet to go over all the issues. (Hoping to have a clearer picture

by the 1st of the year.) Thats the point. I dont yet know where we are headed

only that its going to take more time. Thats why I was asking for info from all

the OCD warriors who have traveled down this road before. We saw the

phychiatrist a week ago and they said dd is still not ready and phych want us to

up the meds which I rather not until I know for sure its Not PANDAS as I have

read that PANDAS

> kids do not do well on high doses antidepresents.

> Thank you for clarifiing who impliments the plan for going back to school. I

can at leaset breathe a little easier knowing that the school cannot have final

say in the matter.

>

> My dd has occasional good days where she really misses her classmates and

teachers and wants to go back. . She was straigth A student, loved school, the

teachers, the kids. So for her to have no interest or the desire to go shows

how much the OCD has taken from her. I ultimately want whatever is best for

her. Hopefully I wont have to pursue the legal aspect but I dont want her in a

school with violent kids either. Thanks for the great suggestions about trying

the school for a half day or so. That makes perfect sense. Im very glad your

son is doing better at his new school. I appreciate your advice and will

check back with everyone. Thanks again!

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To:

> Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 1:05 PM

> Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

>

>

>

> IDEA is a federal law and so the laws are is the same in all states. I totally

agree with the idea that states and districts try to reinterpret them often in

their own interest.

>

> First, the psychiatrist prescribes the amount of time on home instruction, not

the district as the district is not licensed to make a medical determination.

The school will naturally want to end the home instruction quickly, but it's not

completely their decision.

>

> Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

>

> I want to tell you also that the right school is extremely important. My son

was placed in a therapeutic school and it was a nightmare. Anxious kids should

not be in environments where there is a lot of acting out. Kids with conduct

disorder, ODD, ect...have very different needs than anxious kids. The

psychiatric/psychological care he got there was substandard in my opinion, and

he got poor grades as well. This place was considered to be a good school?

Honestly, I think that a special education school with small class size and

caring teachers who can handle issues together with a class make up of mostly

kids like your dd can be a good place to get an education. You'll not find the

perfect place, but there are schools that you can work with and compromise won't

be so costly. I think we've found such a school and it has made a huge

difference.

>

> Does your daughter want to go to school? That's something to consider as well.

>

> I think the first step is to get a prescription from your psychiatrist for

home instruction for 1-2 months. Possibly get a second opinion for psychiatric

care...follow your instincts on this. Begin looking at private schools and make

sure that they let your dd spend a half day or two in class there....that helped

us pick out our present school. Tell her it won't be perfect, but to give it a

try. You'll be able to get a sense of whether or not she'll do OK there.

>

> You must sign the IEP in order for your dd to be placed, and she cannot be

denied a public education. If you are being pushed, you might want to hire an

advocate or lawyer. After our fiasco at a therapeutic school, I hired a lawyer

who was not only a lawyer but also a spec Ed teacher. She grew up in our very

district as well. She pointed us toward the school we eventually picked. Having

a knowledgeable person on your side is worth every penny .

>

> Feel free to e mail me if I can help you in any way.

>

> Bonnie

>

>

> > >

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?Â

My experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as

I have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to makeÂ

them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> > > Â

> > > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed? I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need whenÂ

we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> > > Â

> > > Any direction info would be most appreciated. Thank so much!

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

I might be wrong about how to deal with that one, but no one needs to eat a ho

ho, ever.  I would tell her that she never, in her entire life, has to eat a ho

ho, especially if she thinks it would make her throw up.  I would also talk to

her about - what would happen if she did throw up?  It isnt that awful and she

would get through it and be ok.

Sharon

________________________________

To: " " < >

Cc: " " < >

Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 6:21 AM

Subject: Re: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

 

My daughter has just recently had obsessive thoughts about a certain food ( a ho

ho ) that might make her threw up. What strategies do I use to help her get rid

of the thoughts? This is a new one for me

Sent from my iPhone

> Bonnie, hi!

>

> It was sudden onset and very severe case. Debilitating-- and both phychologist

and phychiatrist said no school or even school work at home until further

notice. We are looking into the PANDAS aspect and shes now being treated by a

pediatrician who has sucessfully treated PANDAS kids who asked us to not

pursure CBT/ERP or increase her meds until hes done testing. So now we're in

limbo waiting to see what course of treatment we should take and the school is

insisting we meet to go over all the issues. (Hoping to have a clearer picture

by the 1st of the year.) Thats the point. I dont yet know where we are headed

only that its going to take more time. Thats why I was asking for info from all

the OCD warriors who have traveled down this road before. We saw the

phychiatrist a week ago and they said dd is still not ready and phych want us to

up the meds which I rather not until I know for sure its Not PANDAS as I have

read that PANDAS

> kids do not do well on high doses antidepresents.

> Thank you for clarifiing who impliments the plan for going back to school. I

can at leaset breathe a little easier knowing that the school cannot have final

say in the matter.

>

> My dd has occasional good days where she really misses her classmates and

teachers and wants to go back. . She was straigth A student, loved school, the

teachers, the kids. So for her to have no interest or the desire to go shows

how much the OCD has taken from her. I ultimately want whatever is best for

her. Hopefully I wont have to pursue the legal aspect but I dont want her in a

school with violent kids either. Thanks for the great suggestions about trying

the school for a half day or so. That makes perfect sense. Im very glad your

son is doing better at his new school. I appreciate your advice and will

check back with everyone. Thanks again!

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To:

> Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 1:05 PM

> Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

>

>

>

> IDEA is a federal law and so the laws are is the same in all states. I totally

agree with the idea that states and districts try to reinterpret them often in

their own interest.

>

> First, the psychiatrist prescribes the amount of time on home instruction, not

the district as the district is not licensed to make a medical determination.

The school will naturally want to end the home instruction quickly, but it's not

completely their decision.

>

> Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

>

> I want to tell you also that the right school is extremely important. My son

was placed in a therapeutic school and it was a nightmare. Anxious kids should

not be in environments where there is a lot of acting out. Kids with conduct

disorder, ODD, ect...have very different needs than anxious kids. The

psychiatric/psychological care he got there was substandard in my opinion, and

he got poor grades as well. This place was considered to be a good school?

Honestly, I think that a special education school with small class size and

caring teachers who can handle issues together with a class make up of mostly

kids like your dd can be a good place to get an education. You'll not find the

perfect place, but there are schools that you can work with and compromise won't

be so costly. I think we've found such a school and it has made a huge

difference.

>

> Does your daughter want to go to school? That's something to consider as well.

>

> I think the first step is to get a prescription from your psychiatrist for

home instruction for 1-2 months. Possibly get a second opinion for psychiatric

care...follow your instincts on this. Begin looking at private schools and make

sure that they let your dd spend a half day or two in class there....that helped

us pick out our present school. Tell her it won't be perfect, but to give it a

try. You'll be able to get a sense of whether or not she'll do OK there.

>

> You must sign the IEP in order for your dd to be placed, and she cannot be

denied a public education. If you are being pushed, you might want to hire an

advocate or lawyer. After our fiasco at a therapeutic school, I hired a lawyer

who was not only a lawyer but also a spec Ed teacher. She grew up in our very

district as well. She pointed us toward the school we eventually picked. Having

a knowledgeable person on your side is worth every penny .

>

> Feel free to e mail me if I can help you in any way.

>

> Bonnie

>

>

> > >

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?Â

My experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as

I have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to makeÂ

them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> > > Â

> > > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed? I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need whenÂ

we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> > > Â

> > > Any direction info would be most appreciated. Thank so much!

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

I don't think this really has to do with the health benefits of eating or not

eating a hoho, but rather that it is important to nip in the bud each new

obsession so that it doesn't generalize to more and more things. If I was

worried about the nutritional value of food, so I wasn't giving my child

anything but " healthy " snacks, I would still want to have my child do some

exposures to eating hohos, not because she should become used to eating them,

but rather so she sees that the fear of vomiting is just an obsession and she

can resist the compulsions that result.

Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

>

>

>

> IDEA is a federal law and so the laws are is the same in all states. I totally

agree with the idea that states and districts try to reinterpret them often in

their own interest.

>

> First, the psychiatrist prescribes the amount of time on home instruction, not

the district as the district is not licensed to make a medical determination.

The school will naturally want to end the home instruction quickly, but it's not

completely their decision.

>

> Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

>

> I want to tell you also that the right school is extremely important. My son

was placed in a therapeutic school and it was a nightmare. Anxious kids should

not be in environments where there is a lot of acting out. Kids with conduct

disorder, ODD, ect...have very different needs than anxious kids. The

psychiatric/psychological care he got there was substandard in my opinion, and

he got poor grades as well. This place was considered to be a good school?

Honestly, I think that a special education school with small class size and

caring teachers who can handle issues together with a class make up of mostly

kids like your dd can be a good place to get an education. You'll not find the

perfect place, but there are schools that you can work with and compromise won't

be so costly. I think we've found such a school and it has made a huge

difference.

>

> Does your daughter want to go to school? That's something to consider as well.

>

> I think the first step is to get a prescription from your psychiatrist for

home instruction for 1-2 months. Possibly get a second opinion for psychiatric

care...follow your instincts on this. Begin looking at private schools and make

sure that they let your dd spend a half day or two in class there....that helped

us pick out our present school. Tell her it won't be perfect, but to give it a

try. You'll be able to get a sense of whether or not she'll do OK there.

>

> You must sign the IEP in order for your dd to be placed, and she cannot be

denied a public education. If you are being pushed, you might want to hire an

advocate or lawyer. After our fiasco at a therapeutic school, I hired a lawyer

who was not only a lawyer but also a spec Ed teacher. She grew up in our very

district as well. She pointed us toward the school we eventually picked. Having

a knowledgeable person on your side is worth every penny .

>

> Feel free to e mail me if I can help you in any way.

>

> Bonnie

>

>

> > >

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?Â

My experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as

I have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to makeÂ

them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> > > Â

> > > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed? I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need whenÂ

we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> > > Â

> > > Any direction info would be most appreciated. Thank so much!

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

So helpful thank you

Sent from my iPhone

> I don't think this really has to do with the health benefits of eating or not

eating a hoho, but rather that it is important to nip in the bud each new

obsession so that it doesn't generalize to more and more things. If I was

worried about the nutritional value of food, so I wasn't giving my child

anything but " healthy " snacks, I would still want to have my child do some

exposures to eating hohos, not because she should become used to eating them,

but rather so she sees that the fear of vomiting is just an obsession and she

can resist the compulsions that result.

>

>

> Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

> > >

> > >

> > > Â

> > > They can recommend placement (location) if they feel they can't meet her

needs, and I think place her there. First thought here - just calmly listen to

what they have to say, see what they offer, what this special school can offer,

etc. Volunteer to tour it. But you can say that you and her doctors feel she is

not ready to go back. But you're willing to see this special school now, as if

she can't return yet it may be the best place for her when she's ready..... So

this shows you are expecting her to return at some point and are being agreeable

(vs being seen as not working with the school). I'm sure you're used to this,

with another child with an IEP.

> > >

> > > Hasn't she been getting homebound services any? If not, due to severity,

then it seems at this point in the year, she'd be held back anyway? I'm asking

here, if it's the case that she hasn't been able to do any schoolwork. I would

think they could just keep her on homebound if that is what she is currently

getting. Our handbook here in NC discusses homebound under " discipline " and

says:

> > >

> > > " Discipline and homebound instruction

> > > (a) If a change of placement occurs under the discipline requirements of

these Policies, an LEA shall not assign a student to homebound

> > > instruction without a determination by the student's IEP Team

> > > that the homebound instruction is the least restrictive alternative

> > > environment for that student. If it is determined that the homebound

> > > instruction is the least restrictive alternative environment for the

> > > student, the student's IEP team shall meet to determine the nature of

> > > the homebound educational services to be provided to the student. In

addition, the continued appropriateness of the homebound

> > > instruction shall be evaluated monthly by the designee or designees of the

student's IEP Team.

> > >

> > > ( " Educational services " means all of the following:

> > > (1) The necessary instructional hours per week in the form and format as

determined by the child's IEP team and consistent with federal and State law.

The instruction shall be deliveredby appropriately qualified teachers to the

extent required by federal and State law, which requires a free appropriate

public education and the opportunity for a sound basic education.

> > > (2) Related services including in the child's IEP.

> > > (3) Behavior intervention services to the extent required above NC

1504-2.1 (d) and (f).

> > > © " Homebound instruction " means educational services provided to a

student outside the school setting. "

> > >

> > > ALSO found the following:

> > >

> > > " Children determined eligible for services under Part B must receive a

program of special education and related services in accordance with an

individualized education program (IEP) developed at a meeting of the child's IEP

Team, including school officials and the child's parents. 34 CFR

§§300.320-300.324. The IEP, which addresses the child's unique educational

needs arising from the child's disability also forms the basis for the child's

placement decision. 34 CFR §300.116((2). Part B expresses a preference for

placing children with disabilities in regular classes with nondisabled children

if the child with a disability can be educated satisfactorily in the regular

educational environment with the use of supplementary aids and services. 34 CFR

§300.114. Although experience has demonstrated that many children with

disabilities can be educated satisfactorily in the regular classroom along with

children without disabilities, unless their

> > IEP calls

> > > for some other arrangement, IDEA also recognizes that the regular

classroom may not be the appropriate placement for some disabled children.

Therefore, each public agency must make available a continuum of alternative

placements, or a range of placement options, to meet the needs of children with

disabilities for special education and related services. The options on this

continuum include instruction in regular classes, special classes, special

schools, home instruction, and instruction in hospitals and institutions. 34 CFR

§300.115 (a) and ((1). Thus, the group responsible for making the placement

decision, which includes persons knowledgeable about the child and the child's

parent, selects the option on the continuum in which the child's IEP can be

appropriately implemented. 34 CFR §300.116(a)-(. "

> > >

> > > HOPE this helps gives you some ideas for discussing your point of view of

her needs in their terms. I agree, the best thing for her right now is to get

her well, on her way to getting well.

> > >

> > > There's some OCD school related information in our FILES section that you

could print out, but that is primarily for help when child is attending school.

Haven't read it lately, can't recall if it mentions anywhere about not being

able to attend. It goes with the info you will see on this site:

> > >

[Guest guest]

My children have had similar obsessions. In fact, we actually brought a pizza

to my daughter's therapy session once so she could overcome her fear of eating

pizza because each slice isn't the same and so it looked creepy to her. The

goal isn't necessarily for her to eat pizza, but to generalize the exposures to

other eating situations.

Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

> > >

> > >

> > > Â

> > > They can recommend placement (location) if they feel they can't meet her

needs, and I think place her there. First thought here - just calmly listen to

what they have to say, see what they offer, what this special school can offer,

etc. Volunteer to tour it. But you can say that you and her doctors feel she is

not ready to go back. But you're willing to see this special school now, as if

she can't return yet it may be the best place for her when she's ready..... So

this shows you are expecting her to return at some point and are being agreeable

(vs being seen as not working with the school). I'm sure you're used to this,

with another child with an IEP.

> > >

> > > Hasn't she been getting homebound services any? If not, due to severity,

then it seems at this point in the year, she'd be held back anyway? I'm asking

here, if it's the case that she hasn't been able to do any schoolwork. I would

think they could just keep her on homebound if that is what she is currently

getting. Our handbook here in NC discusses homebound under " discipline " and

says:

> > >

> > > " Discipline and homebound instruction

> > > (a) If a change of placement occurs under the discipline requirements of

these Policies, an LEA shall not assign a student to homebound

> > > instruction without a determination by the student's IEP Team

> > > that the homebound instruction is the least restrictive alternative

> > > environment for that student. If it is determined that the homebound

> > > instruction is the least restrictive alternative environment for the

> > > student, the student's IEP team shall meet to determine the nature of

> > > the homebound educational services to be provided to the student. In

addition, the continued appropriateness of the homebound

> > > instruction shall be evaluated monthly by the designee or designees of the

student's IEP Team.

> > >

> > > ( " Educational services " means all of the following:

> > > (1) The necessary instructional hours per week in the form and format as

determined by the child's IEP team and consistent with federal and State law.

The instruction shall be deliveredby appropriately qualified teachers to the

extent required by federal and State law, which requires a free appropriate

public education and the opportunity for a sound basic education.

> > > (2) Related services including in the child's IEP.

> > > (3) Behavior intervention services to the extent required above NC

1504-2.1 (d) and (f).

> > > © " Homebound instruction " means educational services provided to a

student outside the school setting. "

> > >

> > > ALSO found the following:

> > >

> > > " Children determined eligible for services under Part B must receive a

program of special education and related services in accordance with an

individualized education program (IEP) developed at a meeting of the child's IEP

Team, including school officials and the child's parents. 34 CFR

§§300.320-300.324. The IEP, which addresses the child's unique educational

needs arising from the child's disability also forms the basis for the child's

placement decision. 34 CFR §300.116((2). Part B expresses a preference for

placing children with disabilities in regular classes with nondisabled children

if the child with a disability can be educated satisfactorily in the regular

educational environment with the use of supplementary aids and services. 34 CFR

§300.114. Although experience has demonstrated that many children with

disabilities can be educated satisfactorily in the regular classroom along with

children without disabilities, unless their

> > IEP calls

> > > for some other arrangement, IDEA also recognizes that the regular

classroom may not be the appropriate placement for some disabled children.

Therefore, each public agency must make available a continuum of alternative

placements, or a range of placement options, to meet the needs of children with

disabilities for special education and related services. The options on this

continuum include instruction in regular classes, special classes, special

schools, home instruction, and instruction in hospitals and institutions. 34 CFR

§300.115 (a) and ((1). Thus, the group responsible for making the placement

decision, which includes persons knowledgeable about the child and the child's

parent, selects the option on the continuum in which the child's IEP can be

appropriately implemented. 34 CFR §300.116(a)-(. "

> > >

> > > HOPE this helps gives you some ideas for discussing your point of view of

her needs in their terms. I agree, the best thing for her right now is to get

her well, on her way to getting well.

> > >

> > > There's some OCD school related information in our FILES section that you

could print out, but that is primarily for help when child is attending school.

Haven't read it lately, can't recall if it mentions anywhere about not being

able to attend. It goes with the info you will see on this site:

> > >

[Guest guest]

My children have had similar obsessions. In fact, we actually brought a pizza

to my daughter's therapy session once so she could overcome her fear of eating

pizza because each slice isn't the same and so it looked creepy to her. The

goal isn't necessarily for her to eat pizza, but to generalize the exposures to

other eating situations.

Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

> > >

> > >

> > > Â

> > > They can recommend placement (location) if they feel they can't meet her

needs, and I think place her there. First thought here - just calmly listen to

what they have to say, see what they offer, what this special school can offer,

etc. Volunteer to tour it. But you can say that you and her doctors feel she is

not ready to go back. But you're willing to see this special school now, as if

she can't return yet it may be the best place for her when she's ready..... So

this shows you are expecting her to return at some point and are being agreeable

(vs being seen as not working with the school). I'm sure you're used to this,

with another child with an IEP.

> > >

> > > Hasn't she been getting homebound services any? If not, due to severity,

then it seems at this point in the year, she'd be held back anyway? I'm asking

here, if it's the case that she hasn't been able to do any schoolwork. I would

think they could just keep her on homebound if that is what she is currently

getting. Our handbook here in NC discusses homebound under " discipline " and

says:

> > >

> > > " Discipline and homebound instruction

> > > (a) If a change of placement occurs under the discipline requirements of

these Policies, an LEA shall not assign a student to homebound

> > > instruction without a determination by the student's IEP Team

> > > that the homebound instruction is the least restrictive alternative

> > > environment for that student. If it is determined that the homebound

> > > instruction is the least restrictive alternative environment for the

> > > student, the student's IEP team shall meet to determine the nature of

> > > the homebound educational services to be provided to the student. In

addition, the continued appropriateness of the homebound

> > > instruction shall be evaluated monthly by the designee or designees of the

student's IEP Team.

> > >

> > > ( " Educational services " means all of the following:

> > > (1) The necessary instructional hours per week in the form and format as

determined by the child's IEP team and consistent with federal and State law.

The instruction shall be deliveredby appropriately qualified teachers to the

extent required by federal and State law, which requires a free appropriate

public education and the opportunity for a sound basic education.

> > > (2) Related services including in the child's IEP.

> > > (3) Behavior intervention services to the extent required above NC

1504-2.1 (d) and (f).

> > > © " Homebound instruction " means educational services provided to a

student outside the school setting. "

> > >

> > > ALSO found the following:

> > >

> > > " Children determined eligible for services under Part B must receive a

program of special education and related services in accordance with an

individualized education program (IEP) developed at a meeting of the child's IEP

Team, including school officials and the child's parents. 34 CFR

§§300.320-300.324. The IEP, which addresses the child's unique educational

needs arising from the child's disability also forms the basis for the child's

placement decision. 34 CFR §300.116((2). Part B expresses a preference for

placing children with disabilities in regular classes with nondisabled children

if the child with a disability can be educated satisfactorily in the regular

educational environment with the use of supplementary aids and services. 34 CFR

§300.114. Although experience has demonstrated that many children with

disabilities can be educated satisfactorily in the regular classroom along with

children without disabilities, unless their

> > IEP calls

> > > for some other arrangement, IDEA also recognizes that the regular

classroom may not be the appropriate placement for some disabled children.

Therefore, each public agency must make available a continuum of alternative

placements, or a range of placement options, to meet the needs of children with

disabilities for special education and related services. The options on this

continuum include instruction in regular classes, special classes, special

schools, home instruction, and instruction in hospitals and institutions. 34 CFR

§300.115 (a) and ((1). Thus, the group responsible for making the placement

decision, which includes persons knowledgeable about the child and the child's

parent, selects the option on the continuum in which the child's IEP can be

appropriately implemented. 34 CFR §300.116(a)-(. "

> > >

> > > HOPE this helps gives you some ideas for discussing your point of view of

her needs in their terms. I agree, the best thing for her right now is to get

her well, on her way to getting well.

> > >

> > > There's some OCD school related information in our FILES section that you

could print out, but that is primarily for help when child is attending school.

Haven't read it lately, can't recall if it mentions anywhere about not being

able to attend. It goes with the info you will see on this site:

> > >

[Guest guest]

Since your daughter is so very ill and it was such sudden onset, I'd wonder if

they could just try treating her for strep (PANDAS). If antibiotics for strep

make a huge difference for her, then it doesn't really matter what her blood

tests say--in my opinion, anyway. If I were you, I would find it so hard to be

patient!

> Bonnie, hi!

>

> It was sudden onset and very severe case. Debilitating-- and both phychologist

and phychiatrist said no school or even school work at home until further

notice. We are looking into the PANDAS aspect and shes now being treated by a

pediatrician who has sucessfully treated PANDAS kids who asked us to not

pursure CBT/ERP or increase her meds until hes done testing. So now we're in

limbo waiting to see what course of treatment we should take and the school is

insisting we meet to go over all the issues. (Hoping to have a clearer picture

by the 1st of the year.) Thats the point. I dont yet know where we are headed

only that its going to take more time. Thats why I was asking for info from all

the OCD warriors who have traveled down this road before. We saw the

phychiatrist a week ago and they said dd is still not ready and phych want us to

up the meds which I rather not until I know for sure its Not PANDAS as I have

read that PANDAS

> kids do not do well on high doses antidepresents.

> Thank you for clarifiing who impliments the plan for going back to school. I

can at leaset breathe a little easier knowing that the school cannot have final

say in the matter.

>

> My dd has occasional good days where she really misses her classmates and

teachers and wants to go back. . She was straigth A student, loved school, the

teachers, the kids. So for her to have no interest or the desire to go shows

how much the OCD has taken from her. I ultimately want whatever is best for

her. Hopefully I wont have to pursue the legal aspect but I dont want her in a

school with violent kids either. Thanks for the great suggestions about trying

the school for a half day or so. That makes perfect sense. Im very glad your

son is doing better at his new school. I appreciate your advice and will

check back with everyone. Thanks again!

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To:

> Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 1:05 PM

> Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

>

>

>

> IDEA is a federal law and so the laws are is the same in all states. I totally

agree with the idea that states and districts try to reinterpret them often in

their own interest.

>

> First, the psychiatrist prescribes the amount of time on home instruction, not

the district as the district is not licensed to make a medical determination.

The school will naturally want to end the home instruction quickly, but it's not

completely their decision.

>

> Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

>

> I want to tell you also that the right school is extremely important. My son

was placed in a therapeutic school and it was a nightmare. Anxious kids should

not be in environments where there is a lot of acting out. Kids with conduct

disorder, ODD, ect...have very different needs than anxious kids. The

psychiatric/psychological care he got there was substandard in my opinion, and

he got poor grades as well. This place was considered to be a good school?

Honestly, I think that a special education school with small class size and

caring teachers who can handle issues together with a class make up of mostly

kids like your dd can be a good place to get an education. You'll not find the

perfect place, but there are schools that you can work with and compromise won't

be so costly. I think we've found such a school and it has made a huge

difference.

>

> Does your daughter want to go to school? That's something to consider as well.

>

> I think the first step is to get a prescription from your psychiatrist for

home instruction for 1-2 months. Possibly get a second opinion for psychiatric

care...follow your instincts on this. Begin looking at private schools and make

sure that they let your dd spend a half day or two in class there....that helped

us pick out our present school. Tell her it won't be perfect, but to give it a

try. You'll be able to get a sense of whether or not she'll do OK there.

>

> You must sign the IEP in order for your dd to be placed, and she cannot be

denied a public education. If you are being pushed, you might want to hire an

advocate or lawyer. After our fiasco at a therapeutic school, I hired a lawyer

who was not only a lawyer but also a spec Ed teacher. She grew up in our very

district as well. She pointed us toward the school we eventually picked. Having

a knowledgeable person on your side is worth every penny .

>

> Feel free to e mail me if I can help you in any way.

>

> Bonnie

>

>

> > >

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level? My

experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as I

have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to makeÂ

them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> > > Â

> > > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed? I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need whenÂ

we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> > > Â

> > > Any direction info would be most appreciated. Thank so much!

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Yes, I agree and so did new Dr.   He put her on a steroid burst which in my

understanding is what they do for PANDAS kids who have had issues with long term

anitbiotics use. (If someone knows the protocol by all means comment here so I

do not misinform anyone.) So we will see if she improves over the next few

weeks.  If she does I guess we will know for sure its PANDAS.  If not, we go

with some intense outpatient CBT/ERP and continue with meds.   Either way, we'll

know which road to take so that will help clarify her treatment and hopefully

get some forward movement going. 

 

What I found very frustrating is that in our case 2 pedicatricians did not want

to help us pursue the PANDAS aspect of this.

________________________________

To:

Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2011 2:25 PM

Subject: Re: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

Since your daughter is so very ill and it was such sudden onset, I'd wonder if

they could just try treating her for strep (PANDAS).  If  antibiotics for strep

make a huge difference for her, then it doesn't really matter what her blood

tests say--in my opinion, anyway.  If I were you, I would find it so hard to be

patient!

> Bonnie, hi!

> 

> It was sudden onset and very severe case. Debilitating-- and both phychologist

and phychiatrist said no school  or even school work at home until further

notice. We are looking into the PANDAS aspect and shes now being treated by a

pediatrician who has sucessfully treated PANDAS kids who  asked us to not

pursure CBT/ERP or increase her meds until hes done testing.  So now we're in

limbo waiting to see what course of treatment we should take and the school is

insisting we meet to go over all the issues. (Hoping to have a clearer picture

by the 1st of the year.)  Thats the point. I dont yet know where we are headed

only that its going to take more time.  Thats why I was asking for info from all

the OCD warriors who have traveled down this road before.  We saw the

phychiatrist a week ago and they said dd is still not ready and phych want us to

up the meds which I rather not until I know for sure its Not PANDAS as I have

read that PANDAS

> kids do not do well on high doses antidepresents. 

> Thank you for clarifiing who impliments the plan for going back to school.  I

can at leaset breathe a little easier knowing that the school cannot have final

say in the matter. 

> 

> My dd has occasional good days where she really misses her classmates and

teachers and wants to go back. . She was straigth A student, loved school, the

teachers, the kids.  So for her to have no interest or the desire to go shows

how much the OCD has taken from her.  I ultimately want whatever is best for

her.  Hopefully I wont have to pursue the legal aspect but I dont want her in a

school with violent kids either. Thanks for the great suggestions about trying

the school for a half day or so.  That makes perfect sense.  Im very glad your

son is doing better at his new school.    I appreciate your advice and will

check back with everyone.  Thanks again!

> 

>

> ________________________________

>

> To:

> Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 1:05 PM

> Subject: Re: What can schools do when child is out for

extended period?

>

> 

>

> IDEA is a federal law and so the laws are is the same in all states. I totally

agree with the idea that states and districts try to reinterpret them often in

their own interest.

>

> First, the psychiatrist prescribes the amount of time on home instruction, not

the district as the district is not licensed to make a medical determination.

The school will naturally want to end the home instruction quickly, but it's not

completely their decision.

>

> Secondly, I am wondering why your dd is still so sick after 3 mos. I think

it's one thing to be unable to function in a public school environment, it's

another to not be able to function when stress is relieved such as when on home

instruction. Believe me, my son has been very sick, but never for so many months

and he always got better a couple of weeks after being home. Have you sought a

second psychiatric opinion?

>

> I want to tell you also that the right school is extremely important. My son

was placed in a therapeutic school and it was a nightmare. Anxious kids should

not be in environments where there is a lot of acting out. Kids with conduct

disorder, ODD, ect...have very different needs than anxious kids. The

psychiatric/psychological care he got there was substandard in my opinion, and

he got poor grades as well. This place was considered to be a good school?

Honestly, I think that a special education school with small class size and

caring teachers who can handle issues together with a class make up of mostly

kids like your dd can be a good place to get an education. You'll not find the

perfect place, but there are schools that you can work with and compromise won't

be so costly. I think we've found such a school and it has made a huge

difference.

>

> Does your daughter want to go to school? That's something to consider as well.

>

> I think the first step is to get a prescription from your psychiatrist for

home instruction for 1-2 months. Possibly get a second opinion for psychiatric

care...follow your instincts on this. Begin looking at private schools and make

sure that they let your dd spend a half day or two in class there....that helped

us pick out our present school. Tell her it won't be perfect, but to give it a

try. You'll be able to get a sense of whether or not she'll do OK there.

>

> You must sign the IEP in order for your dd to be placed, and she cannot be

denied a public education. If you are being pushed, you might want to hire an

advocate or lawyer. After our fiasco at a therapeutic school, I hired a lawyer

who was not only a lawyer but also a spec Ed teacher. She grew up in our very

district as well. She pointed us toward the school we eventually picked. Having

a knowledgeable person on your side is worth every penny .

>

> Feel free to e mail me if I can help you in any way.

>

> Bonnie

>

>

> > >

> > Can they kick her out or place her somewhere else legally? Is there some

cut off in which if so many days are missed they have the right to do so? Who,

what agency should I be talking to? Should I be concerned on a legal level?  My

experience with the special needs coordinator has not always been amicable as I

have another dd who has an IEP and historically, I've had to fight to makeÂ

them to provide the services she needed/deserved.

> > > Â

> > > Right now it looks as though it may be months till shes better. Could she

just take the grade next year if needed?  I have no idea how long this will

take and additional pressure from the school is just not what we need whenÂ

we're just trying to find out what the right/best treatment is.

> > > Â

> > > Any direction info would be most appreciated.  Thank so much!

> > >

> > >