Re: Dissecting the Savage spin

[Guest guest]

The good thing about the whole Savage mess (and I think that

he's an idiot, but it also seems typical of a conservative shock-jock trying

to get ratings, which seems to be working for him quite well), is that it's

at least broadened the discussion on autism in the public eye away from

vaccinations.

It's good to at least see mainstream media discussing OTHER issues

about autism- maybe some day they'll actually start caring about how

we can actually provide the best for our kids, especially once they become

adults.

Jen

Greg Reich wrote:

>

> Since Savage's attack on children with autism on July 16th, he has

> been spinning himself into a victim of political persecution and a

> hero for children with " real " autism, as he puts it. I went back

> through the original audio, including the preceding couple of minutes,

> and broke it down in light of the subsequent spin. If you're

> interested, go to

>

http://gregstake.blogspot.com/2008/07/audio-that-started-it-all-context-what.htm\

l

>

<http://gregstake.blogspot.com/2008/07/audio-that-started-it-all-context-what.ht\

ml>

>

> http://tinyurl.com/6mwbcn <http://tinyurl.com/6mwbcn>

>

> I have a four year old girl, Caitlin, with autism. Maybe Savage would

> consider her one of those with " real " autism, but he's never defined

> his criteria, and he still differentiates autism from the autism

> spectrum and continues to call the latter a fiction. He has brought on

> an " expert " by the name of Breggin, who claims that all

> childhood psychiatric disorders are the result of abuse--though he did

> not go that far on Savage's show--it's chapter 12 in his book, Toxic

> Psychiatry. He also resurrected the sterotype of the " refrigerator

> mother " .

>

> I am truly hoping that the attention span on this issue is not short.

> We have to keep after Savage's advertisers, many of whom are claiming

> they do not advertise during his show (which is why I keep logs of

> when I hear their commercials, as others are doing in other markets as

> part of this effort).

>

>

[Guest guest]

The good thing about the whole Savage mess (and I think that

he's an idiot, but it also seems typical of a conservative shock-jock trying

to get ratings, which seems to be working for him quite well), is that it's

at least broadened the discussion on autism in the public eye away from

vaccinations.

It's good to at least see mainstream media discussing OTHER issues

about autism- maybe some day they'll actually start caring about how

we can actually provide the best for our kids, especially once they become

adults.

Jen

Greg Reich wrote:

>

> Since Savage's attack on children with autism on July 16th, he has

> been spinning himself into a victim of political persecution and a

> hero for children with " real " autism, as he puts it. I went back

> through the original audio, including the preceding couple of minutes,

> and broke it down in light of the subsequent spin. If you're

> interested, go to

>

http://gregstake.blogspot.com/2008/07/audio-that-started-it-all-context-what.htm\

l

>

<http://gregstake.blogspot.com/2008/07/audio-that-started-it-all-context-what.ht\

ml>

>

> http://tinyurl.com/6mwbcn <http://tinyurl.com/6mwbcn>

>

> I have a four year old girl, Caitlin, with autism. Maybe Savage would

> consider her one of those with " real " autism, but he's never defined

> his criteria, and he still differentiates autism from the autism

> spectrum and continues to call the latter a fiction. He has brought on

> an " expert " by the name of Breggin, who claims that all

> childhood psychiatric disorders are the result of abuse--though he did

> not go that far on Savage's show--it's chapter 12 in his book, Toxic

> Psychiatry. He also resurrected the sterotype of the " refrigerator

> mother " .

>

> I am truly hoping that the attention span on this issue is not short.

> We have to keep after Savage's advertisers, many of whom are claiming

> they do not advertise during his show (which is why I keep logs of

> when I hear their commercials, as others are doing in other markets as

> part of this effort).

>

>

[Guest guest]

Abuse does not cause of autism, but autism can lead familes to abuse.

Sondra

[Guest guest]

Abuse does not cause of autism, but autism can lead familes to abuse.

Sondra

[Guest guest]

It's not just conservative shock jocks, liberal ones can be just as

hurtful, howard stern being a great example. Unfortunately stupid

comments are non-partisan. I think the entire thing is falling right

along party lines, the libs are trying to use what he said to get rid

of him, the conservatives are rallying around him. Ironically Imus is

the first one I saw who got more conservative support than liberal,

and what he said wasn't anything plenty of other men haven't said in

songs that people rave as art.

I think savage is an idiot, but whether it's savage, stern, or anyone

in between, a talk show host has a right to be wrong & not be

blackballed off the air just because it's wrong, unpopular, etc. If

the same/similar comment had been made in a position of authority,

such as a physician, educator, or political leader (one with voting

power, not commentator) then I would be first in line to give the

boot. But radio talk show hosts, particularly one I consider an idiot,

don't have authority, only entertainment value.

I don't think savage spinning, the few times I've heard him over the

years he has made similar points, that kids are over-drugged,

under-nourished, and under-parented. He's said these things for years.

A lot of times I agree with him on those points. I also think that we

can all be overly judgmental toward parents and personal kid

situations. But I don't think any of those warrant someone losing

his/her job, particularly when their job is to be provocative, which

he certainly was.

I think talk show hosts have a right to be wrong and to be stupid.

Those who don't want to listen can simply turn the dial, as I do

regularly when I hear his voice on the radio.

Debi

[Guest guest]

An excellent job in dissecting, sir.

 

I have read and re-read the quotes many times, and I am still dumbfounded by its

incredible lack of humanity.

 

Although it is my intention to keep fighting the culture of ignorance and

intolerance we all face daily, I am somewhat skeptical of our future victories.

 

My daughter was diagnosed over three years ago, and the only thing that keeps

her functional and stable enough to keep from upsetting the communities

sensibilities is an adult mood stabilizer.  Long term effects seem unknown to

most, but all that fellow diners want is a quiet meal.  All that fellow shoppers

want is a quietly self-indulgent experience at the mall.  To this day I never

cease to be amazed at people giving me a disapproving glare when Evvie melts

down in public.  Its the usual, " Can't you even control your child. " look.

 

We live in a culture where we feel entitled to have everything our way,  and the

illness of a child is no excuse for our having to tolerate its presence.

 

Truly amazing for a country that used to raise millions just by showing our

citizens pictures of children condemned to live in iron lungs or wheel chairs.

 

As the budget crunch continues, I expect to have even more pressure from our

school district to move Evvie out of the private school they put her into, and

back to " mainstreaming. "

 

So thank you for your efforts, and I will support any boy cot against those who

finance such bilge water, but I am beginning to think the only thing that will

make a difference in our nation is getting back our national conscience.

Subject: Dissecting the Savage spin

To: autism-Michigan , autism_in_Girls

Date: Sunday, July 27, 2008, 6:53 PM

Since Savage's attack on children with autism on July 16th, he has been spinning

himself into a victim of political persecution and a hero for children with

" real " autism, as he puts it. I went back through the original audio, including

the preceding couple of minutes, and broke it down in light of the subsequent

spin. If you're interested, go to http://gregstake. blogspot.. com/2008/

07/audio- that-started- it-all-context- what.html

http://tinyurl. com/6mwbcn

I have a four year old girl, Caitlin, with autism. Maybe Savage would consider

her one of those with " real " autism, but he's never defined his criteria, and he

still differentiates autism from the autism spectrum and continues to call the

latter a fiction. He has brought on an " expert " by the name of Breggin,

who claims that all childhood psychiatric disorders are the result of

abuse--though he did not go that far on Savage's show--it's chapter 12 in his

book, Toxic Psychiatry. He also resurrected the sterotype of the " refrigerator

mother " .

I am truly hoping that the attention span on this issue is not short. We have to

keep after Savage's advertisers, many of whom are claiming they do not advertise

during his show (which is why I keep logs of when I hear their commercials, as

others are doing in other markets as part of this effort).

[Guest guest]

An excellent job in dissecting, sir.

 

I have read and re-read the quotes many times, and I am still dumbfounded by its

incredible lack of humanity.

 

Although it is my intention to keep fighting the culture of ignorance and

intolerance we all face daily, I am somewhat skeptical of our future victories.

 

My daughter was diagnosed over three years ago, and the only thing that keeps

her functional and stable enough to keep from upsetting the communities

sensibilities is an adult mood stabilizer.  Long term effects seem unknown to

most, but all that fellow diners want is a quiet meal.  All that fellow shoppers

want is a quietly self-indulgent experience at the mall.  To this day I never

cease to be amazed at people giving me a disapproving glare when Evvie melts

down in public.  Its the usual, " Can't you even control your child. " look.

 

We live in a culture where we feel entitled to have everything our way,  and the

illness of a child is no excuse for our having to tolerate its presence.

 

Truly amazing for a country that used to raise millions just by showing our

citizens pictures of children condemned to live in iron lungs or wheel chairs.

 

As the budget crunch continues, I expect to have even more pressure from our

school district to move Evvie out of the private school they put her into, and

back to " mainstreaming. "

 

So thank you for your efforts, and I will support any boy cot against those who

finance such bilge water, but I am beginning to think the only thing that will

make a difference in our nation is getting back our national conscience.

Subject: Dissecting the Savage spin

To: autism-Michigan , autism_in_Girls

Date: Sunday, July 27, 2008, 6:53 PM

Since Savage's attack on children with autism on July 16th, he has been spinning

himself into a victim of political persecution and a hero for children with

" real " autism, as he puts it. I went back through the original audio, including

the preceding couple of minutes, and broke it down in light of the subsequent

spin. If you're interested, go to http://gregstake. blogspot.. com/2008/

07/audio- that-started- it-all-context- what.html

http://tinyurl. com/6mwbcn

I have a four year old girl, Caitlin, with autism. Maybe Savage would consider

her one of those with " real " autism, but he's never defined his criteria, and he

still differentiates autism from the autism spectrum and continues to call the

latter a fiction. He has brought on an " expert " by the name of Breggin,

who claims that all childhood psychiatric disorders are the result of

abuse--though he did not go that far on Savage's show--it's chapter 12 in his

book, Toxic Psychiatry. He also resurrected the sterotype of the " refrigerator

mother " .

I am truly hoping that the attention span on this issue is not short. We have to

keep after Savage's advertisers, many of whom are claiming they do not advertise

during his show (which is why I keep logs of when I hear their commercials, as

others are doing in other markets as part of this effort).

[Guest guest]

I agree Sondra. But I have seen some kids who have been abused who

appear to have autism, perhaps that is some of the thought, that since

there is no definitive bloodwork, scan, etc to conclude autism then

these kids may be getting autism diagnoses instead of proper help in

their families. Obviously if a child is behaving this way from abuse

screaming at the child or acting harsh isn't going to fix it, only

love, compassion, and lots of time & caring. Bettelheim, the one who

coined " refrigerator mother " did so after seeing abused Jewish

children in concentration camps acting as if they had autism.

We need to figure out a way to separate these kids from the ones who

have physiological autism. We need health care for these kids and

adults that they are not getting. That's the thing I wish we could all

focus on, not the stupid parts of what savage said, he often says

stupid things.

Debi

>

> Abuse does not cause of autism, but autism can lead familes to abuse.

> Sondra

>

[Guest guest]

I agree Sondra. But I have seen some kids who have been abused who

appear to have autism, perhaps that is some of the thought, that since

there is no definitive bloodwork, scan, etc to conclude autism then

these kids may be getting autism diagnoses instead of proper help in

their families. Obviously if a child is behaving this way from abuse

screaming at the child or acting harsh isn't going to fix it, only

love, compassion, and lots of time & caring. Bettelheim, the one who

coined " refrigerator mother " did so after seeing abused Jewish

children in concentration camps acting as if they had autism.

We need to figure out a way to separate these kids from the ones who

have physiological autism. We need health care for these kids and

adults that they are not getting. That's the thing I wish we could all

focus on, not the stupid parts of what savage said, he often says

stupid things.

Debi

>

> Abuse does not cause of autism, but autism can lead familes to abuse.

> Sondra

>

[Guest guest]

Debi yes but the kids you are of referring too was also insulted by

chemicals, lack of adequate food for mental development and lacked

stimulation for them to develop in a health typical fashions, they were

of triggered into the autism by outside influences and those with

autism were triggered into it by insults unknown such as many with

autism are of with poor diets, are insulted with chemicals their bodys

cant rid of and they lack typical stimulation because of brain

differences not because they are of deprived, so both have the same

core outcome but different causes to get to that core outcome. not sure

if I to maked of sense, but one was insulted by intent and the other

was insulted without intent.

so when you look at the absorbtion issues many with autism have they

may be creating the same things those who are of severely deprived of

diet are, those who are not allowed and dileberatly deprived of social

and paly stimulation are of no different than those with autism whose

brains prvent success with the same, and so the reasons and outcomes

can look similar.

sondra

[Guest guest]

Debi yes but the kids you are of referring too was also insulted by

chemicals, lack of adequate food for mental development and lacked

stimulation for them to develop in a health typical fashions, they were

of triggered into the autism by outside influences and those with

autism were triggered into it by insults unknown such as many with

autism are of with poor diets, are insulted with chemicals their bodys

cant rid of and they lack typical stimulation because of brain

differences not because they are of deprived, so both have the same

core outcome but different causes to get to that core outcome. not sure

if I to maked of sense, but one was insulted by intent and the other

was insulted without intent.

so when you look at the absorbtion issues many with autism have they

may be creating the same things those who are of severely deprived of

diet are, those who are not allowed and dileberatly deprived of social

and paly stimulation are of no different than those with autism whose

brains prvent success with the same, and so the reasons and outcomes

can look similar.

sondra

[Guest guest]

If only it were as simply as turning the dial. This guy supposedly has the

number three audience in talk radio, which means he has some influence. As

such, I can use the free market force of boycott and protest to request that

companies advertising on Savage's show withdraw their support.

I don't think I have the right to legislate him off the air or take him to

court, but what I am doing is absolutely within my rights and within my power.

His listeners vote. When he makes them all the more ignorant by perpetuating

myths about autism (he wasn't even talking about parenting or drug companies

when he launched into his tirade; he went from talking about funding for AIDS

victims in Africa to how he would rather see cancer and diabetes treated in the

United States, then launched into why he didn't mention funding treatement for

autism. That was the context), he influences special education classes and

research funding, and he also casts me and my child in a suspicious light, as he

does you and yours.

The difference between Savage and Stern is that Stern doesn't call ASD a fiction

(and yes, Savage is still doing that) and say that funding for ASD is taking

money away from children with " real " autism. I'm not saying what Stern does is

in any way noble or heroic, but I haven't heard him once call special needs of

any kind a " fraud " or " racket " .

Debi wrote:

I think talk show hosts have a right to be wrong and to be stupid.

Those who don't want to listen can simply turn the dial, as I do

regularly when I hear his voice on the radio.

[Guest guest]

If only it were as simply as turning the dial. This guy supposedly has the

number three audience in talk radio, which means he has some influence. As

such, I can use the free market force of boycott and protest to request that

companies advertising on Savage's show withdraw their support.

I don't think I have the right to legislate him off the air or take him to

court, but what I am doing is absolutely within my rights and within my power.

His listeners vote. When he makes them all the more ignorant by perpetuating

myths about autism (he wasn't even talking about parenting or drug companies

when he launched into his tirade; he went from talking about funding for AIDS

victims in Africa to how he would rather see cancer and diabetes treated in the

United States, then launched into why he didn't mention funding treatement for

autism. That was the context), he influences special education classes and

research funding, and he also casts me and my child in a suspicious light, as he

does you and yours.

The difference between Savage and Stern is that Stern doesn't call ASD a fiction

(and yes, Savage is still doing that) and say that funding for ASD is taking

money away from children with " real " autism. I'm not saying what Stern does is

in any way noble or heroic, but I haven't heard him once call special needs of

any kind a " fraud " or " racket " .

Debi wrote:

I think talk show hosts have a right to be wrong and to be stupid.

Those who don't want to listen can simply turn the dial, as I do

regularly when I hear his voice on the radio.

[Guest guest]

I don't know...I think we still have a national conscience; I just don't think

we have the leadership or the examples available to direct it at the moment.

When you look at horrific events like 9/11 or Hurricane Katrina, there's no

shortage of individuals who will give money and time. It's a lack of

coordination of efforts and a lack of political will to set things straight, not

to mention a media that is conflict-driven and rarely does investigative

reporting on anything consequential anymore.

wrote:

So thank you for your efforts, and I will support any boy cot against those who

finance such bilge water, but I am beginning to think the only thing that will

make a difference in our nation is getting back our national conscience.

[Guest guest]

I don't know...I think we still have a national conscience; I just don't think

we have the leadership or the examples available to direct it at the moment.

When you look at horrific events like 9/11 or Hurricane Katrina, there's no

shortage of individuals who will give money and time. It's a lack of

coordination of efforts and a lack of political will to set things straight, not

to mention a media that is conflict-driven and rarely does investigative

reporting on anything consequential anymore.

wrote:

So thank you for your efforts, and I will support any boy cot against those who

finance such bilge water, but I am beginning to think the only thing that will

make a difference in our nation is getting back our national conscience.

[Guest guest]

I agree sir, that a national sense of direction/purpose, is missing.  I too

agree that the news media is dealing in nothing with substance attached to it,

but I must tell you that most of the public I deal with on a day to day basis,

is so centered on their wants and their needs that they have excluded the needs

and wants of those about them.

 

Suffice it to say that if you see a little girl screaming and hitting herself in

the head on a grocery store floor and any emotion besides pity for her enters

your mind, then perhaps the pity should be shown toward the viewer.

So thank you for your efforts, and I will support any boy cot against those who

finance such bilge water, but I am beginning to think the only thing that will

make a difference in our nation is getting back our national conscience.

[Guest guest]

I agree sir, that a national sense of direction/purpose, is missing.  I too

agree that the news media is dealing in nothing with substance attached to it,

but I must tell you that most of the public I deal with on a day to day basis,

is so centered on their wants and their needs that they have excluded the needs

and wants of those about them.

 

Suffice it to say that if you see a little girl screaming and hitting herself in

the head on a grocery store floor and any emotion besides pity for her enters

your mind, then perhaps the pity should be shown toward the viewer.

So thank you for your efforts, and I will support any boy cot against those who

finance such bilge water, but I am beginning to think the only thing that will

make a difference in our nation is getting back our national conscience.

[Guest guest]

Those are some good points, Sondra. I just don't know though if the

exact brain stuff is the same. The thing is, when my daughter doesn't

experience what ever makes her physically sick isn't making her, her

language & eye contact increases. A child who behaves autistic-like

who witnessed a murder, as an example, through counseling and feeling

safe would have a language increase. Is the exact brain function

exactly the same? I don't think there is enough knowledge to know for

sure. I would think if it was the same then the same treatments would

work, but I may be wrong.

Debi

[Guest guest]

Those are some good points, Sondra. I just don't know though if the

exact brain stuff is the same. The thing is, when my daughter doesn't

experience what ever makes her physically sick isn't making her, her

language & eye contact increases. A child who behaves autistic-like

who witnessed a murder, as an example, through counseling and feeling

safe would have a language increase. Is the exact brain function

exactly the same? I don't think there is enough knowledge to know for

sure. I would think if it was the same then the same treatments would

work, but I may be wrong.

Debi

[Guest guest]

But in the regards of the katrina the victims were those of poverty

and color and that is of often the mind set of many. It is of wrong

but many see of those two things as a lesser human and no real need

of saving... this is of world wide.

I to been of to over hear so much words in the community over barrack

Obama and the thinking is of often racist and words such as they do

not want of a black man to be of president of the USA and that mind

set regardless of what the society wants to belive is of still strong

in many and it makes of me so much sad to know that many are of

judsged by their color alone instead of their character.

but back to katrina there was of much words over why so much lacked

the effort it was because of the fact it was of black America instead

of white America and if this is of true from thier words then the

soceity has much learning to go yet, because no one should be seen as

a lesser of human kind simply because of race, color faith and or

difference also known as disabilities. All people should be reflected

upon by their character not anything less.

And for me when I to see of a child melting down in the stores or

places I to understand of this situation so well that I to not say to

self what a brat but say I to self I to lack what issues this family

may be of struggling with but it is of not my place to judge of it.

And when some strangers turn around to me to make of comment I to

share of similar words to them. I to say there are many causes for

such outburst that we are of not priveldged to know and so we should

not be of to judge it. If they continue of their words I to be of

more direct in sharing of the autism and that is of not somethings

one with autism can control anymore than one with seizures can

prevent of having a seizure. then they usually are of quiet knowing I

to not be of one to agree and co-join to judge with them.

Sondra

[Guest guest]

So in a sense, it's not what he's saying that is a problem, it's that

you want others to hear him speak. If you are not listening to him you

are not impacting what you hear, you are wanting to suppress what

others hear.

I'm not disagreeing with your right to organize a boycott, protest,

what ever. What I'm arguing is if boycotting, protesting, is really

helping/hurting the cause of promoting truth in autism. To me, being

able to call the show, which may/may not happen as I'm largely

ignoring his show because I don't like him, and discuss why what he

said is right/wrong is far more productive, like Fournier did.

And, likely his screeners will only allow who they want to call in, so

that's also arguable.

I would also point out that because he's the third highest audience in

talk radio does not equate to that many people believing 100% of what

he says. I hear a lot of Rush callers, for example, calling in &

saying they do not like anything about his beliefs but listen to get

an opposing viewpoint. I listened to preaching this morning on the

radio but didn't agree 100% with what the preacher said, that doesn't

mean I didn't get something out of the show.

I don't know how much stern may/may not make fun of the disabled, I

know he has made fun of sexual abuse, and as a sex abuse survivor I

found it very disturbing. That doesn't mean I assume 100% of his

listeners approve of sexual abuse or engage in sexual abuse.

How do you know that because he says something about sped that he has

influenced sped? I don't assume law makers are creating legislation

based on what Alan Colmes saying a 10 second stupid statement on his

radio show or any other show, for that matter...not that Alan could

say anything stupid, I LOVE him!

Debi

[Guest guest]

Debi you are of to be getting part of what I to be of tried to

explain but not the whole of it. I to lack how to use the words to

explain what my thinking is in regards to this. But will try to

respond to you words on the both having increases in areas that are

of challenges with a support of one fashions or the other.

both have of very different sorts of insults those that are of

intended insults are from man and so it is of done to cause the

issues of trauma for the child... who then the result is of a core

deficit which causes the child to act somewhat autistic like....

but then you have a child who is of born with some sort of

neurological insults and or biomedical insults and the same out come

or core issues is of the child being dx with autism.

both fashions can causes of trauma to the child one might be of more

emotional and mental where the other is from more medical and

neurology if you will. so the treatments will not be not to look

alike at all but with the right interventions some will gain in the

right directions but as we know even among autism what works for one

with autism does not work for all with autism, and the fact being

that what works for one emotionally traumatized child might not work

for another, that is of what makes ALL human beings unique

individuals.

But when a child or person is of well supported and cared for and

treated effectively with whatever method it is of to be you will see

of gains, some are of so subtle but they are of there and some are of

so great it is of greatly measurable to all who know or see of the

person.

but not saying that those with autism are of

neurologically/biomedically autistic because of abuse, but that their

autism presentation alone can cause those around them to abuse of

them if they are of not able to cope the care of the individual and

are of not well supported.

But those that are of emotionally traumatized and end up with

autistic like presentations are of not with a true presentation of

autism, but have similar reactions and responses to those with

autism. Because those with autism often pervasively over react or

under react to the sensory world around them trying to avoid the

things they find painful and the emotionally traumatized are of

trying to avoid emotional pains and memory that distorts their views

of life around them, both are maybe avoiding and seeking.

still not sure if I to be of getting the words out right yet.but if

you keep of responding it may trigger my thinking further to find the

words of it.

sondra

[Guest guest]

well i to not need of to worry self over things of words from them in

general as I to not know who any of the people are by names. I to not

watch or listen to much talk show peoples unless one is of to let me

know of to watch or listen to one and can tell of me the exact time and

or channel. when one says it is of on the NBC I to often have to ask

for example what channel and they usually tell me since there is of too

many sorts of TV things they cannot tell of me which channel it will be

on my TV which is of why most times i to not get a chance to see of a

show or things because lack how to find it. I to usually find things by

accident. Even when I to watched of the monk show I to loved of that

show but struggled to find it often when it was of to change nights and

networks and things so I to no be of able to find it anymore so not

able to watch it anymore.

Debi I to like of you much so, you are of a good friend to me here.

sondra

[Guest guest]

well i to not need of to worry self over things of words from them in

general as I to not know who any of the people are by names. I to not

watch or listen to much talk show peoples unless one is of to let me

know of to watch or listen to one and can tell of me the exact time and

or channel. when one says it is of on the NBC I to often have to ask

for example what channel and they usually tell me since there is of too

many sorts of TV things they cannot tell of me which channel it will be

on my TV which is of why most times i to not get a chance to see of a

show or things because lack how to find it. I to usually find things by

accident. Even when I to watched of the monk show I to loved of that

show but struggled to find it often when it was of to change nights and

networks and things so I to no be of able to find it anymore so not

able to watch it anymore.

Debi I to like of you much so, you are of a good friend to me here.

sondra

[Guest guest]

Don't worry, I'm sort on words today, too.

Are you are saying people with " true " autism and " like " autism are

both acting the same to avoid painful triggers? I think I get you, in

that people with autism are more likely to be abused because people

around them do not know how to support someone with autism who is

trying to escape painful stuff?

What I'm trying to say is that we need to find a way to have

definitive testing -- blood tests, scans, etc that can differentiate

the different reasons someone with autism is struggling or hurting so

we can develop specific ways to be able to help them. In that way,

those who are acting out " like " autism won't get an " autism " label

with wrong helps, they will get the right label and the right treatments.

Debi