Re: Allergies-how do they affect the immune system???

[Guest guest]

Hi -

I'll be happy to try to explain some of the immune

issues as I understand them.... I might word my

comments as fact, but a lot may be strong hypothesis

and still in the research stage.

Allergies in themselves will definitely affect the

brain if you have a neuroimmune issue and if your

immune system is " shifted " in a way that allergies are

continuously triggering inflammatory cytokines. Take

relief though, that it is unlikely or technically

" damage " - that the problem can be significantly

improved. Dr Goldberg has shown in SPECT scans where

treatment has restored blood flow in children

w/treatment.

Your standard allergy tests will likely be useless.

They generally are not helpful at all in kids.

Good control over seasonal & environmental allergies

are essential (allergy meds like Zyrtec and keeping

your home environment, especially bedroom, clean and

free of dust, for example), and addressing sinus

infections or bronchitis (from such allergies)

promptly is important as well.

Food allergies are harder to detect, as all of the

labs (no matter how those labs claim accuracy) are not

particularly reliable or accurate. Dr G approves the

Median Valley Food Panel, yet while it can be on

target for many, in general it is better used to

determine how activated the immune system is against

food rather than which specific foods. The best

option is simply to start following his " Do's and

Don'ts of Diet " (locate in the files on the

group or on .net under for parents) - essentially

no nuts, no whole grains (although whole grain oats

are often ok), no berries, and especially no COW'S

milk and cow's milk products (goat is usually ok).

Soy can be bad for a lot of people too. A cheap

enough lab - CBC w/differential can be ordered, and

eosiniphils checked to see if they are over 1.5% ...

that could suggest that allergies play a part. This

isn't widely accepted in the medical field, though, so

a doctor not educated in neuroimmune will likely look

at you like you're crazy if you requested this.

Also, too much sugar and simple starch consumption is

really bad news. Fungal overgrowth (candida) in the

gut is really problematic. If you're already eating a

healthy diet, perhaps you're not really consuming that

much?

OCD and mood problems can be related to strep

infections. A really good test to have run

(especially if you have a history of chronic strep

infections) is an ASO titer - checks the antibodies to

strep. In P.A.N.D.A.S. (look it up on the NIMH

website), the production of antibodies is a lot higher

than it should be to a strep infection, and apparently

continues reacting (whether or not the infection is

still present is not really understood and likely not

even that important). The antibodies (as well as a

shift in lymphocytes that express a lot of

inflammation) cross react with the basal ganglia and

can cause significant OCD, and also anxiet and other

mood lability. And the cognitive problems that come

with that can absolutely seem just like ADHD. (This I

know... PANDAS is my particular curse).

I'm going put the rest of my comments within your text

below:

--- J <javanfirkins@...> wrote:

> I've never been tested for allergies (yet at least.)

> I'm 24 years

> old, and have been struggling with mood disorders,

> as well as OCD, and

> ADHD for years.

***** Meeeee toooooo. For a bit of optimism, once I

learned enough from Dr Goldberg, I've had much more

improvement (although there's lots of ups and downs)

from following his basic instructions, even without

medical care that he provides. A few things like

addressing allergies, chronic infections, taking

Acidophilus, eating a low allergy diet, etc, can make

a huge difference in your emotional health. I promise

you it will take some time to learn it all but there's

a few things you can start right away ... I just can't

put them all in here.

>

> Could someone answer me this? Can allergies

> themselves actually

> damage the brain?

***** Not damage, and usually, they are not soley

responsible but rather symptomatic of the already

overactive immune state.

I know that food allergies cause

> activation of the

> immune system response. I know the body attacks

> what are supposed to

> be harmless elements in the body-because it

> recognizes them as invaders.

> I've been wondering if the allergies are simply just

> recognized as a

> threat by the body-or whether they truly are

> damaging to the brain.

**** I think those types of allergies are more like

IGE mediated allergies - the type that causes

anaphylactic shock like peanut allergies, etc. Now,

the more typical food allergies you'll hear us discuss

are IgG mediated food allergies, and this may be more

due to a poor gut health and insufficient digestion,

insufficient good gut bacteria, etc, and food

elimination and probiotic supplementation is very

helpful for many. I don't recommend getting too hard

core into the efforts of " healing leaky gut " right

away. It's a lot to take on, especially w/OCD and

anxiety - if you're like me, you'll get so paranoid

and obsessed about food that you'll stop eating or at

least significantly increase your stress levels and

this will turn into a vicious cycle because such

stress exacerbates the problems. If you simply follow

the Do's and Don'ts of Diet for the meantime and give

it a year while you see a good doctor knowledgable

about neuroimmune issues, you will be much better off,

and only dive deeper into that " stuff " once you've had

time to address other issues.

>

> I know this question might be a little

> complicated... but I have been

> wondering if the body's own response to the

> allergies themselves might

> actually cause an inflammatory response that-in of

> itself is actually

> the damaging aspect of the allergens.

***** Immune system problem first, allergies later.

There's a lot more. Yes, but not by itself. It's

not quite that simple. Tons of people have allergies

without significant mental illness.

>

> I just ask this-because I'm really confused about

> this allergy situation.

**** I'm betting you have more viral and/or bacterial

immune response, but that's just my guess, and only a

little history will help determine that...

>

> I don't know if a chronic activation of the immune

> system due to

> allergies can cause a 'burn out' of the immune

> system working it so

> hard that it doesn't have the resources and ability

> to fight off other

> things which truly are damaging?

>

> Or something to that effect?

It may start first w/an immune defect we haven't

discovered yet, or with an infection that managed to

hide itself from the immune system. It's generally a

combination of factors, and you'll be boggled when you

get down to it all. lol. You may not be able to

identify a specific trigger (although sometimes you

can), but sometimes your medical history can be pretty

significant. If you want to email me off list you can

- I really don't want to bog down the list.

Allergies, though, are simply expressing even more

cytokines, and are a stressor. But it's highly

unlikely that it's just that.

>

> Difficult questions-I would not only be incredibly

> appreciative for

> anyone who responds, but tip my hat to anyone that

> knows about

> allergies this well!

***** Please tell me what is making you focus

specifically on the allergies. You're not off base by

any means ... I'm just wondering if you already have a

lot of experience w/ foods setting off problems, etc.

>

> Thanks!

>

> -

*** Will be glad to talk more, but I'm a long

talker/typer and you may be too.. I'll just put " Long "

in the subject and folks who aren't new trying to

learn the same things can just skip on over us!

HTH -

PS: BTW - I am not a medical person. I have simply

asked hours of questions and read everything that has

come across this list for 5 years and just have a

general idea. Other people are likely to have a

different point of view. This just comes from

personal experience and I'd only say this much since I

relate to your symptoms.

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[Guest guest]

-

Thanks for the reply-that has helped me out quite a bit. I've asked

many people, and they have given me different answers and have really

been a bit puzzled by it.

I'm a big reader so I like your information ;-)

I'm a big writer myself as well so I typically write quite a bit.

So I'll look at the diet listed on some of the locations. i think

you're probably right, it's probably food/substance reactions, and

bacteria/viral infections.

I don't know if it 'truly' has anythin to do with it-or it might just

be popping out in my mind-simply confirming what I might alredy be

assuming...

But the last two people I was seeing since the beginning o 2005 both

ended up getting strep while dating me. It was odd, because I never

got it either time. I just remember it seeming weird.

This might seem like an odd and little bit embarassing question. I'm

wondering if 'scabies' would have anything to do with anything in

terms of immune response and causing problems.

I'm not sure if you are familiar with them-they are kinda like small

bugs, a little like bed bugs in the skin.

I also oddly enough go those while I was with my ex's.

Good information to think about

-Thanks

>

> > I've never been tested for allergies (yet at least.)

> > I'm 24 years

> > old, and have been struggling with mood disorders,

> > as well as OCD, and

> > ADHD for years.

> ***** Meeeee toooooo. For a bit of optimism, once I

> learned enough from Dr Goldberg, I've had much more

> improvement (although there's lots of ups and downs)

> from following his basic instructions, even without

> medical care that he provides. A few things like

> addressing allergies, chronic infections, taking

> Acidophilus, eating a low allergy diet, etc, can make

> a huge difference in your emotional health. I promise

> you it will take some time to learn it all but there's

> a few things you can start right away ... I just can't

> put them all in here.

>

> >

> > Could someone answer me this? Can allergies

> > themselves actually

> > damage the brain?

> ***** Not damage, and usually, they are not soley

> responsible but rather symptomatic of the already

> overactive immune state.

>

> I know that food allergies cause

> > activation of the

> > immune system response. I know the body attacks

> > what are supposed to

> > be harmless elements in the body-because it

> > recognizes them as invaders.

> > I've been wondering if the allergies are simply just

> > recognized as a

> > threat by the body-or whether they truly are

> > damaging to the brain.

> **** I think those types of allergies are more like

> IGE mediated allergies - the type that causes

> anaphylactic shock like peanut allergies, etc. Now,

> the more typical food allergies you'll hear us discuss

> are IgG mediated food allergies, and this may be more

> due to a poor gut health and insufficient digestion,

> insufficient good gut bacteria, etc, and food

> elimination and probiotic supplementation is very

> helpful for many. I don't recommend getting too hard

> core into the efforts of " healing leaky gut " right

> away. It's a lot to take on, especially w/OCD and

> anxiety - if you're like me, you'll get so paranoid

> and obsessed about food that you'll stop eating or at

> least significantly increase your stress levels and

> this will turn into a vicious cycle because such

> stress exacerbates the problems. If you simply follow

> the Do's and Don'ts of Diet for the meantime and give

> it a year while you see a good doctor knowledgable

> about neuroimmune issues, you will be much better off,

> and only dive deeper into that " stuff " once you've had

> time to address other issues.

>

> >

> > I know this question might be a little

> > complicated... but I have been

> > wondering if the body's own response to the

> > allergies themselves might

> > actually cause an inflammatory response that-in of

> > itself is actually

> > the damaging aspect of the allergens.

> ***** Immune system problem first, allergies later.

> There's a lot more. Yes, but not by itself. It's

> not quite that simple. Tons of people have allergies

> without significant mental illness.

>

> >

> > I just ask this-because I'm really confused about

> > this allergy situation.

> **** I'm betting you have more viral and/or bacterial

> immune response, but that's just my guess, and only a

> little history will help determine that...

>

> >

> > I don't know if a chronic activation of the immune

> > system due to

> > allergies can cause a 'burn out' of the immune

> > system working it so

> > hard that it doesn't have the resources and ability

> > to fight off other

> > things which truly are damaging?

> >

> > Or something to that effect?

>

> It may start first w/an immune defect we haven't

> discovered yet, or with an infection that managed to

> hide itself from the immune system. It's generally a

> combination of factors, and you'll be boggled when you

> get down to it all. lol. You may not be able to

> identify a specific trigger (although sometimes you

> can), but sometimes your medical history can be pretty

> significant. If you want to email me off list you can

> - I really don't want to bog down the list.

> Allergies, though, are simply expressing even more

> cytokines, and are a stressor. But it's highly

> unlikely that it's just that.

>

> >

> > Difficult questions-I would not only be incredibly

> > appreciative for

> > anyone who responds, but tip my hat to anyone that

> > knows about

> > allergies this well!

> ***** Please tell me what is making you focus

> specifically on the allergies. You're not off base by

> any means ... I'm just wondering if you already have a

> lot of experience w/ foods setting off problems, etc.

>

>

> >

> > Thanks!

> >

> > -

>

> *** Will be glad to talk more, but I'm a long

> talker/typer and you may be too.. I'll just put " Long "

> in the subject and folks who aren't new trying to

> learn the same things can just skip on over us!

>

> HTH -

>

>

> PS: BTW - I am not a medical person. I have simply

> asked hours of questions and read everything that has

> come across this list for 5 years and just have a

> general idea. Other people are likely to have a

> different point of view. This just comes from

> personal experience and I'd only say this much since I

> relate to your symptoms.

>

>

>

>

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

> Want to start your own business?

> Learn how on Small Business.

> http://smallbusiness./r-index

>

[Guest guest]

Hi J -

Your welcome. More within the text below:

--- J <javanfirkins@...> wrote:

> -

>

> Thanks for the reply-that has helped me out quite a

> bit. I've asked

> many people, and they have given me different

> answers and have really

> been a bit puzzled by it.

***** It takes a long time to come around to the

core underlying issues. There's an incredible amount

of info to process, weed out, sort, etc.

> So I'll look at the diet listed on some of the

> locations. i think

> you're probably right, it's probably food/substance

> reactions, and

> bacteria/viral infections.

***** And it all starts w/some genetic predispotion of

risk - not entirely identified, combined w/medical

history, diet, infections, physical emotional or

medical stress, etc.

> I don't know if it 'truly' has anythin to do with

> it-or it might just

> be popping out in my mind-simply confirming what I

> might alredy be

> assuming...

> But the last two people I was seeing since the

> beginning o 2005 both

> ended up getting strep while dating me. It was odd,

> because I never

> got it either time. I just remember it seeming

> weird.

******* There is the other possibility that you are

carrying it (but not a carrier specifically, because

carriers don't have immune responses to strep), and

that your immune system suppresses the

severity/symptoms because it's chronically activated

against the strep, pumping out antibodies while the

other part of the immune system never kicks in,

finishes off the strep (if it's even still present),

and then sends the signal to stop producing antibodies

to the strep. (Also, strep can reside in sinuses,

lungs, etc so negative throat cultures does not

entirely have to mean strep isn't present.)

The first step is to get a throat culture and have the

ASO titers checked. If that came back significantly

elevated, you have a big clue. However, most docs who

aren't educated in neuroimmune or PANDAS would not

necessarily be eager to run the labs or be convinced

that there's an issue.

What doctor are you waiting to see?

> This might seem like an odd and little bit

> embarassing question. I'm

> wondering if 'scabies' would have anything to do

> with anything in

> terms of immune response and causing problems.

> I'm not sure if you are familiar with them-they are

> kinda like small

> bugs, a little like bed bugs in the skin.

> I also oddly enough go those while I was with my

> ex's.

***** They shouldn't be a significant cause, but

rather a side-effect, because anyone can have them,

but they only last longer in people w/improperly

functioning immune systems, once re-infection is ruled

out.

>

> Good information to think about

>

> -Thanks

Hope that helps. Much more I could say, but it just

starts running together if you try to take in too much

too fast! Find out if you can get the strep labs

ordered and see where you are with that. Oh -

mycoplasma pneumonia infections can set up chronic

bronchitis too, and be mistaken for asthma due to all

the wheezing it causes, and it's not unlike strep in

it's effect on OCD and anxiety.

More later-

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