Re: Re: OT: Sleep meds (was Elderly parents)

[Guest guest]

Thank you fKahaya , for the 5htp idea the other I tryed them already ,

Kindly Marie

To: Lyme_and_Rife Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 4:05 PMSubject: Re: OT: Sleep meds (was Elderly parents)

Hi Barbara & Marie,When I first started treatment for LD I had been having trouble sleeping quite regularly. I started taking tinctures of valerian and kava-kava and they really helped me sleep, but I was never really awake during the day, and had to stop driving. Then before my hip surgery I was not allowed to use those, so Dr.B and Dr.J helped me find alternatives. I switched to Melatonin plus Melatonin Sustained-Release plus 5HTP, and that combination worked fine--and I have no trouble driving (except on expressways). Once a month I take a break from almost everything, and only take the 5HTP that night, which usually works fine. I was able to give up the Melatonin S-R. I tried giving up Melatonin entirely, but was only able to reduce it from two little 3mg capsules to one. I tried skipping the 5HTP 100mg, which seems to be OK once in a while, but not usually. So I will wait until my general health has improved a little more and try again.

But I have made some progress in that regard! Khaya> > > **> >> >> > Hi Kahay>

> I tak ealso a additive sleep medecin here is what is recommanded to get> > rid of it> > decrease of one drop at a time but every other day go back to the revisou> > dosage until it is ok because the body remmebr so if we trick it like this> > he accpts better the lower amount as it oscilate between the used to amount> > and the lower amount . then stay at th elower amount when the sleep is back> > to close to normal every day wait a while for stablisation and do it again> > removing on edrop every other day .> > an other way is to alternate the medecine to sleep so it is not he same> > and the addiction does not come due to diferent medecin so we do not take> > one long enought to get addicted . Thsi has been explained ot me by a dct> > specialised in sleepind desoroders when I di dnto knwo what it iwas coming> > from .>

> Thsi is not andvis eit is just my experience . It is still stuff thought> > but faisable . I am doing it now not a peice of cake and th eless drop the> > mor ediffcult the last two drops are all a swing .> > Kindly Marie> >> > *From:* Barbara Pierce > > *To:* Lyme_and_Rife > > *Sent:* Monday, March 12, 2012 8:32 PM> > *Subject:* Re: Re: OT: Elderly parents> >> >> > khaya,> >> > yes on the valium, but not by choice. i think you remember reading about> > my benzo 'hell' story. had been on conazepam (klonipin) since 07 for> > sleep, i thought. dr didn't tell me the dangers or almost impossible to> > get off. had been

told by nd hard to get off, 3 yrs later. so i slowly> > tried to taper off of it. 4 days after last dose had convulsions,> > seizures, 'flight of ideas", thinking i was dying, and many other> > symptoms. paramedics labeled me a phsych patient who 'had a history of> > self diagnosed diseases and today she thinks she is dying' (he later said> > there was no dr. records to prove the illnesses--my son said i was trying> > to explain 30yrs of illness at once-must have sounded crazy). drs didn't> > know what was wrong either, which seems unbelievable they didn't recognize> > drug withdrawal--they never even hinted or asked. my daughter happened to> > remember i had stopped the clon. and this was the withdrawal. sister did a> > google search and sure enough. husband put some under my tongue and it> > stopped the seizures.> >> >

finally, my fibro dr agreed to help taper with valium. it is the only way> > you can get off safely. after getting stabilized back on the clon. had to> > decrease clon as i increased the equivalent of valium and then could taper> > down, 10% of current dose every 2 wks. doing this since last april, and> > down to 2 1/2 mg. had convulsions with each taper until oct, then only a> > few since then.> >> > can't take anything that is a stimulant or sedative, or anything that> > fills the 'gaba' receptors such as gaba, things at increase serotonin,> > herbs that do any of these things. actually, they suggest taking nothing> > for anything. it can increase the withdrawal symptoms. i have cheated> > with a few necessary herbs and maybe that is why i've had trouble. don't> > know. with withdrawal, anxiety, insomnia, feeling crazy, being

crazy,> > depression, all the things it is suppose to decrease, are increased with> > withdrawal. so i just weather the anxiety and other symptoms-and so does> > my poor husband. in the beginning, sleep was almost impossible, but now it> > actually seems to be doing better than before the drug--god's gift. will> > never be able to take any addicting type drugs in the future, but that ok> > with me.> >> > anyway, save yourself some time, my sister and i did so much research on> > the benzos because i had no dr. to help. had a support forum. the dr who> > is helping me knows nothing about withdrawal from these drugs, yet> > prescribes them a lot. he actually told me that i have educated him on> > this. unbelievable!!> >> > but, i am 'waking up' from the drug, slowly. sometimes too slowly for me> > as i get a

glimpse now and then of real life. that is why i was asking the> > question about is some of this fatigue mental or is it all physical. i'm> > pretty sure some of mine is the drug, and may hang on for a while after i'm> > off it. but was wonder about others, so i could gauge where i am. i know> > a lot of mine, as like marie said of herself, is physical. i am very> > limited physically, but when i feel some energy, i am still wanting to be> > non functioning. (not the old me, even when sick). so, yes, i believe> > there is a big element of my fatigue that is mental, but some is also> > physical.> >> > anyway, thanks for recognizing that the benzos are 'death in disguise" and> > be willing to find info on it for me. i really appreciate it.> >> > don't know which is more addicting, the valium or the emails on this site.>

> glad to see you are withdrawing some. working on that myself. 2> > addictions is hard.> >> > barbara>

[Guest guest]

khaya,those are all good.  my husband has used the 5 htp.  had a nd who really pushed the melatonin and said we are really deficient in it.  when i took it yrs ago, i would take it early in the evening to help me slow down and get ready to sleep.  that helped.  the melatonin and 5htp are in that cascade of supps that help in our chemical cascade for balanced hormones etc.

they are both good.barbara

 

Thank you fKahaya , for the 5htp  idea the other I tryed them already ,

Kindly Marie

To: Lyme_and_Rife Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 4:05 PM

Subject: Re: OT: Sleep meds (was Elderly parents)

 

Hi Barbara & Marie,When I first started treatment for LD I had been having trouble sleeping quite regularly. I started taking tinctures of valerian and kava-kava and they really helped me sleep, but I was never really awake during the day, and had to stop driving. Then before my hip surgery I was not allowed to use those, so Dr.B and Dr.J helped me find alternatives. I switched to Melatonin plus Melatonin Sustained-Release plus 5HTP, and that combination worked fine--and I have no trouble driving (except on expressways). Once a month I take a break from almost everything, and only take the 5HTP that night, which usually works fine. I was able to give up the Melatonin S-R. I tried giving up Melatonin entirely, but was only able to reduce it from two little 3mg capsules to one. I tried skipping the 5HTP 100mg, which seems to be OK once in a while, but not usually. So I will wait until my general health has improved a little more and try again.

But I have made some progress in that regard! Khaya> > > **> >> >> > Hi Kahay>

> I tak ealso a additive sleep medecin here is what is recommanded to get> > rid of it> > decrease of one drop at a time but every other day go back to the revisou> > dosage until it is ok because the body remmebr so if we trick it like this

> > he accpts better the lower amount as it oscilate between the used to amount> > and the lower amount . then stay at th elower amount when the sleep is back> > to close to normal every day wait a while for stablisation and do it again

> > removing on edrop every other day .> > an other way is to alternate the medecine to sleep so it is not he same> > and the addiction does not come due to diferent medecin so we do not take

> > one long enought to get addicted . Thsi has been explained ot me by a dct> > specialised in sleepind desoroders when I di dnto knwo what it iwas coming> > from .>

> Thsi is not andvis eit is just my experience . It is still stuff thought> > but faisable . I am doing it now not a peice of cake and th eless drop the> > mor ediffcult the last two drops are all a swing .

> > Kindly Marie> >> > *From:* Barbara Pierce > > *To:* Lyme_and_Rife

> > *Sent:* Monday, March 12, 2012 8:32 PM> > *Subject:* Re: Re: OT: Elderly parents> >> >> > khaya,> >> > yes on the valium, but not by choice. i think you remember reading about

> > my benzo 'hell' story. had been on conazepam (klonipin) since 07 for> > sleep, i thought. dr didn't tell me the dangers or almost impossible to> > get off. had been

told by nd hard to get off, 3 yrs later. so i slowly> > tried to taper off of it. 4 days after last dose had convulsions,> > seizures, 'flight of ideas " , thinking i was dying, and many other

> > symptoms. paramedics labeled me a phsych patient who 'had a history of> > self diagnosed diseases and today she thinks she is dying' (he later said> > there was no dr. records to prove the illnesses--my son said i was trying

> > to explain 30yrs of illness at once-must have sounded crazy). drs didn't> > know what was wrong either, which seems unbelievable they didn't recognize> > drug withdrawal--they never even hinted or asked. my daughter happened to

> > remember i had stopped the clon. and this was the withdrawal. sister did a> > google search and sure enough. husband put some under my tongue and it> > stopped the seizures.> >> >

finally, my fibro dr agreed to help taper with valium. it is the only way> > you can get off safely. after getting stabilized back on the clon. had to> > decrease clon as i increased the equivalent of valium and then could taper

> > down, 10% of current dose every 2 wks. doing this since last april, and> > down to 2 1/2 mg. had convulsions with each taper until oct, then only a> > few since then.> >> > can't take anything that is a stimulant or sedative, or anything that

> > fills the 'gaba' receptors such as gaba, things at increase serotonin,> > herbs that do any of these things. actually, they suggest taking nothing> > for anything. it can increase the withdrawal symptoms. i have cheated

> > with a few necessary herbs and maybe that is why i've had trouble. don't> > know. with withdrawal, anxiety, insomnia, feeling crazy, being

crazy,> > depression, all the things it is suppose to decrease, are increased with> > withdrawal. so i just weather the anxiety and other symptoms-and so does> > my poor husband. in the beginning, sleep was almost impossible, but now it

> > actually seems to be doing better than before the drug--god's gift. will> > never be able to take any addicting type drugs in the future, but that ok> > with me.> >> > anyway, save yourself some time, my sister and i did so much research on

> > the benzos because i had no dr. to help. had a support forum. the dr who> > is helping me knows nothing about withdrawal from these drugs, yet> > prescribes them a lot. he actually told me that i have educated him on

> > this. unbelievable!!> >> > but, i am 'waking up' from the drug, slowly. sometimes too slowly for me> > as i get a

glimpse now and then of real life. that is why i was asking the> > question about is some of this fatigue mental or is it all physical. i'm> > pretty sure some of mine is the drug, and may hang on for a while after i'm

> > off it. but was wonder about others, so i could gauge where i am. i know> > a lot of mine, as like marie said of herself, is physical. i am very> > limited physically, but when i feel some energy, i am still wanting to be

> > non functioning. (not the old me, even when sick). so, yes, i believe> > there is a big element of my fatigue that is mental, but some is also> > physical.> >> > anyway, thanks for recognizing that the benzos are 'death in disguise " and

> > be willing to find info on it for me. i really appreciate it.> >> > don't know which is more addicting, the valium or the emails on this site.>

> glad to see you are withdrawing some. working on that myself. 2> > addictions is hard.> >> > barbara>

[Guest guest]

Khaya,

Zenbev is something that has helped me on the sleep side. They have a website.

Alan

To: Lyme_and_Rife Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 7:24 PMSubject: Re: OT: Sleep meds (was Elderly parents)

Yes, I think the 5HTP is the most effective. Khaya> > > **> >> >> > Thank you fKahaya , for the

5htp idea the other I tryed them already ,> > Kindly Marie> >> > *From:* khaya.davidson > > *To:* Lyme_and_Rife > > *Sent:* Tuesday, March 13, 2012 4:05 PM> > *Subject:* Re: OT: Sleep meds (was Elderly parents)> >> >> > Hi Barbara & Marie,> > When I first started treatment for LD I had been having trouble sleeping> > quite regularly. I started taking tinctures of valerian and kava-kava and> > they really helped me sleep, but I was never really awake during the day,> > and had to stop driving. Then before my hip surgery I was not allowed to> > use those, so Dr.B and Dr.J helped me find alternatives. I switched to> >

Melatonin plus Melatonin Sustained-Release plus 5HTP, and that combination> > worked fine--and I have no trouble driving (except on expressways). Once a> > month I take a break from almost everything, and only take the 5HTP that> > night, which usually works fine. I was able to give up the Melatonin S-R. I> > tried giving up Melatonin entirely, but was only able to reduce it from two> > little 3mg capsules to one. I tried skipping the 5HTP 100mg, which seems to> > be OK once in a while, but not usually. So I will wait until my general> > health has improved a little more and try again. But I have made some> > progress in that regard!> > Khaya> >