Guest guest Posted April 10, 2005 Report Share Posted April 10, 2005 Improvement in BP? No, I have looked, but the vitamin people don't like stuff counter to their products much more than the pharmaceutical ones do. Typically, in the USA you can't make medical claims, so research goes unfunded or kept out of the mass channels. But in ITALY, there have been trials that show that all vitamin C delivery systems except grapefruit-based natural ones cause excess aldosterone production, because they act as salts initially. I know I have to put this into the files section, soon as I get over my bronchitis. This is especially true of the ascorbates (like Emergen-C), which deliver more ascorbic acid into serum by starting out as minerals, and are converted to acids by the body. BUT, " those give the kidneys and glands hella work to do this job, " as my bio-research assistant daughter says. I used ascorbates and other mineral-based vit C's, and have had fewer and less severe colds, BUT lower K and kidney stones for my effort. The tie to PA seems sensible, but I have not found the study yet. Garlic shows up all over the place in hypertension reduction study, but it takes a good long while (3 mos w/o other factors like increased exercise), and how to get the raw, 3-6 natural garlic cloves daily without problems is hard. Even the best supplement (Kyolic) is so weak, I'm not sure it will do much except kill bacteria that keep fungus under control, so you might end up with menalia, or other fungal problems of the mucous membranes. Dave On Apr 10, 2005, at 7:09 PM, Farah Rahbar wrote: > Hi Dave, > > I took 3000-4000 mg of Vit C, in the form of powder Emerg'ncy brand + > garlic and bunch of other good stuff, but did not see any improvement. > Have you seen any research on that? > > Farah > > Dave <dave@...> wrote: > " primary aldosteronism, " the unbrella term used nowadays for the > variants of renin-angiotnesin mlfuctions resulting in too much aldo, > too little renin, odd cortisol, salt and potassium imbalances. > Starting to look more and more as an underlying condition, if not > cause > of many hypertensions. Reason I ask is this is what this group is > dedicated to, and second, that ascorbic acid, and even more, the > carbonates and mineral ascorbates used to deliver vitamin C are > potential antagonists, of this problem. > > Dave > > > On Apr 10, 2005, at 10:25 AM, ken wrote: > > > What is " PA " > > Re: vitamins > > > > Hi, do you have PA or one of its variants? Pls could you summarize? I > > have much experience with people who use vitamins & minerals, > > including my own earlier usage, who have this disease. It is hard to > > find a doctor who has experience w/this affliction, and not quite as > > hard to find one that uses naturopathic methods in the USA, but one > > who knows both, I have never found. > > > > The isolated nutrients are hard to figure in the USA. Other countries > > have far more experience--both with usage as well as preparation and > > quality control standards. Sales & marketing is not exactly the best > > way to control these things. > > > > Dave > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 11, 2005 Report Share Posted April 11, 2005 Always to to PUBMED to find reliable research on anything you want to put in your body. It is tough to play the big game: you bet your life. May your pressure be low!CE Grim MDClinical Professor of Internal MedicineProfessor of EpidemiologyBoard Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension Re: vitamins Improvement in BP? No, I have looked, but the vitamin people don't like stuff counter to their products much more than the pharmaceutical ones do. Typically, in the USA you can't make medical claims, so research goes unfunded or kept out of the mass channels. But in ITALY, there have been trials that show that all vitamin C delivery systems except grapefruit-based natural ones cause excess aldosterone production, because they act as salts initially. I know I have to put this into the files section, soon as I get over my bronchitis. This is especially true of the ascorbates (like Emergen-C), which deliver more ascorbic acid into serum by starting out as minerals, and are converted to acids by the body. BUT, "those give the kidneys and glands hella work to do this job," as my bio-research assistant daughter says. I used ascorbates and other mineral-based vit C's, and have had fewer and less severe colds, BUT lower K and kidney stones for my effort. The tie to PA seems sensible, but I have not found the study yet. Garlic shows up all over the place in hypertension reduction study, but it takes a good long while (3 mos w/o other factors like increased exercise), and how to get the raw, 3-6 natural garlic cloves daily without problems is hard. Even the best supplement (Kyolic) is so weak, I'm not sure it will do much except kill bacteria that keep fungus under control, so you might end up with menalia, or other fungal problems of the mucous membranes. Dave On Apr 10, 2005, at 7:09 PM, Farah Rahbar wrote: > Hi Dave, > > I took 3000-4000 mg of Vit C, in the form of powder Emerg'ncy brand + > garlic and bunch of other good stuff, but did not see any improvement. > Have you seen any research on that? > > Farah > > Dave <dave@...> wrote: > "primary aldosteronism," the unbrella term used nowadays for the > variants of renin-angiotnesin mlfuctions resulting in too much aldo, > too little renin, odd cortisol, salt and potassium imbalances. > Starting to look more and more as an underlying condition, if not > cause > of many hypertensions. Reason I ask is this is what this group is > dedicated to, and second, that ascorbic acid, and even more, the > carbonates and mineral ascorbates used to deliver vitamin C are > potential antagonists, of this problem. > > Dave > > > On Apr 10, 2005, at 10:25 AM, ken wrote: > > > What is "PA" > > Re: vitamins > > > > Hi, do you have PA or one of its variants? Pls could you summarize? I > > have much experience with people who use vitamins & minerals, > > including my own earlier usage, who have this disease. It is hard to > > find a doctor who has experience w/this affliction, and not quite as > > hard to find one that uses naturopathic methods in the USA, but one > > who knows both, I have never found. > > > > The isolated nutrients are hard to figure in the USA. Other countries > > have far more experience--both with usage as well as preparation and > > quality control standards. Sales & marketing is not exactly the best > > way to control these things. > > > > Dave > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 11, 2005 Report Share Posted April 11, 2005 I dont know what you mean by good stuff. Be sure it is not deadly stuff. You bet your life! May your pressure be low!CE Grim MDClinical Professor of Internal MedicineProfessor of EpidemiologyBoard Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension Re: vitamins Hi Dave, I took 3000-4000 mg of Vit C, in the form of powder Emerg'ncy brand + garlic and bunch of other good stuff, but did not see any improvement. Have you seen any research on that? Farah Dave <dave@...> wrote: "primary aldosteronism," the unbrella term used nowadays for the variants of renin-angiotnesin mlfuctions resulting in too much aldo, too little renin, odd cortisol, salt and potassium imbalances. Starting to look more and more as an underlying condition, if not cause of many hypertensions. Reason I ask is this is what this group is dedicated to, and second, that ascorbic acid, and even more, the carbonates and mineral ascorbates used to deliver vitamin C are potential antagonists, of this problem.DaveOn Apr 10, 2005, at 10:25 AM, ken wrote:> What is "PA"> Re: vitamins>> Hi, do you have PA or one of its variants? Pls could you summarize? I > have much experience with people who use vitamins & minerals, > including my own earlier usage, who have this disease. It is hard to > find a doctor who has experience w/this affliction, and not quite as > hard to find one that uses naturopathic methods in the USA, but one > who knows both, I have never found.>> The isolated nutrients are hard to figure in the USA. Other countries > have far more experience--both with usage as well as preparation and > quality control standards. Sales & marketing is not exactly the best > way to control these things.>> Dave>> On Apr 9, 2005, at 9:34 PM, lowerbp2@... wrote:>>>> In a message dated 4/9/05 14:20:36, schw9883@... writes:>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 11, 2005 Report Share Posted April 11, 2005 Dont think other countires do any QC on vitamins etc. Few others have as good of an FDA as we do. Even with all their problems. Of course Congress forbade them from regulating food supplements. A few more deaths from suupplements and we should be able to get this changed. I trust some site is keeping a list of those who become severely ill or die from using unregulated vitamins, supplements etc. Maybe Dave knows of such a site. Writer yoru congressman woman if you want to have some assurance that the stuff you buy does not contain mercury or arsenic or other powerful herbs that can cause high blood pressure and low K. May your pressure be low!CE Grim MDClinical Professor of Internal MedicineProfessor of EpidemiologyBoard Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension Re: vitamins What is "PA" Re: vitamins Hi, do you have PA or one of its variants? Pls could you summarize? I have much experience with people who use vitamins & minerals, including my own earlier usage, who have this disease. It is hard to find a doctor who has experience w/this affliction, and not quite as hard to find one that uses naturopathic methods in the USA, but one who knows both, I have never found.The isolated nutrients are hard to figure in the USA. Other countries have far more experience--both with usage as well as preparation and quality control standards. Sales & marketing is not exactly the best way to control these things.DaveOn Apr 9, 2005, at 9:34 PM, lowerbp2@... wrote: In a message dated 4/9/05 14:20:36, schw9883@... writes:I was taking dostinex for a microadenoma prolactin tumor.I drank a large coke during the day. Can't remember the rest sincethis was about a week ago.I take alot of vitamins and herbs:Vit cMultiple Vitginkgomilk thistleb complextaurineL carntineFlax seed Oilb12vit esaw palmettoquercitenWhat is in querciten?omega 3 capsulesthank you for your assistance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 11, 2005 Report Share Posted April 11, 2005 Please let me look at their data on Vit C first. May your pressure be low! Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes. Listed in Best Doctors in America Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 11, 2005 Report Share Posted April 11, 2005 In a message dated 4/10/05 15:01:02, farahbar@... writes: I would be very interested in knowing any nutropathic doctors who are familiar with this condition as well. I would avoid these folks like the plague-I can assure you that you will get better and free advice here. May your pressure be low! Clarence E. Grim, BS (Chem/Math), MS (Biochem), MD, FACP, FACC, FAHS Clinical Professor of Medicine and Epidemiology Director, Hypertension Diagnosis and Treatment Center Board Certified in Internal Medicine, Geriatrics and Hypertension Published over 220 scientific papers, book chapters and 220 abstracts in the area of high blood pressure epidemiology, physiology, endocrinology measurement, treatment and how to detect curable causes. Listed in Best Doctors in America Specializing in Difficult to Control High Blood Pressure and the History and Physiology of High Blood pressure in the African Diaspora Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 11, 2005 Report Share Posted April 11, 2005 My family and I have been taking Emergen-C for yrs. I specially increased mine. I was taking 3-5 pks a day when my bp was up before I was diagnosed. I wonder if that caused my aldosterone to be sooo high. Although I was'nt taking it about a month before my last test. Very interesting information. FarahDave <dave@...> wrote: Improvement in BP? No, I have looked, but the vitamin people don't like stuff counter to their products much more than the pharmaceutical ones do. Typically, in the USA you can't make medical claims, so research goes unfunded or kept out of the mass channels. But in ITALY, there have been trials that show that all vitamin C delivery systems except grapefruit-based natural ones cause excess aldosterone production, because they act as salts initially. I know I have to put this into the files section, soon as I get over my bronchitis. This is especially true of the ascorbates (like Emergen-C), which deliver more ascorbic acid into serum by starting out as minerals, and are converted to acids by the body. BUT, "those give the kidneys and glands hella work to do this job," as my bio-research assistant daughter says.I used ascorbates and other mineral-based vit C's, and have had fewer and less severe colds, BUT lower K and kidney stones for my effort. The tie to PA seems sensible, but I have not found the study yet.Garlic shows up all over the place in hypertension reduction study, but it takes a good long while (3 mos w/o other factors like increased exercise), and how to get the raw, 3-6 natural garlic cloves daily without problems is hard. Even the best supplement (Kyolic) is so weak, I'm not sure it will do much except kill bacteria that keep fungus under control, so you might end up with menalia, or other fungal problems of the mucous membranes.DaveOn Apr 10, 2005, at 7:09 PM, Farah Rahbar wrote:> Hi Dave,> > I took 3000-4000 mg of Vit C, in the form of powder Emerg'ncy brand + > garlic and bunch of other good stuff, but did not see any improvement. > Have you seen any research on that?> > Farah >> Dave wrote:> "primary aldosteronism," the unbrella term used nowadays for the> variants of renin-angiotnesin mlfuctions resulting in too much aldo,> too little renin, odd cortisol, salt and potassium imbalances.> Starting to look more and more as an underlying condition, if not > cause> of many hypertensions. Reason I ask is this is what this group is> dedicated to, and second, that ascorbic acid, and even more, the> carbonates and mineral ascorbates used to deliver vitamin C are> potential antagonists, of this problem.>> Dave>>> On Apr 10, 2005, at 10:25 AM, ken wrote:>> > What is "PA"> > Re: vitamins> >> > Hi, do you have PA or one of its variants? Pls could you summarize? I> > have much experience with people who use vitamins & minerals,> > including my own earlier usage, who have this disease. It is hard to> > find a doctor who has experience w/this affliction, and not quite as> > hard to find one that uses naturopathic methods in the USA, but one> > who knows both, I have never found.> >> > The isolated nutrients are hard to figure in the USA. Other countries> > have far more experience--both with usage as well as preparation and> > quality control standards. Sales & marketing is not exactly the best> > way to control these things.> >> > Dave> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2005 Report Share Posted April 14, 2005 Farah, I take Spiro plus potassium supplements and eat foods high in potassium. Personally, I'd rather adjust my medication around my diet than adjust my diet around my medication. If your K runs high on Spiro when you eat a lot of fruits, etc., can you lower your dose and still keep your BP under control? I get fairly regular blood tests and almost every Dr. I see (for whatever reason) is good about writing up an order for to check K levels if I request it. Last year I lost 60 pounds and have blood tests monthly to monitor K. I've gained a few back and am having a harder time losing 10 on my own because I'll stick to small portions closely for three days and end up with muscle cramping the next day (too bad I can't count that exercise, eh?) Take care, Re: vitamins Hi, do you have PA or one of its variants? Pls could you summarize? I have much experience with people who use vitamins & minerals, including my own earlier usage, who have this disease. It is hard to find a doctor who has experience w/this affliction, and not quite as hard to find one that uses naturopathic methods in the USA, but one who knows both, I have never found.The isolated nutrients are hard to figure in the USA. Other countries have far more experience--both with usage as well as preparation and quality control standards. Sales & marketing is not exactly the best way to control these things.DaveOn Apr 9, 2005, at 9:34 PM, lowerbp2@... wrote: In a message dated 4/9/05 14:20:36, schw9883@... writes:I was taking dostinex for a microadenoma prolactin tumor.I drank a large coke during the day. Can't remember the rest sincethis was about a week ago.I take alot of vitamins and herbs:Vit cMultiple Vitginkgomilk thistleb complextaurineL carntineFlax seed Oilb12vit esaw palmettoquercitenWhat is in querciten?omega 3 capsulesthank you for your assistance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 30, 2005 Report Share Posted April 30, 2005 All of those things are discussed here along many others! Welcome to the group. If y ou haven't read 's book I would start there. http://enzymestuff.com/ I am really glad i started enzymes first, because then i didn't have to start over again and try to figure out if things needed to be readjusted. Many kids also don't tolerate vitamins and minerals to begin with, And so far we have never had this problem with starting enzymes first. Joy <j-joy@...> wrote: I am new to this group. It is nice to know that there are groups available for us to discuss any questions we may have regarding our children. My son is Autistic and he is 6 years old. I have had him on vitamins and am looking for any suggestions on what other families have given there children and what has worked or not worked for them. I am currently looking on the Kirkman labs website and have thought of purchasing Pro-Bio Gold, Colostrum Gold, Acidophilus Powder, Cranberry Extract, and either the Children's Multi-Vitamin or Super Nu-Thera Hypo Allergenic. If anyone has any knowledge on what they have given or give there children can you please advise? Any information would be greatly appreciated. Thank You, Joy --------------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2005 Report Share Posted May 1, 2005 Hi, Joy You may want to check out Juice Plus+ which is 29 fruits, vegetables, berries with the water, sugar and salt removed (and free of gluten and casein) in the convenience of a pill. Since your son is 6, he may also be eligible to receive it free for upto three full years! Check out http://www.juiceplus.com/+vc44951 for more information. Don't forget to visit the section on the Children's Health Study, which will tell you more about getting it free for your any child aged between 6 and 15 years. With best wishes, Vivek. > I am new to this group. It is nice to know that there are groups > available for us to discuss any questions we may have regarding our > children. My son is Autistic and he is 6 years old. I have had him on > vitamins and am looking for any suggestions on what other families have > given there children and what has worked or not worked for them. I am > currently looking on the Kirkman labs website and have thought of > purchasing Pro-Bio Gold, Colostrum Gold, Acidophilus Powder, Cranberry > Extract, and either the Children's Multi-Vitamin or Super Nu-Thera Hypo > Allergenic. If anyone has any knowledge on what they have given or give > there children can you please advise? Any information would be greatly > appreciated. > Thank You, Joy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 5, 2005 Report Share Posted July 5, 2005 We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good... deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks! Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 This email message is confidential, intended only for the recipient(s) named above and may contain information that is privileged, exempt from discloser under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, do not disclose or disseminate this message to anyone except the intended recipient. If you have received this message in error, or are not the recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender by return email, and delete all copies of this message. Attachment: vcard [not shown] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 5, 2005 Report Share Posted July 5, 2005 For how long are is it recommended to take the two multis and one b-vitamin after the rygb? Kathy Shattler, M.S.,RD kshattler@..."kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good...deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks!Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 5, 2005 Report Share Posted July 5, 2005 We rec. double the adult dosage of MVI for at least 6 weeks post op, then continuation if lab values deem necessary. Otherwise, they can go down to one MVI/day. Sublinqual bcomplex for lifetime Kathy Shattler wrote: For how long are is it recommended to take the two multis and one b-vitamin after the rygb? Kathy Shattler, M.S.,RD kshattler@... "kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good... deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks! Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football -- Kasey Koster Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 This email message is confidential, intended only for the recipient(s) named above and may contain information that is privileged, exempt from discloser under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, do not disclose or disseminate this message to anyone except the intended recipient. If you have received this message in error, or are not the recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender by return email, and delete all copies of this message. Attachment: vcard [not shown] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2005 Report Share Posted August 21, 2005 What liquid vitamin do you take? Where do you buy it? I tried a liquid but upchucked at the smell when I opened the bottle!! Thanks, Karin > I take liquid vitamins now, but at the beginning I would cut them in half > with a pill cutter and take them every two hours and they were not as hard > on me. I still take the extra iron everyday it is the slow-FE iron it is > extremely gentle on my stomach and I don't get constipated with it. They > are small pills and I take it twice a day. I have blood work done at three > months and it was all good. > Lourdes > > > >From: " pbcgirl21 " <dadsgirl2183@a...> > >Reply- > > > >Subject: vitamins > >Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:03:15 -0000 > > > > > > > > > > > >does anyone know of any small sized vitamins? being only 2 1/2 weeks > > > >out... taking large pills are hard and i can't always get them to stay > > > >down. i need to find some small sized vitamins with iron in them. any > > > >suggestions? thanks > > > >courtney > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 22, 2005 Report Share Posted August 22, 2005 Hi , Walgreen's sales a Multiple Vitamins with Iron that a small and easy to take. I have not had any problems with them. Neighbors Enchanted Glass Creations Stained & Leaded Glass Designs ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: " pbcgirl21 " <dadsgirl2183@...> Reply- Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:03:15 -0000 >does anyone know of any small sized vitamins? being only 2 1/2 weeks >out... taking large pills are hard and i can't always get them to stay >down. i need to find some small sized vitamins with iron in them. any >suggestions? thanks >courtney > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 22, 2005 Report Share Posted August 22, 2005 , Centrum also makes a chewable vitamin for adults. in Phoenix Re: vitamins > Hi , > > Walgreen's sales a Multiple Vitamins with Iron that a small and > easy to take. I have not had any problems with them. > > Neighbors > Enchanted Glass Creations > Stained & Leaded Glass Designs > > > > ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- > From: " pbcgirl21 " <dadsgirl2183@...> > Reply- > Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:03:15 -0000 > >>does anyone know of any small sized vitamins? being only 2 1/2 > weeks >>out... taking large pills are hard and i can't always get them to > stay >>down. i need to find some small sized vitamins with iron in them. > any >>suggestions? thanks >>courtney >> >> >> >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 22, 2005 Report Share Posted August 22, 2005 Try the liquid ones. I just cannot do vitamin pills anymore. They really bother my stomach. good luck nancy in texas > does anyone know of any small sized vitamins? being only 2 1/2 weeks > out... taking large pills are hard and i can't always get them to stay > down. i need to find some small sized vitamins with iron in them. any > suggestions? thanks > courtney Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 If you check the label however I believe the Centrum " adult " chewable is the same formulation as the " children's " chewable... they were not equal the last time I checked. in GA > , > Centrum also makes a chewable vitamin for adults. > in Phoenix > Re: vitamins > > > > Hi , > > > > Walgreen's sales a Multiple Vitamins with Iron that a small and > > easy to take. I have not had any problems with them. > > > > Neighbors > > Enchanted Glass Creations > > Stained & Leaded Glass Designs > > > > > > > > ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- > > From: " pbcgirl21 " <dadsgirl2183@a...> > > Reply- > > Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:03:15 -0000 > > > >>does anyone know of any small sized vitamins? being only 2 1/2 > > weeks > >>out... taking large pills are hard and i can't always get them to > > stay > >>down. i need to find some small sized vitamins with iron in them. > > any > >>suggestions? thanks > >>courtney > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2005 Report Share Posted September 22, 2005 Hi Kasey Can you tell me what your post-op vitamin protocol is for RYGB patients? Thank you! Carina Lagua MA, RD, CDE CNY Surgical Bariatric Center Syracuse, NY 13210"kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We rec. double the adult dosage of MVI for at least 6 weeks post op, then continuation if lab values deem necessary. Otherwise, they can go down to one MVI/day. Sublinqual bcomplex for lifetimeKathy Shattler wrote: For how long are is it recommended to take the two multis and one b-vitamin after the rygb? Kathy Shattler, M.S.,RD kshattler@..."kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good...deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks!Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 This email message is confidential, intended only for the recipient(s) named above and may contain information that is privileged, exempt from discloser under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, do not disclose or disseminate this message to anyone except the intended recipient. If you have received this message in error, or are not the recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender by return email, and delete all copies of this message. begin:vcardfn:Kasey Kostern:Koster;Kaseyorg:OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtionsadr;dom:Ste. C;;1230 SW 89th;Oklahoma City ;OK;73139email;internet:kkoster@...title:Dietitiantel;work:405-360-7100tel;fax:405-364-9112url:http://www.owlo.comversion:2.1end:vcard for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2005 Report Share Posted September 22, 2005 We are at Univerity of Wisconsin Hospital and Clinics in Madison WI. We do 200-400 RNY and Lap Band surgeries a year. We have RNY patients take 2 chewable multivitamins with minerals and iron per day (Flinstones complete or Centrum Jr are acceptable, Centrum Silver chewable is ok if they take an iron supplement, but vitamins from Bariatric Advantage, Building Blocks, and Vista Vitamins are also discussed), Calcium citrate, 1200-1500 mg per day, B12 500 mg per day sublingual and we now are recommending that patients take a Bcomplex in addition. I hope you find this helpful, Diane Olson MS, RD, CDE UW Health (608) 265-1718 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2005 Report Share Posted September 22, 2005 Hello Group, Since we're on the topic of vitamins (and I know this topic has come up in past posts), I'm curious to get feedback on what you all think of "Mega" or "High Potency" multivitamins (with %DV greater than 100%). I've been working as a bariatric RD for more than three years now and have always encouraged these higher potency types over kids chewable or 1-A-Day type vitamins. My concern is that these 1-A-Day type vitamins would not be adequate given their reduced portion sizes and malabsorption issues after surgery. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. TIA, Beth Goodridge, MS, RDCarina Lagua <carinalagua@...> wrote: Hi Kasey Can you tell me what your post-op vitamin protocol is for RYGB patients? Thank you! Carina Lagua MA, RD, CDE CNY Surgical Bariatric Center Syracuse, NY 13210"kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We rec. double the adult dosage of MVI for at least 6 weeks post op, then continuation if lab values deem necessary. Otherwise, they can go down to one MVI/day. Sublinqual bcomplex for lifetimeKathy Shattler wrote: For how long are is it recommended to take the two multis and one b-vitamin after the rygb? Kathy Shattler, M.S.,RD kshattler@..."kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good...deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks!Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 This email message is confidential, intended only for the recipient(s) named above and may contain information that is privileged, exempt from discloser under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, do not disclose or disseminate this message to anyone except the intended recipient. If you have received this message in error, or are not the recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender by return email, and delete all copies of this message. begin:vcardfn:Kasey Kostern:Koster;Kaseyorg:OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtionsadr;dom:Ste. C;;1230 SW 89th;Oklahoma City ;OK;73139email;internet:kkoster@...title:Dietitiantel;work:405-360-7100tel;fax:405-364-9112url:http://www.owlo.comversion:2.1end:vcard for GoodClick here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2005 Report Share Posted September 22, 2005 Since we are discussing vitamins – I attached the handout we give patients with our vitamin/mineral recommendations on it. Townsend, RD Missouri Bariatric Services From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Beth Goodridge Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 3:34 PM Subject: Re: vitamins Hello Group, Since we're on the topic of vitamins (and I know this topic has come up in past posts), I'm curious to get feedback on what you all think of " Mega " or " High Potency " multivitamins (with %DV greater than 100%). I've been working as a bariatric RD for more than three years now and have always encouraged these higher potency types over kids chewable or 1-A-Day type vitamins. My concern is that these 1-A-Day type vitamins would not be adequate given their reduced portion sizes and malabsorption issues after surgery. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. TIA, Beth Goodridge, MS, RD Carina Lagua <carinalagua@...> wrote: Hi Kasey Can you tell me what your post-op vitamin protocol is for RYGB patients? Thank you! Carina Lagua MA, RD, CDE CNY Surgical Bariatric Center Syracuse, NY 13210 " kkoster@... " <kkoster@...> wrote: We rec. double the adult dosage of MVI for at least 6 weeks post op, then continuation if lab values deem necessary. Otherwise, they can go down to one MVI/day. Sublinqual bcomplex for lifetime Kathy Shattler wrote: For how long are is it recommended to take the two multis and one b-vitamin after the rygb? Kathy Shattler, M.S.,RD kshattler@... " kkoster@... " <kkoster@...> wrote: We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good... deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks! Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 This email message is confidential, intended only for the recipient(s) named above and may contain information that is privileged, exempt from discloser under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, do not disclose or disseminate this message to anyone except the intended recipient. If you have received this message in error, or are not the recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender by return email, and delete all copies of this message. begin:vcard fn:Kasey Koster n:Koster;Kasey org:OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions adr;dom:Ste. C;;1230 SW 89th;Oklahoma City ;OK;73139 email;internet:kkoster@... title:Dietitian tel;work:405-360-7100 tel;fax:405-364-9112 url:http://www.owlo.com version:2.1 end:vcard for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2005 Report Share Posted September 22, 2005 I recommend a Bariatric Advantage or Optisource specialty vitamin for about the 1st 6 months, Once there calories have increased I usually recommend a childrens chewable * 2/day with b12 and extra calcium or adult mvi *2 day with b12 and calcium and continue to monitor labs as necessary. JerryCarina Lagua <carinalagua@...> wrote: Hi Kasey Can you tell me what your post-op vitamin protocol is for RYGB patients? Thank you! Carina Lagua MA, RD, CDE CNY Surgical Bariatric Center Syracuse, NY 13210"kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We rec. double the adult dosage of MVI for at least 6 weeks post op, then continuation if lab values deem necessary. Otherwise, they can go down to one MVI/day. Sublinqual bcomplex for lifetimeKathy Shattler wrote: For how long are is it recommended to take the two multis and one b-vitamin after the rygb? Kathy Shattler, M.S.,RD kshattler@..."kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good...deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks!Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 This email message is confidential, intended only for the recipient(s) named above and may contain information that is privileged, exempt from discloser under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, do not disclose or disseminate this message to anyone except the intended recipient. If you have received this message in error, or are not the recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender by return email, and delete all copies of this message. begin:vcardfn:Kasey Kostern:Koster;Kaseyorg:OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtionsadr;dom:Ste. C;;1230 SW 89th;Oklahoma City ;OK;73139email;internet:kkoster@...title:Dietitiantel;work:405-360-7100tel;fax:405-364-9112url:http://www.owlo.comversion:2.1end:vcard for GoodClick here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 Do most of you only recommend bariatric specific vitamins to your patients after bypass surgery? I don't remember ever seeing those recommendations from such organizations as ASBS or ADA to use special vitamins. If these are what are recommended, could you please provide literature or evidence supporting this. I usually just recommend a complete MVI (child's chewable for 1st 6 weeks and adult after 6 weeks post-op). Also, do a majority of you recommend Omega-3 supplementation after surgery? If so when do you have them start and what dose. I've tried the orange cream one I believe called Coromega, it was good. Thanks in advance for your help. Gregoline, RD Columbus Regional Hospital -----Original Message-----From: [mailto: ]On Behalf Of Townsend, R.Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 4:06 PM Subject: RE: vitamins Since we are discussing vitamins - I attached the handout we give patients with our vitamin/mineral recommendations on it. Townsend, RDMissouri Bariatric Services From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Beth GoodridgeSent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 3:34 PM Subject: Re: vitamins Hello Group, Since we're on the topic of vitamins (and I know this topic has come up in past posts), I'm curious to get feedback on what you all think of "Mega" or "High Potency" multivitamins (with %DV greater than 100%). I've been working as a bariatric RD for more than three years now and have always encouraged these higher potency types over kids chewable or 1-A-Day type vitamins. My concern is that these 1-A-Day type vitamins would not be adequate given their reduced portion sizes and malabsorption issues after surgery. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. TIA, Beth Goodridge, MS, RDCarina Lagua <carinalagua@...> wrote: Hi Kasey Can you tell me what your post-op vitamin protocol is for RYGB patients? Thank you! Carina Lagua MA, RD, CDE CNY Surgical Bariatric Center Syracuse, NY 13210"kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We rec. double the adult dosage of MVI for at least 6 weeks post op, then continuation if lab values deem necessary. Otherwise, they can go down to one MVI/day. Sublinqual bcomplex for lifetimeKathy Shattler wrote: For how long are is it recommended to take the two multis and one b-vitamin after the rygb? Kathy Shattler, M.S.,RD kshattler@..."kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good...deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks!Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 This email message is confidential, intended only for the recipient(s) named above and may contain information that is privileged, exempt from discloser under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, do not disclose or disseminate this message to anyone except the intended recipient. If you have received this message in error, or are not the recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender by return email, and delete all copies of this message. begin:vcardfn:Kasey Kostern:Koster;Kaseyorg:OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtionsadr;dom:Ste. C;;1230 SW 89th;Oklahoma City ;OK;73139email;internet:kkoster@...title:Dietitiantel;work:405-360-7100tel;fax:405-364-9112url:http://www.owlo.comversion:2.1end:vcard for GoodClick here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 27, 2005 Report Share Posted September 27, 2005 I am new to this group and have the same questions as regarding bariatric specific vs standard vitamin supplements. Does anyone have any references/studies/literature to support whether some forms of vitamins are more readily absorbed than others after RNY? We recommend 2 chewable childrens multivitamins daily for the first 6 weeks or until they can swallow pills - then change to 2 standard adult MVIs daily. One of our surgeons would like us to change our recommendation to bariatric specific vitamins. I would really like to have some documentation to support a request for change if it is valid. Thanks Betty , MS, RD, LDN, CNSD Manager Nutrition Care Regional Medical Center Bayonet Point 14000 Fivay Road Hudson, FL 34667 phone: 727-869-5503 fax: 727-861-5104 email: betty.davis@... RE: vitamins Do most of you only recommend bariatric specific vitamins to your patients after bypass surgery? I don't remember ever seeing those recommendations from such organizations as ASBS or ADA to use special vitamins. If these are what are recommended, could you please provide literature or evidence supporting this. I usually just recommend a complete MVI (child's chewable for 1st 6 weeks and adult after 6 weeks post-op). Also, do a majority of you recommend Omega-3 supplementation after surgery? If so when do you have them start and what dose. I've tried the orange cream one I believe called Coromega, it was good. Thanks in advance for your help. Gregoline, RD Columbus Regional Hospital -----Original Message-----From: [mailto: ]On Behalf Of Townsend, R.Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 4:06 PM Subject: RE: vitamins Since we are discussing vitamins - I attached the handout we give patients with our vitamin/mineral recommendations on it. Townsend, RDMissouri Bariatric Services From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Beth GoodridgeSent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 3:34 PM Subject: Re: vitamins Hello Group, Since we're on the topic of vitamins (and I know this topic has come up in past posts), I'm curious to get feedback on what you all think of "Mega" or "High Potency" multivitamins (with %DV greater than 100%). I've been working as a bariatric RD for more than three years now and have always encouraged these higher potency types over kids chewable or 1-A-Day type vitamins. My concern is that these 1-A-Day type vitamins would not be adequate given their reduced portion sizes and malabsorption issues after surgery. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. TIA, Beth Goodridge, MS, RDCarina Lagua <carinalagua@...> wrote: Hi Kasey Can you tell me what your post-op vitamin protocol is for RYGB patients? Thank you! Carina Lagua MA, RD, CDE CNY Surgical Bariatric Center Syracuse, NY 13210"kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We rec. double the adult dosage of MVI for at least 6 weeks post op, then continuation if lab values deem necessary. Otherwise, they can go down to one MVI/day. Sublinqual bcomplex for lifetimeKathy Shattler wrote: For how long are is it recommended to take the two multis and one b-vitamin after the rygb? Kathy Shattler, M.S.,RD kshattler@..."kkoster@..." <kkoster@...> wrote: We recommend 2 chewable MVI (one in am, one in pm), in addition to sublingual b12. Compliance has been good...deannamachac wrote: I recently attended the ASBS conference and learned that some programs are encouraging RYGB patients to take a 2 multivitamins in addition to a B complex vitamin(for the thiamin. I am just wonding if this is what most programs are doing or is this a new thing? If anyone wants to share all of the vitamins their bypass patients are taking, it would be appreciated. Thanks!Deanna Machac RD CD -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football -- Kasey Koster Dietitian OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtions 405-360-7100 This email message is confidential, intended only for the recipient(s) named above and may contain information that is privileged, exempt from discloser under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, do not disclose or disseminate this message to anyone except the intended recipient. If you have received this message in error, or are not the recipient(s), please immediately notify the sender by return email, and delete all copies of this message. begin:vcardfn:Kasey Kostern:Koster;Kaseyorg:OKlahoma WEIGHT LOSS OPtionsadr;dom:Ste. C;;1230 SW 89th;Oklahoma City ;OK;73139email;internet:kkoster@...title:Dietitiantel;work:405-360-7100tel;fax:405-364-9112url:http://www.owlo.comversion:2.1end:vcard for GoodClick here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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