Re: diet advice reply to .

[Guest guest]

Dear , Sorry I did not even give 's age...I had put so many details in my Effexor troubles letter to prozacawareness and the w/e in between was a bad one which saw him suicidal again and the police returning him home....the police are obviously better than the doctors here as a very nice poloiceman sat and talked to for a long while and seemed able to persuade him that he HAD to seek help....considering he has seen his psychologist for two and a half years and all he did was send into Effexor-hell. actually said he felt something had got through to the fog that is at present his brain ....perhaps this is a turning point . You asked for his food intake for the last 4 days: B/fast porridge made with water/milk o/juice Lunch lamb stew( with carrots onions,mushrooms, swede

org.stock,cornflour) 2 potatoes carrots,gn.beans,sprouting broccoli. Apple & cranberry crumble with the topping made with oats,tblesp. gluten free flour, butter and tsp brown sugar. Dinner soup made with carrots tomatoes,leeks, garlic,celery,tom puree and veg.stock and topped with grated cheese. B/fast porridge as before , tea. Lunch soup made with lentils,carrots,swede,turnip shredded gn.cabbage and tomato puree.2 rye crackers with hard cheese. Dinner sausages(pork,red wine,garlic) jacket potato with butter,baked beans.Buckwheat pancakes made with2eggs and milk and served with lemon juice and 2tsp.brown sugar. Supper 2 ryvita crackers with cheese Bedtime Ovaltine milk drink No B/fast as somach 'bubbly' Lunch salad with mixed

leaves,cucumber,tomatoes.celery,beetroot.Chicken. Dinner Chicken stir fry with garlic,onions.chilli,soy sauce,baby corn,mange tout.pak choi.served with..wild/brown rice mixed Supper 2 crackers cheese. B/fast 2 eggs and 2 rye crackers & 1 rasher grilled bacon Lunch Lentil soup from the canteen at work Dinner Beef casserole( red wine,dash worcester sauce,tom.puree,carrots,harricotand butter beans) layered pots with milk and butter,gn.beans, sugar snap peas,broccoli. Cheesecake made with oats, oatbran,butter.ground almonds and linseeds for the base with a topping made fromsieved cottage cheese,2 tblsp. honey,thick live nat.yoghurt,sultanas,vanilla,lemon juice and topped with strawberries. Bedtime drink Ovaltine. In addition to above he had the supplements of 300 mag.and eskimo fish oil 3 tabs at breakfast. Lunch time

another 3 fish oil.Dinner time 300mag. 3 fish oil 1adrenal support which we have now stopped 500mg vit C and 1 multi vit. 4 weak tea was drunk during the day but in between meals apart from the one mentioned at breakfast.3 glasses of water. He uses butter to spread on crackers and I have always used olive oil in cooking.No sugar added to drinks or cereal.I do not use salt.All the meat and veg are organic,as were the oats and all the dairy. His age now is 47....he was 45 when he commenced Effexor but has been totally off psych meds since Nov.04. His mood is generally low;even his voice sounds flat. He feels exhausted all the time-he has described this as feeling tired but not sleepy.He has said he feels no emotions for anything but when he gets really agitated over the silliest little thing that has gone wrong he certainly seems angry and when we have argued, which has

happened a lot....my letter referred to the difficulties the drugs caused to our marriage, he cries and his emotions become totally out of control..he paces or crouches in a corner or lies on the bed in a foetal position hoping everything will go away. On down days he lies in bed unable to get up and pulls the covers over his head. I try to sit and rationalise things with him but when he is in this state it is impossible to get through to him....his perception was altered by the Effex. and seems to have been altered permanantly for he takes many things said to him as a negative comment against him. I cannot give much more info. re. his mood as he often says he does not know how he is feeling and seems out of touch with his emotions.I often judge him by body language and his voice. My aunt visited us recently,having not seen P since the month he started Eff. so she noticed the change in him..she described him to me as looking grey and aged

beyond belief. She remarked on how he stooped whilst walking and appeared' totally broken and destroyed'. I know this sounds emotive but it was a good description from someone outside the immediate family who could clearly see the' before and after.' All meds stopped in Nov.2004.I got him to see the nutritionist in March 2005 and he was on supplements till June 2005.Up until then he had had no w/d syptoms as such.The headaches began in June 2005 and were severe migraine type h/aches that centred on the front Lhand side of his brain. They were not light sensitive but lasted day and night for about three months.He stopped all supplements in case they caused the headaches but by then I had read enough literature to see it was the effexor . The headaches now occur once or twice a week and are milder and take place over his whole head....no longer one sided. About this time he became very nauseous and had diarrhea and could not keep food in for

long.About ten minutes after he had eaten he would need the bathroom urgently. His sleep. He goes to bed about 10 and gets to sleep quite quickly but then wakes after a couple of hours.He then dozes, waking every 15 to 30 mins and going back to sleep.He feels he has not had a proper nights rest (as indeed he has'nt!) When stressed he twitches in bed...either his feet or legs. His skin itched badly and still itches occasionally.He simply describes this as a prickly itch- not a burning sensation that some have described on this site.He has tingling in his arms but that has subsided to once a week or so. One thing I forgot to mention is that he frequently gets athletes foot and has done for a few years...maybe 4.I read with interest the links in the files the digestion/allergy/yeast links with depression as he has had all these( but was always bouyant until things started to go wrong in his life.You wrote

ages ago about depression being traced back to a much earlier stage than when it first manifests in someone and I think that is so true for ...physically I think he was at a lower state than we realised and when he was faced with problems that needed coping with he simply had no resistance). I also read the bit about SSRI's effecting your immune system and since he has been off Effexor he has also had 3 bouts of ringworm.I believe the two fungal infections are linked? but I have heard that ringworm strikes at a comprimised immune system. He did not work for months whilst on Eff...was totally debilitated. Now he tries to work but has at least one day off most weeks through tiredness or headache or tummy upset. He gets up at 6:30 commutes by train to London....1 hour travelling.Works in I.T. 1 hour journey home and gets home 7:30 so its a long day which he finds tiring. He takes Mag split into 2 doses morning and

evening. I read Eby's mag. site whilst reading the files here and thought it said calcium was not a problem if people ate calcium rich foods and that it chased mag. out of the cells so I had not started him on calcium but will and alternate it. He doesn't drink enough water maybe 3 glasses a day 20 fl. oz. He drinks very weak black tea.Or orange juice. He has had asthma since the age of 22 but hayfever from his early teens preceeded this. He was diagnosed with IBS at age 42. things at work were starting to get stressful for him and he was taking at least 1 day a week off workbecause of stomach pains and loose bowel.He was prescribed meberavine.I have only recently discovered from his mother that as a small child he had terrible constipation and gas.He was hospitalised once aged about 7 with suspected appedicitis but this turned out to be a blockage which cleared. did not appear to

have digestive problems by the time I first met him age 19 but during his late 20's he became increasingly gassy. During the next few years he was often windy with frequent need to use the bathroom urgently.He was never constipated but tended more towards' loose'.His family diet was meat potatoes, veg and vast amounts of white bread.They never ate fish or fruit. Ginseng was prescibed for the morning and he had been drug/mania free for 4 months by that time. Vit C.I have kept it at 500mg because of his tendancy towards 'loose'.But I will now split it into 3 and try the increase. He walks about 20 mins a day with our dog. We need to work on this but he gets very tired very easily. He joined a gym for some exercise(as he works in London he does not get much opportunity but when the weather is good he tries to get a lunchtime walk in)...I have told him to keep

it gentle but so far that is not a problem as he is too tired to attend and has only been twice in 3 months........ Thanks for your reply,time and knowledge! Regards,Margaret. ccreel_04064 wrote: Dear Margaret, Welcome to the list. Please post an actual four day food diary. Thanks. Please describe all current symptoms your husband has (i.e., anxiety, restlessness, exhaustion, electrical-like zapping in the brain, difficulty sleeping etc.) Are you giving the magnesium in 2 doses? 600 in one dose is a waste. The body can't use that much. Calcium - 300 mg 2x a day. Alternate it with the

magnesium doses. How much water does he drink a day? How long has he had asthma? The asthma drugs exhaust the adrenals. Ginseng is contraindicated in mania. As far as adrenal supplements, I have never seenthem as helpful in a person who has gone thorough an abrupt withdrawal. Thry tend to be too exciting. What heals the adrenals is good nutrients, rest, avoidance of overstimulating things (see article in files), and time. The problem is not the adrenals, it's the autonomic nervous system. The malfunction of this exhausts the adrenals. In other words, the exhausted adrenals are only a symptom of the problem, not the origin of the problem. The root of the problem must be healed in order to heal the adrenals. The same goes for the Bio-Glycozyme Forte and Drive! right now. Drive is worse in that it

increases noradrenaline which increases cortisol -- the root of the problem. B vitamins are often fine if given in a full spectrum multi-vitamin. On their own they can be too stimulating. vit C -- he's at a very low dose. I would suggest raising it gradually by 500 mg. until you notice his bowels being loose for more than a day. At that point, back it down by 500 mg. This should also be in divided doses 3x a day. You said: <<in Bio-G listed is: B1 11mg 1000%RDA B2 11mg 882% andB12 1667%.....in addition B3,B6 and B12 are in the Drive supplement at 250% and 500% of the RDA for the last two so this seems like a rather high amount.>> ** These are not high at all. A person only assimilates a fraction of this. For instance, we assimilate 2% of Vit B12

supplements. After you provide a thourough list of symptoms I will recommend some other things (definitely a Bach flower essence blend among them). I can make specific dietary recommendations after I see his actual daily food. Does he walk at all? What is his age? Regards,<< I recently wrote to Prozac awareness re my husband. 'Effexor problems' detailed his decent whilst on the drugs and I mentioned the mania that began with his taking the Eff. and ended when the drugs were withdrawn.> Could or someone advise re his diet.Fortunately it had always been good in this respect:> No junk or ready meals> Organic or free range meats> plentiful fresh veg organic where poss(i have veg box scheme

locally)> org. milk in very smallamounts> small amount of fruit> cheese and butter usually organic> few eggs org. or free range.> Now the not so good bits!> far too much white bread-up: to a loaf a day when he was on Eff. I swear he became addicted to eating although if you read my letter you will understand that was the least of his addiction worries...> really heavy on carbs generally> would never eat fish> never eaten yoghurt> dislikes salad but ate occasionally.> He takes asthma med once a day in the form of a steroid inhaler.Occasionaly ventolin when needed.> > This is a long process partly because he was taken off the drugs quickly 225mg Eff. 75mg Amitryptaline both not re-instated after he o/d in Nov

2004. During 2005 we did see a nutritionist through the MIND book Food and Mood which co-incidently is good for anyone in UK as it lists suppliers of top quality food and nutrients.She said much of what is said here and guided him towards improving his diet further and stopping wheat as he had IBS and she wanted his gut to heal and for him to stop the steroids. However he became so ill in June with headaches daily he stopped taking the supplements and seemed frightened of taking any pill.> I believe I mentioned in my letter that when I tried to get him to look at this site and the healing protocol etc. he became so emotional and agitated and eventually suicidal.> His mood remains low,flat and he says he feels no emotions other than when really agitated.He thinks of death often and is feels very guilty over what he did whilst on the drugs.> I have worked on this really slowly

and,having been off all meds for a year and a half nearly, he is now eating as above in my first list of foods but I've managed to add oily fish twice a week and he no longer eats bread as he came off wheat at the nutritionists suggestion.This has helped his stomach greatly but he's still prone to bloating maybe a couple of times a week.> Her supplements were:> 3xGinsing on waking > Cytozyme-AD (she tested his adrenals and his readings were so low they were hardly on the scale of the graph that she sent)> Bio-Glycozyme Forte by Biotics Research.> Drive! by Higher Nature.> He took these for about three mnths till he became unwell. I assume the headaches were the start of his delayed w/d as between ceasing all meds in Nov. 2004 and June 2005 it seemed as if the effects of Eff. had been mental....the physical effects kicked in

after6 mnths or so with headaches. tingling arms and legs, bloating and digestive problems.> I have persuaded him now to recommence supplements and he is now taking:> Cytozyme-AD again as I read in these posts that the adrenals needed help to recover.> Eskimo with vit E 3x3a day as this oil was recommended here and in a recent health article as being particularly pure and about the best as I cannot obtain Carlsons.> Vit C 500mg> Mag taurate I'e got him up to 600mg as it said to > introduce slowly....> A general multi vit with the B vits at around the RDA.> > The drive! and the Bio Glycosyme are what I am not sure about. After finding this site in Oct and wishing to persuade him to re-start supplements I spoke with his nutritionist about the B vitimins as I see here not to

overcharge a fragile CNS.> She disagreed and said she considered it important to take them but in Bio-G listed is: B1 11mg 1000%RDA B2 11mg 882% andB12 1667%.....in addition B3,B6 and B12 are in the Drive supplement at 250% and 500% of the RDA for the last two so this seems like a rather high amount.> If I can use these saftely then I would prefer to as the mania I mentined he developed on Eff. caused a financial situation which means I cannot but too many nutrients at the moment and am sticking to the back-bone ones you,ve recommended.> > His diet each day now consists of:> Porridge made with water> Lunch:variety of salad with meat or fish> > Dinner: would be meat or oily fish.Brown rice or potato.about 4 generous servings of lightly cooked veg.I try to use as wide a

variety of veg as possible.> > Snacks are veg like carrots and celery or rye crackers with seeds and cheese.> He was advised to cut out tea but has only managed to cut down and he drinks an occasional red wine but this does not seem to effect him.> He has never eaten nuts or yoghurt but I am very inventive and can sneak these into recipes along with any other benificial food I've seen mentioned here or others that contain magnesium or elements that might be lacking....> I am sorry for the length of this but if anyone feels able to answer re the high-in-B-vits supplements or whether re-instating the ginseng would be beneficial I would be grateful,> Margaret.> > > > > > To subscribe to our off-topic Social list go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/ > > To subscribe to our Truth-in-Health list go to:> > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/truth-in-health> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Margaret, Your food sounds so delicious. You are making me hungry. The lamb stew, lentil soup, all the fresh vegetables, beef casserole. That cheesecake make from oats and cottage cheese sounds wonderful! I wish I was eating at your house.

Yahoo! Mail

Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze.

[Guest guest]

Look's like Margaret is going to have a full house! How are you doing

Ros?

Love you

>

> Hi ,

> I am going with you over to margarets house for diner ''lol''.I

wish i

> could cook.

> Ros

>