Re: Does the BP feel any guilt???

[Guest guest]

The only things I've ever heard nada express remorse about were:

1. Not joining a convent (although she hasn't gone to mass but a dozen

times since the mid 1960s)

2. Not being nicer to her mother (who died when I was 2 but from what

dad & others who knew her have said, treated nada just about like nada

treated me.)

[Guest guest]

Sad, yes. Guilt? From what I've read it's more like shame, and

that only for a fleeting second until they find a way to make it

land on someone else.

>

> I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

>

> My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really

upset

> at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around sad,

and

> on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think my

> sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me feel

bad.

>

> We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

because

> of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

>

> So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt or

> remorse???

>

> Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

>

[Guest guest]

Ha ha ha...remorse. No way. Good luck getting my Nada to admit that

she had done anything to be remorseful about. It was always someone

else who did something to her, whether they did or not. Always

someone else's fault. The perpetural victim. Foowee!

Khris

> >

> > I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

> >

> > My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really

> upset

> > at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around sad,

> and

> > on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think

my

> > sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me feel

> bad.

> >

> > We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

> because

> > of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

> >

> > So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt

or

> > remorse???

> >

> > Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

> >

>

[Guest guest]

My mom does feel guilt, but can't control the actions that cause her to feel

guilty. She doesn't feel guilty often, but when she does, she feels pretty

awful about what she's put me through. Then it's back to business as usual.

It's like a vicious cycle for her.

**************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.

http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489

[Guest guest]

I kinda think my nada has never had a moment of guilt or shame in regards to us

kids. I want to doubt myself, because it doesn't seem possible that she wouldn't

have these emotions. But, in 24 years she has never once apoligized that I've

heard, certainly she never has to me. And that seems impossible to me, that

someone could go that long without remorse, but she seems to have done so quite

admirably. Her reaction to my NC has so far been the same as her reaction to

everything else: a violent, blind rage, broken up by

guilt-provoking/passive-aggressive appeals for pity.

I really don't think someone with BPD, untreated and unacknowledged, CAN feel

remorse as we would call it. They mostly split themselves white, right? I think

there would be some kind of system malfunction if they admitted fault enough to

feel remorse over something like that. They may just spontaneously combust!

Jae

Re: Does the BP feel any guilt???

Sad, yes. Guilt? From what I've read it's more like shame, and

that only for a fleeting second until they find a way to make it

land on someone else.

>

> I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

>

> My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really

upset

> at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around sad,

and

> on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think my

> sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me feel

bad.

>

> We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

because

> of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

>

> So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt or

> remorse???

>

> Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

>

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

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[Guest guest]

First - what's an NC? I'm new to this.

After reading several posts, I find that life is similar with my nada.

I can count on one hand how many times she's apologized and was

actually heartfelt about it, but I still believe she thinks she didn't

do anything wrong. She always twists it around so the other person

feels sorry for her.

[Guest guest]

in my experience, Nada only knows how to make others feel guilt, because it is

everyone

elses fault, responsibility, or problem!

I am starting to believe that my Nada is just pure evil. Trying everything to

get me back into

her web. She has been fighting my separation from her for 3 years now, and has

not had the

results she would like.

I honestly don't think she feels one iota of guilt for the all scheming, and

planning she does

to try and suck the life out of me.

So the short answer, in my case is no, she feels no guilt

[Guest guest]

I can't think of a time when my nada felt guilt - nor can I remember

a post on this board about a nada or fada feeling guilty. Sad -

yes, in the waif manner. But they will feel their sadness is due to

how they were treated by someone. I don't think they can feel guilt,

because they never seem to assume responsibility for anything.

Sylvia

>

> I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

>

> My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really

upset

> at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around sad,

and

> on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think my

> sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me feel

bad.

>

> We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

because

> of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

>

> So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt or

> remorse???

>

> Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

>

[Guest guest]

Yes -- I think that's it, too: Shame. They can't face their shame -

- it would be like a house of cards falling apart, so they deflect

anything that might intensify that unworthiness they already feel.

> >

> > I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

> >

> > My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really

> upset

> > at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around

sad,

> and

> > on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think

my

> > sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me

feel

> bad.

> >

> > We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

> because

> > of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

> >

> > So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt

or

> > remorse???

> >

> > Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I honestly do not think that my nada has ever felt a moment of real

guilt. She cannot admit to herself that she is responsible for what

happens to her. To give you an idea of what she's truly like, when

she was in elementary school she killed her sister's kitten because

she had to clean up after it. She's told me a version of the story

herself and laughed, but her sister gave me the real version of it

last year. Horrifying.

One of our biggest blow-ups was 3 years ago when she called and

screamed at me wanting to know why I didn't want to spend time with

her. She told me that I cause 75% of her problems. (My friend said I

should have said " 75%? I'm shooting for 100%. What am I doing wrong? " )

I was stupid enough during the call to relate some of the worst things

she's done to me since I got married, and she denied them all. She

finally said that if I was upset then she apologized. She wanted to

start allll over again with a clean slate. I got off the phone, had

diarrhea within 5 minutes (too much info, I know) and cried for 3

days. Her sister called me the next week and told me that nada had

called her screaming about how awful I am, and told her that she

wasn't really sorry for anything because she hadn't done anything.

She (my aunt) knew what I must be going through after the phone call,

and she wanted me to know that I shouldn't feel guilty. My aunt knows

how crazy she is, but since she deals with her on a different level,

it doesn't bother her as much. And nade would go absolutely bonkers

if she knew I ever talked to her sister.

I think the biggest problem our relationship creates for her is that

she is embarrassed by the fact that I do not visit her and spend time

with her. She's very active in a senior center in her city, and it

has to be obvious to her peers that our relationship is not good.

Although I know she lies about it. She creates this fantasy that my

husband, who is a physician, calls and talks to her doctors and

arranges for them to take special care of her. Once when I told her

what I thought was causing a particular problem, she told my aunt that

my husband had diagnosed it and that he had called a specialist in her

city to see her. Oh, and that he had called in a prescription for

her. Total fantasy. I have a masters degree in nursing but my

credentials aren't impressive enough for her although she would tell

you she is very proud of me. I'm sure that on some weird level she is.

She thinks I am so incredibly lucky that my husband married me and

often insinuates that he's going to divorce me if I don't act grateful

enough. He was a prime catch; I guess I was an old boot in the pond.

And like Kyla mentioned in a recent post, I have this fear in the back

of my mind that she will find this site and recognize what I've

written. And it scares me.

She could never ever admit to herself that she's done all of these

horrible, hurtful things, or that my childhood was emotional hell. I

think if she ever did, she would crumple up and melt like the wicked

witch in the Wizard of Oz. Everything happens TO her, nothing bad

happens because of her actions. She is extremely smart, very pretty,

and financially able to take care of herself. She will tell you all

of those things in a hurry, yet in her mind she is always a victim.

I have emphasized to my boys over and over again: Every choice you

make has a consequence. For the most part, things don't happen that

are totally out of your control. Emotionally, nada does not get that.

But lucky for her, she never feels guilty!

Oh, and she's a pathological liar, but that's a whole 'nother post.

Wisteria

[Guest guest]

I find the apologies I get aren't actually apologies, i.e.:

" I'm sorry you feel that I've... " ('you feel' being the operative appology

negater)

" Well I'm sorry that you think I'm such a terrible mother! " (Usually in

response to a small request such as " Mom, I wish you would ask me a question or

two about my boyfriend when we talk- " )

" I know I haven't been perfect but I've done the best with what I've been

given "

What do those count as???

JL Suess wrote:

I kinda think my nada has never had a moment of guilt or shame in regards to

us kids. I want to doubt myself, because it doesn't seem possible that she

wouldn't have these emotions. But, in 24 years she has never once apoligized

that I've heard, certainly she never has to me. And that seems impossible to me,

that someone could go that long without remorse, but she seems to have done so

quite admirably. Her reaction to my NC has so far been the same as her reaction

to everything else: a violent, blind rage, broken up by

guilt-provoking/passive-aggressive appeals for pity.

I really don't think someone with BPD, untreated and unacknowledged, CAN feel

remorse as we would call it. They mostly split themselves white, right? I think

there would be some kind of system malfunction if they admitted fault enough to

feel remorse over something like that. They may just spontaneously combust!

Jae

Re: Does the BP feel any guilt???

Sad, yes. Guilt? From what I've read it's more like shame, and

that only for a fleeting second until they find a way to make it

land on someone else.

>

> I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

>

> My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really

upset

> at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around sad,

and

> on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think my

> sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me feel

bad.

>

> We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

because

> of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

>

> So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt or

> remorse???

>

> Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

>

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

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[Guest guest]

Oh my goodness, this topic really hits home for me. I am 35 years

old, my mother is 60 years old. She has been a horrible mother in

many many ways. She has done and said a lot of horrible things to all

4 of her children (when we were young and now that we are adults

too). And NEVER, NEVER not even once, has she ever ever ever

apologized to any of us at all for anything. Not even for silly

mistakes. She has never said that word, and she never will. It's my

opinion that BPD people have no heart and soul when it comes to their

loved ones. But when it comes to strangers, or men, and idiots and

stuff, then they have all the compassion in the world...........just

not to their own family. Weird? It makes no sense to me. But as

children, my mother always treated strangers better than her own

kids, or her own family in general. It's like she had to please them,

to make herself feel better. Always putting on a fake " show " to make

everyone believe are family had our shit together. My mom was also a

complete drunk, and still is today. She drinks daily, only in the

evenings. She got her first DUI at age 58 and wrecked her $25,000 car

to peices, hit 2 parked cars at a stoplight, and hurt some of the

people inside, now she is being sued and she wants me to feel sorry

for her, but I just can't do it. Like she used to tell me when I was

a child " you made your bed, now you lay in it " Now I tell her the

same thing these days. Oh sweet revenge.

Unlike my 3 sisters, I tell my mom off on a regular basis. I can't

tell you how many times I have called her selfish and self-centered

and a materialistic bitch. She gets mad at me for 2 or 3 days, then

she mysteriously forgets it all happened and will call me up to ask

for my help on something. She never calls to see how I am doing,

after major surgery or giving birth. She just calls me when she needs

help with something. So these days, I just tell her, sorry, call a

plumber, or call a computer guy, or call one of your boyfriends,

cause I can't help you,I'm too busy.

Damn the more I type this up, the more I freaking realize what a

piece of shit she really is, and she can't see it, she just doesn't

see it, it's like she is blinded, she will just say that I am being

mean to her blah, blah bullshit.

> >

> > I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

> >

> > My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really

> upset

> > at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around sad,

> and

> > on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think my

> > sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me feel

> bad.

> >

> > We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

> because

> > of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

> >

> > So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt

or

> > remorse???

> >

> > Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

______________________________________________________________________

______________

> Looking for last minute shopping deals?

> Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.

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>

>

[Guest guest]

Your nada sounds exactly like mine. I think they would like us to carry

their guilt for them, and they will go out of their way to inflict it on us, or

anyone who will help them 'pass it along' to another. They truely feel they

" have done the best they could " raising us and have sacraficed everything for

us!!!!! And we are expected to enable them in their disfunction for the

rest of our lives because they are such 'wonderful', giving, loving people!!!!

After all, they gave birth to us! In their disfunctional minds, we owe them

- and we owe them big time!!!

After 53 years of enabling her, I can finally see the light. I'll not carry

her guilt for her anymore. I'll not allow her to steel my joy from my life.

I don't know how old you are, but just be thankful you didn't live your

whole life emeshed in the disfunction. I am so thankful for this site, so

thankful I found out about BPD and the self absorbed. Wish I would have known

about it about 30 years ago!

Don't let her inflict any more guilt on you. You've suffered enough.

LL

**************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.

http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489

[Guest guest]

Mia,

Your post caught my attention this morning, I am 39, and my nada is

60. She too can't say she is sorry for anything, and is a drunk.

She only drinks in the evenings too, and says she doesn't drink that

much. She knows how to tie one on good though......she lives for

all night brawl sessions with her husband. They like to crank up

the music, and stay up all night, fussing, fighting, crying about

her past, mom, dad, brother, sister, exhusbands, and probably her

rotten kids too. We used to stay the night with her once in a while

(holidays, family gatherings), but could never sleep with the loud

music, and all the blah, blah, blah, all night long. It is better

now with an outdoor room that they made for guests. But still at 60

how much fun is it to re-hash the past every time you pick up a

drink??? So unhealthy!!!

Plus she has told me since I was a kid that " you never say your

sorry " . She even said this to her latest husband(I over heard him

say this at my nieces birthday, and felt stuck, or I would have

blasted them both out of their drunkin stupper). This kills me

since I am happily married of almost 20 years, and have 3 kids.

Now tell me how a person could get away with this behavior, and be

married as long as we have, raise 3 great kids, and never say I'm

sorry???

Who's sorry now nada???

drlingirl

> > >

> > > I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

> > >

> > > My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was

really

> > upset

> > > at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around

sad,

> > and

> > > on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think

my

> > > sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me

feel

> > bad.

> > >

> > > We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

> > because

> > > of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

> > >

> > > So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any

guilt

> or

> > > remorse???

> > >

> > > Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

_____________________________________________________________________

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> ______________

> > Looking for last minute shopping deals?

> > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.

> http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?

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> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Now that I think about it, my nada has apologized once---but it was

to herself and it was a hard situation to take: She said she was

sorry that she had kids because she hadn't wanted them.....which

makes her a victim....again!!!

Nan

>

> My mom does feel guilt, but can't control the actions that cause

her to feel

> guilty. She doesn't feel guilty often, but when she does, she

feels pretty

> awful about what she's put me through. Then it's back to business

as usual.

> It's like a vicious cycle for her.

>

>

>

> **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in

shape.

> http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?

NCID=aolcmp00300000002489

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

My Fada-in law does the same thing-- causes a HUGE drama for

everyone he supposedly loves and acts as if nothing happened. If

anyone so much as questions his actions, he rages. Most of the

family is so scared (he's an ex-marine, 6 ft 2, 250 lbs who spends

most of his time badgering people while intoxicated). Then he'll

turn into an overly sensitive idiot and claim to be highly insulted

if questioned or faced with accusation. The simple passing of time

somehow erases his anger and sensitivities for HIM, but not for the

me. After a particularly toxic scene on Father's Day (drunken

verbal abuse)with this man, my H cut off contact with him. After 2

months of NC, he suddenly appeared at a sporting event for our child

and hugs us and says what? Not " I'm sorry for what I did. "

Not " Please forgive me. " No, he simply states " I can't live like

this anymore and I'm glad that's all behind us. "

His utter denial and lack of reflection make me seethe.

~Elle

> >

> > My mom does feel guilt, but can't control the actions that cause

> her to feel

> > guilty. She doesn't feel guilty often, but when she does, she

> feels pretty

> > awful about what she's put me through. Then it's back to

business

> as usual.

> > It's like a vicious cycle for her.

> >

> >

> >

> > **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in

> shape.

> > http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?

> NCID=aolcmp00300000002489

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Wow, I'm new to this group and can hardly believe the similarities

between your and my own mother. Yikes! Mine has always been more

interested in what other people thought or how they see her and

could care less what her family and close friends think. She is now

into interent dating and is so involved in all these strange men's

lives whom she has never and will never meet (they're all in other

states/countries)and when one of us asks her to stop talking about

them or shows concern for her risky behavior we are all just a bunch

of nags. When I was a kid she invited these strange women to live

in our homes and never monitored what they were saying to her own

kids or how they were acting, all that mattered was that she looked

like a saint to the outside world for taking in these poor women.

She once even moved a teenage girl into my room while I was in

school one day!!! I had to share my room with this stranger for a

year and my mother's response was " well you're going to college next

year and you need to learn how to share a room with someone. " ???

I have realized now after 40 years that I was born to meet her

needs, from " loving " her as an infant to doing her bidding and

raising my brohter for her to being her personal taxi service

and " parent " . Guilt has been bred into me and I struggle every time

I talk to her to not let her words and tone make me feel like I'm to

blame for not meeting her needs or for all that she has screwed up

in her own life. But she very rarely feels any true guilt, just a

few mumbled apologies when I freak out on her and tell her how badly

she is treating her kids and grandkids.

Thanks for being her everyone, I really needed people who have

similar experiences who are learning to live through this stuff!

> > >

> > > I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

> > >

> > > My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was

really

> > upset

> > > at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around

sad,

> > and

> > > on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think

my

> > > sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me

feel

> > bad.

> > >

> > > We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

> > because

> > > of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

> > >

> > > So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any

guilt

> or

> > > remorse???

> > >

> > > Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

_____________________________________________________________________

_

> ______________

> > Looking for last minute shopping deals?

> > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.

> http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?

category=shopping

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Dishrag dad always did the apologizing for her.

'She's had a hard life', 'she couldn't have children' (lie-she could

have if she married someone else), 'she's got PMS' (365, 24-7????)

Her apologies were always snarled and followed by a 'but you did

this,', 'you take me too seriously, I was just kidding', 'you're a

wuss', 'you never loved me' (how true that is - but I would instead

snivel and beg her to believe that I did.), 'you don't understand

how hard this/that is...'

She's never felt bad for anyone but herself. And her drama's are

ALWAYS due to someone elses words/actions, but we never get to hear

that person's side of the story, because she always cuts the

offended person out of her and my father's life. Now he's down to

her, and one daughter.

>

> I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

>

> My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really

upset

> at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around sad,

and

> on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think my

> sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me feel

bad.

>

> We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not

because

> of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

>

> So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt or

> remorse???

>

> Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

>

[Guest guest]

Everyone is different, but I don't think they do.

Anything my mother does is only used to twist it back around to get

something she wants.

I really cope with it by reminding myself of all the awful things she

has done to me (and all the awful things BPs have done to other

people)... all while taking zero responsibility for their actions.

My nada has really treated me in ways that made me feel like she

couldn't care if I would die at all.... and basically I don't think

she would at some deep fundamental level.

I don't believe she experiences empathy the way other people do.

Believing that she doesn't experience guilt has really helped me with

coping.

As someone once told me on this forum, " None of her feelings are real. "

This has been invaluable advice. I have always used this as guidance,

and it has really helped me from not stepping on the rollercoaster

again (even though she seems to have " guilt " or " miss me " etc.) I

realize she only views me as an appendage to herself and can never

respect me as a unique separate individual. Sad.

G.

>

> I was wondering if the BP feels any guilt???

>

> My sister used to call me, and tell me, that our nada was really upset

> at my NC at first. She told me that nada just walked around sad, and

> on the verge of crying.....or was crying all the time. I think my

> sister was exaggerating as usual, but it worked on making me feel bad.

>

> We don't talk about nada anymore as I have asked that we not because

> of the guilt I was feeling about her " sadness " .

>

> So does anyone think that the BP's in their life feel any guilt or

> remorse???

>

> Thanks for any reply.....drlingirl

>