Re: 911:: Stupid People... and losing it

[Guest guest]

Tree....you did a lot better than I would have after all of those calls from

her. IMHO you were 100% right and handled it perfectly. Especially with the

outcome from checking on the woman in the morning and learning that this was

just a nosy daughter. I always wonder if some people are soooo worried about

someone why don't they get their worried little behinds off of their couch

and go their themselves. I know if it was a friend or family member that I

was worried about I would be calling the police once I was standing outside

their home with no response to my banging on their doors/windows. Why do

some people think that the police/fire department are there for their every

whim at whatever hour of the morning they feel like calling.

Can you imagine the look on the daughters face if the police and fire

department had made a forced entry and caught her in a " compromising

position " ....!?!?!?!?!?! My oh my would the letters of complaints would have

been flying then.

As for the 2 1/2 years between " losing it's " ...you are doing better than

me...!!! I seem to go about 6 months with mine.

Chicago (Illinois) 9-1-1

Witchy666@...

my opinions.. ..never theirs.. ..and never to be used without prior written

consent

<<

I can't say 'always'. I'm just glad I didn't tell my caller

exactly what I really thought of her and her midnight worries.

Let's see, I'm averaging two and a half years between those

'losing it's.' Is that good? Bad? Average? Comments?

---

Always take good care of yourself and yours,

R J 'Tree' Greenwood

doctree@...

doctree@... on 911-Talk >>

Chicago (Illinois) 9-1-1

Witchy666@...

my opinions.. ..never theirs.. ..and never to be used without prior written

consent

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 16 Jan 2002 at 00:26:14 Mike s held forth

with:

>

> I've been doing this a while and for the most part, I

>consider myself rather gracious, understanding, lienient and

>empathetic. No matter who calls or why, I've always been able

>to handle it with professionalism and dignity, and while I've

>been tested at times, I've dug deep and hit the mute button

>before laughter or scorn has leapt forth from my deep core.

Well, Mike, I can't say that I _ALWAYS_ manage. As a matter of

fact, I just signed my latest counseling memo and letter of

reprimand. What happened was...

Midnight, Saturday night, got a call from a woman a few miles

south of Falls Church saying that she was worried about her

elderly (to her, elderly was only a couple years older than

me). Caller says that she has been trying to call her mother

since noon and no one answered. Asked if her mother had any

medical or mental problems or disabilities. No. Does mom

ever go out on weekends? Yes, often. I explained that we

don't do welfare checks after 9 p.m. unless it is an emergency

and asked if caller considered this an emergency. No, she was

just worried. I recommended that she call or visit her mother

in the morning.

Well, same caller calls back... Remember, this is a Saturday

night and I'm alone. ... to say she's even more worried because

it's now 12:30 and mom isn't answering the phone. I explained

department policy again. She wasn't satisfied so I transferred

her to the sergeant, who just happened to be in the station and

he repeated the department policy. Caller still didn't want an

emergency response (medics, squad to force entry, and police).

During a slight lull in the usual Saturday night fights, we did

send an officer to mom's residence and saw nothing that was out

of the ordinary.

Well, same caller calls AGAIN, in tears, whailing that we have

to " do something. She might be dead or hurt. " However, the

caller would NOT say that she wanted to declare an emergency

because she really didn't want to disturb her mother if there

was nothing wrong. She just kept calling, again and again,

weeping, whailing, " What if she's hurt? What if she's dead? "

Well, after many of these calls, among the 9-1-1s and fights and

drunks and her crying about how her mother might be dead, still

on the line after taking and dispatching lots of other calls...

Well, I lost it. Right from the tape:

" Look, lady. You said you've been calling since noon. I

explained our policy. If you're that concerned, tell me that

you consider this an emergency and we'll be happy to go over

and tear your mother's door off its hinges to see if she's

there and if she is, if she's alive or dead. If you called us

at 1 or 2 or 3 or anytime before 9 o'clock at night, we would

have been happy to check on your mother. But at this hour,

unless you declare it an emergency, we are not going to go

banging on your mother's door just because you failed to call

us at a reasonable hour. Now, is this an emergency? Do you

really want us to check on your mother? "

Caller: " But what if she's dead? What if she's hurt? "

" Look, lady. She might have been hurt at 1 or 2 or 3 o'clock

or even four, five, six, seven, eight or nine. For all I

know, she started bleeding at one and died at eight because

you didn't bother to call anyone to help her until midnight.

If you had been worried enough to call earlier, you would

already know. But, whether your mother is dead or alive or

sick or hurt, unless you are willing to take responsiblity

for our forcing entry to her home at this hour of the night,

you are either going to have to check on her yourself or wait

until morning. "

Caller: <crying harder> " She might be hurt! She might be

dead! "

" Yes, ma'am, that's true. Are you declaring an emergency? If

not, there's nothing else that I can do for you and I need to

take care of lots of other calls. "

I had two other callers who wanted us to do midnight welfare

checks on their relatives. Every one asked, " Well, what if she's

hurt or dead? " All of them kept calling. It got to the point

where my only question was if they were declaring an emergency,

with full response as dictated by our policy and procedures. If

not, the call ended. No, no one wanted to disturb anyone, " Just

make sure that she's all right. " She couldn't explain how we

might check on her mother in the wee hours of the morning without

disturbing her mother. It was one shift that I was glad to see

end (notice I've been missing for a while?).

Well, at 0700 the next morning, day-shift checked on mom. Mom

had turned off the bell on her phone to avoid being disturbed any

more by her pesky and very nosy daughter (oh, and, ah-hem, mom

DID have company that night and was very glad that she was NOT

disturbed in the wee hours).

All was well until the boss called me in and asked if I recalled

a woman asking for a welfare check late at night. Yes, I

remembered serveral. I signed the counseling statement and

accepted my LOR. I knew I lost it. The letter was rather mild

and pleasant. Seems the boss listened to most of my night in

her search for the calls where I violated department policy by

failing to " be polite and courteous to all callers. "

I can't say 'always'. I'm just glad I didn't tell my caller

exactly what I really thought of her and her midnight worries.

Let's see, I'm averaging two and a half years between those

'losing it's.' Is that good? Bad? Average? Comments?

---

Always take good care of yourself and yours,

R J 'Tree' Greenwood

doctree@...

doctree@... on 911-Talk

rgreenwood@...

Join 18 million Eudora users by signing up for a free Eudora Web-Mail account at

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[Guest guest]

Tree,

I think it is normal to become upset with people who don't seem to

understand English.

Last night, I had a similar situation, as the female wanted us to go tell

them to put the phone on the hook. After explaining it was not against the

law to have your phone off the hook, she then stated the roommate at the

location was evil. I also told her it was not against the law to be evil.

We had about the same number of calls as you received, and each time the

tears were flowing. All I could advise her was that if she came up and

wanted to go to the residence, we would escort her to protect her from the

" evil one " .

By the time the fourth call, I also lost it, and raised my voice, more to

get control back of the situation. She wanted my name, which I spelled 3

times, and told me I was " evil " .

We had a similar situation tonight, where the daughter hadn't called the

mother. After officers went to the residence, bothering the next door

nieghbor, and then scaring the resident to death (as well as the officer),

things worked out for the best. The mother was sure the daughter had been

murdered, commited suicide, or had some other major injury so that she

couldn't be contacted. Between the 5-6 calls in a 10 minute period, it was

enough to make you yell.

Time to get ready to go home,

" Evil " Larew

NC911@...

Cornelius/Huntersville/son College Communications

_________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/02 1:31:19 AM Pacific Standard Time,

treeg@... writes:

> I'm averaging two and a half years between those

> 'losing it's.' Is that good? Bad? Average? Comments?

>

> ---You sounded reasonable to me. That must have been really frustrating.

Tammy

[Guest guest]

Tree

Well...I understand policy...but I understand the frustration even more.

Been there way too many times with people that just don't " get it " .

Had one of my own the other day..Lady at local business calls, male that

works there is going through nasty divorce. Wife has been calling and

calling. She just called and told them to " watch the news, cause you are

all going to be on it " . Lady is convinced this is a threat. Officers

have been out to the location many times, and told her what she needs to

do to file a warrant for harassment etc. Finally, she asks for a close

watch on the business. Okay , we can do that..now, what kind of car are

the officers looking for? She has no idea. Can you describe this person?

Nope, no clue. I explain that it is not possible for the officers to do

a real close watch without some idea what they are looking for...if one

of the employees went out to their car to get something just as the

officer went by, they could find themselves being questioned etc.

Well...next day, the director of public works for the city talks to me.

The lady at the business is his sister, and she wanted to know why we

would not send anyone out when this lady " threatened to kill them all "

and then wouldnt even have officers do a close watch!! I stood firm, and

told him, 1.She NEVER said anything about a threat to kill ANYONE to

us..(do you want me to pull that tape for you?) 2. I was very willing to

add her to the close watch list...if she could tell me what the officers

needed to watch for!

Tree...in my eyes...you deserved a pat on the back for handling the

woman so graciously all those other times.....but...that is the way it

goes...follow procedure and no thanks at all, lose it for a moment, and

there is your LOR.

Freida

LaVergne, TN

[Guest guest]

Tree, I had no problems with what you said. There comes a time when less

than courteous statements MUST be made in order to get on with the business

at hand. And what you said wasn't DIS-courteous, it was just plain simple

fact - stated plainly so a door knob could understand. Sometimes it takes

a reality check to shake some people back to Earth. Unfortunately, some

are so out in orbit they resemble the green cheese that the moon is made

out of!

We did not have this policy of no routine welfare checks at night. Calls

were mainly from parents who kid forgot to call home Sunday night to say

they arrived back to campus safely. Being on a college campus, we didn't

mind bothering people at 2 or 3am. Most college kids are just getting home

from the library at that time anyways. :-) (Strange how the library seems

to serve alcohol!) It also helped in that we had resident hall advisors

that we could contact who can enter the dorm room to see if the student

actually returned and is just galivanting around. I can't tell you how

many times I found the errant child at his/her girl/boyfriends. I would

ask the parents about the existance of a girl/boy friend in town. " Oh, but

they wouldn't be over there at this time of night! " " Sure - what's their

name? They might know where your kid is. " I call over there and ask if

this missing kid is there. Of course he/she is. " Call your mom/dad. They

are worried since you forgot to call when you got home today. " Wait 10

minutes. I call mom/dad to make sure child called. " Oh thank you. Where

did you find them? " Well....that's my little secret.

At the parttime agency I worked for, we had one mental who would call in a

check on her mother's house. " I keep calling but no one answers. I'm so

worried. " Her mother also had the habit of turning off her ringer when she

got tired of being bothered by her daughter. Unfortunately, a police

department doesn't have that perrogative!!!!

annette hallmark

tamu utilities (formerly UPD)

[Guest guest]

Good gravy, I would have lost it alot earlier than you did.

Congrats on your restraint! Funny thing was, if she was _SO_WORRIED_

she would have said " yes it's an emergency " and you would have

gladly assisted her, as you explained.

-patrick

>

> Well, Mike, I can't say that I _ALWAYS_ manage. As a matter of

> fact, I just signed my latest counseling memo and letter of

> reprimand. What happened was...

Midnight, Saturday night, got a call from a woman...Well, same

caller calls back...12:30 .... Well, same caller calls AGAIN, in

tears, whailing .... She just kept calling, again and again,

weeping, whailing, ....Well, after many of these calls, ... I lost

it.

[Guest guest]

In four hours I can fly from SF to NY. I would have told her that if she was so

worried, why did she get her

butt over and check on her mother herself. But the major thought that comes to

mind is a letter of reprimand

for such a chicken shit deal, tells me you work for an agency that needs to get

a life. If they have so much

time to write " ah shit " letters, then maybe they would do better to assign

someone to check on people at

night.

Rich

> south of Falls Church saying that she was worried about her

> elderly (to her, elderly was only a couple years older than

> me). Caller says that she has been trying to call her mother

> since noon and no one answered.

[Guest guest]

Great story. And if I might...

" Well, ma'am, if your mother is dead I'm sure she'll still be dead in the

morning; she won't be going anywhere now will she? "

hm

Re: 911:: Stupid People... and losing it

> Well, Mike, I can't say that I _ALWAYS_ manage. As a matter of

> fact, I just signed my latest counseling memo and letter of

> reprimand. What happened was...

>

> Midnight, Saturday night, got a call from a woman a few miles

> south of Falls Church saying that she was worried about her

> elderly (to her, elderly was only a couple years older than

> me). Caller says that she has been trying to call her mother

> since noon and no one answered.

[Guest guest]

> Caller: " But what if she's dead? What if she's hurt? "

> R J 'Tree' Greenwood

********************************************************************

If she's dead, she isn't going to get any better or worse.

If she's hurt, don't you think you should have called us earlier than wait

till GD midnight?

Iowa State Patrol Communications

Werling NØXZY

scott@...

http://www.ia.net/~anachamb/pumpkin.html

http://www.jonescountytourism.com

http://www.earthsat.com/wx/dotwx/winter_roads.html

[Guest guest]

Harry I loved it!! You have a great sense of .... humor.

Freida

LaVergne,TN

> Great story. And if I might...

>

> " Well, ma'am, if your mother is dead I'm sure she'll still be dead in the

morning; she won't be going anywhere now will she? "

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/02 4:31:13 AM Eastern Standard Time,

treeg@... writes:

> Well, same caller calls AGAIN, in tears, whailing that we have

> to " do something. She might be dead or hurt. " However, the

> caller would NOT say that she wanted to declare an emergency

> because she really didn't want to disturb her mother if there

> was nothing wrong. She just kept calling, again and again,

> weeping, whailing, " What if she's hurt? What if she's dead? "

>

Our department does not have a policy about not making welfare checks

depending on the hour of the day. We will check on someone at any hour of

the day or night. If the caller is from out of state we advise them to make

a report to their local police and have them send us teletype requesting

welfare check. I guess the reasoning there is that an out of state call

where we can not confirm who this person is allows too much room for abuse.

My BIGGEST problem with welfare checks is that often the people calling are

within 30 minutes of the person they are so, so worried about. I always ask,

" Is there a reason YOU have not gotten in your car and driven over to check

on this person " ? Most often the excuse is fairly lame; " I live 20 minutes

away " , " I have kids at home " , " I thought the police would do that " ..and on

and on. If I can not shame them into checking on this person themselves we

will send an officer over to check. Our response depends on what we find.

If the house is secure and the officers can not see anything amiss through

downstairs windows then we consider the matter closed. We will NOT break

down doors or break in windows unless there is real evidence that someone in

the house is sick or injured.

We also do not call the person back to let them know what the outcome of the

check has been. They are told to call us back in a specified amount of time

(depending on how busy we are) and that we will advise them of the outcome.

Most times the " missing " person is located and told to call their loved one

that is losing sleep over their absence.

Patty

BTPD NJ

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/02 8:44:41 AM Eastern Standard Time,

hallmark@... writes:

> There comes a time when less

> than courteous statements MUST be made in order to get on with the business

>

> at hand. And what you said wasn't DIS-courteous, it was just plain simple

> fact - stated plainly so a door knob could understand

Why is it that none of our superiors (you know, the ones that haven't been in

dispatch or patrol for 20 plus years) understand this concept? I am going to

stay in this job until I have a Chief that will tell one of these imbiciles

that calls with one of these complaints that the police department is NOT

their personal butler and the matter they demanded was NOT a police problem

and to get on with their lives and take some responsibility for themselves

and their personal life. OK, so I'll be working till I'm 100!

Can you tell I worked a busy 13 hour day? With one more to go and snow

predicted.......I'm so happy I could just @#$@!

Patty

BTPD NJ

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/02 10:24:29 AM Eastern Standard Time,

rjmorrison@... writes:

> If they have so much

> time to write " ah shit " letters, then maybe they would do better to assign

> someone to check on people at

> night.

>

Maybe they ought to find something more important for those people at the top

to do! Sounds to me like the brass doesn't have enough really important

stuff to keep them busy!

Patty

BTPD NJ

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/02 12:04:21 PM Eastern Standard Time,

marnells@... writes:

> " Well, ma'am, if your mother is dead I'm sure she'll still be dead in the

> morning; she won't be going anywhere now will she? "

>

>

OUCH!! LOL!

Patty

BTPD NJ

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/02 8:25:33 PM Mountain Standard Time,

Gypsy0005@... writes:

<< If the caller is from out of state we advise them to make

a report to their local police and have them send us teletype requesting

welfare check. I guess the reasoning there is that an out of state call

where we can not confirm who this person is allows too much room for abuse.

>>

How do you confirm who the caller is? (Not picking on you Gypsy, just

throwing that question out).

My department accepts out-of-state calls w/o requiring them to contact their

local department. And we'll send those tty's only after the caller states

they have called the other department and was told to have us do so. But

there's no way for me to confirm who the caller really is, or if it's a

legitimate " emergency " ..... locally we've refused " welfare checks " on

children when one of the parents calls us during unreasonable hours -

explaining to them that we will not be part of any harassment to the other

parent. (these are the people who have called numerous times because one

parent will refuse to let the other talk to the child on the phone -- so the

angry parent will call at 0100 and want us to make sure the kids are ok...

NOT!!!)

Kathy

[Guest guest]

Patty

So well put.............and not bad i might add after 13 hrs of HELL........

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/02 10:50:36 PM Eastern Standard Time,

dsptchmom@... writes:

> How do you confirm who the caller is? (Not picking on you Gypsy, just

> throwing that question out).

>

>

We can't and don't confirm who the caller is. This is just another example

of a well thought out policy (she says with tongue in cheek) by the powers

that be. Someone with lots of gold on their uniform said it was a good idea

so now those of us in the radio room must believe that this is fact.

Personally I don't see the difference between in and out of state requests.

Our department will refuse in cases like you described where the caller is

obviously harassing the other party in cases of divorce and visitation.

As a general rule our department is very, very service oriented. We will

check on missing freinds and relatives, we will give you direction to

anywhere you want to go, we will tell you all about events happening in the

area even if it has nothing to do with our department. Gosh, we're even

expected to know the road conditions on the NY State Thruway, a mere 100 plus

miles from our town!

OK, I'm going to bed now. I'm beginning to lose it and I'm here all alone in

my room. Must get some sleep and store up a bounty or patience and

understanding for all those idiots that will no doubt wait till the snow

starts tomorrow and jump in their cars and slide into each other. Good Night

All....stay safe.

Patty

BTPD NJ

[Guest guest]

Patty i know you wont get this till tomm but i hope you have a good day at

work. Even tho with the snow coming i know it probley wont be. All the same

try. Our department is the same way as far as telling you where and what is

going on. Our street patrol is also wonderful at helping with minor car

trouble (ex...a flat tire, or giving a ride to someone who lives in the next

town after a wreck) Well everyone we will talk to you all tomm have a

wonderful night and stay safe.

Robyn

[Guest guest]

Tree made a mistake, but was big enough to admit it to all of us. I'm sure

there isn't a dispatcher on this list that hasn't had a similar experience

dealing with stupid people. Sometimes it's tough to keep a courteous

demeanor when faced with such scenarios that seem to repeat themselves all

to often. It's easy to become cynical when dealing with the same situations

day after day for years. The primary reason that we as a group exist is to

help people, and I like to believe that the primary reason that each of us

does this mostly thankless job is because we are truly interested in helping

people.

Tree, although you were wrong by being less than courteous, you were also

right in sharing the experience with us. Thanks.

Nick Gossman

CPD Clearwater Fl

Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2002 09:01:25 -0800

Subject: Re: Stupid People... and losing it

Great story. And if I might...

" Well, ma'am, if your mother is dead I'm sure she'll still be dead in the

morning; she won't be going anywhere now will she? "

hm

Re: 911:: Stupid People... and losing it

> Well, Mike, I can't say that I _ALWAYS_ manage. As a matter of

> fact, I just signed my latest counseling memo and letter of

> reprimand. What happened was...

>

> Midnight, Saturday night, got a call from a woman a few miles

> south of Falls Church saying that she was worried about her

> elderly (to her, elderly was only a couple years older than

> me). Caller says that she has been trying to call her mother

> since noon and no one answered.

[Guest guest]

>In a message dated 1/18/02 4:31:13 AM Eastern Standard Time,

>treeg@... writes:

>

>

> > Well, same caller calls AGAIN, in tears, whailing that we have

> > to " do something. She might be dead or hurt. " However, the

> > caller would NOT say that she wanted to declare an emergency

> > because she really didn't want to disturb her mother if there

> > was nothing wrong. She just kept calling, again and again,

> > weeping, whailing, " What if she's hurt? What if she's dead? "

Hey Tree, Friday night male subject calls who is watching the kids while his

wife is at nightclub calls because the kids are sick (nothing serious).

Wants us to send a unit to the club to tell wife to come home and that the

club wont make announcement over PA system. By the way, the club knows how

busy we are because alot of our calls are to that club. Anyway, I guess

that's why they make hold buttons.

Hattiesburg MS

_________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

<< " locally we've refused " welfare checks " on

children when one of the parents calls us during unreasonable hours -

explaining to them that we will not be part of any harassment to the other

parent. (these are the people who have called numerous times because one

parent will refuse to let the other talk to the child on the phone -- so the

angry parent will call at 0100 and want us to make sure the kids are ok...

NOT!!!) " >>

Glad to see we're not the only ones experiencing this particular problem!!!

Xenia/Greene County

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/19/02 12:21:09 PM Eastern Standard Time,

BBALINT@... writes:

> << " locally we've refused " welfare checks " on

> children when one of the parents calls us during unreasonable hours -

> explaining to them that we will not be part of any harassment to the other

> parent. (these are the people who have called numerous times because one

> parent will refuse to let the other talk to the child on the phone -- so

> the

>

>

Along those same bitter domestic lines...does anyone else have a problem with

courts ordering the " child exchange " take place at a particular police

department? We get alot in our department. Mostly uneventful and the

exchange takes place in the parking lot, but we do get a few that come in to

complain that the other parent did not show up at the designated time. We do

NOT get involved in these, but refer them back to their attorney to go back

to court and address the issue. We have had a few parents that just won't go

away and continue to demand that we respond to the offending parents house

and rip the kids out for thier scheduled visitation. How do you guys handle

something like this? Any departments out there that enforce these civil

divorce orders?

Patty

BTPD NJ

p.s. Dayshift today was fairly uneventful. Snow held off till near the end

of my shift and we only had a few minor accidents. The only exception was

the jerk that called to complain about being stopped for speeding while my

officers were still standing next to his car! Told him to talk to the

officers on the scene with his complaint and hung up on him. He called 3

times to talk to Sgt but I doubt it will go anywhere. Seems he isn't the

most upstanding driver we have in NJ and his NY and CT DL's dont look much

better.

[Guest guest]

I can't say 'always'. I'm just glad I didn't tell my caller

> exactly what I really thought of her and her midnight worries.

> Let's see, I'm averaging two and a half years between those

> 'losing it's.' Is that good? Bad? Average? Comments?

I've got to start paying more attention...this was a hoot. I'm the proud

owner of several of those T-shirts. Well, two and a half years isn't bad

considering the alternative........a lifetime supply of Vaseline and saggy

suspenders....

Bob in Tacoma

Dispatcher

http://www.lesa.net

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/19/02 11:12:02 PM Eastern Standard Time,

gryeyes@... writes:

> I am a smart ass, y'see.

>

>

Will you be my friend?

I spent my younger, (ok, MUCH younger years) in a Catholic School. The nuns

there used to say to me each and everyday, " Donnelly (maiden name), you are

trouble looking for a place to happen " . Some things never

change.................

Patty

BTPD NJ