Re: Urge surfing alcohol

January 28, 2012

ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AT ALL my dear Lou:-) firstly let me tell u how much i have missed u & readin ur wonderful posts here, not to mention everyone else's in this group. I took a long break indeed, went to some online cbt groups & shared my experience with act, to understand that when it all boils down to it, can act reach out to everyone, as it has to me, regardless of what 'psycholigical suffering' one is classified under. <<<What am I leaving out today?>>>I didn't hear u commend urself for 'that' commited action, behaviour activation, i.e. for 'surfing the urge':-). So there u r, ur already doing what needs to be done. Other than that there is nothing to be done. That treadmill will always be there, but u can choose to not step on it anymore, as there is really no where to get once ur on it. As it only takes u to the same old place of self-blame, self-critisim, self-judgements. That place is not worth it. <<<What am I leaving out today?>>>U might be leaving out some self-compassion towards urself for having a tough day, some kindness towards urself for letting it all out with tears. Give urself a hug for being more present, and getting better and better at it. & a huuuuuuuuuuuge hug from my side too, as i have missed u soooooooo much. take care my dear friend.wasalaam:-) -K Designs. "" Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.

That way, when you criticize them, you're already a mile away AND you have their

shoes." ~ a very pious intellectual To: ACT_for_the_Public From: experiential2012@...Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2012 07:32:57 +0000Subject: Urge surfing alcohol

I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...

"There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love." By Washington Irvine.

I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to practice more patience, will power and persistence.

What am I leaving out today?

Lou ;-)

January 29, 2012

and Lou, what great posts! Your humility and honesty, Lou, and your willingness to share your story is amazing and so helpful to me personally. Huge kudos for your urge-surfing! You are making such good progress; pat yourself on the back. , you astound me with your insight and always say what I wish I would have thought of saying. You truly have a wonderful grasp of ACT in action. I have missed you greatly and am so glad you are back.

Lou, one question, if I may: Do you mean you are literally being hit in the face, or symbolically? If physically, I assume you are working with people who cannot help acting out in such a way, but I would be concerned about your physical safety. I hope you and the place you work are being protective of you in that regard. If it's a symbolic hitting in the face, well, I guess we all get that from time to time and it can be more painful than a physical punch. I agree with the quote that tears are a sign of power and not weakness. It means you are so in touch with yourself and your feelings that you are unable to hide behind an artificial barrier. That's wonderful. You are being fully in the moment without artifice.

Helena

From: "" <experiential2012@....au>To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 3:34:21 AMSubject: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

, (I'm humbled) Ã‡Ã¤Ã¤Ã ÃˆÃŸÃ¡ ÃŠÃ¦Ã‡Ã–ÃšYour kindness is very warm and your persistence is admirable. You are in a great place and I love your curiosity. I hope you will share some of what you learned. You have also been missed sparky :-)You know I saw that hit coming and just took it. I'd be hopeless in a fight! I've been thinking about Pema Chodron and what she taught me about self-compassion and ritualising tasks (since I'm in task mode). I know all that stuff works, well, actually it's necessary and I do practice often. Thanks for the reminder, I'll add that to my tool kit today.Peace unto you,Lou>> > ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AT ALL my dear Lou:-) firstly let me tell u how much i have missed u & readin ur wonderful posts here, not to mention everyone else's in this group. I took a long break indeed, went to some online cbt groups & shared my experience with act, to understand that when it all boils down to it, can act reach out to everyone, as it has to me, regardless of what 'psycholigical suffering' one is classified under. <<<What am I leaving out today?>>>I didn't hear u commend urself for 'that' commited action, behaviour activation, i.e. for 'surfing the urge':-). So there u r, ur already doing what needs to be done. Other than that there is nothing to be done. That treadmill will always be there, but u can choose to not step on it anymore, as there is really no where to get once ur on it. As it only takes u to the same old place of self-blame, self-critisim, self-judgements. That place is not worth it. <<<What am I leaving out today?>>>U might be leaving out some self-compassion towards urself for having a tough day, some kindness towards urself for letting it all out with tears. Give urself a hug for being more present, and getting better and better at it. & a huuuuuuuuuuuge hug from my side too, as i have missed u soooooooo much. take care my dear friend.wasalaam:-) -K Designs.> > > "" Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.> > That way, when you criticize them, you're already a mile away AND you have their> shoes." > ~ a very pious intellectual> To: ACT_for_the_Public > Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2012 07:32:57 +0000> Subject: Urge surfing alcohol> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...> > > > "There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love." By Washington Irvine.> > > > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > > > What am I leaving out today?> > > > Lou ;-)>

January 29, 2012

Hey there,

I'm not sure I understand what you are meaning by " today the urge is stretching

my resolve " and really not sure that resolve is what is required if not drinking

is the behavior you're aiming for. Not drinking is what is required for not

drinking. Sorry BTW for the uncomfortable work incident. Hard to sit with that

stuff for sure. Thoughts, urges, etc. come and go. In terms of you missing

anything, hard to say, but I do know I sure miss out on a lot of moments

wondering here in my head if I'm missing something. Try to gently step outside

and enjoy the day some regardless of what your mind argues. I will too.

kind regards,

terry

>

> I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) but

today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in the face

and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know everything

reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do it. *Sigh*. I

think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, then I go back to the

quote Russ posted once...

>

> " There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of

power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are messengers

of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love. " By Washington Irvine.

>

> I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge to

want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start drinking

alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it produces. So

the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, committed action,

make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the same old treadmill

and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to practice more patience, will

power and persistence.

>

> What am I leaving out today?

>

> Lou ;-)

>

January 29, 2012

I've been sober over 11 years. I don't say this to brag rather to let you know that it is possible. Personally I used a 12 step program. I wasn't aware of ACT at the time. My experience is that ACT is congruent with how I practice a 12 step program. The powerlessness of alcohol is about coming into direct contact with my experience/ consequences of drinking. I was fused with I could/can drink like others who don't have the allergy I have. Just like a food allergy when I ingest alcohol I have a reaction. Usually I breakout in a drunk or some other behavior I don't like. Sometimes my reaction would be like a mild rash other times more like a full blown anaphylactic shock=drunk. I read a couple of articles contrasting ACT and 12 step that was helpful for me. If you are interested I can find them and forward them to you. I found them helpful in my journey. I'm not suggesting you attend 12 step meetings there are many paths. I found the information helpful.You can do it and good luck. BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, then I go back to the quote Russ posted once... " There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love. " By Washington Irvine.I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to practice more patience, will power and persistence. What am I leaving out today? Lou ;-)

January 30, 2012

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know.BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in > the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, > then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...> > " There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are > messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love. " By Washington > Irvine.> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start > drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the > same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to > practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > What am I leaving out today?> > Lou ;-)>

January 30, 2012

,Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really. If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.Jim

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.

No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know.

BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol

>

> I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night)

> but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in

> the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know

> everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do

> it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing,

> then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...

>

> " There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of

> power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are

> messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love. " By Washington

> Irvine.

>

> I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge

> to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start

> drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it

> produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation,

> committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the

> same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to

> practice more patience, will power and persistence.

>

> What am I leaving out today?

>

> Lou ;-)

>

January 30, 2012

,

Welcome back! I've missed reading your wise and deeply inspirational posts.

Cheers,

Stan

>

> ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AT ALL my dear Lou:-) firstly let me tell u how much i have

missed u & readin ur wonderful posts here, not to mention everyone else's in

this group. I took a long break indeed, went to some online cbt groups & shared

my experience with act, to understand that when it all boils down to it, can act

reach out to everyone, as it has to me, regardless of what 'psycholigical

suffering' one is classified under. <<<What am I leaving out today?>>>I didn't

hear u commend urself for 'that' commited action, behaviour activation, i.e. for

'surfing the urge':-). So there u r, ur already doing what needs to be done.

Other than that there is nothing to be done. That treadmill will always be

there, but u can choose to not step on it anymore, as there is really no where

to get once ur on it. As it only takes u to the same old place of self-blame,

self-critisim, self-judgements. That place is not worth it. <<<What am I

leaving out today?>>>U might be leaving out some self-compassion towards urself

for having a tough day, some kindness towards urself for letting it all out with

tears. Give urself a hug for being more present, and getting better and better

at it. & a huuuuuuuuuuuge hug from my side too, as i have missed u soooooooo

much. take care my dear friend.wasalaam:-) -K Designs.

>

> " " Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.

>

> That way, when you criticize them, you're already a mile away AND you have

their

> shoes. "

> ~ a very pious intellectual

> To: ACT_for_the_Public

> From: experiential2012@...

> Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2012 07:32:57 +0000

> Subject: Urge surfing alcohol

>

> I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk

night) but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me

in the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know

everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do it.

*Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, then I go

back to the quote Russ posted once...

>

> " There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of

power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are messengers

of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love. " By Washington Irvine.

>

> I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge to

want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start drinking

alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it produces. So

the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, committed action,

make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the same old treadmill

and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to practice more patience, will

power and persistence.

>

> What am I leaving out today?

>

> Lou ;-)

>

January 31, 2012

Hi ,Thanks for your reply. I'm a bit confused on one point and hope you can clarify for me: Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout? That's a pretty rare occurrence among the general drinking population. My 92 year old Mom has been drinking for almost seven decades and has never come close to a blackout.

Does moderation (2-3 small drinks, once or twice a week) not work for you?Thanks,Jim

You're right Jim, I'm not urge surfing alcohol, I'm surfing 'unhealthy risk taking' in the form of an alcohol black out. Actually, I could just leave that at unhealthy risk taking, it comes in many forms. I was told at work today how " inefficient I am and that I'm incompetent " . I guess I've been busted. *Sigh* Surfs up :-(

I think about how told us of his brother and how he kept going (it's hard to imagine something more difficult to face/sit with). He said something like...'turns out I can still write to the list, teach, do therapy and yoga even when I'm crying'. I think of that a lot so I'm choosing my group over the avoidance

tonight. Cheers mate,

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2012 9:25 AM

Subject: Re:

Re: Urge surfing alcohol

,Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really. If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.Jim

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.

No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know.

BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol

>

> I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night)

> but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in

> the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know

> everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do

> it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing,

> then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...

>

> " There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of

> power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are

> messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love. " By Washington

> Irvine.

>

> I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge

> to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start

> drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it

> produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation,

> committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the

> same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to

> practice more patience, will power and persistence.

>

> What am I leaving out today?

>

> Lou ;-)

>

January 31, 2012

Sorry for jumping in here, Jim; but don't you think if someone says they decided to avoid alcohol because it represents "unhealthy risk taking" avoidance behavior for them, or for whatever reason, why would you question the decision they made to steer their bus free of booze? Bless your mother for being a moderate drinker for seven decades with no blackouts, and the myriad of people who can drink 2-3 small drinks a week without incurring risk, but we are all different.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 4:13:09 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi , Thanks for your reply. I'm a bit confused on one point and hope you can clarify for me: Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout? That's a pretty rare occurrence among the general drinking population. My 92 year old Mom has been drinking for almost seven decades and has never come close to a blackout.

Does moderation (2-3 small drinks, once or twice a week) not work for you?

Thanks,

Jim

You're right Jim,

I'm not urge surfing alcohol, I'm surfing 'unhealthy risk taking' in the form of an alcohol black out. Actually, I could just leave that at unhealthy risk taking, it comes in many forms. I was told at work today how "inefficient I am and that I'm incompetent". I guess I've been busted. *Sigh* Surfs up :-(

I think about how told us of his brother and how he kept going (it's hard to imagine something more difficult to face/sit with). He said something like...'turns out I can still write to the list, teach, do therapy and yoga even when I'm crying'. I think of that a lot so I'm choosing my group over the avoidance tonight.

Cheers mate,

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2012 9:25 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

, Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really.

If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.

Jim

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know. BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in > the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, > then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...> > "There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are > messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love." By Washington > Irvine.> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start > drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the > same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to > practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > What am I leaving out today?> > Lou ;-)>

January 31, 2012

Thanks Helena,Point taken. I was simply taking at her word that " I don't think it's the alcohol that's the issue. " Thanks,Jim

Sorry for jumping in here, Jim; but don't you think if someone says they decided to avoid alcohol because it represents " unhealthy risk taking " avoidance behavior for them, or for whatever reason, why would you question the decision they made to steer their bus free of booze? Bless your mother for being a moderate drinker for seven decades with no blackouts, and the myriad of people who can drink 2-3 small drinks a week without incurring risk, but we are all different.

Helena

To: " ACT for the Public " <ACT_for_the_Public >

Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 4:13:09 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi , Thanks for your reply. I'm a bit confused on one point and hope you can clarify for me: Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout? That's a pretty rare occurrence among the general drinking population. My 92 year old Mom has been drinking for almost seven decades and has never come close to a blackout.

Does moderation (2-3 small drinks, once or twice a week) not work for you?

Thanks,

Jim

You're right Jim,

I'm not urge surfing alcohol, I'm surfing 'unhealthy risk taking' in the form of an alcohol black out. Actually, I could just leave that at unhealthy risk taking, it comes in many forms. I was told at work today how " inefficient I am and that I'm incompetent " . I guess I've been busted. *Sigh* Surfs up :-(

I think about how told us of his brother and how he kept going (it's hard to imagine something more difficult to face/sit with). He said something like...'turns out I can still write to the list, teach, do therapy and yoga even when I'm crying'. I think of that a lot so I'm choosing my group over the avoidance tonight.

Cheers mate,

To: ACT_for_the_Public

Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2012 9:25 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

, Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really.

If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.

Jim

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.

I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know. BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in

> the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing,

> then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...> > " There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are

> messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love. " By Washington > Irvine.> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start

> drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the

> same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to > practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > What am I leaving out today?> > Lou ;-)

>

February 1, 2012

Hi Lou - of course you can answer Jim's question for yourself. I did not answer Jim's question to you, knowing you would do that, but I did offer some comments relative to the discussion and the nature of the question itself, which hit me like a ton of bricks, for some reason. Maybe because it reminded me of when I was trying to cut alcohol out of my life and many of my well-meaning friends questioned why I would do that since I didn't really have a problem. I let their well-meaningness get in the way of my goal until I decided to steer my own ship. I'm sorry if you found my comments intrusive.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Wednesday, February 1, 2012 2:43:37 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Helena,

Can I answer for Jim please? Without ever knowing for sure.....

Curiosity?

And that's ok right? It's ok for me.....

Lou

To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:28 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Sorry for jumping in here, Jim; but don't you think if someone says they decided to avoid alcohol because it represents "unhealthy risk taking" avoidance behavior for them, or for whatever reason, why would you question the decision they made to steer their bus free of booze? Bless your mother for being a moderate drinker for seven decades with no blackouts, and the myriad of people who can drink 2-3 small drinks a week without incurring risk, but we are all different.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 4:13:09 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi , Thanks for your reply. I'm a bit confused on one point and hope you can clarify for me: Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout? That's a pretty rare occurrence among the general drinking population. My 92 year old Mom has been drinking for almost seven decades and has never come close to a blackout.

Does moderation (2-3 small drinks, once or twice a week) not work for you?

Thanks,

Jim

You're right Jim,

I'm not urge surfing alcohol, I'm surfing 'unhealthy risk taking' in the form of an alcohol black out. Actually, I could just leave that at unhealthy risk taking, it comes in many forms. I was told at work today how "inefficient I am and that I'm incompetent". I guess I've been busted. *Sigh* Surfs up :-(

I think about how told us of his brother and how he kept going (it's hard to imagine something more difficult to face/sit with). He said something like...'turns out I can still write to the list, teach, do therapy and yoga even when I'm crying'. I think of that a lot so I'm choosing my group over the avoidance tonight.

Cheers mate,

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2012 9:25 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

, Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really.

If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.

Jim

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know. BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in > the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, > then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...> > "There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are > messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love." By Washington > Irvine.> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start > drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the > same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to > practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > What am I leaving out today?> > Lou ;-)>

February 1, 2012

I Vow to remember that today is a new day

Full of new and fresh moments.

Today, I will not cling to events of yesterday or yesteryear

But stay connected to what today brings.

I will not madly pursue my desires at the expense of others or myself, nor flee from challenging tasks.

I will remain true to the unfolding process of today

without losing myself in thoughts of what was or what might be.

I will treat today with awareness and sensitivity

Even in the most ordinary of tasks.

I will apply myself wholeheartedly to the fullness of today

For I know that today holds the resource of authenticity.

For Lou...for all of us.

To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012, 10:27Subject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

yOU ARE NEVER INTUSIVE TOM ME...BECAUSE I APPRECISATE WHO YOU ARE....

To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:50 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi Lou - of course you can answer Jim's question for yourself. I did not answer Jim's question to you, knowing you would do that, but I did offer some comments relative to the discussion and the nature of the question itself, which hit me like a ton of bricks, for some reason. Maybe because it reminded me of when I was trying to cut alcohol out of my life and many of my well-meaning friends questioned why I would do that since I didn't really have a problem. I let their well-meaningness get in the way of my goal until I decided to steer my own ship. I'm sorry if you found my comments intrusive.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Wednesday, February 1, 2012 2:43:37 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Helena,

Can I answer for Jim please? Without ever knowing for sure.....

Curiosity?

And that's ok right? It's ok for me.....

Lou

To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:28 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Sorry for jumping in here, Jim; but don't you think if someone says they decided to avoid alcohol because it represents "unhealthy risk taking" avoidance behavior for them, or for whatever reason, why would you question the decision they made to steer their bus free of booze? Bless your mother for being a moderate drinker for seven decades with no blackouts, and the myriad of people who can drink 2-3 small drinks a week without incurring risk, but we are all different.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 4:13:09 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi , Thanks for your reply. I'm a bit confused on one point and hope you can clarify for me: Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout? That's a pretty rare occurrence among the general drinking population. My 92 year old Mom has been drinking for almost seven decades and has never come close to a blackout.

Does moderation (2-3 small drinks, once or twice a week) not work for you?

Thanks,

Jim

You're right Jim,

I'm not urge surfing alcohol, I'm surfing 'unhealthy risk taking' in the form of an alcohol black out. Actually, I could just leave that at unhealthy risk taking, it comes in many forms. I was told at work today how "inefficient I am and that I'm incompetent". I guess I've been busted. *Sigh* Surfs up :-(

I think about how told us of his brother and how he kept going (it's hard to imagine something more difficult to face/sit with). He said something like...'turns out I can still write to the list, teach, do therapy and yoga even when I'm crying'. I think of that a lot so I'm choosing my group over the avoidance tonight.

Cheers mate,

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2012 9:25 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

, Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really.

If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.

Jim

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know. BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in > the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, > then I go back to

the quote Russ posted once...> > "There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are > messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love." By Washington > Irvine.> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start > drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the > same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to > practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > What am I leaving out

today?> > Lou ;-)>

February 1, 2012

Simone - Thanks for a great post at the perfect time. BillTo: ACT_for_the_Public From: adrianandboo@...Date: Wed, 1 Feb 2012 11:12:54 +0000Subject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

I Vow to remember that today is a new day

Full of new and fresh moments.

Today, I will not cling to events of yesterday or yesteryear

But stay connected to what today brings.

I will not madly pursue my desires at the expense of others or myself, nor flee from challenging tasks.

I will remain true to the unfolding process of today

without losing myself in thoughts of what was or what might be.

I will treat today with awareness and sensitivity

Even in the most ordinary of tasks.

I will apply myself wholeheartedly to the fullness of today

For I know that today holds the resource of authenticity.

For Lou...for all of us.

To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012, 10:27Subject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

yOU ARE NEVER INTUSIVE TOM ME...BECAUSE I APPRECISATE WHO YOU ARE....

To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:50 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi Lou - of course you can answer Jim's question for yourself. I did not answer Jim's question to you, knowing you would do that, but I did offer some comments relative to the discussion and the nature of the question itself, which hit me like a ton of bricks, for some reason. Maybe because it reminded me of when I was trying to cut alcohol out of my life and many of my well-meaning friends questioned why I would do that since I didn't really have a problem. I let their well-meaningness get in the way of my goal until I decided to steer my own ship. I'm sorry if you found my comments intrusive.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Wednesday, February 1, 2012 2:43:37 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Helena,

Can I answer for Jim please? Without ever knowing for sure.....

Curiosity?

And that's ok right? It's ok for me.....

Lou

To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:28 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Sorry for jumping in here, Jim; but don't you think if someone says they decided to avoid alcohol because it represents "unhealthy risk taking" avoidance behavior for them, or for whatever reason, why would you question the decision they made to steer their bus free of booze? Bless your mother for being a moderate drinker for seven decades with no blackouts, and the myriad of people who can drink 2-3 small drinks a week without incurring risk, but we are all different.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 4:13:09 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi , Thanks for your reply. I'm a bit confused on one point and hope you can clarify for me: Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout? That's a pretty rare occurrence among the general drinking population. My 92 year old Mom has been drinking for almost seven decades and has never come close to a blackout.

Does moderation (2-3 small drinks, once or twice a week) not work for you?

Thanks,

Jim

You're right Jim,

I'm not urge surfing alcohol, I'm surfing 'unhealthy risk taking' in the form of an alcohol black out. Actually, I could just leave that at unhealthy risk taking, it comes in many forms. I was told at work today how "inefficient I am and that I'm incompetent". I guess I've been busted. *Sigh* Surfs up :-(

I think about how told us of his brother and how he kept going (it's hard to imagine something more difficult to face/sit with). He said something like...'turns out I can still write to the list, teach, do therapy and yoga even when I'm crying'. I think of that a lot so I'm choosing my group over the avoidance tonight.

Cheers mate,

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2012 9:25 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

, Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really.

If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.

Jim

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know. BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in > the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, > then I go back to

the quote Russ posted once...> > "There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are > messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love." By Washington > Irvine.> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start > drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the > same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to > practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > What am I leaving out

today?> > Lou ;-)>

February 1, 2012

"This moment" is always the perfect time.

" To: "ACT_for_the_Public" <act_for_the_public >Sent: Wednesday, February 1, 2012 6:45:20 PMSubject: RE: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Simone - Thanks for a great post at the perfect time. Bill

To: ACT_for_the_Public From: adrianandboo@...Date: Wed, 1 Feb 2012 11:12:54 +0000Subject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

I Vow to remember that today is a new day

Full of new and fresh moments.

Today, I will not cling to events of yesterday or yesteryear

But stay connected to what today brings.

I will not madly pursue my desires at the expense of others or myself, nor flee from challenging tasks.

I will remain true to the unfolding process of today

without losing myself in thoughts of what was or what might be.

I will treat today with awareness and sensitivity

Even in the most ordinary of tasks.

I will apply myself wholeheartedly to the fullness of today

For I know that today holds the resource of authenticity.

For Lou...for all of us.

To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012, 10:27Subject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

yOU ARE NEVER INTUSIVE TOM ME...BECAUSE I APPRECISATE WHO YOU ARE....

To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:50 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi Lou - of course you can answer Jim's question for yourself. I did not answer Jim's question to you, knowing you would do that, but I did offer some comments relative to the discussion and the nature of the question itself, which hit me like a ton of bricks, for some reason. Maybe because it reminded me of when I was trying to cut alcohol out of my life and many of my well-meaning friends questioned why I would do that since I didn't really have a problem. I let their well-meaningness get in the way of my goal until I decided to steer my own ship. I'm sorry if you found my comments intrusive.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Wednesday, February 1, 2012 2:43:37 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Helena,

Can I answer for Jim please? Without ever knowing for sure.....

Curiosity?

And that's ok right? It's ok for me.....

Lou

To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:28 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Sorry for jumping in here, Jim; but don't you think if someone says they decided to avoid alcohol because it represents "unhealthy risk taking" avoidance behavior for them, or for whatever reason, why would you question the decision they made to steer their bus free of booze? Bless your mother for being a moderate drinker for seven decades with no blackouts, and the myriad of people who can drink 2-3 small drinks a week without incurring risk, but we are all different.

Helena

To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 4:13:09 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi , Thanks for your reply. I'm a bit confused on one point and hope you can clarify for me: Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout? That's a pretty rare occurrence among the general drinking population. My 92 year old Mom has been drinking for almost seven decades and has never come close to a blackout.

Does moderation (2-3 small drinks, once or twice a week) not work for you?

Thanks,

Jim

You're right Jim,

I'm not urge surfing alcohol, I'm surfing 'unhealthy risk taking' in the form of an alcohol black out. Actually, I could just leave that at unhealthy risk taking, it comes in many forms. I was told at work today how "inefficient I am and that I'm incompetent". I guess I've been busted. *Sigh* Surfs up :-(

I think about how told us of his brother and how he kept going (it's hard to imagine something more difficult to face/sit with). He said something like...'turns out I can still write to the list, teach, do therapy and yoga even when I'm crying'. I think of that a lot so I'm choosing my group over the avoidance tonight.

Cheers mate,

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2012 9:25 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

, Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really.

If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.

Jim

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know. BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in > the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, > then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...> > "There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are > messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love." By Washington > Irvine.> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start > drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the > same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to > practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > What am I leaving out today?> > Lou ;-)>

February 2, 2012

Yeah, but just don't tell me that in advance! :-)

> >

> > I've been sober over 11 years. I don't say this to brag rather to let you

> > know that it is possible. Personally I used a 12 step program. I wasn't

> > aware of ACT at the time. My experience is that ACT is congruent with how I

> > practice a 12 step program. The powerlessness of alcohol is about coming

> > into direct contact with my experience/ consequences of drinking. I was

> > fused with I could/can drink like others who don't have the allergy I have.

> > Just like a food allergy when I ingest alcohol I have a reaction. Usually I

> > breakout in a drunk or some other behavior I don't like. Sometimes my

> > reaction would be like a mild rash other times more like a full blown

> > anaphylactic shock=drunk.

> >

> > I read a couple of articles contrasting ACT and 12 step that was helpful for

> > me. If you are interested I can find them and forward them to you. I found

> > them helpful in my journey. I'm not suggesting you attend 12 step meetings

> > there are many paths. I found the information helpful.

> >

> > You can do it and good luck.

> >

> > Beverly

> >

> > Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless

> >

> > Urge surfing alcohol

> >

> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night)

> > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in

> > the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know

> > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do

> > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing,

> > then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...

> >

> > " There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of

> > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are

> > messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love. " By Washington

> > Irvine.

> >

> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge

> > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start

> > drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it

> > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation,

> > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the

> > same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to

> > practice more patience, will power and persistence.

> >

> > What am I leaving out today?

> >

> > Lou ;-)

> >

>

> </blockquote>

>

> Â

>

> </blockquote>

>

> Â

>

February 3, 2012

In reading this, Lou, I wondered if you are resigned to painting this picture of yourself in indelible ink, or if you may be sub-consciously doing that. I speak from my own experience: for many years, I believed myself to be a certain way - it was intrinsic and just "who I was" as a result of my genes and my life experiences Turns out, the primary reason for "the way I was" is because I believed that. So, when you say you live in a world of extremes and can't remember being any other way, does that mean you believe that is who you are at your core, or could you entertain the idea of a different Lou emerging - one who lives life in balance, who lives contentedly instead of chaotically? Not that imbalance and chaos will never occur again, but perhaps they could be exceptions rather than the norm?

Just throwing this out there for consideration - not knowing if it even contains a smidgen of truth for you, as it does for me. For example, until recently, I saw myself as hopelessly feisty and brutally honest as a rule of thumb, fearless in saying exactly what I thought, somewhat impulsive, "devil may care" attitude - and I was proud of that because it had helped me to survive a lot of trauma and I just couldn't see myself any other way. I was tough and a survivor. Case close. I was afraid (I think sub-consciously) that if I mellowed out or tried to be some other way, I would get hurt. Now I see I don't HAVE TO be resigned to that self-view, and I became aware that it hurt some people, including myself. That self-view got in the way of living according to my value of connection with others. I now see myself as still totally honest but less brutally so; still fearless but more sensitive to other people's feelings. I am authentic as a person - in fact, more so since I am not sucked into the "this is just who I am" view of myself.

Best,

Helena (and do you now prefer "" to "Lou"?)

From: " L" <experiential2012@....au>To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Thursday, February 2, 2012 10:32:27 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi Jim,

The further into this conversation I get with you, the more I realise the extremes I live in. Not just with substances. Its in the way I work, the way I love and the way I feel. I cant remember being any other way. I grew in a house of alcoholic violence so I have never had a desire to be a drinker, like I said, I think it is ugly. Still, I learned that it is very effective at getting you out of your mind, at least temporarily. This too will pass.

Thanks Jim, I've enjoyed our chat.

From: JAMES P RYAN <jim.ryangmail>To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Thursday, 2 February 2012 11:00 PMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi ,

I wish you all the best too. The problem is, I've been where you're standing and fear that that sentiments like "My movement forward looks past this type of behaviour." and "drinking is not the real problem" suggest you don't know, or don't want to know what you are up against here. If the drinking is as self-destructive as all that it's best to know that on a deep level rather than kid yourself that you can sort it out with a noble-sounding self-improvement plan or minor lifestyle tweak.

Here's a fun fact: most drinkers, the vast majority in fact, don't give any thought to their body mass index / alcohol consumption ratio and they certainly never feel compelled to count drinks. They don't have to. Unlike us they don't feel a compulsion to keep drinking past the point where the bad stuff starts happening. That's why I suggested you try some "normal" drinking (1-2 small ones, once or twice a week) on for size. It's helps you find out what sort of drinker you really are, the kind who can eventually do it normally or the sort who can't and needs to stop. If you are one of the "needs to stop" type of drinkers, you'll also need all the support you can get-- more than this list can provide, but you won't know that until you know it.

Best,

Jim

Hi Jim,

You asked me, "Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout?"

Well mate this seems to be part of the dysfunction. Like I said, I really haven't been drinking alcohol for very long and initially I made mistakes, like not accounting for the time it takes to metabolise. My therapist helped me a lot and I'll usually do the numbers now however, there are just those self-destructive moments when I don't think I'm worthy for this world that I tend to get a bit dangerous to myself. I know I'm not alone, I know there are many people who do this. My movement forward looks past this type of behaviour. I'm slow Jim, I do wish I could learn faster. It is what it is I guess. Everyday is different for me. Thanks for chiming in with me, its been a hard week this one...no, I managed it and stayed relatively level, it was the 2 weeks before that was more challenging to do my ACT practice.

Thank you Jim, I wish you all the best,

Lou

From: Jim <jim.ryangmail>To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Wednesday, 1 February 2012 7:43 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

Hi , Thanks for your reply. I'm a bit confused on one point and hope you can clarify for me: Why should drinking have to lead to a risky blackout? That's a pretty rare occurrence among the general drinking population. My 92 year old Mom has been drinking for almost seven decades and has never come close to a blackout.

Does moderation (2-3 small drinks, once or twice a week) not work for you?

Thanks,

Jim

On Tue, Jan 31, 2012 at 1:59 AM, L <experiential2012@....au> wrote:

You're right Jim,

I'm not urge surfing alcohol, I'm surfing 'unhealthy risk taking' in the form of an alcohol black out. Actually, I could just leave that at unhealthy risk taking, it comes in many forms. I was told at work today how "inefficient I am and that I'm incompetent". I guess I've been busted. *Sigh* Surfs up :-(

I think about how told us of his brother and how he kept going (it's hard to imagine something more difficult to face/sit with). He said something like...'turns out I can still write to the list, teach, do therapy and yoga even when I'm crying'. I think of that a lot so I'm choosing my group over the avoidance tonight.

Cheers mate,

From: Jim <jim.ryangmail>To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 31 January 2012 9:25 AMSubject: Re: Re: Urge surfing alcohol

, Why urge surf something that isn't a problem? I know lots of normal drinkers and they never seem to have trouble putting down the occasional beer or wine if, say, they get prescribed a medication they can't drink on. They might experience an occasional mild hankering for alcohol but nothing that would require massive amounts of willpower or advanced techniques like urge surfing.

That's the way it is with most people. Really.

If alcohol isn't a problem for you, you should have no difficulty doing the same.

Jim

On Mon, Jan 30, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Beverly Leigh <bleigh01aol> wrote:

No I don't drink socially. I was in error on my last email. I have over 10 years of continuous sobriety. It will be 11 years in March.No I don't and didn't use other substances. I view my drinking as an allergy. I don't literally breakout. I react to alcohol differently than allergic types of drink.I'm glad you are taking or yourself and not overloading yourself with reading. If you change your mind let me know. BeverlyConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless Urge surfing alcohol> > I've been off alcohol for almost a month now (other than one drunk night) > but today the urge is stretching my resolve. Someone I work with hit me in > the face and I cried again. Damn man, that's twice in two weeks. I know > everything reflects on performance and I'm sure the other workers don't do > it. *Sigh*. I think of `cleansing tears' but they are not all cleansing, > then I go back to the quote Russ posted once...> > "There is a sacredness in tears. They are not the mark of weakness but of > power. They speak more eloquently than ten thousand tongues. They are > messengers of overwhelming grief...and unspeakable love." By Washington > Irvine.> > I guess that makes me pretty powerful, right? So now I sit surfing the urge > to want to black out and lose living for a night. I didn't even start > drinking alcohol till I was 41yrs old, I don't like the sensory numbness it > produces. So the strategy is as usual, keep busy, behavioural activation, > committed action, make a list etc. etc. *Sigh again*. It just feels like the > same old treadmill and I'm still not going anywhere. I know I need to > practice more patience, will power and persistence. > > What am I leaving out today?> > Lou ;-)>

Jim

Designer | Developer

http://www.jryanportfolio.com

February 3, 2012

This is the freedom you speak of that is here with this work. Thanks for the

reminder that I'm not my thoughts, beliefs, not a slave to this conceptualized

self. Practice like leaves on the stream discussed recently make room for

alternatives I never knew before ACT. Good practice to everyone today.