Guest guest Posted April 13, 2012 Report Share Posted April 13, 2012 Helena, What's your deal? You seem to readily blame me for having special powers to annoy you when it's you yourself who puts the weighty stuff out there, (please note you started this thread), you ask for feedback, continue to engage, and then when I bother to just slow it down to look at it more closely, you throw up your arms and start yelling at me. What's up with that? Re: "To my understanding, if one is experiencing "self as context" for the most part (don't know if anyone can have that fully in every moment) , you could not be fused with your "self as content" at the same time - which is where you are coming from when you pick up <name your vice>. " It sounds like there are assumptions, givens and conclusions about ACT and substance abuse that you are outlining.for us here is all. And I don't follow. I was confused and just trying to slow it down so we could look at it piece by piece. peace out, terry To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:55 PM Subject: Re: Re: Self as Context Keep hovering! I don't think I shifted anything unless you wanted to shift. I described my experience. To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 5:19:34 PMSubject: Re: Re: Self as Context >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well let's be aware you are now asserting something more than just your personal take,NO, I am not. Terry, I don't know how you do it, but I feel depleted after your responses to me. Helena, like I detailed here in my last post, that's not my experience of self as context. Please see the two posts below I added (one from you and then my reply to you) that didn't get included in this thread. Naturally all takes are valid. But when you say "to my understanding if one is experiencing self as context, you can not be simultaneously fused with your self as content", well let's be aware you are now asserting something more than just your personal take, you are shifting some to implying something factual about this ability to experience self as context, and now including the concept of cognitive fusion in your equation. Thanks, terry > > I see what you're saying. I got the concept, even understood it, but I didn't experience "self as context" until I stopped engaging in habitual avoidant behaviors. > > To my understanding, if one is experiencing "self as context" for the most part (don't know if anyone can have that fully in every moment) , you could not be fused with your "self as content" at the same time - which is where you are coming from when you pick up <name your vice>. The more I did that picking up, or putting on that cloak as I described it, the more fused I got with my stories and my suffering and the further away from knowing my "self as context. Just my experience, which is all I can speak to. Yours may be completely different and every bit as valid! > > Helena Re: Self as Context Hi Helena, I just saw this post of yours. My experience has been different. Self as context like all processes are experienced on a continuum for me. Now naturally, if I'm constantly engaging in self-destructive behavior and all that entails, less of me is available to show up for something new. And yes, the unworkable behavior along with the internal and external ritual does tend to take on a psuedo meaning, pseudo life of it's own, and as you say the quest itself can create a false sense of nobility, righteousness. But once the gig is up, there is always a part of me that sort of sees even that, truth be told, even if I pick the cloak up temporarily. That choice (to pick up the cloak) tho has nothing to do with knowing who i am essentially, complete, whole. Sure wastes a lot of valuable time though. ------------------------------------------ To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 8:00 AM Subject: Re: Self as Context I was strictly speaking from my experience. I could not experience self as context, let alone understand it, when I was using alcohol. Alcohol mis-use (used as an escape) kept the ego right up front and center, for me. I viewed it as wearing a cloak that obscured my true essence, or self as context. I'm sure others may have their own metaphors or words that would make more sense to them. As far as seeking as an avoidance posture is concerned - Seeking and searching for answers took on a more desperate color for me when I used escape mechanisms over and over - maybe because I got more and more lost to myself each time I took that route. At one point I realized that my seeking and searching was providing me comfort: See, even though I get drunk every now and then, I could feel good about myself by saying - oh, look how I am searching; look how I am seeking the truth. Thus, I came to realize my very searching was posturing as an escape mechanism as well. Maybe that doesn't make sense to anyone else but me! There was a lot of guilt around my using alcohol but darn it, I was still a good person - just look at how I hunger to be on the right path; look at my earnest quest! Talk about rationalizing! It all changed for me - hugely! - when I gave up the avoidance activity. Then when I searched, I found answers. I found me. Helena > > > > To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public > > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 11:07:13 AM > Subject: Re: Self as Context > I think I'd add that I have no idea what the relationship is-- if any-- between ability to access self as context for those who regularly abuse substances or routinely engage avoidant behaviors. Avoidant self-destructive rituals do tend to create a lot of unnecessary drama, distraction and suffering, but ability to access self as context and all processes remains intact so far as i can tell. Self as Context was initially introduced to me by Steve who said (paraphrasing)" now notice there are four of us present here in the room. There is my mind, your mind and then there is you and then there is me." That was all I needed to get it! And it was so refreshing to have someone just note and include that, as he does in most of his responses, one way or another. There are plenty of metaphors and exercises out there to help access this space. So it's pretty accessible imho. I don't know if that speaks to your thesis here or helps in any way. > > > > > To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public > > Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 5:57 PM > Subject: Re: Self as Context > > Well, this is very interesting. Just re: the first sentence: The part about not understanding the concept resonates. The part about not being able to experience does not. The rest, I don't know. Words and such so get in the way. That's my chime for today. I have been enjoying the discussion on the other list too. > > > Thanks for opening up this for all of us, Helena. > > > Self as Context > > > This concept cannot be understood or experienced as long as one is abusing substances on a regular basis, or frequently engaging in other avoidance behaviors. Yet, that is the very person who longs to know what it means; she or he is the most ardent seeker. Seeking and seeming-to-seek can stand in as avoidance postures. Someone who frequently dons the cloak of the false self wants like crazy to find a way out - to find their TRUE self apart from ego and content - but until they are willing to give up that cloak, they will never get it. > > > Just my opinion, from my experience. Chime in if you have other viewpoints, or even if you agree. > > > > Helena > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2012 Report Share Posted April 14, 2012 What's my deal? I blame no one but myself for being annoyed, for being sucked in over and over. I made it very clear that I was speaking FROM MY EXPERIENCE. I am not making assumptions or drawing conclusions about anyone else. I am not outlining anything for anyone else. If you can experience self-as-context at the same time you are fused with self-as-content, fine. I can't. That's all I said.HTo: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 8:10:32 PMSubject: Re: Re: Self as Context Helena, What's your deal? You seem to readily blame me for having special powers to annoy you when it's you yourself who puts the weighty stuff out there, (please note you started this thread), you ask for feedback, continue to engage, and then when I bother to just slow it down to look at it more closely, you throw up your arms and start yelling at me. What's up with that? Re: "To my understanding, if one is experiencing "self as context" for the most part (don't know if anyone can have that fully in every moment) , you could not be fused with your "self as content" at the same time - which is where you are coming from when you pick up <name your vice>. " It sounds like there are assumptions, givens and conclusions about ACT and substance abuse that you are outlining.for us here is all. And I don't follow. I was confused and just trying to slow it down so we could look at it piece by piece. peace out, terry To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:55 PM Subject: Re: Re: Self as Context Keep hovering! I don't think I shifted anything unless you wanted to shift. I described my experience. To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 5:19:34 PMSubject: Re: Re: Self as Context >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well let's be aware you are now asserting something more than just your personal take,NO, I am not. Terry, I don't know how you do it, but I feel depleted after your responses to me. Helena, like I detailed here in my last post, that's not my experience of self as context. Please see the two posts below I added (one from you and then my reply to you) that didn't get included in this thread. Naturally all takes are valid. But when you say "to my understanding if one is experiencing self as context, you can not be simultaneously fused with your self as content", well let's be aware you are now asserting something more than just your personal take, you are shifting some to implying something factual about this ability to experience self as context, and now including the concept of cognitive fusion in your equation. Thanks, terry > > I see what you're saying. I got the concept, even understood it, but I didn't experience "self as context" until I stopped engaging in habitual avoidant behaviors. > > To my understanding, if one is experiencing "self as context" for the most part (don't know if anyone can have that fully in every moment) , you could not be fused with your "self as content" at the same time - which is where you are coming from when you pick up <name your vice>. The more I did that picking up, or putting on that cloak as I described it, the more fused I got with my stories and my suffering and the further away from knowing my "self as context. Just my experience, which is all I can speak to. Yours may be completely different and every bit as valid! > > Helena Re: Self as Context Hi Helena, I just saw this post of yours. My experience has been different. Self as context like all processes are experienced on a continuum for me. Now naturally, if I'm constantly engaging in self-destructive behavior and all that entails, less of me is available to show up for something new. And yes, the unworkable behavior along with the internal and external ritual does tend to take on a psuedo meaning, pseudo life of it's own, and as you say the quest itself can create a false sense of nobility, righteousness. But once the gig is up, there is always a part of me that sort of sees even that, truth be told, even if I pick the cloak up temporarily. That choice (to pick up the cloak) tho has nothing to do with knowing who i am essentially, complete, whole. Sure wastes a lot of valuable time though. ------------------------------------------ To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 8:00 AM Subject: Re: Self as Context I was strictly speaking from my experience. I could not experience self as context, let alone understand it, when I was using alcohol. Alcohol mis-use (used as an escape) kept the ego right up front and center, for me. I viewed it as wearing a cloak that obscured my true essence, or self as context. I'm sure others may have their own metaphors or words that would make more sense to them. As far as seeking as an avoidance posture is concerned - Seeking and searching for answers took on a more desperate color for me when I used escape mechanisms over and over - maybe because I got more and more lost to myself each time I took that route. At one point I realized that my seeking and searching was providing me comfort: See, even though I get drunk every now and then, I could feel good about myself by saying - oh, look how I am searching; look how I am seeking the truth. Thus, I came to realize my very searching was posturing as an escape mechanism as well. Maybe that doesn't make sense to anyone else but me! There was a lot of guilt around my using alcohol but darn it, I was still a good person - just look at how I hunger to be on the right path; look at my earnest quest! Talk about rationalizing! It all changed for me - hugely! - when I gave up the avoidance activity. Then when I searched, I found answers. I found me. Helena > > > > To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public > > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 11:07:13 AM > Subject: Re: Self as Context > I think I'd add that I have no idea what the relationship is-- if any-- between ability to access self as context for those who regularly abuse substances or routinely engage avoidant behaviors. Avoidant self-destructive rituals do tend to create a lot of unnecessary drama, distraction and suffering, but ability to access self as context and all processes remains intact so far as i can tell. Self as Context was initially introduced to me by Steve who said (paraphrasing)" now notice there are four of us present here in the room. There is my mind, your mind and then there is you and then there is me." That was all I needed to get it! And it was so refreshing to have someone just note and include that, as he does in most of his responses, one way or another. There are plenty of metaphors and exercises out there to help access this space. So it's pretty accessible imho. I don't know if that speaks to your thesis here or helps in any way. > > > > > To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public > > Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 5:57 PM > Subject: Re: Self as Context > > Well, this is very interesting. Just re: the first sentence: The part about not understanding the concept resonates. The part about not being able to experience does not. The rest, I don't know. Words and such so get in the way. That's my chime for today. I have been enjoying the discussion on the other list too. > > > Thanks for opening up this for all of us, Helena. > > > Self as Context > > > This concept cannot be understood or experienced as long as one is abusing substances on a regular basis, or frequently engaging in other avoidance behaviors. Yet, that is the very person who longs to know what it means; she or he is the most ardent seeker. Seeking and seeming-to-seek can stand in as avoidance postures. Someone who frequently dons the cloak of the false self wants like crazy to find a way out - to find their TRUE self apart from ego and content - but until they are willing to give up that cloak, they will never get it. > > > Just my opinion, from my experience. Chime in if you have other viewpoints, or even if you agree. > > > > Helena > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2012 Report Share Posted April 14, 2012 Hi Terry, Helena It may have been said before, but I regularly watch your exchanges and am always reminded of the "annoying aunt" metaphor. I think you each play that role to the other. No-one's fault - these things happen in a social world. But if you can recognise it, you can move on, and enjoy the party! Best wishes, x To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Saturday, 14 April 2012, 13:13 Subject: Re: Re: Self as Context What's my deal? I blame no one but myself for being annoyed, for being sucked in over and over. I made it very clear that I was speaking FROM MY EXPERIENCE. I am not making assumptions or drawing conclusions about anyone else. I am not outlining anything for anyone else. If you can experience self-as-context at the same time you are fused with self-as-content, fine. I can't. That's all I said.HTo: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 8:10:32 PMSubject: Re: Re: Self as Context Helena, What's your deal? You seem to readily blame me for having special powers to annoy you when it's you yourself who puts the weighty stuff out there, (please note you started this thread), you ask for feedback, continue to engage, and then when I bother to just slow it down to look at it more closely, you throw up your arms and start yelling at me. What's up with that? Re: "To my understanding, if one is experiencing "self as context" for the most part (don't know if anyone can have that fully in every moment) , you could not be fused with your "self as content" at the same time - which is where you are coming from when you pick up <name your vice>. " It sounds like there are assumptions, givens and conclusions about ACT and substance abuse that you are outlining.for us here is all. And I don't follow. I was confused and just trying to slow it down so we could look at it piece by piece. peace out, terry To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:55 PM Subject: Re: Re: Self as Context Keep hovering! I don't think I shifted anything unless you wanted to shift. I described my experience. To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 5:19:34 PMSubject: Re: Re: Self as Context >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well let's be aware you are now asserting something more than just your personal take,NO, I am not. Terry, I don't know how you do it, but I feel depleted after your responses to me. Helena, like I detailed here in my last post, that's not my experience of self as context. Please see the two posts below I added (one from you and then my reply to you) that didn't get included in this thread. Naturally all takes are valid. But when you say "to my understanding if one is experiencing self as context, you can not be simultaneously fused with your self as content", well let's be aware you are now asserting something more than just your personal take, you are shifting some to implying something factual about this ability to experience self as context, and now including the concept of cognitive fusion in your equation. Thanks, terry > > I see what you're saying. I got the concept, even understood it, but I didn't experience "self as context" until I stopped engaging in habitual avoidant behaviors. > > To my understanding, if one is experiencing "self as context" for the most part (don't know if anyone can have that fully in every moment) , you could not be fused with your "self as content" at the same time - which is where you are coming from when you pick up <name your vice>. The more I did that picking up, or putting on that cloak as I described it, the more fused I got with my stories and my suffering and the further away from knowing my "self as context. Just my experience, which is all I can speak to. Yours may be completely different and every bit as valid! > > Helena Re: Self as Context Hi Helena, I just saw this post of yours. My experience has been different. Self as context like all processes are experienced on a continuum for me. Now naturally, if I'm constantly engaging in self-destructive behavior and all that entails, less of me is available to show up for something new. And yes, the unworkable behavior along with the internal and external ritual does tend to take on a psuedo meaning, pseudo life of it's own, and as you say the quest itself can create a false sense of nobility, righteousness. But once the gig is up, there is always a part of me that sort of sees even that, truth be told, even if I pick the cloak up temporarily. That choice (to pick up the cloak) tho has nothing to do with knowing who i am essentially, complete, whole. Sure wastes a lot of valuable time though. ------------------------------------------ To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 8:00 AM Subject: Re: Self as Context I was strictly speaking from my experience. I could not experience self as context, let alone understand it, when I was using alcohol. Alcohol mis-use (used as an escape) kept the ego right up front and center, for me. I viewed it as wearing a cloak that obscured my true essence, or self as context. I'm sure others may have their own metaphors or words that would make more sense to them. As far as seeking as an avoidance posture is concerned - Seeking and searching for answers took on a more desperate color for me when I used escape mechanisms over and over - maybe because I got more and more lost to myself each time I took that route. At one point I realized that my seeking and searching was providing me comfort: See, even though I get drunk every now and then, I could feel good about myself by saying - oh, look how I am searching; look how I am seeking the truth. Thus, I came to realize my very searching was posturing as an escape mechanism as well. Maybe that doesn't make sense to anyone else but me! There was a lot of guilt around my using alcohol but darn it, I was still a good person - just look at how I hunger to be on the right path; look at my earnest quest! Talk about rationalizing! It all changed for me - hugely! - when I gave up the avoidance activity. Then when I searched, I found answers. I found me. Helena > > > > To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public > > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 11:07:13 AM > Subject: Re: Self as Context > I think I'd add that I have no idea what the relationship is-- if any-- between ability to access self as context for those who regularly abuse substances or routinely engage avoidant behaviors. Avoidant self-destructive rituals do tend to create a lot of unnecessary drama, distraction and suffering, but ability to access self as context and all processes remains intact so far as i can tell. Self as Context was initially introduced to me by Steve who said (paraphrasing)" now notice there are four of us present here in the room. There is my mind, your mind and then there is you and then there is me." That was all I needed to get it! And it was so refreshing to have someone just note and include that, as he does in most of his responses, one way or another. There are plenty of metaphors and exercises out there to help access this space. So it's pretty accessible imho. I don't know if that speaks to your thesis here or helps in any way. > > > > > To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public > > Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 5:57 PM > Subject: Re: Self as Context > > Well, this is very interesting. Just re: the first sentence: The part about not understanding the concept resonates. The part about not being able to experience does not. The rest, I don't know. Words and such so get in the way. That's my chime for today. I have been enjoying the discussion on the other list too. > > > Thanks for opening up this for all of us, Helena. > > > Self as Context > > > This concept cannot be understood or experienced as long as one is abusing substances on a regular basis, or frequently engaging in other avoidance behaviors. Yet, that is the very person who longs to know what it means; she or he is the most ardent seeker. Seeking and seeming-to-seek can stand in as avoidance postures. Someone who frequently dons the cloak of the false self wants like crazy to find a way out - to find their TRUE self apart from ego and content - but until they are willing to give up that cloak, they will never get it. > > > Just my opinion, from my experience. Chime in if you have other viewpoints, or even if you agree. > > > > Helena > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2012 Report Share Posted April 14, 2012 Thank you, annoying uncle : )To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2012 8:40:27 AMSubject: Re: Re: Self as Context Hi Terry, Helena It may have been said before, but I regularly watch your exchanges and am always reminded of the "annoying aunt" metaphor. I think you each play that role to the other. No-one's fault - these things happen in a social world. But if you can recognise it, you can move on, and enjoy the party! Best wishes, x To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Saturday, 14 April 2012, 13:13 Subject: Re: Re: Self as Context What's my deal? I blame no one but myself for being annoyed, for being sucked in over and over. I made it very clear that I was speaking FROM MY EXPERIENCE. I am not making assumptions or drawing conclusions about anyone else. I am not outlining anything for anyone else. If you can experience self-as-context at the same time you are fused with self-as-content, fine. I can't. That's all I said.HTo: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 8:10:32 PMSubject: Re: Re: Self as Context Helena, What's your deal? You seem to readily blame me for having special powers to annoy you when it's you yourself who puts the weighty stuff out there, (please note you started this thread), you ask for feedback, continue to engage, and then when I bother to just slow it down to look at it more closely, you throw up your arms and start yelling at me. What's up with that? Re: "To my understanding, if one is experiencing "self as context" for the most part (don't know if anyone can have that fully in every moment) , you could not be fused with your "self as content" at the same time - which is where you are coming from when you pick up <name your vice>. " It sounds like there are assumptions, givens and conclusions about ACT and substance abuse that you are outlining.for us here is all. And I don't follow. I was confused and just trying to slow it down so we could look at it piece by piece. peace out, terry To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:55 PM Subject: Re: Re: Self as Context Keep hovering! I don't think I shifted anything unless you wanted to shift. I described my experience. To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 5:19:34 PMSubject: Re: Re: Self as Context >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well let's be aware you are now asserting something more than just your personal take,NO, I am not. Terry, I don't know how you do it, but I feel depleted after your responses to me. Helena, like I detailed here in my last post, that's not my experience of self as context. Please see the two posts below I added (one from you and then my reply to you) that didn't get included in this thread. Naturally all takes are valid. But when you say "to my understanding if one is experiencing self as context, you can not be simultaneously fused with your self as content", well let's be aware you are now asserting something more than just your personal take, you are shifting some to implying something factual about this ability to experience self as context, and now including the concept of cognitive fusion in your equation. Thanks, terry > > I see what you're saying. I got the concept, even understood it, but I didn't experience "self as context" until I stopped engaging in habitual avoidant behaviors. > > To my understanding, if one is experiencing "self as context" for the most part (don't know if anyone can have that fully in every moment) , you could not be fused with your "self as content" at the same time - which is where you are coming from when you pick up <name your vice>. The more I did that picking up, or putting on that cloak as I described it, the more fused I got with my stories and my suffering and the further away from knowing my "self as context. Just my experience, which is all I can speak to. Yours may be completely different and every bit as valid! > > Helena Re: Self as Context Hi Helena, I just saw this post of yours. My experience has been different. Self as context like all processes are experienced on a continuum for me. Now naturally, if I'm constantly engaging in self-destructive behavior and all that entails, less of me is available to show up for something new. And yes, the unworkable behavior along with the internal and external ritual does tend to take on a psuedo meaning, pseudo life of it's own, and as you say the quest itself can create a false sense of nobility, righteousness. But once the gig is up, there is always a part of me that sort of sees even that, truth be told, even if I pick the cloak up temporarily. That choice (to pick up the cloak) tho has nothing to do with knowing who i am essentially, complete, whole. Sure wastes a lot of valuable time though. ------------------------------------------ To: ACT for the Public <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 8:00 AM Subject: Re: Self as Context I was strictly speaking from my experience. I could not experience self as context, let alone understand it, when I was using alcohol. Alcohol mis-use (used as an escape) kept the ego right up front and center, for me. I viewed it as wearing a cloak that obscured my true essence, or self as context. I'm sure others may have their own metaphors or words that would make more sense to them. As far as seeking as an avoidance posture is concerned - Seeking and searching for answers took on a more desperate color for me when I used escape mechanisms over and over - maybe because I got more and more lost to myself each time I took that route. At one point I realized that my seeking and searching was providing me comfort: See, even though I get drunk every now and then, I could feel good about myself by saying - oh, look how I am searching; look how I am seeking the truth. Thus, I came to realize my very searching was posturing as an escape mechanism as well. Maybe that doesn't make sense to anyone else but me! There was a lot of guilt around my using alcohol but darn it, I was still a good person - just look at how I hunger to be on the right path; look at my earnest quest! Talk about rationalizing! It all changed for me - hugely! - when I gave up the avoidance activity. Then when I searched, I found answers. I found me. Helena > > > > To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public > > Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 11:07:13 AM > Subject: Re: Self as Context > I think I'd add that I have no idea what the relationship is-- if any-- between ability to access self as context for those who regularly abuse substances or routinely engage avoidant behaviors. Avoidant self-destructive rituals do tend to create a lot of unnecessary drama, distraction and suffering, but ability to access self as context and all processes remains intact so far as i can tell. Self as Context was initially introduced to me by Steve who said (paraphrasing)" now notice there are four of us present here in the room. There is my mind, your mind and then there is you and then there is me." That was all I needed to get it! And it was so refreshing to have someone just note and include that, as he does in most of his responses, one way or another. There are plenty of metaphors and exercises out there to help access this space. So it's pretty accessible imho. I don't know if that speaks to your thesis here or helps in any way. > > > > > To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public > > Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 5:57 PM > Subject: Re: Self as Context > > Well, this is very interesting. Just re: the first sentence: The part about not understanding the concept resonates. The part about not being able to experience does not. The rest, I don't know. Words and such so get in the way. That's my chime for today. I have been enjoying the discussion on the other list too. > > > Thanks for opening up this for all of us, Helena. > > > Self as Context > > > This concept cannot be understood or experienced as long as one is abusing substances on a regular basis, or frequently engaging in other avoidance behaviors. Yet, that is the very person who longs to know what it means; she or he is the most ardent seeker. Seeking and seeming-to-seek can stand in as avoidance postures. Someone who frequently dons the cloak of the false self wants like crazy to find a way out - to find their TRUE self apart from ego and content - but until they are willing to give up that cloak, they will never get it. > > > Just my opinion, from my experience. Chime in if you have other viewpoints, or even if you agree. > > > > Helena > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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