Re: Sensory Issues

[Guest guest]

> Sully was the same way. in fact Sully refused to nurse. every time I put

him to the breast he became rigid and screamed, that is a pretty mild

description actually. Using the bottle wasn't much better. Unless we didn't

hold him. It took him a very long time to bond. I was heartbroken, wondering

why my baby didn't want me...

>

- you had my baby! I was in hospital for eight days, and so many times a

day they'd come in and try to get him to nurse. They'd squish his head against

me while he screamed and screamed and screamed and kicked and was rigid and I

cried and cried and cried. It was soooooo hot that week, and they kept telling

me to strip off and hold him against my skin, and I would do that and he would

turn purple with the heat and the screaming and I'd be sitting there drenched

with sweat, just crying and crying while some nurse or other held his head

against the breast trying to force him to latch on... He never latched. Not

even once. I had never felt so rejected, or like such a failure.

Looking back, it's obvious that the sensory issues were at play. At the time,

it was just the first step down a road of pain, confusion, rejection, and

failure that I blamed myself - and only myself - for.

Later, someone would see me bottlefeeding him and feel that they needed to

inform me that " breast is best. " I would burst into tears -- even in the mall

-- ESPECIALLY in the mall, when this devastating piece of wisdom was imparted by

strangers. I couldn't make them understand that HE didn't want ME, not the

other way around...

<sigh>

If only autism could be diagnosed at birth.

Jacquie

[Guest guest]

>

> If only autism could be diagnosed at birth.

>

If only people would SHUT UP until they have learned the full story. If

they never learn it, then fine. They can be quiet.

Salli

[Guest guest]

" " " while some nurse or other held his head against the breast trying to

force him to latch on... " " "

ACKKKKK that's horrible. Some nurses should not be allowed near people. I

was very lucky and would latch on and nurse but there was a lady in the

room next to me that was having a horrible time and the nurses would not

leave her alone. They didn't call a lactation consultant for the poor women.

Finally at around 4am they allowed her to give this poor infant a bottle.

I wanted to murder them for making that poor mother suffer. I did get to

meet her the next day and she was devestated and crying, I told her that

nothing is her fault that not everyone can nurse but the stupid nursed made

her feel like a failure. Oh I hated them for that.

See I was the only thing didn't have a sensory issue with, he could

nurse and wouldn't stop. If I wasn't touching him all the time he would

have a fit. Lay him down and that was the end of my day. Once his routine

ended he lost it. If I put acutal clothing on other then the sleepers he

lost it.

>Later, someone would see me bottlefeeding him and feel that they needed to

>inform me that " breast is best. " I would burst into tears -- even in the

>mall -- ESPECIALLY in the mall, when this devastating piece of wisdom was

>imparted by strangers. I couldn't make them understand that HE didn't want

>ME, not the other way around...

When breastfeeding mom's do this is really pissed me off. (sorry about the

wording but it makes me so angry) Oh yea stupid people the way to promote

breastfeeding is making the bottle feeding mother feel stupid.

Sorry always been a sore point with me, We I was co-leader of the LLL in

Port Jervis we had a few moms that did things like this. I wanted to scream.

I'm so sorry that people did that. No one should be made to feel guilty for

a parenting choice. We all have to do what we have to do for our children.

I know the depressing feelings I had them with . After my gallbladder

removal I could not nurse him anymore. I just could not lay him on my chest

and by the time I was able to do it again, He didn't want anything to do

with me. I would get the rudest comment.

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[Guest guest]

> leave her alone. They didn't call a lactation consultant for the poor women.

> Finally at around 4am they allowed her to give this poor infant a bottle.

4am the same day the kid was born? Like, within 24 hours??? They didn't let me

bottlefeed until I got a uterine infection after four days!!!!!!! And even

then, I had to get out of bed one afternoon after a hideous torture session of

squishing him on me, take that hideous milking machine thingy to the nursery,

fling it into the nurses station, and say, " Give me my baby and a bottle. " They

said, " Here, you'll need two bottles. " He was drinking THAT much every feeding

after that. Poor little mite.

Jacquie

[Guest guest]

> If only people would SHUT UP until they have learned the full story. If

> they never learn it, then fine. They can be quiet.

>

Thank you, Salli. That means so much, especially coming from you. I see

was a LLL co-leader too. It's nice to know that at least the women at

the head of the meetings and the chapters are practical, reasonable people. I

guess it's the ones at the bottom who are the bigmouths and who give it all a

bad name. :-) Are you still leading, Salli? I wonder about maybe including a

sort of sensitivity training into the program -- or would that be going against

policy?

Jacquie

[Guest guest]

>

>4am the same day the kid was born? Like, within 24 hours??? I think it

>was the following day as I was able to walk and our babies shared the same

>birthdate. so maybe 48hrs. I was not able to do much the first 24 hrs after

>sean beause of the c-section and then not sleeping for 48hrs before the

>operation so I don't remember much of that first day.

They didn't let me bottlefeed until I got a uterine infection after

four days!!!!!!! And even then, I had to get out of bed one afternoon after

a hideous torture session of squishing him on me, take that hideous milking

machine thingy to the nursery, fling it into the nurses station, and say,

" Give me my baby and a bottle. " They said, " Here, you'll need two bottles. "

He was drinking THAT much every feeding after that. Poor little mite.

That's just torture for both you and , poor momma , poor little one.

Not everyone can breastfeed, not everyone wants to breastfeed and nurses and

hosptials should know this

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[Guest guest]

It's nice to know that at least the women at the head of the meetings and

the chapters are practical, reasonable people. I guess it's the ones at the

bottom who are the bigmouths and who give it all a bad name. :-) Are you

still leading, Salli?

Yes, I am.

I wonder about maybe including a sort of sensitivity training into the

program -- or would that be going against policy?

>

Actually few LLL leaders would ever make any remarks about what you are

doing. That sensitivity training is built right in. A very good friend of

mine who is a bit militant about breastfeeding was not allowed to become an

LLL leader because she was, we decided, too likely to make remarks that

would be hurtful. We have a special training program called Human Relations

Enrichment that is supposed to teach you how to deal sensitively and

non-judgementally with other people. We are told over and over again that

the mother is the expert on her baby and she is an adult who must be allowed

to make her own decisions. We don't even like the word, " advice, "

preferring " information, " and telling other people what to do is anathema to

LLL's philosophy.

You just don't catch flies with vinegar.

But having said that, real life is not always perfect. New leaders are

recommended by old leaders and old leaders tend to pick moms who are like

them. I did not do this; I had a statewide job training new leaders and I

tried to pick moms who I thought would add balance so we had a nice mix of

conventional and non-conventional rather than all tandem nursing

homeschooling homebirthing vegetarians although I would never have

overlooked someone who was suitable and fell into typical LLL parameters.

There is not a lot of supervision at the local level so some groups are

markedly different from others and some leaders are much more competent.

Most leaders do know what they are supposed to do though and many of the

nasty remarks will come from moms in the group. Technically the leader is

supposed to clarify any such remark; I could give you a zillion examples by

pointing out that such and such is what this person thinks but that actually

LLL takes no position on anything except breastfeeding.

Salli

[Guest guest]

My mom told me that when I was born in 1965, the

nurses were pushing bottle feeding because it was

" sensible and formualted just for babies " She was

made to feel " old-fashoined " and " stubborn " for

choosing to breast-feed. My MIL told me that the

hospital she gave birth in just assumed mothers would

bottle-feed. Times have changed, but bottle/breast is

still the mother's choice and no one should force a

decision.

Tuna

>> " " " while some nurse or other held his head against

the breast trying to force him to latch on... " " " <<<

>>>>I was very lucky and would latch on and nurse

but there was a lady in the room next to me that was

having a horrible time and the nurses would not leave

her alone. They didn't call a lactation consultant for

the poor women. Finally at around 4am they allowed her

to give this poor infant a bottle.<<<<

=====

" Normal is just a setting on the washing machine. "

Whoopi Goldberg

______________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

>>Later, someone would see me bottlefeeding him and feel that they needed to

inform me that " breast is best. " I would burst into tears -- even in the

mall -- ESPECIALLY in the mall, when this devastating piece of wisdom was

imparted by strangers. I couldn't make them understand that HE didn't want

ME, not the other way around...<<

I can't believe SOME PEOPLE.

I can respect that someone would think one way or another, but for heaven's

sake, keep your mouth shut.

I don't doubt breast is best, but my breasts were kept to myself, thank you.

From moment one, I bottlefed, and I'm not ashamed to say so. Having one

infant on each breast would just make me want to scream MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

And that is how most breastfeed their twins, so from the pregnancy on, I

knew I would not even try it.

But if anyone had walked up to me and uttered such rude and uncalled for

comments, I would have gladly ripped them a new s$$hole.

Grace

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[Guest guest]

No one should be made to feel guilty for

> a parenting choice. We all have to do what we have to do for our

children.

That's it in a nutshell . I've nursed all my babies but time

and " style " has directly reflected sensory issues. nursed and

nursed and nursed, and then was 'all done'. At 18mo she was done.

Period. End of that.

Gail could not be swaddled, or held, or have any light, or noise,

yadda yadda yadda. She only nursed out of the side of her mouth just

long enough to take the edge off and you had to lie down on the bed

and not touch her. Gave the kid a bottle and sat her in front of a

ceiling fan and she was ecstatic. Ummm, once I figured out the right

kind of bottle nipple. We tried a dozen or more to get JUST the

right one.

would scream and scream and scream, had to be swaddled up tight

and held, start him off with a nuk to get the tongue thrust

happening, then switch to the breast, and he'd nurse long enough to

take the edge off and shut down/fall asleep thing. But he had to be

held all the time (velcro baby sort) and he refused the bottle

alltogether. Once he figured it out he was a fierce nurser and

didn't wean until he was four and a half, but since he ate almost

nothing and was often the only time he was quiet and still, nursing

served for us.

thinks nursing is the greatest idea ever known to man.

He'll be four in two weeks. Given the opportunity he'd nurse every

hour on the hour every day. I'm ready for him to stop but he isn't.

He loves to touch my skin and snuggle up tight which I don't mind

except that he's like trying to hold a 45lb wiggle worm, and that I

do mind.

is a sweet baby. He nurses fine, he eats food fine. I have

no idea how long he will nurse but I don't think it's going to be

such an involved issue with him.

Each kid has their own limits and things that work for them. Best

laid plans of mice and men and all that. You do your best and that's

that.

[Guest guest]

>

> Gail could not be swaddled, or held, or have any light, or noise,

> yadda yadda yadda. She only nursed out of the side of her mouth just

> long enough to take the edge off and you had to lie down on the bed

> and not touch her. Gave the kid a bottle and sat her in front of a

> ceiling fan and she was ecstatic. Ummm, once I figured out the right

> kind of bottle nipple. We tried a dozen or more to get JUST the

> right one.

This whole scenario sounds so very spectrum-ish. And yet the experts who

have seen Gail have their doubts?

Salli

[Guest guest]

> This whole scenario sounds so very spectrum-ish. And yet the

experts who

> have seen Gail have their doubts?

Uhhh, yeah.

[Guest guest]

Tuna -

I was born in 1965 also...and I can't even IMAGINE my mother

breastfeeding...

I'm POSITIVE I was always on the bottle.

Penny

[Guest guest]

> I was born in 1965 also...and I can't even IMAGINE my mother

> breastfeeding...

>

> I'm POSITIVE I was always on the bottle.

My grandfather was doctor in a military hospital and he refused to work

with women who would not breastfeed. My mother did not dare bottlefeed.

And all her children breastfed. Well, my brother didn't. He let his wife do

it for him.

Salli

[Guest guest]

How would your grandfather deal with women like me, who tried for a week and the

kid wouldn't do it?

Jacquie

[Guest guest]

> How would your grandfather deal with women like me, who tried for

> a week and the kid wouldn't do it?

Jacquie -- I believe the key word there would be " refused. " YOU did not

refuse to breastfeed. ERIC refused to breastfeed. And it had nothing to do

with YOU. It was all HIM and his sensory issues and not in any way

whatsoever your fault.

And if Salli's grandfather couldn't understand that, he could go harrass his

son for not breastfeeding.

-Sara.

[Guest guest]

> Jacquie -- I believe the key word there would be " refused. " YOU did not

> refuse to breastfeed. ERIC refused to breastfeed. And it had nothing to

do

> with YOU. It was all HIM and his sensory issues and not in any way

> whatsoever your fault.

Oh so you mean people like ME LOL.

That's just fine by me. I don't care what Salli's grandfather thinks of me,

or would have thought of me, so long as Salli doesn't hate me for REFUSING.

Grace

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[Guest guest]

>

> Yes, Grace, we Breastfeeding Nazi's don't speak to people like you.

>

Yeah, I know. It's a good thing that I am so comfortable with my decision,

LOL. Seriously, in my particular case, at that particular time, it was what

I considered to be best. Not best for the baby, obviously - - but best for

all of us as a whole.

Looking back, I still maintain that position.

But thank you for lowering yourself to the likes of me, LOL!!

> So are you ever going to be anywhere near Ohio? 'Cause I don't fly, so

> California's probably out for us. I will go drink coffee with you...tho

it

> will have to be decaf. You don't want to see me on caffeine. Trust me.

(I

> mean aside from the migraine and the puking.)

Sara, I would. I'd love to see you, although I have no plans to be near

Ohio in the near future LOL. But you know what?

I keep on getting this feeling you'd be allergic to the sight of me, LOL.

Grace

_________________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

> Tell you what, if you're ever coming this way, I will send you a " care

> package " of acceptable products you may use in my presence. Make-up and

> hair spray will not be among them; you will just have to be ugly while

> you're here.

>

Then it shall never happen, I'm afraid.

Going without hairspray is easy. I don't use hairspray. And to spend time

with you, I'd forego one of my favorite things in life: perfume.

But no makeup?

You mean like cosmetics?

Like... foundation? Blush? Liner? Powder?

I intend to enter the pearly gates with makeup on, dear.

It is just not meant to be. You will have to sit at the other end of

Starbucks drinking your decaf or whatever, and either yell at me, or we can

do instant chat with our laptops and smile at one another instead of typing

" LOL " . !!!!

Grace

_________________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

> For you, dear Grace, I will suffer the pangs of makeup.

WELL, i Should THINK so!!!!! )

>

> Actually I'm not that bad anymore. You'd just have to do without perfume

> and fabric softener. And fish. When I was pg with Gabe tho I couldn't

> leave the house.

That is reasonable, and possible. No perfume... and I will wear something

that is drycleaned, since I'd probably be in a suit anyhow. And as for the

mackerel around my neck, I'll have to leave that in California.

Just don't get pregnant in between now and then. Makeup is not optional.

Grace

>

>

> -Sara.

>

>

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[Guest guest]

>Surely that's because you like it, not because you feel you need it, right?

Grace, you are one the most beautiful girls I have ever seen.

Hey everybody, don't believe me? click here and remind yourselves:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/parenting_autism/files/Grace%27s%20Family%20Pi

ctures/grace.jpg

<

OH GOOD GRIEF, Jacquie.

The link was simply overkill. LOL

As far as makeup goes - - I love it, need it, crave it, and will not

function without it. Cannot function without it.

On the rare days when I leave the house without makeup - - - I feel like I

left my face at home. I become... well, autistic. I won't look straight at

anyone, and will probably never take off my glasses and baseball cap.

No, no... I melt without makeup.

I am simply not Grace without makeup. Need? You bet your bottom dollar I

need! I'd send you a picture of me without makeup on just to prove it too,

if such a thing even existed! Actually, I have a picture of me with almost

NO makeup on, and the difference is DRASTIC. But my excuse was a good one

that day, it was pouring rain and most of it ran, so I was left with no

choice but to wash it off and redo it - - only I had very litlte makeup on

me. I didn't realize my face would be peeled off in the evening, so I

hadn't brought out my handy dandy makeup bag, LOL.

No.... makeup is a MUST.

Grace

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[Guest guest]

> I had pictured you...rounder. Not chubby but with a wider face. And

paler.

> But then, you live in California, what was I thinking?

Isn't it funny how we end up picturing one another?

The only person I pegged correctly was Jacquie, thus far. Nobody else looks

the way I pictured them to look.

Round, wide... OK. But I wonder what made you think PALE? LOL

>

> I have to figue out that files thing sometime. But it's NEW and

> DIFFERENT...I don't know if I can handle that.

ABA, Sara... ABA.

Break it down into bits and pieces and reinforce your every move. First...

start with hitting the files link. Again... good job, Sara. GOOD

CLICKING!!!

Grace

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[Guest guest]

> > Jacquie -- I believe the key word there would be " refused. " YOU did not

> > refuse to breastfeed. ERIC refused to breastfeed. And it had

> Oh so you mean people like ME LOL.

Yes, Grace, we Breastfeeding Nazi's don't speak to people like you.

So are you ever going to be anywhere near Ohio? 'Cause I don't fly, so

California's probably out for us. I will go drink coffee with you...tho it

will have to be decaf. You don't want to see me on caffeine. Trust me. (I

mean aside from the migraine and the puking.) I know -- we can all go land

on Salli. Maybe we'll even kick her out of the house SANS KIDS...can you

imagine? Salli? Without kids in tow? I would drive to Salli's house.

-Sara.

[Guest guest]

> it was what

> I considered to be best. Not best for the baby, obviously - -

> but best for

> all of us as a whole.

A baby needs a happy mother more than she needs breastmilk.

> Sara, I would. I'd love to see you, although I have no plans to be near

> Ohio in the near future LOL. But you know what?

> I keep on getting this feeling you'd be allergic to the sight of me, LOL.

LOL!

Tell you what, if you're ever coming this way, I will send you a " care

package " of acceptable products you may use in my presence. Make-up and

hair spray will not be among them; you will just have to be ugly while

you're here.

-Sara.

[Guest guest]

For you, dear Grace, I will suffer the pangs of makeup.

Actually I'm not that bad anymore. You'd just have to do without perfume

and fabric softener. And fish. When I was pg with Gabe tho I couldn't

leave the house.

-Sara.