Re: Re: Project to publish book about how churches can accommodate people with autism

[Guest guest]

> I have not read that book and there is not much information out

> there that deals with autism ministry, the majority of books about

> autism deal with Autism 101, early childhood, relationships, and

> education/work with a male dominance. Even Kingley

> Publishers and Future Horizons don't have much on autism and

> religion, Future Horizons only have a kids book on teaching autistic

> kids Bible stories and Kingley Publishers don't have any at

> all.

Some years ago, a member of an online group created a manual for her

own church about how to accommodate autistics. It was online, and she

shared the URL with the group. Although I am not interested in

churches myself, I sent the URL to a cousin who is a minister. It

seemed like a well thought out guide. Unfortunately, I don't remember

the author's name, and the email to my cousin was in the not-backed-up

computer that was stolen when my home was burglarized several years ago.

Jane

[Guest guest]

Re:

> Some years ago, a member of an online group created a manual for her

> own church about how to accommodate autistics. It was online, and she

> shared the URL with the group. Although I am not interested in

> churches myself, I sent the URL to a cousin who is a minister. It

> seemed like a well thought out guide. Unfortunately, I don't remember

> the author's name, and the email to my cousin was in the not-backed-up

> computer that was stolen when my home was burglarized several years ago.

The manual probably included the church's name — search Google for " [that

church's name] " + autism ... See what comes up.

If the correct page's link appears but proves dead, take that link and

search it at http://www.archive.org which stores old versions of web-sites.

>

> Jane

>

>

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[Guest guest]

> The manual probably included the church's name — search Google for

> " [that

> church's name] " + autism ... See what comes up.

But where do I find the name of the church?

Jane

[Guest guest]

I had hoped you might know the church's name, as you knew about the manual.

Since you don't, let's try two other ways.

/1/ If you know the city and state of the church, you can Google " [city],

[state] " + " church — add in the denomination, if you know it — then read

the listings and see if a church's name sounds familiar (maybe your cousin

once mentioned what church he was writing for). If you an get the church's

name that way, then you can use my original plan.

/2/ Figure that NOT that many churches ever had autism manuals, so Google

" church " + " autism " + manual " as see what you get. When I didn't just now,

the first result was a church-bookstore disabilities-resources page which

includes more than one manual on autism & church:

http://www.clcnetwork.org/clc-store

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BETTER LETTERS <http://adf.ly/135205/betterletters>*

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[Guest guest]

> /2/ Figure that NOT that many churches ever had autism manuals, so

> Google

> " church " + " autism " + manual " as see what you get.

Interesting.

Provides Christian churches with info on how to include people with

intellectual disabilities (including autistics).

http://www.friendship.org/?gclid=COS47c63l60CFUsaQgodRlNtnA

" ...a special needs ministry dedicated to the spiritual health of

children and adults with autism .... "

http://www.jonathanschild.com/

Article about a church that has a director of pastoral ministry with

persons with disabilities

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/30/autism-in-the-church-grow_n_855677.html

A book:

http://www.faithaliveresources.org/Products/116016/autism-and-your-church.aspx

A Church with an Arts N Autism program:

http://www.covenanttuscaloosa.com/

Church produced a DVD to educate members about autistic kids

http://stjohndfw.info/article-1238791474.html

List of disability resources for churches

http://www.disabilitiesandfaith.org/resource/

Jane

[Guest guest]

> I have not read that book and there is not much information out there that

deals with autism ministry, the majority of books about autism deal with Autism

101, early childhood, relationships, and education/work with a male dominance.

Even Kingley Publishers and Future Horizons don't have much on autism

and religion, Future Horizons only have a kids book on teaching autistic kids

Bible stories and Kingley Publishers don't have any at all.

I would assume that you would want to include info on including

children as well though? And perhaps some advice for teachers of

church related children's groups?

I think JK have a book on autism and spirituality, though I've not

read it. They have a couple of books on autism and Buddhism now too.

My concern is that there may not be much of an audience for such a

specialised book, and you're asking people to put up an awful lot of

money for your project. How exactly is the USD10 000 going to be

spent? Most people don't use that much to write a book.

Not wanting to quash your idea, but I have a sense it needs a lot more

thinking through. Remember that church attendence in the West is

dropping off, while alternative religions are growing, and also that

the church hasn't a great history for wanting to accomodate people who

are different. It's never been their priority. You would first need

to let the right people know this book exists and secondly persuade

them to buy it. You don't seem to be a scholar, or if you are you've

not mentioned it, and that may also put people off taking what you say

seriously. For the book to work you either need to outrightly target

a specific denomination you know about, or you need a broad study of

how things work across denominations, enough to qualify you to give

advice for different kinds of churches - because to take extreme ends

of the scale, what you advise for Catholics is going to need to be a

whole lot different to what you advise for Quakers, for example.

Note I'm not saying you don't have anything worthwhile to say, I just

dont know and haven't seen anything that would perusade me to

financially support your project.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

>

>

>

> I got this idea from a Facebook friend who contacted me about doing a possible

workshop on autism awareness in her church (still trying to work out the details

on this) and I thought, maybe this is what many churches need, a way to

accommodate autistics in their churches. I even told my pastor about the

presentation idea (not the book idea yet) and he said that he likes the idea and

wants to see the presentation. The book would either lean towards the mainstream

Protestant denominations or the United Pentecostal Church International (My

husband and I go to a United Pentecostal Church)

OK, well that's good that you have some idea where you are going with

it and why. I think that to get money out of people you need to be

much clearer about your plans on the project web page, though if you

prove me wrong that's great :-)

>

> As for the $10000, both Kickstarter and Amazon Payments would each take about

5 percent of the funds for processing fees, which means that it would be about

$1000 taken out for processing fees. That would leave about $9000 left. 50

backers of $25 would get a free autographed copy of the book and that would run

for $1250, leaving $7750. Costs of copyright registration, ISBN registration,

printing proofreading copies, paying a proofreader, translators, audio book

recording, actual self-publishing costs, marketing costs, plus shipping would be

the remainder of the costs. Yes, it does cost money to write, self-publish, and

market the book.

Yes, I realise that money is involved, it's just that it's an awful

lot to ask for a book that is only likely to interest a small minority

of people. Ideas if funding is not forthcoming might be to create a

webpage instead, or to try to put something together that a publishing

house might take up.

The other concern that you haven't addressed in this reply is why you

would be the right person to write this book. You haven't mentioned

prior experience of writing, nor a wider experience of autism needs

than just your own, and if you are actually active in giving sermons

etc then your perspective as a churchgoing autistic is fairly unique

and may or may not be of use to others, depending on how broadly you

can address the needs of autistics generally, churchgoers generally

and church organisers and ministers.

Please believe me, I'm not just trying to bash your idea here, but to

encourage some clear planning, and some clarity to those you seek

funding from as to why they should give you money to do this.

Another idea - and if you do this I would be very interested - would

be to write about your own experiences. This you are eminently

qualified for, and it might be a unique enough book in the autism

world to attract the attention of JK or similar.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

I submit a piece of my writing to Key Ministry (who focuses on kids

with autism) and they said that I know a lot about both autism and the

Bible. I believe that not many people write about accommodating

autistics in worship is because many would perceive autistics as being

atheists and/or agnostics, not ones that believe in God.

I'm not sure most people think about that at all.

I'm also very unsure that simply being something qualifies a person to

write a book about it. I certainly don't think that being asked to

give one talk means there is a huge demand for a book. I was

concerned that you said there aren't any books on the subject yet, and

when I told you ones I've read, which even though they don't cover all

your ground you could use for references, you were dismissive about

them without checking them out.

JK was just an example of a mainstream autism publisher; if you know

others in the US that would work better for you.

I wish you luck, I just can't see it coming in the nature of USD 10 000.

Happy Christmas though anyway!

Ruth

[Guest guest]

> The book audience is larger than one would expect, since

> the target audience is churches and there are millions

> of churches in the United States alone.

335,000, and presumably an equal number of independent religious

study groups. (so 1 in 100 to 1 in 50 would be 3000 to 7000

copies.)

>

> I'm also very unsure that simply being something

> qualifies a person to write a book about it.

Yes, but in this case, she is writing, from the perspective of

being something (autistic and Christian), on things lay people

very definitely participate in, which include running of

churches, providing accomodations for hidden disabilities,

inclusion and civil rights in religious groups. There are also

a number of churches which are adverse to having the ministry

manage the operation of the church.

> The reason why I am planning on writing the book is that

> I am both autistic and a Christian that goes to church

> every week. I submit a piece of my writing to Key Ministry

> (who focuses on kids with autism)

It seems they are providing a very useful service. Since

religious participation is a social activity, this can be very

useful. Even if religion and religious social activities are

not especially useful for autistics, for those who desire such

participation, it is helpful to remove barriers to the

participation and make it available.

A very major issue is that there may be substantial resistance

in some churches to elimiation of the practice of " laying hands "

(a practice in which practitioners attempt to " cure " autism and

other personality traits). This practice essentially excludes

autistics from those congregations. " Laying hands " needs to be

made a relic of history in the same manner as violent forms of

exocism.

> I believe that not many people write about accommodating

> autistics in worship is because many would perceive

> autistics as being atheists and/or agnostics, not ones

> that believe in God.

There may well be a high percentage of atheistic autistics, but

that should not affect church accommodation, because those who

attend would presumably be people who are practitioners. (In

the case of Christian practioners, I think that would generally

equate to believers.)

Quite apart from the " laying hands " issue, there are some groups

who more broadly consider autistics spiritually unworthy, but I

think they are a statistically insignificant minority.

Regardless, there may be a tendency to think of accommodation of

hidden disabilities a burden on the church as a business

(generally euphemistically described as " the church's mission " ).

The basic issue is that churches, and particularly those whose

income is dependent on the church, do not want to encourage

anything that will diminish the appeal of the church to their

financial supporters.

> For JKP, since they are based in London ... I want to

> make sure that the book remains in American English,

> not edited into British English.

Then I presume they could tell you whether they will accommodate

that. It is very possible that the editors will follow their

own usage unless requested otherwise. Still, it seems that the

first place to look for support would be Key Ministry, because

of their focus on access to churches by people with

hidden disabilities.

A question -- would this be directed to accommodation of

children,

accommodation of adults or both?

- s0

[Guest guest]

> Then I presume they could tell you whether they will accommodate

> that. It is very possible that the editors will follow their

> own usage unless requested otherwise. Still, it seems that the

> first place to look for support would be Key Ministry, because

> of their focus on access to churches by people with

> hidden disabilities.

A search on <Christian publishing companies> brings up a lot, both

regular publishers and self-publishers.

Jane

[Guest guest]

> 335,000, and presumably an equal number of independent religious

> study groups. (so 1 in 100 to 1 in 50 would be 3000 to 7000

> copies.)

Assuming that all those people wanted to and could afford to buy a copy.

The pov I am coming from is that the autistic population is a minority

and the protestant Christian population is a minority, and the

crossover is a very minor minority.

I'd love it if there was more interest, but most people in that

crossover population are not going to be able to finance such a

publication.

And I'd love to be proven wrong, but so far USD2 ... leaves a long way to go.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

> Before anyone judge about the idea of the book, read a little part of the book

and then make up your mind on it based on my writing ability Here is a little

sample of the writing.

Your content is OK, but what concerns me, and the same goes for the

funding webpage, is that your sentence structures are clumsy and your

grammar is often incorrect. That stops it from being an easy,

pleasant read.

Also your style is very informal, which may work for certain kinds of

magazine publications, but is less acceptable in a book.

On your webpage you have a wrong word, " Do " instead of " Due " .

This could be overcome by a really good dedicated proofreader,

perhaps, but that raises the cost quite alot. Or you could put the

project off for a little while and take some English and writing

courses, perhaps. A lot of people who do these find them enjoyable as

well as useful.

I think this is what concerned me about your project in the first

place - details like this make the difference between something coming

across as professional or not - and if you want people to fund and buy

your work it will have to be professional.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

> To self-publish at Crossbooks, it would cost between $1300 to $7000 for the

standard packages, $1400 to $2800 for the color packages, and $7000 to $37000

for the pro packages. This shows that many self-publishing packages are NOT

cheap and they include printing costs, editing, ISBN and copyright registration,

marketing, a limited number of free copies.

> I was looking around before getting a good estimate of how much it would cost

to actually self-publish the book.

Jane, how much did it cost you to publish " Mapping Charlie " , if you

don't mind me asking?

Ruth

[Guest guest]

> Jane, how much did it cost you to publish " Mapping Charlie " , if you

> don't mind me asking?

About $600, but I got no marketing, no editing, no free copies. Also,

I ended up paying another couple hundred dollars for making some

corrections at the " proof " stage and then for buying " review copies "

to send to potential reviewers. I did not pay the extra hundreds of

dollars it would have cost to have the book formated for ebook

readers, which probably is necessary these days.

Jane