Re: Learning/Thinking differences... on the job...

[Guest guest]

i m the same way...i vastly prefer emails to talking to someone one the

phone. i forget what is said, but with an email, i have it to refer to, to

help me remember.

gail

> Come to think of it, I could see other things popping up too as time goes

> on... seems like my supervisors are verbal/auditory thinkers, and I " can

> do " this but it's not natural...

>

> For example, after I send out 5 or so emails regarding things I'm working

> on, the phone call comes through about what I've been doing --> then, after

> explaining a bit of it in words over the phone, it's " oh, you're doing a

> lot. " And I'll ask if the emails were read, just because I don't want to

> repeat the information and bore her, but it sounds like emails are

> generally

> glossed over (as in, [delete]?)

>

> Thanks for any thoughts on this!

>

>

>

> >

> >

> > Hi,

> > I recently had a discussion with someone who would like more

> documentation

> > from me as I'm reading through lots of training materials. However, the

> way

> > I best learn and think is to assimilate large amounts of information and

> > organize it almost in a kinesthetic, visual, " mind's eye " sort of way.

> >

> > As a side note, I had a big noticeable difference in GPA between high

> > school and college, where professors only cared if you learned the

> material

> > and not about seeing " correct " steps of learning (especially had trouble

> in

> > high school math classes for this, despite a 4.0 in advance college

> maths.)

> >

> > So now just recently I replied to the suggestion that the note-taking

> would

> > help learn better, as it did for the person asking for more documentation

> > (auditory/verbal thinker?), that " I found in college that note-taking

> just

> > distracts and slows me down. " After the silence gap, I added, " but of

> course

> > sure I can write down and document more. "

> >

> > I had thought of saying more after the silence about how I am/was a very

> > active-visual-curious-creative type learner, but then thought it best not

> to

> > complicate the situation... Yet just the thought of having to compose

> > acceptable note-taking format for presentation of " what was learned " is

> > taking precious time in which I could be thinking about the

> information...

> >

> > Please share if you relate to this, have you explained differences like

> > this as they related to job function and competence?

> > Thanks!

> > Jeanie

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> So now just recently I replied to the suggestion that the note-taking

> would help learn better, as it did for the person asking for more

> documentation (auditory/verbal thinker?), that " I found in college that

> note-taking just distracts and slows me down. " After the silence gap, I

> added, " but of course sure I can write down and document more. "

Perhaps what you are describing are two different things. If

note taking slows you down and more likely distracts you, that

perhaps suggests that you tend to concentrate when writing.

As to note taking, the alternative to note taking in college are

commercial canned notes or outlines. In law, there are several

styles of these, ranging from Gilberts - outline form, Coif - a

bit of an analysis, and several others. I like that format

because it is easier to just sit back and listen in class,

perhaps taking only a few notes, and then rely on notes of a

corraboration of students hired for the purpose of making up

those commercial outline notes.

Regarding how that applies to work, I think it depends on the

type of work. In any case, you already know your style. The

one exception is that if a person gives instructions, it is

often important to write it down. If the person is giving the

instructions too fast, just explain that you want to " carefully "

write their instructions down so you " get it right " .

If needed, use the analogy that " My words are important to me,

and I think you should expect the same respect for what you

say. " More likely than not, " Lemme write this down " is self-

explanitory. Most managers like it when someone writes down

instructions because the " your words are important " part are

pretty much self-explanitory.

> have you explained differences like this as they

> related to job function and competence?

In my field, writing s___ down is important. Two ancedotes in

this regard:

1. In an aviation technology class during engineering, I was

working with an Iranian student on a weight-and-balance problem.

" Where's the math? "

" I did it in my head. " This was 3 digit long division.

Apparently that's part of Iranian education.

I said that this was impressive, but that skill is not useful

for aircraft w & b calculations.

2. I find it curious that some waitstaff at restaurants will try

to memorize the order rather than write it down. Apparently in

some places, orders are entered on a computer, so the writing is

an extra step. I've learned to expect that they're liable to

get anything " off-list " wrong, resulting in customers

getting " someone else's order " .

- s0

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: Gail Nichols

i m the same way...i vastly prefer emails to talking to someone one the

phone. i forget what is said, but with an email, i have it to refer to, to

help me remember.

**Same here. I never liked talking on the phone. For some reason it stresses

me out. I'm about to get my first cell phone ever. Maybe I'll have to learn

to text after all. Better than talking.

D.

[Guest guest]

Yes, for me it's visual preference over auditory - reading and understanding

very predictably any day, better than who knows what might be heard, lol.

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: Gail Nichols

>

> i m the same way...i vastly prefer emails to talking to someone one the

> phone. i forget what is said, but with an email, i have it to refer to, to

> help me remember.

>

> **Same here. I never liked talking on the phone. For some reason it

> stresses

> me out. I'm about to get my first cell phone ever. Maybe I'll have to learn

>

> to text after all. Better than talking.

>

> D.

>

[Guest guest]

Concentration... when note-taking concentration is on the paper, the

smoothness of the pencil/pen, the exact questions asked (rather than any

material comprehension,) and the correct communication of what I'm writing

on the paper itself for the audience who may read it (rather than any

concentrating at all on even absorbing a word of what is written.) The

problem is, is that if learning takes place in a visual-spatial type field

and goes directly into the mind for subsequent " translation " to the verbal,

then verbal/worded note-taking is not a part of an effective learning

process for that individual. Sure the individual can still spit out and

parrot any words, but for the most effectively meaningful first

comprehension phase, note-taking in a traditional sense just does not seem

work.

I 100% believe that the person asking for the documentation has it in their

very best intentions for me to learn the material.

At the same time it feels like the classic case of an assumption that I

encountered about 99% of the time in grammar/secondary school, and that is,

if the method of study works for " everyone else " then it must work for you

too.

So, when I set about creating a document of notes for the specific purpose

only of creating a document, I first wasted an embarrassing amount of time

finding the right paper for presentation, the right pen/pencil for

presentation, and then wrote the first word and erased it because it was not

" neat enough for presentation. " Then, I took a second sheet and began to do

the same routine, but upon writing and then erasing the first letter I

decided to do something better, if the objective is to learn something. So

I filled the " note-taking " sheet with mostly arrows, symbols, visual

depictions, etc, which make sense to me. Thankfully we work with

'alternative thinkers/learners' and actually, this will be a part of my

direct work, so it's going to be alright.

Regarding that assumption of -- if method of study works for " everyone else "

then it must work for you too -- has anyone verbally in conversation had,

brought up, and discussed these differences with a supervisor of any kind?

How did you open the conversation; what did you say? How did it go?

On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 10:29 PM, Stan's Computer

wrote:

>

>

>

>

> > So now just recently I replied to the suggestion that the note-taking

> > would help learn better, as it did for the person asking for more

> > documentation (auditory/verbal thinker?), that " I found in college that

> > note-taking just distracts and slows me down. " After the silence gap, I

> > added, " but of course sure I can write down and document more. "

>

> Perhaps what you are describing are two different things. If

> note taking slows you down and more likely distracts you, that

> perhaps suggests that you tend to concentrate when writing.

>

> As to note taking, the alternative to note taking in college are

> commercial canned notes or outlines. In law, there are several

> styles of these, ranging from Gilberts - outline form, Coif - a

> bit of an analysis, and several others. I like that format

> because it is easier to just sit back and listen in class,

> perhaps taking only a few notes, and then rely on notes of a

> corraboration of students hired for the purpose of making up

> those commercial outline notes.

>

> Regarding how that applies to work, I think it depends on the

> type of work. In any case, you already know your style. The

> one exception is that if a person gives instructions, it is

> often important to write it down. If the person is giving the

> instructions too fast, just explain that you want to " carefully "

> write their instructions down so you " get it right " .

>

> If needed, use the analogy that " My words are important to me,

> and I think you should expect the same respect for what you

> say. " More likely than not, " Lemme write this down " is self-

> explanitory. Most managers like it when someone writes down

> instructions because the " your words are important " part are

> pretty much self-explanitory.

>

>

> > have you explained differences like this as they

> > related to job function and competence?

>

> In my field, writing s___ down is important. Two ancedotes in

> this regard:

>

> 1. In an aviation technology class during engineering, I was

> working with an Iranian student on a weight-and-balance problem.

> " Where's the math? "

> " I did it in my head. " This was 3 digit long division.

> Apparently that's part of Iranian education.

> I said that this was impressive, but that skill is not useful

> for aircraft w & b calculations.

>

> 2. I find it curious that some waitstaff at restaurants will try

> to memorize the order rather than write it down. Apparently in

> some places, orders are entered on a computer, so the writing is

> an extra step. I've learned to expect that they're liable to

> get anything " off-list " wrong, resulting in customers

> getting " someone else's order " .

>

> - s0

>