Re: Changing from Cytomel to Armour

[Guest guest]

WOW yes you need to get that ferritin back up. The Armoru would go

straight into RT3 mode again with it that low. I owuld then get 30mg

Armoru if you can and start wht adding 30mg in the AM . wait 2 weeks

thne add another 30mg Armoru and removing 10mcg T3.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Birrdyy,

Why can't you stay on the T3? Unless I missed some of the thread, I

thought you felt better on T3 and were almost optimized, maybe needing

a small raise.

I'm on armour with high RT3, and low ferritin. I have hypo symptoms

and cannot raise it without getting a combination of hyper/hypo

symptoms. More raises bring my temps down!

When I switched to armour from T4, my doc didn't know what dose to put

me on. He gave me rx for 1/4 gr. (15 mg.) and 1/2 gr. (30 mg.). I

carried them around, took when I felt I needed them and recorded when

and how much. I ended up taking the same amounts at the same time

each day, that is how we found my dose.

-

>

> WOW yes you need to get that ferritin back up. The Armoru would go

> straight into RT3 mode again with it that low. I owuld then get 30mg

> Armoru if you can and start wht adding 30mg in the AM . wait 2 weeks

> thne add another 30mg Armoru and removing 10mcg T3.

[Guest guest]

Thanks Val. I'm glad I mentioned the ferritan situation. I always miss these connections. I'm back on the iron and will wait to add any T4 to the mix.

On that same note.....I really think I need to increase my T3 again. I am soooooo freckin fatigued, swollen eyelids and my throat (thryoid area) is bothering me for the first time in my life. Can I be adding more T3 with ferritan at 37 or should I wait with that as well.

Ferritan actually went from 117 (9/8/8) to 101 (10/9) and then to 37 (11/17).....in one month, wow. At 101 I thought I'd be fine stopping the ferritan but I guess not. The combo of not taking iron and going more hypo did my ferritan in.

WOW yes you need to get that ferritin back up. The Armoru would go straight into RT3 mode again with it that low. I owuld then get 30mg Armoru if you can and start wht adding 30mg in the AM . wait 2 weeks

thne add another 30mg Armoru and removing 10mcg T3.-- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WVhttp://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I can stay on T3 if I want to switch doctors. Believe me I'm seconds from it. It's the whole deal with my " insurance " doctor wanting to add Synthroid to the Cytomel. He says it's not physiological to do just T3 and I agree but am worried about maybe making more RT3 again. I know it's best to do a combo of T4/T3 preferrably with Armour but I haven't done that yet. I know that Val's doctor likes that better than all T3 if a person can make it work and I understand the thinking, I really do.

I was almost optimized at 65 maybe needing only 5 or 10 more but doc did not like TSH at .05. He's reasonable, is welling to work with patients but says that TSH is not good. Is not totally obsessed with it and is fine if it's even at .2 or .3 (.4 being the lowest in range) but only if I add some T4 to the mix. See, it's hard to walk away from someone who is willing to work with you. The only thing that is pushing me away from him is that when I asked him what I can do to feel better if I can't go up on the T3 and he said, maybe this is as good as it gets. Notttttttttttttttt!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can't do anything, go anywhere and yesterday I was in bed all day long. That screams, find another doctor, I know. I'm sure that's what I'll wind up doing. Most doctors say, we'll get you better not, this is all there is.

So, you see my delimna with regard to Cytomel over a T4/T3 combo.

Birrdyy,Why can't you stay on the T3? Unless I missed some of the thread, Ithought you felt better on T3 and were almost optimized, maybe needinga small raise.I'm on armour with high RT3, and low ferritin. I have hypo symptoms

and cannot raise it without getting a combination of hyper/hyposymptoms. More raises bring my temps down!When I switched to armour from T4, my doc didn't know what dose to putme on. He gave me rx for 1/4 gr. (15 mg.) and 1/2 gr. (30 mg.). I

carried them around, took when I felt I needed them and recorded whenand how much. I ended up taking the same amounts at the same timeeach day, that is how we found my dose.- >> WOW yes you need to get that ferritin back up. The Armoru would go

> straight into RT3 mode again with it that low. I owuld then get 30mg > Armoru if you can and start wht adding 30mg in the AM . wait 2 weeks > thne add another 30mg Armoru and removing 10mcg T3.

[Guest guest]

I would not raise T3 either! IN fact it is most likely your low Ferritin

causing your fatigue. AND making you more hypo.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Okey dokey. Thanks.

But.....the fatigue is the same as when I was on 65 T3 and almost there. There was one day where I felt normal. That was the only day I ever had 98.6 averaged temps but I believe around that time is also when basal was 98. So close, yet so far. I will however wait until ferritan is up again. Just when I thought something (ferritan) was in place nice a neat.

I would not raise T3 either! IN fact it is most likely your low Ferritin causing your fatigue. AND making you more hypo. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WVhttp://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Just had another thought.....do you think since I'm taking less T3 (50 from 65) I should try and lower HC (35). I'm also on 3/4 pill of Florinef. My BP has been running high normal and I wonder if the HC with such a low dose of T3 will bring that up any?? In the doctors office yesterday it was 128/88 but I just took it several times and it's anywhere from 138/94 to 146/102. Not to sure how accurate my machine is. The 128/88 seems more like it but the other numbers make me nervous. At the doctors I usually have like 140/90 or 130/80 ish. I do get very nervous at doctor appointment.

I would not raise T3 either! IN fact it is most likely your low Ferritin causing your fatigue. AND making you more hypo. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WVhttp://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

You could try lowering ti but if you go too low it will come back to

haunt you.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Actually, I tried to a couple of weeks ago and it didn't work. Every upsetting phone conversation I would get shakey. So, you don't think that the HC with less T3 has anything to do with the weird BP?

You could try lowering ti but if you go too low it will come back to haunt you. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WVhttp://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

It is hard to say all you can do s try it.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Birrdyy,

Not having the right doctor is SO stressful! You wouldn't believe how

many doctors have tried to get me back on all T4. And the speeches,

and how much they believe in it, yadda yadda. But I've already taken

it and done bad on it, so I am not going to let my health get worse

just to satisfy them.

I'm not so sure this doc is really willing to work with you. On T3 or

armour, your TSH will never be what he wants. Both of these make your

TSH very low. My doc at least knows that, he told me that to get TSH

to even register he would have to drastically reduce, maybe take me

off of thyroid meds! And of course he won't do that, so you follow the

free T3 and free T4. (that might be where my problem will be if I go

on all T3, stay tuned)

If you can't find a good spot on all T3, then maybe a little armour,

maybe!! (When I try a new prescription, I ask the pharmacist to let me

buy 5-10 tabs. That way if the pork allergy comes up, you won't have

too many you can't use).

Hope it works out for you soon!

>

> Hi ,

>

> I can stay on T3 if I want to switch doctors. Believe me I'm

seconds from

> it. It's the whole deal with my " insurance " doctor wanting to add

Synthroid

> to the Cytomel. He says it's not physiological to do just T3 and I

agree

> but am worried about maybe making more RT3 again. I know it's

best to do

> a combo of T4/T3 preferrably with Armour but I haven't done that yet. I

> know that Val's doctor likes that better than all T3 if a person can

make it

> work and I understand the thinking, I really do.

>

> I was almost optimized at 65 maybe needing only 5 or 10 more but doc

did not

> like TSH at .05. He's reasonable, is welling to work with patients

but says

> that TSH is not good. Is not totally obsessed with it and is fine

if it's

> even at .2 or .3 (.4 being the lowest in range) but only if I add

some T4 to

> the mix. See, it's hard to walk away from someone who is willing to

work

> with you. The only thing that is pushing me away from him is that

when I

> asked him what I can do to feel better if I can't go up on the T3 and he

> said, maybe this is as good as it gets.

Notttttttttttttttt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> Can't do anything, go anywhere and yesterday I was in bed all day long.

> That screams, find another doctor, I know. I'm sure that's what

I'll wind

> up doing. Most doctors say, we'll get you better not, this is all

there is.

>

> So, you see my delimna with regard to Cytomel over a T4/T3 combo.

[Guest guest]

, that's so great that you have a doctor who doesn't think it's bad to have a completely suppressed TSH. The ONLY reason I'm still there (with this doctor) is that I do believe that a more complete thryoid treatment is really the thing to do, if you can and don't make yourself worse. Having said that, my good doctor says we don't need T4 which of course confuses me even more. On top of that Val's doctor says he prefers people on T4/T3 and I put a ton of weight behind what he says. So you see the problem. To many cooks in the kitchen.

What always gets me and I let them do this everytime......is I think they are so adament and seem to really to the core of their being believe what they say. It takes me a couple of days to recover from that and see that just because they believe it doesn't make it so.

I will see him maybe one more time after maybe trying Armour or Synthroid and if he tells me again, this is as good as get then I'm out of there. Doctors should say, we will do what it takes to make you better not,this is it, deal with it. I guess that alone should've made me walk out.

Thanks for all the suggestions and all the pepp talks.

Birrdyy,Not having the right doctor is SO stressful! You wouldn't believe howmany doctors have tried to get me back on all T4. And the speeches,and how much they believe in it, yadda yadda. But I've already taken

it and done bad on it, so I am not going to let my health get worsejust to satisfy them.I'm not so sure this doc is really willing to work with you. On T3 orarmour, your TSH will never be what he wants. Both of these make your

TSH very low. My doc at least knows that, he told me that to get TSHto even register he would have to drastically reduce, maybe take meoff of thyroid meds! And of course he won't do that, so you follow the

free T3 and free T4. (that might be where my problem will be if I goon all T3, stay tuned)If you can't find a good spot on all T3, then maybe a little armour,maybe!! (When I try a new prescription, I ask the pharmacist to let me

buy 5-10 tabs. That way if the pork allergy comes up, you won't havetoo many you can't use).Hope it works out for you soon!

>> Hi ,> > I can stay on T3 if I want to switch doctors. Believe me I'mseconds from> it. It's the whole deal with my " insurance " doctor wanting to addSynthroid

> to the Cytomel. He says it's not physiological to do just T3 and Iagree> but am worried about maybe making more RT3 again. I know it'sbest to do> a combo of T4/T3 preferrably with Armour but I haven't done that yet. I

> know that Val's doctor likes that better than all T3 if a person canmake it> work and I understand the thinking, I really do.> > I was almost optimized at 65 maybe needing only 5 or 10 more but doc

did not> like TSH at .05. He's reasonable, is welling to work with patientsbut says> that TSH is not good. Is not totally obsessed with it and is fineif it's> even at .2 or .3 (.4 being the lowest in range) but only if I add

some T4 to> the mix. See, it's hard to walk away from someone who is willing towork> with you. The only thing that is pushing me away from him is thatwhen I> asked him what I can do to feel better if I can't go up on the T3 and he

> said, maybe this is as good as it gets. Notttttttttttttttt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!> Can't do anything, go anywhere and yesterday I was in bed all day long.> That screams, find another doctor, I know. I'm sure that's what

I'll wind> up doing. Most doctors say, we'll get you better not, this is allthere is.> > So, you see my delimna with regard to Cytomel over a T4/T3 combo.

[Guest guest]

birrdyy wrote:

> I do believe that a more complete thryoid treatment is really the

> thing to do, if you can and don't make yourself worse.

That is the key---IF you don't make yourself worse.

>

> they are so adament and seem to really to the core of their being

> believe what they say.

Yeah, too bad they aren't the ones to suffer the consequences when their

dedicated beliefs do not fit the patient.

sol

[Guest guest]

Amen on both counts, Sol.

birrdyy wrote:> I do believe that a more complete thryoid treatment is really the > thing to do, if you can and don't make yourself worse.That is the key---IF you don't make yourself worse. > > they are so adament and seem to really to the core of their being > believe what they say. Yeah, too bad they aren't the ones to suffer the consequences when their

dedicated beliefs do not fit the patient.sol

[Guest guest]

Don't totally use MY doctor's ideas on this. Much as I love him, he is

NOYT the formost expert on this as he does not HAVE hypo! I am the

expert on my body and why I love him is HE agrees with this! He has

seen me crash tyring to add Armour back in and says to use my own

judgement! Now THAT is a good doctor.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Thanks Val.

On RTH someone mentioned something about a friends mother who was on T3 only for many years and developed heart and lung problems that they attribute to T3 only. I asked if this was a " good " doc or a tow the line kind of doctor. The person didn't know. Have you read anything about this. I know Dr. Lowe has been on a high dose for what 25 years and doesn't seem to have any problems.

Any thoughts on this?

Don't totally use MY doctor's ideas on this. Much as I love him, he is NOYT the formost expert on this as he does not HAVE hypo! I am the expert on my body and why I love him is HE agrees with this! He has

seen me crash tyring to add Armour back in and says to use my own judgement! Now THAT is a good doctor.-- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WVhttp://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Heart probelms are more likely to be from LOW thyroid or way too much

T3. Lung issues I wouod have to suspect adrenal. You need to know a lot

more detils to really believe an accusation like that. T3 has fixed my

heart troubles for th most part. I have some heart weakness from the

time I was in Myexedema but as thye only gave me less than 2 years to

live, I would say that is to be expected. If I had been on T3 or Amrour

YEARS before then i would not have this damage today. of that I am certain.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Thanks Val for the reassurance. I should've thought about your situation before getting to concerned about what this other person said. If you think about it, she could've developed these problems anyway.

Heart probelms are more likely to be from LOW thyroid or way too much T3. Lung issues I wouod have to suspect adrenal. You need to know a lot more detils to really believe an accusation like that. T3 has fixed my

heart troubles for th most part. I have some heart weakness from the time I was in Myexedema but as thye only gave me less than 2 years to live, I would say that is to be expected. If I had been on T3 or Amrour

YEARS before then i would not have this damage today. of that I am certain. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WVhttp://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

http://jtcs.ctsnetjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/98/5/972

If this doesn;t set your mind at ease aout T3 and the heart.. nothing

wilL! LOL BTW I also learned that T3 regenerates the LIVER! I found

that when my cat had the liver idsease. I switxhed him from Armour to T3

and he has done SO much better on it I have kept him on it.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Fantastic info. Thanks billions.

Sometimes someone sneaks into your head and confuses you. Doctors do this to me all the time and it takes me a couple of days to get them out of my head.

http://jtcs.ctsnetjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/98/5/972If this doesn;t set your mind at ease aout T3 and the heart.. nothing

wilL! LOL BTW I also learned that T3 regenerates the LIVER! I found that when my cat had the liver idsease. I switxhed him from Armour to T3 and he has done SO much better on it I have kept him on it. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WVhttp://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Triiodothyronine is the long name for T3.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/