Re: Lupron - role in Shrinking One's Prostate?

[Guest guest]

That is very, very interesting to hear. The main reason that I opted for surgery instead of seeding was to avoid Lupron to shrink the prostate. The other reason is that I have ulcerative colitis and was concerned about the rectal side effects of seeding.

Louis. . . .

Lupron - role in Shrinking One's Prostate?

I started my new treatment, for Seeding/Brachythera py, with a brandnew Urologist, new Radiation Oncologist, and new Seeding Center inwestern Florida. Previously, as many of you may recall, I was anearly 5% of (1) sample out of (12), gleasons 3+3=6, state T1C,Bostwick Labs biopsy report - patient. And my previous Urologist,had me on Lupron/Casodex total deprevation medication, for thepast 11 months. His goal, which he accomplished with Lupron/Casaodex,was to shrink my prostate from 80 to 40 or less - so that Seedingcould be accomplished. This he accomplished.My new urologist today, at the Florida Cancer Institute in ville, FL (45 miles north of Tampa), advised me "...I wishyou had come to me 11 months ago." "There was no reason to go theLupron/Casodex deprivation route to shrink your prostate." He said in essence, one does not need to go on Lupron/Casodex -as a means of just shrinking

one's large prostate glands downfor eventual Seeding/Brachythera py! "It is not needed!" "You caneasily do the shrinking with radiation, and thus avoid totaldrepreviation Lupron/Casodex and their unwanted side effects!"This is a total eye opener to me, now 11 months into this.If only I had known to have gone to this much more competentUrology/Radiation Oncology Center. Would have made life mucheasier. All I can suggest, if you're Urologist/RadiationOncologist is suggesting, after your initial Volume Study,that you should go on Lupron/Casodex total deprivationtherapy to shrink you gland for seeding - I would either directly question him on this, or I'd get a 2nd opinion. Ask you're Radiation/Oncologis t why this shrinking cannot beaccomplished with radiation therapy?I was surprised not to have seen anything on this on thisboard, in the last 12 months.FredSpring Hill,

FLFlorida Cancer Institute, ville, FL

[Guest guest]

there is now some recent presentations suggesting that 4 months of androgen deprivation prior to radiation for high risk patients is sufficient, and superior ot radiation alone for that subgourp of patients. It does not appear that you are at high risk though, so new MD may be correct in stating that your androgen deprivation was unnecessary. sun4fj wrote: I started my new treatment, for Seeding/Brachytherapy, with a brandnew Urologist, new Radiation Oncologist, and new Seeding Center inwestern Florida.

Previously, as many of you may recall, I was anearly 5% of (1) sample out of (12), gleasons 3+3=6, state T1C,Bostwick Labs biopsy report - patient. And my previous Urologist,had me on Lupron/Casodex total deprevation medication, for thepast 11 months. His goal, which he accomplished with Lupron/Casaodex,was to shrink my prostate from 80 to 40 or less - so that Seedingcould be accomplished. This he accomplished.My new urologist today, at the Florida Cancer Institute in ville, FL (45 miles north of Tampa), advised me "...I wishyou had come to me 11 months ago." "There was no reason to go theLupron/Casodex deprivation route to shrink your prostate." He said in essence, one does not need to go on Lupron/Casodex -as a means of just shrinking one's large prostate glands downfor eventual Seeding/Brachytherapy! "It is not needed!" "You caneasily do the shrinking with radiation, and thus avoid

totaldrepreviation Lupron/Casodex and their unwanted side effects!"This is a total eye opener to me, now 11 months into this.If only I had known to have gone to this much more competentUrology/Radiation Oncology Center. Would have made life mucheasier. All I can suggest, if you're Urologist/RadiationOncologist is suggesting, after your initial Volume Study,that you should go on Lupron/Casodex total deprivationtherapy to shrink you gland for seeding - I would either directly question him on this, or I'd get a 2nd opinion. Ask you're Radiation/Oncologist why this shrinking cannot beaccomplished with radiation therapy?I was surprised not to have seen anything on this on thisboard, in the last 12 months.FredSpring Hill, FLFlorida Cancer Institute, ville, FL

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[Guest guest]

There are good reasons for incouding ADT in the protocol.

Conceivably you may be cured at this point and not even need

radiation, though I wouldn't bet on it. There's a lot of evidence

that ADT combined with radiation has better outcomes than radiation

only. What was your PSA and what is it now?

I'd be as much worried about the radiation oncologist giving you this

advice now, than the urologist who put you onto ADT.

>

> I started my new treatment, for Seeding/Brachytherapy, with a brand

> new Urologist, new Radiation Oncologist, and new Seeding Center in

> western Florida. Previously, as many of you may recall, I was an

> early 5% of (1) sample out of (12), gleasons 3+3=6, state T1C,

> Bostwick Labs biopsy report - patient. And my previous Urologist,

> had me on Lupron/Casodex total deprevation medication, for the

> past 11 months. His goal, which he accomplished with

Lupron/Casaodex,

> was to shrink my prostate from 80 to 40 or less - so that Seeding

> could be accomplished. This he accomplished.

>

> My new urologist today, at the Florida Cancer Institute in

> ville, FL (45 miles north of Tampa), advised me " ...I wish

> you had come to me 11 months ago. " " There was no reason to go the

> Lupron/Casodex deprivation route to shrink your prostate. " He

> said in essence, one does not need to go on Lupron/Casodex -

> as a means of just shrinking one's large prostate glands down

> for eventual Seeding/Brachytherapy! " It is not needed! " " You can

> easily do the shrinking with radiation, and thus avoid total

> drepreviation Lupron/Casodex and their unwanted side effects! "

>

> This is a total eye opener to me, now 11 months into this.

> If only I had known to have gone to this much more competent

> Urology/Radiation Oncology Center. Would have made life much

> easier. All I can suggest, if you're Urologist/Radiation

> Oncologist is suggesting, after your initial Volume Study,

> that you should go on Lupron/Casodex total deprivation

> therapy to shrink you gland for seeding - I would either directly

> question him on this, or I'd get a 2nd opinion. Ask you're

> Radiation/Oncologist why this shrinking cannot be

> accomplished with radiation therapy?

>

> I was surprised not to have seen anything on this on this

> board, in the last 12 months.

>

> Fred

> Spring Hill, FL

> Florida Cancer Institute, ville, FL

>

[Guest guest]

>

> ... And my previous Urologist,

> had me on Lupron/Casodex total deprevation medication, for the

> past 11 months. His goal, which he accomplished with Lupron/Casaodex,

> was to shrink my prostate from 80 to 40 or less - so that Seeding

> could be accomplished. This he accomplished.

Administering Lupron prior to, during, and somewhat after radiation

is very common and actually has two intended effects. One is to

shrink the prostate. The other is to weaken the tumor cells and

make them more susceptible to radiation damage.

I have never heard of using Lupron for 11 months before. The usual

prescription seems to be for 2 months before radiation.

> My new urologist today, at the Florida Cancer Institute in

> ville, FL (45 miles north of Tampa), advised me " ...I wish

> you had come to me 11 months ago. " " There was no reason to go the

> Lupron/Casodex deprivation route to shrink your prostate. " He

> said in essence, one does not need to go on Lupron/Casodex -

> as a means of just shrinking one's large prostate glands down

> for eventual Seeding/Brachytherapy! " It is not needed! " " You can

> easily do the shrinking with radiation, and thus avoid total

> drepreviation Lupron/Casodex and their unwanted side effects! "

>

> This is a total eye opener to me. ...

This is new to me too. It may be that your new doctors are doing

something that is fairly new to everyone.

If this is a new approach, it has the obvious advantage of not

requiring Lupron, but I wonder if any clinical trials have been

done to show whether, long term, it has the same benefits for

cancer control.

> If only I had known to have gone to this much more competent

> Urology/Radiation Oncology Center. Would have made life much

> easier. All I can suggest, if you're Urologist/Radiation

> Oncologist is suggesting, after your initial Volume Study,

> that you should go on Lupron/Casodex total deprivation

> therapy to shrink you gland for seeding - I would either directly

> question him on this, or I'd get a 2nd opinion. Ask you're

> Radiation/Oncologist why this shrinking cannot be

> accomplished with radiation therapy?

>

> I was surprised not to have seen anything on this on this

> board, in the last 12 months.

Apparently others haven't heard of it either.

I know you must feel bad about having had Lupron for all that

time and not needing it. Lupron is a bummer. No doubt about

it. However you might derive some consolation in knowing that

clinical trials have shown that the statistical odds of

successful long term cancer control are enhanced by the Lupron.

The number of cancer recurrences is lower for men who had Lupron

plus radiation than radiation alone.

You paid a big price, but you may have gotten something useful in

return for it.

Alan

[Guest guest]

Alan -

A urologist cannot shrink a LARGE prostate gland, down to

seeding size with Lupron or with Lupron/Casodex (total) -

in less than like 6 or 7 month miniumum. I believe my

radiation oncologist told me 40 was a target shrunk

size for seeding. Mine started at 80, and

now has shrunk to like 38 or so. Still shrinking.

Now my new radiation oncologist, who spends his practice at

100% of only prostate patients, advises in my very early-found

diagnosis back in Feb. 07 - he could have easily done the

whole shrink with no Lupron. He didn't elaborate, as it

doesn't apply to me.

Fred

Spring Hill, FL

> >

> > ... And my previous Urologist,

> > had me on Lupron/Casodex total deprevation medication, for the

> > past 11 months. His goal, which he accomplished with

Lupron/Casaodex,

> > was to shrink my prostate from 80 to 40 or less - so that Seeding

> > could be accomplished. This he accomplished.

>

> Administering Lupron prior to, during, and somewhat after radiation

> is very common and actually has two intended effects. One is to

> shrink the prostate. The other is to weaken the tumor cells and

> make them more susceptible to radiation damage.

>

> I have never heard of using Lupron for 11 months before. The usual

> prescription seems to be for 2 months before radiation.

>

> > My new urologist today, at the Florida Cancer Institute in

> > ville, FL (45 miles north of Tampa), advised me " ...I wish

> > you had come to me 11 months ago. " " There was no reason to go the

> > Lupron/Casodex deprivation route to shrink your prostate. " He

> > said in essence, one does not need to go on Lupron/Casodex -

> > as a means of just shrinking one's large prostate glands down

> > for eventual Seeding/Brachytherapy! " It is not needed! " " You can

> > easily do the shrinking with radiation, and thus avoid total

> > drepreviation Lupron/Casodex and their unwanted side effects! "

> >

> > This is a total eye opener to me. ...

>

> This is new to me too. It may be that your new doctors are doing

> something that is fairly new to everyone.

>

> If this is a new approach, it has the obvious advantage of not

> requiring Lupron, but I wonder if any clinical trials have been

> done to show whether, long term, it has the same benefits for

> cancer control.

>

> > If only I had known to have gone to this much more competent

> > Urology/Radiation Oncology Center. Would have made life much

> > easier. All I can suggest, if you're Urologist/Radiation

> > Oncologist is suggesting, after your initial Volume Study,

> > that you should go on Lupron/Casodex total deprivation

> > therapy to shrink you gland for seeding - I would either directly

> > question him on this, or I'd get a 2nd opinion. Ask you're

> > Radiation/Oncologist why this shrinking cannot be

> > accomplished with radiation therapy?

> >

> > I was surprised not to have seen anything on this on this

> > board, in the last 12 months.

>

> Apparently others haven't heard of it either.

>

> I know you must feel bad about having had Lupron for all that

> time and not needing it. Lupron is a bummer. No doubt about

> it. However you might derive some consolation in knowing that

> clinical trials have shown that the statistical odds of

> successful long term cancer control are enhanced by the Lupron.

> The number of cancer recurrences is lower for men who had Lupron

> plus radiation than radiation alone.

>

> You paid a big price, but you may have gotten something useful in

> return for it.

>

> Alan

>

[Guest guest]

If I were you I would certainly ask him to elaborate and I would take

notes. If he knows something new, please let us know!

Fuller

> > >

> > > ... And my previous Urologist,

> > > had me on Lupron/Casodex total deprevation medication, for the

> > > past 11 months. His goal, which he accomplished with

> Lupron/Casaodex,

> > > was to shrink my prostate from 80 to 40 or less - so that

Seeding

> > > could be accomplished. This he accomplished.

> >

> > Administering Lupron prior to, during, and somewhat after

radiation

> > is very common and actually has two intended effects. One is to

> > shrink the prostate. The other is to weaken the tumor cells and

> > make them more susceptible to radiation damage.

> >

> > I have never heard of using Lupron for 11 months before. The

usual

> > prescription seems to be for 2 months before radiation.

> >

> > > My new urologist today, at the Florida Cancer Institute in

> > > ville, FL (45 miles north of Tampa), advised me " ...I wish

> > > you had come to me 11 months ago. " " There was no reason to go

the

> > > Lupron/Casodex deprivation route to shrink your prostate. " He

> > > said in essence, one does not need to go on Lupron/Casodex -

> > > as a means of just shrinking one's large prostate glands down

> > > for eventual Seeding/Brachytherapy! " It is not needed! " " You

can

> > > easily do the shrinking with radiation, and thus avoid total

> > > drepreviation Lupron/Casodex and their unwanted side effects! "

> > >

> > > This is a total eye opener to me. ...

> >

> > This is new to me too. It may be that your new doctors are doing

> > something that is fairly new to everyone.

> >

> > If this is a new approach, it has the obvious advantage of not

> > requiring Lupron, but I wonder if any clinical trials have been

> > done to show whether, long term, it has the same benefits for

> > cancer control.

> >

> > > If only I had known to have gone to this much more competent

> > > Urology/Radiation Oncology Center. Would have made life much

> > > easier. All I can suggest, if you're Urologist/Radiation

> > > Oncologist is suggesting, after your initial Volume Study,

> > > that you should go on Lupron/Casodex total deprivation

> > > therapy to shrink you gland for seeding - I would either

directly

> > > question him on this, or I'd get a 2nd opinion. Ask you're

> > > Radiation/Oncologist why this shrinking cannot be

> > > accomplished with radiation therapy?

> > >

> > > I was surprised not to have seen anything on this on this

> > > board, in the last 12 months.

> >

> > Apparently others haven't heard of it either.

> >

> > I know you must feel bad about having had Lupron for all that

> > time and not needing it. Lupron is a bummer. No doubt about

> > it. However you might derive some consolation in knowing that

> > clinical trials have shown that the statistical odds of

> > successful long term cancer control are enhanced by the Lupron.

> > The number of cancer recurrences is lower for men who had Lupron

> > plus radiation than radiation alone.

> >

> > You paid a big price, but you may have gotten something useful in

> > return for it.

> >

> > Alan

> >

>