Re: Tertroxin Week 8 Update

[Guest guest]

You say BP and temps and pulse stayed the same, what are they?

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Hi Val,

My BP & HR have always been quite high.

BP currently at rest ~ 150/100 & HR ~80-100.

This is MUCH lower (by at least 30 points BP & 10bpm HR) than before

Pred & Florinef though. My BP also now consistently rises at least 10

points on rising since Florinef as well.

Note BEFORE Florinef my temps including basals were always HIGH.

AFTER Florinef dropped a lot to HypoT levels. They improved as Sex

Hormones, Vit D, B12 etc were optimised. They also improved more as

NTH was increased. However despite that energy levels, motivation,

exercise tolerance & weight issues remained unresolved.Hence started

RT3 clearing protocol.

My Basal temps, daily averages, mid avo temps are all still at or

very close to optimal levels.

-Basal temps usually 36.6 C (97.9 F)

-Mid avo temps ~37C (98.6 F)

-Note my daily av temp is VERY steady at 37 C (98.6 F)

-Occassionally on the T3 protocol my basal has dipped to 36.2-36.4 C

(97.16-97.52 F). Is usually when I increased my T3 meds. It returns

to normal within 2-3 days.

I had mentioned these previously & you said to just monitor for any

change and in particular to watch HR did not get further elevated.

Lethal Lee

------------------------------------------------------------------

>

> You say BP and temps and pulse stayed the same, what are they?

>

> --

> Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

>

> http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

>

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

> http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

>

[Guest guest]

Your BP is sitl at a worrisome level. What potassium level do you try to

keep ? Potassium DOES lower BP, but I hate to tell you to take more if you

have acheived a good bnalance.

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Thanks for you concern Val,

My BP has been thoroughly investigated over the past 8 years since

the problem first appeared immediately after my Gallbladder Surgery.

Prior to the surgery my BP was always on the low side 100/60-80. Even

when pregnant full term with twins it never went above 137/90.

I have had 24 hour BP monitoring on 3 separate occassions including

earlier this year. My BP does go down at night so the 24 hour

average is better than the daytime BPs. I have had EKG, Stress EKG

etc seen a Cardiologist all is fine & given OK.

I am already on 3000mg RX Potassium 1 1/2 tabs Florinef. My Potassium

levels are around 4.2-4.3 on those meds & supps. Sodium is usually

143-145. I dont have any low Aldo Sodium & Potassium symptoms now

though I certainly did have quite severe ones before.

I also only recently started sleeping through the night (2 1/2 months

ago) after 8 years of sleep issues. Prior to that I rarely was able

to sleep at night at all. The turnaround happened very suddenly after

fixing Sex hormones (Estrogen Dominance & both E2 & Prog low) &

Androgens ( DHEAS & Testosterone almost NIL) which were all very low.

I hope that the return to good sleep & getting UNHYPOT will get my BP

even lower. I also just recently started some light exercise after

not being able to do that for some time. All will help I think.

My Doc is very happy where I am now compared to where I used to be.

All moving in the right direction anyway.

Lethal Lee

--------------------------------------------------------

In RT3_T3 , " T " wrote:

>

> Your BP is sitl at a worrisome level. What potassium level do you

try to

> keep ? Potassium DOES lower BP, but I hate to tell you to take more

if you

> have acheived a good bnalance.

> Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

>

> http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

>

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

> http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Val,

As per your suggested raising schedule I have continued as follows

1)Increased by 10mcg to 110 mcg from 29th Ocober (week 9)

2)Increased by another 10mcg to 120mcg from 7th November (10 days

later)Week 10 1/2

3) Due to increase another 10mcg on 16th November (10 days later)

Week 12

Things continue the same as before. No change BP HR or temps.

Some reduction in water retention, a little reduction in weight.

Energy slightly better I am walking 30-40 mins 2-3 times a week

needing a small 4 mg HC stress dose (in advance)when I do. Been

walking for last few weeks only first exercise I have been able to do

for over a year.

Have had no further episodes of HyperT shakes since back in week 6

when I stopped for 2 days & started back at lower dose.

Due to have second Phleb for Hemochromatosis management on 30th

November. Went well last time stress dosed 8mg HC on the day as per

your advice. Will do the same again for next one.

I will have new Labs drawn for TSH, Frees, Abs & RT3 at Week 12 &

will report results when I do. RT3 will take some weeks to get back

unfortunately (took 6 weeks last time). Other results will get back

within 1-2 days.

Due to see my Doc next on 2nd December when I hope to persuade her

to continue on T3 as I feel so much better on it.

Anything to add/suggest Val?

Lethal Lee

----------------------------------------------------------------

> >

> > Your BP is sitl at a worrisome level. What potassium level do you

> try to

> > keep ? Potassium DOES lower BP, but I hate to tell you to take

more

> if you

> > have acheived a good bnalance.

> > Artistic Grooming- Hurricane

WV

> >

> > http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

> >

> http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

> >

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Val,

As per your suggested raising schedule I have continued as follows

1)Increased by 10mcg to 110 mcg from 29th Ocober (week 9)

2)Increased by another 10mcg to 120mcg from 7th November (10 days

later)Week 10 1/2

3) Due to increase another 10mcg on 16th November (10 days later)

Week 12

Things continue the same as before. No change BP HR or temps.

Some reduction in water retention, a little reduction in weight.

Energy slightly better I am walking 30-40 mins 2-3 times a week

needing a small 4 mg HC stress dose (in advance)when I do. Been

walking for last few weeks only first exercise I have been able to do

for over a year.

Have had no further episodes of HyperT shakes since back in week 6

when I stopped for 2 days & started back at lower dose.

Due to have second Phleb for Hemochromatosis management on 30th

November. Went well last time stress dosed 8mg HC on the day as per

your advice. Will do the same again for next one.

I will have new Labs drawn for TSH, Frees, Abs & RT3 at Week 12 &

will report results when I do. RT3 will take some weeks to get back

unfortunately (took 6 weeks last time). Other results will get back

within 1-2 days.

Due to see my Doc next on 2nd December when I hope to persuade her

to continue on T3 as I feel so much better on it.

Anything to add/suggest Val?

Lethal Lee

----------------------------------------------------------------

> >

> > Your BP is sitl at a worrisome level. What potassium level do you

> try to

> > keep ? Potassium DOES lower BP, but I hate to tell you to take

more

> if you

> > have acheived a good bnalance.

> > Artistic Grooming- Hurricane

WV

> >

> > http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

> >

> http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

> >

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

> >

>

[Guest guest]

What's to addd! LOL Sounds liek you are doign great! Just more of the same

and I htink you are over the worst of the hump now. I sure wish I could

exercise but my work days take all I have and some days, then some... But i

have not been able to do much by way of exercisein many years so I guess

thta is part of MY problem aswell!

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Hi Val,

Sorry for the length Val but wanted to let you know what has been

going on.

UPDATE Week 14 on Tertroxin

1)Increased by 10mcg to 110 mcg from 29th October (week 9)

2)Increased by another 10mcg to 120mcg from 7th November (Week 10 1/2)

3)Increased by another 10mcg to 130mcg on 16th November (Week 12)

4)Increased by another 10mcg to 140mcg on 25th November (Week 13)

5) Due to increase another 10mcg to 150mcg on 4th December

Had some tests done this morning results as follows

===========================================================

6th July 2008

NTH on 255mg(4 1/4 grains) for 9 days at time of this test

Tested 8 am.

Last NTH dose taken 12 hours before test

Started Prednisolone 5 months prior to this test.

TSH.......................0.01 U/L (0.4-4.0)

FT4..........................22 pmol/L (9-24) *87% of OLD Ref Range

FT3.........................6.6 pmol/L (2.6-6.6) *Top of OLD Ref Range

TPOAb.............less than 1 IU/mL (less than 5.6)

TGAb.......................2.2 IU/mL (less than 4.1) *54% of Ref Range

Started Tertroxin (T3 only)in early Sept

1st December 2008

Tested 9am

Tertroxin on 140mcg for 7 days at time of test

Last Tertroxin dose taken 9 hours before test

Started Prednisolone 10 months prior to this test.

TSH...............less than 0.01 U/L (0.4-4.0)

FT4...............less than 5 pmol/L (9-24) *below range to be

expected on T3 meds

FT3.........................23 pmol/L (2.6-6.6) *VERY elevated

TPOAb.............less than 1 IU/mL (less than 5.6)

TGAb.......................5.1 IU/mL (less than 4.1) *elevated

positive Abs

RT3...........................pending *will take 3-6 weeks for results

=====================================================================

My Analysis

TSH who cares

FT4 is undetectable (which is good)

but look at that FT3!!!!!

Thing is no way I'm Hyper.... my temps basal & av daily are rock

solid and NEVER vary!!! Basal is 36.4C everyday & daily av is 37C

everyday. In fact every temp during the day is 37 C (98.6 F)it never

changes!!!!!

I sleep fine, no IBS at all, LITTLE ENERGY, usually little appetite

but that has improved a little recently (last 10 days or so).

BP & HR are EXACTLY the same as before I started Tertroxin. Have had

a few BP's drop from sitting to standing in last couple of weeks ...

probably due to stress & mucking up my meds.

Heres what happened last two weeks

My frustration is energy has NOT improved!!! I was walking 30-40 mins

2-3 times a week until 2 weeks ago. Then I had some work done on the

house & tradesman turned up without warning one day. That meant I had

to run around moving furniture, covering things, giving instructions

etc. Wore myself out & to make it worse I forgot some of my meds &

didnt eat when I should of. Result being I was throwing up by

midday!!!!

Stress dosed & got myself back on track but simply couldnt motivate

myself to walk after that. On reflection should have stress dosed

more I think??? The work cost a fortune for very little really (more

than quoted) but was absolutely necessary (carport in danger of

collapsing). And of course theres still a a mess to cleanup too (wood

dust inside as had some things done there too). Still got the

tradesmans scaffolding here as they havent turned up to collect it.

Cant even use the carport after AU$40000 repairs as a result (where

scaffolding is stacked) so our cars sit on the driveway in the heat,

trailer is sitting on front lawn, and scaffolding blocks access to

backyard so cant mow back lawn. Did I mention I HATE tradesmen!!!!

My Twin 16 year old Sons have finally finished year 11 exams & final

work were done & handed in on Friday just gone. Was a VERY stressful

time for both of them & me. I needed to keep them on track for

revision, run around finding resources etc & ferry them to & from the

school most days. They have appointments with Dr JC on 9th December

to finally get RX for Adrenal & Thyroid Meds so we can get those

started & reasonably sorted before Year 12 starts in Feb'09.

My DH had a followup appointment with his Doc on Thursday just gone

(finally AFTER 2 months). I went too of course!!!! Doc agreed high

Ferritin warranted HH testing . Agreed he looked Hypo & has Hashis.

Agreed his Androgens are all low as well. He agreed to test all the

other things we wanted Serum ACTH & 8am Cortisol, Aldosterone &

Renin, MTHFR Gene testing, KFT, LFT, Vit D, Vit B12 , RBC Folate,

Homocysteine, hsCRP, repeat FBC & ESR. DH got his Exercise Stress

Test results too. All were good no heart issues & BP is fine. Doc

asked whether we wanted Endo appiontment I said empatically NO just

get the tests done & we would get him appointment with Dr JC

(hopefully to get ACTH Stim done by Xmas). Dr JC is off for almost

two months as well from second week in December so not at all sure

WHEN he will get an appointment with her.

I had second Venesection done on Friday just gone. Thought I had

prepared well (stress dosed ate & drank prior) & was fine during &

immediately after. Got home had to take son to school & back again.

Started smelling awful smell (like turps or new paint) made me really

nauseous so didnt eat afterwoods. Discovered neighbour had roof spray

painted & as it was very windy in avo the fumes & overspray were

right through my house!!!! Is only the undercoat so can look forward

to more of the same this week apparently. I stress dosed again tried

Alkala closed all doors & windows put on Reverse Cycle Aircon with

Plasma filter took 5-6 hours to get rid of worst of the smell!!!!!!

Twins were due at party so drove them there & back again. Still

couldnt face food then ~10pm cooked a couple of steaks. The smell of

cooking finally triggered vomiting after which I felt a little

better. Ate, drank Alkala & stress dosed & felt a bit better again.

Then I discovered I had NOT taken any of my am tabs including Pred,

Florinef or RX Potassium!!!!! Doh-h-h-h!!!! Sometimes I think I'm a

real slow learner!!!! Took all weekend for me to feel almost human

again. So due to all the foregoing I didnt get the good feelings like

I did for my first Venesection. No wonder really is it??

My weight has not improved either most of the little I lost early on

has returned (at least no heavier than when I started the T3) ... not

surprising since I havent walked for 2 weeks I suppose? I am

seriously thinking of trying small dose of Dexamphetamine again to

help with Dopamine & motivation.

I am just so peeved that after 3 months on T3 only I havent improved

more. I was really hoping for some more energy & weight loss by Xmas.

I really cant stand this extra weight in the heat!!! Never mind that

I wont look in a mirror, refuse to be photographed & cant fit into

anything!I mean I'm heavier than when fullterm with Twins (13 kilos

heavier in fact). Whole family is coming to our place for Xmas this

year too so no pressure...!!!!!!

So I guess I put it down to Thyroid Resistence still & keep on

increasing???? I know you had to go over 200mcg to breakthrough the

Thyroid resistence then decreased to 150mcg daily dose????

I see my Doc tomorrow so will have to convince her to keep RX'ing the

Tertroxin & allow me to go higher (assuming you agree thats whats

needed). I know above Thyroid results will make her nervous

So what do you think?

Lethal Lee

================================================================

[Guest guest]

What is your pulse? You say same as before what is before? LOL my doctor

feels that sometime you have to ignore the labs and push higher till the

cellular resistance breaks down, thi is also Lowe's theory, bu it would

scare me if your pulse is already on the high side. I have heard of

doctors recommending beat blockers while T3 is ramped higher to overcome

reisstance.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Sorry, LOL not beat blockers.. Shoudl have been BETA blockers.. Damnrd

fingers!

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Hi Val,

This is my post on 30th Oct on this thread

" My BP & HR have always been quite high.

BP currently at rest ~ 150/100 & HR ~80-100.

This is MUCH lower (by at least 30 points BP & 10 bpm HR) than before

Pred & Florinef though. My BP also now consistently rises at least 10

points on rising since Florinef as well.

Note BEFORE Florinef my temps including basals were always HIGH.

AFTER Florinef dropped a lot to HypoT levels. They improved as Sex

Hormones, Vit D, B12 etc were optimised. They also improved more as

NTH was increased. However despite that energy levels, motivation,

exercise tolerance & weight issues remained unresolved. Hence started

RT3 clearing protocol.

My Basal temps, daily averages, mid avo temps are all still at or

very close to optimal levels.

-Basal temps usually 36.4 C (97.9 F)

-Mid avo temps ~37C (98.6 F)

-Note my daily av temp is VERY steady at 37 C (98.6 F)

-Occassionally on the T3 protocol my basal has dipped to 36.2-36.4 C

(97.16-97.52 F). Is usually when I increased my T3 meds. It returns

to normal within 2-3 days. Note this has NOT happened last 4

increases.

I had mentioned these previously & you said to just monitor for any

change and in particular to watch HR did not get further elevated "

As I said previously my BP & heart has been thoroughly investigated &

OK'ed. NEVER taken BP meds told by Cardiologist dont need them (BP

spikes in daytime but much lower at night as per 24 hour monitors

done 3 times). I would be very reluctant to use BP meds.

So in view of above do I keep on with increasing T3 protocol (10mcg

increases evry 10 days)or sit on 140mcg (been on since 25th Nov)?

Note this is week 14).

Lethal Lee

--------------------------------------------------------------

-- In RT3_T3 ,

wrote:

>

> What is your pulse? You say same as before what is before? LOL my

doctor

> feels that sometime you have to ignore the labs and push higher

till the

> cellular resistance breaks down, thi is also Lowe's theory, bu it

would

> scare me if your pulse is already on the high side. I have heard of

> doctors recommending beat blockers while T3 is ramped higher to

overcome

> reisstance.

>

> --

> Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

>

> http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

>

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

> http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

>

[Guest guest]

I would (And did) continue raising it. I went all the way to 250mcg

before I actually felt the breakthrough symtoms of hyper than had to

seriousl lower it immediately, but my temps were lower than yours. Now

My doctor says he has never seen a weight problem that wasnt; from low

thyroid but then there's me.. HA! LOL But I do think the horrendous

insulin doses I have to take keep it on me too.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

[Guest guest]

Well that certainly happened to me. I went quite hyper somewhere between

about 40-50 mcg and 75 mcg T3. Was definitely very hyper at 75 mcg.

Through inexperience and probably because I had felt so bad with so many

symptoms for so very many years, I did not recognize that I was hyper. I

was still pushing for higher and had just raised to 81.25 mcg a day or

two before I finally found out I had already been hyper for a long time.

I should say however, that I was never tested for RT3, just assumed I

had it from history and symptoms.

sol

Leisa Forman wrote:

> Lee, as a person who is about to do the swich from armour to t3..what

> I got out of your letter was that it might be true that not everyone

> needs the very high dose of t3 to clear rt3. That its easy to raise to

> quickly and pass into hyper from hypo.

> also, that I wish I had HC to help me with the switch.

> thanks for your update

>

> -

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Val,

Update

BIG developments in last few weeks...iis beeen a wild ride!!!!

These were my most recent Lab results...

1st December 2008

Tested 9am

Tertroxin on 140mcg for 7 days at time of test

Last Tertroxin dose taken 9 hours before test

Started Prednisolone 10 months prior to this test.

TSH...............less than 0.01 U/L (0.4-4.0)

FT4...............less than 5 pmol/L (9-24) *below range

FT3........................23 pmol/L (2.6-6.6) *VERY elevated

TPOAb..............less than 1 IU/mL (less than 5.6)

TGAb.......................5.1 IU/mL (less than 4.1) *elevated

positive Abs

RT3..........................pending *will take 3-6 weeks for results

I previously posted that despite these results I had absolutely NO

HyperT symptoms. However things have just not been right since my

toxin exposure (paint fumes from neighbours) in late November. Been

feeling up & down a lot.

So I tried lowering Prednisolone from 10mg to 7.5mg. I tried more

Florinef increased from 1 1/2 to 1 3/4 tabs. I was still increasing

Tertroxin was on 140mcg at time of last Labs & was about to increase

to 150mcg. None of the adjustments helped or rather some did briefly

then went back to bad.

Xmas Stress

Then the week leading up to Xmas was VERY stressful here. We were

having 13 guests for Xmas plus the 4 of us so total 17 for lunch.

Another couple of guests came to visit later after lunch too.

Dear Hubby was doing ALL Xmas shopping & cooking. The stress was

mainly from needing to clean & tidy the whole house & yard and after

a year of severe neglect this was quite a job. The house is large

(two storey, 4 bed, 3 bath, office, family/meals room,separate

dining, lounge. Plus house is on a BIG block 800 sq metres with a big

swimming pool, lots of grass & garden. In addition we had to move

furniture around a lot. It hadnt been put back to right place after

my daughter moved out 3 months ago (after staying with us for 15

months when relationship broke up). To accommodate her & her 'stuff'

when she moved in last June we had to cram things all over the place

and move our other kids to different rooms. Now we needed to move

everything back so we had room for everyone to sit for Xmas. It was

like we had just moved house so many rooms had to be swapped over!!!

Well it was very interesting to say the least! I was next to

useless!!!!! I had severe shaky muscles (particularly the legs) after

only 10-15 minutes of trying to stand up & do things!!! I also got

very hot & sweaty easily which has NOT happened in a very long time.

I was also feeling very puffed & even started having shortness of

breath feelings again.

Prior to this I was having no obvious signs of HyperT. My BP, HR,

temps, were all great and in fact had never moved during the whole T3

protocol. They STILL hadnt moved but despite the fact that watching

for changes there IS supposed to clue you into becoming HyperT.

The ONLY thing that changed was my BP was occassionally dropping on

standing again which it hadnt done since I started Florinef back in

Feb. So I guess this was maybe a sign of Adrenal stress & maybe

electrolytes out of balance?

So until I had to actually do something physically stressful I had NO

idea I was HyperT!!!! Before Xmas week I usually just sat on computer

or lounge with occassional attempts at gentle walking.

Trust me to go from no energy & inability to lose weight because of

RT3 to no energy & inability to lose weight because I was Hypert!!!

No mad energy, no increase in appetite, no change in weight, no

change in temps, resting HR or BP, no change in sleep. Really I could

have coped with some increased energy & losing some weight...come

on!!!!

Adjusting Tertroxin to eliminate Hypert

So through trial & error and by adjusting my meds I did find I was in

fact hyperT!!!! I just dont seem to get the obvious symptoms/clues to

warn me that is what is happening!!!

This is what I did

1)I skipped T3 for a day then tried going back on it.

2)Tried 100mcg (down from 140) no good.

3)Dropped to 80 still no good.

4)Dropped to 60 then 40 STILL no good.

5)So I stopped for 3 days & started stress dosing HC 4-8mg daily (in

addition to normal 10mg Pred daily). That was much better.

6)Then I finally started to get some LOW Thyroid symptoms. My snoring

got dramatically worse (thanks to Hubby for pointing that out). My

face (particularly around my eyes) got very puffy too. To add insult

to injury my weight jumped up 4 kg overnight!!!!

7)So I started back on T3 80 mcg daily & feeling a lot better than I

have for some time. The puffiness is reducing & weight has gone down

2 kg. No more SOB or muscle trembling either.

I now am feeling much more focussed, calmer, more motivated.

Naturally I'm hoping weight reduction will continue. I will be

recommencing walking as soon as heat wave is passed.

Was feeling some burnout from the Moderating which I started back in

October with in the new Forums. That is now eased as we have

several new mods to share the load.

Anyway we survived Xmas fine & the house feels more a home now. More

space, things put away & organised, garden tidy, pool clean. Didnt

realise how much the mess & clutter affected me. In fact was too sick

to care most of the time!!!! But it DOES make a difference for sure

Summary Current Meds

80mcg Tertroxin

10mg Pred

1 1/2tabs Florinef

3000mg Slow-K (RX Potassium)

800 mg L-Tryptophan

Sex Hormone HRT unchanged

Numerous other vits & supps

My Health Plan

I had an appointment with my Hormonal Doc on 2nd December & next

review is 4th Feb.

I have Labs requisition for Androgens, Sex Hormones, Iron Studies &

FBC to get done in January. I am still waiting for 1st December RT3

results too.

Also I am getting another OPG of jaw/teeth as 15 months since last

one & have still got Dental work to get done this year. Since last

OPG I have had Wisdom tooth which has crumbled & broken off (over the

last 12 months) now no tooth above the gum line at all !!! But

strangely enough absolutely NO pain at all??? Will likely need to get

it cut out under anesthetic as nothing left to grab on to!!!! In

addition I have two caps on front teeth chipped so need replacing.

More difficult is to fix a molar which has large Mercury filling. A

quarter of that tooth broke off a while back & havent done anything

about it yet so thats gonna need a crown of course.

I have also got a referral to get a Dexascan done for bone density.

I'm never had one done, am now 51, Menopausal, had low

Estrogen/Testosterone for some time (until HRT optimised) PLUS am on

long term steroids (for life as Hypopit). After reading about Phils

heart/bone issues I thought a baseline scan was wise to do & Doc

agreed!!!!

Have a referral to go back to Dermatologist for my annual body skin

check (history of Melenoma) last done November last year.

Oh and due to have another ven/phleb done end of January for ongoing

Hemochromatosis management unless Labs show no need.

Will be continuing on 80mcg Tertroxin for forseeable future.

Final Comments

We are going away for a week mid January so hopefully that will be

relaxing & not too stressful.

So anyway thats my update. Its currently very hot here been 36-40 C

past few days & set to continue. So will be hiding out in

airconditioned lounge for New Year no doubt!!!! Maybe some champagne

will be imbibed... I did have 1/2 glass at Xmas & was low flying on

that. Talk about a cheap drunk. At least no bad side effects & no

symptoms next day so thats a plus.

Lethal Lee

[Guest guest]

Hi Sol & Leisa,

Yes its obvious I had more resistance than you Sol but much less than

Val had.

What was confusing is I had none of the warning signs which I was

looking out for. But there was no harm done and I dont regret the

experience at all.

It is very easy to fix going HyperT from T3 only. Just need to stop

for a day or two & its gone. IF you go HyperT from too much Armour or

any med with T4 in it its much worse. You have to get rid of the

accumulated Ft4 & it can take weeks to do that. Probably need meds in

fact to help with side effects too.

I was tested for RT3 several times & its always been high. I gave NTH

a good try (on it for 17 months & got up to 4 1/4 grains) first & it

simply was not working.

The fact that as soon as I stopped the NTH I felt immediate

improvement in brain fog symptoms was a real pointer for me that I

was doing the right thing.

MY DH & Twins are about to start treatment for Adrenals & Thyroid

too. They all have Hashis sam as me too. They also have high RT3 but

we are trying NTH first for all of them. But same with me IF it

doesnt work will be doing T3 protocol for them too. None of them are

as symptomatic as me so hopefully the NTH will be sufficient & they

dont have my level of resistence.

I'm certainly far more optimistic that this year my health is going

to be so much better after last weeks breakthrough.

So Happy New Year & I hope this year you find your own breakthroughs

as well.

Lethal Lee

-----------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------

In RT3_T3 , sol wrote:

Well that certainly happened to me. I went quite hyper somewhere

between about 40-50 mcg and 75 mcg T3. Was definitely very hyper at

75 mcg.

Through inexperience and probably because I had felt so bad with so

many symptoms for so very many years, I did not recognize that I was

hyper. I was still pushing for higher and had just raised to 81.25

mcg a day or two before I finally found out I had already been hyper

for a long time.

I should say however, that I was never tested for RT3, just assumed I

had it from history and symptoms.

sol

-------------------------------------------------------------

Leisa Forman wrote:

Lee, as a person who is about to do the swich from armour to t3..what

I got out of your letter was that it might be true that not everyone

needs the very high dose of t3 to clear rt3. That its easy to raise

to quickly and pass into hyper from hypo. also, that I wish I had HC

to help me with the switch.

thanks for your update

[Guest guest]

So in hindsite...what could have avoided the hypo to hyper without noticing? Woukd it be going slow, or being more patient for tissues to absorb the changes with the t3...or what? Id like to avoid missing the right level and jumping to hyper.....It would save adrenals and keep me healthier.> Lee, as a person who is about to do the swich from armour to t3..what > I got out of your letter was that it might be true that not everyone > needs the very high dose of t3 to clear rt3. That its easy to raise to > quickly and pass into hyper from hypo.> also, that I wish I had HC to help me with the

switch.> thanks for your update>> ->------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

HI Leisa,

In my particular situation there was NOTHING I could have done to

avoid going Hyper without noticing. I simply did not have

the 'normal' warning signs. Those being increased HR, or change in BP

or increased temps. I should point out that most people WOULD likely

get these warning signs so I dont think mine is a typical situation.

Of course if you are not in the habit of taking those vitals & are

not aware of what your normals are then you will not know what is

happening. Thats not the case with me ... I have taken vitals for a

long time & know my normals inside out. I also have a home BP monitor

& Mercury glass thermometer so I can do the checking.

Certainly people have different levels of resistance as well as

different reasons for the resistance & each persons combination of

problems & symptoms are unique. There is simply no way to tell in

advance what a particular individuals likely optimal T3 dose will be

(no more than you can for Armour).

I would NOT suggest T3 protocol for anyone UNLESS they had had

extensive testing done to identify contributing factors to RT3. This

would include full Adrenal testing, Sex Hormones, nutritional testing

etc. THEN all deficiencies, below optimal levels & imbalances should

be addressed (optimised).

I would also give NTH (Armour) time to work (sufficent time plus high

enough doses) & only IF that fails to resolve all symptoms would I

try T3 only. For many people doing all the aforementioned WILL work

so T3 would not be needed. I did all this myself before doing T3.

I would strongly recommend AGAINST doing T3 if Adrenals are weak and

AI is not well supported with appropriate meds. By that I mean IF you

need HC, Florinef, Androgen HRT this should all be done first & be

optimised and very stable.

Otherwise T3 only protocol will likely cause more harm than good.

You say you are not on HC? Have you tested Adrenals & have you got

AI? Is Cortisol suboptimal? If so I strongly suggest you get that

sorted first.

When I did go from Hypo to Hyper it was stress dosing with HC (plus

stopping T3 for a bit) that used up the FT3 dumping into my sytem.

What would you do if you had no HC? That would not be a good scenario.

As for alternatives to what I did.

There are some who have so much resistance that nothing less

than 'bombarding' the receptors will clear the RT3. By bombarding I

mean taking T3 to the point that FT3 is very elevated which you can

see mine was. For me that was almost 6 weeks at higher at 140mcg or

higher. For Val she had to go to 250mcg. Sol says for her it was much

lower around 80mcg.

Despite my FT3 being so high it took another almost 4 weeks before my

receptors cleared. My FT3 by that time must have been astronomical.

Despite that it only took 4-5 days to get myself back on track.

Nor did I have really bad or distressing symptoms. They were a bit

uncomfortable & I rather I hadnt had them (especially in lead up to

Xmas) but they were not dangerous or life threatening. I certainly

did not need to seek medical help or assistance.

I did know in advance what to do when I did get Hyper symptoms &

immediately did them (reduce dose, if needed stop for a day or two,

stress dose HC to use up excess) & it worked quite quickly.

In fact the T3 protocol is aimed at increasing T3 (once past 12 week

period when FT4 has cleared) high enough to reach the Hyper point.

Thats how you know receptors have cleared. I must point out that ALL

of this was discussed approved & supervised by my Doc. She was

confident that I knew my body & was vigilant and could cope with the

protocol and what needed to be done when Hyper appeared.

Of course you CAN be extremely conservative in dosing T3 & increase

very slowly. As far as I can see all that does is greatly extend the

time it takes to achieve the same outcome. I would think you also run

the risk that if you dont bombard the receptors enough you will never

achieve that breakthrough.

Lastly I can say for me it was the right thing to do. But you need to

have addressed all I mentioned in my post & be well prepared.

Lethal Lee

----------------------------------------------------------------

In RT3_T3 , Leisa Forman wrote:

>

> So in hindsite...what could have avoided the hypo to hyper without

noticing? Woukd it be going slow, or being more patient for tissues

to absorb the changes with the t3...or what? Id like to avoid missing

the right level and jumping to hyper.....It would save adrenals and

keep me healthier.

>

>

> > Lee, as a person who is about to do the swich from armour to

t3..what

> > I got out of your letter was that it might be true that not

everyone

> > needs the very high dose of t3 to clear rt3. That its easy to

raise to

> > quickly and pass into hyper from hypo.

> > also, that I wish I had HC to help me with the switch.

> > thanks for your update

> >

> > -

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>