Re: Phone call from nada

November 29, 2008

Hi Jonna,

I'm sorry you have to deal with this. I'm glad you had peace for 6

weeks.

I can totally relate to your post, nada is very similar to yours.

They will try to beat you into going back into their web of deceit.

I got the old " do you want me to go to the grave sad? " Translation:

If I can't emotionally beat on you, I'm gonna die an unhappy person.

I've been NC for almost 2 months. I shut off my answering machine on

holidays so I don't have to hear her voice or the dishrag fathers.

They are always on caller ID trying to get me on those days but the

phone rings and rings. I am at the point where I am so sickened by

them and their attempts at continued abuse that I can't hear their

voice without shaking.

I think it is great that you got a " break " for 6 weeks. I think I

would just screen my calls and when you are " up " to talking to her,

then you should answer the phone. The minute she starts in with all

the crap about what a rotten person you are (because you won't let

her beat on you) then you tell her you are ending the call. Then just

hang up.

I tried that with nada, I tried to only talk about the weather with

her, literally. I told her I'd see her 1x a month, that was IT. She

pushed through that boundary, used my 4 year old to get info where we

were and showed up. So now, no contact for almost two lovely months.

I am happy being NC but have this dreaded fear all the time that I

can't stand. Every car door outstide my house makes my heart race. I

know, I know they are " coming for me " to scream and cry and lie and

lie until I stand there and say " yes, yes, yes, I am a piece of

garbage and deserve your abuse " This has been the pattern of my

life for 37 years. I've gone NC before, but always go back to them

when they " come for me " I hope this time I am stronger and I don't

fall for that sick little " but I LOOOOOOVE you so much you don't even

know, I would DIE for you I love you, don't you know " Then, back on

the nuse and WHAM she gets me around the neck. Every. Single.

Time. The hate I feel for her cannot be described.

--sorry--I totally vented here on your post but what I really wnated

to convey is that your nada is similiar to mine and you should be

proud for avoiding the madness for 6 weeks. Continue to set those

boundaries, and more importantly, enforce them. I'm trying to do

that. So not easy but I need the peace in my life.

Glad we have eachother on this board. I read as many posts as I can

and have never felt so validated in my life.

Hang in there, stay strong.

>

> Hi, nada phoned me today after 6 weeks of NC after she and dad left

> my son's birthday party abruptly because she was feeling neglected

in

> classic queen fashion. She had been typically nada obnoxious when

we

> picked her and dad up from their place and during the trip to the

> party. My daughter's partner took them home, and when he got back

to

> the party, he said that nada wanted me to call her. So I called her

> straight away, and she asked if I was mad because they left early.

I

> assured her that I wasn't mad with her. (I was actually relieved

that

> she had gone.)

> So, two weeks passed, which is about the time it takes for me to

feel

> the FOG, but I decided not to give in to it and did not call them.

My

> dishrag dad called me after 3 weeks, usually nada puts him up to it

> and after a few pleasantries, puts nada on the phone. But this time

> he said nada was at a neighbor's house so I didn't think she knew

he

> called me. He then phoned me at the 5 week mark, once again nada

did

> not seem to be around. Usually, nada only phones me when she's

> waifish and wants something

> So today, she demands to know why I am neglecting her and dad, that

> they have done everything for me, all my life and that they are so

> hurt and bewildered. She demanded to know why they haven't heard

from

> me and what they have done to deserve it. I told her she is welcome

> to phone me. She said your father has called you twice (so she

> knows).I told her it's complicated and hard to explain, but she

> demanded a face to face meeting to talk about it. She said she has

to

> go to a therapist to make sense of me. It all got very messy and I

> told her that she should ask her therapist about BPD. Well, nada

> glossed over that. Also told her that there were always strings

> attached to anything they ever did for me, they expect me to be

> forever grateful. That was denied. She told me she welcomed my (ex –

> by 10 years) husband into the family, that he was a disappointment

> and ruined me (he is also BPD). And that I kept him away from his

> (probably BPD) father!!! (I'm the scapegoat again) She said she was

> never going to welcome anyone else to our family. That's true,

she's

> awful to my daughter in law and my niece's husband. She said I gave

> her my daughter (my firstborn) but not my son. What the ?? I did

not

> give her my daughter. I mentioned that there was so much hitting

and

> yelling when I was growing up and that I always felt in the way,

> never felt part of the family. She raged over the phone that she

> never, ever hit me (perhaps using a wooden spoon does not count in

> her mind) but that she got me around the neck one time (that's when

> she tried to strangle me and my dad pulled her off me). Her

version

> is that my (golden) brother told her not to do that. She told me

that

> I am wrong, that my memories are wrong and that I am wrong not to

do

> what she and dad want from me. She said they deserve respect

because

> they are my parents, that my brother is broken hearted because he

> does not hear from me. (That's another story.) That I owe them for

> everything they have done (so much of it was forced on me and was

> controlling) and because she lent me money in the past (which I

> always paid back). She stated a whole lot of things that she claims

I

> told her over the years. Not true. She said she has never shown me

> anything but love. And there was a whole lot of other crap she

threw

> up at me. She said that she and dad always check the answer machine

> when they come in the house or ask each other if I have called.

> I told her it was easier for me to have limited contact, so she

raged

> about that. I told her I am working through some issues, so she

raged

> about that. I told her I am not prepared to meet with her, so she

> raged about that. She even said that Hitler would not be treated

this

> way. She told me I should respect my family and do my duty. This

from

> the same woman who emigrated permanently from her country at the

age

> of 25 to get away from her own nada.

> She asked if I am talking to anyone about my issues, and I told her

> that yes, I am seeing a therapist. She told me to ask my therapist

> what is wrong with me. Nada does not know that I have been dealing

> with depression for many years, and of course would not understand

> that that I am a struggling KO.

> She looks at me, does not see herself and she can't stand it. I'm

not

> good enough for her, never was and never will be. But because she

> chose to live near me and not my golden brother, she is demanding

> that I do what she wants and needs.

> She said " we are getting old, and if you keep this up I hope you

> don't come to my funeral when I die " .

> Then I thought, what would some of my fellow KO's do, so after 22

> minutes (have a timer on my phone) I asked her if she was ready to

> end the call. She said she was not, I said I was - and hung up. I

> felt sick, I was shaking and my heart was racing for most of the

> call.

> I so understand why some of you have said that NC is hard at first.

> Does 6 weeks count? This was not a conscious choice though, I just

> sort of fell in to it and let it go on. I told myself to enjoy it

> while it lasted. She could have called me at any time and just been

> pleasant, but she created havoc. She tried to bully and guilt me

into

> being what she wants. According to her, she's perfect, and I am

> wrong, ungrateful and need fixing. I had some self doubts

afterwards,

> but now realise that she was displaying typical narcissistic BPD

with

> the crap she told me and gaslighting on a major scale.

> So, what happens next? Where to from here? I am not used to putting

> myself first. Nada started burning the bridge today, and I threw

some

> fuel on it too.

> She'll probably work up yet another unstable angina attack, and

I'll

> get a call from the hospital, and be expected to come running and

to

> taxi dad around again since he doesn't drive any more. What a mess.

> So glad there is understanding here on this board.

> Jonna

>

November 29, 2008

Don't divulge information to her, like that you are in therapy,

unless you really want her to use it against you. Just say, " That's

really none of your business and it is not up for discussion. " She's

not asking if you're seeing someone because she actually cares about

you. She's asking because she has projected her issues onto you and

wants to make sure YOU'RE the one who needs help. She admitted to

you that she's seeing someone so she can make sense of YOU. " That's

great, Mom, I hope it works out for you. "

It's best not to argue or try to defend yourself when their claws

come out. Just make it clear you are not willing to play anymore.

Mom wants to tell you your memories are wrong? " Well, I remember

things differently. I guess we disagree. " Mom wants to tell you

you're cruel for not calling? " It seems like your feelings are hurt

that I didn't call when you wanted me to. I can't call you every

day. That doesn't mean I don't love you. You insinuated that I'm

treating you worse than people would treat Hitler. That statement

seems manipulative, and the next time you do that I will hang up on

you. " She has your dad call from the hospital to tell you she's on

her deathbed? " Wow, sorry that happened again dad. I'll bet you

guys could use some quiet time to recover. Why don't you call me

when you get settled back at home. "

You gave her 22 minutes of cutting into you. Next time, try to stop

her the first time she attacks. Good job hanging up. I'll bet those

6 weeks of quiet were nice.

kt

> >

> > Hi, nada phoned me today after 6 weeks of NC after she and dad

left

> > my son's birthday party abruptly because she was feeling

neglected

> in

> > classic queen fashion. She had been typically nada obnoxious when

> we

> > picked her and dad up from their place and during the trip to the

> > party. My daughter's partner took them home, and when he got back

> to

> > the party, he said that nada wanted me to call her. So I called

her

> > straight away, and she asked if I was mad because they left

early.

> I

> > assured her that I wasn't mad with her. (I was actually relieved

> that

> > she had gone.)

> > So, two weeks passed, which is about the time it takes for me to

> feel

> > the FOG, but I decided not to give in to it and did not call

them.

> My

> > dishrag dad called me after 3 weeks, usually nada puts him up to

it

> > and after a few pleasantries, puts nada on the phone. But this

time

> > he said nada was at a neighbor's house so I didn't think she knew

> he

> > called me. He then phoned me at the 5 week mark, once again nada

> did

> > not seem to be around. Usually, nada only phones me when she's

> > waifish and wants something

> > So today, she demands to know why I am neglecting her and dad,

that

> > they have done everything for me, all my life and that they are

so

> > hurt and bewildered. She demanded to know why they haven't heard

> from

> > me and what they have done to deserve it. I told her she is

welcome

> > to phone me. She said your father has called you twice (so she

> > knows).I told her it's complicated and hard to explain, but she

> > demanded a face to face meeting to talk about it. She said she

has

> to

> > go to a therapist to make sense of me. It all got very messy and

I

> > told her that she should ask her therapist about BPD. Well, nada

> > glossed over that. Also told her that there were always strings

> > attached to anything they ever did for me, they expect me to be

> > forever grateful. That was denied. She told me she welcomed my

(ex –

>

> > by 10 years) husband into the family, that he was a

disappointment

> > and ruined me (he is also BPD). And that I kept him away from his

> > (probably BPD) father!!! (I'm the scapegoat again) She said she

was

> > never going to welcome anyone else to our family. That's true,

> she's

> > awful to my daughter in law and my niece's husband. She said I

gave

> > her my daughter (my firstborn) but not my son. What the ?? I did

> not

> > give her my daughter. I mentioned that there was so much hitting

> and

> > yelling when I was growing up and that I always felt in the way,

> > never felt part of the family. She raged over the phone that she

> > never, ever hit me (perhaps using a wooden spoon does not count

in

> > her mind) but that she got me around the neck one time (that's

when

> > she tried to strangle me and my dad pulled her off me). Her

> version

> > is that my (golden) brother told her not to do that. She told me

> that

> > I am wrong, that my memories are wrong and that I am wrong not to

> do

> > what she and dad want from me. She said they deserve respect

> because

> > they are my parents, that my brother is broken hearted because he

> > does not hear from me. (That's another story.) That I owe them

for

> > everything they have done (so much of it was forced on me and was

> > controlling) and because she lent me money in the past (which I

> > always paid back). She stated a whole lot of things that she

claims

> I

> > told her over the years. Not true. She said she has never shown

me

> > anything but love. And there was a whole lot of other crap she

> threw

> > up at me. She said that she and dad always check the answer

machine

> > when they come in the house or ask each other if I have called.

> > I told her it was easier for me to have limited contact, so she

> raged

> > about that. I told her I am working through some issues, so she

> raged

> > about that. I told her I am not prepared to meet with her, so she

> > raged about that. She even said that Hitler would not be treated

> this

> > way. She told me I should respect my family and do my duty. This

> from

> > the same woman who emigrated permanently from her country at the

> age

> > of 25 to get away from her own nada.

> > She asked if I am talking to anyone about my issues, and I told

her

> > that yes, I am seeing a therapist. She told me to ask my

therapist

> > what is wrong with me. Nada does not know that I have been

dealing

> > with depression for many years, and of course would not

understand

> > that that I am a struggling KO.

> > She looks at me, does not see herself and she can't stand it. I'm

> not

> > good enough for her, never was and never will be. But because she

> > chose to live near me and not my golden brother, she is demanding

> > that I do what she wants and needs.

> > She said " we are getting old, and if you keep this up I hope you

> > don't come to my funeral when I die " .

> > Then I thought, what would some of my fellow KO's do, so after 22

> > minutes (have a timer on my phone) I asked her if she was ready

to

> > end the call. She said she was not, I said I was - and hung up. I

> > felt sick, I was shaking and my heart was racing for most of the

> > call.

> > I so understand why some of you have said that NC is hard at

first.

> > Does 6 weeks count? This was not a conscious choice though, I

just

> > sort of fell in to it and let it go on. I told myself to enjoy it

> > while it lasted. She could have called me at any time and just

been

> > pleasant, but she created havoc. She tried to bully and guilt me

> into

> > being what she wants. According to her, she's perfect, and I am

> > wrong, ungrateful and need fixing. I had some self doubts

> afterwards,

> > but now realise that she was displaying typical narcissistic BPD

> with

> > the crap she told me and gaslighting on a major scale.

> > So, what happens next? Where to from here? I am not used to

putting

> > myself first. Nada started burning the bridge today, and I threw

> some

> > fuel on it too.

> > She'll probably work up yet another unstable angina attack, and

> I'll

> > get a call from the hospital, and be expected to come running and

> to

> > taxi dad around again since he doesn't drive any more. What a

mess.

> > So glad there is understanding here on this board.

> > Jonna

> >

>

November 29, 2008

Wow, your nada sounds just like mine. And that horrible phone call

sounds just like what I've been through! KT made a great point about

the therapy. I have *never* divulged that to my nada. It is the one

secret that I have been able to keep from her prying, invasive,

selfish, rude self! (Except for the secret that I really do hate her)

So guess what nada's going to do with that? She's going to say, " Oh

my daughter doesn't want to talk to me. She is such a mess. Did you

know she's in -gasp!- *therapy*? And you know what they do in there!

Blame the mother! Always blame the mother! [What you and your mother

have is *not* " normal " mother-daughter conflict! It's sick, toxic,

control!]

" Are you in therapy " , pulled out in the middle of an argument

especially, is a HUGE boundary violation. It's none of her effing

business!

As for the hanging up and the shaking, boy I went through that too.

For me, we went NC after I *screamed* at her when she tried to back me

into that corner and I had just had *enough*. I literally pulled the

plug (unhooked my phone forever - she doesn't have my cell number).

It sounds like you've learned some valuable stuff:

1) You don't have to answer a question you don't want to.

2) Not only does she know what your dad is doing, but she is most

certainly pulling the strings!

I don't know what else to say except that I have been right where you are.

-Deanna

> > >

> > > Hi, nada phoned me today after 6 weeks of NC after she and dad

> left

> > > my son's birthday party abruptly because she was feeling

> neglected

> > in

> > > classic queen fashion. She had been typically nada obnoxious when

> > we

> > > picked her and dad up from their place and during the trip to the

> > > party. My daughter's partner took them home, and when he got back

> > to

> > > the party, he said that nada wanted me to call her. So I called

> her

> > > straight away, and she asked if I was mad because they left

> early.

> > I

> > > assured her that I wasn't mad with her. (I was actually relieved

> > that

> > > she had gone.)

> > > So, two weeks passed, which is about the time it takes for me to

> > feel

> > > the FOG, but I decided not to give in to it and did not call

> them.

> > My

> > > dishrag dad called me after 3 weeks, usually nada puts him up to

> it

> > > and after a few pleasantries, puts nada on the phone. But this

> time

> > > he said nada was at a neighbor's house so I didn't think she knew

> > he

> > > called me. He then phoned me at the 5 week mark, once again nada

> > did

> > > not seem to be around. Usually, nada only phones me when she's

> > > waifish and wants something

> > > So today, she demands to know why I am neglecting her and dad,

> that

> > > they have done everything for me, all my life and that they are

> so

> > > hurt and bewildered. She demanded to know why they haven't heard

> > from

> > > me and what they have done to deserve it. I told her she is

> welcome

> > > to phone me. She said your father has called you twice (so she

> > > knows).I told her it's complicated and hard to explain, but she

> > > demanded a face to face meeting to talk about it. She said she

> has

> > to

> > > go to a therapist to make sense of me. It all got very messy and

> I

> > > told her that she should ask her therapist about BPD. Well, nada

> > > glossed over that. Also told her that there were always strings

> > > attached to anything they ever did for me, they expect me to be

> > > forever grateful. That was denied. She told me she welcomed my

> (ex –

> >

> > > by 10 years) husband into the family, that he was a

> disappointment

> > > and ruined me (he is also BPD). And that I kept him away from his

> > > (probably BPD) father!!! (I'm the scapegoat again) She said she

> was

> > > never going to welcome anyone else to our family. That's true,

> > she's

> > > awful to my daughter in law and my niece's husband. She said I

> gave

> > > her my daughter (my firstborn) but not my son. What the ?? I did

> > not

> > > give her my daughter. I mentioned that there was so much hitting

> > and

> > > yelling when I was growing up and that I always felt in the way,

> > > never felt part of the family. She raged over the phone that she

> > > never, ever hit me (perhaps using a wooden spoon does not count

> in

> > > her mind) but that she got me around the neck one time (that's

> when

> > > she tried to strangle me and my dad pulled her off me). Her

> > version

> > > is that my (golden) brother told her not to do that. She told me

> > that

> > > I am wrong, that my memories are wrong and that I am wrong not to

> > do

> > > what she and dad want from me. She said they deserve respect

> > because

> > > they are my parents, that my brother is broken hearted because he

> > > does not hear from me. (That's another story.) That I owe them

> for

> > > everything they have done (so much of it was forced on me and was

> > > controlling) and because she lent me money in the past (which I

> > > always paid back). She stated a whole lot of things that she

> claims

> > I

> > > told her over the years. Not true. She said she has never shown

> me

> > > anything but love. And there was a whole lot of other crap she

> > threw

> > > up at me. She said that she and dad always check the answer

> machine

> > > when they come in the house or ask each other if I have called.

> > > I told her it was easier for me to have limited contact, so she

> > raged

> > > about that. I told her I am working through some issues, so she

> > raged

> > > about that. I told her I am not prepared to meet with her, so she

> > > raged about that. She even said that Hitler would not be treated

> > this

> > > way. She told me I should respect my family and do my duty. This

> > from

> > > the same woman who emigrated permanently from her country at the

> > age

> > > of 25 to get away from her own nada.

> > > She asked if I am talking to anyone about my issues, and I told

> her

> > > that yes, I am seeing a therapist. She told me to ask my

> therapist

> > > what is wrong with me. Nada does not know that I have been

> dealing

> > > with depression for many years, and of course would not

> understand

> > > that that I am a struggling KO.

> > > She looks at me, does not see herself and she can't stand it. I'm

> > not

> > > good enough for her, never was and never will be. But because she

> > > chose to live near me and not my golden brother, she is demanding

> > > that I do what she wants and needs.

> > > She said " we are getting old, and if you keep this up I hope you

> > > don't come to my funeral when I die " .

> > > Then I thought, what would some of my fellow KO's do, so after 22

> > > minutes (have a timer on my phone) I asked her if she was ready

> to

> > > end the call. She said she was not, I said I was - and hung up. I

> > > felt sick, I was shaking and my heart was racing for most of the

> > > call.

> > > I so understand why some of you have said that NC is hard at

> first.

> > > Does 6 weeks count? This was not a conscious choice though, I

> just

> > > sort of fell in to it and let it go on. I told myself to enjoy it

> > > while it lasted. She could have called me at any time and just

> been

> > > pleasant, but she created havoc. She tried to bully and guilt me

> > into

> > > being what she wants. According to her, she's perfect, and I am

> > > wrong, ungrateful and need fixing. I had some self doubts

> > afterwards,

> > > but now realise that she was displaying typical narcissistic BPD

> > with

> > > the crap she told me and gaslighting on a major scale.

> > > So, what happens next? Where to from here? I am not used to

> putting

> > > myself first. Nada started burning the bridge today, and I threw

> > some

> > > fuel on it too.

> > > She'll probably work up yet another unstable angina attack, and

> > I'll

> > > get a call from the hospital, and be expected to come running and

> > to

> > > taxi dad around again since he doesn't drive any more. What a

> mess.

> > > So glad there is understanding here on this board.

> > > Jonna

> > >

> >

>

November 29, 2008

Hi Jonna,

Congratulations on being nada free for 6 weeks. It takes a whole lot

of courage and strength to go NC. If anything, pat yourself on the

back for making it to this point. It took me about 8 years after I

moved out to finally go NC (almost a year now). Your comment about

having difficulties putting yourself first ring true with me too.

It's hard to learn how to do that, to protect and love ourselves

after such abusive childhoods. But we're not children anymore, they

can't control us anymore if we choose not to let them. I have the

same exact situation as you - stepnada is a full-blown Queen and my

father is a dishrag. And also like you, Stepnada stormed out of my

sister's house because " she didn't feel welcome. " She was pissed

that my sister asked her to please stop arguing with her because she

was getting in my sister's face about the quote for flooring my

sister showed her, saying how wrong it was ect. Dad went to my

sister and told her that she HAD to apologize to stepnada. Sister

refused. They left and have never come back. So disgusted that they

would walk out on my sister and her child, I decided I was done too.

The few times I spoke to stepnada on the phone after she walked out

on my sister, she said some really awful things about her and I just

wasn't having it anymore. I didn't really fight with them. I just

stopped calling. And since they believe that it is OUR

responsibility to keep the relationship going, they have not called

me. I don't miss them. Life has changed dramatically for the better

and I cannot envision going back. I would have a relationship with

my father without her, but that will not happen.

Try to remember all the things we read in these books about

projection. I think it is key to what they are putting us through.

In example, when my stepnada accuses us of not loving her, I know she

is saying that she has never loved us. Or when she says we're

ungrateful, she's really admitting to me that she is ungrateful.

Keep your chin up and surround yourself with people who love you

unconditionally. Why give so much of yourself to somebody who

doesn't appreciate it and never will? The people who love us

unconditionally are the ones who deserve all the energy we put into

relationships.

allcats