Re: Giving love or giving up???

[Guest guest]

To answer your question, I no longer fight through the lies. I used

to fight so hard to get people in the family to see the truth. Now I

don't even bother. They are swayed by her freaking out/crying all

the time so they just automatically side with her. I personally think

they can't cope with her moods so it is easier to blame me and stop

talking to me (which makes her happy and calm) than to stand up for

the truth. I think in most people's hearts, they KNOW the truth.

Most people aren't strong enough to stand up for the truth. I know I

am and always have been, hence why I don't get along with nada and

don't want nada in my life. I refuse to be one of the

many " followers " who does what she wants when she wants it, even when

it is wrong. To me, it is like a little cult or something that she

runs. Sick.

As far as your brother, it is very sad that she is feeding him lies

about how you feel about him. It's unfortunate you can't contact him

without her presence to tell him how much you love him and want a

relationship. Nadas make that impossible in many cases. My brother

and his new wife stopped talking to me at nada's demand. He just does

whatever she wants to please her and keep her calm. My brother is

weak, very weak and she controls him. I still love him and have no

anger toward him. I know he'll never escape her mentally ill world.

I've learned to accept it. It is not my fault nor is it my problem

so I've moved on. If/when I see my brother and his family I'll be

nice and cordial, but I've accepted the fact that as long as nada is

on this earth, I will not be able to have a relationship with him

because she won't allow it.

Nadas control the worlds of those people who let them. I'm moving on

and enjoy my world of peace for now.

I personally wouldn't try to explain the truth. If someone asks you,

sure, tell the facts as unemotionally as you can (so so so hard to

do!) but if people don't bring it up, I wouldn't either.

It never ceases to amaze me how many people easily fall under our

nada's sick little spells. But there are also people who see the

truth...

>

> My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada is

> starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first

time

> in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing happened.

> Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she

does

> something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's

hurtful

> and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life. Yet

I

> still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving

and

> supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without warning.

> Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or is

> NC the only way to go?

>

> Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old brother

> who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells

people

> this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the

one

> who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

>

> He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him to

> know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that this

> summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal. That

> really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that I

> understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if

she

> convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it and

> heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never

talked

> to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no

idea

> what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-mail

> him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned off.

So

> my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

>

> So here's my question:

>

> Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people

figure

> it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive

and

> sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or that

> I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really need

> some unbiased feedback...

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks. That is kind of what I was expecting to hear and needed to

hear. She has proven time after time that she will win at all costs

so why up the ante, right?

I can't believe I'm even wasting my energy thinking about it. I'm

just going to pray that my brother sees the truth someday and leave

it in God's hands. Same for my other brother, although he's older and

seesm to think for himself.

It's so confusing. The more I distance myself from her, the easier it

is for her build this campaign against me, but I'm tired of fighting

it. It's worth it to be free from her abuse.

> >

> > My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada

is

> > starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first

> time

> > in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> > contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> > apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> > until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing happened.

> > Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she

> does

> > something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's

> hurtful

> > and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life.

Yet

> I

> > still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving

> and

> > supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without

warning.

> > Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or

is

> > NC the only way to go?

> >

> > Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old

brother

> > who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> > ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells

> people

> > this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the

> one

> > who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> > keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

> >

> > He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him

to

> > know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that

this

> > summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> > because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal.

That

> > really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that I

> > understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if

> she

> > convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it

and

> > heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never

> talked

> > to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no

> idea

> > what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-

mail

> > him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned

off.

> So

> > my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

> >

> > So here's my question:

> >

> > Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people

> figure

> > it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive

> and

> > sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> > straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or

that

> > I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really need

> > some unbiased feedback...

> >

>

[Guest guest]

> Yet I

> still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving and

> supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without warning.

That's exactly the hook that I've found with my BPD nada. It's somehow

almost more painful to think of a life of NC, as an " orphan " , than to

stay in relationship and put up with the abuse. I keep telling myself

that I know about BPD, so I should be able to overlook the abusive

things she says or does. I should be stronger somehow because I know

the truth.

I'm in a similar place at the moment -- wondering if it's worth

continuing a relationship or if I'm just hanging on to a fantasy of

that good mom. I know I'm not just fooling myself -- she's in there. I

just haven't seen her in a very long time.

I understand with your brother it must be very conflicting for you. It

seems like it would be important to him to know that you're still

there and that you support him. Does he have an opportunity to check

email at school? Could you leave a message for him there for him to

call you -- maybe even collect, if necessary -- so that you can

reconnect? There are other options to contact him, if that's your

struggle. I know my brother often thinks I'm " over-reacting " or

doesn't notice that I'm trying to maintain contact with him, though.

He has a different way of dealing with and processing the family drama.

So I don't know if I'm qualified to give you an " unbiased " answer, but

I can tell you that when I am in a place like this -- debating what to

do and struggling with old patterns -- I seek out more support. I call

my therapist if I don't have an appointment scheduled in the near

future. I re-read UBM and SWOE and I journal. I get bodywork and make

sure I'm taking care of myself. It's a process and there's no one

answer. In the long run, though, it makes sense to do what's best for

you.

>

> My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada is

> starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first time

> in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing happened.

> Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she does

> something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's hurtful

> and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life. Yet I

> still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving and

> supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without warning.

> Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or is

> NC the only way to go?

>

> Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old brother

> who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells people

> this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the one

> who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

>

> He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him to

> know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that this

> summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal. That

> really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that I

> understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if she

> convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it and

> heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never talked

> to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no idea

> what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-mail

> him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned off. So

> my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

>

> So here's my question:

>

> Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people figure

> it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive and

> sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or that

> I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really need

> some unbiased feedback...

>

[Guest guest]

Your situation makes my heart break; its so sad that your brother is

basically being held " captive " by your nada because he is still

financially dependent on her. I believe you are right and he never

got your letter. He probably has been brainwashed by your nada that

it is his job to take care of her, also. That puts a lot of stress on

him, it will be very difficult for him to ever break away from her and

have his own life.

All you can do is try to let him know, somehow, that you are there for

him if he ever wants to talk to you. Leave the door open.

RE your nada, I suppose you can try limited contact as long as she is

behaving herself, but when you see the first hints of abusive behavior

just exit, again.

I'm sure lots of other members here will have some good advice for you.

-Annie

>

> My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada is

> starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first time

> in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing happened.

> Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she does

> something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's hurtful

> and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life. Yet I

> still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving and

> supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without warning.

> Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or is

> NC the only way to go?

>

> Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old brother

> who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells people

> this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the one

> who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

>

> He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him to

> know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that this

> summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal. That

> really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that I

> understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if she

> convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it and

> heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never talked

> to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no idea

> what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-mail

> him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned off. So

> my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

>

> So here's my question:

>

> Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people figure

> it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive and

> sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or that

> I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really need

> some unbiased feedback...

>

[Guest guest]

This is so sad about not being able to speak with your brother. I

wanted to let you know that you are not alone in facing this

behavior: my nada promised me three years ago when I married that

she would make sure I never saw my younger brother or sister again.

She's made good on her promise pretty much through the means you

describe below - she pays their cell phone bills, monitors their

calls, periodically checks all their e-mails, opens their mail,

threatens to cut them off financially, etc. She has lied to them

about how I am too depressed to be in touch with them, and I'm sure

has come up with other fibs concerning either my mental health or my

selfishness and betrayal through the years. My contact with my

father has decreased to practically nothing - I'm pretty sure

because she flies into a rage whenever he mentions that he has

spoken to me - and he's too codependent not to tell her about our

conversations. The same, sadly, with my extended family members -

she has intimidated those close to her into being too frightened of

her reaction to be in touch with me.

Well, sad though it is to be without family, I have to say it is

liberating - think I was just reading in a novel that with every

loss, no matter how unwelcome, comes a little bit of freedom. My

own family is far healthier than it could be if she were involved in

our lives at all. Yes, I miss my brother and sister (there is a

third sister too, basically nada-in-training, who I don't miss at

all!), but I realize now that all the fantasies I had about saving

my teen siblings were just fantasies, sicne I grew up thinking it

was my job to save everyone. I really hope that they will leave and

move away and get some therapy, but the best I can do for them is to

show that it's possible. Hope that helps -

Sara

> >

> > My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada

is

> > starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first

time

> > in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> > contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> > apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> > until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing

happened.

> > Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she

does

> > something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's

hurtful

> > and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life.

Yet I

> > still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very

loving and

> > supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without

warning.

> > Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or

is

> > NC the only way to go?

> >

> > Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old

brother

> > who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> > ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells

people

> > this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the

one

> > who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> > keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

> >

> > He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him

to

> > know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that

this

> > summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> > because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal.

That

> > really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that

I

> > understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if

she

> > convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it

and

> > heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never

talked

> > to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no

idea

> > what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-

mail

> > him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned

off. So

> > my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

> >

> > So here's my question:

> >

> > Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people

figure

> > it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive

and

> > sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> > straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or

that

> > I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really

need

> > some unbiased feedback...

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the feedback. You are right. I know that there always is a

way, but you know I think deep down I'm actually a little scared to

reach out to my brother. He has no boundaries so I'm sure my mom will

find out one way or the other and I just don't know how she will

react. Any time I show someone love she gets jealous and if I'm not

talking to her at the same time watch out! I'm truly " walking on

eggshells. " Thanks for helping me sort through these feelings - there

are so many sides to it.

I am going to take your advice to take care of myself and I'll know

what to do when I'm ready to do it. Great advice!

> >

> > My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada

is

> > starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first

time

> > in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> > contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> > apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> > until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing happened.

> > Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she

does

> > something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's

hurtful

> > and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life.

Yet I

> > still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving

and

> > supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without

warning.

> > Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or

is

> > NC the only way to go?

> >

> > Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old

brother

> > who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> > ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells

people

> > this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the

one

> > who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> > keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

> >

> > He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him

to

> > know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that

this

> > summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> > because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal.

That

> > really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that I

> > understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if

she

> > convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it

and

> > heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never

talked

> > to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no

idea

> > what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-

mail

> > him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned

off. So

> > my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

> >

> > So here's my question:

> >

> > Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people

figure

> > it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive

and

> > sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> > straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or

that

> > I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really need

> > some unbiased feedback...

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for your caring words. Sometimes I worry about him because for

example he is 18 and still does not drive. My nada told me he is

scared, but I took him driving shortly after he turned 16 and he did

great and didn't seem scared. So I also wonder if she's manipulating

that situation. He is the third child in the family (I am oldest and

have another brother who has left home) and I wonder if she

has " learned her lesson " about letting us leave home and is doing her

best to keep him there. This may be part of why she is splitting us.

I always encourage him and even have a college fund set up for him so

that is a threat to her. However, my therapist made a good point

about him " coming out. " That takes a lot of courage so my hope is

that he really will find it in him to leave home and have a healthier

life after high school graduation.

> >

> > My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada

is

> > starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first

time

> > in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> > contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> > apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> > until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing happened.

> > Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she

does

> > something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's

hurtful

> > and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life.

Yet I

> > still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving

and

> > supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without

warning.

> > Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or

is

> > NC the only way to go?

> >

> > Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old

brother

> > who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> > ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells

people

> > this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the

one

> > who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> > keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

> >

> > He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him

to

> > know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that

this

> > summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> > because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal.

That

> > really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that I

> > understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if

she

> > convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it

and

> > heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never

talked

> > to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no

idea

> > what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-

mail

> > him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned

off. So

> > my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

> >

> > So here's my question:

> >

> > Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people

figure

> > it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive

and

> > sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> > straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or

that

> > I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really need

> > some unbiased feedback...

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Great advice - thanks!!!

> > >

> > > My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my

nada

> is

> > > starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the

first

> time

> > > in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> > > contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she

doesn't

> > > apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just

waits

> > > until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing

> happened.

> > > Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she

> does

> > > something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's

> hurtful

> > > and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life.

> Yet I

> > > still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very

> loving and

> > > supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without

> warning.

> > > Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada

or

> is

> > > NC the only way to go?

> > >

> > > Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old

> brother

> > > who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> > > ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells

> people

> > > this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is

the

> one

> > > who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> > > keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

> > >

> > > He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him

> to

> > > know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that

> this

> > > summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted

it

> > > because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal.

> That

> > > really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that

> I

> > > understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or

if

> she

> > > convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it

> and

> > > heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never

> talked

> > > to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have

no

> idea

> > > what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-

> mail

> > > him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned

> off. So

> > > my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

> > >

> > > So here's my question:

> > >

> > > Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people

> figure

> > > it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be

passive

> and

> > > sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> > > straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or

> that

> > > I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really

> need

> > > some unbiased feedback...

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Going NC is scary. It's also remarkably powerful.

Here's my experience. NC was difficult. You need a real support

network in place. But if you stay strong, things get better & better.

What I now see, is that I never had a REAL relationship with my FOO to

begin with...so I haven't actually lost ANYTHING. Having been NC for 2

1/2 years now, I'm absolutely certain that I have only gained personal

power and self-respect. Meanwhile, my narcissistic/BPD family is

scrambling around looking for their ultra-compliant little scapegoat,

emotional garbage-can, & passive audience. Poor little buggers. My

heart goes out to them.

I found this excerpt on the web about narcissism(substitute BPD)

& co-narcissism (Non-BPD):

A relationship is an interpersonal interaction in which each person is

able to consider and act on his or her own needs, experience, and

point of view, as well as being able to consider and respond to the

experience of the other person. In a narcissistic encounter, there is,

psychologically, only one person present. The co-naracissist (NON)

dissappears for both people, and only the naracissistic (BPD) person's

experience is important.

When you ain't got nothing you got nothing to lose!

> >

> > My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada is

> > starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first time

> > in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> > contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> > apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> > until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing happened.

> > Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she does

> > something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's hurtful

> > and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life. Yet I

> > still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving and

> > supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without warning.

> > Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or is

> > NC the only way to go?

> >

> > Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old brother

> > who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> > ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells people

> > this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the one

> > who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> > keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

> >

> > He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him to

> > know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that this

> > summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> > because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal. That

> > really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that I

> > understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if she

> > convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it and

> > heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never talked

> > to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no idea

> > what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-mail

> > him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned off. So

> > my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

> >

> > So here's my question:

> >

> > Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people figure

> > it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive and

> > sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> > straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or that

> > I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really need

> > some unbiased feedback...

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yes - that explains my brother. Sometimes the real him is there, but

lately it's her in his body. He's disappeared. It's eerie - his voice

even sounds like her. Like there's this 52 year old woman in an 18

year old guy's body. At times I thought it was just a strong genetic

likeness, but this is probably much closer to the truth and explains

why it makes me feel so creeped out. I mean I really love him and

have fond memories from when he was younger, but he has changed. As

you put it, maybe my real brother doesn't even exist anymore.

> > >

> > > My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my

nada is

> > > starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the

first time

> > > in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> > > contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she

doesn't

> > > apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just

waits

> > > until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing

happened.

> > > Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she

does

> > > something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's

hurtful

> > > and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life.

Yet I

> > > still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very

loving and

> > > supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without

warning.

> > > Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada

or is

> > > NC the only way to go?

> > >

> > > Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old

brother

> > > who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> > > ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells

people

> > > this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is

the one

> > > who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> > > keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

> > >

> > > He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him

to

> > > know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that

this

> > > summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted

it

> > > because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal.

That

> > > really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that

I

> > > understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or

if she

> > > convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it

and

> > > heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never

talked

> > > to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have

no idea

> > > what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-

mail

> > > him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned

off. So

> > > my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

> > >

> > > So here's my question:

> > >

> > > Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people

figure

> > > it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be

passive and

> > > sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> > > straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or

that

> > > I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really

need

> > > some unbiased feedback...

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

You are probably right, all the signs are there; your nada wants to

totally control, isolate, and infantilize your brother so he will

never leave her.

Fear of abandonment is one of the key traits of bpd.

Nadas are masters of using guilt to manipulate their children (its one

of their chief weapons, along with physical fear, fear of being

badmouthed to the rest of the family, suicide threats, etc.) and she

may very well be brainwashing him with guilt over ever leaving her:

its his job to stay with, support, and be care-taker to poor, sad nada.

Its the emotional equivalent of breaking his legs so that he can't run

away.

If you leave your door open to him, if he knows that you are there for

him when he does want to talk or does get the courage to leave,

that's probably the best you can do.

-Annie

> > >

> > > My anger and sadness over the last abusive incident with my nada

> is

> > > starting to fade. I started taking antidepressents for the first

> time

> > > in my life so I'm feeling strong and have been thinking about

> > > contacting her. I know this is a dangerous pattern - she doesn't

> > > apologize and won't discuss what happened at all. She just waits

> > > until the whole thing blows over and acts as if nothing happened.

> > > Then we have a few good months, she gains my trust and then she

> does

> > > something awful to me and the whole cycle starts again. It's

> hurtful

> > > and exhausting and I always regret letting her back in my life.

> Yet I

> > > still have this yearning for the mom who is sometimes very loving

> and

> > > supportive, even though I know she could turn evil without

> warning.

> > > Has anyone succeeded at having a relationship with their nada or

> is

> > > NC the only way to go?

> > >

> > > Part of my motivation is to get in touch with my 18-yr-old

> brother

> > > who still lives with her. I believe she's been telling him I'm

> > > ashamed of the fact that he is gay, which is a lie. She tells

> people

> > > this is the reason I am keeping my distance from her. She is the

> one

> > > who has a problem with it, but I just want him to be happy. I'm

> > > keeping my distance because of her behavior, not his.

> > >

> > > He's graduating from high school this year, and I just want him

> to

> > > know the truth. I sent him a letter telling him basically that

> this

> > > summer, but I'm not sure if he got it. I know she intercepted it

> > > because she told me he didn't like it and found it impersonal.

> That

> > > really confused me because I wrote from the heart, but now that I

> > > understand more about BPD I wonder if she kept it from him or if

> she

> > > convinced him it was impersonal or untrue. Hopefully he saw it

> and

> > > heard what I was saying despite her manipulation. He has never

> talked

> > > to me about it and doesn't initiate contact with me so I have no

> idea

> > > what he thinks. She says their computer is broken so I can't e-

> mail

> > > him. She also stopped paying his cell phone and it was turned

> off. So

> > > my only way to him is through her (by her design I'm sure.)

> > >

> > > So here's my question:

> > >

> > > Do you fight through the lies or just let it go and let people

> figure

> > > it out on their own? I've been trained all my life to be passive

> and

> > > sometimes I think I should be more assertive and set the record

> > > straight. Other times I think there's no winning with a BPD or

> that

> > > I'm being codependent and should let it go. I guess I really need

> > > some unbiased feedback...

> > >

> >

>