Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the number > about the Explant program. > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, not > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I can > see about assistance with removal. > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all my > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, all > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months from > them. > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I am now > IN SHOCK. > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE implants!!!! > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were SALINE, > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > No wonder I've been sick! > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me some > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I have > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, Tennessee. > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Leyna, here's belated BIG HUGE HUG!!! I don't have access to a computer everyday right now, so I'm catching up. What a shocking thing to learn!!! I'm praying for you. Love & Blessings, Sunny --- In , " leyna1964 " <leyna1964@...> wrote: > > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the number > about the Explant program. > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, not > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I can > see about assistance with removal. > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all my > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, all > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months from > them. > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I am now > IN SHOCK. > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE implants!!!! > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were SALINE, > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > No wonder I've been sick! > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me some > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I have > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, Tennessee. > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 You got THAT right!! The top reason I'm getting a lawyer is for accountability of the manufacturers. The money is secondary. Have you heard of the Raging Grannys? They're a group out of Vancouver, B.C. Canada, I think. Well, they protest and get things done. They're very elderly and look really cute. I'm what they call an assertive, determined granny. (It must be some of my Ukrainian heritage...we are stubborn & steadfast, sometimes to a fault!) I WILL sit on their doorstep until they budge. People used to look and say, " oh, no...it's HER!!! You'd better talk to her, or she will be here all week. " lol Whatever it takes!! Love & Prayers, Sunny > > > > > > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > > > > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > > > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > > > > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the number > > > about the Explant program. > > > > > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > > > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, > > not > > > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > > > > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I > can > > > see about assistance with removal. > > > > > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all > my > > > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, > all > > > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months from > > > them. > > > > > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > > > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > > > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > > > > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I am > > now > > > IN SHOCK. > > > > > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE > > implants!!!! > > > > > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were > SALINE, > > > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > > > > > No wonder I've been sick! > > > > > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me > some > > > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > > > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > > > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > > > > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I > have > > > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, > > Tennessee. > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 I don't remember the doctor's name who did my surgery....it was 16 years ago, and he was elderly at that time, so I imagine that he's no longer practicing. When I said " Saline " , he must have thought I wanted silicone. *shudders* Does anyone know of anyone who gives loans to people with really bad credit and a bankruptcy? First, when/if that doctor calls me back on Monday, I'll schedule a consultation with them, IF they are the one who does En Bloc. The name was Wallace....was that the one Rogene recommended? I had called them before, a few weeks ago, and the nurse I talked to had implants herself and was very adament about how implants do NOT cause any health problems, and she went on and on about how deformed I would be after I had them removed. So I'm not at all thrilled about having to call her back..... > > > > > > > > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > > > > > > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > > > > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > > > > > > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the > number > > > > about the Explant program. > > > > > > > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > > > > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, > > > not > > > > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > > > > > > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I > > can > > > > see about assistance with removal. > > > > > > > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all > > my > > > > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, > > all > > > > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months > from > > > > them. > > > > > > > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > > > > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > > > > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > > > > > > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I > am > > > now > > > > IN SHOCK. > > > > > > > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE > > > implants!!!! > > > > > > > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were > > SALINE, > > > > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > > > > > > > No wonder I've been sick! > > > > > > > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me > > some > > > > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > > > > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > > > > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > > > > > > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I > > have > > > > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, > > > Tennessee. > > > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 -Ok, so I just contacted that Colleen girl-she has a nice website. I hope she writes back, especially since we live in the same place! Does everyone think that I should have an MRI done, to see if my SILICONE implants are leaking? -- In , Tricia Trish <glory2glory1401@...> wrote: > > {{{HUG}}} > > I know this is a shock....wow. I have heard of this happening before though! I am not sure why this was an often repeated mistake....either the doctor didn't hear you right (not likely), or he was arrogant and took it upon himself to implant you with what HE thought was a better product, leftover inventory, or just what was on hand. (more likely). It is unfortunate. In fact, I have a friend who has had " salines " for about 16 years and my guess is that she REALLY has silicone....just my intuition anyway. > > It is a blessing that you have found the funds for explant now though....if you can go to an expert at explant, I would highly recommend it. You have no idea if your implants are ruptured or not, and it is really, really important that you have them taken out en bloc. No exceptions there! En bloc is the only way to go in your case. > > Ohio isn't that far from you, is it? > > Have you tried to make contact with Colleen McKenzie in Tennessee? She also went through explant...she has a website at www.poisonedbeauty.com Maybe she can walk you through this and help you find someone who will explant properly, and get the assistance you need. There's got to be a way for you to get these things out and get it paid for. > > I'm so sorry! It's a shock, but it's not the end of the world....you'll get through this and we will be here to help you through the difficulties. That's the purpose for this group! > {{{HUG}}}} > Patty > > leyna1964 <leyna1964@...> wrote: > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the number > about the Explant program. > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, not > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I can > see about assistance with removal. > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all my > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, all > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months from > them. > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I am now > IN SHOCK. > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE implants!!!! > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were SALINE, > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > No wonder I've been sick! > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me some > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I have > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, Tennessee. > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Get your email and more, right on the new .com > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Sunny, I have heard of the Raging Grannies! I love it!!!! Activist grannies. Well, I am also an assertive determined grannie! Maybe we should think of them not as 'cute' but 'strong spirited women'!!! ;-) I still can't believe I am a grannie! I was a grannie that mountain biked and jogged until I got sick. ;-( But my spirit is still there and I'm on the mend. So I will be back campaigning for the dems this fall and in 2008! I write letters and let my congress people know what I think! In 2004 I was too sick to be a pollwatcher, although my husband was - a " lawyer for Kerry'. My hope in 2008 is to be there with him. Sunny, what do you plan to do with your lawyer? WIll you sue the manufacturer? You are talking about a lawsuit, and not a settlement? Money is always important in a lawsuit - that's how the scumbags are made accountable. Did you see that plaintiffs won 2 Vioxx cases recently? And a judge today threw out a Merck victory for a new trial for the plaintiff. THIS is accountability!!!! Merck lied about the dangers of this drug. And as Ilena mentioned, Big Tobacco recently got slammed in court too. It has been a very good week for consumer justice. Oh, and of course, in a different vein, a federal court judge ruled that Bush administration warrantless wiretapping violated the US Constitution in the first and fourth amendment, and separation of powers, as well as federal statutory law! I think the Supreme Court will eventually uphold this ruling, but it will go to a lower appeals court first. Bush said to the public that we should want to know who is calling Al Queda - which was simply dishonest. He can still tap phones, and even get a warrant after the fact in an emergency, all within the law. He chose to simply violate the law and claim he had powers to do so. But the Judge said that in America, we do not have a hereditary King. > > > > > > > > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > > > > > > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > > > > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > > > > > > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the > number > > > > about the Explant program. > > > > > > > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > > > > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, > > > not > > > > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > > > > > > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I > > can > > > > see about assistance with removal. > > > > > > > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all > > my > > > > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, > > all > > > > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months > from > > > > them. > > > > > > > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > > > > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > > > > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > > > > > > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I > am > > > now > > > > IN SHOCK. > > > > > > > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE > > > implants!!!! > > > > > > > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were > > SALINE, > > > > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > > > > > > > No wonder I've been sick! > > > > > > > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me > > some > > > > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > > > > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > > > > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > > > > > > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I > > have > > > > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, > > > Tennessee. > > > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 No...I had my implants put in 16 years ago, and the doctor was elderly at that time, so more than likely he is no longer alive. Also, I remember signing some paper saying that if anything went wrong, I would not hold him responisible. > > > > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the number > > about the Explant program. > > > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, > not > > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I can > > see about assistance with removal. > > > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all my > > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, all > > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months from > > them. > > > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I am > now > > IN SHOCK. > > > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE > implants!!!! > > > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were SALINE, > > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > > > No wonder I've been sick! > > > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me some > > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I have > > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, > Tennessee. > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 I'm really confused about the whole thing. I mean, I thought that Dow Corning was this huge company, and that Bristol Meyers was just somehow the name of the implants or something...if that makes sense. I do remember seeing it on my paperwork. When I got the implants, the Dow Corning Settlement went into effect one year later. My best friend at the time had implants, and she talked me into going with her to " get tested " for all the diseases associated with implants. She said we would " get a lot of money " if we had any of the diseases and conditions associated with implants. So she got her blood drawn before me and she came out of the doctors office all upset, saying " There is NOTHING wrong with me! " . I didn't think anything would be wrong with me either, but I went in and got my blood drawn. The doctor said I had Raynaud's syndrome, and the antibodies for Lupus and Rheumatoid Arthritis. So, I got a lawyer at that time, who said I would receive a LOT of money. Over the years, I've turned in medical records and my original surgery records to Dow Corning, and in return, I've received paperwork from them every few months or year or so. It wasn't until today that I contacted them about explant assistance, and found out that my implants were really silicone. My lawyer is no longer practicing, and neither is the doctor who did my surgery-at least I doubt that he is, and I don't even remember his name. BUT, Dow Corning today said they would send me copies of all my papers, so I should find out more then. > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the number > about the Explant program. > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, not > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I can > see about assistance with removal. > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all my > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, all > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months from > them. > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I am now > IN SHOCK. > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE implants!!!! > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were SALINE, > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > No wonder I've been sick! > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me some > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I have > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, Tennessee. > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 While I'm certainly not an expert on anything other than how sick I got from implants (saline), I do agree that there are additional complications with silicone than there are with saline. Saline are by no means safe and pose a threat to our immune systems - we tend to share many of the same complaints, which perhaps are brought about by the shell being made of the same materials - but I think the scary part about silicone is that the gel breaks loose and is embedded throughout the body, and thus continues to make people sick. Sis > > > > > > > > In a message dated 8/18/2006 1:22:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, > > leyna1964@ writes: > > > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE implants!!!! > > > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were SALINE, > > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > > > No wonder I've been sick! > > > > > > > > > > > > Leyna, > > > > At the same time -- thank God they are helping you explant. It's an AWFUL > > situation, but now you can hopefully get them out! > > > > Silicone IS worse than having Salines, but either way --- many of us have > > never had Silicone ones, and have Salines that are making us just as sick. So, > > I know it's alarming... and in my mind, I would feel violated in some way... > > but view it as a way now to get them OUT. > > > > Use that upset and anger to make you want to detox that much harder. I know > > that's easier said than done, because I'm having trouble finding it in me to > > detox... but this gives you all the more reason to get this junk OUT of your > > body! > > > > Hang in there!!!!!! > > > > Brigite > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Not completely Rogene. But they sure are working on it - if this administration and their cronies get their way, there will be no access to the courts for injured consumers. So that is where we have to become active and vote. Our lives and the lives of our families are at stake. > > > > > > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > > > > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > > > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > > > > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the number > > > about the Explant program. > > > > > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > > > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, > > not > > > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > > > > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I > can > > > see about assistance with removal. > > > > > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all > my > > > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, > all > > > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months from > > > them. > > > > > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > > > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > > > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > > > > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I am > > now > > > IN SHOCK. > > > > > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE > > implants!!!! > > > > > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were > SALINE, > > > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > > > > > No wonder I've been sick! > > > > > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me > some > > > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > > > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > > > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > > > > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I > have > > > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, > > Tennessee. > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 > > . .. > > How awful! . . . Both your doctor and your pharmacist should have caught the conflict between medications! . . . I suspect they're regrouping and trying to figure out how to cover they -you-kno-whats! > > Can you find a good naturopath there in Hawaii? . . . He/she may be able to help you get straightened out . . . I have a friend who lived in Honolulu . . . She may be able to recommend someone there. > > I'd suggesting calling your pharmacist . . . He/she probably knows more about the medications anyway! . . . Some doctors get their education from their non-medically educated drug salesmen! > > Hugs, > > Rogene >Thanks Rogene, You are right they are blaming each other. Any way I am going to start looking for naturopath and maybe just keep the rheumy, I am sorry about the post was mine one you were talking about? Terri P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Rogene, Well, I don't know yet that I will qualify for a loan. My credit is HORRIBLE. I want to get it done as soon as I can find out the price from this doctor, and as soon as a loan is approved and a check sent to me or whatever. I'm now scared to get the mammogram I had scheduled for October.... > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the number > about the Explant program. > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, not > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I can > see about assistance with removal. > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all my > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, all > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months from > them. > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I am now > IN SHOCK. > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE implants!!!! > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were SALINE, > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > No wonder I've been sick! > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me some > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I have > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, Tennessee. > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 That's what I figured. I've been having yearly mammograms for the last 12 years, and from what I'm reading, it's one of the easiest ways to make implants rupture-so I've been very lucky! I will cancel the appointment. > > Leyna . .. As long as you are planning to have your implants removed, I'd forget about getting the October mammogram . . . If your explanting surgeon wants one done before explant, he will let you know. > > Rogene > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 The doctor (well, nurse actually) who told me that was the one you recommended-Dr. Wallace. He's the only one who does En Bloc that I've found so far. > > Leyna . .. As long as you are planning to have your implants removed, I'd forget about getting the October mammogram . . . If your explanting surgeon wants one done before explant, he will let you know. > > Rogene > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Molly, I definitely am going for settlement as well. What I meant is that even if I don't get a settlement, it'll be worth it, to put them in the limelight. Isn't being a Grandma great? One of my cousins was fretting because she was going to become a grandma, and I told her, " Hey, look at me! Even with my grey hair -- don't I look younger since I have my grandchildren in my life. Now, she's really enjoying her 2 grandsons. What I meant by " cute " with the Raging Grannies, is the way they dress. They certainly are strong-spirited women, that's for sure. I'm in the process of researching our Canadian Federal Government for how many names are necessary on a petition to force a law change, publicly generated. If it's the peoples' government and this is a democracy, then let's see if that works. Best wishes & blessings, Sunny -- In , " Molly Bloom " <mollyb54@...> wrote: > > Sunny, > I have heard of the Raging Grannies! I love it!!!! Activist grannies. > Well, I am also an assertive determined grannie! Maybe we should think of them not as > 'cute' but 'strong spirited women'!!! ;-) > I still can't believe I am a grannie! I was a grannie that mountain biked and jogged until I > got sick. ;-( But my spirit is still there and I'm on the mend. So I will be back campaigning > for the dems this fall and in 2008! I write letters and let my congress people know what I > think! In 2004 I was too sick to be a pollwatcher, although my husband was - a " lawyer > for Kerry'. My hope in 2008 is to be there with him. > > Sunny, what do you plan to do with your lawyer? WIll you sue the manufacturer? You are > talking about a lawsuit, and not a settlement? > Money is always important in a lawsuit - that's how the scumbags are made accountable. > > Did you see that plaintiffs won 2 Vioxx cases recently? And a judge today threw out a > Merck victory for a new trial for the plaintiff. THIS is accountability!!!! > Merck lied about the dangers of this drug. > > And as Ilena mentioned, Big Tobacco recently got slammed in court too. > > It has been a very good week for consumer justice. > > Oh, and of course, in a different vein, a federal court judge ruled that Bush administration > warrantless wiretapping violated the US Constitution in the first and fourth amendment, > and separation of powers, as well as federal statutory law! I think the Supreme Court will > eventually uphold this ruling, but it will go to a lower appeals court first. Bush said to the > public that we should want to know who is calling Al Queda - which was simply dishonest. > He can still tap phones, and even get a warrant after the fact in an emergency, all within > the law. He chose to simply violate the law and claim he had powers to do so. But the > Judge said that in America, we do not have a hereditary King. > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm totally freaking out now and need a few group hugs here! > > > > > > > > > > I was reading a post about someone here who was involved in an > > > > > Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning Settlement. > > > > > > > > > > I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and called the > > number > > > > > about the Explant program. > > > > > > > > > > The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer a Dow Corning > > > > > Claiment because they " found out " that my implants are Bristol, > > > > not > > > > > Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > > > > > > > > > So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol office so that I > > > can > > > > > see about assistance with removal. > > > > > > > > > > Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, I sent in all > > > my > > > > > paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow Corning,where, > > > all > > > > > these years, I've been receiving paperwork every few months > > from > > > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > Basically, I did not know my size bags, or anything about my > > > > > implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I wanted saline > > > > > implants and to make them " not too big " . > > > > > > > > > > So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few minutes ago and I > > am > > > > now > > > > > IN SHOCK. > > > > > > > > > > She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round SILICONE > > > > implants!!!! > > > > > > > > > > OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my implants were > > > SALINE, > > > > > and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > > > > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > > > > > > > > > No wonder I've been sick! > > > > > > > > > > So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is sending me > > > some > > > > > paperwork to fill out, and they are going to cover $1,000 of my > > > > > explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them removed, they will > > > > > reimburse me for another $3,000. > > > > > > > > > > I am going to check into getting a loan to cover the rest. I > > > have > > > > > been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in Memphis, > > > > Tennessee. > > > > > > > > > > I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 I'm sorry but I disagree here. If your insurance will cover it, DO have an MRI! The MRI is not 100% accurate., but can still detect rupture in many cases. It was an MRI that showed my rupture (although it showed intracapsular and not extracapsular which it was). But that MRI helped me get insurance coverage for explant. > > >> I'm totally freaking out now and need a > > few group hugs > > > here! > > >> > > >> I was reading a post about someone here who was > > involved in an > > >> Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning > > Settlement. > > >> > > >> I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and > > called the number > > >> about the Explant program. > > >> > > >> The lady I talked to told me that I am no longer > > a Dow Corning > > >> Claiment because they " found out " that my > > implants are Bristol, > > > not > > >> Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > >> > > >> So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol > > office so that I can > > >> see about assistance with removal. > > >> > > >> Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years ago, > > I sent in all my > > >> paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to Dow > > Corning,where, all > > >> these years, I've been receiving paperwork every > > few months from > > >> them. > > >> > > >> Basically, I did not know my size bags, or > > anything about my > > >> implants-just that I had told the surgeon that I > > wanted saline > > >> implants and to make them " not too big " . > > >> > > >> So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few > > minutes ago and I am > > > now > > >> IN SHOCK. > > >> > > >> She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round > > SILICONE > > > implants!!!! > > >> > > >> OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my > > implants were SALINE, > > >> and I'm now finding out that they are SILICONE!!! > > >> > > >> I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > >> > > >> No wonder I've been sick! > > >> > > >> So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady is > > sending me some > > >> paperwork to fill out, and they are going to > > cover $1,000 of my > > >> explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them > > removed, they will > > >> reimburse me for another $3,000. > > >> > > >> I am going to check into getting a loan to cover > > the rest. I have > > >> been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc in > > Memphis, > > > Tennessee. > > >> > > >> I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> --------------------------------- > > >> Get your email and more, right on the new > > .com > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2006 Report Share Posted August 20, 2006 Rogene, Thanks for the support Rogene! I can't wait to get it done-I'm at the point to where I'm not even that worried about being deformed afterwards....well, not too much-I do have to get mammograms and breast exams done all the time! lol Oh, and then there's the husband! I asked him last night if he would mind, if I became deformed, if I keep my shirt on and never let him see my breasts ever again. He said he loved me and that he did not mind. LOL > > Leyna, > > How long it takes to get scheduled varies considerablly from one doctor to another, and from one time frame to another . .. You're looking at anything from one week to three months. > > Your manager sounds like a lulu! .. . I'm glad you didn't have to tell her something far worse! . . . I thought one requrement of a manager is to maintain confidentiality! > > Just take a deep breath and use this as an opportunity to educate a bunch of people about breast implants . .. You'll probably save a life or two. Keep your head up! . .. You only bought into what the FDA still says is safe! . . . Plus a lousy doctor's reassuranes .. . You're not alone . . There are millions of us who did the same. > > You're going to get through this . .. one step at a time. .. You'll be soooooooooo glad to be on the other side of the explant experience! > > Hugs and prayers, > > Rogene > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2006 Report Share Posted August 20, 2006 > > >>>>> I'm totally freaking out now and > > need a > > >>> few group hugs > > >>>> here! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I was reading a post about someone here who > > was > > >>> involved in an > > >>>>> Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning > > >>> Settlement. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and > > >>> called the number > > >>>>> about the Explant program. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> The lady I talked to told me that I am no > > longer > > >>> a Dow Corning > > >>>>> Claiment because they " found out " that my > > >>> implants are Bristol, > > >>>> not > > >>>>> Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol > > >>> office so that I can > > >>>>> see about assistance with removal. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years > > ago, > > >>> I sent in all my > > >>>>> paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to > > Dow > > >>> Corning,where, all > > >>>>> these years, I've been receiving paperwork > > every > > >>> few months from > > >>>>> them. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Basically, I did not know my size bags, or > > >>> anything about my > > >>>>> implants-just that I had told the surgeon that > > I > > >>> wanted saline > > >>>>> implants and to make them " not too big " . > > >>>>> > > >>>>> So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few > > >>> minutes ago and I am > > >>>> now > > >>>>> IN SHOCK. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round > > >>> SILICONE > > >>>> implants!!!! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my > > >>> implants were SALINE, > > >>>>> and I'm now finding out that they are > > SILICONE!!! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> No wonder I've been sick! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady > > is > > >>> sending me some > > >>>>> paperwork to fill out, and they are going to > > >>> cover $1,000 of my > > >>>>> explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them > > >>> removed, they will > > >>>>> reimburse me for another $3,000. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I am going to check into getting a loan to > > cover > > >>> the rest. I have > > >>>>> been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc > > in > > >>> Memphis, > > >>>> Tennessee. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2006 Report Share Posted August 20, 2006 See if you can get an MRI - needs to be a breast coil. It may help with insurance for explant (depending on where you are, what insurance, etc) - it did with mine. You are not the first I have heard that discovered they had silicone after being told they had saline. This is the height of arrogance. A plastic surgeon in Nashville TN was sued by a woman for this very thing. She ended up dropping the case - not sure why. But an appeals court said a jury could infer fraudulent concealment, therefore the statute of limitations had not run.. This guy was a big deal at Vanderbilt, and has his own clinic, contracted with Inamed to design tissue expanders, etc. He also had a drinking problem, that came out in the court docs, and clearly was an arrogant you-know-what. A real piece of work. > > > > >> I'm totally freaking out now and > > need a > > > > few group hugs > > > > > here! > > > > >> > > > > >> I was reading a post about someone here who > > was > > > > involved in an > > > > >> Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning > > > > Settlement. > > > > >> > > > > >> I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, > > and > > > > called the number > > > > >> about the Explant program. > > > > >> > > > > >> The lady I talked to told me that I am no > > longer > > > > a Dow Corning > > > > >> Claiment because they " found out " that my > > > > implants are Bristol, > > > > > not > > > > >> Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > > > >> > > > > >> So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol > > > > office so that I can > > > > >> see about assistance with removal. > > > > >> > > > > >> Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years > > ago, > > > > I sent in all my > > > > >> paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to > > Dow > > > > Corning,where, all > > > > >> these years, I've been receiving paperwork > > every > > > > few months from > > > > >> them. > > > > >> > > > > >> Basically, I did not know my size bags, or > > > > anything about my > > > > >> implants-just that I had told the surgeon > > that I > > > > wanted saline > > > > >> implants and to make them " not too big " . > > > > >> > > > > >> So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few > > > > minutes ago and I am > > > > > now > > > > >> IN SHOCK. > > > > >> > > > > >> She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel > > round > > > > SILICONE > > > > > implants!!!! > > > > >> > > > > >> OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my > > > > implants were SALINE, > > > > >> and I'm now finding out that they are > > SILICONE!!! > > > > >> > > > > >> I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > > > >> > > > > >> No wonder I've been sick! > > > > >> > > > > >> So anyway, to make a long story short-the > > lady is > > > > sending me some > > > > >> paperwork to fill out, and they are going to > > > > cover $1,000 of my > > > > >> explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them > > > > removed, they will > > > > >> reimburse me for another $3,000. > > > > >> > > > > >> I am going to check into getting a loan to > > cover > > > > the rest. I have > > > > >> been unable to find a surgeon who does En > > Bloc in > > > > Memphis, > > > > > Tennessee. > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2006 Report Share Posted August 20, 2006 Why don't you check - has insurance already agreed to help you with explant? (Sorry if you already answered this)... If so, then don't have the MRI since you are getting an explant anyway. If insurance has not agreed, then you might consider it. If you plan on paying on your own anyway, then don't worry about it. And Rogene is correct - you can still have a rupture without the MRI showing it. But if an MRI does show rupture, it can help get insurance to pay for part of the explant, as it did in my case. Just DON " T get a mammogram now!!!! If your implants are not already ruptured, a mammo can rupture them. > > >>>>> I'm totally freaking out now and > > need a > > >>> few group hugs > > >>>> here! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I was reading a post about someone here who > > was > > >>> involved in an > > >>>>> Explant Assistance program in the Dow Corning > > >>> Settlement. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I'm a claiment, so I dug out a book I had, and > > >>> called the number > > >>>>> about the Explant program. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> The lady I talked to told me that I am no > > longer > > >>> a Dow Corning > > >>>>> Claiment because they " found out " that my > > >>> implants are Bristol, > > >>>> not > > >>>>> Dow Corning or whatever. I did not know this. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> So the lady gave me the number of the Bristol > > >>> office so that I can > > >>>>> see about assistance with removal. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Now, right after I got my implants, 16 years > > ago, > > >>> I sent in all my > > >>>>> paperwork to my lawyer, who mailed it in to > > Dow > > >>> Corning,where, all > > >>>>> these years, I've been receiving paperwork > > every > > >>> few months from > > >>>>> them. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Basically, I did not know my size bags, or > > >>> anything about my > > >>>>> implants-just that I had told the surgeon that > > I > > >>> wanted saline > > >>>>> implants and to make them " not too big " . > > >>>>> > > >>>>> So this Bristol lady pulls my records a few > > >>> minutes ago and I am > > >>>> now > > >>>>> IN SHOCK. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> She told me that I have 400 Surgitek Gel round > > >>> SILICONE > > >>>> implants!!!! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> OMG!!! All these 16 years, I have thought my > > >>> implants were SALINE, > > >>>>> and I'm now finding out that they are > > SILICONE!!! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I'm FREAKING OUT RIGHT NOW! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> No wonder I've been sick! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> So anyway, to make a long story short-the lady > > is > > >>> sending me some > > >>>>> paperwork to fill out, and they are going to > > >>> cover $1,000 of my > > >>>>> explant, and then AFTER I pay to have them > > >>> removed, they will > > >>>>> reimburse me for another $3,000. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I am going to check into getting a loan to > > cover > > >>> the rest. I have > > >>>>> been unable to find a surgeon who does En Bloc > > in > > >>> Memphis, > > >>>> Tennessee. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I'm FREAKING OUT over this! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2006 Report Share Posted August 20, 2006 Not dumb. Trusting. I was too. My PS said he was board certified and he never was! He later had his license revoked. So... Oh, I also had no idea what type or brand of implants he used. I had to have them identified after explant. So my dear, you are not alone. We learn the hard way to be less trusting of doctors. I sure have. Hah! I was looking at my records from my neurologist a few years ago. He said, under 'psychiatric' that I was " debating, analyzing, perfectionistic " . This was a problem for HIM. I was unaware that it was a psychiatric problem! I am an engineer and lawyer. What the heck does he expect? Oh yeah, I forgot, we are NOT supposed to debate doctors, analyze or expect rational answers from them!!! > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> {{{HUG}}} > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> I know this is a shock....wow. I have > > > > heard of > > > > > > this happening > > > > > > > before though! I am not sure why this was > > an > > > > > > often repeated > > > > > > > mistake....either the doctor didn't hear > > you > > > > right > > > > > > (not likely), or > > > > > > > he was arrogant and took it upon himself > > to > > > > > > implant you with what HE > > > > > > > thought was a better product, leftover > > > > inventory, > > > > > > or just what was > > > > > > > on hand. (more likely). It is > > unfortunate. > > > > In > > > > > > fact, I have a > > > > > > > friend who has had " salines " for about 16 > > > > years > > > > > > and my guess is that > > > > > > > she REALLY has silicone....just my > > intuition > > > > > > anyway. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> It is a blessing that you have found > > the > > > > funds > > > > > > for explant now > > > > > > > though....if you can go to an expert at > > > > explant, I > > > > > > would highly > > > > > > > recommend it. You have no idea if your > > > > implants > > > > > > are ruptured or > > > > > > > not, and it is really, really important > > that > > > > you > > > > > > have them taken out > > > > > > > en bloc. No exceptions there! En bloc is > > the > > > > > > only way to go in > > > > > > > your case. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Ohio isn't that far from you, is it? > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> Have you tried to make contact with > > Colleen > > > > > > McKenzie in > > > > > > > Tennessee? She also went through > > > > explant...she > > > > > > has a website at > > > > > > > www.poisonedbeauty.com Maybe she can walk > > you > > > > > > through this and help > > > > > > > you find someone who will explant > > properly, > > > > and > > > > > > get the assistance > > > > > > > you need. There's got to be a way for you > > to > > > > get > > > > > > these things out > > > > > > > and get it paid for. > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> I'm so sorry! It's a shock, but it's > > not > > > > the > > > > > > end of the > > > > > > > world....you'll get through this and we > > will > > > > be > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2006 Report Share Posted August 20, 2006 Exactly! That is where an MRI can come in helpful. My internist wrote a letter of medical necessity based on the MRI, and then Dr. Kolb helped as well. Insurance didn't bat an eye. -- In , Lynda <coss@...> wrote: > > I have always advised women to never, never ask their insurance > company if they will cover this procedure, get two doctors to write a > letter of medical necessity and approach it that way by submitting > the letters. It seems to work out best for most women that way. > > Lynda > > > At 12:15 PM 8/20/2006, you wrote: > > >No, I haven't talked to my insurance company about > >this yet-it's the number one thing on my list to do > >tomorrow, before I talk to any more surgeons. > > > >--- Molly Bloom > ><<mailto:mollyb54%40bellsouth.net>mollyb54@...> wrote: > > > > > Why don't you check - has insurance already agreed > > > to help you with explant? (Sorry if > > > you already answered this)... If so, then don't > > > have the MRI since you are getting an > > > explant anyway. If insurance has not agreed, then > > > you might consider it. > > > If you plan on paying on your own anyway, then don't > > > worry about it. > > > > > > And Rogene is correct - you can still have a rupture > > > without the MRI showing it. > > > But if an MRI does show rupture, it can help get > > > insurance to pay for part of the explant, as > > > it did in my case. > > > > > > Just DON " T get a mammogram now!!!! If your implants > > > are not already ruptured, a > > > mammo can rupture them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> I'm totally freaking out now and > > > > > need a > > > > > >>> few group hugs > > > > > >>>> here! > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> I was reading a post about someone here > > > who > > > > > was > > > > > >>> involved in an > > > > > >>>>> Explant Assistance program in the Dow > > > Corning > > > > >=== message truncated === > > > >__________________________________________________ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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