Guest guest Posted March 7, 2002 Report Share Posted March 7, 2002 Messages from archive of gallstonesegroups messages/gallstones/ From: Beth <tyrr@...> Date: Sun Jul 2, 2000 7:47pm Subject: My first liver cleanse Dear List Mates, Well, I tried it. Here's how my first liver/gallbladder cleanse went, in point form: ·did what the procedure instructed, drinking the oil/grapefruit potion last night ·was up to excrete epsom salt water twice in the first 1.5 hours of retiring :-( ·up four more times during the night do expell salt water ·woke up at 5:00 a.m. with nausea which lasted for an hour ·fell back to sleep and got up at 7:30 to evacuate bowels, again, and take second-last drink of salts and just stayed up afterward ·began passing small, dark, pea-green stones 1-3 per occasion ·I was pretty disappointed that there weren't more stones, not to mention bigger ones, so I didn't bother to drink the last serving of salts ·subsequent movements revealed several tiny, tan coloured stones, probably 25 or so, and I wished I'd had the last serving of salts, but I was already drinking a beverage and thought better of downing it at that point ·my last movement contained several tiny stones and one green one the size of an elongated dime(the biggest one yet) All in all, I think I would have done better had I done a parasite cleanse closer to the flush, and in addition, done the required zapping for a week prior. As cautioned, I did feel the nausea which I could have avoided, but all in all I feel the cleanse was a success. I'm confused as to why the instructions inferred that I would sleep through the night; those salts just kept coming! I wonder if my system takes longer than most to process them. Anyone out there able to sleep through the night? I thought I'd have an accident if I tried to hold it, so I just kept going to the loo. Having been warned by several of you how disgusting the epsom salts would taste, I held my nose and quickly gulped the stuff with a straw, rinsing my mouth with tap water before unplugging my nose. This save me from the gag-reflex I knew would occur. The olive oil/pink grapefruit mixture was surprizingly tasty while I chugged it but I didn't really appreciate the olive taste when I finished. It was no biggie, though, and quite an easy task. ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: Wykes <maryyx@...> Date: Sat Jul 8, 2000 6:15am Subject: 3rd flush Morning all... Well, I am doing my third flush this weekend. Started with the apple juice yesterday, and will continue today. Then do the epsom salts, oil/juice mixture, etc. this afternoon and evening. Didn't have much visible result the second time.... but I think part of the reason is that I didn't follow all the way through with the Epsom salts. I have felt better since that 2nd cleanse. So... we'll see how it goes this time. At any rate, I know I am on the right track. We have had company this past week, and I have eaten many inappropriate foods. The difference in the way I have felt has left me with no doubt that the liver cleansing diet is the way to go for me... as a life long eating plan. Have a great weekend all. ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: Wykes <maryyx@...> Date: Sun Jul 9, 2000 3:20am Subject: not fun Hi all... I am up early cause it is more pleasant than just lying in bed feeling yucky. My first two cleanses, I really didn't have much of a problem with feeling bad.... but this one is not fun. As with last time, after taking the oil/juice mixture and lying down, I had some pain in the gallbladder area (though not severe).... and then some in my back on the right side. I was lying on my right side... and finally decided that maybe my excess bulk was squashing the gallbladder in that position and rolled over on to my back.... as I have also seen that recommended. That felt better, and I was able to get to sleep. For me this lying on the right side is complicated by the fact that I have sleep apnea, and have to sleep with a mask on my face that keeps the breathing passages open during the night. It is very awkward to sleep on my side, 'cause the mask slips. I woke up a little before four feeling very yucky. Made a trip to the bathroom and felt a little better.... but had major nausea, and was burping oil/juice mixture. I started thinking that maybe I don't want to keep doing this.... but then I thought about surgery as an alternative and decided it wasn't so bad. I have not had surgery recommended, but feel I was headed in that direction. I had an ultrasound scheduled a few months ago, but missed my appointment. Had started a new job, and forgot about it. I was set to go for the first apointment, but the ultrasound machine broke down and they called a few hours prior to the appt. to reschedule.... and it was that 2nd appt. that I missed. I decided that it was kind of pointless, since I already knew what the problem was, and I didn't want to argue with my Doctor about alternative procedures. He has generally been a bit condescending about alternatives to standard medical procedures. Well... TTYL.... ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <survivor@...> Date: Tue Jul 11, 2000 9:16pm Subject: glad to be a part of the group Hi everyone! I have been struggling with this condition since December of 1999 and perhaps longer without knowing what the source of the problem was. At that time my oncologist told me that the results of my last blood tests showed that the liver function levels were elevated. I was referred to a gastroenterologist who sent me for an ultra sound revealing that I have gall stones. Since then I have done 3 flushes using epsom salts, olive oil and grapefruit juice. Each time large numbers of stones were flushed and this last time, some were quite large (the size of marbles). Had another ultra sound today that revealed that I still have lots of gall stones. I know that the gastroenterologist wants to do a procedure in which a camera is passed down my throat and into an area where he can see if there are any stones blocking the bile ducts. Needless to say, I do not want to under go this procedure, nor do I want to lose my gall bladder to surgery. Does anyone know how many flushes can be done safely within a year? I read that it is recommended that two weeks pass before doing another flush. Also, due to not being able to keep down the epsom salt solution, I have begun to grind it up and put it into gel capsules. This is the only method that has allowed me to keep from vomitting the solution. I drink plenty of water with the capsules but have found that the diahhrea begins immediately and really burns when evacuating. It has been a really difficult process but I am determined not to give up. I would appreciate any comments or suggestions! Becky ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <MSIMS0960@...> Date: Mon Jul 10, 2000 4:58pm Subject: Relief of Allergies after Cleanses? Hello everyone, I've been trying to do a cleanse for the last 2 years and 2 months ago I did one and did everything wrong that you possibly mess up. I got 10 -15 stones out and felt miserable. Now I'm preparing for the next one better. But my biggest question is, will the cleanses eventually rid one of allergies, heart palpitations, candida etc. I have such bad shortness of breath that I cannot excercise or do anything physical anymore. I'm only 37 and very depressed and sad about my condition. I really need some hope that I get out of this chronic illness pattern. I have been diagnosed with gallstones when I was 20 years old but never did much about it. They didn't bother me that much or I thought. I'm grateful for your input Anette ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <Kalexan328@...> Date: Thu Jul 13, 2000 7:40am Subject: Success Stories I am curious to know how many in our egroup have had success with the flushes where they had no attacks for 1 year; 2 years? I keep trying to manage my problem with flushes because I have had 3 friends who seem to have flushed their baby stones goodbye! Lucy is the most dramatic... She was our Nanny for 6 years and at times we would not see her much and she told us she had stomach problems. Years later she revealed that she had gallstones since she was 13 yaers old and in Mexico the treatment of choice was pain killers. Now at age 23 she was told to have her gallbladder out. She was having regular attacks... almost daily! I had just flushed two months earlier, so I gave her the recipe. She tried it and flushed out many " grape-sized " stones. She did the flush again two weeks later... even though she would throw up the olive oil and have to take a second dose! Now 18 months later... NO PROBLEMS. She eats whatever she wants and only complains that " no pain " is making her fat. WOW... there must be someting to these flushes... but I am still working on my success story. It is getting a bit embarrassing fainting at business dinners and getting picked up off the hotel lobby floor in France! I just think God gave us gallbladders for a reason... Here I flush again... ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <Kalexan328@...> Date: Wed Jul 12, 2000 11:11am Subject: Six attacks & six flushes in 2 years I have been flushing stones for two years now. After the first flush I went 9 months without an attack. Now I get an attack about once every 3-4 months. The last attack came 3 weeks after a flush... yes, I was eating an egg roll! Is my experience normal? Do those of us with sludgey gallbladders face a lifetime of attacks unless we eat perfectly? Does anyone take a pain killer when they get an attack or do you have the baby natually like I do? I think I need some pain relief! Thanks, ken ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: Ron Self <RLSELF@...> Date: Thu Jul 20, 2000 9:59am Subject: First Cleanse Hello everyone, I did my first cleanse on Saturday, July 08. I did not notice any change in my condition or my general health the following day (Sunday). However, on Monday, I awoke, wide awake, not groggy, full of energy, for the first time in many years. I live in Miami and we have extreme heat and humidity and am now able to work outside all day long and not become winded and hardly even break a sweat. Everyone around me is complaining about how unbearable the heat is and I do not even notice the heat. Has anyone else noticed a drastic change in their body temperature or the perception of relative heat in general? I cannot believe what a change the flush has made in my life and am preparing to do another this Friday night. Since the first flush, I no longer have any of the swelling and bloating and indigestion that I had suffered with for years. I am full of energy. I just want to say thanks that this list exist and thank everyone for their support. I have one question that I would like to pose to the group: I used grapefruit juice with the olive oil. My wife now wants to give the flush a try. The problem is that she is dangerously allergic to grapefruit and it's juice. It causes her to have a serious drop in blood pressure and can cause unconsciousness. Can she use orange juice or another type of fruit juice? Is it the acid in the juice that is important? Will any othe juice still cause the same reaction (the flushing of stones)? Please advise if you have tried other juices with the olive oil and had success. Thanks in advance. Ron ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <jrobb4148@...> Date: Wed Aug 9, 2000 10:02am Subject: 1st gallstone flush After reading non stop for two days, I am convinced of trying the gallbladder flush tonight. I certainly appreciate all the information and encouragement people have put into their messages on this board and others. This is my 3rd day of an apple juice fast. I have also had a couple of plums and a small salad last night as I was really getting spacey. Anyway, I assume that the apple juice has done its softening thing on the stones and I will continue the fast today. I am very hopeful that this will eleviate my problem with gallstones in the gallbladder and allow me to avoid my scheduled surgery on the 29th of August. I have found Lite Olive Oil and Virgin Olive Oil but not both in the same bottle. I will try to find some again today. I will post results of my 1st flush tomorrow. Jerome ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <jrobb4148@...> Date: Thu Aug 10, 2000 12:16pm Subject: 1st Flush. wow! Thanks to you all for the encouaging words, After a 3 day apple juice fast ,I comlpeted the liver/gallbladder flush this morning. Everything went fine until about 11:00pm last night. I did not take any sleeping aid and was awake most of the night with only short sleeps of maybe 1/2 hour at the most. After consuming the oil/citrus at 10pm I layed on my right side for 1/2 hour followed by another 1/2 hour on my back with good images of what was taking place. When I tried to lay on my side to go to sleep I got tremendous pains in my middle and would hiccup a few times, releasing an oily odor from my mouth. I would have to sit up on the edge of the bed until the pain passed and then I tried to lay on my back in a more upright position, propped up with pillows. This position helped, but as I would start to dose off my position might change and I would be woken up by the pains reaching from my stomach to my throat. I assume now that these were the stones passing their way along, but it was very painful and worrisome. I was fearful that maybe a stone had gotten lodged in an inappropriate location. the pains continued through the night and did not cease until about 9am. Starting an hour after my 3rd epsom salts in the morning, the jackpot hit with about 300 small stones ranging from the size and color of a fresh green pea to diminshing sizes. The majority were green but there were also tan or yellowish stones too. The tan ones were particularly waxy and a little more crumbly whereas the green ones were definitly firm/gelitin-like and waxy. Looks like cholesterol to me. I took pictures of them on a small plate and put the largest ones in a jar to show the doctor. Now, I have to figure out a good diet until my next flush. I will call the surgeon and cancel my surgery as I am now a believer in taking charge of this siituation and trying my best to keep my gallbladder intact. From my readings I am not sure whether to wait two weeks or two months before I flush again. Any input? thanks, Jerome ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <jrobb4148@...> Date: Thu Aug 10, 2000 3:15pm Subject: wow! cont... It would seem by my painful experience with the flush last night that I indeed was having a gallstone attack during the flush. I had steady severe pain in the upper abdomen that increased raipidly and lasted from several minutes to longer for hours. I had colic, gas, belching, indigestion, nausea and small amount of vomitting along with chills. For a first time experience this was not pleasant. Everything I have read has said, " no pain. " Wow, was I surprised! This afternoon I passed about 10 more, with one being especially large, 1.5 cm. I hope the next time I do this it is more as others have experienced, and not so tramatic. I have had trouble with indigestion and severe stomach pains in the evenings periodically for years. It is caused by the entrance flap to the stomach flipping into the open position and the stomach acid flows back up the esphagus and burns the lining, which is very painful. The symtoms last night seemed similar. I normally take Zantac and/or a sleeping pill called Ambien to relieve the situation. But I was afraid I might cause some interference with the flush so I didn't take the Zantac or Ambien. Does anyone have a comment on using a stomach acid reducer or sleeping aid the next time I do a flush? thanks, Jerome ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <Kalexan328@...> Date: Tue Aug 15, 2000 11:09pm Subject: Flush or fiction? Obviously we will not settle the " flush or fiction " debate this week... after all, the debate has raged for over 100 years. 35 years ago my mother suffered greatly with gallstones. After a few months of suffering she opted to " flush. " She never had another attack again... although she would always burp when we would rub her shoulders. Two years ago our 20 year old nanny complained that she had been told she needed a $5000 operation to remove her gb. She said that since she was 13 she would go to the hospital and be given pain killers with regular attacks. Now she was having attacks daily and the doctors wanted to operate, but she had no money to pay. Her first flush produced grape sized stones, her second flush two weeks later produced next to nothing... Two years later... not one sign of an attack or indigestion just a little diahrea when drinking milk! No... I'm not so lucky, but I know that a week after each flush all symptoms go away... not stomach aches or attacks for 3-9 months. Conclusion: The flush may not be a cureall... if you want a magic bullet... go find an MD with a knife. You don't really need the gb anyway... God just made a stupid mistake by including that little sac... My Dad and sister had theirs out and went on to eat whatever they wanted... just about 70-100 pounds over-weight each one of them. Could it be we need that little sac? I'd take 1-2 attack a year for the rest of my if it keeps my eating habits right and my weight under control... Remember, we may be the lucky few when heed the warning signs of poor diet and take the hard, yet rewarding road to great health with a little bit of pain when we cheat! ken ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: Diane Combs <totustuus@...> Date: Wed Aug 16, 2000 7:34pm Subject: To flush or not to flush This is such and interesting debate. I think that the anecdotes from people who got out large stones are pretty convincing. It isn't proof pos though. However, trusting soul that I am, I do believe this can work to flush stones. I flushed once and got a load of greenies and next time I flush I will screen because I didn't really look to see past the floaters to the sinkers and check out if there were some bonafied calicium stones. After my flush I had the worst gallbladder attack of all time. Apparently the stone had tried to move out of the gallbladder and got stuck in the neck. My stone was an inch and a quarter last time it was measured by the ultrasound. According to the doctors, it is way to large to pass even if the flush could work. Anyway.. I am now trying the stone crushing herbs and I eat only raw foods. My health has improved immensely and I haven't had an attack in months! However, I am convinced my stone is still in there. Sometimes I feel a poking feeling in that area. I am going to do a parasite cleanse and then try flushing again. I would have done that earlier but I didn't want to do the parasite cleanse until cherry season is over. I wait all year for cherry season and that is one of the foods not recommended when doing the parasite cleanse. Actually the only fruit recommended is apples and cranberries. So.. cherry season is almost over and the parasite cleanse will begin. PRobably next week. I hope I can get that big ol stone out with the flush. Good health.. Diane ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: Dale <Da_@...> Date: Wed Aug 16, 2000 8:45pm Subject: Re: Softening of gallstones I primarily used the GCG and didn't have the Hydrangea Root until around August of 99. I took the GCG for about three weeks before my first flush. I took it mainly because when I was told I had A Stone that is all I was able to ascertain regarding having stones. So I felt a need to breakup whatever may be there since all I could get from my doctor or the hospital was that I had " A " Stone. I took my GCG in fresh squeezed apple juice, which I also drank the weeks before the flush. I must admit, I really thought with all the stones I got out on that first flush that I didn't have anymore. But as I learned latter stones develop in the liver and are passed into the gallbladder where they will grow in size as time goes on. So, the stones in the liver, then, move and let others come forward. That is the reason why it is figured that thousands of stones need to pass before the liver is cleared of a major amount of them. And that is why the flush is called a liver and gallbladder flush. Dale Da_@... ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: E+JW <jw.rensink@...> Date: Tue Jul 25, 2000 7:17am Subject: out After being in pain for more than a month (almost all day) and after having 4 attacks a week (longest one: 22 hours) I couldn't deal with this anymore, so last week my gallbladder has been removed. In spring I was doing very well after having pain during some weeks, but the stuff I used before, didn't help me now. I was also watching my food and EFA's for a long time, but before this I was always eating healthy, I'm 55 kg's, so it wasn't my way of living that caused the troubles. Now I couldn't take it much longer, physically and also mentally, felt like a time-bomb. They took out a 21 mm.stone and several little ones. I am reliefed the congestion has gone, but for a long time I was thinking the alternative way worked for me, more's the pity. Every day I read the mails, and gave me the feeling I wasn't alone in this. I learned a lot from you! Wish you all the luck! Edith / Holland. ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- From: <linkon4@...> Date: Thu Aug 31, 2000 9:54am Subject: Re: gallbladder cleanse Hello Diane, I too have much g.bladder liver pain and attacks. I am currently breast feeding my 10 month old baby and did the g.bladder flush last night, she has had no diareha stomach cramps, crying spells or anything since last evening. I only took two epsom salt dosages last night at 6pm and 8 pm then at 10 took the olive oil/g.juice. I skipped one dose (took a cup for the 2 doses) I had done these flushes before I was pregnant for about two years until there was no more stones coming out. My liver hurts so very much I felt like I had to do something I was successful in getting out a lot of stones out so far, one as big as a grape! I find a coffee retention enema very helpful also, I feel better not so sick to my stomach and headache. It is nice to read of others b.feeding and trying to determine the balance of what to take and not to take. I too feel the strain on my digestive system and liver but am so pleased with my babys health and the bond that has taken place. if any other mothers out there have any other tips or comments please speak up the support is wonderful. Take care, ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- Date: Fri, 15 Sep 2000 00:45:03 +0200 From: " Dr. Assn. " <info@...> info@... Subject: Dr. Hulda : New Information on www..net story 1 " I believe Dr. 's liver cleanse saved my life. After several attacks (the lying on the floor screaming type) a friend introduced me to Dr. 's liver cleanse program. I didn't wait to do the parasite program as I was still in pain (even though I was taking pain pills) I did the procedure and there were 20 or 30 stones as big as my thumb, plus a hundred or so smaller ones. I did it again after the third week of the parasite program and still again 2 weeks later. That last time there were just a few little ones. The doctor had told me that I needed an operation IMMEDIATELY or I would die! But at the hospital, I was told they couldn't operate because my liver was infected for which they gave me penicillin! Thank God! They were going to cut out my gallbladder! CP " *** story 2 " Dr. Good morning to you and your staff. I really appreciate all you are doing for those of us who have cancer or have had cancer. My brother and myself have both been diagnosed with prostrate cancer. At the time I found out, 2 years ago, I didn't know about alternative treatments so I just went along with my doctor and had the operation to remove my prostrate. Since then I have read your books and have followed up with your parasite program. My brother, on the other hand, decided to try alternative methods after I told him about your book and other ways of treating cancer without his prostrate being removed. He started the parasite program plus he went to a Clinic in R., Nevada, Dr. B., that works with improving the immune system.(Dr. B. supports your methods). His PSA was over 6, with a positive biopsy of cancer, but now it is below 1. Now his regular medical doctor is all upset because he didn't follow his advice to remove the prostate even though the PSA is back to normal. In fact he had an appointment yesterday with his doctor and this doctor actually told him that he would be dead within 3 years and said all these alternative methods he has tried is all a bunch of quackery and these doctors are taking him for a sucker. What is going on in this country? The regular medical doctors are out to stop anyone that does not do it their way. I believe in these alternative methods because I saw what the conventional medicine did to my father-in-law that just died from lung cancer. BM " ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- << Good, luck , with your op. I believe they always do the keyhole surgery now, which is a lot easier to recover from. >> ************************************* Hello, glad to find out that you're doing better. I have tried not to write about this, but here it goes. No! GB surgery does not always help at all, and the so-called " keyhole " surgery is not always easy. I did a survey of friends when I first started having this problem with my GB to find out the pros and cons of GB surgery. Here's the scoop. I just recently called a good friend of mine who I worked at the hospital with for 8 1/2 years. She had GB surgery after putting it off for a long time. She just didn't wish to have surgery and tried a healthy diet and never even heard of the cleanse. If she had heard of it at that time, I'm 100 percent sure she would have tried it. Anyway, she started off by saying her digestion is just terrible. She can't even eat the foods that she loves anymore like lettuce, she can't handle it. So now salads are out. It messes up her digestion horribly. Also, she still has pain and she has diarrhea all the time now. Always has the runs after everything she eats, even just snacks. Plus, she couldn't have the keyhole surgery, but had to have the major one. Then she went on to tell me about her 30-year-old daughter who had GB surgery not too long after her. Her daughter had the keyhole surgery, and after the surgery while she was at home recovering, just kept getting sicker and sicker. She had started leaking bile into her abdomen and it was making her very ill and turning yellow from the bile. Well, they had to careflight her to a major hospital in a big city, I won't say which. Then she had to stay in ICU for several weeks to get her better before they could do a second surgery on her to find the leaking. Yes, she's out and fine now after a very long illness, and it took her time to build up any strength. She really was fortunate they could find the leak and fix it. Then I've talked to a lady at the health food store that I frequently go to. She had GB surgery several years ago. Her exact words to me are: " If I had just known what I now know, I would never, never have had the surgery, ever! " See, she's all messed up. She can't eat so many things now it's unreal and still has pain. She drinks 1 pint or more of aleo vera juice every day cuz of her stomach and the immense about of acid in it since the surgery. She can't eat wheat, lettuce and many other things. I'll ask her how something is, she says, " Oh, I can't have that either! " She said to me, do what you can to avoid the surgery. This is just a couple of people. My husband actually has talked to one person who is glad they had the GB surgery. I haven't talked to anyone who is glad. I'm sure there are some people who are glad, just I haven't talked to them. I will also say that in Dr. Cabot's books, she explains that those who must have GB surgery have an extremely difficult time with their livers, having fatty livers. It is just almost something that is going to happen to you if you have your GB removed. Then you MUST always be on a special diet to fight that. This is something that modern-day medicine -- if one wishes to call it medicine -- doesn't tell you. So be prepared. Sorry to put this on anyone who is having surgery. It's something to think about, and I would be prepared. There is no such thing as " an easy surgery, " never. All surgery is hard on your system. I know, I've had surgery several times in the past. Nothing is ever the same again, so weigh everything before you do it, please. I have a friend who is probably in his 60s now. He had a severe gall bladder attack over 10 years ago. This is the first person that I ever heard about the cleanse from and it stuck in my mind. I talked to him back in about July, and he's still doing his cleanses every year. Sometimes he has to do it twice, but he hasn't had anymore attacks. Take care, Susie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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