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Re: Glutamate

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Bebe,

Others may know more about the glutamate. I'll let them tell you.

On the reading side: THE DIVINE SECRETS OF THE YA-YA SISTERHOOD, is good.

On an uplifting note, The Road Less Traveled by M. Peck,

Unconditional Life and Ageless Body Timeless Mind by Deepak Chopra are

interesting. Grisham's books, all of them, are entertaining with a

little excitement thrown in. He writes mostly about lawyers, since he is

one, and has some good plots. Just go to a bookstore and look around. I

can't, because I see too many things I want. But it does give me an idea

about what to look for in the library.

Mike Gray

At 08:42 AM 7/8/02 -0400, you wrote:

>HI:

>Much of my " Laymen's Research " mentions Glutomate and the abnormal glutamate

>metabolism that occurs.

>Hopefully some of you more knowledgeable people might educate me as to

>whether there are certain foods to avoid/eat or vitamins to take to

>decrease/increase this abnormal glutamate metabolism.

>I feel very powerless and want to take some sort of action...I've volunteered

>for any and all research that will use a non-diagnosed PLS/SLOW PROGRESSING

>ALS person.

>Anyone out there read any good, distracting books that they would like to

>recommend

>Bebe

>

>

>

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  • 6 years later...
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Dear Beverly,

Article form Life extension: Research shows that theanine has numerous

health-enhancing effects, including protecting cognitive function. In

studies of neurons in cell culture, theanine significantly reversed

glutamate-induced toxicity, a major cause of degenerative brain decline.

Based on published data

Wish you the best. I use theaninne and Vitalzym for my

depression...Lydia

>

> Hi guys. I've been doing more research on the glutamate toxicity

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Dear Beverly,

Sorry this is so long Ive been trying to chop off the other postings.

Anyway, I really feel for you with the depression. I also started the long

road to ms with depression. With me it began almost immediately after I

contracted pneumonia when I was 40.

I was in hospital with the psychiatrist trying a number of drugs to help. They

didn't until he tried MAOI (an old antidressant) which worked very well until he

tried to take me off them 8 months later. The depression returned and so I was

kept on them for about six years. I came off them by cutting them down very,

very slowly eventually succeeding but was put on Effexor which helped but my

liver function tests after about a year were not good so I was taken off, given

an SSRI antidepressant plus amitriptyline _ this was because the psycho and the

neruro had different ideas as to which was the best and I ended up on both.

Actually, my depression symptoms were successfully treated and a got a good

night's sleep.

Now about three years after the depression appeared I developed optic neuritis

and, like you, was diagnosed with ms.

Fast foward another six years. I was on the BBD _ no dramatic improvement but

I was in good health overall. I then began to learn of LDN and thought that was

a good thing to try. As I have said before on this site, I contacted Dr Bob

Lawrence who supplied the LDN and also spoke at length about nuitritional

treatment for depression.

He was incredibly helpful and I read his papers on the link between ms

depression and zinc deficiency.

I had a chat with him this afternoon when I rang up to order some more LDN. The

conversation among other things was about low zinc levels which are amazingly

common in people with ms and depression.

For your information I really think that it may be worth you starting to take

25mgs of zinc once a day for a week and then increase this to 50mgs a week or so

later. You cam slowly increase this _ certainly to a 100mgs a day (in split

doseses). Dr Lawrence uses a zinc taste test to find out whether there is

enough zinc in an individual. He supplies a small bottle of zinc sulphate which

you keep in the fridge. Take it out for a couple of hours and then try a small

tasting. If after 10 seconds the liquig is tasteless or very bland it shows a

deficiency in zinc. An immediate strong unpleasant metallic taste indicates you

have sufficient zinc.

It is important to take at different time of the day a small supplement _ 2mgs

of copper. You do not have to increase the copper amount even though you have

increased the zinc.

In addition to the zinc it is important to take a lot of omega 3 supplements _

preferably six grammes a day (flaxseed oil or fish omega3 is fine. Make sure

you have taken a good vitamin B50 complex. The other mineral that is need is

vanadium and a daily tablet of vandyl sulphate is important. Each nutrient

should be itroduced one at a time in order to deduce the relevant butrient that

is deficient.

Since I have been taking those supplements there has been a definite improvement

in the onset of any depression wobbles. I ditched the SSRI last October and had

lowered slowly the amitriptyline to 70 mgs. I am strill trying to get this

lower.

I really, really, hope you find some relief by possibly trying this. I am a

total cynic about everything but this really seems to have helped.

Depression is horrible. There is a link with ms. This could be pathological or

reactive to being in a horrible situation. I was like you depressed and then

diagnosed with ms. The depression has gone the ms hasn't bt I am working on it.

Love Judith

Glutamate

Hi guys. I've been doing more research on the glutamate toxicity in

MS. Found something interesting; thought I'd pass it along. Someone

suggested to me that my long-standing (3 1/2 yrs) treatment-resistant

depression might be connected to the MS. I knew MS could cause

depression, but I never thought they might be connected. Started

looking and lo and behold, found a reference to depression related to

glutamate toxicity, just like MS. Like maybe the depression was the

first symptom of my MS, starting 3 yrs before physical symptoms.

The scary part for me is that if I think my depression might be as

incurable as the MS, I don't think I could bear up. With good mental

health, anything is possible. With bad mental health, nothing

happens.

I guess I just have to believe that all the stuff I am doing for the

MS will eventually help the depression. What took 50 yrs to develop

isn't going to be corrected in a few months, huh?

Anyway, thought I'd pass this along in case anyone else is suffering

from depression---there is a list of glutamate blockers at the end of

info.: B3, COQ10, herbs, magnesium, vit E succinate, and I am now

taking L-Pyroglutamic Acid, which is supposed to block glutamate. And

all these would obviously be good for MS as well.

THANKS FOR BEING A PLACE I CAN LEARN, SHARE AND VENT! It means so

much to me!!

Beverly

" DOPAMINE-GLUTAMATE RELATIONSHIP:

Glutamate is an excitatory amino acid neurotransmitter that is

cytotoxic when over-expressed at synaptic terminals. As a result,

elevated glutamate appears to play a role in several diseases,

including ischemia and methamphetamine-induced toxicity. Berman and

Hastings52 have shown the reactive oxygen species and dopamine

oxidation products can modify glutamate transport function, resulting

in the elevated levels implicated in such neuro-degeneration. It

follows, therefore, that if the three neurologic diseases under

discussion (MS, ALS and Parkinson's) involve the excessive oxidation

of dopamine, abnormally high levels of cytotoxic glutamate will also

be present in patients suffering from them.

Glutamate abnormalities have been found also in multiple sclerosis

where elevated levels are related to relapses. Increases in serum

glutamate do not occur sharply during relapses, rather they rise

gradually for a month or two prior to the onset of a clinical

relapse, peak during it and then slowly decline.55 Barkhatova and

coworkers also have established elevated glutamate levels in the

cerebral fluid of patients with multiple sclerosis.56

**********************************************************************

**Conclusions. Long-term iodine deficiency appears linked to

abnormalities in the dopaminergic system that include an increased

number of dopamine receptors. It is argued that this raises

susceptibility to dopamine oxidation which, in turn, causes

deficiencies of the antioxidant enzymes Cu/Zn superoxide dismutase,

glutathione peroxidase and catalase. Dopamine deficiency also leads

to elevated cytotoxic glutamate levels. Implications of the iodine-

dopachrome-glutamate hypothesis, for treatment of these three

neurologic disorders, are then discussed. Possible interventions

include the use of levodopa, vitamin B3, Coenzyme Q10, various

antioxidants, amino acids, iodine and glutamate antagonists.

***************************************************

However, excess glutamate can cause neurons to die from

excitotoxicity. Excitotoxicity is the phenomenon of spreading neuron

death that occurs in response to a specific brain injury. Most

studies of this focus on the role of glutamate in stroke.

High levels of glutamate and excitatory neurotransmitter activity can

also cause cause brain cells to die without there being a specific

brain injury.

******************************************************

Recent studies examining the role of glutamate in DEPRESSION have

found that glutamate antagonists can reduce depressive symptoms. This

suggests that a new target for antidepressant therapies and that a

combined monoamine/glutamate approach may provide relief for a

broader range of patients with treatment resistant depression.

Studies examining patients with major depressive disorders have also

found a higher ratio of excitatory to inhibitory amino acids. Anxiety

models have successfully used glutamate antagonists suggesting a

similar excitatory:inhibitory neurotransmitter imbalance in these

patients. Research in this area continues.

**********************************************************

There are a lot of things that act as glutamate receptor blockers.

You know, like silymarin, curcumin and ginkgo biloba. These things

are known to directly block glutamate receptors and reduce

excitotoxicity. Curcumin is very potent. Most of your flavonoids

reduce excitotoxicity.

Magnesium is particularly important, because magnesium can block the

NMDA glutamate type receptor. That's its natural function, so it

significantly reduces toxicity. Vitamin E succinate is powerful at

inhibiting excitotoxicity. "

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*I eat a lot of seaweed for the iodine and interestingly, it also

contains natural glutamates (so do fermented vegetables and I eat those

too and drink fermented kombucha tea). This information may pertain to

the manipilated glutamates, msg. That is potent stuff that wipes me

out. I no longer eat any processed foods because of the msg and other

preservatives they contain, not to mention that they're dead food.

*********************************************************************

> **Conclusions. Long-term iodine deficiency appears linked to

> abnormalities in the dopaminergic system that include an increased

> number of dopamine receptors. It is argued that this raises

> susceptibility to dopamine oxidation which, in turn, causes

> deficiencies of the antioxidant enzymes Cu/Zn superoxide dismutase,

> glutathione peroxidase and catalase. Dopamine deficiency also leads

> to elevated cytotoxic glutamate levels. Implications of the iodine-

> dopachrome-glutamate hypothesis, for treatment of these three

> neurologic disorders, are then discussed. Possible interventions

> include the use of levodopa, vitamin B3, Coenzyme Q10, various

> antioxidants, amino acids, iodine and glutamate antagonists.

> ***************************************************

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