Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

[Guest guest]

I doubt seriously that YOU would be out of a job, Digna! I sense that you are

industrious enough to do whatever it takes to stay working. Remember the Mutual

Aid Societies? We lost those when the government took over that role by stealing

from one to give to another.

Quote Worthy: " Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the government. "

-- Madison

Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

Well, my work depends on federal and state funding primarily, althought

there are HMO/managed care contracts as well as a few private insurances and

private pay. But, I'm always bw the wall and a hard place to state it

bluntly; w/o the funding our businesses receive, we'd have a census of about

1/4th of what it is now, or 25% of capacity instead of 94% to 96% as we now

have. Therefore, I'd be jobless! But I sure hate the thought of paying more

taxes, especially for the unnecessary bills, tests, meds, etc, and for those

that could but won't work or do for themselves. Yet, my own g/son w autistic

disorder wouldn't make it w/o his SSI stipend, small as it is, while he

struggles through college, and he'd need even more help from me than just

free lodging and food, and books.... Indeed, I'm caught in between. Aren't

we all? But discussions are healthy, and demonstrate all sides are important

to listen to. Politics itself? I dislike the topic so I don't discuss

politicians, parties, etc. I find that these discussions are more about

healthcare policy and economics of our nation and states.

Digna

RE: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included

>> in

>> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>>

>> The last thing we need is more government regulation in our lives. That

>> is

>> not what this country was built on nor what our Founding Father's

>> intended.

>> What ever happened to personal responsibility? If the public did not buy

>> the " highly processed crap " , companies would not continue to produce it.

>> By

>> the way, if the government regulates away all the processed food that

>> contributes to poor health, how do you think it will impact the RD???

>> Before this is misinterpreted, my point is that if the government takes

>> over

>> everything, and Big Brother is dictating our every move, our usefulness

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I doubt seriously that YOU would be out of a job, Digna! I sense that you are

industrious enough to do whatever it takes to stay working. Remember the Mutual

Aid Societies? We lost those when the government took over that role by stealing

from one to give to another.

Quote Worthy: " Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the government. "

-- Madison

Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

Well, my work depends on federal and state funding primarily, althought

there are HMO/managed care contracts as well as a few private insurances and

private pay. But, I'm always bw the wall and a hard place to state it

bluntly; w/o the funding our businesses receive, we'd have a census of about

1/4th of what it is now, or 25% of capacity instead of 94% to 96% as we now

have. Therefore, I'd be jobless! But I sure hate the thought of paying more

taxes, especially for the unnecessary bills, tests, meds, etc, and for those

that could but won't work or do for themselves. Yet, my own g/son w autistic

disorder wouldn't make it w/o his SSI stipend, small as it is, while he

struggles through college, and he'd need even more help from me than just

free lodging and food, and books.... Indeed, I'm caught in between. Aren't

we all? But discussions are healthy, and demonstrate all sides are important

to listen to. Politics itself? I dislike the topic so I don't discuss

politicians, parties, etc. I find that these discussions are more about

healthcare policy and economics of our nation and states.

Digna

RE: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included

>> in

>> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>>

>> The last thing we need is more government regulation in our lives. That

>> is

>> not what this country was built on nor what our Founding Father's

>> intended.

>> What ever happened to personal responsibility? If the public did not buy

>> the " highly processed crap " , companies would not continue to produce it.

>> By

>> the way, if the government regulates away all the processed food that

>> contributes to poor health, how do you think it will impact the RD???

>> Before this is misinterpreted, my point is that if the government takes

>> over

>> everything, and Big Brother is dictating our every move, our usefulness

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

If the intent of healthcare reform was to insure the uninsured or under insured

and not just a giant power grab, the first thing to be addressed would be Tort

reform. Secondly buying policies across state lines. The mandates of state

governments have played a very large part in the excessive cost of insurance.

We should have access to policies that are written " cafeteria style " . The

states with the highest policy costs mandate coverage of a host of conditions.

That runs up costs for everyone. If I want only catastrophic health care

coverage and choose to pay for routine care my self - why not??? Why not expand

health savings accounts and allow people to be responsible for their own care???

This healthcare bill limits health savings accounts. WHY??? For those of us

who want to manage our own care and are capable of doing an incredibly superior

job - we have that right in the US of A. This government has no right to

mandate anything in regards to health care to us. Why does it take over 2000

pages to address this?? In addition " rules " are still being written around it.

I reside in Mayo country. We have the best healthcare outcomes for the lowest

expenditures. Ditto the Cleveland Clinic. Why not take these models and

duplicate them thru out the country. Why not harness what made this country

great - the entrepreneurial spirit of our citizens. Issue a challenge to

American business - large and small - to solve the healthcare crisis. Guess

what? Many have. Example - Safeway Inc. They developed an innovative health

care program for their employees and were able to hold healthcare costs stable

from 2005-2009. During that time healthcare costs increased by 40%. The CEO,

Steve Burd addressed Congress regarding his program and success. It fell on

deaf ears. My question - is our government the problem or the solution??? How

many uninsured and under insured would be covered for the cost of the new

bureaucracy - 16,000 IRS employees???

---- " Rowell wrote:

> McCarthy was a drunk and apparently couldn't parse his words well, so he made

a lot of people mad at him, but he did expose some real communists infiltrating

the U.S. government. Those who went to public school may not have been taught

the truth about " McCarthyism " . Socialists don't want the truth out about that.

>

> History proves what we need to know much sooner and safer than our own

actions. " Those who don't know history are destined to repeat it. " (Edmund

Burke, British statesman and philosopher)

>

>

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > Included in

> > Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> >

> > I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe.

> > I don't

> > have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just

> > like others

> > here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In

> > fact, I

> > think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

> >

> > Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family

> > of " radical

> > liberal progressives " )

> >

> > Sent from my iPhone

> >

> > On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens " <dignacassens@...

> > <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> > wrote:

> >

> > Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our

> > thoughts and

> > can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my

> > history

> > lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this

> > country's Bill

> > of Rights.

> >

> > Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

> >

> > Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > > >

> > > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that

> > we jump

> > > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's

> > what we

> > > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can

> > build your

> > > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't

> > entered.

> > > > If

> > > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered,

> > add a

> > > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which

> > puts

> > > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually

> > measuring

> > > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on

> > admission!

> > > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > > healthcare

> > > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > > >

> > > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators

> > sometimes.

> > > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > > figuring

> > > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it

> > for you.

> > > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated

> > with

> > > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with

> > input

> > > > > from the RD.

> > > > >

> > > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how

> > about

> > > > > working with your system design team to include the

> > information you

> > > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > > payment

> > > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The

> > flip

> > > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's

> > where the

> > > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > > >

> > > > > Have a good day.

> > > > > pam

> > > > >

> > > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > > Pharmacy

> > > > >

> > > > > MS Student

> > > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > > School of Nursing

> > > > >

> > > > > University of Washington

> > > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> > >

> > <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix

> > almost

> > > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > > found

> > > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a

> > BMI

> > > > of

> > > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being

> > lead to

> > > > > > believe.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was

> > just

> > > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > > care

> > > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > > MD......

> > > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented

> > every

> > > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> > 75-1d750a68eb31

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Well stated. The problem is that these solutions limit government. We have to

elect citizen legislators who want to help America with these real solutions,

not those who want to seize power for themselves for the rest of their lives,

like the late Ted Kennedy.

Quote Worthy: " Extreme taxation, excessive controls, oppressive government

competition with business, frustrated minorities and forgotten Americans are not

the products of free enterprise. They are the residue of centralized

bureaucracy, of government by a self-anointed elite. " -- Reagan

Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > Included in

> > Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> >

> > I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe.

> > I don't

> > have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just

> > like others

> > here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In

> > fact, I

> > think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

> >

> > Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family

> > of " radical

> > liberal progressives " )

> >

> > Sent from my iPhone

> >

> > On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens " <dignacassens@...

> > <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> > wrote:

> >

> > Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our

> > thoughts and

> > can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my

> > history

> > lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this

> > country's Bill

> > of Rights.

> >

> > Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

> >

> > Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > > >

> > > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that

> > we jump

> > > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's

> > what we

> > > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can

> > build your

> > > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't

> > entered.

> > > > If

> > > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered,

> > add a

> > > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which

> > puts

> > > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually

> > measuring

> > > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on

> > admission!

> > > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > > healthcare

> > > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > > >

> > > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators

> > sometimes.

> > > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > > figuring

> > > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it

> > for you.

> > > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated

> > with

> > > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with

> > input

> > > > > from the RD.

> > > > >

> > > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how

> > about

> > > > > working with your system design team to include the

> > information you

> > > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > > payment

> > > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The

> > flip

> > > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's

> > where the

> > > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > > >

> > > > > Have a good day.

> > > > > pam

> > > > >

> > > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > > Pharmacy

> > > > >

> > > > > MS Student

> > > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > > School of Nursing

> > > > >

> > > > > University of Washington

> > > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> > >

> > <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix

> > almost

> > > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > > found

> > > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a

> > BMI

> > > > of

> > > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being

> > lead to

> > > > > > believe.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was

> > just

> > > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > > care

> > > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > > MD......

> > > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented

> > every

> > > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> > 75-1d750a68eb31

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Well stated. The problem is that these solutions limit government. We have to

elect citizen legislators who want to help America with these real solutions,

not those who want to seize power for themselves for the rest of their lives,

like the late Ted Kennedy.

Quote Worthy: " Extreme taxation, excessive controls, oppressive government

competition with business, frustrated minorities and forgotten Americans are not

the products of free enterprise. They are the residue of centralized

bureaucracy, of government by a self-anointed elite. " -- Reagan

Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > Included in

> > Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> >

> > I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe.

> > I don't

> > have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just

> > like others

> > here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In

> > fact, I

> > think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

> >

> > Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family

> > of " radical

> > liberal progressives " )

> >

> > Sent from my iPhone

> >

> > On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens " <dignacassens@...

> > <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> > wrote:

> >

> > Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our

> > thoughts and

> > can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my

> > history

> > lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this

> > country's Bill

> > of Rights.

> >

> > Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

> >

> > Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > > >

> > > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that

> > we jump

> > > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's

> > what we

> > > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can

> > build your

> > > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't

> > entered.

> > > > If

> > > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered,

> > add a

> > > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which

> > puts

> > > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually

> > measuring

> > > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on

> > admission!

> > > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > > healthcare

> > > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > > >

> > > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators

> > sometimes.

> > > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > > figuring

> > > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it

> > for you.

> > > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated

> > with

> > > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with

> > input

> > > > > from the RD.

> > > > >

> > > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how

> > about

> > > > > working with your system design team to include the

> > information you

> > > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > > payment

> > > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The

> > flip

> > > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's

> > where the

> > > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > > >

> > > > > Have a good day.

> > > > > pam

> > > > >

> > > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > > Pharmacy

> > > > >

> > > > > MS Student

> > > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > > School of Nursing

> > > > >

> > > > > University of Washington

> > > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> > >

> > <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix

> > almost

> > > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > > found

> > > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a

> > BMI

> > > > of

> > > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being

> > lead to

> > > > > > believe.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was

> > just

> > > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > > care

> > > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > > MD......

> > > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented

> > every

> > > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> > 75-1d750a68eb31

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Pam,

Thank you.

I have been following this thread ( and the one a few months ago about health

care reform) and cannot understand what seems to me to be a giant leap from what

I read and what I experience to communism.  I am very happy to have Medicare.

My

husband has had multiple surgeries in the past 2 years and without Medicare the

costs would have put a very big hole in our savings.

Madalyn Friedberg. RD CDN

 

I'm with Yomari on this one. To think that providing healthcare to 

Americans is the first step to communism is somewhat off the track. I 

was born and raised in the Northeast, in small town New England, where 

we still had town meetings. Some of the " founding fathers " (what about 

the mothers???) grew up not far from where I did, albeit a couple 

years earlier. To think that those who began our country could foresee 

the mess we're in is ridiculous. What they did was give us the 

framework to build a country, and hope that we'd have the brains to 

see into our own future. I honestly cannot see any of them saying " I 

got mine, you're on your own " .

, are you referring to McCarthyism? If so, I'm glad we're past 

that. I suppose if I had the time I could go find quotes to match 

yours. That's an easy exercise in trying to prove your point. I'd much 

prefer to let my actions prove mine. That and I have other work to 

do.....

Regards,

pam

Pam Charney

pcharney@...

> This healthcare reform IS socialism. People don’t realize that 

> socialism is a pre-cursor to communism. The founding fathers fought 

> to free America from socialism. Here is a good explanation of how a 

> free country ends up in communism: " Every time we talk about these 

> taxes we get around to the idea of 'from each according to his 

> capacity and to each according to his needs'. That's socialism. It's 

> written into the Communist Manifesto. Maybe we ought to see that 

> every person who gets a tax return receives a copy of the Communist 

> Manifesto with it so he can see what's happening to him. " —T. 

> s

>

> America used to fight against any root of communism to keep it from 

> taking root here. Now people just want to deny the possibility. 

> Maybe we ought coin a term “communism deniersâ€.

>

> And speaking of how the founding fathers actually thought: " If ye 

> love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than 

> the animating contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not 

> your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands, which feed 

> you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget 

> that ye were our countrymen! " -

>

>

>

> Quoteworthy: “We can’t expect the American people to jump from 

> Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in 

> giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to 

> find that they have Communism.†Soviet dictator Nikita Khrushchev 

> speaking of Roosevelt’s “New Deal†paradigm shift.

>

>

> From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On 

> Behalf Of yomari cruz

> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 6:21 AM

> To: rd-usa

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be 

> Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

>

>

> By the way the idea of us going back to communism is the most 

> ridiculous idea

> you conservatives have these days. I laugh every time I hear that. 

> And that I

> did say with an attitude.

>

> ________________________________

> From: Yomari Cruz-Deweese <yomaricruz@...<mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.com

> >>

> To: " rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com> "

><rd-usa

>

> <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>>

> Sent: Fri, July 23, 2010 8:16:10 AM

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be 

> Included in

> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

> I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe. 

> I don't

> have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just 

> like others

> here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In 

> fact, I

> think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

>

> Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family 

> of " radical

> liberal progressives " )

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens " <dignacassens@...

> <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> wrote:

>

> Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our 

> thoughts and

> can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my 

> history

> lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this 

> country's Bill

> of Rights.

>

> Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > >

> > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that 

> we jump

> > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's 

> what we

> > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can 

> build your

> > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't 

> entered.

> > > If

> > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered, 

> add a

> > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which 

> puts

> > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually 

> measuring

> > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on 

> admission!

> > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > healthcare

> > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > >

> > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators 

> sometimes.

> > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > figuring

> > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it 

> for you.

> > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated 

> with

> > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with 

> input

> > > > from the RD.

> > > >

> > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how 

> about

> > > > working with your system design team to include the 

> information you

> > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > payment

> > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The 

> flip

> > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's 

> where the

> > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > >

> > > > Have a good day.

> > > > pam

> > > >

> > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > Pharmacy

> > > >

> > > > MS Student

> > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > School of Nursing

> > > >

> > > > University of Washington

> > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> >

> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix 

> almost

> > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > found

> > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a 

> BMI

> > > of

> > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being 

> lead to

> > > > > believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was 

> just

> > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > care

> > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > MD......

> > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented 

> every

> > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> 75-1d750a68eb31

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Pam,

Thank you.

I have been following this thread ( and the one a few months ago about health

care reform) and cannot understand what seems to me to be a giant leap from what

I read and what I experience to communism.  I am very happy to have Medicare.

My

husband has had multiple surgeries in the past 2 years and without Medicare the

costs would have put a very big hole in our savings.

Madalyn Friedberg. RD CDN

 

I'm with Yomari on this one. To think that providing healthcare to 

Americans is the first step to communism is somewhat off the track. I 

was born and raised in the Northeast, in small town New England, where 

we still had town meetings. Some of the " founding fathers " (what about 

the mothers???) grew up not far from where I did, albeit a couple 

years earlier. To think that those who began our country could foresee 

the mess we're in is ridiculous. What they did was give us the 

framework to build a country, and hope that we'd have the brains to 

see into our own future. I honestly cannot see any of them saying " I 

got mine, you're on your own " .

, are you referring to McCarthyism? If so, I'm glad we're past 

that. I suppose if I had the time I could go find quotes to match 

yours. That's an easy exercise in trying to prove your point. I'd much 

prefer to let my actions prove mine. That and I have other work to 

do.....

Regards,

pam

Pam Charney

pcharney@...

> This healthcare reform IS socialism. People don’t realize that 

> socialism is a pre-cursor to communism. The founding fathers fought 

> to free America from socialism. Here is a good explanation of how a 

> free country ends up in communism: " Every time we talk about these 

> taxes we get around to the idea of 'from each according to his 

> capacity and to each according to his needs'. That's socialism. It's 

> written into the Communist Manifesto. Maybe we ought to see that 

> every person who gets a tax return receives a copy of the Communist 

> Manifesto with it so he can see what's happening to him. " —T. 

> s

>

> America used to fight against any root of communism to keep it from 

> taking root here. Now people just want to deny the possibility. 

> Maybe we ought coin a term “communism deniersâ€.

>

> And speaking of how the founding fathers actually thought: " If ye 

> love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than 

> the animating contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not 

> your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands, which feed 

> you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget 

> that ye were our countrymen! " -

>

>

>

> Quoteworthy: “We can’t expect the American people to jump from 

> Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in 

> giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to 

> find that they have Communism.†Soviet dictator Nikita Khrushchev 

> speaking of Roosevelt’s “New Deal†paradigm shift.

>

>

> From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On 

> Behalf Of yomari cruz

> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 6:21 AM

> To: rd-usa

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be 

> Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

>

>

> By the way the idea of us going back to communism is the most 

> ridiculous idea

> you conservatives have these days. I laugh every time I hear that. 

> And that I

> did say with an attitude.

>

> ________________________________

> From: Yomari Cruz-Deweese <yomaricruz@...<mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.com

> >>

> To: " rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com> "

><rd-usa

>

> <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>>

> Sent: Fri, July 23, 2010 8:16:10 AM

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be 

> Included in

> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

> I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe. 

> I don't

> have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just 

> like others

> here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In 

> fact, I

> think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

>

> Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family 

> of " radical

> liberal progressives " )

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens " <dignacassens@...

> <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> wrote:

>

> Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our 

> thoughts and

> can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my 

> history

> lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this 

> country's Bill

> of Rights.

>

> Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > >

> > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that 

> we jump

> > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's 

> what we

> > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can 

> build your

> > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't 

> entered.

> > > If

> > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered, 

> add a

> > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which 

> puts

> > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually 

> measuring

> > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on 

> admission!

> > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > healthcare

> > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > >

> > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators 

> sometimes.

> > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > figuring

> > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it 

> for you.

> > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated 

> with

> > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with 

> input

> > > > from the RD.

> > > >

> > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how 

> about

> > > > working with your system design team to include the 

> information you

> > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > payment

> > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The 

> flip

> > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's 

> where the

> > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > >

> > > > Have a good day.

> > > > pam

> > > >

> > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > Pharmacy

> > > >

> > > > MS Student

> > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > School of Nursing

> > > >

> > > > University of Washington

> > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> >

> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix 

> almost

> > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > found

> > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a 

> BMI

> > > of

> > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being 

> lead to

> > > > > believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was 

> just

> > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > care

> > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > MD......

> > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented 

> every

> > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> 75-1d750a68eb31

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Pam,

Thank you.

I have been following this thread ( and the one a few months ago about health

care reform) and cannot understand what seems to me to be a giant leap from what

I read and what I experience to communism.  I am very happy to have Medicare.

My

husband has had multiple surgeries in the past 2 years and without Medicare the

costs would have put a very big hole in our savings.

Madalyn Friedberg. RD CDN

 

I'm with Yomari on this one. To think that providing healthcare to 

Americans is the first step to communism is somewhat off the track. I 

was born and raised in the Northeast, in small town New England, where 

we still had town meetings. Some of the " founding fathers " (what about 

the mothers???) grew up not far from where I did, albeit a couple 

years earlier. To think that those who began our country could foresee 

the mess we're in is ridiculous. What they did was give us the 

framework to build a country, and hope that we'd have the brains to 

see into our own future. I honestly cannot see any of them saying " I 

got mine, you're on your own " .

, are you referring to McCarthyism? If so, I'm glad we're past 

that. I suppose if I had the time I could go find quotes to match 

yours. That's an easy exercise in trying to prove your point. I'd much 

prefer to let my actions prove mine. That and I have other work to 

do.....

Regards,

pam

Pam Charney

pcharney@...

> This healthcare reform IS socialism. People don’t realize that 

> socialism is a pre-cursor to communism. The founding fathers fought 

> to free America from socialism. Here is a good explanation of how a 

> free country ends up in communism: " Every time we talk about these 

> taxes we get around to the idea of 'from each according to his 

> capacity and to each according to his needs'. That's socialism. It's 

> written into the Communist Manifesto. Maybe we ought to see that 

> every person who gets a tax return receives a copy of the Communist 

> Manifesto with it so he can see what's happening to him. " —T. 

> s

>

> America used to fight against any root of communism to keep it from 

> taking root here. Now people just want to deny the possibility. 

> Maybe we ought coin a term “communism deniersâ€.

>

> And speaking of how the founding fathers actually thought: " If ye 

> love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than 

> the animating contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not 

> your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands, which feed 

> you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget 

> that ye were our countrymen! " -

>

>

>

> Quoteworthy: “We can’t expect the American people to jump from 

> Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in 

> giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to 

> find that they have Communism.†Soviet dictator Nikita Khrushchev 

> speaking of Roosevelt’s “New Deal†paradigm shift.

>

>

> From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On 

> Behalf Of yomari cruz

> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 6:21 AM

> To: rd-usa

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be 

> Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

>

>

> By the way the idea of us going back to communism is the most 

> ridiculous idea

> you conservatives have these days. I laugh every time I hear that. 

> And that I

> did say with an attitude.

>

> ________________________________

> From: Yomari Cruz-Deweese <yomaricruz@...<mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.com

> >>

> To: " rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com> "

><rd-usa

>

> <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>>

> Sent: Fri, July 23, 2010 8:16:10 AM

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be 

> Included in

> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

> I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe. 

> I don't

> have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just 

> like others

> here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In 

> fact, I

> think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

>

> Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family 

> of " radical

> liberal progressives " )

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens " <dignacassens@...

> <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> wrote:

>

> Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our 

> thoughts and

> can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my 

> history

> lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this 

> country's Bill

> of Rights.

>

> Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > >

> > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that 

> we jump

> > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's 

> what we

> > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can 

> build your

> > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't 

> entered.

> > > If

> > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered, 

> add a

> > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which 

> puts

> > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually 

> measuring

> > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on 

> admission!

> > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > healthcare

> > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > >

> > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators 

> sometimes.

> > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > figuring

> > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it 

> for you.

> > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated 

> with

> > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with 

> input

> > > > from the RD.

> > > >

> > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how 

> about

> > > > working with your system design team to include the 

> information you

> > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > payment

> > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The 

> flip

> > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's 

> where the

> > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > >

> > > > Have a good day.

> > > > pam

> > > >

> > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > Pharmacy

> > > >

> > > > MS Student

> > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > School of Nursing

> > > >

> > > > University of Washington

> > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> >

> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix 

> almost

> > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > found

> > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a 

> BMI

> > > of

> > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being 

> lead to

> > > > > believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was 

> just

> > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > care

> > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > MD......

> > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented 

> every

> > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> 75-1d750a68eb31

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

I understand thinking it is a giant leap. But just listen to what a real live

(late) communist “leader†said. Or,... don’t, at the nation’s peril. " We

can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we

can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until

they awaken one day to find that they have Communism. " --Nikita Khrushchev

From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On Behalf Of

Madalyn Friedberg

Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 12:55 PM

To: rd-usa

Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

Pam,

Thank you.

I have been following this thread ( and the one a few months ago about health

care reform) and cannot understand what seems to me to be a giant leap from what

I read and what I experience to communism. I am very happy to have Medicare. My

husband has had multiple surgeries in the past 2 years and without Medicare the

costs would have put a very big hole in our savings.

Madalyn Friedberg. RD CDN

I'm with Yomari on this one. To think that providing healthcare to

Americans is the first step to communism is somewhat off the track. I

was born and raised in the Northeast, in small town New England, where

we still had town meetings. Some of the " founding fathers " (what about

the mothers???) grew up not far from where I did, albeit a couple

years earlier. To think that those who began our country could foresee

the mess we're in is ridiculous. What they did was give us the

framework to build a country, and hope that we'd have the brains to

see into our own future. I honestly cannot see any of them saying " I

got mine, you're on your own " .

, are you referring to McCarthyism? If so, I'm glad we're past

that. I suppose if I had the time I could go find quotes to match

yours. That's an easy exercise in trying to prove your point. I'd much

prefer to let my actions prove mine. That and I have other work to

do.....

Regards,

pam

Pam Charney

pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> This healthcare reform IS socialism. People don’t realize that

> socialism is a pre-cursor to communism. The founding fathers fought

> to free America from socialism. Here is a good explanation of how a

> free country ends up in communism: " Every time we talk about these

> taxes we get around to the idea of 'from each according to his

> capacity and to each according to his needs'. That's socialism. It's

> written into the Communist Manifesto. Maybe we ought to see that

> every person who gets a tax return receives a copy of the Communist

> Manifesto with it so he can see what's happening to him. " —T.

> s

>

> America used to fight against any root of communism to keep it from

> taking root here. Now people just want to deny the possibility.

> Maybe we ought coin a term “communism deniersâ€.

>

> And speaking of how the founding fathers actually thought: " If ye

> love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than

> the animating contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not

> your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands, which feed

> you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget

> that ye were our countrymen! " -

>

>

>

> Quoteworthy: “We can’t expect the American people to jump from

> Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in

> giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to

> find that they have Communism.†Soviet dictator Nikita Khrushchev

> speaking of Roosevelt’s “New Deal†paradigm shift.

>

>

> From: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>] On

> Behalf Of yomari cruz

> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 6:21 AM

> To: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

>

>

> By the way the idea of us going back to communism is the most

> ridiculous idea

> you conservatives have these days. I laugh every time I hear that.

> And that I

> did say with an attitude.

>

> ________________________________

> From: Yomari Cruz-Deweese

<yomaricruz@...<mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.com><mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.c\

om

> >>

> To:

" rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogr\

oups.com> "

><rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

>

> <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>>

> Sent: Fri, July 23, 2010 8:16:10 AM

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in

> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

> I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe.

> I don't

> have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just

> like others

> here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In

> fact, I

> think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

>

> Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family

> of " radical

> liberal progressives " )

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens "

<dignacassens@...<mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>

> <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> wrote:

>

> Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our

> thoughts and

> can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my

> history

> lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this

> country's Bill

> of Rights.

>

> Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > >

> > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that

> we jump

> > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's

> what we

> > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can

> build your

> > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't

> entered.

> > > If

> > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered,

> add a

> > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which

> puts

> > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually

> measuring

> > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on

> admission!

> > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > healthcare

> > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > >

> > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators

> sometimes.

> > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > figuring

> > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it

> for you.

> > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated

> with

> > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with

> input

> > > > from the RD.

> > > >

> > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how

> about

> > > > working with your system design team to include the

> information you

> > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > payment

> > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The

> flip

> > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's

> where the

> > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > >

> > > > Have a good day.

> > > > pam

> > > >

> > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > Pharmacy

> > > >

> > > > MS Student

> > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > School of Nursing

> > > >

> > > > University of Washington

> > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com><mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> >

> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix

> almost

> > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > found

> > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a

> BMI

> > > of

> > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being

> lead to

> > > > > believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was

> just

> > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > care

> > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > MD......

> > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented

> every

> > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> 75-1d750a68eb31

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

I understand thinking it is a giant leap. But just listen to what a real live

(late) communist “leader†said. Or,... don’t, at the nation’s peril. " We

can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we

can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until

they awaken one day to find that they have Communism. " --Nikita Khrushchev

From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On Behalf Of

Madalyn Friedberg

Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 12:55 PM

To: rd-usa

Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

Pam,

Thank you.

I have been following this thread ( and the one a few months ago about health

care reform) and cannot understand what seems to me to be a giant leap from what

I read and what I experience to communism. I am very happy to have Medicare. My

husband has had multiple surgeries in the past 2 years and without Medicare the

costs would have put a very big hole in our savings.

Madalyn Friedberg. RD CDN

I'm with Yomari on this one. To think that providing healthcare to

Americans is the first step to communism is somewhat off the track. I

was born and raised in the Northeast, in small town New England, where

we still had town meetings. Some of the " founding fathers " (what about

the mothers???) grew up not far from where I did, albeit a couple

years earlier. To think that those who began our country could foresee

the mess we're in is ridiculous. What they did was give us the

framework to build a country, and hope that we'd have the brains to

see into our own future. I honestly cannot see any of them saying " I

got mine, you're on your own " .

, are you referring to McCarthyism? If so, I'm glad we're past

that. I suppose if I had the time I could go find quotes to match

yours. That's an easy exercise in trying to prove your point. I'd much

prefer to let my actions prove mine. That and I have other work to

do.....

Regards,

pam

Pam Charney

pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> This healthcare reform IS socialism. People don’t realize that

> socialism is a pre-cursor to communism. The founding fathers fought

> to free America from socialism. Here is a good explanation of how a

> free country ends up in communism: " Every time we talk about these

> taxes we get around to the idea of 'from each according to his

> capacity and to each according to his needs'. That's socialism. It's

> written into the Communist Manifesto. Maybe we ought to see that

> every person who gets a tax return receives a copy of the Communist

> Manifesto with it so he can see what's happening to him. " —T.

> s

>

> America used to fight against any root of communism to keep it from

> taking root here. Now people just want to deny the possibility.

> Maybe we ought coin a term “communism deniersâ€.

>

> And speaking of how the founding fathers actually thought: " If ye

> love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than

> the animating contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not

> your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands, which feed

> you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget

> that ye were our countrymen! " -

>

>

>

> Quoteworthy: “We can’t expect the American people to jump from

> Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in

> giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to

> find that they have Communism.†Soviet dictator Nikita Khrushchev

> speaking of Roosevelt’s “New Deal†paradigm shift.

>

>

> From: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>] On

> Behalf Of yomari cruz

> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 6:21 AM

> To: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

>

>

> By the way the idea of us going back to communism is the most

> ridiculous idea

> you conservatives have these days. I laugh every time I hear that.

> And that I

> did say with an attitude.

>

> ________________________________

> From: Yomari Cruz-Deweese

<yomaricruz@...<mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.com><mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.c\

om

> >>

> To:

" rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogr\

oups.com> "

><rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

>

> <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>>

> Sent: Fri, July 23, 2010 8:16:10 AM

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in

> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

> I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe.

> I don't

> have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just

> like others

> here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In

> fact, I

> think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

>

> Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family

> of " radical

> liberal progressives " )

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens "

<dignacassens@...<mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>

> <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> wrote:

>

> Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our

> thoughts and

> can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my

> history

> lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this

> country's Bill

> of Rights.

>

> Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > >

> > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that

> we jump

> > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's

> what we

> > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can

> build your

> > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't

> entered.

> > > If

> > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered,

> add a

> > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which

> puts

> > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually

> measuring

> > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on

> admission!

> > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > healthcare

> > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > >

> > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators

> sometimes.

> > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > figuring

> > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it

> for you.

> > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated

> with

> > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with

> input

> > > > from the RD.

> > > >

> > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how

> about

> > > > working with your system design team to include the

> information you

> > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > payment

> > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The

> flip

> > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's

> where the

> > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > >

> > > > Have a good day.

> > > > pam

> > > >

> > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > Pharmacy

> > > >

> > > > MS Student

> > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > School of Nursing

> > > >

> > > > University of Washington

> > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com><mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> >

> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix

> almost

> > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > found

> > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a

> BMI

> > > of

> > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being

> lead to

> > > > > believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was

> just

> > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > care

> > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > MD......

> > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented

> every

> > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> 75-1d750a68eb31

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Wow, . Good one. In a nutshell - that sums it all and Nikita would

know.....

Merav Levi, RD, MS, CDNhttp://www.linkedin.com/in/meravlevi

To: rd-usa

From: drowell@...

Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:47:18 +0000

Subject: RE: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

I understand thinking it is a giant leap. But just listen to what a real

live (late) communist “leader” said. Or,... don’t, at the nation’s peril. " We

can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we

can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until

they awaken one day to find that they have Communism. " --Nikita Khrushchev

From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On Behalf Of

Madalyn Friedberg

Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 12:55 PM

To: rd-usa

Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

Pam,

Thank you.

I have been following this thread ( and the one a few months ago about health

care reform) and cannot understand what seems to me to be a giant leap from what

I read and what I experience to communism. I am very happy to have Medicare. My

husband has had multiple surgeries in the past 2 years and without Medicare the

costs would have put a very big hole in our savings.

Madalyn Friedberg. RD CDN

I'm with Yomari on this one. To think that providing healthcare to

Americans is the first step to communism is somewhat off the track. I

was born and raised in the Northeast, in small town New England, where

we still had town meetings. Some of the " founding fathers " (what about

the mothers???) grew up not far from where I did, albeit a couple

years earlier. To think that those who began our country could foresee

the mess we're in is ridiculous. What they did was give us the

framework to build a country, and hope that we'd have the brains to

see into our own future. I honestly cannot see any of them saying " I

got mine, you're on your own " .

, are you referring to McCarthyism? If so, I'm glad we're past

that. I suppose if I had the time I could go find quotes to match

yours. That's an easy exercise in trying to prove your point. I'd much

prefer to let my actions prove mine. That and I have other work to

do.....

Regards,

pam

Pam Charney

pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> This healthcare reform IS socialism. People don’t realize that

> socialism is a pre-cursor to communism. The founding fathers fought

> to free America from socialism. Here is a good explanation of how a

> free country ends up in communism: " Every time we talk about these

> taxes we get around to the idea of 'from each according to his

> capacity and to each according to his needs'. That's socialism. It's

> written into the Communist Manifesto. Maybe we ought to see that

> every person who gets a tax return receives a copy of the Communist

> Manifesto with it so he can see what's happening to him. " —T.

> s

>

> America used to fight against any root of communism to keep it from

> taking root here. Now people just want to deny the possibility.

> Maybe we ought coin a term “communism deniers”.

>

> And speaking of how the founding fathers actually thought: " If ye

> love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than

> the animating contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not

> your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands, which feed

> you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget

> that ye were our countrymen! " -

>

>

>

> Quoteworthy: “We can’t expect the American people to jump from

> Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in

> giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to

> find that they have Communism.” Soviet dictator Nikita Khrushchev

> speaking of Roosevelt’s “New Deal” paradigm shift.

>

>

> From: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>] On

> Behalf Of yomari cruz

> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 6:21 AM

> To: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

>

>

> By the way the idea of us going back to communism is the most

> ridiculous idea

> you conservatives have these days. I laugh every time I hear that.

> And that I

> did say with an attitude.

>

> ________________________________

> From: Yomari Cruz-Deweese

<yomaricruz@...<mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.com><mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.c\

om

> >>

> To:

" rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogr\

oups.com> "

><rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

>

> <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>>

> Sent: Fri, July 23, 2010 8:16:10 AM

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in

> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

> I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe.

> I don't

> have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just

> like others

> here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In

> fact, I

> think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

>

> Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family

> of " radical

> liberal progressives " )

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens "

<dignacassens@...<mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>

> <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> wrote:

>

> Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our

> thoughts and

> can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my

> history

> lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this

> country's Bill

> of Rights.

>

> Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > >

> > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that

> we jump

> > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's

> what we

> > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can

> build your

> > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't

> entered.

> > > If

> > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered,

> add a

> > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which

> puts

> > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually

> measuring

> > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on

> admission!

> > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > healthcare

> > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > >

> > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators

> sometimes.

> > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > figuring

> > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it

> for you.

> > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated

> with

> > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with

> input

> > > > from the RD.

> > > >

> > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how

> about

> > > > working with your system design team to include the

> information you

> > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > payment

> > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The

> flip

> > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's

> where the

> > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > >

> > > > Have a good day.

> > > > pam

> > > >

> > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > Pharmacy

> > > >

> > > > MS Student

> > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > School of Nursing

> > > >

> > > > University of Washington

> > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com><mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> >

> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix

> almost

> > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > found

> > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a

> BMI

> > > of

> > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being

> lead to

> > > > > believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was

> just

> > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > care

> > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > MD......

> > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented

> every

> > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> 75-1d750a68eb31

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Wow, . Good one. In a nutshell - that sums it all and Nikita would

know.....

Merav Levi, RD, MS, CDNhttp://www.linkedin.com/in/meravlevi

To: rd-usa

From: drowell@...

Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:47:18 +0000

Subject: RE: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

I understand thinking it is a giant leap. But just listen to what a real

live (late) communist “leader” said. Or,... don’t, at the nation’s peril. " We

can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we

can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until

they awaken one day to find that they have Communism. " --Nikita Khrushchev

From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On Behalf Of

Madalyn Friedberg

Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 12:55 PM

To: rd-usa

Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

Pam,

Thank you.

I have been following this thread ( and the one a few months ago about health

care reform) and cannot understand what seems to me to be a giant leap from what

I read and what I experience to communism. I am very happy to have Medicare. My

husband has had multiple surgeries in the past 2 years and without Medicare the

costs would have put a very big hole in our savings.

Madalyn Friedberg. RD CDN

I'm with Yomari on this one. To think that providing healthcare to

Americans is the first step to communism is somewhat off the track. I

was born and raised in the Northeast, in small town New England, where

we still had town meetings. Some of the " founding fathers " (what about

the mothers???) grew up not far from where I did, albeit a couple

years earlier. To think that those who began our country could foresee

the mess we're in is ridiculous. What they did was give us the

framework to build a country, and hope that we'd have the brains to

see into our own future. I honestly cannot see any of them saying " I

got mine, you're on your own " .

, are you referring to McCarthyism? If so, I'm glad we're past

that. I suppose if I had the time I could go find quotes to match

yours. That's an easy exercise in trying to prove your point. I'd much

prefer to let my actions prove mine. That and I have other work to

do.....

Regards,

pam

Pam Charney

pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> This healthcare reform IS socialism. People don’t realize that

> socialism is a pre-cursor to communism. The founding fathers fought

> to free America from socialism. Here is a good explanation of how a

> free country ends up in communism: " Every time we talk about these

> taxes we get around to the idea of 'from each according to his

> capacity and to each according to his needs'. That's socialism. It's

> written into the Communist Manifesto. Maybe we ought to see that

> every person who gets a tax return receives a copy of the Communist

> Manifesto with it so he can see what's happening to him. " —T.

> s

>

> America used to fight against any root of communism to keep it from

> taking root here. Now people just want to deny the possibility.

> Maybe we ought coin a term “communism deniers”.

>

> And speaking of how the founding fathers actually thought: " If ye

> love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than

> the animating contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not

> your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands, which feed

> you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget

> that ye were our countrymen! " -

>

>

>

> Quoteworthy: “We can’t expect the American people to jump from

> Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in

> giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to

> find that they have Communism.” Soviet dictator Nikita Khrushchev

> speaking of Roosevelt’s “New Deal” paradigm shift.

>

>

> From: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>] On

> Behalf Of yomari cruz

> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 6:21 AM

> To: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

>

>

> By the way the idea of us going back to communism is the most

> ridiculous idea

> you conservatives have these days. I laugh every time I hear that.

> And that I

> did say with an attitude.

>

> ________________________________

> From: Yomari Cruz-Deweese

<yomaricruz@...<mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.com><mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.c\

om

> >>

> To:

" rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogr\

oups.com> "

><rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

>

> <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>>

> Sent: Fri, July 23, 2010 8:16:10 AM

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in

> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

> I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe.

> I don't

> have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just

> like others

> here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In

> fact, I

> think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

>

> Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family

> of " radical

> liberal progressives " )

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens "

<dignacassens@...<mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>

> <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> wrote:

>

> Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our

> thoughts and

> can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my

> history

> lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this

> country's Bill

> of Rights.

>

> Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > >

> > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that

> we jump

> > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's

> what we

> > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can

> build your

> > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't

> entered.

> > > If

> > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered,

> add a

> > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which

> puts

> > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually

> measuring

> > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on

> admission!

> > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > healthcare

> > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > >

> > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators

> sometimes.

> > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > figuring

> > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it

> for you.

> > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated

> with

> > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with

> input

> > > > from the RD.

> > > >

> > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how

> about

> > > > working with your system design team to include the

> information you

> > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > payment

> > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The

> flip

> > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's

> where the

> > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > >

> > > > Have a good day.

> > > > pam

> > > >

> > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > Pharmacy

> > > >

> > > > MS Student

> > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > School of Nursing

> > > >

> > > > University of Washington

> > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com><mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> >

> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix

> almost

> > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > found

> > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a

> BMI

> > > of

> > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being

> lead to

> > > > > believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was

> just

> > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > care

> > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > MD......

> > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented

> every

> > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> 75-1d750a68eb31

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Wow, . Good one. In a nutshell - that sums it all and Nikita would

know.....

Merav Levi, RD, MS, CDNhttp://www.linkedin.com/in/meravlevi

To: rd-usa

From: drowell@...

Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:47:18 +0000

Subject: RE: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

I understand thinking it is a giant leap. But just listen to what a real

live (late) communist “leader” said. Or,... don’t, at the nation’s peril. " We

can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we

can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until

they awaken one day to find that they have Communism. " --Nikita Khrushchev

From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On Behalf Of

Madalyn Friedberg

Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 12:55 PM

To: rd-usa

Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

Pam,

Thank you.

I have been following this thread ( and the one a few months ago about health

care reform) and cannot understand what seems to me to be a giant leap from what

I read and what I experience to communism. I am very happy to have Medicare. My

husband has had multiple surgeries in the past 2 years and without Medicare the

costs would have put a very big hole in our savings.

Madalyn Friedberg. RD CDN

I'm with Yomari on this one. To think that providing healthcare to

Americans is the first step to communism is somewhat off the track. I

was born and raised in the Northeast, in small town New England, where

we still had town meetings. Some of the " founding fathers " (what about

the mothers???) grew up not far from where I did, albeit a couple

years earlier. To think that those who began our country could foresee

the mess we're in is ridiculous. What they did was give us the

framework to build a country, and hope that we'd have the brains to

see into our own future. I honestly cannot see any of them saying " I

got mine, you're on your own " .

, are you referring to McCarthyism? If so, I'm glad we're past

that. I suppose if I had the time I could go find quotes to match

yours. That's an easy exercise in trying to prove your point. I'd much

prefer to let my actions prove mine. That and I have other work to

do.....

Regards,

pam

Pam Charney

pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> This healthcare reform IS socialism. People don’t realize that

> socialism is a pre-cursor to communism. The founding fathers fought

> to free America from socialism. Here is a good explanation of how a

> free country ends up in communism: " Every time we talk about these

> taxes we get around to the idea of 'from each according to his

> capacity and to each according to his needs'. That's socialism. It's

> written into the Communist Manifesto. Maybe we ought to see that

> every person who gets a tax return receives a copy of the Communist

> Manifesto with it so he can see what's happening to him. " —T.

> s

>

> America used to fight against any root of communism to keep it from

> taking root here. Now people just want to deny the possibility.

> Maybe we ought coin a term “communism deniers”.

>

> And speaking of how the founding fathers actually thought: " If ye

> love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than

> the animating contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not

> your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands, which feed

> you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget

> that ye were our countrymen! " -

>

>

>

> Quoteworthy: “We can’t expect the American people to jump from

> Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in

> giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to

> find that they have Communism.” Soviet dictator Nikita Khrushchev

> speaking of Roosevelt’s “New Deal” paradigm shift.

>

>

> From: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>] On

> Behalf Of yomari cruz

> Sent: Friday, July 23, 2010 6:21 AM

> To: rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

>

>

> By the way the idea of us going back to communism is the most

> ridiculous idea

> you conservatives have these days. I laugh every time I hear that.

> And that I

> did say with an attitude.

>

> ________________________________

> From: Yomari Cruz-Deweese

<yomaricruz@...<mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.com><mailto:yomaricruz%40yahoo.c\

om

> >>

> To:

" rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogr\

oups.com> "

><rd-usa <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>

>

> <mailto:rd-usa%40yahoogroups.com>>

> Sent: Fri, July 23, 2010 8:16:10 AM

> Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> Included in

> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>

> I am glad I havent had a chnce to go into the group and unsubscribe.

> I don't

> have an attitude, in fact I was just expressing my own opinion just

> like others

> here do. I never said they don't have a right to their opinions. In

> fact, I

> think u didn't get my humor... In any case it really is not important.

>

> Yomari (also from Puerto Rico-and a proud PIP member from a family

> of " radical

> liberal progressives " )

>

> Sent from my iPhone

>

> On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:23 PM, " Digna Cassens "

<dignacassens@...<mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>

> <mailto:dignacassens%40roadrunner.com>>

> wrote:

>

> Oh, goodness, Yomari, what a bad attitude! We can't all clone our

> thoughts and

> can and should express our own opinions and ideas. THAT's what my

> history

> lessons taught me THIS country was founded on, or at least this

> country's Bill

> of Rights.

>

> Digna (from Puerto Rico and with very radical and different ideas)

>

> Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be

> > > Included in Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

> > > >

> > > > Before we go off on a tangent here, I'd like to suggest that

> we jump

> > > > for joy over the inclusion of BMI calculators in EMRs. It's

> what we

> > > > wanted, folks. First, we complained that patients weren't being

> > > > weighed or measured on admission to the hospital. You can

> build your

> > > > system so that there's a stop if height and weight aren't

> entered.

> > > If

> > > > you're afraid that stated or " guessed " values will be entered,

> add a

> > > > qualifier that says " actual " or " stated " or " estimated " , which

> puts

> > > > the person entering information on alert that not actually

> measuring

> > > > will be identified. So, now you have height and weight on

> admission!

> > > > Second, we wanted to be included as a valued member of the

> > > healthcare

> > > > team. Here's the chance.

> > > >

> > > > Clinical systems are really just super duper calculators

> sometimes.

> > > > So, rather than the RD or DTR spending time with a calculator

> > > figuring

> > > > out the BMI for all those inpatients, the system will do it

> for you.

> > > > We are not the only providers who care about BMI. Systems don't

> > > > diagnose, people do, so the affixing of a diagnosis associated

> with

> > > > the BMI is the responsibility of the provider, hopefully with

> input

> > > > from the RD.

> > > >

> > > > So rather than bemoaning this awful (????) turn of events, how

> about

> > > > working with your system design team to include the

> information you

> > > > want to diagnose appropriately? After all, there is additional

> > > payment

> > > > for obesity-related conditions under prospective payment. The

> flip

> > > > side of that is you have to avoid misdiagnosing, so here's

> where the

> > > > expert RD can really shine.

> > > >

> > > > Have a good day.

> > > > pam

> > > >

> > > > Pam Charney, PhD, RD

> > > > Affiliate Associate Professor

> > > > Pharmacy

> > > >

> > > > MS Student

> > > > Clinical Informatics and Patient Centered Technology

> > > > School of Nursing

> > > >

> > > > University of Washington

> > > > Seattle, WA

> > > > pcharney@...<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com><mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

<mailto:pcharney%40mac.com

> >

> <mailto:pcharney%40mac.com>

> > > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/pamcharney

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > I work with Alaskan natives and the words wasted cacheix

> almost

> > > > > always go with a BMI of 22 or less. When I worked in El Paso I

> > > found

> > > > > the older larger boned Hispanics also looked wasted etc at a

> BMI

> > > of

> > > > > 22. It is not the gold standard that the public is being

> lead to

> > > > > believe.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jackie Chase RD

> > > > > Dillingham AK

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I agree Holly........on a related note............this was

> just

> > > > > released this month.....an easy to read synopsis of the health

> > > care

> > > > > bill as written by Senators Tom Coburn MD and Barrasso

> > > MD......

> > > > > I've only skimmed it, but it looks like they have documented

> every

> > > > > statement they make.........

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> >http://www.drhotze.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?nodeguid=751b6d91-ccfe-4e23-bd

> 75-1d750a68eb31

> >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Thanks for your vote. So far I have not wanted and continue to thrive and work

hard. I think I'd manage bc I use my brains and body to keep on going and doing.

Digna

RE: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included

>> in

>> Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

>>

>> The last thing we need is more government regulation in our lives. That

>> is

>> not what this country was built on nor what our Founding Father's

>> intended.

>> What ever happened to personal responsibility? If the public did not buy

>> the " highly processed crap " , companies would not continue to produce it.

>> By

>> the way, if the government regulates away all the processed food that

>> contributes to poor health, how do you think it will impact the RD???

>> Before this is misinterpreted, my point is that if the government takes

>> over

>> everything, and Big Brother is dictating our every move, our usefulness

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I have read with interest the differing view points on the BMI subject. I can

see the pros and the cons. What I disagree with is the statement by some people

that this group should not be a forum for political discussion. What a perfect

place to hear differing opinions in a safe non-threatening, professional manner.

If it effects our profession and our lives, it is appropriate. Why does

govenment involvement make a topic taboo? Besides if two people agree on

everything, one of them is unnecessary. Knowledge and change only come from

discussion. Bring it on!

[Guest guest]

Very well said, I have always though that we and the ADA have been " good girls

not making waves " long enough. I remember years ago being told by the ADA

contact not to say anything that might upset the natural food people, they would

fight back. We still may not fight back but having a " political " discussion

among ourselves is a big step. The BMI is going to be such a big deal that I am

considering talking to the INtern program here in Alaska to start getting some

data on BMI of Alaskan Natives. I think the bell curve will shift.

Jackie Chase RD

Dillingham AK

>

>

> I have read with interest the differing view points on the BMI subject. I can

see the pros and the cons. What I disagree with is the statement by some people

that this group should not be a forum for political discussion. What a perfect

place to hear differing opinions in a safe non-threatening, professional manner.

If it effects our profession and our lives, it is appropriate. Why does

govenment involvement make a topic taboo? Besides if two people agree on

everything, one of them is unnecessary. Knowledge and change only come from

discussion. Bring it on!

>

>

[Guest guest]

Very well said, I have always though that we and the ADA have been " good girls

not making waves " long enough. I remember years ago being told by the ADA

contact not to say anything that might upset the natural food people, they would

fight back. We still may not fight back but having a " political " discussion

among ourselves is a big step. The BMI is going to be such a big deal that I am

considering talking to the INtern program here in Alaska to start getting some

data on BMI of Alaskan Natives. I think the bell curve will shift.

Jackie Chase RD

Dillingham AK

>

>

> I have read with interest the differing view points on the BMI subject. I can

see the pros and the cons. What I disagree with is the statement by some people

that this group should not be a forum for political discussion. What a perfect

place to hear differing opinions in a safe non-threatening, professional manner.

If it effects our profession and our lives, it is appropriate. Why does

govenment involvement make a topic taboo? Besides if two people agree on

everything, one of them is unnecessary. Knowledge and change only come from

discussion. Bring it on!

>

>

[Guest guest]

Great comment! I agree. I think those who want to " hit and run " instead of

joining a lively debate discussion are those who know they cannot win in the

arena of ideas, because feelings are all they really have. Feelings are what

feel taboo, as in " don't step on my feelings " . It's when we can begin to

separate feelings from fact and logic that real debate becomes productive and

right and wrong become clear. Yes, there is right and wrong, better and worse

decisions. That is what debate seeks to elucidate. Politics, like religion,

carries some personal feelings with it. But like religion, your politics are

useless if experience and reality do not shine forth to reveal the truth.

" You've got your truth and I've got my truth " , means " there is no such thing as

truth. " That isn't... well, true!

Dave

Quoteworthy: " Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our

inclination, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of

facts and evidence. " -

From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On Behalf Of

mimco_2000

Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 9:21 AM

To: rd-usa

Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

I have read with interest the differing view points on the BMI subject. I can

see the pros and the cons. What I disagree with is the statement by some people

that this group should not be a forum for political discussion. What a perfect

place to hear differing opinions in a safe non-threatening, professional manner.

If it effects our profession and our lives, it is appropriate. Why does

govenment involvement make a topic taboo? Besides if two people agree on

everything, one of them is unnecessary. Knowledge and change only come from

discussion. Bring it on!

[Guest guest]

Great comment! I agree. I think those who want to " hit and run " instead of

joining a lively debate discussion are those who know they cannot win in the

arena of ideas, because feelings are all they really have. Feelings are what

feel taboo, as in " don't step on my feelings " . It's when we can begin to

separate feelings from fact and logic that real debate becomes productive and

right and wrong become clear. Yes, there is right and wrong, better and worse

decisions. That is what debate seeks to elucidate. Politics, like religion,

carries some personal feelings with it. But like religion, your politics are

useless if experience and reality do not shine forth to reveal the truth.

" You've got your truth and I've got my truth " , means " there is no such thing as

truth. " That isn't... well, true!

Dave

Quoteworthy: " Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our

inclination, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of

facts and evidence. " -

From: rd-usa [mailto:rd-usa ] On Behalf Of

mimco_2000

Sent: Saturday, July 24, 2010 9:21 AM

To: rd-usa

Subject: Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

I have read with interest the differing view points on the BMI subject. I can

see the pros and the cons. What I disagree with is the statement by some people

that this group should not be a forum for political discussion. What a perfect

place to hear differing opinions in a safe non-threatening, professional manner.

If it effects our profession and our lives, it is appropriate. Why does

govenment involvement make a topic taboo? Besides if two people agree on

everything, one of them is unnecessary. Knowledge and change only come from

discussion. Bring it on!

[Guest guest]

,

Thank you for putting this very real problem in words. The problem is not

limited to politics--I have experienced it up close and personal. it is a way

of thinking, a way of " arguing " , a way of behavior, and it is prevalent in our

day.

Diane

Re: Obesity Rating for Every American Must Be Included in

Stimulus-Mandated Electronic Health Records, Says HHS

I have read with interest the differing view points on the BMI subject. I can

see the pros and the cons. What I disagree with is the statement by some people

that this group should not be a forum for political discussion. What a perfect

place to hear differing opinions in a safe non-threatening, professional manner.

If it effects our profession and our lives, it is appropriate. Why does

govenment involvement make a topic taboo? Besides if two people agree on

everything, one of them is unnecessary. Knowledge and change only come from

discussion. Bring it on!