Re: Cast your vote (was 12-step-free digest)

[Guest guest]

I agree. The " brainwashed guy " wins on legal grounds, I think. I'm getting

a great giggle out of the whole idea, anyway. I recently went to a meeting

to look up an old aquaintance. He wasn't at the meeting but I forced myself

to sit through 40 minutes (I promply skedaddled at the smoke break!) and was

saddened at seeing the same faces spouting the same warped rhetoric, their

lives still diminished and on hold, clinging to the program. Who of the

truly spiritual people in this world spend much of their time telling people

how spiritual they are? None, I guess. Back to lurking in the shadows for a

while...........Mike

[Guest guest]

Hi Apple, folks

Using the AA logo would be a copyright violation, but I understand that AA

never bothers to prosecute violators these days (tho they might make an

exception for you). Also, putting unremovable labels on things might

constitute criminal damage (dont know the law there, but is likely).

I guess I'm noe of the bleeting sheep Y referred to, but I'm not sure too

disruptive tactics are a good idea; putting removable flyers in books etc is

ok, but I wouldnt do anything that is legally dubious and might provoke

retaliation of some kind (such as hacks on your site) by the AA leviathan.

Best,

Pete

> I've contacted a label company for a price quote, but the project might

> be completed only AFTER I come back from vacation. (at the end of

> september).

>

> I need a group vote... I have two designs in mind:

>

> Both of them will have the same text

> " The dark side of Alcoholics Anonymous revealed!

> www.AAdeprogramming.com

> (Shhhhh.... don't let your sponsor find out)

>

> One design has the AA circle and triangle, with the double " A " s in the

> middle. At first glance it looks like an AA decal. But thre is one

> line of text (there are three), for each side of the triangle.

>

> The other design, has the brainwashed AA guy (from the site) coming out

> of the AA zone. The same text will appear in an appropriately

> decorative typeface.

>

> Please cast your vote... " subtle AA logo " or " brainwashed guy " .

>

> Apple

>

>

> > >Hi there... I've decided on decals that are hard to peel off. They

> can

> > >be placed in Big Books, other recovery books and on phone booths

> > >outside of meetings.

> > >Apple

> >

> > " hard to peel off " - apple, you continue to kill me. Man, that's

> funny.

> > Yes! That will be super cool. Please give us a preview as to the

> text that

> > will be on them.

> >

> > Oooo. I just thought of some recovery clubs that could use a little

> > late-night " decorating " MMMMMmmmmwahahahahahahah... Oh I feel alive.

> >

> >

> > Laterz,

> >

> > Alan Ro...er... I mean... from Nebraska...yeah, that's

> the

> > ticket...

> >

> > ______________________________________________________

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Was the salesman clueless?

> Productopia has the answers.

> http://clickhere./click/555

>

>

>

> eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free

> - Simplifying group communications

>

>

>

>

----------------------

Pete Watts

Owner

PSY-PHAR Psychotherapy/Pharmacotherapy Outocomes Discussion

PERSONALITY-DISORDERS Support/Discussion

[Guest guest]

Hi Apple, folks

Using the AA logo would be a copyright violation, but I understand that AA

never bothers to prosecute violators these days (tho they might make an

exception for you). Also, putting unremovable labels on things might

constitute criminal damage (dont know the law there, but is likely).

I guess I'm noe of the bleeting sheep Y referred to, but I'm not sure too

disruptive tactics are a good idea; putting removable flyers in books etc is

ok, but I wouldnt do anything that is legally dubious and might provoke

retaliation of some kind (such as hacks on your site) by the AA leviathan.

Best,

Pete

> I've contacted a label company for a price quote, but the project might

> be completed only AFTER I come back from vacation. (at the end of

> september).

>

> I need a group vote... I have two designs in mind:

>

> Both of them will have the same text

> " The dark side of Alcoholics Anonymous revealed!

> www.AAdeprogramming.com

> (Shhhhh.... don't let your sponsor find out)

>

> One design has the AA circle and triangle, with the double " A " s in the

> middle. At first glance it looks like an AA decal. But thre is one

> line of text (there are three), for each side of the triangle.

>

> The other design, has the brainwashed AA guy (from the site) coming out

> of the AA zone. The same text will appear in an appropriately

> decorative typeface.

>

> Please cast your vote... " subtle AA logo " or " brainwashed guy " .

>

> Apple

>

>

> > >Hi there... I've decided on decals that are hard to peel off. They

> can

> > >be placed in Big Books, other recovery books and on phone booths

> > >outside of meetings.

> > >Apple

> >

> > " hard to peel off " - apple, you continue to kill me. Man, that's

> funny.

> > Yes! That will be super cool. Please give us a preview as to the

> text that

> > will be on them.

> >

> > Oooo. I just thought of some recovery clubs that could use a little

> > late-night " decorating " MMMMMmmmmwahahahahahahah... Oh I feel alive.

> >

> >

> > Laterz,

> >

> > Alan Ro...er... I mean... from Nebraska...yeah, that's

> the

> > ticket...

> >

> > ______________________________________________________

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Was the salesman clueless?

> Productopia has the answers.

> http://clickhere./click/555

>

>

>

> eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free

> - Simplifying group communications

>

>

>

>

----------------------

Pete Watts

Owner

PSY-PHAR Psychotherapy/Pharmacotherapy Outocomes Discussion

PERSONALITY-DISORDERS Support/Discussion

[Guest guest]

Hi Apple, folks

Using the AA logo would be a copyright violation, but I understand that AA

never bothers to prosecute violators these days (tho they might make an

exception for you). Also, putting unremovable labels on things might

constitute criminal damage (dont know the law there, but is likely).

I guess I'm noe of the bleeting sheep Y referred to, but I'm not sure too

disruptive tactics are a good idea; putting removable flyers in books etc is

ok, but I wouldnt do anything that is legally dubious and might provoke

retaliation of some kind (such as hacks on your site) by the AA leviathan.

Best,

Pete

> I've contacted a label company for a price quote, but the project might

> be completed only AFTER I come back from vacation. (at the end of

> september).

>

> I need a group vote... I have two designs in mind:

>

> Both of them will have the same text

> " The dark side of Alcoholics Anonymous revealed!

> www.AAdeprogramming.com

> (Shhhhh.... don't let your sponsor find out)

>

> One design has the AA circle and triangle, with the double " A " s in the

> middle. At first glance it looks like an AA decal. But thre is one

> line of text (there are three), for each side of the triangle.

>

> The other design, has the brainwashed AA guy (from the site) coming out

> of the AA zone. The same text will appear in an appropriately

> decorative typeface.

>

> Please cast your vote... " subtle AA logo " or " brainwashed guy " .

>

> Apple

>

>

> > >Hi there... I've decided on decals that are hard to peel off. They

> can

> > >be placed in Big Books, other recovery books and on phone booths

> > >outside of meetings.

> > >Apple

> >

> > " hard to peel off " - apple, you continue to kill me. Man, that's

> funny.

> > Yes! That will be super cool. Please give us a preview as to the

> text that

> > will be on them.

> >

> > Oooo. I just thought of some recovery clubs that could use a little

> > late-night " decorating " MMMMMmmmmwahahahahahahah... Oh I feel alive.

> >

> >

> > Laterz,

> >

> > Alan Ro...er... I mean... from Nebraska...yeah, that's

> the

> > ticket...

> >

> > ______________________________________________________

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Was the salesman clueless?

> Productopia has the answers.

> http://clickhere./click/555

>

>

>

> eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free

> - Simplifying group communications

>

>

>

>

----------------------

Pete Watts

Owner

PSY-PHAR Psychotherapy/Pharmacotherapy Outocomes Discussion

PERSONALITY-DISORDERS Support/Discussion

[Guest guest]

I understand that AA did try to protect copyright on its logo when used by

rehabs etc but gave up as they got too common and was producing that dreaded

" controversy " .i.e. bad publicity they do so much to avoid. Also, they get the

free promotion of course by others using it.

My vote incidentally, is for the AA logo modified with arms coming off the

circle, in the manner of a swastika, in homage to the crypto-Nazi roots of AA.

This would probably get around a copyright claim too, particularly if the " AA "

were left off.

Apple, have you got something on your site on the Nazi sympathies of Buchman?

Diener is the guy to wirite it if you havent.

Pete

> wrose-@... wrote:

>

> That's an interesting question-would AA sue anybody?

>

> Doesn't that violate a tradition or step??

>

>

> original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=7951

> > For your safety, I must vote for the " brainwashed guy. " I think the AA

> > circle/triangle with the AA in the middle is protected by copyright

> > (held by GSO) and with your website printed right on it, they would

> > have no trouble tracking you down and suing for copyright violation.

> If

> > the " brainwashed guy " on your site is your original creation, you

> > automatically hold the copyright to it and can use it as you see fit,

> > or designate it as " copyfree " if you wish.

> >

> > Kate

> >

> > > I need a group vote... I have two designs in mind:

> > >

> > > Both of them will have the same text

> > > " The dark side of Alcoholics Anonymous revealed!

> > > www.AAdeprogramming.com

> > > (Shhhhh.... don't let your sponsor find out)

> > >

> > > One design has the AA circle and triangle, with the double " A " s in

> the

> > > middle. At first glance it looks like an AA decal. But thre is one

> > > line of text (there are three), for each side of the triangle.

> > >

> > > The other design, has the brainwashed AA guy (from the site) coming

> > out

> > > of the AA zone. The same text will appear in an appropriately

> > > decorative typeface.

> > >

> > > Please cast your vote... " subtle AA logo " or " brainwashed guy " .

> > >

> > > Apple

> > >

> > >

> > > > >Hi there... I've decided on decals that are hard to peel off.

> They

> > > can

> > > > >be placed in Big Books, other recovery books and on phone booths

> > > > >outside of meetings.

> > > > >Apple

> > > >

> > > > " hard to peel off " - apple, you continue to kill me. Man, that's

> > > funny.

> > > > Yes! That will be super cool. Please give us a preview as to the

> > > text that

> > > > will be on them.

> > > >

> > > > Oooo. I just thought of some recovery clubs that could use a

> > little

> > > > late-night " decorating " MMMMMmmmmwahahahahahahah... Oh I feel

> alive.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Laterz,

> > > >

> > > > Alan Ro...er... I mean... from Nebraska...yeah, that's

> > > the

> > > > ticket...

> > > >

> > > > ______________________________________________________

> > >

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Was the salesman clueless?

> Productopia has the answers.

> http://clickhere./click/555

>

>

>

> eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free

> - Simplifying group communications

>

>

>

>

----------------------

Pete Watts

Owner

PSY-PHAR Psychotherapy/Pharmacotherapy Outocomes Discussion

PERSONALITY-DISORDERS Support/Discussion

[Guest guest]

I understand that AA did try to protect copyright on its logo when used by

rehabs etc but gave up as they got too common and was producing that dreaded

" controversy " .i.e. bad publicity they do so much to avoid. Also, they get the

free promotion of course by others using it.

My vote incidentally, is for the AA logo modified with arms coming off the

circle, in the manner of a swastika, in homage to the crypto-Nazi roots of AA.

This would probably get around a copyright claim too, particularly if the " AA "

were left off.

Apple, have you got something on your site on the Nazi sympathies of Buchman?

Diener is the guy to wirite it if you havent.

Pete

> wrose-@... wrote:

>

> That's an interesting question-would AA sue anybody?

>

> Doesn't that violate a tradition or step??

>

>

> original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=7951

> > For your safety, I must vote for the " brainwashed guy. " I think the AA

> > circle/triangle with the AA in the middle is protected by copyright

> > (held by GSO) and with your website printed right on it, they would

> > have no trouble tracking you down and suing for copyright violation.

> If

> > the " brainwashed guy " on your site is your original creation, you

> > automatically hold the copyright to it and can use it as you see fit,

> > or designate it as " copyfree " if you wish.

> >

> > Kate

> >

> > > I need a group vote... I have two designs in mind:

> > >

> > > Both of them will have the same text

> > > " The dark side of Alcoholics Anonymous revealed!

> > > www.AAdeprogramming.com

> > > (Shhhhh.... don't let your sponsor find out)

> > >

> > > One design has the AA circle and triangle, with the double " A " s in

> the

> > > middle. At first glance it looks like an AA decal. But thre is one

> > > line of text (there are three), for each side of the triangle.

> > >

> > > The other design, has the brainwashed AA guy (from the site) coming

> > out

> > > of the AA zone. The same text will appear in an appropriately

> > > decorative typeface.

> > >

> > > Please cast your vote... " subtle AA logo " or " brainwashed guy " .

> > >

> > > Apple

> > >

> > >

> > > > >Hi there... I've decided on decals that are hard to peel off.

> They

> > > can

> > > > >be placed in Big Books, other recovery books and on phone booths

> > > > >outside of meetings.

> > > > >Apple

> > > >

> > > > " hard to peel off " - apple, you continue to kill me. Man, that's

> > > funny.

> > > > Yes! That will be super cool. Please give us a preview as to the

> > > text that

> > > > will be on them.

> > > >

> > > > Oooo. I just thought of some recovery clubs that could use a

> > little

> > > > late-night " decorating " MMMMMmmmmwahahahahahahah... Oh I feel

> alive.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Laterz,

> > > >

> > > > Alan Ro...er... I mean... from Nebraska...yeah, that's

> > > the

> > > > ticket...

> > > >

> > > > ______________________________________________________

> > >

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Was the salesman clueless?

> Productopia has the answers.

> http://clickhere./click/555

>

>

>

> eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free

> - Simplifying group communications

>

>

>

>

----------------------

Pete Watts

Owner

PSY-PHAR Psychotherapy/Pharmacotherapy Outocomes Discussion

PERSONALITY-DISORDERS Support/Discussion

[Guest guest]

I understand that AA did try to protect copyright on its logo when used by

rehabs etc but gave up as they got too common and was producing that dreaded

" controversy " .i.e. bad publicity they do so much to avoid. Also, they get the

free promotion of course by others using it.

My vote incidentally, is for the AA logo modified with arms coming off the

circle, in the manner of a swastika, in homage to the crypto-Nazi roots of AA.

This would probably get around a copyright claim too, particularly if the " AA "

were left off.

Apple, have you got something on your site on the Nazi sympathies of Buchman?

Diener is the guy to wirite it if you havent.

Pete

> wrose-@... wrote:

>

> That's an interesting question-would AA sue anybody?

>

> Doesn't that violate a tradition or step??

>

>

> original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=7951

> > For your safety, I must vote for the " brainwashed guy. " I think the AA

> > circle/triangle with the AA in the middle is protected by copyright

> > (held by GSO) and with your website printed right on it, they would

> > have no trouble tracking you down and suing for copyright violation.

> If

> > the " brainwashed guy " on your site is your original creation, you

> > automatically hold the copyright to it and can use it as you see fit,

> > or designate it as " copyfree " if you wish.

> >

> > Kate

> >

> > > I need a group vote... I have two designs in mind:

> > >

> > > Both of them will have the same text

> > > " The dark side of Alcoholics Anonymous revealed!

> > > www.AAdeprogramming.com

> > > (Shhhhh.... don't let your sponsor find out)

> > >

> > > One design has the AA circle and triangle, with the double " A " s in

> the

> > > middle. At first glance it looks like an AA decal. But thre is one

> > > line of text (there are three), for each side of the triangle.

> > >

> > > The other design, has the brainwashed AA guy (from the site) coming

> > out

> > > of the AA zone. The same text will appear in an appropriately

> > > decorative typeface.

> > >

> > > Please cast your vote... " subtle AA logo " or " brainwashed guy " .

> > >

> > > Apple

> > >

> > >

> > > > >Hi there... I've decided on decals that are hard to peel off.

> They

> > > can

> > > > >be placed in Big Books, other recovery books and on phone booths

> > > > >outside of meetings.

> > > > >Apple

> > > >

> > > > " hard to peel off " - apple, you continue to kill me. Man, that's

> > > funny.

> > > > Yes! That will be super cool. Please give us a preview as to the

> > > text that

> > > > will be on them.

> > > >

> > > > Oooo. I just thought of some recovery clubs that could use a

> > little

> > > > late-night " decorating " MMMMMmmmmwahahahahahahah... Oh I feel

> alive.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Laterz,

> > > >

> > > > Alan Ro...er... I mean... from Nebraska...yeah, that's

> > > the

> > > > ticket...

> > > >

> > > > ______________________________________________________

> > >

> >

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Was the salesman clueless?

> Productopia has the answers.

> http://clickhere./click/555

>

>

>

> eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free

> - Simplifying group communications

>

>

>

>

----------------------

Pete Watts

Owner

PSY-PHAR Psychotherapy/Pharmacotherapy Outocomes Discussion

PERSONALITY-DISORDERS Support/Discussion

[Guest guest]

I still maintain that I cannot be sued for stickers ending up wherever

they end up. If someone is beated to a pulp with a baseball bat, the

bat manufacturer is not responsible. Same with guns, & Wesson

(not !) aren't legally to blame for the murders commited with

guns which they manufacture. I hope that people won't be too evil with

the stickers. Phone booths outside of clubs are a good spot. People's

cars are NOT a good spot. I can't control it of course, but I hope

that our crew will try to come off as classy guerillas.

Apple

> Hi Apple, folks

>

> Using the AA logo would be a copyright violation, but I understand

that AA

> never bothers to prosecute violators these days (tho they might make

an

> exception for you). Also, putting unremovable labels on things might

> constitute criminal damage (dont know the law there, but is likely).

>

> I guess I'm noe of the bleeting sheep Y referred to, but I'm

not sure too

> disruptive tactics are a good idea; putting removable flyers in books

etc is

> ok, but I wouldnt do anything that is legally dubious and might

provoke

> retaliation of some kind (such as hacks on your site) by the AA

leviathan.

>

[Guest guest]

I still maintain that I cannot be sued for stickers ending up wherever

they end up. If someone is beated to a pulp with a baseball bat, the

bat manufacturer is not responsible. Same with guns, & Wesson

(not !) aren't legally to blame for the murders commited with

guns which they manufacture. I hope that people won't be too evil with

the stickers. Phone booths outside of clubs are a good spot. People's

cars are NOT a good spot. I can't control it of course, but I hope

that our crew will try to come off as classy guerillas.

Apple

> Hi Apple, folks

>

> Using the AA logo would be a copyright violation, but I understand

that AA

> never bothers to prosecute violators these days (tho they might make

an

> exception for you). Also, putting unremovable labels on things might

> constitute criminal damage (dont know the law there, but is likely).

>

> I guess I'm noe of the bleeting sheep Y referred to, but I'm

not sure too

> disruptive tactics are a good idea; putting removable flyers in books

etc is

> ok, but I wouldnt do anything that is legally dubious and might

provoke

> retaliation of some kind (such as hacks on your site) by the AA

leviathan.

>

[Guest guest]

I do not, no... I've read about this in Bufe's book and others, but I'm

not a historian. If you know 's e-mail, please mail it to me

privately, or ask him if he has something that's ready to go that I can

post. I'm kinda busy before vacation to pursue this.

Apple

>

> Apple, have you got something on your site on the Nazi sympathies of

Buchman?

> Diener is the guy to wirite it if you havent.

[Guest guest]

I do not, no... I've read about this in Bufe's book and others, but I'm

not a historian. If you know 's e-mail, please mail it to me

privately, or ask him if he has something that's ready to go that I can

post. I'm kinda busy before vacation to pursue this.

Apple

>

> Apple, have you got something on your site on the Nazi sympathies of

Buchman?

> Diener is the guy to wirite it if you havent.