reaching a block? (w/response)

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" milisabelle " writes:

<<For over 1 1/2 years I have been coming off valium, which I was put on because

a doc cold turkeyed me off Clonazepam which my therapist had me on for years. I

trusted her, don't know why. she kept me going on it by saying over and over

that I could not get addicted, and the dose was tiny. When the other doc C/Ted

me, I was psychotic within 2 days. That is why she put me on the valium. I was

in utter shock at the huge dose: 30 mg.!! In 2 days I am cutting another mg..

But I'm scared now, because something is happening...>>

** I read your whole post (not easy given lack of spaces and paragraphs) so

let me interrupt right here. You're right when you say it is difficult to

differentiate between the mold, the reaction to the drug, and the drug

withdrawal. I think all your energy should go to getting out of where you are

living. The " wheel " that squeaks loudly gets oiled more quickly that those that

merely need oil and make little noise.

You said:

<<With no one to help me, I cut wrong. At one point I was waking up at 4 am, as

directed by the therapist (who went nuts on me and I had to quit). I just

didn't want to wake up during the night. but then that started a pattern of

waking up before my 7 am dose, and going crazy for several hours every morning.

That eased but then I started this all day long crying thing...>>

** This is difficult to make anything of because I have no idea at which

point you were when this happened and what dose you were on. Also, it's not

clear to me (again, maybe the difficulty I'm having reading the post) when your

previous dose drop was and how many of these you had dose.

What I can tell you is that most likely you are cutting too fast Valium has a

huge half-life of about 7 days (168 hrs.). This is why you feel nothing

negative the first day. There's plenty left in your system even skipping a full

dose for a day.

I seriously doubt that 1 mg. decreases are causing you this kind of distress.

I think the problem comes from three places:

1) You began decreasing Valium while still in crisis from a cold turkey

withdrawal from Klonopin (clonazepam). This means that you're only making it

worse. The evidence for this is your statement about believing the drug is

making you feel worse. If you had been stable prior to doing the Valium

decreases this would most likely not happen.

You said:

<<When I cut a mg., I get a day of feeling a bit like what I will when I'm off,

more myself, calm... then it gets worse and worse for a few days..The worst of

the problem is that I wanted off the benzos in the first place because my

side-effect is that I have a paradoxical reaction - it GIVES me wave after wave

of anxiety attacks. My last cut I decided on 7 am. I think now that that was

another mistake. >>

** I don't understand what you mean here. What does the time have to do

with it? The " paradoxical reaction " is not paradoxical at all. This is like a

big snowball rolling downhill. The longer it's been rolling the bigger it gets

and the faster it goes.

How do you decide when to do your decreases? I believe you never stabilize

before you're doing another decrease. With this drug it would take most likely

at least 3 weeks between decreases to fully stabilize. Also, are you saying

you're dropping only 1 mg. at a time?

You said:

<<I'm on a horrible rollercoaster and dragging my family with me. My daughter

tells me about what I was like the first few months and I shudder at what that

put her through. My family situation is extremely complicated and getting

desperate.

Now I am starting to feel a serious urge for the next dose, 3 mg. versus 2

mg..>>

** Please explain clearly how much Valium you are taking and how often you

take it. The only thing clear to me is that you were prescribed 30 mg of Valium

when experiencing an abrupt Klonopin withdrawal.

You said:

<<How desperately I wish I could TALK to somebody! With all the online forums

closing done, it's been hard... >>

** What online forums have closed?

We're less about talking here about what people are experiencing and more

about talking about how to fix these things. We've found that the people in

most groups are stuck in the same place three years down the road. This doesn't

happen here.

I need to tell you that a cold turkey withdrawal makes recovery much more

complicated.

You said:

<<I'm facing a huge life crisis with my two adult but disabled kids, we are

getting sicker and sicker because our house is full of toxic mold and I can't

always separate which symptom is which. The only way for us to leave is to go

through 'city housing' which scares us silly, just what I don't need. I have

multiple other health issues.

Everyone keeps saying how strong,brave, etc. I am to keep cutting the valium

(also addicted to codeine by doctor because of severe abcesses - told not to cut

that by doc because it would be too much for me).>>

** How long were you on the codeine when you were told not to stop it? With

antibiotics one should not be very addicted to codeine even after 10 days or so.

How much codeine are you on and how often?

You said:

<<I so desperately want the horrible effects of the valium to stop that I am

moving ahead with the cuts a little faster than I have been told is good. But

with all that I am going through,the last thing I need is MORE anxiety and

terror, and the valium causes that. Has anyone else run into a dose change that

sudenly made things more difficult? >>

** You're complaining about a problem that is caused by reducing too

frequently. The anxiety and terror is left over from the Clonazepam cessation.

You believe the problem is the Valium but it's not.

You said:

<<I SO wish that I had not stopped the regular pattern, the 4 hour one, waking

up at 4 am... but I don't see how I can change that now...So I'm stuck with the

horrible rollercoaster, made worse by the mold that hits us around 4-5am, and

several times during the day. Even if the city can get us out of this house, I

feel so totally raw and desperate, I don't know if we will be able to handle

moving (long story, have to do it 'secretly')>>

** It may not seem like it but you'll manage. We are capable of much more

than we believe we are. Why does the mold " hit " at certain times?

You said:

<<I can't even focus enough anymore to know what it is I am asking for... What I

really want is just support, help...But we are so isolated...It is almost

impossible for me to believe that the horrible valium rollercoaster will ever

stop, even if I am off the poison! I am even afraid to take anything, even

camomile tea, for fear of making things worse, I react so strongly to anything

now..

Any words of advice or support would be greatly appreciated!!>>

** Opiates (codeine) interferes in the assimilation of a benzodiazepine

(Valium). They have to be taken at least 4 hours apart for this to not happen.

If you can answer all my questions I can help you a little right now. To

really clarify the problems you'll need to get out of the toxic mold

environment. Make noise, lots of noise. Call your legislator. Threaten to call

the media.

Please answer as clearly as possible. Thanks.

Regards,

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