Re: Fermentation for dummies

[Guest guest]

aprilshowers2462 wrote:

>

>- dill pickles in brine developed a couple of small whitish moldy-looking

spots. My brine

>was from NT (with whey). I tried to just scoop off the moldy bits but now I'm

squeamish

>about eating the pickles as the brine water is a bit cloudy, though the overall

smell is

>briny/fine. Edible?

>

>

I had one batch of pickles flop this summer because I didn't use enough

salt. All of my subsequent batches have turned out fine. Sandor Katz

recommends skimming the top every day to get the scum off. FWIW, all of

my batches have been slightly cloudy, but have tasted just fine. We've

been eating them for about two months now without any digestive

incident, so I think you may be safe.

HTH!

--s

[Guest guest]

I've read a couple times now that if the top gets moldy you can

discard that and still eat what's underneath.

I'd be squeamish about the pickles, too, tho.

I did have a batch of sauerkraut that got some mold on top that I

used what was underneath and didn't get sick and it tasted fine.

I think somewhere it said that few harmful bacteria can grow in the

salt and acidity so the food lactofermented is usually quite safe.

I bet if you contact the ative Extension, tho, you'll get a

different story, but their job is really to prevent any possibility

of food poisoning, so how to tell when they err on the side of

caution???

>

> I do love lacto-fermentation and am getting to be one of those

people that always have a

> jar of something in a warm corner.

>

> But I also can't say that my efforts have been enormously

successful. My first batch of

> sauerkraut went so well that I started fermenting everything in

smaller batches. Some

> setbacks:

>

> - fermented in a small crock pot, the edges of the sauerkraut

turned brown - this is the

> part that didn't quite stay under the brine. Can I scrape off the

brown part and eat on?

>

> - dill pickles in brine developed a couple of small whitish moldy-

looking spots. My brine

> was from NT (with whey). I tried to just scoop off the moldy bits

but now I'm squeamish

> about eating the pickles as the brine water is a bit cloudy,

though the overall smell is

> briny/fine. Edible?

>

> In NT, Sally says that if a batch of fermented veggies/fruits goes

bad, the smell will be so

> horrible you won't want to eat it. This doesn't seem to me

reliable. Anyone out there

> willing to share their experiences with fermenting fruits and

veggies, and specifically

> experience with knowing when to just toss a batch?

>

> Thanks.

> april

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, April

I used to use Fallon's whey-method. The taste was unreliable, imo, and

after reading all the comments on this site about people NOT using whey, I

switched over to the Wild Fermentation techniques this summer, including

scouting out and using white oak and wild grape leaves. I'm thrilled. My

brine, in a few jars, is cloudy but I think it's because I didn't skim the

" scum " quickly enough, having left them on their own, sitting on the

counter, while I went on vacation. They still taste great! I

especially love the result of using the oak or grape leaves (which I remove

after the first four days) - pickles are snap-crisp from all the great

tannin (which is also a natural chelator/de-toxifier). I use wide-mouth

mason jars and discovered that I have small 2-4 oz. Anchor Hocking glass

custard cups that fit perfectly into the mouth of the mason jars - once I

get the contents in the jars, fill it with brine, I " sit " the custard cup

into the mouth of the jar. It basically looks like it is floating on top

the ingredients, and its rim is parallel with the jar rim. There's enough

weight to it so the ingredients are kept under-brine, while the brine is

forced to move up the sides of the custard cup, making a brine seal between

it's outer edges and the jar sides, forcing air out. I wish I'd taken a

photo - easier to explain. LOL. I noticed a lot less " scum " using this

technique and the contents were basically sealed, with no air contact. HTH.

Sharon

On 8/30/06, aprilshowers2462 <april.streeter@...> wrote:

>

> I do love lacto-fermentation and am getting to be one of those people

> that always have a

> jar of something in a warm corner.

>

> But I also can't say that my efforts have been enormously successful. My

> first batch of

> sauerkraut went so well that I started fermenting everything in smaller

> batches. Some

> setbacks:

>

> - fermented in a small crock pot, the edges of the sauerkraut turned brown

> - this is the

> part that didn't quite stay under the brine. Can I scrape off the brown

> part and eat on?

>

> - dill pickles in brine developed a couple of small whitish moldy-looking

> spots. My brine

> was from NT (with whey). I tried to just scoop off the moldy bits but now

> I'm squeamish

> about eating the pickles as the brine water is a bit cloudy, though the

> overall smell is

> briny/fine. Edible?

>

> In NT, Sally says that if a batch of fermented veggies/fruits goes bad,

> the smell will be so

> horrible you won't want to eat it. This doesn't seem to me reliable.

> Anyone out there

> willing to share their experiences with fermenting fruits and veggies, and

> specifically

> experience with knowing when to just toss a batch?

>

> Thanks.

> april

>

> __._,_._

>

[Guest guest]

>

> - dill pickles in brine developed a couple of small whitish

moldy-looking spots. My brine

> was from NT (with whey). I tried to just scoop off the moldy bits

but now I'm squeamish

> about eating the pickles as the brine water is a bit cloudy, though

the overall smell is

> briny/fine. Edible?

My mother and I have been making dill pickles for 35 years. I don't

use whey. I did try the NT recipe once, and the pickles were mushy.

I use a very strong brine with a little vinegar, and boiling water

which blanches the cucumbers,dill,garlic & grape leaf, then they

ferment for 6 weeks. Never had one go bad, but they do get a bit

cloudy with whitish stuff in the jar. My mother says it doesn't spoil

(I have had unopened jars at room temperature for years that were

fine) because you sterilize all the jars and utensils, because the

brine is boiled, and because of the high salt content.

[Guest guest]

Is it a particular kind of oak leaf or not? My mother was wondering.

Nanette

Re: Fermentation for dummies

Hi, April

I used to use Fallon's whey-method. The taste was unreliable, imo, and

after reading all the comments on this site about people NOT using whey, I

switched over to the Wild Fermentation techniques this summer, including

scouting out and using white oak and wild grape leaves. I'm thrilled. My

brine, in a few jars, is cloudy but I think it's because I didn't skim the

" scum " quickly enough, having left them on their own, sitting on the

counter, while I went on vacation. They still taste great! I

especially love the result of using the oak or grape leaves (which I

remove

after the first four days) - pickles are snap-crisp from all the great

tannin (which is also a natural chelator/de-toxifier). I use wide-mouth

mason jars and discovered that I have small 2-4 oz. Anchor Hocking glass

custard cups that fit perfectly into the mouth of the mason jars - once I

get the contents in the jars, fill it with brine, I " sit " the custard cup

into the mouth of the jar. It basically looks like it is floating on top

the ingredients, and its rim is parallel with the jar rim. There's enough

weight to it so the ingredients are kept under-brine, while the brine is

forced to move up the sides of the custard cup, making a brine seal

between

it's outer edges and the jar sides, forcing air out. I wish I'd taken a

photo - easier to explain. LOL. I noticed a lot less " scum " using this

technique and the contents were basically sealed, with no air contact.

HTH.

Sharon

On 8/30/06, aprilshowers2462 <april.streeter@...> wrote:

>

> I do love lacto-fermentation and am getting to be one of those people

> that always have a

> jar of something in a warm corner.

>

> But I also can't say that my efforts have been enormously successful. My

> first batch of

> sauerkraut went so well that I started fermenting everything in smaller

> batches. Some

> setbacks:

>

> - fermented in a small crock pot, the edges of the sauerkraut turned

brown

> - this is the

> part that didn't quite stay under the brine. Can I scrape off the brown

> part and eat on?

>

> - dill pickles in brine developed a couple of small whitish

moldy-looking

> spots. My brine

> was from NT (with whey). I tried to just scoop off the moldy bits but

now

> I'm squeamish

> about eating the pickles as the brine water is a bit cloudy, though the

> overall smell is

> briny/fine. Edible?

>

> In NT, Sally says that if a batch of fermented veggies/fruits goes bad,

> the smell will be so

> horrible you won't want to eat it. This doesn't seem to me reliable.

> Anyone out there

> willing to share their experiences with fermenting fruits and veggies,

and

> specifically

> experience with knowing when to just toss a batch?

>

> Thanks.

> april

>

> __._,_._

>

[Guest guest]

Nanette J. Landen wrote:

>Is it a particular kind of oak leaf or not? My mother was wondering.

>

>Nanette

>

>

>

I cry absolute ignorance about the kind of oak tree in our back yard.

Let me consult with my resident carpenter.....he says it's a red oak. I

doubt, though, that it makes any difference. Well, perhaps the tannin

levels are different in the different varieties, but I'm not that

specific about those kinds of requirements for my ferments; I'd use

leaves from whatever oak tree happened to be available.

HTH!

--s