Re: Discussing Topper's funky leg illness

[Guest guest]

All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal color as they should.

When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on the shin as the left did...

It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot, cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has left a scar.

I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40 years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the lumps.. she's just not sure...

If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@...

Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas what the heck it is?

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 "De" writes:

I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain?? Mornings, evenings or all the time?Deanna

[Guest guest]

All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal color as they should.

When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on the shin as the left did...

It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot, cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has left a scar.

I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40 years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the lumps.. she's just not sure...

If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@...

Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas what the heck it is?

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 "De" writes:

I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain?? Mornings, evenings or all the time?Deanna

[Guest guest]

All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal color as they should.

When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on the shin as the left did...

It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot, cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has left a scar.

I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40 years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the lumps.. she's just not sure...

If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@...

Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas what the heck it is?

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 "De" writes:

I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain?? Mornings, evenings or all the time?Deanna

[Guest guest]

Lymphedema!

Re: Discussing Topper's funky leg illness

All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal color as they should.

When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on the shin as the left did...

It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot, cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has left a scar.

I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40 years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the lumps.. she's just not sure...

If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@...

Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas what the heck it is?

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 "De" writes:

I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain?? Mornings, evenings or all the time?Deanna

[Guest guest]

Lymphedema!

Re: Discussing Topper's funky leg illness

All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal color as they should.

When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on the shin as the left did...

It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot, cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has left a scar.

I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40 years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the lumps.. she's just not sure...

If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@...

Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas what the heck it is?

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 "De" writes:

I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain?? Mornings, evenings or all the time?Deanna

[Guest guest]

Lymphedema!

Re: Discussing Topper's funky leg illness

All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal color as they should.

When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on the shin as the left did...

It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot, cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has left a scar.

I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40 years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the lumps.. she's just not sure...

If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@...

Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas what the heck it is?

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 "De" writes:

I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain?? Mornings, evenings or all the time?Deanna

[Guest guest]

I'm stumped! Hmm....I think I would try some hot herbal Green tea.

It is fairly inexpensive and can be found at any grocery store. It's

pretty much a cure all or at least a " help all " I'll email you

off list in a little while and we can play 20 questions.

Deanna

> All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It

started out

> as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's

red, and

> hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or

five

> weeks after the first.

>

> Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking

> mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that

many

> in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is

the

> largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around

the

> back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be

covered

> by the boot of an ice skate.

>

> The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts

you can

> feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

>

> As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the

ankles

> and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

>

> My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or

tingling..

> and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and

> normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal

color

> as they should.

>

> When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on

the shin

> as the left did...

>

> It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to

> rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot,

cold,

> air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear

> slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the

fabric is

> as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

>

> When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship

betrayal

> type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as

I was

> running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of

DHEA (I'd

> been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea

if any

> of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone

else sees

> something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal

> glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month

ago...

> I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

>

> Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best

keeping

> the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when

they are

> very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep..

they

> really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas,

> refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

>

> At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in

both

> legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps'

are. The

> rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked

my shins

> HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

>

> I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low

dose of

> aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning

> couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but

a 2nd

> degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has

left a

> scar.

>

> I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the

> hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident

in a

> work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the

paper work

> for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was

> living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with

him..

> and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs

> medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right

now.. I

> have no idea what this is....

>

> Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not

> concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that

sure

> what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40

years of

> medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every

> morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's

not

> just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the

lumps..

> she's just not sure...

>

> If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be

> identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@j...

>

> Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started

stretches

> again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of

the

> time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and

spend time

> down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

>

> Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some

pressure surge

> through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just

under the

> skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but

sometimes does

> if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

>

> Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas

what the

> heck it is?

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain??

> Mornings, evenings or all the time?

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

I'm stumped! Hmm....I think I would try some hot herbal Green tea.

It is fairly inexpensive and can be found at any grocery store. It's

pretty much a cure all or at least a " help all " I'll email you

off list in a little while and we can play 20 questions.

Deanna

> All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It

started out

> as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's

red, and

> hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or

five

> weeks after the first.

>

> Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking

> mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that

many

> in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is

the

> largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around

the

> back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be

covered

> by the boot of an ice skate.

>

> The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts

you can

> feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

>

> As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the

ankles

> and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

>

> My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or

tingling..

> and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and

> normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal

color

> as they should.

>

> When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on

the shin

> as the left did...

>

> It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to

> rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot,

cold,

> air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear

> slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the

fabric is

> as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

>

> When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship

betrayal

> type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as

I was

> running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of

DHEA (I'd

> been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea

if any

> of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone

else sees

> something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal

> glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month

ago...

> I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

>

> Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best

keeping

> the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when

they are

> very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep..

they

> really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas,

> refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

>

> At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in

both

> legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps'

are. The

> rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked

my shins

> HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

>

> I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low

dose of

> aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning

> couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but

a 2nd

> degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has

left a

> scar.

>

> I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the

> hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident

in a

> work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the

paper work

> for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was

> living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with

him..

> and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs

> medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right

now.. I

> have no idea what this is....

>

> Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not

> concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that

sure

> what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40

years of

> medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every

> morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's

not

> just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the

lumps..

> she's just not sure...

>

> If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be

> identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@j...

>

> Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started

stretches

> again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of

the

> time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and

spend time

> down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

>

> Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some

pressure surge

> through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just

under the

> skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but

sometimes does

> if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

>

> Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas

what the

> heck it is?

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain??

> Mornings, evenings or all the time?

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

I'm stumped! Hmm....I think I would try some hot herbal Green tea.

It is fairly inexpensive and can be found at any grocery store. It's

pretty much a cure all or at least a " help all " I'll email you

off list in a little while and we can play 20 questions.

Deanna

> All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It

started out

> as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and painful. It's

red, and

> hot most of the time... started in the second leg about a month or

five

> weeks after the first.

>

> Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is thinking

> mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could have that

many

> in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on the left is

the

> largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now moving around

the

> back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle that would be

covered

> by the boot of an ice skate.

>

> The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts

you can

> feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

>

> As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the

ankles

> and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

>

> My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or

tingling..

> and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are heathy and

> normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return to normal

color

> as they should.

>

> When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on

the shin

> as the left did...

>

> It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning to

> rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot,

cold,

> air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to wear

> slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the

fabric is

> as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

>

> When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship

betrayal

> type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal glandular as

I was

> running low and was trying to stretch it... and I'd run out of

DHEA (I'd

> been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing well). I have no idea

if any

> of that pertains directly... but I include it so that if anyone

else sees

> something that I don't.. they have the info. I increased my adrenal

> glandular back up to the dose before I'd reduced, about a month

ago...

> I'm picking up more DHEA tomorrow (finally have the money to).

>

> Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best

keeping

> the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and when

they are

> very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short on sleep..

they

> really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on the hot areas,

> refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

>

> At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot... in

both

> legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with the 'lumps'

are. The

> rest of the time it's like a walked into a low board and whacked

my shins

> HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

>

> I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low

dose of

> aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood thinning

> couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing normally... but

a 2nd

> degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got infected and has

left a

> scar.

>

> I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and the

> hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident

in a

> work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the

paper work

> for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even though I was

> living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I do live with

him..

> and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is something that needs

> medical care.. that will be faced when needed.. but for right

now.. I

> have no idea what this is....

>

> Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's not

> concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that

sure

> what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40

years of

> medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests' every

> morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and it's

not

> just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing the

lumps..

> she's just not sure...

>

> If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be

> identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@j...

>

> Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started

stretches

> again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up most of

the

> time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking goal and

spend time

> down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

>

> Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some

pressure surge

> through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a tingling just

under the

> skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or sneeze... but

sometimes does

> if I have a really deep, long 'jaw cracker' yawn.

>

> Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas

what the

> heck it is?

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle pain??

> Mornings, evenings or all the time?

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

Yes... you've said that...... Need more input, grasshopper..... heheheheheheheeh

I'm not saying that you are wrong.... I know that's what made you end up in the hospital.....

It's just weird..... To have gone so many years so badly hypo.. then have it pop up now.... weird....

Topper ()

On Thu, 2 Sep 2004 11:41:49 -0500 "Feisty\(ThyroFeisty\)" writes:

Lymphedema!

[Guest guest]

Yes... you've said that...... Need more input, grasshopper..... heheheheheheheeh

I'm not saying that you are wrong.... I know that's what made you end up in the hospital.....

It's just weird..... To have gone so many years so badly hypo.. then have it pop up now.... weird....

Topper ()

On Thu, 2 Sep 2004 11:41:49 -0500 "Feisty\(ThyroFeisty\)" writes:

Lymphedema!

[Guest guest]

Yes... you've said that...... Need more input, grasshopper..... heheheheheheheeh

I'm not saying that you are wrong.... I know that's what made you end up in the hospital.....

It's just weird..... To have gone so many years so badly hypo.. then have it pop up now.... weird....

Topper ()

On Thu, 2 Sep 2004 11:41:49 -0500 "Feisty\(ThyroFeisty\)" writes:

Lymphedema!

[Guest guest]

I was just reading about that online!! I actually typed " do you

think it's lymph related " in my reply but then deleted it for some

reason. That's another reason I suggested Green tea! It's a diuretic

and this helps Lymphedema! Great minds think alike

Deanna

> Lymphedema!

> Re: Discussing Topper's

funky leg illness

>

>

> All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It

started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and

painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second

leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

>

> Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is

thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could

have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on

the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now

moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle

that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

>

> The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts

you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

>

> As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the

ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

>

> My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or

tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are

heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return

to normal color as they should.

>

> When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on

the shin as the left did...

>

> It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning

to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot,

cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to

wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the

fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

>

> When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship

betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal

glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and

I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing

well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I

include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they

have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose

before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA

tomorrow (finally have the money to).

>

> Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best

keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and

when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short

on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on

the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

>

> At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot...

in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with

the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low

board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

>

> I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low

dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood

thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing

normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got

infected and has left a scar.

>

> I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and

the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident

in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the

paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even

though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I

do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is

something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed..

but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

>

> Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's

not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that

sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40

years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests'

every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and

it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing

the lumps.. she's just not sure...

>

> If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be

identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@j...

>

> Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started

stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up

most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking

goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

>

> Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some

pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a

tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or

sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw

cracker' yawn.

>

> Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas

what the heck it is?

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

writes:

> I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle

pain??

> Mornings, evenings or all the time?

>

> Deanna

>

>

[Guest guest]

I was just reading about that online!! I actually typed " do you

think it's lymph related " in my reply but then deleted it for some

reason. That's another reason I suggested Green tea! It's a diuretic

and this helps Lymphedema! Great minds think alike

Deanna

> Lymphedema!

> Re: Discussing Topper's

funky leg illness

>

>

> All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It

started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and

painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second

leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

>

> Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is

thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could

have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on

the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now

moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle

that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

>

> The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts

you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

>

> As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the

ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

>

> My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or

tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are

heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return

to normal color as they should.

>

> When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on

the shin as the left did...

>

> It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning

to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot,

cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to

wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the

fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

>

> When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship

betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal

glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and

I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing

well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I

include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they

have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose

before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA

tomorrow (finally have the money to).

>

> Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best

keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and

when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short

on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on

the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

>

> At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot...

in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with

the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low

board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

>

> I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low

dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood

thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing

normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got

infected and has left a scar.

>

> I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and

the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident

in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the

paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even

though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I

do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is

something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed..

but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

>

> Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's

not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that

sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40

years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests'

every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and

it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing

the lumps.. she's just not sure...

>

> If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be

identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@j...

>

> Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started

stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up

most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking

goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

>

> Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some

pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a

tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or

sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw

cracker' yawn.

>

> Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas

what the heck it is?

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

writes:

> I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle

pain??

> Mornings, evenings or all the time?

>

> Deanna

>

>

[Guest guest]

I was just reading about that online!! I actually typed " do you

think it's lymph related " in my reply but then deleted it for some

reason. That's another reason I suggested Green tea! It's a diuretic

and this helps Lymphedema! Great minds think alike

Deanna

> Lymphedema!

> Re: Discussing Topper's

funky leg illness

>

>

> All the time.. over two months now.. closer to three?.... It

started out as pitting edema.. then turned solid/hard.... and

painful. It's red, and hot most of the time... started in the second

leg about a month or five weeks after the first.

>

> Ruth and I are both feeling lumps on the sides... she is

thinking mulitple blood clots... but I can't imagine that I could

have that many in both legs and still be alive.... The hard area on

the left is the largest, on the front of the shin mostly.... but now

moving around the back.. ummmm... the part of the back of the ankle

that would be covered by the boot of an ice skate.

>

> The hard part on the shin has a definite edge.... in many parts

you can feel it... almost 'cliff' like.

>

> As this has progressed I have virtually no soft swelling of the

ankles and feet even though they used to swell horribly before.

>

> My feet and toes are of normal color, not painful, not cold or

tingling.. and I have normal feeling and motion in them. Nails are

heathy and normal.. and when the nail beds are pressed they return

to normal color as they should.

>

> When the right leg started, it started in the exact same spot on

the shin as the left did...

>

> It seems as though the areas that were pitting edema are turning

to rock.... except the rock has feeling (gentle touch, scratch, hot,

cold, air blowing across) But it hurts to add any pressure. Even to

wear slacks or to put a sheet on in bed.. the pressure/weight of the

fabric is as if I'm being kicked in the shins.

>

> When I started I was under a lot of emotional stress (friendship

betrayal type stress), then I'd had to cut back on my adrenal

glandular as I was running low and was trying to stretch it... and

I'd run out of DHEA (I'd been on 12.5 mcg for over a year and doing

well). I have no idea if any of that pertains directly... but I

include it so that if anyone else sees something that I don't.. they

have the info. I increased my adrenal glandular back up to the dose

before I'd reduced, about a month ago... I'm picking up more DHEA

tomorrow (finally have the money to).

>

> Alison sent me some herbal soap that helps a lot.... I feel best

keeping the legs up... doing a lot of toe and feet wiggling.. and

when they are very sore, like these last two and a half weeks short

on sleep.. they really like cool compresses (damp wash cloth laid on

the hot areas, refreshing them as the 'fever' heats the cloth)

>

> At times I have severe/sharp pain, but not in the same spot...

in both legs, around the sides of the hot/hard areas, with

the 'lumps' are. The rest of the time it's like a walked into a low

board and whacked my shins HARD and it's just not stopping hurting...

>

> I have no fever.. do not feel in any way ill.... I started a low

dose of aspirin (81mg) 6 weeks ago... thinking that a little blood

thinning couldn't hurt. Normal cuts on my skin are healing

normally... but a 2nd degree burn that I got from a cookie sheet got

infected and has left a scar.

>

> I'm nervous about what this is... but can't afford a doc.. and

the hospital here... well put it this way.. I was in for an accident

in a work truck... the company didn't show up quick enough with the

paper work for worker's comp.. and they went after my dad... even

though I was living 40 miles away... they came after him.... Now I

do live with him.. and he doesn't need them to sue... If this is

something that needs medical care.. that will be faced when needed..

but for right now.. I have no idea what this is....

>

> Ruth is a retired ER nurse... she's helping me watch... she's

not concerned to the point of hauling me in.. but she's not all that

sure what it is either.. she's never seen anything like in some 40

years of medical experience. She's the one that does the 'toe tests'

every morning... so that we can be sure that I really can feel and

it's not just me knowing that I'm touching my toes. But even probing

the lumps.. she's just not sure...

>

> If anyone wants to do a twenty questions and see if this can be

identified... give me a holler off list.... topper2@j...

>

> Because of it I've stopped my exercises.. just recently started

stretches again cause I'm getting so stiff sitting with my feet up

most of the time.... I haven't even been able to reach my walking

goal and spend time down by the river cause of this bulltweet....

>

> Oh... I just sighed... when I sigh it's like there is some

pressure surge through the bad parts and it hurts more.. like a

tingling just under the skin... it doesn't happen during a cough or

sneeze... but sometimes does if I have a really deep, long 'jaw

cracker' yawn.

>

> Are you sorry you asked? Or (closing eyes and wishing) any ideas

what the heck it is?

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 14:28:40 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

writes:

> I must have missed that post. Is it circulation?? Muscle

pain??

> Mornings, evenings or all the time?

>

> Deanna

>

>

[Guest guest]

Green tea is bad for thyroid.. it's the fluoride in it.. I'm considering peppermint tea.. that has been my tonic for years... I have a box stashed for emergencies....

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 17:38:15 -0000 "De" writes:

I'm stumped! Hmm....I think I would try some hot herbal Green tea. It is fairly inexpensive and can be found at any grocery store. It's pretty much a cure all or at least a "help all" I'll email you off list in a little while and we can play 20 questions. Deanna

[Guest guest]

so that's two votes for lymph related.. and a good suspicion of my own... what puzzles me is how hard it is..... It did start out as a pitting edema... it was that way... oh... six months.. before it got hard....

keep going gals.... knowing what it is will let me choose the best course of action... 's got infected... I'm not wanting that to happen to me... I have no drainage or anything.. and my comments about cuts healing normally was to stress that I don't fear any internal infection... yet

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 17:39:54 -0000 "De" writes:

I was just reading about that online!! I actually typed "do you think it's lymph related" in my reply but then deleted it for some reason. That's another reason I suggested Green tea! It's a diuretic and this helps Lymphedema! Great minds think alike :)Deanna

[Guest guest]

WOW! I never knew that. I love Green tea. But, is it bad for thyroid

meds or only people that still have a thyroid?? You'd think those of

us who are soley on meds would be able to get away with a little

more....

I'll keep researching then! I think peppermint is a stimulative, so

while it might help with feeling blah and low energy, it might not

be good for soothing lymph related problems. I read a diuretic would

be good. Aren't cranberries and cherries a diuretics? Hmmm...I'll

keep looking

Deanna

> Green tea is bad for thyroid.. it's the fluoride in it.. I'm

considering

> peppermint tea.. that has been my tonic for years... I have a box

stashed

> for emergencies....

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 17:38:15 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> I'm stumped! Hmm....I think I would try some hot herbal Green tea.

> It is fairly inexpensive and can be found at any grocery store.

It's

> pretty much a cure all or at least a " help all " I'll email you

> off list in a little while and we can play 20 questions.

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

WOW! I never knew that. I love Green tea. But, is it bad for thyroid

meds or only people that still have a thyroid?? You'd think those of

us who are soley on meds would be able to get away with a little

more....

I'll keep researching then! I think peppermint is a stimulative, so

while it might help with feeling blah and low energy, it might not

be good for soothing lymph related problems. I read a diuretic would

be good. Aren't cranberries and cherries a diuretics? Hmmm...I'll

keep looking

Deanna

> Green tea is bad for thyroid.. it's the fluoride in it.. I'm

considering

> peppermint tea.. that has been my tonic for years... I have a box

stashed

> for emergencies....

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 17:38:15 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> I'm stumped! Hmm....I think I would try some hot herbal Green tea.

> It is fairly inexpensive and can be found at any grocery store.

It's

> pretty much a cure all or at least a " help all " I'll email you

> off list in a little while and we can play 20 questions.

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

WOW! I never knew that. I love Green tea. But, is it bad for thyroid

meds or only people that still have a thyroid?? You'd think those of

us who are soley on meds would be able to get away with a little

more....

I'll keep researching then! I think peppermint is a stimulative, so

while it might help with feeling blah and low energy, it might not

be good for soothing lymph related problems. I read a diuretic would

be good. Aren't cranberries and cherries a diuretics? Hmmm...I'll

keep looking

Deanna

> Green tea is bad for thyroid.. it's the fluoride in it.. I'm

considering

> peppermint tea.. that has been my tonic for years... I have a box

stashed

> for emergencies....

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 17:38:15 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> I'm stumped! Hmm....I think I would try some hot herbal Green tea.

> It is fairly inexpensive and can be found at any grocery store.

It's

> pretty much a cure all or at least a " help all " I'll email you

> off list in a little while and we can play 20 questions.

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

Peppermint tea is a non caffeine kidney enhancer.??? I don't want to use the word stimulant... it really makes you push through a lot of fluid... good for bladder infections. or anything where white counts can get high and you want to keep the blood clean of impurities... like dead white cells... so that the live white cells have clear targets of the invaders....

Okay.. lymph experts.... Do I have to be careful about restricting activity... with the suspicion of possible blood clots.. I've stopped all extra activity and exercise... with the thought in mind that the clots need to dissolve, not break loose..... But would moderate activity... like my bedxercises.. but beneficial in getting fluid moving again?

If this is lymph, I assume the 'hard' stuff is just backed up solid fluid.... Lymph fluid being kinda thickish.. not thin like blood.... the heat is the body trying to do...what? The red is that it's irritated... the pain is that it's irritated... But I have just never felt 'sick' about it... I dont' feel as though my body is fighting an infection... I don't feel tired as if my body is fighting an infection... and when I am fighting a 'sick' I tend to get more of an appetite... so I'm just not seeing any of that... just the symptoms of the legs them selves.....

I want to get back to exercising.. get back to losing more weight.. all that has been on hold..... boo hoo

Fluoride... I'm trying to pull it out of my brain.. if anyone still has any of the data..... fluoride binds with thyroid hormone, on the same order as soy ??? In which case if you have no thyroid function and totally dependant on meds... you have not back up for a bit of extra production by remaining thyroid gland function and that makes it a big no no... unless you are consistent with your dosing of the binding foods and adjust your meds accordingly....

I only have soy in two products, and have tried to limit their use... putting them on 'treat' status... Miracle Whip and Peanut butter... otherwise I'm pretty good with limiting the bad foods... still eating those that are generally healthy.. broccoli, cabbage and such... but spreading out the use... and eating them about an hour before a thyroid dose.. so that the new dose is there to replenish... so far that seems to be working... Considering that skipping one of my multidoses makes me sleepy/yawny...

I just put green tea on my personal bad list... never to try....

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 18:08:11 -0000 "De" writes:

WOW! I never knew that. I love Green tea. But, is it bad for thyroid meds or only people that still have a thyroid?? You'd think those of us who are soley on meds would be able to get away with a little more....I'll keep researching then! I think peppermint is a stimulative, so while it might help with feeling blah and low energy, it might not be good for soothing lymph related problems. I read a diuretic would be good. Aren't cranberries and cherries a diuretics? Hmmm...I'll keep lookingDeanna

[Guest guest]

Peppermint tea is a non caffeine kidney enhancer.??? I don't want to use the word stimulant... it really makes you push through a lot of fluid... good for bladder infections. or anything where white counts can get high and you want to keep the blood clean of impurities... like dead white cells... so that the live white cells have clear targets of the invaders....

Okay.. lymph experts.... Do I have to be careful about restricting activity... with the suspicion of possible blood clots.. I've stopped all extra activity and exercise... with the thought in mind that the clots need to dissolve, not break loose..... But would moderate activity... like my bedxercises.. but beneficial in getting fluid moving again?

If this is lymph, I assume the 'hard' stuff is just backed up solid fluid.... Lymph fluid being kinda thickish.. not thin like blood.... the heat is the body trying to do...what? The red is that it's irritated... the pain is that it's irritated... But I have just never felt 'sick' about it... I dont' feel as though my body is fighting an infection... I don't feel tired as if my body is fighting an infection... and when I am fighting a 'sick' I tend to get more of an appetite... so I'm just not seeing any of that... just the symptoms of the legs them selves.....

I want to get back to exercising.. get back to losing more weight.. all that has been on hold..... boo hoo

Fluoride... I'm trying to pull it out of my brain.. if anyone still has any of the data..... fluoride binds with thyroid hormone, on the same order as soy ??? In which case if you have no thyroid function and totally dependant on meds... you have not back up for a bit of extra production by remaining thyroid gland function and that makes it a big no no... unless you are consistent with your dosing of the binding foods and adjust your meds accordingly....

I only have soy in two products, and have tried to limit their use... putting them on 'treat' status... Miracle Whip and Peanut butter... otherwise I'm pretty good with limiting the bad foods... still eating those that are generally healthy.. broccoli, cabbage and such... but spreading out the use... and eating them about an hour before a thyroid dose.. so that the new dose is there to replenish... so far that seems to be working... Considering that skipping one of my multidoses makes me sleepy/yawny...

I just put green tea on my personal bad list... never to try....

Topper ()

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 18:08:11 -0000 "De" writes:

WOW! I never knew that. I love Green tea. But, is it bad for thyroid meds or only people that still have a thyroid?? You'd think those of us who are soley on meds would be able to get away with a little more....I'll keep researching then! I think peppermint is a stimulative, so while it might help with feeling blah and low energy, it might not be good for soothing lymph related problems. I read a diuretic would be good. Aren't cranberries and cherries a diuretics? Hmmm...I'll keep lookingDeanna

[Guest guest]

Found this online....love the internet!

CAUSES OF LYMPHEDEMA

Secondary and Primary

Surgical procedures and/or radiation therapy in the treatment of

Breast, Gynecological, Head , Neck, Prostate or Testicular, Bladder,

Colon Cancers or Melanomas.( Due to treatment, there is removal of,

or damage to the lymph nodes or vessels so that lymph fluid is no

longer able to be transported properly in the body).

Trauma - injuries and accidents in which the lymphatic system is

interrupted or damaged

Infections - which interrupts normal lymphatic pathway function

Primary

Present at birth for unknown causes or associated with arterial-

venous abnormalities.

Lymphedema Praecox - appears during puberty, mostly in girls, and

usually affects one lower extremity.

Lymphedema Tarda - occurs in both male and female adults. The onset

is sudden with no apparent cause and can affect one or both

extremities.

TREATMENT FOR LYMPHEDEMA

Complex Decongestive Physiotherapy, (CDP) or Complete Decongestive

Therapy (CDT)

Manual Lymphatic Drainage

This treatment is a gentle light touch massage. This prevents damage

to the tissues. It promotes lymph flow through the collateral

(superficial) lymph vessels to channel the lymph into the abdominal

area ( the " watershed " ) and into normal functioning lymphatic vessels

and nodes. These collateral lymph vessels are usually working

normally and the problem lies in the deeper vessels which were

damaged and scarred.

Bandaging

The therapist places compression bandaging around the limb. Often

foam chip pads are placed under the bandaging to increase pressure on

fibrotic area to break down scar tissue. These bandages stay on 24

hours a day throughout the treatment period. They come off only to

shower, do skin care, assess the swelling reduction and to do the MLD.

Skin Care

Use a soap with a low pH., unscented and not antibacterial soaps. A

good liquid soap is Cetaphil. The skin must be moisturized after

bathing. Use a lotion like Eucerin or Nivea. If there are any

irritations use an antibacterial cream. Always dry the area very

well,and gently, after washing.

Exercises

An individualized exercise program will be given by the therapist to

each patient. They will improve muscular contractions and joint

mobility.There will also be strengthening exercises for the limb that

will reduce muscle atrophy. Muscular contractions along with the low-

stretch bandages provide constant counter pressure to keep the lymph

fluid moving.

> Peppermint tea is a non caffeine kidney enhancer.??? I don't want

to use

> the word stimulant... it really makes you push through a lot of

fluid...

> good for bladder infections. or anything where white counts can get

high

> and you want to keep the blood clean of impurities... like dead

white

> cells... so that the live white cells have clear targets of the

> invaders....

>

> Okay.. lymph experts.... Do I have to be careful about restricting

> activity... with the suspicion of possible blood clots.. I've

stopped all

> extra activity and exercise... with the thought in mind that the

clots

> need to dissolve, not break loose..... But would moderate

activity...

> like my bedxercises.. but beneficial in getting fluid moving again?

>

> If this is lymph, I assume the 'hard' stuff is just backed up solid

> fluid.... Lymph fluid being kinda thickish.. not thin like

blood.... the

> heat is the body trying to do...what? The red is that it's

irritated...

> the pain is that it's irritated... But I have just never

felt 'sick'

> about it... I dont' feel as though my body is fighting an

infection... I

> don't feel tired as if my body is fighting an infection... and when

I am

> fighting a 'sick' I tend to get more of an appetite... so I'm just

not

> seeing any of that... just the symptoms of the legs them

selves.....

>

> I want to get back to exercising.. get back to losing more weight..

all

> that has been on hold..... boo hoo

>

> Fluoride... I'm trying to pull it out of my brain.. if anyone still

has

> any of the data..... fluoride binds with thyroid hormone, on the

same

> order as soy ??? In which case if you have no thyroid function and

> totally dependant on meds... you have not back up for a bit of extra

> production by remaining thyroid gland function and that makes it a

big no

> no... unless you are consistent with your dosing of the binding

foods and

> adjust your meds accordingly....

>

> I only have soy in two products, and have tried to limit their

use...

> putting them on 'treat' status... Miracle Whip and Peanut butter...

> otherwise I'm pretty good with limiting the bad foods... still

eating

> those that are generally healthy.. broccoli, cabbage and such... but

> spreading out the use... and eating them about an hour before a

thyroid

> dose.. so that the new dose is there to replenish... so far that

seems to

> be working... Considering that skipping one of my multidoses makes

me

> sleepy/yawny...

>

> I just put green tea on my personal bad list... never to try....

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 18:08:11 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> WOW! I never knew that. I love Green tea. But, is it bad for

thyroid

> meds or only people that still have a thyroid?? You'd think those

of

> us who are soley on meds would be able to get away with a little

> more....

>

> I'll keep researching then! I think peppermint is a stimulative,

so

> while it might help with feeling blah and low energy, it might not

> be good for soothing lymph related problems. I read a diuretic

would

> be good. Aren't cranberries and cherries a diuretics? Hmmm...I'll

> keep looking

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

Found this online....love the internet!

CAUSES OF LYMPHEDEMA

Secondary and Primary

Surgical procedures and/or radiation therapy in the treatment of

Breast, Gynecological, Head , Neck, Prostate or Testicular, Bladder,

Colon Cancers or Melanomas.( Due to treatment, there is removal of,

or damage to the lymph nodes or vessels so that lymph fluid is no

longer able to be transported properly in the body).

Trauma - injuries and accidents in which the lymphatic system is

interrupted or damaged

Infections - which interrupts normal lymphatic pathway function

Primary

Present at birth for unknown causes or associated with arterial-

venous abnormalities.

Lymphedema Praecox - appears during puberty, mostly in girls, and

usually affects one lower extremity.

Lymphedema Tarda - occurs in both male and female adults. The onset

is sudden with no apparent cause and can affect one or both

extremities.

TREATMENT FOR LYMPHEDEMA

Complex Decongestive Physiotherapy, (CDP) or Complete Decongestive

Therapy (CDT)

Manual Lymphatic Drainage

This treatment is a gentle light touch massage. This prevents damage

to the tissues. It promotes lymph flow through the collateral

(superficial) lymph vessels to channel the lymph into the abdominal

area ( the " watershed " ) and into normal functioning lymphatic vessels

and nodes. These collateral lymph vessels are usually working

normally and the problem lies in the deeper vessels which were

damaged and scarred.

Bandaging

The therapist places compression bandaging around the limb. Often

foam chip pads are placed under the bandaging to increase pressure on

fibrotic area to break down scar tissue. These bandages stay on 24

hours a day throughout the treatment period. They come off only to

shower, do skin care, assess the swelling reduction and to do the MLD.

Skin Care

Use a soap with a low pH., unscented and not antibacterial soaps. A

good liquid soap is Cetaphil. The skin must be moisturized after

bathing. Use a lotion like Eucerin or Nivea. If there are any

irritations use an antibacterial cream. Always dry the area very

well,and gently, after washing.

Exercises

An individualized exercise program will be given by the therapist to

each patient. They will improve muscular contractions and joint

mobility.There will also be strengthening exercises for the limb that

will reduce muscle atrophy. Muscular contractions along with the low-

stretch bandages provide constant counter pressure to keep the lymph

fluid moving.

> Peppermint tea is a non caffeine kidney enhancer.??? I don't want

to use

> the word stimulant... it really makes you push through a lot of

fluid...

> good for bladder infections. or anything where white counts can get

high

> and you want to keep the blood clean of impurities... like dead

white

> cells... so that the live white cells have clear targets of the

> invaders....

>

> Okay.. lymph experts.... Do I have to be careful about restricting

> activity... with the suspicion of possible blood clots.. I've

stopped all

> extra activity and exercise... with the thought in mind that the

clots

> need to dissolve, not break loose..... But would moderate

activity...

> like my bedxercises.. but beneficial in getting fluid moving again?

>

> If this is lymph, I assume the 'hard' stuff is just backed up solid

> fluid.... Lymph fluid being kinda thickish.. not thin like

blood.... the

> heat is the body trying to do...what? The red is that it's

irritated...

> the pain is that it's irritated... But I have just never

felt 'sick'

> about it... I dont' feel as though my body is fighting an

infection... I

> don't feel tired as if my body is fighting an infection... and when

I am

> fighting a 'sick' I tend to get more of an appetite... so I'm just

not

> seeing any of that... just the symptoms of the legs them

selves.....

>

> I want to get back to exercising.. get back to losing more weight..

all

> that has been on hold..... boo hoo

>

> Fluoride... I'm trying to pull it out of my brain.. if anyone still

has

> any of the data..... fluoride binds with thyroid hormone, on the

same

> order as soy ??? In which case if you have no thyroid function and

> totally dependant on meds... you have not back up for a bit of extra

> production by remaining thyroid gland function and that makes it a

big no

> no... unless you are consistent with your dosing of the binding

foods and

> adjust your meds accordingly....

>

> I only have soy in two products, and have tried to limit their

use...

> putting them on 'treat' status... Miracle Whip and Peanut butter...

> otherwise I'm pretty good with limiting the bad foods... still

eating

> those that are generally healthy.. broccoli, cabbage and such... but

> spreading out the use... and eating them about an hour before a

thyroid

> dose.. so that the new dose is there to replenish... so far that

seems to

> be working... Considering that skipping one of my multidoses makes

me

> sleepy/yawny...

>

> I just put green tea on my personal bad list... never to try....

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 18:08:11 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> WOW! I never knew that. I love Green tea. But, is it bad for

thyroid

> meds or only people that still have a thyroid?? You'd think those

of

> us who are soley on meds would be able to get away with a little

> more....

>

> I'll keep researching then! I think peppermint is a stimulative,

so

> while it might help with feeling blah and low energy, it might not

> be good for soothing lymph related problems. I read a diuretic

would

> be good. Aren't cranberries and cherries a diuretics? Hmmm...I'll

> keep looking

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

Found this online....love the internet!

CAUSES OF LYMPHEDEMA

Secondary and Primary

Surgical procedures and/or radiation therapy in the treatment of

Breast, Gynecological, Head , Neck, Prostate or Testicular, Bladder,

Colon Cancers or Melanomas.( Due to treatment, there is removal of,

or damage to the lymph nodes or vessels so that lymph fluid is no

longer able to be transported properly in the body).

Trauma - injuries and accidents in which the lymphatic system is

interrupted or damaged

Infections - which interrupts normal lymphatic pathway function

Primary

Present at birth for unknown causes or associated with arterial-

venous abnormalities.

Lymphedema Praecox - appears during puberty, mostly in girls, and

usually affects one lower extremity.

Lymphedema Tarda - occurs in both male and female adults. The onset

is sudden with no apparent cause and can affect one or both

extremities.

TREATMENT FOR LYMPHEDEMA

Complex Decongestive Physiotherapy, (CDP) or Complete Decongestive

Therapy (CDT)

Manual Lymphatic Drainage

This treatment is a gentle light touch massage. This prevents damage

to the tissues. It promotes lymph flow through the collateral

(superficial) lymph vessels to channel the lymph into the abdominal

area ( the " watershed " ) and into normal functioning lymphatic vessels

and nodes. These collateral lymph vessels are usually working

normally and the problem lies in the deeper vessels which were

damaged and scarred.

Bandaging

The therapist places compression bandaging around the limb. Often

foam chip pads are placed under the bandaging to increase pressure on

fibrotic area to break down scar tissue. These bandages stay on 24

hours a day throughout the treatment period. They come off only to

shower, do skin care, assess the swelling reduction and to do the MLD.

Skin Care

Use a soap with a low pH., unscented and not antibacterial soaps. A

good liquid soap is Cetaphil. The skin must be moisturized after

bathing. Use a lotion like Eucerin or Nivea. If there are any

irritations use an antibacterial cream. Always dry the area very

well,and gently, after washing.

Exercises

An individualized exercise program will be given by the therapist to

each patient. They will improve muscular contractions and joint

mobility.There will also be strengthening exercises for the limb that

will reduce muscle atrophy. Muscular contractions along with the low-

stretch bandages provide constant counter pressure to keep the lymph

fluid moving.

> Peppermint tea is a non caffeine kidney enhancer.??? I don't want

to use

> the word stimulant... it really makes you push through a lot of

fluid...

> good for bladder infections. or anything where white counts can get

high

> and you want to keep the blood clean of impurities... like dead

white

> cells... so that the live white cells have clear targets of the

> invaders....

>

> Okay.. lymph experts.... Do I have to be careful about restricting

> activity... with the suspicion of possible blood clots.. I've

stopped all

> extra activity and exercise... with the thought in mind that the

clots

> need to dissolve, not break loose..... But would moderate

activity...

> like my bedxercises.. but beneficial in getting fluid moving again?

>

> If this is lymph, I assume the 'hard' stuff is just backed up solid

> fluid.... Lymph fluid being kinda thickish.. not thin like

blood.... the

> heat is the body trying to do...what? The red is that it's

irritated...

> the pain is that it's irritated... But I have just never

felt 'sick'

> about it... I dont' feel as though my body is fighting an

infection... I

> don't feel tired as if my body is fighting an infection... and when

I am

> fighting a 'sick' I tend to get more of an appetite... so I'm just

not

> seeing any of that... just the symptoms of the legs them

selves.....

>

> I want to get back to exercising.. get back to losing more weight..

all

> that has been on hold..... boo hoo

>

> Fluoride... I'm trying to pull it out of my brain.. if anyone still

has

> any of the data..... fluoride binds with thyroid hormone, on the

same

> order as soy ??? In which case if you have no thyroid function and

> totally dependant on meds... you have not back up for a bit of extra

> production by remaining thyroid gland function and that makes it a

big no

> no... unless you are consistent with your dosing of the binding

foods and

> adjust your meds accordingly....

>

> I only have soy in two products, and have tried to limit their

use...

> putting them on 'treat' status... Miracle Whip and Peanut butter...

> otherwise I'm pretty good with limiting the bad foods... still

eating

> those that are generally healthy.. broccoli, cabbage and such... but

> spreading out the use... and eating them about an hour before a

thyroid

> dose.. so that the new dose is there to replenish... so far that

seems to

> be working... Considering that skipping one of my multidoses makes

me

> sleepy/yawny...

>

> I just put green tea on my personal bad list... never to try....

>

> Topper ()

>

> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 18:08:11 -0000 " De " <violetjade11@y...>

> writes:

> WOW! I never knew that. I love Green tea. But, is it bad for

thyroid

> meds or only people that still have a thyroid?? You'd think those

of

> us who are soley on meds would be able to get away with a little

> more....

>

> I'll keep researching then! I think peppermint is a stimulative,

so

> while it might help with feeling blah and low energy, it might not

> be good for soothing lymph related problems. I read a diuretic

would

> be good. Aren't cranberries and cherries a diuretics? Hmmm...I'll

> keep looking

>

> Deanna