Re: Fungal vs. Bacterial Problems (was Coconut oil (lectins/celiac))

[Guest guest]

Emma,

> > I think that in addition to food chemicals, there is probably a

> > similar thing with fermentation byproducts. I believe I have probably

> > always had an ecological imbalance in my gut, so I might have to

> > excrete large amounts of fungal byproducts.

> Everyone thinks fungal when they think of ecological imbalances. Yeast

> can potentially create alcohol, but in terms of food chemicals,

> certain strains of bacteria are generally the ones that deconjugate

> phenols and produce amines, in fact even some " friendly " species of

> bifidus do this.

Since I have probably had a lifelong deficiency of HCl, I've probably

given ample opportunity for every pathogen under the sun to inhabit my

intestines. I don't think that I *don't* have bacterial problems, but

there are several things that point to a fungal problem:

First and foremost, I acquired toenail fungus while I was working in a

concrete plant 11 hours a day a little over a year ago. During this

time I was drinking lots of coffee and had intense cravings for orange

juice. The toe fungus is just self-apparently a fungus, so its kind

of the clinching evidence. It seemed to respond best to internal

treatment, indicating a systemic problem. My best success treating it

was with a 7-day VCO fast -- nothing but virgin coconut oil and salty

lemon water.

Also, I was on three rounds of antibiotics as an infant, three rounds

of antibiotics around 9-11 years old, and possibly more in between,

and repeated use of antibiotics tends to lead to fungal problems.

After a 2-week fast last year and the use of a smorgasboard of

anti-fungal, antibiotic, antiparasitic supplements, probiotics,

digestive aids and intestinal cleansers, I shat out what looked like

many many little white balls. At the time, they reminded me of the

term " fungus balls " that I had seen a number of times associated with

candida.

That's not a comprehensive evaluation of my symptoms, but just the few

that seem to point clearly towards a fungal problem rather than other

problems (which I don't deny possibly *also* having).

> > It also seemed to contribute to a canker sore problem though, and I

> > eventually lowered my salt intake back down. I usually get canker

> > sores in response to a low-calcium diet, but recently I got them on a

> > high-calcium diet.

> Oh boy. I hate to say this but mouth ulcers are a really common

> problem with food chemical intolerance. I used to get them all the time.

Do you know anything about the mechanism? Mine seem to have a number

of causes, but low calcium is very clearly one of them. I also think

I have a tendency toward mild tetany as well. I know tetany can be

caused by severe calcium deficiency, and when my calcium gets under a

gram per day for a couple of days, I start getting twitches, first in

my eyes, and then in my forearms. So part of it does seem to relate

to a very high need of calcium for me.

Chris

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[Guest guest]

Emma,

> Did you know the amino acid histidine is an essential component for

> the manufacture of HCl? That's why H2 blockers reduce stomach acid.

I just read that last night actually. What's the best way to correct

a histidine deficiency? Should I take a histidine supplement? I

bought a zinc supplement today, and was going to get one that had zinc

histidinate, zinc glycinate, and something else, but it's ratio of

zinc to copper was 7.5 and so I bought zinc citrate with no copper.

I'd prefer something more like 15-to-1, because I suspect I'm more

likely to have too much copper than too little, but I'd also prefer a

little background insurance in case I want to take high doses of zinc.

> I read a discussion that theorised that food chem intolerant people

> are deficient in histidine - for use in manufacture of a variety of

> other enzymes and HCl - because they constantly produce so much

> histamine in response to salicylates, sulphites, other amines etc.

Well, random itching fits are probably a sign of that, huh? I have a

general tendency towards random itchiness. Occasionally, my back will

all the sudden start itching like crazy with no apparent explanation.

> This doesn't mean that fungal problems aren't associated with food

> chem intolerance, just that there is no evidence that they are playing

> a particularly causal role in it (unlike say clostridium bacteria in

> autism), rather appear to be opportunists acting in response to a

> favourable environment.

Well I see *that* point, but it's clearly fungi causing my toe fungus,

and probably causing other things.

> I haven't researched this particular one. Mouth ulcers are caused by a

> virus, aren't they?

I think they are part viral, part other things. I'm not sure if the

virus is an essential factor or not. However, I recently had canker

sores that were not responding to calcium, and I reasoned that if they

were viral, extensive swishing with coconut oil should, via monolaurin

and lauric acid released by lingual lipase during swishing, kill the

virus. And, regardless of whether I am correct about the mechanism,

the extensive swishing with coconut oil definitely killed the canker

sores very effectively.

> My theory is that it might be related to the fact salicylates strip

> off sialic acid coatings from cells. It seems certain pathogens

> produce lectins as a way to attack and attach to cells, so salicylates

> would make one vulnerable to infection via this route.

Why do they strip of sialic acid coatings?

> I drank too much coffee today and my brain has stopped working, but I

> wonder if it's possible excess histamine could cause a vulnerability too.

Yeah I hate that. For what it's worth, I drank way too much coffee,

deliberately because I was very mad but had gotten over the urge to

drink wine by the time I got home (in the middle of the afternoon).

It had effects more like amphetamines than caffeine, something like a

dopamine rush or something I think -- in any case, I took a large dose

of liquid calcium/magnesium citrate and a downed a large dose of water

and the whole thing went away very quickly. I find in general that

caffeine increases my need for calcium. Also, calcium deficiency

gives me twitches, anxiety and insomnia.

> Actually, muscle cramps/tics/twitches are one of the food chem

> intolerance symptoms.

But mine are very clearly a direct reaction to calcium deficiency.

Maybe the salicylates increase my need for calcium.

> I actually used to get really severe calf cramps at night before I

> started low-carbing - I'd say once or twice a week, so I'd be hobbling

> around *all the time*. I thought it might be to do with

> potassium/magnesium/calcium but I never figured it out properly.

> However, after I started low carbing, one of the things that helped me

> figure out I had a food chemical problem was that I only ever got leg

> cramps after I drank wine or ate spicy curries. I wish I knew exactly

> why low carbing helped so many of my different symptoms, but there are

> probably as many mechanisms involved as there are symptoms!

True.

Chris

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The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

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[Guest guest]

>

> I wish I knew exactly

> why low carbing helped so many of my different symptoms, but there are

> probably as many mechanisms involved as there are symptoms!

>

Its funny, I first found relief from low carbing myself. I turned out to be

IgA to gluten and casein. So I introduced back all carbs but the gluten

containing ones. GF doesn't help me as much as low carbing did. Certain

foods, like corn, still don't feel quite right to me and I'm beginning to

phase the last bits of them out of my diet.

-Lana

[Guest guest]

Emma,

> > But mine are very clearly a direct reaction to calcium deficiency.

> > Maybe the salicylates increase my need for calcium.

> Not saying it's not so, but are you sure it's the calcium and not the

> citrate? Both carbonate and citrate would help anyway through

> different mechanisms, I wonder if you've tested with any other forms

> of calcium?

Yes, I'm positive it's calcium, not only because tetany is a classic

symptom of calcium deficiency, but because I usually don't use calcium

citrate, and milk (which has some citrate but less than calcium

citrate would), calcium citrate, bone meal powder, coral calcium, and

any other source of calcium prevent or remedy it.

> My brain really wasn't working yesterday (or today), but I'm actually

> wondering if your huge need for calcium indicates an oxalate problem,

> as this would cause a calcium/phosphate electrolyte imbalance.

Perhaps, although it would seem, then, that I must be producing

oxalates in my intestines, because I don't eat a lot of oxalates.

In one of Walsh's articles on undermethylation, it says that

calcium is needed for methylation. I haven't come across an

explanation for that in the biochem I've been reading yet, but I've

only gotten my feet wet. If that's true, it may be related to my

very, very high need for methylcobalamin (which in turn could be

related to HCl deficiency but is probably also related to a problem

with one of the enzymes involved in B12-dependent methylation I would

think).

In any case, my need for calcium doesn't appear to be incredibly high.

I need about a gram a day to prevent canker sores and to give me

80-90% guarantee against twitches, and maybe 2 grams to give me 99%

guarantee against twitches. Maybe that indicates I need a lot more

for optimal health, I'm not sure. But it's well within the

traditional intake of calcium (which is over 1.5 grams for the lowest

minimum intakes in the groups Price studied, and the typical intake

among the groups he studied is a bit higher, with some of them being a

lot higher). Still, I react with noticeable deficiency symptoms

eaiser than most other people; or maybe my deficiency symptoms are

just different and of a more noticeable character.

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

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[Guest guest]

You may already know this, but in many cases we get ample amounts of

calcium in our diet and still can have symptoms of calcium deficiency.

Our bodies sometimes cannot assimilate the calcium. Or sometimes we

are eating foods that prevent the calcium from absorbing. Have you

checked in to that yet?

[Guest guest]

Lea,

> You may already know this, but in many cases we get ample amounts of

> calcium in our diet and still can have symptoms of calcium deficiency.

> Our bodies sometimes cannot assimilate the calcium. Or sometimes we

> are eating foods that prevent the calcium from absorbing. Have you

> checked in to that yet?

Well first of all, my need for calcium is not out of the normal range,

really. When I was getting spasms in my forearms, I had practically

no calcium for a couple days. A gram or so cuts off most of the major

symptoms, which is roughly the RDA. Primitive diets had an absolute

minimum of 1.5 grams of calcium per day and were usually considerably

higher.

If I ate a lot of phytate or oxalate, I'd suspect that to be a

problem, but my diet is very low in phytate and oxalate both. You may

be on to something with the malabsorption, perhaps.

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

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[Guest guest]

Emma,

> Oxalate is also produced in the body and regarded as a metabolic end

> product. It can be produced in the uronic acid pathway - via sugars

> and vitamin C.

I take vitamin C, but I don't notice any difference between when I am

and am not taking vitamin C with respect to calcium, so if I have an

oxalate issue, I don't think it's from vitamin C supplementation (or

dietary oxalates). I don't know what you mean by sugars, but if I

low-carb, I still need the calcium.

> It can also be produced from amino acid

> decarboxylation, i.e. amine formation - i.e. it is dicarboxylic acid.

I'm more certain than ever in the last couple days I have a big

problem with amines, and I'll write to the list later when I have more

time about a recent reaction that I had. But food amines shouldn't

create the oxalic acid, right? Maybe I have amine-forming bacteria in

my intestines that are also creating oxalate?

> However - treat anything coming out of Pfeiffer with caution.

I do. Can you expand more on your general statement? Is it just your

observation that a few things you have read are outdated, or is there

more to it?

> The dichotomy of symptoms described by Pfeiffer just don't fit the

> facts of the conditions people experience - I've yet to see anyone who

> *just* has the symptoms that Pfeiffer prescribe to " undermethylation "

> or " overmethylation " - most people have both.

You can say that again. When I read Walsh's article, I was like, wait

a second: I have as many symptoms of overmethylation as

undermethylation, and when one set gets worse, so does the other, and

when one set gets better, so does the other. I thought maybe I was in

a minority; however, maybe Walsh just has no idea what he's talking

about.

Also, it makes no sense to me that with so many different pathways

downstream for SAM production that any " overmethylation " problem would

simply be due to an excessive production of SAM. And although I'm

barely getting my feet wet reading about this stuff, it seems that the

overmethylation of any given one thing is usually associated with the

undermethylation of others -- so that it isn't " overmethylation " that

is the problem, but a disturbance in the appropriate degrees of

various methylations.

> Methylation problems tend to coexist with brain/emotional/behaviour

> disorder problems - autism, ADHD, foggy head, bipolar, etc. They also

> tend to clear up when you have been failsafe for a while, unless you

> are unlucky like some autistic children with an MFTHR mutation

> (preventing folate from methylating cobalamin), in which case you need

> to rely on choline and betaine intake instead.

Wheat is far and away the best source of betaine and is also a decent

source of choline. I wrote to the enzymes and autism list suggesting

that this may be why a number of people have been saying in the last

couple of days that they have experienced either a worsening when

going GFCF or an improvement after GFCF with enzymes by introducing

gluten and casein while keeping the enzymes over GFCF with enzymes.

But I don't think my post has gone through yet. I might be on

moderation as a new member or something.

>Cobalamin need can also

> be related to a need to get rid of sulphites (sulfitocobalamin). It is

> possible to have a problem with transsulfuration without having a

> problem with methylation.

I need methylcobalamin specifically though. Cyano does nothing for me

(or at least doesn't do what methylcobalamin does). I seem to find

that 5'-deoxyadenosylcobalamin is like relatively anxiety-free speed

when taken WITH methylcobalamin when the former is close to 1000

mcg/day and the latter is several times that, which is an effect I

don't notice from either alone. Methylcobalamin itself seems to give

me mental stability and in high doses (5,000 mcg or more I think) an

increased libido.

>I no longer have

Did you mean to write more?

> Yes, this would be my " but " - not everyone gets twitches/tics/cramps

> when they skip their calcium for the day, most people are able to

> regulate blood calcium levels well enough by pulling some out of the

> bone or recycling more, so blood levels are still kept in the right

> range to prevent these symptoms - however, oxalate is one of the few

> things that actively makes it difficult to keep your blood calcium

> levels up where they should be, by constantly binding it and dragging

> it out of circulation.

Good point. But where would the problem lie? I don't think vitamin C

supplementation has any consistent relation to it, and I don't eat a

whole lot of oxalates. Amine/oxalate-producing intestinal bacteria

maybe?

Chris

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The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

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[Guest guest]

Emma wrote:

> > Methylation problems tend to coexist with brain/emotional/behaviour

> > disorder problems - autism, ADHD, foggy head, bipolar, etc. They also

> > tend to clear up when you have been failsafe for a while, unless you

> > are unlucky like some autistic children with an MFTHR mutation

> > (preventing folate from methylating cobalamin), in which case you need

> > to rely on choline and betaine intake instead.

I forgot to mention in my last post: betaine (which is derived from

choline as well as found in the diet, for those not in the know) can

only substitute for B6/B12 for this reaction in the kidney and liver,

but not in the nervous system. So dietary betaine and choline would

have a B12-sparing effect to allow more to be used for the nervous

system maybe, but could not actually replace B12 in the nervous

system.

Also, I think that dietary methylcobalamin overrides this defect. I'm

not sure why else many of us would need methylcobalamin and receive no

benefit from cyanocobalamin.

Perhaps of interest: betaine is also used by the kidneys to protect

against osmotic stress when there is a high solute load. So people

overburdened with chemicals to excrete will have their betaine hogged

into the medulla and unavailable in the cortex where it is used to

convert homocysteine to methionine and thus support methylation in

place of B12/B6.

Chris

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The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

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