Re: Warning Signs You're Dating a Loser

[Guest guest]

Jesus! I just read most of this (must print it out and read in full)

but recognised my BP FADA in a lot of this. Really worrying.

Reinforced my belief that all my life I thought his behaviour

was " normal " . It also makes me think of all the boyfriends I've had

and why things didn't work out....admittedly, I have some of what I

recently referred to as " defective genes (FADA's side, not hers!),

when speaking to my mum last week. She reassured me that she has

seen me mature over the years (because, admittedly, I used to have

tantrums and lash out-just like FADA!) and I am proud to say that I

have reduced that nearly 100%. If only I could overcome my feeling of

suffocation in relationships, I may, just then, meet (and keep) a

great guy!

Best wishes, and thanks for posting this!

Psych1967

>

> The Loser: Warning Signs You're Dating a Loser " by ph M.

Carver,

> Ph.D., Psychologist Comment (September 27, 2003)

>

> Credit: This handout was written by ph M. Carver, Ph.D., a

> Clinical Psychologist. It is provided as a public service and can

be

> reproduced as needed. Dr. Carver is in private practice in Southern

> Ohio. http://www.drjoecarver.com

>

>

> This article was published to the Internet several years ago and

was

> originally written to help identify " Losers " in relationships. The

e-

> mail feedback I have received on the article has been tremendous.

> It's clear the article is a way of identifying not only " losers "

but

> controlling, abusive, and manipulating individuals. It's also

obvious

> these warning signs are not only found in dating relationships -

but

> in our spouse, our parents, our friends, and our relatives. There

are

> more victims in the environment of the Loser than his or her

partner.

>

> I've been contacted for help by the friends and loved ones of

people

> involved in relationships with Losers (controlling and/or abusive

> partners). The loved ones want to understand the situation and ask

> for recommendations and guidance. For this group I have recently

> published " Love and Stockholm Syndrome: The Mystery of Loving an

> Abuser " .

>

> Obviously, this article has created the need for sequels. I hope to

> publish a guide to assist Losers who want to change their life and

> behavior. An article addressing sons and daughters who were

parented

> by Losers is also being planned. If our parent or parents have the

> characteristics listed in this article, our ability to function as

a

> healthy adult may be hindered due to the dysfunctional

family/parent

> model. My goal is to follow this issue and provide help and

guidance

> to all those involved with controlling and abusive individuals -

from

> partners to extended victims.

>

> Introduction

> Very few relationships start on terms other than sweetness and

> politeness. In the beginning, " the honeymoon " of the relationship,

> it's difficult to determine what type of individual you are dating.

> Both you and the date are guarded, trying to obtain information

about

> the other as much as possible without seeming like a police

> detective.

>

> Romantic relationships can be wonderful with the right person. A

> relationship with the wrong individual however can lead to years of

> heartache, emotional/social damage, and even physical damage. A

> damaging adult partner can damage us, damage our loved ones, and

even

> damage the way we feel about love and romance in the future. They

can

> turn what is supposed to be a loving, supporting, and understanding

> relationship into the " fatal attraction " often described in movies.

> There are a variety of " bad choices " that may be encountered each

> week - most of which are easily to identify and avoid. We all know

to

> avoid people that appear insane or abusive and not select them as a

> dating partner. However, some individuals are better at hiding

their

> personality and behavior abnormalities. In an effort to provide

some

> warning about these very damaging individuals, this paper will

> outline a type of individual commonly found in the dating scene, a

> male or female labeled " The Loser " .

>

> " The Loser " is a type of partner that creates much social,

emotional

> and psychological damage in a relationship. " The Loser " has

permanent

> personality characteristics that create this damage. These are

> characteristics that they accept simply as the way they are and not

a

> problem or psychological difficulty. In one sense, they have always

> lived with this personality and behavior, often something they

> probably learned from their relatives/family. Psychologists usually

> treat the victims of " The Loser " , women or men who arrive at the

> office severely depressed with their self-confidence and self-

esteem

> totally destroyed.

>

> The following list is an attempt to outline the characteristics

> of " The Loser " and provide a manner in which women and men can

> identify potentially damaging relationships before they are

> themselves severely damaged emotionally or even physically. If your

> partner possesses even one of these features, there is risk in the

> relationship. More than three of these indicators and you are

> involved with " The Loser " in a very high risk relationship that

will

> eventually create damage to you. When a high number of these

features

> are present - it's not a probably or possibility. You will be hurt

> and damaged by " The Loser " if you stay in the relationship.

>

> 1. Rough Treatment - " The Loser " will hurt you on purpose. If he

> or she hits you, twists your arm, pulls your hair, kicks you,

shoves

> you, or breaks your personal property EVEN ONCE, drop them. Male

> losers often begin with behaviors that move you physically or hit

the

> wall. Female losers often slap, kick and even punch their male

> partners when upset.

>

> 2. Quick Attachment and Expression - " The Loser " has very

> shallow emotions and connections with others. One of the things

that

> might attract you to " The Loser " is how quickly he or she says " I

> Love You " or wants to marry or commit to you. Typically, in less

than

> a few weeks of dating you'll hear that you're the love of their

life,

> they want to be with you forever, and they want to marry you.

You'll

> receive gifts, a variety of promises, and be showered with their

> attention and nice gestures. This is the " honeymoon phase " - where

> they catch you and convince you that they are the best thing that

> ever happened to you. Remember the business saying " If it's too

good

> to be true it probably is (too good to be true)! " You may be so

> overwhelmed by this display of instant attraction, instant

> commitment, and instant planning for the future that you'll miss

the

> major point - it doesn't make sense!! Normal, healthy individuals

> require a long process to develop a relationship because there is

so

> much at stake. Healthy individuals will wait for a lot of

information

> before offering a commitment - not three weeks. It's true that we

can

> become infatuated with others quickly - but not make such

unrealistic

> promises and have the future planned after three dates. The rapid

> warm-up is always a sign of shallow emotions which later cause " The

> Loser " to detach from you as quickly as they committed. " The Loser "

> typically wants to move in with you or marry you in less than four

> weeks or very early in the relationship.

>

> 3. Frightening Temper - " The Loser " has a scary temper. If your

> boyfriend or girlfriend blows up and does dangerous things, like

> driving too fast because they're mad, breaking/throwing things,

> getting into fights, or threatening others - that temper will soon

be

> turned in your direction. In the beginning of the relationship, you

> will be exposed to " witnessed violence " - fights with others,

threats

> toward others, angry outbursts at others, etc. You will also hear

of

> violence in their life. You will see and witness this temper -

> throwing things, yelling, cursing, driving fast, hitting the walls,

> and kicking things. That quickly serves to intimidate you and fear

> their potential for violence, although " The Loser " quickly assures

> you that they are angry at others or situations, not at you. At

> first, you will be assured that they will never direct the

hostility

> and violence at you - but they are clearly letting you know that

they

> have that ability and capability - and that it might come your way.

> Later, you fear challenging or confronting them - fearing that same

> temper and violence will be turned in your direction.

>

> 4. Killing Your Self-Confidence - " The Loser " repeatedly puts

> you down. They constantly correct your slight mistakes, making you

> feel " on guard " , unintelligent, and leaving you with the feeling

that

> you are always doing something wrong. They tell you that you're too

> fat, too unattractive, or don't talk correctly or look well. This

> gradual chipping away at your confidence and self-esteem allows

them

> to later treat you badly - as though you deserved it. In public,

you

> will be " walking on eggshells " - always fearing you are doing or

> saying something that will later create a temper outburst or verbal

> argument.

>

> 5. Cutting Off Your Support - In order to control someone

> completely, you must cut off their supportive friends - sometimes

> even their family. " The Loser " feels your friends and family might

> influence you or offer negative opinions about their behavior. " The

> Loser " begins by telling you these friends treat you badly, take

> advantage of you, and don't understand the special nature of the

love

> you share with them. In some cases, if they can't get rid of your

> best same-sex friend, " The Loser " will claim he or she made a pass

at

> them. If you talk to your friends or family, " The Loser " will

punish

> you by asking multiple questions or making nasty accusations.

> Eventually, rather than face the verbal punishment, interrogation,

> and abuse, you'll develop the feeling that it's better not to talk

to

> family and friends. You will withdraw from friends and family,

> prompting them to become upset with you. " The Loser " then tells you

> they are treating you badly again and you'd be better to keep your

> distance from them. Once you are isolated and alone, without

support,

> their control over you can increase.

>

> 6. The Mean and Sweet Cycle - " The Loser " cycles from mean to

> sweet and back again. The cycle starts when they are intentionally

> hurtful and mean. You may be verbally abused, cursed, and

threatened

> over something minor. Suddenly, the next day they become sweet,

doing

> all those little things they did when you started dating. You hang

> on, hoping each mean-then-sweet cycle is the last one. The other

> purpose of the mean cycle is to allow " The Loser " to say very nasty

> things about you or those you care about, again chipping away at

your

> self-esteem and self-confidence. " The Loser " often apologizes but

the

> damage to your self-esteem is already done - exactly as planned.

>

> 7. It's Always Your Fault - " The Loser " blames you for their

> anger as well as any other behavior that is incorrect. When they

> cheat on you, yell at you, treat you badly, damage your property,

or

> embarrass you publicly - it's somehow your fault. If you are ten

> minutes late for a date, it's your fault that the male loser drives

> 80 miles per hour, runs people off the road, and pouts the rest of

> the evening. " The Loser " tells you their anger and misbehavior

would

> not have happened if you had not made some simple mistake, had

loved

> them more, or had not questioned their behavior. " The Loser " never,

> repeat " never " , takes personal responsibility for their behavior -

> it's always the fault of someone else. If they drive like a maniac

> and try to pull an innocent driver off the highway to assault them -

> it's actually the fault of the other driver (not his) as they

didn't

> use a turn signal when they changed lanes. They give you the

> impression that you had it (anger, yelling, assault) coming and

> deserved the anger, violence, pouting, or physical display of

> aggression.

>

> 8. Breakup Panic - " The Loser " panics at the idea of breaking

> up - unless it's totally their idea - then you're dropped like a

hot

> rock. Abusive boyfriends often break down and cry, they plead, they

> promise to change, and they offer marriage/trips/gifts when you

> threaten ending the relationship. Both male and female losers may

> threaten suicide, threaten to return to old sweethearts (who feel

> lucky they're gone!), or threaten to quit their job and leave the

> area - as though you will be responsible for those decisions. " The

> Loser " offers a multitude of " deals " and halfway measures,

> like " Let's just date one more month! " They shower you with phone

> calls, often every five minutes, hoping that you will make an

> agreement or see them just to stop the telephone harassment. Some

> call your relatives, your friends, their friends, and anyone else

> they can think of - telling those people to call you and tell you

how

> much they love you. Creative losers often create so much social

> pressure that the victim agrees to go back to the bad relationship

> rather than continue under the social pressure. Imagine trying to

end

> a relationship and receiving tearful calls from all his or her

> relatives (they secretly hope you'll keep them so they don't have

> to), seeing a plea for your return in the newspaper or even on a

> local billboard, receiving flowers at work each day, or having them

> arrive at your place of work and offer you a wedding ring (male

loser

> technique) or inform you that they might be pregnant (female loser

> technique) in front of your coworkers! Their reaction is

emotionally

> intense, a behavior they use to keep you an emotional prisoner. If

> you go back to them, you actually fear a worse reaction if you

> threaten to leave again (making you a prisoner) and they later

> frequently recall the incident to you as further evidence of what a

> bad person you are. Remember, if your prize dog jumps the fence and

> escapes, if you get him back you build a higher fence. Once back in

> the grasp of " The Loser " - escape will be three times as difficult

> the next time.

>

> 9. No Outside Interests - " The Loser " will encourage you to drop

> your hobbies, interests, and involvement with others. If you have

an

> individual activity, they demand that they accompany you, making

you

> feel miserable during the entire activity. The idea behind this is

to

> prevent you from having fun or interests other than those which

they

> totally control.

>

> 10. Paranoid Control - " The Loser " will check up on you and keep

> track of where you are and who you are with. If you speak to a

member

> of the opposite sex, you receive twenty questions about how you

know

> them. If you don't answer their phone call, you are ask where you

> were, what were you doing, who you were talking to, etc. They will

> notice the type of mud on your car, question why you shop certain

> places, and question why you called a friend, why the friend called

> you, and so forth. Some losers follow you to the grocery, then

later

> ask if you've been there in an attempt to catch you in a lie. In

> severe cases, they go through your mail, look through your

> purse/wallet, hit your redial on the phone when they arrive, or

> search through your garbage for evidence. High-tech losers may

> encourage you to make " private " calls to friends from their

> residence, calls that are being secretly taped for later reference.

> They may begin to tell you what to wear, what to listen to in

music,

> and how to behave in public. Eventually, they tell you that you can

> not talk to certain friends or acquaintances, go certain places, or

> talk about certain issues in public. If no date is present on

Friday

> night - " The Loser " will inform you that they will call you that

> night - sometime. That effectively keeps you home, awaiting the

call,

> fearing the verbal abuse and questions you might receive if you

> weren't home for the call. This technique allows " The Loser " to do

> what they want socially, at the same time controlling your behavior

> from a distance or a local bar.

>

> 11. Public Embarrassment - In an effort to keep you under control

> while in public, " The Loser " will lash out at you, call you names,

or

> say cruel or embarrassing things about you in private or in front

of

> people. When in public, you quickly learn that any opinion you

> express may cause them to verbally attack you, either at the time

or

> later. If you stay with " The Loser " too long, you'll soon find

> yourself politely smiling, saying nothing, and holding on to their

> arm when in public. You'll also find yourself walking with your

head

> down, fearful of seeing a friend who might speak to you and create

an

> angry reaction in " The Loser " .

>

> 12. It's Never Enough - " The Loser " convinces you that you are

> never quite good enough. You don't say " I love you " enough, you

don't

> stand close enough, you don't do enough for them after all their

> sacrifices, and your behavior always falls short of what is

expected.

> This is another method of destroying your self-esteem and

confidence.

> After months of this technique, they begin telling you how lucky

you

> are to have them - somebody who tolerates someone so inadequate and

> worthless as you.

>

> 13. Entitlement - " The Loser " has a tremendous sense of

> entitlement, the attitude that they have a perfectly logical right

to

> do whatever they desire. If cut off in traffic, " The Loser " feels

> they have the right to run the other driver off the road, assault

> them, and endanger the lives of other drivers with their temper

> tantrum. Keep in mind, this same sense of entitlement will be used

> against you. If you disobey their desires or demands, or violate

one

> of their rules, they feel they are entitled to punish you in any

> manner they see fit.

>

> 14. Your Friends and Family Dislike Him - As the relationship

> continues, your friends and family will see what " The Loser " is

doing

> to you. They will notice a change in your personality or your

> withdrawal. They will protest. " The Loser " will tell you they are

> jealous of the " special love " you have and then use their protest

and

> opinion as further evidence that they are against you - not him.

The

> mention of your family members or friends will spark an angry

> response from them - eventually placing you in the situation where

> you stop talking about those you care about, even your own family

> members. " The Loser " will be jealous and threatened by anyone you

are

> close to - even your children. In some cases, your parents or

> brothers/sisters will not be allowed to visit your home.

>

> 15. Bad Stories - People often let you know about their

> personality by the stories they tell about themselves. It's the old

> story about giving a person enough rope and they'll hang

themselves.

> The stories a person tells informs us of how they see themselves,

> what they think is interesting, and what they think will impress

you.

> A humorous individual will tell funny stories on himself. " The

Loser "

> tells stories of violence, aggression, being insensitive to others,

> rejecting others, etc. They may tell you about past relationships

and

> in every case, they assure you that they were treated horribly

> despite how wonderful they were to that person. They brag about

their

> temper and outbursts because they don't see anything wrong with

> violence and actually take pride in the " I don't take nothing from

> nobody " attitude. People define themselves with their stories, much

> like a culture is described by it's folklore and legends. Listen to

> these stories - they tell you how you will eventually be treated

and

> what's coming your way.

>

> 16. The Waitress Test - It's been said that when dating, the way

> an individual treats a waitress or other neutral person of the

> opposite sex is the way they will treat you in six months. During

> the " honeymoon phase " of a relationship, you will be treated like a

> king or queen. However, during that time " The Loser " has not

> forgotten how he or she basically feels about the opposite sex.

> Waitresses, clerks, or other neutral individuals will be treated

> badly. If they are cheap - you'll never receive anything once the

> honeymoon is over. If they whine, complain, criticize, and torment -

> that's how they'll treat you in six months. A mentally healthy

person

> is consistent, they treat almost all people the same way all the

> time. If you find yourself dating a man who treats you like a queen

> and other females like dirt - hit the road.

>

> 17. The Reputation - As mentioned, mentally healthy individuals

> are consistent in their personality and their behavior. " The Loser "

> may have two distinct reputations - a group of individuals who will

> give you glowing reports and a group that will warn you that they

are

> serious trouble. If you ask ten people about a new restaurant -

five

> say it's wonderful and five say it's a hog pit - you clearly

> understand that there's some risk involved in eating there. " The

> Loser " may actually brag about their reputation as a " butt

> kicker " , " womanizer " , " hot temper " or " being crazy " . They may tell

> you stories where other's have called them crazy or suggested that

> they receive professional help. Pay attention to the reputation.

> Reputation is the public perception of an individual's behavior. If

> the reputation has two sides, good and bad, your risk is high. You

> will be dealing with the bad side once the honeymoon is over in the

> relationship. With severe behavior problems, " The Loser " will be

> found to have almost no friends, just acquaintances. Emotionally

> healthy and moral individuals will not tolerate friendships with

> losers that treat others so badly. If you find yourself disliking

the

> friends of " The Loser " , it's because they operate the same way he

or

> she does and you can see it in them.

>

> 18. Walking on Eggshells - As a relationship with " The Loser "

> continues, you will gradually be exposed to verbal intimidation,

> temper tantrums, lengthy interrogations about trivial matters,

> violence/threats directed at others but witnessed by you, paranoid

> preoccupation with your activities, and a variety of put-downs on

> your character. You will quickly find yourself " walking on

eggshells "

> in their presence - fearful to bring up topics, fearful to mention

> that you spoke to or saw a friend, and fearful to question or

> criticize the behavior of " The Loser " . Instead of experiencing the

> warmth and comfort of love, you will be constantly on edge, tense

> when talking to others (they might say something that you'll have

to

> explain later), and fearful that you'll see someone you'll have to

> greet in public. Dates and times together will be more comfortable

> and less threatening when totally alone - exactly what " The Loser "

> wants - no interference with their control or dominance.

>

> 19. Discounted Feelings/Opinions - " The Loser " is so self-

> involved and self-worshiping that the feelings and opinions of

others

> are considered worthless. As the relationship continues and you

begin

> to question what you are feeling or seeing in their behavior, you

> will be told that your feelings and opinions don't make sense,

> they're silly, and that you are emotionally disturbed to even think

> of such things. " The Loser " has no interest in your opinion or your

> feelings - but they will be disturbed and upset that you dare

> question their behavior. " The Loser " is extremely hostile toward

> criticism and often reacts with anger or rage when their behavior

is

> questioned.

>

> 20. They Make You " Crazy " - " The Loser " operates in such a

> damaging way that you find yourself doing " crazy " things in self-

> defense. If " The Loser " is scheduled to arrive at 8:00 pm - you

call

> Time & Temperature to cover the redial, check your garbage for

> anything that might get you in trouble, and call your family and

> friends to tell them not to call you that night. You warn

> family/friends not to bring up certain topics, avoid locations in

the

> community where you might see co-workers or friends, and not speak

to

> others for fear of the 20 questions. You become paranoid as well -

> being careful what you wear and say. Nonviolent males find

themselves

> in physical fights with female losers. Nonviolent females find

> themselves yelling and screaming when they can no longer take the

> verbal abuse or intimidation. In emotional and physical self-

defense,

> we behave differently and oddly. While we think we are " going

crazy " -

> it's important to remember that there is no such thing as " normal

> behavior " in a combat situation. Rest assured that your behavior

will

> return to normal if you detach from " The Loser " before permanent

> psychological damage is done.

>

> Dangerous Versions of " The Loser "

> There are more severe if not dangerous versions of " The Loser " that

> have been identified over the years. If you are involved in a

> relationship with one of these versions, you may require

professional

> and legal assistance to save yourself.

>

> Physical Abuser - Physical abusers begin the relationship with

> physical moving - shoving, pushing, forcing, etc. That quickly

moves

> into verbal threats with physical gestures - the finger in the

face,

> clinched fist in the face, and voiced physical threats such as " You

> make me want to break your face! " Eventually, these combine to form

> actual physical abuse - hitting, slapping, and kicking. " The Loser "

> is always sorry the next day and begins the mean-then-sweet cycle

all

> over again. Getting away from physical abusers often requires the

> assistance of family, law enforcement agencies, or local abuse

> agencies. Female losers often physically attack their partner,

break

> car windows, or behave with such violence that the male partner is

> forced to physically protect himself from the assault. If the

female

> loser is bruised in the process of self-protection, as when

> physically restraining her from hitting, those bruises are

> then " displayed " to others as evidence of what a bad person the

> partner is and how abusive they have been in the relationship.

>

> Psychotic Losers - There are losers that are severely ill in a

> psychiatric sense - the movie description of the " Fatal

Attraction " .

> Some may tell you wild stories and try to convince you that they

are

> connected to The Mob or a government agency (CIA, FBI, etc.). They

> may fake terminal illness, pregnancy, or disease. They intimidate

and

> frighten you with comments such as " I can have anyone killed... "

> or " No one leaves a relationship with me... " . If you try to end the

> relationship, they react violently and give you the impression that

> you, your friends, or your family are in serious danger. People

often

> then remain in the abusive and controlling relationship due to fear

> of harm to their family or their reputation. While such fears are

> unrealistic as " The Loser " is only interested in controlling you,

> those fears feel very real when combined with the other

> characteristics of " The Loser " . Psychotic or psychiatrically ill

> losers may also stalk, follow, or harass you. They may threaten

> physical violence, show weapons, or threaten to kill you or

> themselves if you leave them. If you try to date others, they may

> follow you or threaten your new date. Your new date may be

subjected

> to phone harassment, vandalism, threats, and even physical

assaults.

> If you are recently divorced, separated, or recently ended another

> relationship, " The Loser " may be intimidating toward your ex-

partner,

> fearing you might return if the other partner is not " scared off " .

> Just remember - everything " The Loser " has ever done to anyone will

> be coming your way. " The Loser " may send you pictures of you, your

> children, or your family - pictures they have taken secretly -

> hinting that they can " reach out and touch " those you love. You may

> need help and legal action to separate from these individuals.

>

> Guidelines for Detachment Separating from " The Loser " often

involves

> three stages:

> The Detachment,

> Ending the Relationship, and

> the Follow-up Protection.

>

> The Detachment During this part of separating from " The Loser " , you

> recognize what you must do and create an Exit Plan. Many

individuals

> fail in attempts to detach from " The Loser " because they leave

> suddenly and impulsively, without proper planning, and without

> resources. In many cases, " The Loser " has isolated their partner

from

> others, has control of finances, or has control of major exit needs

> such as an automobile. During the detachment phase you should... -

> Observe the way you are treated. Watch for the methods listed above

> and see how " The Loser " works. - Gradually become more boring, talk

> less, share less feelings and opinions. The goal is almost to

> bore " The Loser " to lessen the emotional attachment, at the same

time

> not creating a situation which would make you a target.

> - Quietly contact your family and supportive others. Determine

> what help they might be - a place to stay, protection, financial

> help, etc.

> - - If you fear violence or abuse, check local legal or law

> enforcement options such as a restraining order.

> - - If " The Loser " is destructive, slowly move your valuables

> from the home if together, or try to recover valuables if in their

> possession. In many cases, you may lose some personal items during

> your detachment - a small price to pay to get rid of " The Loser " .

> - Stop arguing, debating or discussing issues. Stop defending

> and explaining yourself - responding with comments such as " I've

been

> so confused lately " or " I'm under so much stress I don't know why I

> do anything anymore " .

> - - Begin dropping hints that you are depressed, burned out, or

> confused about life in general. Remember

> - - " The Loser " never takes responsibility for what happens in

> any relationship. " The Loser " will feel better about leaving the

> relationship if they can blame it on you. Many individuals are

forced

> to " play confused " and dull, allowing " The Loser " to tell

others " My

> girlfriend (or boyfriend) about half nuts! " They may tell others

> you're crazy or confused but you'll be safer. Allow them to think

> anything they want about you as long as you're in the process of

> detaching.

> - - Don't start another relationship. That will only complicate

> your situation and increase the anger. Your best bet is to " lay

low "

> for several months. Remember, " The Loser " will quickly locate

another

> victim and become instantly attached as long as the focus on you is

> allowed to die down.

> - - As " The Loser " starts to question changes in your behavior,

> admit confusion, depression, emotionally numbness, and a host of

> other boring reactions. This sets the foundation for the ending of

> the relationship.

>

>

> Ending the Relationship

>

> Remembering that " The Loser " doesn't accept responsibility,

responds

> with anger to criticism, and is prone to panic detachment

reactions -

> ending the relationship continues the same theme as the detachment.

>

> - Explain that you are emotionally numb, confused, and burned

> out. You can't feel anything for anybody and you want to end the

> relationship almost for his or her benefit. Remind them that

they've

> probably noticed something is wrong and that you need time to sort

> out your feelings and fix whatever is wrong with you. As disgusting

> as it may seem, you may have to use a theme of " I'm not right for

> anyone at this point in my life. " If " The Loser " can blame the end

on

> you, as they would if they ended the relationship anyway, they will

> depart faster.

>

> - If " The Loser " panics, you'll receive a shower of phone

> calls, letters, notes on your car, etc. React to each in the same

> manner - a boring thanks. If you overreact or give in, you've lost

> control again.

>

> - Focus on your need for time away from the situation. Don't

> agree to the many negotiations that will be offered - dating less

> frequently, dating only once a week, taking a break for only a

week,

> going to counseling together, etc. As long as " The Loser " has

contact

> with you they feel there is a chance to manipulate you.

>

>

> - " The Loser " will focus on making you feel guilty. In each

> phone contact you'll hear how much you are loved, how much was done

> for you, and how much they have sacrificed for you. At the same

time,

> you'll hear about what a bum you are for leading them on, not

giving

> them an opportunity to fix things, and embarrassing them by ending

> the relationship.

>

> - Don't try to make them understand how you feel - it won't

> happen. " The Loser " only is concerned with how they feel - your

> feelings are irrelevant. You will be wasting your time trying to

make

> them understand and they will see the discussions as an opportunity

> to make you feel more guilty and manipulate you.

>

> - Don't fall for sudden changes in behavior or promises of

> marriage, trips, gifts, etc. By this time you have already seen

> how " The Loser " is normally and naturally. While anyone can change

> for a short period of time, they always return to their normal

> behavior once the crisis is over.

>

> - Seek professional counseling for yourself or the support of

> others during this time. You will need encouragement and guidance.

> Keep in mind, if " The Loser " finds out you are seeking help they

will

> criticize the counseling, the therapist, or the effort.

>

> - Don't use terms like " someday " , " maybe " , or " in the future " .

> When " The Loser " hears such possibilities, they think you are

> weakening and will increase their pressure. - Imagine a dead slot

> machine. If we are in Las Vegas at a slot machine and pull the

handle

> ten times and nothing happens - we move on to another machine.

> However, if on the tenth time the slot machine pays us even a

little,

> we keep pulling the handle - thinking the jackpot is on the way. If

> we are very stern and stable about the decision to end the

> relationship over many days, then suddenly offer a possibility or

> hope for reconciliation - we've given a little pay and the pressure

> will continue. Never change your position - always say the same

> thing.

>

> - The Loser " will stop playing a machine that doesn't pay off

> and quickly move to another. Follow-up Protection " The Loser " never

> sees their responsibility or involvement in the difficulties in the

> relationship. From a psychological standpoint, " The Loser " has

lived

> and behaved in this manner most of their life, clearly all of their

> adult life. As they really don't see themselves at fault or as an

> individual with a problem, " The Loser " tends to think that the

> girlfriend or boyfriend is simply going through a phase - their

> partner (victim) might be temporarily mixed up or confused, they

> might be listening to the wrong people, or they might be angry

about

> something and will get over it soon. " The Loser " rarely detaches

> completely and will often try to continue contact with the partner

> even after the relationship is terminated. During the Follow-up

> Protection period, some guidelines are: - Never change your

original

> position. It's over permanently! Don't talk about possible changes

in

> your position in the future. You might think that will calm " The

> Loser " but it only tells them that the possibilities still exist

and

> only a little more pressure is needed to return to the

relationship.

>

> - Don't agree to meetings or reunions to discuss old times.

> For " The Loser " , discussing old times is actually a way to upset

you,

> put you off guard, and use the guilt to hook you again. - Don't

offer

> details about your new life or relationships. Assure him that both

> his life and your life are now private and that you hope they are

> happy.

>

> - If you start feeling guilty during a phone call, get off the

> phone fast. More people return to bad marriages and relationships

due

> to guilt than anything else. If you listen to those phone calls, as

> though taping them, you'll find " The Loser " spends most of the call

> trying to make you feel guilty.

>

> - In any contact with the ex " Loser " , provide only a status

> report, much like you'd provide to your Aunt Gladys. For

> example: " I'm still working hard and not getting any better at

> tennis. That's about it. "

>

> - When " The Loser " tells you how difficult the breakup has

> been, share with him some general thoughts about breaking-up and

how

> finding the right person is difficult. While " The Loser " wants to

> focus on your relationship, talk in terms of Ann Landers - " Well,

> breaking up is hard on anyone. Dating is tough in these times. I'm

> sure we'll eventually find someone that's right for both of us. "

> Remember - nothing personal!

>

> - Keep all contact short and sweet - the shorter the better. As

> far as " The Loser " is concerned, you're always on your way

somewhere,

> there's something in the microwave, or your mother is walking up

the

> steps to your home. Wish " The Loser " well but always with the same

> tone of voice that you might offer to someone you have just talked

to

> at the grocery store. For phone conversations, electronic companies

> make a handy gadget that produces about twenty sounds - a doorbell,

> an oven or microwave alarm, a knock on the door, etc. That little

> device is handy to use on the phone - the microwave dinner just

came

> out or someone is at the door. Do whatever you have to do to keep

the

> conversation short - and not personal.

>

> Summary

> In all of our relationships throughout life, we will meet a variety

> of individuals with many different personalities. Some are a joy to

> have in our life and some provide us with life-long love and

> security. Others we meet pose some risk to us and our future due to

> their personality and attitudes. Both in medicine and mental health

>

> - the key to health is the early identification and treatment

> of problems

> - before they reach the point that they are beyond treatment.

> In years of psychotherapy and counseling practice, treating the

> victims of " The Loser " , patterns of attitude and behavior emerge

> in " The Loser " that can now be listed and identified in the hopes

of

> providing early identification and warning. When those signs and

> indicators surface and the pattern is identified, we must move

> quickly to get away from the situation. Continuing a relationship

> with " The Loser " will result in a relationship that involves

> intimidation, fear, angry outbursts, paranoid control, and a total

> loss of your self-esteem and self-confidence. If you have been

> involved in a long-term relationship with " The Loser " , after you

> successfully escape you may notice that you have sustained some

> psychological damage that will require professional repair. In many

> cases, the stress has been so severe that you may have a stress-

> produced depression. You may have severe damage to your self-

> confidence/self-esteem or to your feelings about the opposite sex

or

> relationships. Psychologists, psychiatrists, social workers, and

> counselors are available in your community to assist and guide you

as

> you recover from your damaging relationship with " The Loser " .

>

> - Credit: This handout was written by ph M. Carver, Ph.D.,

> a Clinical Psychologist. It is provided as a public service and can

> be reproduced as needed. Dr. Carver is in private practice in

> Southern Ohio. ##

>

[Guest guest]

I agree, this is absolutely marvelous and very valuable advice for any teen or

adult out

there looking for Mr. or Miss Right! (I particularly liked the " waitress/waiter

test " , holy

cow, is that ever a great test!) I'm sending this article to my Sister!

Parts of the article are even relevant for friendship relationships, too, I

think.

However, for those of us *raised* by a Loser parent, this article is only

heartbreakingly

sad. Reading that list of behaviors was eerie; nada subjected me and my Sister

to many

of them: Rough Treatment, Frightening Temper, Killing your Self-Confidence, the

Mean

and Sweet Cycle, Its Always Your Fault, Paranoid Control, Its Never Enough,

Entitlement,

Discounted Feelings/Opinions, etc.

Several times the article mentions " get away from a Loser before permanent

psychological

damage is done. " Well, duh!, children *can't* get away from an abusive parent:

they have

to be rescued. It makes me sad that my Sister and I were mistreated in such a

calculated

and hidden way that we were never rescued. That is the worst, most insidious

aspect of

BPD in my opinion: that BPDs can (apparently) modulate their behavior enough so

that

they can choose to do their worst acting-out in private, attacking and damaging

those

who are least able to defend themselves.

After enduring emotional and physical battering from toddler-hood, I'm afraid

that a lot

of us KO's *do* wind up with permanent psychological damage. I'm pretty sure

that I did,

anyway. I wound up trauma-bonding with my nada, at one point; didn't even

realize how

sick *that* was until much later.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if elementary school there could be " life skills "

classes offered

based on this article, like:

" How to Recognize a Loser, 101: finding a healthy life-partner " , or

" How to Recognize an Abusive Family " : rescuing yourself from an unhealthy FOO "

along with other life-skills classes such as:

" How To Budget Your Income " ,

" Car Maintenance for Women " ,

" Basic Housekeeping for Men "

" Self-defense Techniques - martial arts 101 " , etc!

Those would be a lot more useful than trigonometry, sez I.

-Annie

>

> The Loser: Warning Signs You're Dating a Loser " by ph M. Carver,

> Ph.D., Psychologist Comment (September 27, 2003)

>

> Credit: This handout was written by ph M. Carver, Ph.D., a

> Clinical Psychologist. It is provided as a public service and can be

> reproduced as needed. Dr. Carver is in private practice in Southern

> Ohio. http://www.drjoecarver.com

>

>

> This article was published to the Internet several years ago and was

> originally written to help identify " Losers " in relationships. The e-

> mail feedback I have received on the article has been tremendous.

> It's clear the article is a way of identifying not only " losers " but

> controlling, abusive, and manipulating individuals. It's also obvious

> these warning signs are not only found in dating relationships - but

> in our spouse, our parents, our friends, and our relatives. There are

> more victims in the environment of the Loser than his or her partner.