Re: Pre-Conception Vitamin Amount Recommendations?

[Guest guest]

On 2/9/08, penciloid <hoppythetoad@...> wrote:

>[snip]

> It seems that when a person takes 10,000% percent of the RDA of

> something (in my case, pantothenic acid), and their blood levels are

> in the middle of normal, then their body must not being absorbing it

> right, or they need more than most people.

Well thank God it was not 10,000% of normal. If on a good whole foods

diet, your blood level was very deficient, that would indicate a

problem with absorption. If when taking a ridiculously high amount of

something, your blood level is normal, that is more likely an

indicator that your body is working correctly and regulating the

amount it holds on to according to what it needs.

I'm not saying there is never a reason to take a higher-than-normal

amount of something, but if your blood levels are in the middle of

normal, and there is no evidence that the normal blood level is

actually a deficient one, then that is good.

> Anyway, I imagine that before I started taking a zillion vitamins, I

> must've been deficient in several things. My goal is to make sure I'm

> not low on anything before conceiving. I had severe morning sickness

> last time, which I hope to avoid.

Morning sickness can be good -- women who get morning sickness are

less likely to have birth defects. If you can avoid the things that

produce it, that is good, because you're probably avoiding toxins. If

you can take things to ease it, that is good, because you will feel

better. Mega-dosing B6 works, I'm not sure why, but there was a study

that found ginger works better, which sounds safer to me, so you might

want to try that.

[snip]

> I'm especially interested in your opinions of these amounts she

> recommended:

> -3 mg iodine (my multi has 150 mcg)

> -1000 mg choline

> -1000 mg inositol

> -1-5 mg folic acid

The iodine is probably safe, the choline will be very beneficial, I

don't know about the inositol.

The folic acid is way too high, completely unnecessary and probably

harmful. You need about 600 mcg of folic acid (0.6 mg), and you

should do everything you can to get it from food instead of

supplements, unless you find a 5-methyl-tetrahydrafolate supplement,

or at least a folinic acid supplement. In the current Wise

Traditions, my article has figures about how to get the folate

requirement from food, and you can also look on www.nutritiondata.com

and see how you're doing. If you can't eat a folate-rich diet because

of preference or food intolerances, it is better to take the 600 mcg

(0.6 mg) folic acid supplement, preferably in divided doses of 200 mcg

per meal, but it is better to get the folate from food because " folic

acid " does not cross the placenta and the body's ability to reduce it

into a food form of folate is limited, and the excess unmetabolized

folic acid *could* be harmful but this is not sorted out yet.

> Also, what is your opinion of vitamin K? My multi doesn't have any.

It would be good to add some MK-4 and MK-7. Thorne and Jarrow are

good sources, but there are a couple other good ones and I keep

forgetting which are which. I would just avoid high doses (>1000 mcg

(1 mg) /day) of K1.

> Finally, I'm thinking of following Dr. Klennar's recommendations on

> vitamin C (4 g/day for the first trimester then increasing the amounts

> after that).

What is the reasoning/evidence for this?

Chris

[Guest guest]

> Morning sickness can be good -- women who get morning sickness are

> less likely to have birth defects. If you can avoid the things that

> produce it, that is good, because you're probably avoiding toxins. If

> you can take things to ease it, that is good, because you will feel

> better.

In my case, I was throwing up 5-10 times per day. The only foods I

could sometimes keep down were Cheerios and saltines - and now they're

both out on my gluten free diet! I couldn't even go in the grocery

store or kitchen, so my husband was pretty hungry at the time. I can't

go through all that again because while my husband can fend for

himself, a toddler can't.

I can see the reasoning that avoiding some foods might reduce toxin

load, but I doubt everything but Cheerios and saltines were toxic for

my son. I didn't try ginger or B6, because the nausea and vomiting

came on so quickly that I didn't feel up to trying anything to help it.

[Guest guest]

> In my case, I was throwing up 5-10 times per day. The only foods I

> could sometimes keep down were Cheerios and saltines - and now they're

> both out on my gluten free diet! I couldn't even go in the grocery

> store or kitchen, so my husband was pretty hungry at the time. I can't

> go through all that again because while my husband can fend for

> himself, a toddler can't.

Something to consider- I've met quite a few women who went through severe

morning sickness or hyperemesis that didn't have it in subsequent

pregnancies after going gluten-free and removing their other food allergens

from their diet. Of course, it's no guarantee, but after going through

hyperemesis in my last pregnancy and now being in the process of recovering

my health after going GFCF, I have to say that I'm hopeful that it won't

recur again, or not recur to the extent that it did last time.

KerryAnn

www.tfrecipes.com/forum/ - Traditional Foods Menu Mailer and NEW Forum!

" I could have saved thousands-if only I'd been able to convince them they

were slaves. " Harriet Tubman

[Guest guest]

As far as I know, the extra C strengthens the amniotic sac. If

the sac breaks early in labor, then the baby is more vulnerable to

infection, and the cord more vulnerable to prolapse, plus if the sac

breaks later then the laboring woman gets less dehydrated, and the birth

canal more lubricated when the mother needs it. A mother with a healthy

strong amniotic sac will also break the sac just a little, and the

babies' head can engage- plug up the leaking water and prevent

dehydration. Also obviously the strong sac can help prevent miscarriage.

There are contraindications though, if you're birthing in a hospital.

Too high vitamin C can cause more bleeding during childbirth, which the

hospital may hold against you and use as an excuse to cut you. I read

that study at naturalchildbirth.org.

I agree with Adele, I think your multi is too low in iodine.

morning sickness often indicates higher levels of certain pregnancy

hormones, and therefore statistically correlates with positive pregnancy

outcomes. If you combine your B complex or B rich foods with high

protein and a bit of fat in the morning, that really knocks it down. I

took Floradix and popped protein with some fat as soon as I woke up.

I would encourage you to look into infusions. I did nettles, alfalfa,

oat straw, yellow dock, and sometimes ginger or chammomile and red

rasberry leaf (which is a uterine tonic, but stimulates some women to

contractions). K rich foods are really important near parturition, for

the baby's clotting factor.

Desh

[Guest guest]

Hi Penciloid,

> In my case, I was throwing up 5-10 times per day. The only foods I

> could sometimes keep down were Cheerios and saltines - and now they're

> both out on my gluten free diet! I couldn't even go in the grocery

> store or kitchen, so my husband was pretty hungry at the time. I can't

> go through all that again because while my husband can fend for

> himself, a toddler can't.

Sorry, I didn't realize it was so severe. I would definitely want to

be avoiding that too! My apologies for suggesting otherwise.

> I can see the reasoning that avoiding some foods might reduce toxin

> load, but I doubt everything but Cheerios and saltines were toxic for

> my son. I didn't try ginger or B6, because the nausea and vomiting

> came on so quickly that I didn't feel up to trying anything to help it.

Maybe ginger would work as a preventative?

Chris

[Guest guest]

How do people meet the RDA for vitamin E without supplements? When

using nutritiondata.com to check my diet, vitamin E seems to be about

the hardest thing. Is there any options besides eating tons of eggs

every day?

[Guest guest]

Do you eat organ meats/gizzards during this time?

Dr.Bernard Jensen in his book says the above foods can make a big

difference for women in the first 3 months of pregnancy and probably

can help or even avoid the morning sickness?

has anyone seen that effect?

-Dan.

>

> I've seen the WAP food guidelines for pregnant and nursing mothers

and

> I follow many of them. I know that some people here don't believe in

> vitamins, since our food should be enough. However, in my case, I

> think my body has been deficient in many things for years. In the

> fall, I had my vitamin and mineral levels checked. B12 was almost

> getting low and everything else was fine. I'd been taking massive

> doses of things for 6 months in my quest to heal my adrenal fatigue.

> It seems that when a person takes 10,000% percent of the RDA of

> something (in my case, pantothenic acid), and their blood levels are

> in the middle of normal, then their body must not being absorbing it

> right, or they need more than most people.

>

> Anyway, I imagine that before I started taking a zillion vitamins, I

> must've been deficient in several things. My goal is to make sure

I'm

> not low on anything before conceiving. I had severe morning sickness

> last time, which I hope to avoid. I was looking through Adelle

's

> book " Let's Have Healthy Children " and saw the chart of her

> recommended vitamin doses. Of course, I'm sure a lot of new research

> has come out in 30 years, so I'd like your opinions of how much I

> should take of various things.

>

> I'm especially interested in your opinions of these amounts she

> recommended:

>

> -3 mg iodine (my multi has 150 mcg)

> -1000 mg choline

> -1000 mg inositol

> -1-5 mg folic acid

>

> Also, what is your opinion of vitamin K? My multi doesn't have any.

> Finally, I'm thinking of following Dr. Klennar's recommendations on

> vitamin C (4 g/day for the first trimester then increasing the

amounts

> after that).

>

[Guest guest]

I didn't mean to imply that I agree with the 4g of C, either. but I did

do extra C last pregnancy because I am deficient. Rainbow Light was the

best prenatal I could afford, along with the Floradix and CLO, some high

quality macrominerals and trace/sea minerals. I didn't take the chemical

prenatal on days when my diet was great. I did do raw liver and tons of

eggs for the choline.

Desh

[Guest guest]

> The folic acid is way too high, completely unnecessary and probably

> harmful. You need about 600 mcg of folic acid (0.6 mg), and you

> should do everything you can to get it from food instead of

> supplements, unless you find a 5-methyl-tetrahydrafolate supplement,

> or at least a folinic acid supplement. In the current Wise

> Traditions, my article has figures about how to get the folate

> requirement from food, and you can also look on www.nutritiondata.com

> and see how you're doing. If you can't eat a folate-rich diet because

> of preference or food intolerances, it is better to take the 600 mcg

> (0.6 mg) folic acid supplement, preferably in divided doses of 200 mcg

> per meal, but it is better to get the folate from food because " folic

> acid " does not cross the placenta and the body's ability to reduce it

> into a food form of folate is limited, and the excess unmetabolized

> folic acid *could* be harmful but this is not sorted out yet.

>

> >

My two-year old son has been prescribed a 5 mg megadose of folic acid

for a genetic condition. We have been advised to give him a

multivitamin, since the high dose of folic acid may deplete B-6 and

zinc. I was wondering if there was a good way to get him B6 and zinc

supplementation without synthetic vitamins. He probably already gets a

good supply of B6 and zinc, I would guess, from a WAPF/NT diet (with

the exception of lactofermented prodcuts which I haven't succeeded in

introducing to him yet--but he loves his pastured beef and eggs, raw

milk, etc.) Also, should I request an alternative form of folic

acid?--it's mixed up in liquid at a compounding pharmacy.