Re: NT/WAP low carb site

[Guest guest]

Try going to www.homodiet.netfirms.com and check out that low carb diet. It

looks like it's the closest thing you're looking for. If you want to better

understand the science behind a ketogenic diet and just how fat adaptation works

try reading Lyle Mc's book " Ketogenic Diet " .

Another thing you may want to consider is to keep an active lifestyle. You can

almost double your metabolism just by being very active. That includes walking,

hobbies, painting, going out, bike riding, getting more done in a day, you name

it. Try to see if you have time for any of it, a half hour to two hours

everyday or every other day on the weekdays is perfect.

I would recommend adopting pilates or yoga, and maybe get into calisthenics and

lifting weights as that will boost your metabolism quite a bit. For a beginner

you'll get the most benefits out of yoga and calisthenics. For every pound of

muscle you put on that is 14 more calories you burn a day with a base metabolic

rate alone.

Dan Holt

________________________________

From: slbooks4me <beauty4ashesisaiah61@...>

Sent: Sun, November 29, 2009 10:28:24 PM

Subject: NT/WAP low carb site

Hi does anyone know of a good site that is low carb but still TF? I am reading

Taubes Good/Bad Calories and need to see a low carb diet in play to reverse

metabolic syndrome, or can you? I have been eating a pretty strict WAP diet for

yrs now and can't really lose weight. I don't usually eat enough to be able to

maintain weight but i still maintain or gain. I def. think it is the carb issue

for me.

I have thought i was eating a pretty low carb diet myself as we were hardly ever

eating grains. When i did eat them i made to sure to eat a small portion.

Mostly i have eaten meat and veggies. But am wondering if too many veggies, or

the wrong = high carb ones are what i have been choosing. I need info that may

help me get rid of extra weight. At this time in my life i can't spend a couple

hrs a day at the gym, and that is what it has taken me in the past. Killing

myself there doing cardio and weight training to lose anything (was not

WAP,then, following low fat, low cal dietary advice w/ protein, lots of salad).

We had 2 children after losing what i needed, and it is really stuck now.

My diet wether i avoid all grains for weeks or not seems to make no difference

and i really can't see eating meat and fat only.... i can't stand either w/o

veggies. We were on GAPS for 8 months and i lost 10lbs during that time, need

to lose 50. Our diet consisted of lots of bone broth soups, plain 24 hr yogurt,

meat, veggies - mostly low starch ones because high starch was not allowed (no

raw milk either and minimal fruit), eggs, bacon, some fruits no more than 1 a

day like a sour apple, nut breads.... SCD like. I would think that after 8

months more than 10lbs would have come off if a low carb diet was what i

needed.... unless i needed no carb for a while kind of like Atkins.

I am possibly hypothyroid Dr. Peat said jut a little, another which was a Broda

Doc said very hypo. My temps are consistently low with a small amount of

antibodies indicating it could be hashis and my Frees and TSH show non

optimal/low, but barely " normal " in ranges nobody in the conventional med

acknowledges it period. Local Naturopath says they are normal too. Can't

afford to see another. Enough of a difference though that Dr. Peat and the

Broda Doc. said work on it. So this could be part of it. I was hoping to find

answers in the Taubes book. Maybe someone here who has read it can help put the

pieces together as his book is kind of hard to read, dry, to many studies

mentioned to keep everything straight. I thought maybe a site with info

bringing it together may help. to see A BLD menu etc.

TIA

[Guest guest]

So you may have metabolic syndrome and lymphocytic thyroiditis.

Doing a high fat low carb diet may be a good choice for metabolic syndrome.

For Hashimoto's disease you may want to consider having kombucha, raw milk, and

coconut oil throughout the day. Raw milk may also be good for metabolic

syndrome and goes good with a lower fat diet. You could try replacing your carb

intake with only unheated raw honey, raw milk, a little bit of fruit, and some

vegetables like celery, carrots, and broccoli.

You may want to also consider consuming organ and gland meats. Try seeing if

you can find hypothalamus, thyroid, or any of the other types of glands from

animals that help to balance out hormones. Maybe have a half oz of each of the

different organs in a shake everyday and mask the taste with something. If the

problem goes away reduce the organ consumption down to once a week if you still

want to continue it.

Dan Holt

________________________________

From: slbooks4me <beauty4ashesisaiah61@...>

Sent: Sun, November 29, 2009 10:28:24 PM

Subject: NT/WAP low carb site

Hi does anyone know of a good site that is low carb but still TF? I am reading

Taubes Good/Bad Calories and need to see a low carb diet in play to reverse

metabolic syndrome, or can you? I have been eating a pretty strict WAP diet for

yrs now and can't really lose weight. I don't usually eat enough to be able to

maintain weight but i still maintain or gain. I def. think it is the carb issue

for me.

I have thought i was eating a pretty low carb diet myself as we were hardly ever

eating grains. When i did eat them i made to sure to eat a small portion.

Mostly i have eaten meat and veggies. But am wondering if too many veggies, or

the wrong = high carb ones are what i have been choosing. I need info that may

help me get rid of extra weight. At this time in my life i can't spend a couple

hrs a day at the gym, and that is what it has taken me in the past. Killing

myself there doing cardio and weight training to lose anything (was not

WAP,then, following low fat, low cal dietary advice w/ protein, lots of salad).

We had 2 children after losing what i needed, and it is really stuck now.

My diet wether i avoid all grains for weeks or not seems to make no difference

and i really can't see eating meat and fat only.... i can't stand either w/o

veggies. We were on GAPS for 8 months and i lost 10lbs during that time, need

to lose 50. Our diet consisted of lots of bone broth soups, plain 24 hr yogurt,

meat, veggies - mostly low starch ones because high starch was not allowed (no

raw milk either and minimal fruit), eggs, bacon, some fruits no more than 1 a

day like a sour apple, nut breads.... SCD like. I would think that after 8

months more than 10lbs would have come off if a low carb diet was what i

needed.... unless i needed no carb for a while kind of like Atkins.

I am possibly hypothyroid Dr. Peat said jut a little, another which was a Broda

Doc said very hypo. My temps are consistently low with a small amount of

antibodies indicating it could be hashis and my Frees and TSH show non

optimal/low, but barely " normal " in ranges nobody in the conventional med

acknowledges it period. Local Naturopath says they are normal too. Can't

afford to see another. Enough of a difference though that Dr. Peat and the

Broda Doc. said work on it. So this could be part of it. I was hoping to find

answers in the Taubes book. Maybe someone here who has read it can help put the

pieces together as his book is kind of hard to read, dry, to many studies

mentioned to keep everything straight. I thought maybe a site with info

bringing it together may help. to see A BLD menu etc.

TIA

[Guest guest]

Look at http://www.marksdailyapple.com

Even though he advocates a " primal " diet, a lot of WAPF-ers follow his

site. He advocates no grains, limiting dairy, and eating lots of veggies,

meat, and healthy fats. Some nuts and seeds. He also has exercise tips and

routines.

stacy

[Guest guest]

,

It certainly sounds like you have a thyroid problem, in which case the LAST

thing you want to do is go low-carb because it will further slow down your

thyroid. Even Ray Peat says to eat lots of protein AND fruit for the thyroid. He

says the best fruits are oranges, melons, grapes, pineapple, kiwi, etc...the

ones with good sugars to help make the cholesterol your body needs to make

hormones (like thyroid hormones).

Taubes' book, while quite thorough and important, is not a diet book nor

does it really have many definitive answers for you. Have you heard of the " High

Everything Diet " ? Matt Stone talks a lot about it on his blog, which is very

WAPF-friendly(180degreehealth.blogspot.com) and it seems like it could help you.

A similar approach would be Dr. Schwarzbein's " Scwarzbein Principle II:

The Transition. " Essentially, you can't stimulate the metabolism by omitting any

macronutrients (like carbs), you've got to eat, and eat a lot of everything

(except refined carbs and other processed foods.)

Good luck!

>

> So you may have metabolic syndrome and lymphocytic thyroiditis.

>

> Doing a high fat low carb diet may be a good choice for metabolic syndrome.

>

> For Hashimoto's disease you may want to consider having kombucha, raw milk,

and coconut oil throughout the day. Raw milk may also be good for metabolic

syndrome and goes good with a lower fat diet. You could try replacing your carb

intake with only unheated raw honey, raw milk, a little bit of fruit, and some

vegetables like celery, carrots, and broccoli.

>

> You may want to also consider consuming organ and gland meats. Try seeing if

you can find hypothalamus, thyroid, or any of the other types of glands from

animals that help to balance out hormones. Maybe have a half oz of each of the

different organs in a shake everyday and mask the taste with something. If the

problem goes away reduce the organ consumption down to once a week if you still

want to continue it.

>

> Dan Holt

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

> From: slbooks4me <beauty4ashesisaiah61@...>

>

> Sent: Sun, November 29, 2009 10:28:24 PM

> Subject: NT/WAP low carb site

>

>

> Hi does anyone know of a good site that is low carb but still TF? I am reading

Taubes Good/Bad Calories and need to see a low carb diet in play to reverse

metabolic syndrome, or can you? I have been eating a pretty strict WAP diet for

yrs now and can't really lose weight. I don't usually eat enough to be able to

maintain weight but i still maintain or gain. I def. think it is the carb issue

for me.

>

> I have thought i was eating a pretty low carb diet myself as we were hardly

ever eating grains. When i did eat them i made to sure to eat a small portion.

Mostly i have eaten meat and veggies. But am wondering if too many veggies, or

the wrong = high carb ones are what i have been choosing. I need info that may

help me get rid of extra weight. At this time in my life i can't spend a couple

hrs a day at the gym, and that is what it has taken me in the past. Killing

myself there doing cardio and weight training to lose anything (was not

WAP,then, following low fat, low cal dietary advice w/ protein, lots of salad).

We had 2 children after losing what i needed, and it is really stuck now.

>

> My diet wether i avoid all grains for weeks or not seems to make no difference

and i really can't see eating meat and fat only.... i can't stand either w/o

veggies. We were on GAPS for 8 months and i lost 10lbs during that time, need

to lose 50. Our diet consisted of lots of bone broth soups, plain 24 hr yogurt,

meat, veggies - mostly low starch ones because high starch was not allowed (no

raw milk either and minimal fruit), eggs, bacon, some fruits no more than 1 a

day like a sour apple, nut breads.... SCD like. I would think that after 8

months more than 10lbs would have come off if a low carb diet was what i

needed.... unless i needed no carb for a while kind of like Atkins.

>

> I am possibly hypothyroid Dr. Peat said jut a little, another which was a

Broda Doc said very hypo. My temps are consistently low with a small

amount of antibodies indicating it could be hashis and my Frees and TSH show non

optimal/low, but barely " normal " in ranges nobody in the conventional med

acknowledges it period. Local Naturopath says they are normal too. Can't

afford to see another. Enough of a difference though that Dr. Peat and the

Broda Doc. said work on it. So this could be part of it. I was hoping to find

answers in the Taubes book. Maybe someone here who has read it can help put the

pieces together as his book is kind of hard to read, dry, to many studies

mentioned to keep everything straight. I thought maybe a site with info

bringing it together may help. to see A BLD menu etc.

>

> TIA

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I have been practicing yoga for ten years.  For me, it does not build muscle

mass nor

is it a good weight management tool.  It is the best for balance, posture, body

alignment and flexibility, which are just important as weight mangement.

 

Pamela

Try going to www.homodiet. netfirms. com and check out that low carb diet. It

looks like it's the closest thing you're looking for. If you want to better

understand the science behind a ketogenic diet and just how fat adaptation works

try reading Lyle Mc's book " Ketogenic Diet " .

Another thing you may want to consider is to keep an active lifestyle. You can

almost double your metabolism just by being very active. That includes walking,

hobbies, painting, going out, bike riding, getting more done in a day, you name

it. Try to see if you have time for any of it, a half hour to two hours everyday

or every other day on the weekdays is perfect.

I would recommend adopting pilates or yoga, and maybe get into calisthenics and

lifting weights as that will boost your metabolism quite a bit. For a beginner

you'll get the most benefits out of yoga and calisthenics. For every pound of

muscle you put on that is 14 more calories you burn a day with a base metabolic

rate alone.

Dan Holt

[Guest guest]

> Hi does anyone know of a good site that is low carb but still TF? ...I have

been eating a pretty strict WAP diet for yrs now and can't really lose weight.

It sounds like thyroid especially if you did the meat/veggies thing, with

unlimited meat. I did that and my metabolism was whacked. It came back when I

went on Kwasniewski which limits protein, brings back starch from veg, and adds

sat fat.

There was recently an excellent thread about thyroid.

This was at a low-carber forum (registration needed.)

Highly recommend reading that. (I copied one post at the end of this)

I would second the recommendation for Mark's Daily Apple, also Kwasniewski's

Optimal Diet. Both allow for more carbs overall than Atkins induction levels.

Mark's Daily Apple get their carbs from veggies and fruit, where Kwasniewski

advocates getting carbs from starchy veg and limiting fiber either from veg or

grains. He also limits fructose.

From author " " :

You've leapt to a very logical (but incorrect) conclusion: that " the thyroid " is

a monolithic object rather than an entire metabolic system, and that " treating

it " means treating the organ (the gland) rather than the hormones that support

the gland.

The diabetes analogy is a good one, because it will hopefully help me to write

about this in a way that will clarify the issue for you in a concrete way.

If it turns out that you have the thyroid equivalent of Type 1 diabetes (that

is, you have a goiter, which means that there's a problem with the gland itself,

or you are converting food into insufficient T4 in the gland) -- then you will

indeed be put on Synthroid, and you will have to take it for life. As with Type

1 diabetes, there is currently no cure for a non-working Thyroid GLAND. And T4

is to a large extent, but not exclusively, made in the gland itself.

However, if you have the Type 2 diabetes thyroid equivalent -- it means you have

a problem with the T1 or T2 or (in 99.9% of the cases) T3 hormones that support

the gland.

But guess what? T1, T2 and T3 -- unlike T4 -- are not made in the gland!

T4 is NOT the physiologically active hormone. Instead it needs to be converted

by an enzyme called 5'-deiodinase (the ' after the five means " prime " ) in order

to become the active hormone T3 (liothyronine). At least 80% of the body's daily

production of T3 is produced not in the thyroid gland, but in the tissues of

your body (liver, kidney, etc.).

T3 IS the physiologically active thyroid hormone and is 4 times more potent, and

3 times shorter acting than T4. T3 is what goes to all the cells in the body and

tells them how fast to operate, which determines the body temperature.

5' deiodinase has two jobs. It converts T4 to T3, and it converts RT3 to T2.

5 deiodinase (note, no " prime " ) is the enzyme that converts T4 to RT3.

The specific route by which this conversion happens:

5' deiodinase (5 " prime " deiodinase) plucks the iodine atom off the 5' position

of T4 to make T3. It also converts RT3 to T2. T3 is 4 times more potent than T4

and is the primary agonist (stimulator) at the cell level.

But if the 5' deiodinase gets blocked at the cell receptor level, T4 gets

converted by 5 (no prime) deiodinase into rT3 instead of T3.

It's exactly like becoming insulin resistant. Instead of glucose being taken up

by insulin to the cells for food, the cells have blocked their insulin receptors

and the insulin must then carry the glucose to the liver to be converted to

adipose fat for storage.

The pancreas just thinks it's not producing enough insulin and makes even more,

creating more blocked cell receptors. Would you tell someone in this condition

to take insulin to fix the problem because after all, insulin works great for

lots of diabetic folks? No, of course not. You would tell this person to begin

making the dietary changes needed to slow down insulin production and increase

insulin sensitivity.

If they don't listen, what will happen? Even the fat cells will become insulin

resistant and then the pancreas will burn out, turning them from a Type 2 to a

Type 1 diabetic. Then they'll be able to use insulin all right!

Well, having blocked T3 cell receptors because your T4 is converting not into T3

but into rT3 (not glucose into food, but into adipose fat storage) and pouring

MORE T4 into your system will do the same thing: burn out your entire thyroid

system. Then sure, you'll be on T4 forever, and T3 too.

" Under stress (and this can take many forms, including calorie and/or

carbohydrate restriction over an extended period of time) the body converts T4

less to T3 and more to RT3 to conserve energy. With less T3, the cells of the

body slow down. This makes it clear that there is a peripheral auto-regulatory

mechanism as well as the glandular one that regulates T4 production. And there

is a glandular auto-regulatory mechanism (negative feedback inhibition), that

regulates the thyroid gland's T4 production. The amount of T4 that is converted

peripherally to the active T3 can drop by 50%. And at the same time, the amount

of T4 converted to the inactive RT3 can increase by 50%. "

This understanding of the glandular problem (goiter, not enough T4 production in

the gland) vs. the peripheral T4 to rT3 problem also answers SeeJay's question

about why people stay on Synthroid forever, whereas that is not the case (or

should not be the case) for Cytomel.

In the case of a Type 1 diabetes thyroid equivalent, the nature of the glandular

problem is likely chronic and incurable (now, anyway), so synthetic T4 must,

like insulin, be taken daily and forever.

In the case of a Type 2 diabetes thyroid equivalent, the problem lies in the

peripheral tissue and organs, and a short course of the right amount of T3,

given in the correct protocol, can drain the rT3 reservoir, unblock the T3 cell

receptors and 'fix' the problem -- just as a change from a sugar and

fructose-laden high carb diet to a sugar and fructose-free low carb, high fat

diet can restore insulin sensitivity to cells. Unless one reverts back to old

behavior and/or eating patterns, the fix should be permanent.

This also explains, btw, one noted 'marker' for an rT3 problem and what happens

when you fix it: Total Cholesterol level changes.

People who eat a high fat, low carb diet should have very normal TC after one

year. But because the 5' deiodinase -- in the liver, remember -- is one of the

signals given to the liver that cholesterol levels are fine, and that signal is

replaced by the inactive 5 (no prime) deiodinase molecule, the liver keeps

churning out what it believes is missing but needed. Cholesterol. That's why

mine has increased dramatically in the last two years (as my rT3 problem

increased) despite extremely low risk markers for heart disease otherwise. Mine

went from 200 to 381 in just 24 months. You didn't answer my question about

whether yours was over 200, but I'm guessing it is.

Cytomel therapy has another 'side-effect' and you can probably guess now what it

it: dramatic lowering of TC. And now you know why, and exactly how that works,

and why every Medical Journal article on the subject specifically states that

high TC caused by peripheral thyroid hormone problems be treated by thyroid

medication (which you also now know must be T3, and not T4), and not statins.

It's the only time I've ever seen statins not suggested by the statinators for

curing anything. With my T3 therapy, I expect my TC to, in the words of the

Medical Journals -- drop like a rock.

So to answer your original question that made me laugh: " Does T4 work for 33%

who take it? 75% 98%? " -- T4 therapy given to patients with a thyroid glandular

problem (that is, the Type 1's of the thyroid world) should be 100% effective,

100% of the time.

Otoh, giving T4 therapy to patients who have peripheral thyroid hormone problems

(the Type 2's of the thyroid world) is the same as giving them cotton candy, in

ever increasing doses. It might make them feel better (high on the excess

glucose) for a short while, and then it will, if not stopped, cause severe

damage throughout the body.

At this moment you have no idea if you are Type 1 or Type 2 and speculating

about what drug or drugs you will need is futile. You need to get the tests done

-- all the tests -- that will tell you which type of thyroid problem you have,

and that will tell you what specific drug you need, and in what dose and

protocol, to take to help it.

[Guest guest]

I feel yoga goes good with plyometrics and calisthenics. They help balance each

other out. If you only did the yoga you probably are not getting the benefits I

am describing. plyometrics is another good one to go with your routine, try

jumping as this will build up strength and flexibility in your legs. Also if

you can handle it try doing a quick all out sprint everyday or every other day.

50-400 meter, your choice.

My form in yoga improves tremendously when I do calisthenics. I could do a

headstand within three days with just six tries because I lifted weights and did

bodyweight exercises too.

Dan Holt

________________________________

From: Theta <calblonde1@...>

Sent: Mon, November 30, 2009 12:04:16 PM

Subject: Re: NT/WAP low carb site

I have been practicing yoga for ten years. For me, it does not build muscle

mass nor

is it a good weight management tool. It is the best for balance, posture, body

alignment and flexibility, which are just important as weight mangement.

Pamela

Try going to www.homodiet. netfirms. com and check out that low carb diet. It

looks like it's the closest thing you're looking for. If you want to better

understand the science behind a ketogenic diet and just how fat adaptation works

try reading Lyle Mc's book " Ketogenic Diet " .

Another thing you may want to consider is to keep an active lifestyle. You can

almost double your metabolism just by being very active. That includes walking,

hobbies, painting, going out, bike riding, getting more done in a day, you name

it. Try to see if you have time for any of it, a half hour to two hours everyday

or every other day on the weekdays is perfect.

I would recommend adopting pilates or yoga, and maybe get into calisthenics and

lifting weights as that will boost your metabolism quite a bit. For a beginner

you'll get the most benefits out of yoga and calisthenics. For every pound of

muscle you put on that is 14 more calories you burn a day with a base metabolic

rate alone.

Dan Holt

[Guest guest]

> Which forum was it?

> Do you have more details on " all the tests " ?

The forum is " Active Low Carber Forums " .

Post is:

Main > Low Carb Health and... > Thyroid Disease > TSH of 9!

http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=403439

The tests are levels of T1, T2, T3, T4, ferritin, and cortisol.

There may be more too, I was skimming a lot. The whole thread is worth a read.

Connie

[Guest guest]

> I feel yoga goes good with plyometrics and calisthenics.

Interesting you should notice that. Sonnon writes about how in India, they

developed club swinging to complement yoga and meditation. Club swinging adds

the elements of weight and force coming to and from the whole body that are not

possible solely with bodyweight poses. It requires strength, coordination,

timing, and the proper firing sequences of all the body parts in all planes of

motion. (right-left; up-down; side-side; around Z axis; around X axis, around Y

axis).

http://www.rmaxinternational.com/flowcoach/?p=530

Connie

[Guest guest]

Carolyn,

Have you considered iodine? I know it could be problematic if you have hashi's

but it might be worth looking into. I have been reading about applying iodine

topically. Ray Peat didn't think you should be on thyroid? It sounds like you

talked to him. I gained weight when I started drinking raw milk. It was mostly

edema, I think. I stopped drinking the milk, turned out I was allergic, took

some iodine and I'm back to my normal weight. I think many people who are

overweight really have edema. Peat says iodide is good for ridding the body of

it. Peat doesn't think most people need iodine but this is one area where I

disagree. Do you want to see the diet that Peat and Lee promote? I can

post it.

Joan

[Guest guest]

Here are my thoughts on raw milk.

First of all try mixing in a tablespoon of unheated for every cup of raw milk

consumed. Or try to get a hold of raw goat milk as that is much easier to

absorb. If that doesn't work try fermenting the raw milk.

I would prefer raw goat milk from a pastured farm because unlike cows they are

smaller so they are more likely not to be fed mixed rations and instead just eat

grass. This may be why people are allergic to the raw milk, as it may also

contains antinutrients from the mixed rations. A farmer I spoke to that runs a

pastured farm says the mixed rations ruin the milk's taste, as it should

naturally taste sweet. Organic Pastures gives their cows mixed rations. The

type of breed of cow makes a difference too.

The raw milk you may be getting is from cows that are given mixed rations such

as corn, wheat, and soy which aren't something cows have evolved to absorb

effectively.

You may also want to consider building up your probiotics and enzymes in your

gut, and to take in prebiotics from whole foods to feed the probiotics. This

may also improve absorption of raw milk.

Dan Holt

________________________________

From: coloredoctave <joanlulich@...>

Sent: Mon, November 30, 2009 7:27:42 PM

Subject: Re: NT/WAP low carb site

Carolyn,

Have you considered iodine? I know it could be problematic if you have hashi's

but it might be worth looking into. I have been reading about applying iodine

topically. Ray Peat didn't think you should be on thyroid? It sounds like you

talked to him. I gained weight when I started drinking raw milk. It was mostly

edema, I think. I stopped drinking the milk, turned out I was allergic, took

some iodine and I'm back to my normal weight. I think many people who are

overweight really have edema. Peat says iodide is good for ridding the body of

it. Peat doesn't think most people need iodine but this is one area where I

disagree. Do you want to see the diet that Peat and Lee promote? I can

post it.

Joan

[Guest guest]

In the beginning of the post I meant unheated honey.

________________________________

From: Holt <danthemanholt@...>

Sent: Mon, November 30, 2009 9:53:37 PM

Subject: Re: NT/WAP low carb site

Here are my thoughts on raw milk.

First of all try mixing in a tablespoon of unheated for every cup of raw milk

consumed. Or try to get a hold of raw goat milk as that is much easier to

absorb. If that doesn't work try fermenting the raw milk.

I would prefer raw goat milk from a pastured farm because unlike cows they are

smaller so they are more likely not to be fed mixed rations and instead just eat

grass. This may be why people are allergic to the raw milk, as it may also

contains antinutrients from the mixed rations. A farmer I spoke to that runs a

pastured farm says the mixed rations ruin the milk's taste, as it should

naturally taste sweet. Organic Pastures gives their cows mixed rations. The

type of breed of cow makes a difference too.

The raw milk you may be getting is from cows that are given mixed rations such

as corn, wheat, and soy which aren't something cows have evolved to absorb

effectively.

You may also want to consider building up your probiotics and enzymes in your

gut, and to take in prebiotics from whole foods to feed the probiotics. This

may also improve absorption of raw milk.

Dan Holt

____________ _________ _________ __

From: coloredoctave <joanlulich (DOT) com>

Sent: Mon, November 30, 2009 7:27:42 PM

Subject: Re: NT/WAP low carb site

Carolyn,

Have you considered iodine? I know it could be problematic if you have hashi's

but it might be worth looking into. I have been reading about applying iodine

topically. Ray Peat didn't think you should be on thyroid? It sounds like you

talked to him. I gained weight when I started drinking raw milk. It was mostly

edema, I think. I stopped drinking the milk, turned out I was allergic, took

some iodine and I'm back to my normal weight. I think many people who are

overweight really have edema. Peat says iodide is good for ridding the body of

it. Peat doesn't think most people need iodine but this is one area where I

disagree. Do you want to see the diet that Peat and Lee promote? I can

post it.

Joan

[Guest guest]

> Does anyone know an endocrinologist that will do this?

I don't, but maybe there are public labs where you can have the tests done for

your own information. While you try to find a more workable doctor.

> My doctor pretty much won't listen to all this information

In that thread one of the people who had researched thyroid issues, said that

the thyroid standards of care have not changed in 40 years. Because the makers

of Armour thyroid are on the advisory panel.

> Interesting RE the diet.

> Low carb never works for me and I feel totally

> whacked out so I gave it up a long time ago.

Sorry to hear that. Perhaps you might do better with lower carb than SAD, but

not Atkins 20g induction. How I have come to dislike that - it makes people

think that carb control is all like that.

> Anyway, thanks for the information. Maybe I'll get enough to put the pieces

> of the puzzle together and find good health.

> Dawn

yes, good luck!

Connie

[Guest guest]

> Would Jan Kwasniewski's diet be rich in prebiotics.

Well, he certainly advises traditional ferments like sauerkraut. But since plant

foods are treated more like condiments I wouldn't say " rich " in probiotics. It's

not an emphasis.

They aren't needed as much either as the diet is so healthy to gut and

metabolism, you aren't trying to restore from the damage of other kinds of food.