Guest guest Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 Leigh, I am not sure what the official right answer would be but... I have seen this handled several ways: 1) Some PTs write POC with only what they plan to do and when the Dr. signs it, then they are covered. 2) Some do US for instance once or twice so they can say they at least tried what the Dr. said and then do whatever they think is indicated. 3) Some call Dr or nurse and recommend what they think is best. (most Docs OK that) 3) What helped me was to print up script pads that had a check box for eval and treat, with a small section to put anything specific they wanted to include or exclude. With a little bit of education all the doctors I worked with learned to just check the eval and treat box . Greg ________________________________ To: PTManager Sent: Thu, January 6, 2011 12:21:58 PM Subject: Physician referrals -- follow to the letter?  When a referral for PT comes from a physician that includes modalities that the therapist chooses not to use, is there any requirement (state law, Joint Commission, CMS, or other) that this be addressed in the documentation or with involvement of the physician? For example, a prescription for PT treatment of chondromalacia patella specifies ultrasound and VMO strengthening, and the therapist instead does ankle mobilization, patellar taping and glute strengthening based on his examination findings and assessment. Must the MD agree, or can the PT proceed as he sees fit, reporting the results to the physician in a progress note? (This is in a hospital-based outpatient setting.) Thanks for your input. Leigh , MSPT San Francisco, CA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 Some payers will require a POC and this is often matched to the therapy that is ultimately reimbursed, so in a broad sense it is best they match. The easiest way to handle this is to communicate with the referral sources that PT is a service that can determine the best course of treatment by ordering EVALUATION and TREATMENT . This is another issue in itself , but we must continue to educate the public and the referral sources that PT is not an ordered " product " like a lab or x-ray but rather a professional service capable of making autonomous medical decisions and treatment plans Another option is to create a POC document that acknowledges the order but lines out the actual plan , frequency and goals of the treatment plan ( based on evaluation findings) - seek physician approval by adding signature line Ron Barbato PT Administrative Director, Rehabilitation Services Program Director, Cancer Support Services Ephraim McDowell Health rbarbato@... PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This transmission may contain information that is privileged subject to attorney-client privilege or attorney work product, confidential and/or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, then please do not read it and be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the information contained herein (including any reliance thereon) is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you received this transmission in error, please immediately advise me, by reply e-mail, and delete this message and any attachments without retaining a copy in any form. Thank you. Physician referrals -- follow to the letter? When a referral for PT comes from a physician that includes modalities that the therapist chooses not to use, is there any requirement (state law, Joint Commission, CMS, or other) that this be addressed in the documentation or with involvement of the physician? For example, a prescription for PT treatment of chondromalacia patella specifies ultrasound and VMO strengthening, and the therapist instead does ankle mobilization, patellar taping and glute strengthening based on his examination findings and assessment. Must the MD agree, or can the PT proceed as he sees fit, reporting the results to the physician in a progress note? (This is in a hospital-based outpatient setting.) Thanks for your input. Leigh , MSPT San Francisco, CA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 ..Hi Leigh, I will address Medicare specifically: Medicare Part B does not require a physician referral. It does require certification and an approved treatment plan. So it does not matter what is on the prescription, only what is on the treatment plan. This can be handled a couple of ways. If the physician is usually adament about what treatment to use and changes are suggested, then it probably would be wise to contact the physician to clarify the plan. Or simply, you can simply fill out the new treatment on the plan and send it to the physician for approval. Once you get the certification and signed treatment plan back from the physician, Medicare is very specific about further changes in the plan. Any major changes such as the ones you mention, will necessitate sending the treatment plan back to the physician for approval. Now a word about non-Medicare clients: if not being done, a possible helpful solution is, after the evaluation is complete, send a written treatment plan back to the physician for every client. This allows for communication of changes recommended which can then be approved or rejecdted by the physician. Once trust is established, most physicians will willingly allow chnages and as has been our experience, will write an " eval and treat " referral and allow us to determine the appropriate treatment which they can then approve when we send them the treatment plan. > Leigh, > I am not sure what the official right answer would be but... > I have seen this handled several ways: > 1) Some PTs write POC with only what they plan to do and when the Dr. > signs it, then they are covered. > 2) Some do US for instance once or twice so they can say they at least > tried what the Dr. said and then do whatever they think is indicated. > 3) Some call Dr or nurse and recommend what they think is best. (most > Docs OK that) > 3) What helped me was to print up script pads that had a check box for > eval and treat, with a small section to put anything specific they > wanted to include or exclude. With a little bit of education all the > doctors I worked with learned to just check the eval and treat box . > Greg > > > > ________________________________ > > To: PTManager > Sent: Thu, January 6, 2011 12:21:58 PM > Subject: Physician referrals -- follow to the letter? > >  > When a referral for PT comes from a physician that includes modalities > that the therapist chooses not to use, is there any requirement (state > law, Joint Commission, CMS, or other) that this be addressed in the > documentation or with involvement of the physician? > > For example, a prescription for PT treatment of chondromalacia patella > specifies ultrasound and VMO strengthening, and the therapist instead > does ankle mobilization, patellar taping and glute strengthening based > on his examination findings and assessment. Must the MD agree, or can > the PT proceed as he sees fit, reporting the results to the physician > in a progress note? (This is in a hospital-based outpatient setting.) > > Thanks for your input. > > Leigh , MSPT > San Francisco, CA > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 I do not believe that a referral is a prescription, or is a set of directions. When my family practitioner refers me to an orthopedist, podiatrist, or pulmonologist, it is not with directions or a protocol, else he is treating the pulmonologist, et. al. as a technician. Right? Just to keep us in touch with our own core principles, from The Code of Ethics, here's Principle # 3: Principle #3: Physical therapists shall be accountable for making sound professional judgments. 3A. Physical therapists shall demonstrate independent and objective professional judgment in the patient's/client's best interest in all practice settings. 3B. Physical therapists shall demonstrate professional judgment informed by professional standards, evidence (including current literature and established best practice), practitioner experience, and patient/client values. 3C. Physical therapists shall make judgments within their scope of practice and level of expertise and shall communicate with, collaborate with, or refer to peers or other health care professionals when necessary. 3D. Physical therapists shall not engage in conflicts of interest that interfere with professional judgment. 3E. Physical therapists shall provide appropriate direction of and communication with physical therapist assistants and support personnel. Dick Hillyer, PT,DPT,MBA,MSM _____ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Greg noel Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 10:13 PM To: PTManager Subject: Re: Physician referrals -- follow to the letter? Leigh, I am not sure what the official right answer would be but... I have seen this handled several ways: 1) Some PTs write POC with only what they plan to do and when the Dr. signs it, then they are covered. 2) Some do US for instance once or twice so they can say they at least tried what the Dr. said and then do whatever they think is indicated. 3) Some call Dr or nurse and recommend what they think is best. (most Docs OK that) 3) What helped me was to print up script pads that had a check box for eval and treat, with a small section to put anything specific they wanted to include or exclude. With a little bit of education all the doctors I worked with learned to just check the eval and treat box . Greg ________________________________ From: leighallenpt <leigh.allen.pt@... <mailto:leigh.allen.pt%40gmail.com> > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thu, January 6, 2011 12:21:58 PM Subject: Physician referrals -- follow to the letter? When a referral for PT comes from a physician that includes modalities that the therapist chooses not to use, is there any requirement (state law, Joint Commission, CMS, or other) that this be addressed in the documentation or with involvement of the physician? For example, a prescription for PT treatment of chondromalacia patella specifies ultrasound and VMO strengthening, and the therapist instead does ankle mobilization, patellar taping and glute strengthening based on his examination findings and assessment. Must the MD agree, or can the PT proceed as he sees fit, reporting the results to the physician in a progress note? (This is in a hospital-based outpatient setting.) Thanks for your input. Leigh , MSPT San Francisco, CA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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