Guest guest Posted August 12, 2009 Report Share Posted August 12, 2009 I think it is very important to consider the whole picture not from a limited perspective such as the small piece of the puzzle we see as therapists. There seems to be a lot of fear around this issue. We need to assess what we are afraid of and be self critical. Why do we rank 37th in the world for quality of care? Why is International Hospital in Bangkok Thailand considered one of the best? And why are some US doctors leaving to work there? Why did I see some people I know flying to other countries for their health care? They come back with stories about how wonderful the care was and how much cheaper it is for them. These are folks without insurance and pay cash, so they leave the US for less expensive, better quality care. In the opinion of 4 people I've known to do that. Why not travel to other countries and see first hand what some others are doing? My wife and I spent a couple of weeks traveling around BC Canada touring hospitals and visiting relatives to get an insiders view of their health care system. My sister in law is a physiotherapist in Canada. Anyway, it is easy to judge and repeat what we are told by the media and folks with an agenda. Where is the unbiased info? Wade, PT OR Curtis Marti wrote: > > > Mr. s, > > Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to > considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting that > I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. Clearly, > my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can only > hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to resubmit > it. > > Thanks again, > > -Curtis > > ________________________________ > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com>] On > Behalf Of s > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this > piece. Thank you. > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > Sincerely, > > E. s, PT, DPT > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > www.douglasspt.com > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 12, 2009 Report Share Posted August 12, 2009 Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference please. Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle Suite D Topeka, KS 66618 (785)246-2300 (P) (785)246-2301 (F) Interactive Physical Therapy 1709 SE 29th Street Suite 300-400 Topeka, KS 66605 (785)266-4600 (P) (785)266-4601 (F) www.interactiveptandfitness.com On Aug 12, 2009, at 6:58 PM, Alliance Physical Therapy <alliancept@... > wrote: > I think it is very important to consider the whole picture not from a > limited perspective such as the small piece of the puzzle we see as > therapists. > > There seems to be a lot of fear around this issue. We need to assess > what we are afraid of and be self critical. > > Why do we rank 37th in the world for quality of care? Why is > International Hospital in Bangkok Thailand considered one of the best? > And why are some US doctors leaving to work there? > > Why did I see some people I know flying to other countries for their > health care? They come back with stories about how wonderful the care > was and how much cheaper it is for them. These are folks without > insurance and pay cash, so they leave the US for less expensive, > better > quality care. In the opinion of 4 people I've known to do that. > > Why not travel to other countries and see first hand what some others > are doing? My wife and I spent a couple of weeks traveling around BC > Canada touring hospitals and visiting relatives to get an insiders > view > of their health care system. My sister in law is a physiotherapist in > Canada. > > Anyway, it is easy to judge and repeat what we are told by the media > and > folks with an agenda. Where is the unbiased info? > > Wade, PT > OR > > Curtis Marti wrote: > > > > > > Mr. s, > > > > Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to > > considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting > that > > I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. > Clearly, > > my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can > only > > hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to > resubmit > > it. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > -Curtis > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager > %40yahoogroups.com>] On > > Behalf Of s > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM > > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch > this > > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and > families. > > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on > this > > piece. Thank you. > > > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > > > Sincerely, > > > > E. s, PT, DPT > > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > > www.douglasspt.com > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 12, 2009 Report Share Posted August 12, 2009 Wade, thanks for your info. Maybe you can give us your views on the Canadian system you might have analysed. As a PT in private practise for 23 years, I see enough managed care in our lives presently. I just saw patient with bilateral bunionectomy done in March 2009 and receiving PT today. Now she not only has pain and swelling in the fore foot region but also her right hip is painful from improper ambulation. I am not a Gov lover when it comes to ruling over my life, however, I would like to welcome one more player in the field because I believe if I don't like it I have the might to change the Government, I cannot change the Blues and the Cignas of this country. Hiten Dave' PT Healthcare Reform > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this > piece. Thank you. > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > < http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > > < http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > < http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html >> > > Sincerely, > > E. s, PT, DPT > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > www.douglasspt.com > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Mr. s, As promised, here at the links that would be valuable for you and others to view. Each lasts around 8 minutes and it is information that we as healthcare providers need to know. www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/29036/ www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w4f04zrF2s & NR=1\ I want to reiterate that there are exaggerations being put out there on both sides of this argument. That said, I believe that the previous links provide much more truth than fiction. Thank you ahead of time for considering another view. If you feel inspired to contact your legislators, you can locate them at www.capitolconnect.com <http://www.capitolconnect.com/> . Then click on the " Legislator Search " link. Thanks again, -Curtis ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Curtis Marti Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 4:03 PM To: PTManager Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform Mr. s, Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting that I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. Clearly, my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can only hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to resubmit it. Thanks again, -Curtis ________________________________ From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of s Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Healthcare Reform Hello all, hope this finds you well, I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this piece. Thank you. http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > Sincerely, E. s, PT, DPT Orthopedic Clinical Specialist Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists www.douglasspt.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Hi all, I just wanted to let you know that I have a friend and his father, who own 2 very large companies in Canada. The father of one of the officer's of their company recently broke his hip.? The hospital did not have any beds so they placed him in one of the hallways.? They found him dead 3 days later.? Second issue,? they travel to Canada every week and were in Canada early this spring. The 72 year old president of the company (USA citizen) developed atrial fib.? He went to the emergency room, waited all day. After some preliminary tests, they were told they do not treat his condition if it doesn't last at least 1 week.? He came back to the US, had a major problem, which DID need to be treated. Ivashenko PT DPT OCS CProT Healthcare Reform > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this > piece. Thank you. > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > Sincerely, > > E. s, PT, DPT > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > www.douglasspt.com > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 It is from the World Health Organization and it is based on factors and weights for these factors. These factors are: Overall Level of Health - WHO used the measure of disability - adjusted life expectancy (this includes homicide rates and accidental death rate) Distribution of Health in the Populations - these were broken down into goodness, best attainable average level of health care, and fairness, smallest feasible differences among individual and groups Responsiveness - which include respect for persons and client orientation - this last includes amenities available Distribution of Financing - which includes the percentage of household income spent on health care This report was done in 2000. There were concerns over the results. Ruesewald Therapy Billing PO Box 880 , Lake Dallas , TX 75065 fax From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Ric Baird Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 7:55 PM To: PTManager Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference please. Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle Suite D Topeka, KS 66618 (785)246-2300 (P) (785)246-2301 (F) Interactive Physical Therapy 1709 SE 29th Street Suite 300-400 Topeka, KS 66605 (785)266-4600 (P) (785)266-4601 (F) www.interactiveptandfitness.com On Aug 12, 2009, at 6:58 PM, Alliance Physical Therapy <alliancept@... <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > wrote: > I think it is very important to consider the whole picture not from a > limited perspective such as the small piece of the puzzle we see as > therapists. > > There seems to be a lot of fear around this issue. We need to assess > what we are afraid of and be self critical. > > Why do we rank 37th in the world for quality of care? Why is > International Hospital in Bangkok Thailand considered one of the best? > And why are some US doctors leaving to work there? > > Why did I see some people I know flying to other countries for their > health care? They come back with stories about how wonderful the care > was and how much cheaper it is for them. These are folks without > insurance and pay cash, so they leave the US for less expensive, > better > quality care. In the opinion of 4 people I've known to do that. > > Why not travel to other countries and see first hand what some others > are doing? My wife and I spent a couple of weeks traveling around BC > Canada touring hospitals and visiting relatives to get an insiders > view > of their health care system. My sister in law is a physiotherapist in > Canada. > > Anyway, it is easy to judge and repeat what we are told by the media > and > folks with an agenda. Where is the unbiased info? > > Wade, PT > OR > > Curtis Marti wrote: > > > > > > Mr. s, > > > > Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to > > considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting > that > > I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. > Clearly, > > my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can > only > > hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to > resubmit > > it. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > -Curtis > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager > %40yahoogroups.com>] On > > Behalf Of s > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM > > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch > this > > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and > families. > > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on > this > > piece. Thank you. > > > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > > > Sincerely, > > > > E. s, PT, DPT > > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > > www.douglasspt.com > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Good morning everyone! I've been paying attention, with great interest, to the debate surrounding healthcare reform in our country. Things that I don't hear much about but, I feel, are well worth addressing are: 1. Personal responsibility (or the lack thereof) is a major factor in the health of each individual and the health of our country. I've seen statistics from various sources that estimate $1 to $3 of every $4 spent on healthcare in our country is for something that could have been prevented. We, as a nation, are very unhealthy in a number of respects and we have traditionally operated under a " sick care " system. My opinion is that instead of a very small, insignificant amount of money being dedicated to wellness and prevention which our Government is now proposing to be included in the " reform package " , that personal responsibility " reform " be a major topic that receives substantial attention and funding in order to change the mindset of the USA. Also, keep in mind that we are already seeing patient outcomes as a criteria for reimbursement. Very simply a compliant patient (one that takes responsibility in their rehab) nearly always has a better outcome than a non-compliant patient. 2. A huge portion of our healthcare costs can be traced back to the amount of money healthcare organizations and providers spend on liability and malpractice insurance. My belief is that this is largely due to the numerous frivolous law-suits and settlements that have been awarded by our judicial system. A major reason for this is again related to the idea that personal responsibility for one's health (and a lot of other things) is a fading ideal in this country. While I have no numbers to back this except what my own company pays each year for said insurance, common sense tells me that if limitations were set on lawsuits and settlements and on the financial prizes that attorneys can receive in such cases that our health care costs could be considerably less. I suspect due to the lobbying power of the attorneys in our country this is not a topic that gets much attention from our government or our press. Some things to think about? Thanks for the opportunity to share! Chad Chad W. Yoakam, MS, PT Manager of Rehabilitation Services Livingston HealthCare Orthopedic and Rehabilitation Institute ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Ruesewald Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 8:18 AM To: PTManager Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform It is from the World Health Organization and it is based on factors and weights for these factors. These factors are: Overall Level of Health - WHO used the measure of disability - adjusted life expectancy (this includes homicide rates and accidental death rate) Distribution of Health in the Populations - these were broken down into goodness, best attainable average level of health care, and fairness, smallest feasible differences among individual and groups Responsiveness - which include respect for persons and client orientation - this last includes amenities available Distribution of Financing - which includes the percentage of household income spent on health care This report was done in 2000. There were concerns over the results. Ruesewald Therapy Billing PO Box 880 , Lake Dallas , TX 75065 fax From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Ric Baird Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 7:55 PM To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference please. Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle Suite D Topeka, KS 66618 (785)246-2300 (P) (785)246-2301 (F) Interactive Physical Therapy 1709 SE 29th Street Suite 300-400 Topeka, KS 66605 (785)266-4600 (P) (785)266-4601 (F) www.interactiveptandfitness.com On Aug 12, 2009, at 6:58 PM, Alliance Physical Therapy <alliancept@... <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > wrote: > I think it is very important to consider the whole picture not from a > limited perspective such as the small piece of the puzzle we see as > therapists. > > There seems to be a lot of fear around this issue. We need to assess > what we are afraid of and be self critical. > > Why do we rank 37th in the world for quality of care? Why is > International Hospital in Bangkok Thailand considered one of the best? > And why are some US doctors leaving to work there? > > Why did I see some people I know flying to other countries for their > health care? They come back with stories about how wonderful the care > was and how much cheaper it is for them. These are folks without > insurance and pay cash, so they leave the US for less expensive, > better > quality care. In the opinion of 4 people I've known to do that. > > Why not travel to other countries and see first hand what some others > are doing? My wife and I spent a couple of weeks traveling around BC > Canada touring hospitals and visiting relatives to get an insiders > view > of their health care system. My sister in law is a physiotherapist in > Canada. > > Anyway, it is easy to judge and repeat what we are told by the media > and > folks with an agenda. Where is the unbiased info? > > Wade, PT > OR > > Curtis Marti wrote: > > > > > > Mr. s, > > > > Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to > > considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting > that > > I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. > Clearly, > > my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can > only > > hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to > resubmit > > it. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > -Curtis > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager > %40yahoogroups.com>] On > > Behalf Of s > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM > > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch > this > > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and > families. > > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on > this > > piece. Thank you. > > > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> >> > > > > Sincerely, > > > > E. s, PT, DPT > > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > > www.douglasspt.com > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Good morning everyone! I've been paying attention, with great interest, to the debate surrounding healthcare reform in our country. Things that I don't hear much about but, I feel, are well worth addressing are: 1. Personal responsibility (or the lack thereof) is a major factor in the health of each individual and the health of our country. I've seen statistics from various sources that estimate $1 to $3 of every $4 spent on healthcare in our country is for something that could have been prevented. We, as a nation, are very unhealthy in a number of respects and we have traditionally operated under a " sick care " system. My opinion is that instead of a very small, insignificant amount of money being dedicated to wellness and prevention which our Government is now proposing to be included in the " reform package " , that personal responsibility " reform " be a major topic that receives substantial attention and funding in order to change the mindset of the USA. Also, keep in mind that we are already seeing patient outcomes as a criteria for reimbursement. Very simply a compliant patient (one that takes responsibility in their rehab) nearly always has a better outcome than a non-compliant patient. 2. A huge portion of our healthcare costs can be traced back to the amount of money healthcare organizations and providers spend on liability and malpractice insurance. My belief is that this is largely due to the numerous frivolous law-suits and settlements that have been awarded by our judicial system. A major reason for this is again related to the idea that personal responsibility for one's health (and a lot of other things) is a fading ideal in this country. While I have no numbers to back this except what my own company pays each year for said insurance, common sense tells me that if limitations were set on lawsuits and settlements and on the financial prizes that attorneys can receive in such cases that our health care costs could be considerably less. I suspect due to the lobbying power of the attorneys in our country this is not a topic that gets much attention from our government or our press. Some things to think about? Thanks for the opportunity to share! Chad Chad W. Yoakam, MS, PT Manager of Rehabilitation Services Livingston HealthCare Orthopedic and Rehabilitation Institute ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Ruesewald Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 8:18 AM To: PTManager Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform It is from the World Health Organization and it is based on factors and weights for these factors. These factors are: Overall Level of Health - WHO used the measure of disability - adjusted life expectancy (this includes homicide rates and accidental death rate) Distribution of Health in the Populations - these were broken down into goodness, best attainable average level of health care, and fairness, smallest feasible differences among individual and groups Responsiveness - which include respect for persons and client orientation - this last includes amenities available Distribution of Financing - which includes the percentage of household income spent on health care This report was done in 2000. There were concerns over the results. Ruesewald Therapy Billing PO Box 880 , Lake Dallas , TX 75065 fax From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Ric Baird Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 7:55 PM To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference please. Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle Suite D Topeka, KS 66618 (785)246-2300 (P) (785)246-2301 (F) Interactive Physical Therapy 1709 SE 29th Street Suite 300-400 Topeka, KS 66605 (785)266-4600 (P) (785)266-4601 (F) www.interactiveptandfitness.com On Aug 12, 2009, at 6:58 PM, Alliance Physical Therapy <alliancept@... <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > wrote: > I think it is very important to consider the whole picture not from a > limited perspective such as the small piece of the puzzle we see as > therapists. > > There seems to be a lot of fear around this issue. We need to assess > what we are afraid of and be self critical. > > Why do we rank 37th in the world for quality of care? Why is > International Hospital in Bangkok Thailand considered one of the best? > And why are some US doctors leaving to work there? > > Why did I see some people I know flying to other countries for their > health care? They come back with stories about how wonderful the care > was and how much cheaper it is for them. These are folks without > insurance and pay cash, so they leave the US for less expensive, > better > quality care. In the opinion of 4 people I've known to do that. > > Why not travel to other countries and see first hand what some others > are doing? My wife and I spent a couple of weeks traveling around BC > Canada touring hospitals and visiting relatives to get an insiders > view > of their health care system. My sister in law is a physiotherapist in > Canada. > > Anyway, it is easy to judge and repeat what we are told by the media > and > folks with an agenda. Where is the unbiased info? > > Wade, PT > OR > > Curtis Marti wrote: > > > > > > Mr. s, > > > > Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to > > considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting > that > > I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. > Clearly, > > my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can > only > > hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to > resubmit > > it. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > -Curtis > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager > %40yahoogroups.com>] On > > Behalf Of s > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM > > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch > this > > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and > families. > > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on > this > > piece. Thank you. > > > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> >> > > > > Sincerely, > > > > E. s, PT, DPT > > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > > www.douglasspt.com > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Good morning everyone! I've been paying attention, with great interest, to the debate surrounding healthcare reform in our country. Things that I don't hear much about but, I feel, are well worth addressing are: 1. Personal responsibility (or the lack thereof) is a major factor in the health of each individual and the health of our country. I've seen statistics from various sources that estimate $1 to $3 of every $4 spent on healthcare in our country is for something that could have been prevented. We, as a nation, are very unhealthy in a number of respects and we have traditionally operated under a " sick care " system. My opinion is that instead of a very small, insignificant amount of money being dedicated to wellness and prevention which our Government is now proposing to be included in the " reform package " , that personal responsibility " reform " be a major topic that receives substantial attention and funding in order to change the mindset of the USA. Also, keep in mind that we are already seeing patient outcomes as a criteria for reimbursement. Very simply a compliant patient (one that takes responsibility in their rehab) nearly always has a better outcome than a non-compliant patient. 2. A huge portion of our healthcare costs can be traced back to the amount of money healthcare organizations and providers spend on liability and malpractice insurance. My belief is that this is largely due to the numerous frivolous law-suits and settlements that have been awarded by our judicial system. A major reason for this is again related to the idea that personal responsibility for one's health (and a lot of other things) is a fading ideal in this country. While I have no numbers to back this except what my own company pays each year for said insurance, common sense tells me that if limitations were set on lawsuits and settlements and on the financial prizes that attorneys can receive in such cases that our health care costs could be considerably less. I suspect due to the lobbying power of the attorneys in our country this is not a topic that gets much attention from our government or our press. Some things to think about? Thanks for the opportunity to share! Chad Chad W. Yoakam, MS, PT Manager of Rehabilitation Services Livingston HealthCare Orthopedic and Rehabilitation Institute ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Ruesewald Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 8:18 AM To: PTManager Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform It is from the World Health Organization and it is based on factors and weights for these factors. These factors are: Overall Level of Health - WHO used the measure of disability - adjusted life expectancy (this includes homicide rates and accidental death rate) Distribution of Health in the Populations - these were broken down into goodness, best attainable average level of health care, and fairness, smallest feasible differences among individual and groups Responsiveness - which include respect for persons and client orientation - this last includes amenities available Distribution of Financing - which includes the percentage of household income spent on health care This report was done in 2000. There were concerns over the results. Ruesewald Therapy Billing PO Box 880 , Lake Dallas , TX 75065 fax From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Ric Baird Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 7:55 PM To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference please. Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle Suite D Topeka, KS 66618 (785)246-2300 (P) (785)246-2301 (F) Interactive Physical Therapy 1709 SE 29th Street Suite 300-400 Topeka, KS 66605 (785)266-4600 (P) (785)266-4601 (F) www.interactiveptandfitness.com On Aug 12, 2009, at 6:58 PM, Alliance Physical Therapy <alliancept@... <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > wrote: > I think it is very important to consider the whole picture not from a > limited perspective such as the small piece of the puzzle we see as > therapists. > > There seems to be a lot of fear around this issue. We need to assess > what we are afraid of and be self critical. > > Why do we rank 37th in the world for quality of care? Why is > International Hospital in Bangkok Thailand considered one of the best? > And why are some US doctors leaving to work there? > > Why did I see some people I know flying to other countries for their > health care? They come back with stories about how wonderful the care > was and how much cheaper it is for them. These are folks without > insurance and pay cash, so they leave the US for less expensive, > better > quality care. In the opinion of 4 people I've known to do that. > > Why not travel to other countries and see first hand what some others > are doing? My wife and I spent a couple of weeks traveling around BC > Canada touring hospitals and visiting relatives to get an insiders > view > of their health care system. My sister in law is a physiotherapist in > Canada. > > Anyway, it is easy to judge and repeat what we are told by the media > and > folks with an agenda. Where is the unbiased info? > > Wade, PT > OR > > Curtis Marti wrote: > > > > > > Mr. s, > > > > Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to > > considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting > that > > I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. > Clearly, > > my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can > only > > hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to > resubmit > > it. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > -Curtis > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager > %40yahoogroups.com>] On > > Behalf Of s > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM > > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch > this > > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and > families. > > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on > this > > piece. Thank you. > > > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> >> > > > > Sincerely, > > > > E. s, PT, DPT > > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > > www.douglasspt.com > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Don't forget that in the U.S. we have our own horror stories of folks getting improper treatment or waiting for hours on end in emergency room waiting rooms and being found dead when someone finally comes to see them.... the much-publicized Los Angeles case where workers ignored a woman writhing in pain on the floor of the ER lobby and then was found dead when she was finally seen comes to mind. Eileen Casey, PT Director of Rehab Services Brattleboro Memorial Hospital 17 Belmont Ave Brattleboro, VT 05301 ecasey@... ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of alex51057@... Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 9:38 AM To: PTManager Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform Hi all, I just wanted to let you know that I have a friend and his father, who own 2 very large companies in Canada. The father of one of the officer's of their company recently broke his hip.? The hospital did not have any beds so they placed him in one of the hallways.? They found him dead 3 days later.? Second issue,? they travel to Canada every week and were in Canada early this spring. The 72 year old president of the company (USA citizen) developed atrial fib.? He went to the emergency room, waited all day. After some preliminary tests, they were told they do not treat his condition if it doesn't last at least 1 week.? He came back to the US, had a major problem, which DID need to be treated. Ivashenko PT DPT OCS CProT Healthcare Reform > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this > piece. Thank you. > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> >> > > Sincerely, > > E. s, PT, DPT > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > www.douglasspt.com > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Eileen, You're exactly right. However, I believe it's important to differentiate the exceptions versus the norms. -Curtis ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Eileen Casey Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 12:59 PM To: PTManager Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform Don't forget that in the U.S. we have our own horror stories of folks getting improper treatment or waiting for hours on end in emergency room waiting rooms and being found dead when someone finally comes to see them.... the much-publicized Los Angeles case where workers ignored a woman writhing in pain on the floor of the ER lobby and then was found dead when she was finally seen comes to mind. Eileen Casey, PT Director of Rehab Services Brattleboro Memorial Hospital 17 Belmont Ave Brattleboro, VT 05301 ecasey@... <mailto:ecasey%40bmhvt.org> <mailto:ecasey@... <mailto:ecasey%40bmhvt.org> > ________________________________ From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of alex51057@... <mailto:alex51057%40aol.com> Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 9:38 AM To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform Hi all, I just wanted to let you know that I have a friend and his father, who own 2 very large companies in Canada. The father of one of the officer's of their company recently broke his hip.? The hospital did not have any beds so they placed him in one of the hallways.? They found him dead 3 days later.? Second issue,? they travel to Canada every week and were in Canada early this spring. The 72 year old president of the company (USA citizen) developed atrial fib.? He went to the emergency room, waited all day. After some preliminary tests, they were told they do not treat his condition if it doesn't last at least 1 week.? He came back to the US, had a major problem, which DID need to be treated. Ivashenko PT DPT OCS CProT Healthcare Reform > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this > piece. Thank you. > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > >> > > Sincerely, > > E. s, PT, DPT > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > www.douglasspt.com > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Eileen, You're exactly right. However, I believe it's important to differentiate the exceptions versus the norms. -Curtis ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Eileen Casey Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 12:59 PM To: PTManager Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform Don't forget that in the U.S. we have our own horror stories of folks getting improper treatment or waiting for hours on end in emergency room waiting rooms and being found dead when someone finally comes to see them.... the much-publicized Los Angeles case where workers ignored a woman writhing in pain on the floor of the ER lobby and then was found dead when she was finally seen comes to mind. Eileen Casey, PT Director of Rehab Services Brattleboro Memorial Hospital 17 Belmont Ave Brattleboro, VT 05301 ecasey@... <mailto:ecasey%40bmhvt.org> <mailto:ecasey@... <mailto:ecasey%40bmhvt.org> > ________________________________ From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of alex51057@... <mailto:alex51057%40aol.com> Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 9:38 AM To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform Hi all, I just wanted to let you know that I have a friend and his father, who own 2 very large companies in Canada. The father of one of the officer's of their company recently broke his hip.? The hospital did not have any beds so they placed him in one of the hallways.? They found him dead 3 days later.? Second issue,? they travel to Canada every week and were in Canada early this spring. The 72 year old president of the company (USA citizen) developed atrial fib.? He went to the emergency room, waited all day. After some preliminary tests, they were told they do not treat his condition if it doesn't last at least 1 week.? He came back to the US, had a major problem, which DID need to be treated. Ivashenko PT DPT OCS CProT Healthcare Reform > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this > piece. Thank you. > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > >> > > Sincerely, > > E. s, PT, DPT > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > www.douglasspt.com > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 You make a good point about the frivolous lawsuits. I heard an interview with 2 investigative journalists 4 or 5 years ago who wrote a book called " Critical Condition: How Health Care in America Became Big Business--and Bad Medicine " . While I intended to get the book and read it, I never did. However they covered all areas including the frivolous lawsuits. We also must ask why is it bad doctors continue to practice despite multiple lawsuits over the years? I'm sure many in this group know of examples. I know of a surgeon that I was warned about by the PT's when I started a new job at a hospital 7 years ago. They talked about the poor outcomes of his patients and the ongoing lawsuits. He is still doing back surgeries and was out one day a couple weeks ago for a deposition. If he is not good at it why does the medical board allow him to continue doing these surgeries? He just keeps getting sued and keeps paying higher and higher malpractice insurance. Maybe we need to have a system where ongoing problems like this are addressed, maybe he is in the wrong part of medicine and would do better as a PCP, physiatrist or internal medicine? So I see 2 issues with the lawsuits, the frivolous ones and the justified ones where we need to remove the MD from that form of practice. No one seems to compare with Sweden, France, Germany, Norway... etc... I would also like to see people get away from the comparisons to England and Canada. We are not going to adopt their system so it is an erroneous comparison. It is interesting how popular " medical tourism " has become. There are more folks leaving the US to get health care in other countries, but not very many coming from other countries to the US. In 2007 about 750,000 Americans traveled overseas for their health care. 65,000 Americans went to International Hospital in Thailand in that 1 year out of the 430,000 international patients they get every year. So another interesting point is what happens if all Americans get access to affordable health care? These hospitals in other countries may suffer from the loss of revenue. It is good to have a philosophical debate and try to see all sides of an issue. I remember when I took anthropology and read about the Nacirema tribe. They seemed like a very unusual tribe of people until I realized it was American written backwards and I was reading about our culture from a different perspective Many debates are surrounded by emotions and there is a lot of hatred out there in this debate. Emotions tend to block us from seeing clearly and make us biased. Anyway, here is an interesting quote I've heard many times in the past: " Americans can always be counted on to do the right thing, after exhausting all other options. " - Winston Churchill Hopefully we can do the right thing, whatever form that may take, without going through the process of " exhausting all other options " . Wade, PT Oregon Chad Yoakam wrote: > > > Good morning everyone! > > I've been paying attention, with great interest, to the debate > surrounding healthcare reform in our country. Things that I don't hear > much about but, I feel, are well worth addressing are: > > 1. Personal responsibility (or the lack thereof) is a major factor in > the health of each individual and the health of our country. I've seen > statistics from various sources that estimate $1 to $3 of every $4 spent > on healthcare in our country is for something that could have been > prevented. We, as a nation, are very unhealthy in a number of respects > and we have traditionally operated under a " sick care " system. My > opinion is that instead of a very small, insignificant amount of money > being dedicated to wellness and prevention which our Government is now > proposing to be included in the " reform package " , that personal > responsibility " reform " be a major topic that receives substantial > attention and funding in order to change the mindset of the USA. Also, > keep in mind that we are already seeing patient outcomes as a criteria > for reimbursement. Very simply a compliant patient (one that takes > responsibility in their rehab) nearly always has a better outcome than a > non-compliant patient. > > 2. A huge portion of our healthcare costs can be traced back to the > amount of money healthcare organizations and providers spend on > liability and malpractice insurance. My belief is that this is largely > due to the numerous frivolous law-suits and settlements that have been > awarded by our judicial system. A major reason for this is again > related to the idea that personal responsibility for one's health (and a > lot of other things) is a fading ideal in this country. While I have no > numbers to back this except what my own company pays each year for said > insurance, common sense tells me that if limitations were set on > lawsuits and settlements and on the financial prizes that attorneys can > receive in such cases that our health care costs could be considerably > less. I suspect due to the lobbying power of the attorneys in our > country this is not a topic that gets much attention from our government > or our press. > > Some things to think about? Thanks for the opportunity to share! > > Chad > > Chad W. Yoakam, MS, PT > > Manager of Rehabilitation Services > > Livingston HealthCare Orthopedic and Rehabilitation Institute > > ________________________________ > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com>] On > Behalf Of Ruesewald > Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 8:18 AM > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform > > It is from the World Health Organization and it is based on factors and > weights for these factors. > > These factors are: > > Overall Level of Health - WHO used the measure of disability - adjusted > life > expectancy (this includes homicide rates and accidental death rate) > > Distribution of Health in the Populations - these were broken down into > goodness, best attainable average level of health care, and fairness, > smallest feasible differences among individual and groups > > Responsiveness - which include respect for persons and client > orientation - > this last includes amenities available > > Distribution of Financing - which includes the percentage of household > income spent on health care > > This report was done in 2000. There were concerns over the results. > > Ruesewald > > Therapy Billing > > PO Box 880 , Lake Dallas , TX 75065 > > fax > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> ] > On Behalf > Of Ric Baird > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 7:55 PM > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform > > Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference > please. > > Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC > Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness > 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle > Suite D > Topeka, KS 66618 > (785)246-2300 (P) > (785)246-2301 (F) > > Interactive Physical Therapy > 1709 SE 29th Street > Suite 300-400 > Topeka, KS 66605 > (785)266-4600 (P) > (785)266-4601 (F) > > www.interactiveptandfitness.com > > On Aug 12, 2009, at 6:58 PM, Alliance Physical Therapy > <alliancept@... <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > > wrote: > > > I think it is very important to consider the whole picture not from a > > limited perspective such as the small piece of the puzzle we see as > > therapists. > > > > There seems to be a lot of fear around this issue. We need to assess > > what we are afraid of and be self critical. > > > > Why do we rank 37th in the world for quality of care? Why is > > International Hospital in Bangkok Thailand considered one of the best? > > And why are some US doctors leaving to work there? > > > > Why did I see some people I know flying to other countries for their > > health care? They come back with stories about how wonderful the care > > was and how much cheaper it is for them. These are folks without > > insurance and pay cash, so they leave the US for less expensive, > > better > > quality care. In the opinion of 4 people I've known to do that. > > > > Why not travel to other countries and see first hand what some others > > are doing? My wife and I spent a couple of weeks traveling around BC > > Canada touring hospitals and visiting relatives to get an insiders > > view > > of their health care system. My sister in law is a physiotherapist in > > Canada. > > > > Anyway, it is easy to judge and repeat what we are told by the media > > and > > folks with an agenda. Where is the unbiased info? > > > > Wade, PT > > OR > > > > Curtis Marti wrote: > > > > > > > > > Mr. s, > > > > > > Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to > > > considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting > > that > > > I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. > > Clearly, > > > my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can > > only > > > hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to > > resubmit > > > it. > > > > > > Thanks again, > > > > > > -Curtis > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > > > From: PTManager > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager > > %40yahoogroups.com>] On > > > Behalf Of s > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM > > > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > > > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > > > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > > > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch > > this > > > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and > > families. > > > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > > > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on > > this > > > piece. Thank you. > > > > > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> >> > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > E. s, PT, DPT > > > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > > > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > > > www.douglasspt.com > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Exactly. I can probably find at least 2 horror stories for every 1 horror story about the English or Canadian systems. Still no one ever mentions, any other country such as many of the European countries, why is that? All I hear is how so many people are suffering in Canada. My relatives in Canada seem to enjoy their life there. My sister in law is a physio and loves their health care system. Why does Canada have a lower infant mortality rate, why does Canada have less obesity, why do Canadians live longer? We need to stop comparing and using scare tactics. We are not adopting their systems, why try to scare people. Wade, PT OR Eileen Casey wrote: > > > Don't forget that in the U.S. we have our own horror stories of folks > getting improper treatment or waiting for hours on end in emergency room > waiting rooms and being found dead when someone finally comes to see > them.... the much-publicized Los Angeles case where workers ignored a > woman writhing in pain on the floor of the ER lobby and then was found > dead when she was finally seen comes to mind. > > Eileen Casey, PT > > Director of Rehab Services > > Brattleboro Memorial Hospital > > 17 Belmont Ave > > Brattleboro, VT 05301 > > > > ecasey@... <mailto:ecasey%40bmhvt.org> <mailto:ecasey@... > <mailto:ecasey%40bmhvt.org>> > > ________________________________ > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com>] On > Behalf Of alex51057@... <mailto:alex51057%40aol.com> > Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 9:38 AM > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform > > Hi all, > > I just wanted to let you know that I have a friend and his father, who > own 2 very large companies in Canada. The father of one of the officer's > of their company recently broke his hip.? The hospital did not have any > beds so they placed him in one of the hallways.? They found him dead 3 > days later.? > > Second issue,? they travel to Canada every week and were in Canada early > this spring. The 72 year old president of the company (USA citizen) > developed atrial fib.? He went to the emergency room, waited all day. > After some preliminary tests, they were told they do not treat his > condition if it doesn't last at least 1 week.? He came back to the US, > had a major problem, which DID need to be treated. > > Ivashenko PT DPT OCS CProT > > Healthcare Reform > > > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > > > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > > > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > > > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch > this > > > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and > families. > > > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > > > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this > > > piece. Thank you. > > > > > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html>> >> > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > E. s, PT, DPT > > > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > > > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > > > www.douglasspt.com > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Rick et al - In Europe, royalty and Parliaments ruled, asserting that only they could confer rights -- which they could also withdraw if they could get more votes or property doing so. Elite oligarchies or families could dictate what was done with one's resources, possessions, flocks, or even children. That was not tolerable to hearts yearning for liberty. Our nation was founded to be different from those others. Returning to basics, our Founders established a Constitution which recognized that a strong central government easily becomes a tryanny. Power is just too tempting, as we have well seen. Every culture in history which has concentrated massive central power in the hands of a few has declined, whereas our intentional non-European experiment, enhancing the liberties of the individual citizens, flourished. We need to preserve our liberties from further devolving into the hands of elitists and " statists " . Please understand that I am not speaking for or against either the Republicans or Democrats, but about Freedom; neither right nor left, but liberty. I'm speaking on behalf of free men and free women, who exercise liberty in making their own decisions about issues in their own operating environment. The Declaration of Independence (which was written before either the Articles of Confederation or the Constitution) says: " We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed... " Let's review that again: Governments are instituted to secure the God-given rights of mankind which were recognized before the discovery of America. To *secure the rights of the individuals*. So, I have to ask, What is a primary job of government, other than to assure that the citizens get to exercise their liberties? Please don't get me wrong. A lot of people need a better healthcare insurance plan; Charitable acts are good and noble; Being humanitarian is a good thing. But disproportionately taking resources from one class of citizens to provide goods or services for another group or class is not a legitimate role of our government. Healthcare is not the job of government: Defending the shores is. Delivering the mail is (maybe.) and Expanding peoples liberties, staying out of their business is the job of government. Some of the public discourse reminds me of a manipulative addicted patient who talks and talks and talks but never complies with their rehab program. They continuously create crisis after crisis, diversion after diversion, and then get upset when their therapist gets back to measuring degrees of ROM, repetitions of difficult exercises, and distance walked. This therapist is looking back at the original documents, bypassing the clamor, and asking: " 1) Defending the borders, 2) delivering the mail, and 3) ensuring our individual liberties: How's that working for you? " Respectfully, Dick Hillyer, DPT W. Hillyer,PT,DPT,MBA,MSM Lee Therapist Group, LLC Hillyer Consulting Cape Coral, FL 33914 _____ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of s Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 1:09 PM To: PTManager Subject: Healthcare Reform Hello all, hope this finds you well, I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this piece. Thank you. http://www.pbs. <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html Sincerely, E. s, PT, DPT Orthopedic Clinical Specialist Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists www.douglasspt.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 This situation is one that I think most aware individuals in our profession have recognized for years. Notice that one of the executives testifying was Rich of Golden Rule. Ever read the reviews of his company by policy holders? They are almost universally TERRIBLE! Trying to get legitimately owed reimbursement from them is like trying to get blood out of a rock. Do think Golden Rule is actually going to forced to change its abhorrent policies? Their abuses have been known for years but nothing of substance has ever been done to stop them. Notice that the Congressman questioning them is Bart Stupak of Michigan. Guess who his largest campaign contributor is? Blue Cross Blue Shield! Do you think he's going to bite the hand that feeds him? Quite frankly, even if your patients, friends, and families call or write their Congressmen, their representatives in Congress, for the most part, really don't care. They are bought and paid for and no longer represent you. They act entirely in their own self interest. They represent the highest bidder. When the mail against the bail-outs for banks and other Wall Street entities ran 100:1 against, these Congressmen still voted against their constituents' wishes and voted for the bail-outs. You no longer live in a democratic republic ... you live in an executive socialistic plutocracy. This man explains the situation as candidly as anyone I've come across. Remember, as far as they (meaning the political ruling and the ultra-wealthy elite) are concerned, it's ALWAYS about the money. And if you think you have an alternative by voting in a Republican when the incumbent is a Democrat or vice versa, think again. In this past election, the Rockefellers supported Obama and the Rothschilds supported McCain. Heads they win, tails you lose. Read the Banker's Manifesto of 1893 to understand these international bankers' strategy. http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread412260/pg1 The last paragraph is particularly noteworthy. A parallel situation is present in the healthcare reform debate. The present system is seriously flawed. The proposed system is seriously flawed. But a debate raging between the supporters of each takes the focus off the fact that both will ride on the backs of the middle class. Again, heads they win, tails you lose. If you notice though, the healthcare debate has taken attention off the financial crisis and who is responsible for it ... just as intended. The money being drained from us all by just the Federal Reserve far exceeds the costs of health care but for same strange reason, reform suddenly has to be pushed through right now. How do we change the system? Good question. Here're a few ideas to start: Organize a 10+ million man/woman march on Washington DC to demand change ... REAL change, starting with auditing and hopefully dissolving the Federal Reserve system, auditing the gold reserves in Fort Knox (which most likely are a mere fraction of what's claimed to be there), establishing government oversight of organizations such as the DTCC, dissolving secret Treasury Department organizations such as the Exchange Stabilization Fund which manipulate markets, enforcing the illegality of naked short selling of gold by government backed bullion banks, and proceeding from there. Push for prosecution of every last bankster, brokerage house executive, hedge fund manager, mortgage company executive, etc. responsible for this present financial crisis (including such individuals as Hank son who was behind the Goldman Sachs engineering of this bubble and received a $30,000,000 windfall profit from selling his stock holdings free of capital gains tax to comply with laws to avoid conflict-of-interest when taking public office) and push for RESTITUTION of funds to the American people. Organize, mobilize support for, and field a viable third party to oust virtually ALL incumbent bought-and-paid-for politicians on federal and state levels and replace them with true representatives of the people. Compile an accurate list of the involved oligarchy so that, when the appropriate time comes, groups of concerned citizens can approach their personal residences, respectfully request their presence, and politely ask that they return the funds they " borrowed " , with interest. Turn off your TVs. In doing so, you withdraw your support from Wall Street and stop polluting your mind with the drivel they want you to focus on. Sell off any investments that support Wall Street. With high frequency trading and other forms of front end trading, the market is not free, fair, and open. When companies such as Goldman Sachs have 46 separate trading days of gains of more than $100 million in the last quarter (a virtual impossibility in any manner except one in which cheating is involved), you know without a shadow of a doubt that the market is rigged. Sit down, relax, and watch a couple of fanciful movies to ease the seriousness of this all. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TLD3Z6sJWA , PT, OCS Marquette, MI Healthcare Reform Hello all, hope this finds you well, I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this piece. Thank you. http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html Sincerely, E. s, PT, DPT Orthopedic Clinical Specialist Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists www.douglasspt.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 This situation is one that I think most aware individuals in our profession have recognized for years. Notice that one of the executives testifying was Rich of Golden Rule. Ever read the reviews of his company by policy holders? They are almost universally TERRIBLE! Trying to get legitimately owed reimbursement from them is like trying to get blood out of a rock. Do think Golden Rule is actually going to forced to change its abhorrent policies? Their abuses have been known for years but nothing of substance has ever been done to stop them. Notice that the Congressman questioning them is Bart Stupak of Michigan. Guess who his largest campaign contributor is? Blue Cross Blue Shield! Do you think he's going to bite the hand that feeds him? Quite frankly, even if your patients, friends, and families call or write their Congressmen, their representatives in Congress, for the most part, really don't care. They are bought and paid for and no longer represent you. They act entirely in their own self interest. They represent the highest bidder. When the mail against the bail-outs for banks and other Wall Street entities ran 100:1 against, these Congressmen still voted against their constituents' wishes and voted for the bail-outs. You no longer live in a democratic republic ... you live in an executive socialistic plutocracy. This man explains the situation as candidly as anyone I've come across. Remember, as far as they (meaning the political ruling and the ultra-wealthy elite) are concerned, it's ALWAYS about the money. And if you think you have an alternative by voting in a Republican when the incumbent is a Democrat or vice versa, think again. In this past election, the Rockefellers supported Obama and the Rothschilds supported McCain. Heads they win, tails you lose. Read the Banker's Manifesto of 1893 to understand these international bankers' strategy. http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread412260/pg1 The last paragraph is particularly noteworthy. A parallel situation is present in the healthcare reform debate. The present system is seriously flawed. The proposed system is seriously flawed. But a debate raging between the supporters of each takes the focus off the fact that both will ride on the backs of the middle class. Again, heads they win, tails you lose. If you notice though, the healthcare debate has taken attention off the financial crisis and who is responsible for it ... just as intended. The money being drained from us all by just the Federal Reserve far exceeds the costs of health care but for same strange reason, reform suddenly has to be pushed through right now. How do we change the system? Good question. Here're a few ideas to start: Organize a 10+ million man/woman march on Washington DC to demand change ... REAL change, starting with auditing and hopefully dissolving the Federal Reserve system, auditing the gold reserves in Fort Knox (which most likely are a mere fraction of what's claimed to be there), establishing government oversight of organizations such as the DTCC, dissolving secret Treasury Department organizations such as the Exchange Stabilization Fund which manipulate markets, enforcing the illegality of naked short selling of gold by government backed bullion banks, and proceeding from there. Push for prosecution of every last bankster, brokerage house executive, hedge fund manager, mortgage company executive, etc. responsible for this present financial crisis (including such individuals as Hank son who was behind the Goldman Sachs engineering of this bubble and received a $30,000,000 windfall profit from selling his stock holdings free of capital gains tax to comply with laws to avoid conflict-of-interest when taking public office) and push for RESTITUTION of funds to the American people. Organize, mobilize support for, and field a viable third party to oust virtually ALL incumbent bought-and-paid-for politicians on federal and state levels and replace them with true representatives of the people. Compile an accurate list of the involved oligarchy so that, when the appropriate time comes, groups of concerned citizens can approach their personal residences, respectfully request their presence, and politely ask that they return the funds they " borrowed " , with interest. Turn off your TVs. In doing so, you withdraw your support from Wall Street and stop polluting your mind with the drivel they want you to focus on. Sell off any investments that support Wall Street. With high frequency trading and other forms of front end trading, the market is not free, fair, and open. When companies such as Goldman Sachs have 46 separate trading days of gains of more than $100 million in the last quarter (a virtual impossibility in any manner except one in which cheating is involved), you know without a shadow of a doubt that the market is rigged. Sit down, relax, and watch a couple of fanciful movies to ease the seriousness of this all. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TLD3Z6sJWA , PT, OCS Marquette, MI Healthcare Reform Hello all, hope this finds you well, I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this piece. Thank you. http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html Sincerely, E. s, PT, DPT Orthopedic Clinical Specialist Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists www.douglasspt.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Dick, The US Constitution, in it's preamble, states " We the People....in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare,... " and Article 1, Section 8: " The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States... " So I would propose that in order to promote the general welfare of it's citizens, one might stretch to the conclusion that providing health care services to all it's citizens just might promote their general welfare. And in order to from a more perfect health care system, that periodic reform might be necessary. And the Constitution provides for our government the ability to levy taxes to pay for such benefits. Both sides of this debate will continue to exert their beliefs, and unfortunately few will be persuaded to change their stance. Will we ever see meaningful Health Care Reform? Or will we recreate the inequities that previous abbreviated attempts have delivered? How many posts have been made to this listserve over the past few years complaining about therapy caps, coding inequities, denials of service, patients failing to show when their insurance runs out, etc? Would anyone disagree that our current Health Care System is less than perfect? Why can't we as a nation focus on trying to form that perfect health care system, that would adress the general welfare of it's citizens? Debate yes, but work constructively to evolve our current dysfunctional system into a better one. Not sure if our founding fathers put them in order of priority or not, but in Article 1, Section 8 of the US Constitution, the bullet point about " general welfare " is first while " establish post offices " is seventh. Defining general welfare is left more up to interpretation than post offices though. go figure. W. , PT, MS Grosse Pointe Woods, MI PTA Program Chair, Baker College of Park Therapeutics Chair, Michigan Board of Physical Therapy david.perry@... " And in the end it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years. " Abraham Lincoln " A person who never made a mistake never tried anything new. " Albert Einstein ________________________________ To: PTManager Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 7:25:08 PM Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform Rick et al - In Europe, royalty and Parliaments ruled, asserting that only they could confer rights -- which they could also withdraw if they could get more votes or property doing so. Elite oligarchies or families could dictate what was done with one's resources, possessions, flocks, or even children. That was not tolerable to hearts yearning for liberty. Our nation was founded to be different from those others. Returning to basics, our Founders established a Constitution which recognized that a strong central government easily becomes a tryanny. Power is just too tempting, as we have well seen. Every culture in history which has concentrated massive central power in the hands of a few has declined, whereas our intentional non-European experiment, enhancing the liberties of the individual citizens, flourished. We need to preserve our liberties from further devolving into the hands of elitists and " statists " . Please understand that I am not speaking for or against either the Republicans or Democrats, but about Freedom; neither right nor left, but liberty. I'm speaking on behalf of free men and free women, who exercise liberty in making their own decisions about issues in their own operating environment. The Declaration of Independence (which was written before either the Articles of Confederation or the Constitution) says: " We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed... " Let's review that again: Governments are instituted to secure the God-given rights of mankind which were recognized before the discovery of America. To *secure the rights of the individuals* . So, I have to ask, What is a primary job of government, other than to assure that the citizens get to exercise their liberties? Please don't get me wrong. A lot of people need a better healthcare insurance plan; Charitable acts are good and noble; Being humanitarian is a good thing. But disproportionately taking resources from one class of citizens to provide goods or services for another group or class is not a legitimate role of our government. Healthcare is not the job of government: Defending the shores is. Delivering the mail is (maybe.) and Expanding peoples liberties, staying out of their business is the job of government. Some of the public discourse reminds me of a manipulative addicted patient who talks and talks and talks but never complies with their rehab program. They continuously create crisis after crisis, diversion after diversion, and then get upset when their therapist gets back to measuring degrees of ROM, repetitions of difficult exercises, and distance walked. This therapist is looking back at the original documents, bypassing the clamor, and asking: " 1) Defending the borders, 2) delivering the mail, and 3) ensuring our individual liberties: How's that working for you? " Respectfully, Dick Hillyer, DPT W. Hillyer,PT,DPT, MBA,MSM Lee Therapist Group, LLC Hillyer Consulting Cape Coral, FL 33914 _____ From: PTManager@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:PTManager@yahoogrou ps.com] On Behalf Of s Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 1:09 PM To: PTManager@yahoogrou ps.com Subject: Healthcare Reform Hello all, hope this finds you well, I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on this piece. Thank you. http://www.pbs. <http://www.pbs. org/moyers/ journal/07312009 /watch.html> org/moyers/journal/ 07312009/ watch.html Sincerely, E. s, PT, DPT Orthopedic Clinical Specialist Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists www.douglasspt. com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Ric, I Googled " America's Health Care Rank " and this World Health Organization article was the first one listed ==> http://www.who.int/whr/2000/media_centre/press_release/en/index.html. This WHO article cites the 37th ranking but it is not an article bashing the U.S. as it illustrates issues in other countries as well. I have seen the 37th rank and others in that neighborhood in many journals and articles over the past few years but I don't have them readily available. -- Mark Dwyer, PT, MHA Director of Rehabilitation Services Olathe Medical Center Olathe, Kansas markdwyer87@... Re: Healthcare Reform <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PTManager/message/46880;_ylc=X3oDMTJybDJoMWVoBF9T\ Azk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzExMDA3ODEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYxMzQ3BG1zZ0lkAzQ2ODgwBHNlYwNk\ bXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyNTAxNzI3Nzg-> Posted by: " Ric Baird " RBaird5957@... <mailto:RBaird5957@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Healthcare%20Reform> Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:10 am (PDT) Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference please. Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle Suite D Topeka, KS 66618 (785)246-2300 (P) (785)246-2301 (F) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2009 Report Share Posted August 13, 2009 Ric, I Googled " America's Health Care Rank " and this World Health Organization article was the first one listed ==> http://www.who.int/whr/2000/media_centre/press_release/en/index.html. This WHO article cites the 37th ranking but it is not an article bashing the U.S. as it illustrates issues in other countries as well. I have seen the 37th rank and others in that neighborhood in many journals and articles over the past few years but I don't have them readily available. -- Mark Dwyer, PT, MHA Director of Rehabilitation Services Olathe Medical Center Olathe, Kansas markdwyer87@... Re: Healthcare Reform <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PTManager/message/46880;_ylc=X3oDMTJybDJoMWVoBF9T\ Azk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzExMDA3ODEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYxMzQ3BG1zZ0lkAzQ2ODgwBHNlYwNk\ bXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyNTAxNzI3Nzg-> Posted by: " Ric Baird " RBaird5957@... <mailto:RBaird5957@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Healthcare%20Reform> Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:10 am (PDT) Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference please. Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle Suite D Topeka, KS 66618 (785)246-2300 (P) (785)246-2301 (F) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 I personally believe ONE of the roles of government is to see to the well being of ALL its citizens. The current economic conditions exemplify the effect of laissez-faire policies. The health care debate is about how to make the current system better, lowering costs and giving everyone a reasonable option for quality health insurance. I just don't understand all the " noise " about socialism and patriotism. These noisemakers need to engage in civil discourse to help make life better for ALL Americans. -- Cleve J., PT Change what you cannot accept. The less you know, the more you believe. Bono " Common sense is not so common. " -- Voltaire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 I personally believe ONE of the roles of government is to see to the well being of ALL its citizens. The current economic conditions exemplify the effect of laissez-faire policies. The health care debate is about how to make the current system better, lowering costs and giving everyone a reasonable option for quality health insurance. I just don't understand all the " noise " about socialism and patriotism. These noisemakers need to engage in civil discourse to help make life better for ALL Americans. -- Cleve J., PT Change what you cannot accept. The less you know, the more you believe. Bono " Common sense is not so common. " -- Voltaire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Dick, I appreciate the conversation, you know I always value your insight and input. As amazing a document as the Declaration of Independence is and was it is not without it's flaws and inconsistencies. Take, for example, the line " all men are created equal " , sounds great, but, in 1776, the definition of " all men " was quite narrow and included only heterosexual, white males, mostly of English descent, it certainly did not include blacks, American Indians, or females of any race. It has taken centuries of struggle and yes, government intervention, in the form of amendments to that great constitution to ensure ALL men (and women) are treated as equals and many would argue that we are still a long way from achieving true equality. Given your position on the limited role government should play in our lives, and I agree with you on this issue in many aspects, I would value your opinion on the Medicare program. Do you feel Medicare has been successful in providing health care options for the seniors of this country or do you feel we would all be better off, and the system would work better, if those over 65 were forced to fend for themselves in the open market when purchasing health care insurance? Thanks again, Dick, and the rest of the posters here, for the debate. E. s, PT, DPT Orthopedic Clinical Specialist Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists www.douglasspt.com > > Rick et al - > > In Europe, royalty and Parliaments ruled, asserting that only they could > confer rights -- which they could also withdraw if they could get more votes > or property doing so. Elite oligarchies or families could dictate what was > done with one's resources, possessions, flocks, or even children. That was > not tolerable to hearts yearning for liberty. Our nation was founded to be > different from those others. > > Returning to basics, our Founders established a Constitution which > recognized that a strong central government easily becomes a tryanny. Power > is just too tempting, as we have well seen. Every culture in history which > has concentrated massive central power in the hands of a few has declined, > whereas our intentional non-European experiment, enhancing the liberties of > the individual citizens, flourished. We need to preserve our liberties from > further devolving into the hands of elitists and " statists " . > > Please understand that I am not speaking for or against either the > Republicans or Democrats, but about Freedom; neither right nor left, but > liberty. I'm speaking on behalf of free men and free women, who exercise > liberty in making their own decisions about issues in their own operating > environment. > > The Declaration of Independence (which was written before either the > Articles of Confederation or the Constitution) says: " We hold these truths > to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by > their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, > Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, > Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the > consent of the governed... " > > Let's review that again: Governments are instituted to secure the God-given > rights of mankind which were recognized before the discovery of America. To > *secure the rights of the individuals*. So, I have to ask, What is a > primary job of government, other than to assure that the citizens get to > exercise their liberties? > > Please don't get me wrong. A lot of people need a better healthcare > insurance plan; Charitable acts are good and noble; Being humanitarian is > a good thing. But disproportionately taking resources from one class of > citizens to provide goods or services for another group or class is not a > legitimate role of our government. > > Healthcare is not the job of government: Defending the shores is. > Delivering the mail is (maybe.) and Expanding peoples liberties, staying out > of their business is the job of government. Some of the public discourse > reminds me of a manipulative addicted patient who talks and talks and talks > but never complies with their rehab program. They continuously create > crisis after crisis, diversion after diversion, and then get upset when > their therapist gets back to measuring degrees of ROM, repetitions of > difficult exercises, and distance walked. > > This therapist is looking back at the original documents, bypassing the > clamor, and asking: > " 1) Defending the borders, 2) delivering the mail, and 3) ensuring our > individual liberties: How's that working for you? " > > Respectfully, > Dick Hillyer, DPT > > > > > W. Hillyer,PT,DPT,MBA,MSM > Lee Therapist Group, LLC > Hillyer Consulting > Cape Coral, FL 33914 > > > > > > _____ > > From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf > Of s > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 1:09 PM > To: PTManager > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the outcome > of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this interview > and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. It is far > time that we rescue health care from the grips of the insurance industry. I > am very interested to hear your opinions on this piece. Thank you. > > http://www.pbs. <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > > Sincerely, > > E. s, PT, DPT > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > www.douglasspt.com > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Dick, I appreciate the conversation, you know I always value your insight and input. As amazing a document as the Declaration of Independence is and was it is not without it's flaws and inconsistencies. Take, for example, the line " all men are created equal " , sounds great, but, in 1776, the definition of " all men " was quite narrow and included only heterosexual, white males, mostly of English descent, it certainly did not include blacks, American Indians, or females of any race. It has taken centuries of struggle and yes, government intervention, in the form of amendments to that great constitution to ensure ALL men (and women) are treated as equals and many would argue that we are still a long way from achieving true equality. Given your position on the limited role government should play in our lives, and I agree with you on this issue in many aspects, I would value your opinion on the Medicare program. Do you feel Medicare has been successful in providing health care options for the seniors of this country or do you feel we would all be better off, and the system would work better, if those over 65 were forced to fend for themselves in the open market when purchasing health care insurance? Thanks again, Dick, and the rest of the posters here, for the debate. E. s, PT, DPT Orthopedic Clinical Specialist Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists www.douglasspt.com > > Rick et al - > > In Europe, royalty and Parliaments ruled, asserting that only they could > confer rights -- which they could also withdraw if they could get more votes > or property doing so. Elite oligarchies or families could dictate what was > done with one's resources, possessions, flocks, or even children. That was > not tolerable to hearts yearning for liberty. Our nation was founded to be > different from those others. > > Returning to basics, our Founders established a Constitution which > recognized that a strong central government easily becomes a tryanny. Power > is just too tempting, as we have well seen. Every culture in history which > has concentrated massive central power in the hands of a few has declined, > whereas our intentional non-European experiment, enhancing the liberties of > the individual citizens, flourished. We need to preserve our liberties from > further devolving into the hands of elitists and " statists " . > > Please understand that I am not speaking for or against either the > Republicans or Democrats, but about Freedom; neither right nor left, but > liberty. I'm speaking on behalf of free men and free women, who exercise > liberty in making their own decisions about issues in their own operating > environment. > > The Declaration of Independence (which was written before either the > Articles of Confederation or the Constitution) says: " We hold these truths > to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by > their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, > Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. - That to secure these rights, > Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the > consent of the governed... " > > Let's review that again: Governments are instituted to secure the God-given > rights of mankind which were recognized before the discovery of America. To > *secure the rights of the individuals*. So, I have to ask, What is a > primary job of government, other than to assure that the citizens get to > exercise their liberties? > > Please don't get me wrong. A lot of people need a better healthcare > insurance plan; Charitable acts are good and noble; Being humanitarian is > a good thing. But disproportionately taking resources from one class of > citizens to provide goods or services for another group or class is not a > legitimate role of our government. > > Healthcare is not the job of government: Defending the shores is. > Delivering the mail is (maybe.) and Expanding peoples liberties, staying out > of their business is the job of government. Some of the public discourse > reminds me of a manipulative addicted patient who talks and talks and talks > but never complies with their rehab program. They continuously create > crisis after crisis, diversion after diversion, and then get upset when > their therapist gets back to measuring degrees of ROM, repetitions of > difficult exercises, and distance walked. > > This therapist is looking back at the original documents, bypassing the > clamor, and asking: > " 1) Defending the borders, 2) delivering the mail, and 3) ensuring our > individual liberties: How's that working for you? " > > Respectfully, > Dick Hillyer, DPT > > > > > W. Hillyer,PT,DPT,MBA,MSM > Lee Therapist Group, LLC > Hillyer Consulting > Cape Coral, FL 33914 > > > > > > _____ > > From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf > Of s > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 1:09 PM > To: PTManager > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the outcome > of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch this interview > and to then forward it to your patients, friends and families. It is far > time that we rescue health care from the grips of the insurance industry. I > am very interested to hear your opinions on this piece. Thank you. > > http://www.pbs. <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html > > Sincerely, > > E. s, PT, DPT > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > www.douglasspt.com > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Wade, I think that the need for eliminating frivolous lawsuits is something that most people on both sides of this issue can agree upon. On another note, you wrote, " In 2007 about 750,000 Americans traveled overseas for their health care. 65,000 Americans went to International Hospital in Thailand in that 1 year out of the 430,000 international patients they get every year. " While I'm not certain of the total numbers of admissions, I can say that Thailand is a main hub of missionary work that serves as a springboard to all of the surrounding countries where Christians are often persecuted (Myanmar, Loas, Cambodia, etc). The Americans that receive healthcare at the International Hospital are often American citizens who are taking up residence in Thailand versus traveling there specifically for their healthcare needs. Just like many other areas of the world, you can get great healthcare at the International Hospital of Thailand, if you have the money to do so. It just so happens that the standard of living in Thailand is so much less expensive than the USA that comparatively, it is much more affordable. The way that we resolve the expense of our healthcare system is healthy competition, deregulation, and tort reform. Keeping the government out, will allow for the free market to drive improved efficiencies, drive down costs, and make the best healthcare in the world more accessible to those who need it. Thanks, Curtis ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of Alliance Physical Therapy Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 1:44 PM To: PTManager Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform You make a good point about the frivolous lawsuits. I heard an interview with 2 investigative journalists 4 or 5 years ago who wrote a book called " Critical Condition: How Health Care in America Became Big Business--and Bad Medicine " . While I intended to get the book and read it, I never did. However they covered all areas including the frivolous lawsuits. We also must ask why is it bad doctors continue to practice despite multiple lawsuits over the years? I'm sure many in this group know of examples. I know of a surgeon that I was warned about by the PT's when I started a new job at a hospital 7 years ago. They talked about the poor outcomes of his patients and the ongoing lawsuits. He is still doing back surgeries and was out one day a couple weeks ago for a deposition. If he is not good at it why does the medical board allow him to continue doing these surgeries? He just keeps getting sued and keeps paying higher and higher malpractice insurance. Maybe we need to have a system where ongoing problems like this are addressed, maybe he is in the wrong part of medicine and would do better as a PCP, physiatrist or internal medicine? So I see 2 issues with the lawsuits, the frivolous ones and the justified ones where we need to remove the MD from that form of practice. No one seems to compare with Sweden, France, Germany, Norway... etc... I would also like to see people get away from the comparisons to England and Canada. We are not going to adopt their system so it is an erroneous comparison. It is interesting how popular " medical tourism " has become. There are more folks leaving the US to get health care in other countries, but not very many coming from other countries to the US. In 2007 about 750,000 Americans traveled overseas for their health care. 65,000 Americans went to International Hospital in Thailand in that 1 year out of the 430,000 international patients they get every year. So another interesting point is what happens if all Americans get access to affordable health care? These hospitals in other countries may suffer from the loss of revenue. It is good to have a philosophical debate and try to see all sides of an issue. I remember when I took anthropology and read about the Nacirema tribe. They seemed like a very unusual tribe of people until I realized it was American written backwards and I was reading about our culture from a different perspective Many debates are surrounded by emotions and there is a lot of hatred out there in this debate. Emotions tend to block us from seeing clearly and make us biased. Anyway, here is an interesting quote I've heard many times in the past: " Americans can always be counted on to do the right thing, after exhausting all other options. " - Winston Churchill Hopefully we can do the right thing, whatever form that may take, without going through the process of " exhausting all other options " . Wade, PT Oregon Chad Yoakam wrote: > > > Good morning everyone! > > I've been paying attention, with great interest, to the debate > surrounding healthcare reform in our country. Things that I don't hear > much about but, I feel, are well worth addressing are: > > 1. Personal responsibility (or the lack thereof) is a major factor in > the health of each individual and the health of our country. I've seen > statistics from various sources that estimate $1 to $3 of every $4 spent > on healthcare in our country is for something that could have been > prevented. We, as a nation, are very unhealthy in a number of respects > and we have traditionally operated under a " sick care " system. My > opinion is that instead of a very small, insignificant amount of money > being dedicated to wellness and prevention which our Government is now > proposing to be included in the " reform package " , that personal > responsibility " reform " be a major topic that receives substantial > attention and funding in order to change the mindset of the USA. Also, > keep in mind that we are already seeing patient outcomes as a criteria > for reimbursement. Very simply a compliant patient (one that takes > responsibility in their rehab) nearly always has a better outcome than a > non-compliant patient. > > 2. A huge portion of our healthcare costs can be traced back to the > amount of money healthcare organizations and providers spend on > liability and malpractice insurance. My belief is that this is largely > due to the numerous frivolous law-suits and settlements that have been > awarded by our judicial system. A major reason for this is again > related to the idea that personal responsibility for one's health (and a > lot of other things) is a fading ideal in this country. While I have no > numbers to back this except what my own company pays each year for said > insurance, common sense tells me that if limitations were set on > lawsuits and settlements and on the financial prizes that attorneys can > receive in such cases that our health care costs could be considerably > less. I suspect due to the lobbying power of the attorneys in our > country this is not a topic that gets much attention from our government > or our press. > > Some things to think about? Thanks for the opportunity to share! > > Chad > > Chad W. Yoakam, MS, PT > > Manager of Rehabilitation Services > > Livingston HealthCare Orthopedic and Rehabilitation Institute > > ________________________________ > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com>] On > Behalf Of Ruesewald > Sent: Thursday, August 13, 2009 8:18 AM > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: RE: Healthcare Reform > > It is from the World Health Organization and it is based on factors and > weights for these factors. > > These factors are: > > Overall Level of Health - WHO used the measure of disability - adjusted > life > expectancy (this includes homicide rates and accidental death rate) > > Distribution of Health in the Populations - these were broken down into > goodness, best attainable average level of health care, and fairness, > smallest feasible differences among individual and groups > > Responsiveness - which include respect for persons and client > orientation - > this last includes amenities available > > Distribution of Financing - which includes the percentage of household > income spent on health care > > This report was done in 2000. There were concerns over the results. > > Ruesewald > > Therapy Billing > > PO Box 880 , Lake Dallas , TX 75065 > > fax > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> ] > On Behalf > Of Ric Baird > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 7:55 PM > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: Healthcare Reform > > Seriously, 37th in the world? Could you provide me that reference > please. > > Ric Baird, MS, PT, ATC > Interactive Physical Therapy & Fitness > 4745 NW Hunters Ridge Circle > Suite D > Topeka, KS 66618 > (785)246-2300 (P) > (785)246-2301 (F) > > Interactive Physical Therapy > 1709 SE 29th Street > Suite 300-400 > Topeka, KS 66605 > (785)266-4600 (P) > (785)266-4601 (F) > > www.interactiveptandfitness.com > > On Aug 12, 2009, at 6:58 PM, Alliance Physical Therapy > <alliancept@... <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > <mailto:alliancept%40alliancept.us> > > wrote: > > > I think it is very important to consider the whole picture not from a > > limited perspective such as the small piece of the puzzle we see as > > therapists. > > > > There seems to be a lot of fear around this issue. We need to assess > > what we are afraid of and be self critical. > > > > Why do we rank 37th in the world for quality of care? Why is > > International Hospital in Bangkok Thailand considered one of the best? > > And why are some US doctors leaving to work there? > > > > Why did I see some people I know flying to other countries for their > > health care? They come back with stories about how wonderful the care > > was and how much cheaper it is for them. These are folks without > > insurance and pay cash, so they leave the US for less expensive, > > better > > quality care. In the opinion of 4 people I've known to do that. > > > > Why not travel to other countries and see first hand what some others > > are doing? My wife and I spent a couple of weeks traveling around BC > > Canada touring hospitals and visiting relatives to get an insiders > > view > > of their health care system. My sister in law is a physiotherapist in > > Canada. > > > > Anyway, it is easy to judge and repeat what we are told by the media > > and > > folks with an agenda. Where is the unbiased info? > > > > Wade, PT > > OR > > > > Curtis Marti wrote: > > > > > > > > > Mr. s, > > > > > > Thank you for the posting. Although I disagree, I'm always open to > > > considering the views of others. I'm disappointed that the posting > > that > > > I submitted two weeks ago was not sent out on the list serve. > > Clearly, > > > my posting portrayed an opposing position on this issue and I can > > only > > > hope that it was an unintentional oversight. I will attempt to > > resubmit > > > it. > > > > > > Thanks again, > > > > > > -Curtis > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > > > From: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > > [mailto:PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager > > %40yahoogroups.com>] On > > > Behalf Of s > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:09 PM > > > To: PTManager <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > <mailto:PTManager%40yahoogroups.com> > > > Subject: Healthcare Reform > > > > > > Hello all, hope this finds you well, > > > I wanted to share a link to an interview with Wendell Potter, former > > > vice-president of Cigna. I urge all of you with an interest in the > > > outcome of the current healthcare debate to take the time to watch > > this > > > interview and to then forward it to your patients, friends and > > families. > > > It is far time that we rescue health care from the grips of the > > > insurance industry. I am very interested to hear your opinions on > > this > > > piece. Thank you. > > > > > > http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> >> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> >> > > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> >> > > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> > <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html <http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07312009/watch.html> >> >> > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > E. s, PT, DPT > > > Orthopedic Clinical Specialist > > > Fellow American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists > > > www.douglasspt.com > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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