Re: Working through my Shame

June 5, 2010

I have alot of issues with shame too and I am making alot of connections lately.

I read in my human development book that the ages of 1-3 years old are where a

person develops shame vs. autonomy or self-confidence. Now, watching my nephew

go through his terrible twos with a mother who is either borderline or has a

huge infestation of fleas from her borderline mother, I can totally see why

children of borderlines have such shame issues. because a borderline IS NOT CUT

OUT to deal with the behaviors a child this age exhibits. they are not cute,

they are too much work, they are too easily frustrated, they are impervious to

reason, they want their way and are prepared to go to any lengths to get it,

they do not care about any aspect of what the other person is thinking, feeling,

or experiencing, because they can't. they are fully themselves, utterly consumed

with self and their relationship with the world that is unfolding moment by

moment and incapable of suppressing anything. they are " the almighty ME " , and a

normal person with adequate coping skills finds it exhausting. it's a stage they

have to go through to form identity and self-concept but a borderline, being

still stuck in the 'almighty me' because they probably were traumatized at this

age, not only can't tolerate the egotism but resents the child for trying to

form a separate identity. it is the least 'about the parent' phase probably

until puberty. so of course the borderline is going to royally screw this up.

and I guess we default into the shame part of the equation, having been

controlled by shame because the borderline couldn't muster the selflessness to

let us develop normally.

>

> Hey everyone,

>

> I am going through some meditating and feelings have been coming up. Many of

them deal with shame as usual.

>

> It's been pretty tough to go through. However, I'm noticing that I'm feeling

more comfortable with myself afterwards.

>

> One of the things I struggle with about myself is feeling guilty about

different thoughts I have or saying something that might " offend " someone. It

usually has to do with religion and feeling like a bad person for feeling angry

about something or someone. Having negative thoughts towards someone or

something or just not particularly liking a certain person.

>

> I never had these thoughts before as I numbed my feelings but now they are

coming up and it seems okay now. I still feel guilty about feelin them, but I

think everyone feels them from time to time.

>

> Thanks for letting me share.

>

> Healing and discouvering and honoring myself is hard. especially the disowned

parts.

>

> Joy

>

June 5, 2010

Well said..this explains a lot, doesn't it?

~patricia

Re: Working through my Shame

I have alot of issues with shame too and I am making alot of connections

lately. I read in my human development book that the ages of 1-3 years old are

where a person develops shame vs. autonomy or self-confidence. Now, watching my

nephew go through his terrible twos with a mother who is either borderline or

has a huge infestation of fleas from her borderline mother, I can totally see

why children of borderlines have such shame issues. because a borderline IS NOT

CUT OUT to deal with the behaviors a child this age exhibits. they are not

cute, they are too much work, they are too easily frustrated, they are

impervious to reason, they want their way and are prepared to go to any lengths

to get it, they do not care about any aspect of what the other person is

thinking, feeling, or experiencing, because they can't. they are fully

themselves, utterly consumed with self and their relationship with the world

that is unfolding moment by moment and incapable of suppressing anything. they

are " the almighty ME " , and a normal person with adequate coping skills finds it

exhausting. it's a stage they have to go through to form identity and

self-concept but a borderline, being still stuck in the 'almighty me' because

they probably were traumatized at this age, not only can't tolerate the egotism

but resents the child for trying to form a separate identity. it is the least

'about the parent' phase probably until puberty. so of course the borderline is

going to royally screw this up.

and I guess we default into the shame part of the equation, having been

controlled by shame because the borderline couldn't muster the selflessness to

let us develop normally.

>

> Hey everyone,

>

> I am going through some meditating and feelings have been coming up. Many of

them deal with shame as usual.

>

> It's been pretty tough to go through. However, I'm noticing that I'm feeling

more comfortable with myself afterwards.

>

> One of the things I struggle with about myself is feeling guilty about

different thoughts I have or saying something that might " offend " someone. It

usually has to do with religion and feeling like a bad person for feeling angry

about something or someone. Having negative thoughts towards someone or

something or just not particularly liking a certain person.

>

> I never had these thoughts before as I numbed my feelings but now they are

coming up and it seems okay now. I still feel guilty about feelin them, but I

think everyone feels them from time to time.

>

> Thanks for letting me share.

>

> Healing and discouvering and honoring myself is hard. especially the

disowned parts.

>

> Joy

>

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From Randi Kreger, Owner BPDCentral, WTO Online Community and author SWOE and

the SWOE Workbook.

June 5, 2010

You put that very well, josephine; its a concept I've been trying to get across

for a long time now in this and other Groups I belong to. The very nature of

bpd, the criteria that define bpd, means that a person with bpd is the least

likely person to be able to cope well with raising small children: the " terrible

twos " in particular. Its like putting a two-year-old in charge of another

two-year-old. Trauma and emotional damage and even physical damage is virtually

guaranteed to ensue.

I wish that there were some screening process in place to ensure that those with

bpd traits would be monitored closely if they are raising children, to help them

develop parenting skills or to rescue the kids if necessary.

My own bpd/npd nada even told me (when I was an adult) that she had " given up on

having a loving mother-daughter relationship " with me by the time I was three

years old!! My bpd/npd nada believed that I rejected her and didn't love her.

She was then and still is completely clueless (or in denial) that her red-faced

screaming rage-tantrums and the physical abuse she inflicted on me had made her

toddler/preschooler terrified of her. I loved her and needed her love

desperately, but I was also afraid of my own mother and very nervous and jittery

around her.

So nada, the borderline/narcissist, interpreted my fear of her as me rejecting

her. Not her fault, my fault. Total projection and denial.

That's why in my opinion those with bpd (or other Cluster B comorbidities) are

just not qualified to raise kids, and shouldn't do so without intense

supervision. Bpds like my nada are too emotionally disregulated, they can't

accept responsibility for their own actions, they project blame onto others (the

baby, even) and they tend to lack empathy. At least, the ones with a high

degree of npd or aspd traits tend to lack empathy.

Its just a tragedy any way you look at it, seems to me.

-Annie

>

> I have alot of issues with shame too and I am making alot of connections