Re: Seeking Conversational Tips

[Guest guest]

Dear Away,

First of all, it is not you! There are many people whose only form of speech

seems to be a soliloquy/monologue. There is little you can do to turn the

conversation into a dialogue, especially if the other person completely lacks

self-awareness. I have found that there are 2 types of people who do this kind

of conversation hijacking - 1) people who have deep-seated self-esteem problems

(they try to make up for their lack of self-esteem by trying to impress everyone

with their " interesting stories " and " intelligent speech " , they are afraid of

appearing dull, stupid, outcast if they remain quiet); or 2) people who are

completely self-absorbed/egotistical/narcissistic (they love hearing the sound

of their own voices and think that what they have to say is always much more

important and interesting than what anyone else has to say). Either way, you do

not want to spend an evening to trapped with these types of people.

In that situation, it is best to move on politely as soon . So, after the first

or second story that was interesting, you say something like (and if you have to

interrupt them, that is OK in this situation, otherwise you will be their

hostage for the rest of the night):

" What an interesting story! Thanks for sharing. We'll have to chat more later. "

After that you simply walk away and find another group or individual with whom

to chat. In a way you will be helping the person as well. If people keep walking

away from them, they will eventually have to re-examine their communication

style and may end up evolving into a better conversationalist.

I know that as KOs our first reaction is always to think we did something wrong,

it is somehow our fault, etc. Until 4 years ago, I used to walk away from EVERY

single random conversation, social event, chance meeting, etc. wondering what I

had done wrong (even when there was absolutely NO evidence of ANYthing being

wrong, which was the case 99% of the time, in my head I would hear my mother's

voice telling me I didn't stand up straight enough, I spoke too loudly or too

softly, I didn't say enough, I said too much, etc.). Every now and then this

still " tries " to happen, but I put an immediate stop to it and remind myself

that I am a grown, intelligent woman and the way I conduct myself socially is

not something over which I have to agonize for days. If there is something I

truly wish I hadn't said or done, I make a mental note for next time, but I

don't dwell on it. I cannot put in words how very liberating and wonderful this

change has been for me!

Good luck and keep your head up high!

Arianna

>

> Hi Folks,

> I'm working through " Helping the Child Who Doesn't Fit In " and to that end,

have attended two functions in the last week with fairly well-educated, employed

people. Both have involved eating, drinking and mingling both seated and moving

about a room. This was not a " dating " or " singles " situation.

>

> On both occasions, I did fine meeting and greeting, and also asking a question

in the formal meeting time. But things fell down one on one. On both occasions,

I initiated a conversation with one person (first time a man, second time, a

woman) and soon found myself listening to long monologues, but when it was time

for me to speak, I was cut off after about eight seconds, for another monologue.

Even though I lad listened carefully to the other person, what I was trying to

say was disregarded. I couldn't even finish, and believe me, I was not taking

that long!

>

> I don't know what to think. Is it me? Did I send out some kind of signal? Or

is this fairly common to find " monologuists " in groups who hog the airspace?

>

> In the conversation with the man, I know that there was another person

standing by listenng, and fairly soon after my " monologuist " began talking, he

moved away. Which surprised me a little because I found the story interesting.

But soob, that story turned into another and when I tried to interject, my

sentence was cut off. Finally I excused myself to the restroom and disengaged

myself. So I'm wondering, did the bystander get a signal early on that I didn't?

>

> Anybody have any thoughts/guidelines for casual conversation out there? I long

for a " you talk/I talk conversation " but man, this is HARD.

> Sincerely,

> Away From Borderland

>

[Guest guest]

Arianna,

That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two groups of

people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you do nothing

to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with more or let

the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people I have had

to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and was toxic

so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have developed a few

" red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first conversation. I

definitely agree that we probably need these because while others will realize

the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on ourselves and doubt us. I

like having a checklist in mind because it turns the experience into an

objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of relationships,

different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

1. person has no long term friends

2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if they

have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical questions and

continues on

4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do deserve

compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early on-

especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my intelligence,

career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate you.

Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned that

for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to continue

being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never have to

see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move away.

If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase. I

never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people like

this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

> >

> > Hi Folks,

> > I'm working through " Helping the Child Who Doesn't Fit In " and to that end,

have attended two functions in the last week with fairly well-educated, employed

people. Both have involved eating, drinking and mingling both seated and moving

about a room. This was not a " dating " or " singles " situation.

> >

> > On both occasions, I did fine meeting and greeting, and also asking a

question in the formal meeting time. But things fell down one on one. On both

occasions, I initiated a conversation with one person (first time a man, second

time, a woman) and soon found myself listening to long monologues, but when it

was time for me to speak, I was cut off after about eight seconds, for another

monologue. Even though I lad listened carefully to the other person, what I was

trying to say was disregarded. I couldn't even finish, and believe me, I was not

taking that long!

> >

> > I don't know what to think. Is it me? Did I send out some kind of signal? Or

is this fairly common to find " monologuists " in groups who hog the airspace?

> >

> > In the conversation with the man, I know that there was another person

standing by listenng, and fairly soon after my " monologuist " began talking, he

moved away. Which surprised me a little because I found the story interesting.

But soob, that story turned into another and when I tried to interject, my

sentence was cut off. Finally I excused myself to the restroom and disengaged

myself. So I'm wondering, did the bystander get a signal early on that I didn't?

> >

> > Anybody have any thoughts/guidelines for casual conversation out there? I

long for a " you talk/I talk conversation " but man, this is HARD.

> > Sincerely,

> > Away From Borderland

> >

>

[Guest guest]

People with ADD or mild autism may do this as well.

--.

[Guest guest]

Very good point, . I didn't even think about it, probably since I don't

have much social experience with people who have ADD or autistic spectrum

conditions, but you are absolutely right. These people would be in the 3rd

category of conversation hogs.

>

>

> People with ADD or mild autism may do this as well.

>

> --.

>

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

I really like your list of red flags and with your permission I will save them

for future use and sharing. I think they are perfectly on target.

As KOs we do tend to put up with people that most " normal " people would not (at

least not for nearly as long as we do) because we have been trained to bend over

backwards to accommodate someone else without regard for our own well-being. So

we do have to be extra vigilant and stay away from people who are not healthy

for us.

Thanks,

Arianna

>

> Arianna,

> That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two groups

of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you do

nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with more

or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people I

have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> 1. person has no long term friends

> 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical questions

and continues on

> 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do deserve

compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early on-

especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my intelligence,

career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate you.

Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

>

> Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Fairly new to group. What are KO's and fleas?  Thanks

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Sun, June 13, 2010 4:11:32 PM

Subject: Re: Seeking Conversational Tips

 

Dear ,

I really like your list of red flags and with your permission I will save them

for future use and sharing. I think they are perfectly on target.

As KOs we do tend to put up with people that most " normal " people would not (at

least not for nearly as long as we do) because we have been trained to bend over

backwards to accommodate someone else without regard for our own well-being. So

we do have to be extra vigilant and stay away from people who are not healthy

for us.

Thanks,

Arianna

>

> Arianna,

> That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two groups

of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you do

nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with more

or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people I

have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> 1. person has no long term friends

> 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical questions

and continues on

> 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do deserve

compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early on-

especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my intelligence,

career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate you.

Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

>

> Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks guys, all your comments were helpful. Today I went to my third social

function in 7 days, a real record for me, and a nice lady sat beside me. We

struck up a conversation and I encountered none of the monologuing with her.

After she told me a story she said, " Now tell me about you. " And she listened

quietly and patiently while I talked for a little bit. She actually mentioned

having lunch together some day, which I will accept.

I think what I have learned this week is a little more about discernment. It's a

great big world out there with lots of people in it, and some of them have to be

compatible with me and maybe want another friend. I have a little more hope now,

and I'm also watching myself carefully, so that I'm not overstepping boundaries

or letting my fleas jump all over other people FLEA CONTROL, people, flea

control. Ha ha!

Sincerely,

AwayFromBorderland

> >

> >

> > People with ADD or mild autism may do this as well.

> >

> > --.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Of course Arianna!

I'm glad that you found them helpful. I just got back from a goodbye dinner for

the chief residents at the hospital I used to work at (general surgery- don't do

it I remember that you're in med school!). Of course since I will see these

people socially I wasn't quite as rude as described below but I did stick to my

guns and not engage in conversation with residents who I think are clearly

malicious. I'm not sure how it's perceived but it is very liberating!

> >

> > Arianna,

> > That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two groups

of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you do

nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with more

or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people I

have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> > 1. person has no long term friends

> > 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> > 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical questions

and continues on

> > 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> > 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do

deserve compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early

on- especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my

intelligence, career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate

you. Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> > 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

> >

> > Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

My young grandson, who has Apserger s, has a T shirt. Excuse me, but I m

not being bad. I have autism.

It takes great patience and love.

Doug

> >

> >

> > People with ADD or mild autism may do this as well.

> >

> > --.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Arianna and ,

I have read this post with interest because I have the issue of being the

person that monopolizes a conversation. I do have Asperger's Syndrome. I am

not aware that I have even done this till maybe later in the evening. I think

it could also be because I have an auditory problem and i am compensating my

inability to hear words correctly, which makes me have to focus very hard on

what the other person is saying, by creating a monologue. I think that is also

nervousness and because of being socially isolated.

It is true that I don't have a lot of friend or long term friends.

I don't work or drive and so this may attribute to this. Also I have moved

around a lot.

I am an interesting person and I probably am in love with my life. Maybe I

try to make my life and conversations interesting in order to " hold " the other

persons attention. I don't know how to ask people about themselves, because to

me that seems invasive..and if they were like me (which I guess they aren't)

they would be able to tell me what they want me to know. I don't know what

questions to ask...or when to ask them.

They may also find me interesting but they can't follow all the " stories "

that I have opened up and am jumping around to. I can see that I am causing a

lot of mental gymnastics.

I did buy the book Helping The Child who doesn't fit in...and maybe what I am

looking for is in there.

I imagine that my hogging the conversation is also trying to " hold " on to the

person. It is unfortunate that it has the opposite effect.

Since you have given good suggestions for how to avoid people with issues

like mine ...I wonder if you could put yourself in my place and try to give me

some workable social skills.

Becky

>

> Arianna,

> That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two groups

of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you do

nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with more

or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people I

have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> 1. person has no long term friends

> 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical questions

and continues on

> 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do deserve

compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early on-

especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my intelligence,

career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate you.

Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

>

> Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Becky, I'd add my two cents as I've knows quite a few Asperger types and even

wondered about myself sometimes. The key is that you must not forget that you

are having a conversation, a *two-way* interaction with another person. Staying

aware of their expressions and responsiveness to what you are saying is

important. It's easy to get lost in your own mind of what you want to say or

(for me) get too focused on internal anxiety. But the focus needs to be enough

on the person you are speaking to that you do not lose track and keep awareness

of how what you are saying is being received. Hope that helps some.

> >

> > Arianna,

> > That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two groups

of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you do

nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with more

or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people I

have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> > 1. person has no long term friends

> > 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> > 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical questions

and continues on

> > 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> > 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do

deserve compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early

on- especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my

intelligence, career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate

you. Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> > 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

> >

> > Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

KO is " kids of " like we are kids of a BPD parent...fleas are traits,

behaviors we've picked up from out BPD parents beacause we all learn from

our parents how to behave...we can over come them, it takes work , though..

Jackie

Hi,

Fairly new to group. What are KO's and fleas? Thanks

[Guest guest]

Away and Becky - I so glad you're both working on the " art " of social

conversation - please be assured that this stuff CAN be learned.

Away - hope you find Dr. Duke's book (Helping the Child...) helpful. I used

this book a LOT when working with my son (who has inattentive-type ADD) - part

of ADD is not paying attention to non-verbal cues - so ADD kids have to be

coached on that, just as they have to be coached on organizational skills,

learning to focus, where to sit in the classroom, and lots of other stuff that

seems to come naturally to kids who do not have ADD or ADHD (or Asperger's, or

other autism-spectrum problems).

Becky - Some stuff I used with my son when he was elementary school - think of

conversation as a ping-pong game. First one person " serves " and then the other

person has to hit the ball that was served, back and forth. You have to keep

your eye on the ball (focus on the subject at hand), and you have to give the

other person a chance to hit the ball back to you, or they will get bored. Try

having practice conversations with someone who agrees to help you with this -

use a stopwatch or a watch with a second hand. Try to limit yourself to no more

than 30 seconds before letting the other person talk. Have that person tell you

when they're starting to get bored, and draw your attention to the nonverbal

cues (See, I'm looking around the room. Now I'm backing away from you. What do

you think that means?) Practice some " lines " that will help you toss the

conversation back to the other person.

I took a business etiquette class (yes, there are such things) on this very

topic - how to " work " a cocktail party or reception. We were advised to read

the newspaper for that day before going to the party - national and

international news, the sports section (whether we like sports or not), and the

editorial columns. That provides at least 10-15 minutes of " material " for you.

One tip - always finish your story (whatever you're talking about) with a

question to the other person, rather than with a declarative statement.

Also - general etiquette provides some " outs " when you have to mingle or get

stuck with somebody who's gassing on and on. Excusing yourself to go greet a

new arrival, or get some punch, or go to the bathroom, etc. - usually works.

Or, " You know, that's an interesting story, but before I forget, I have been

wanting to ask you... " - then change the subject to something that is more

" ping-pong " friendly.

> > >

> > > Arianna,

> > > That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two

groups of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you

do nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with

more or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people

I have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> > > 1. person has no long term friends

> > > 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> > > 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical

questions and continues on

> > > 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> > > 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do

deserve compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early

on- especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my

intelligence, career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate

you. Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> > > 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

> > >

> > > Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I have some observations about guidelines for a good social conversation, based

solely on my own opinion. A conversation is like a game of tennis. You throw the

ball back and forth to each other. If one person holds onto the ball for too

long and doesn't throw it back, the game is no longer being played.

I'm very aware of " how long " I am speaking at any one time. Think of a radio

commercial. Thirty seconds is a REALLY long time for one person to be speaking

in a first conversation with someone you have just met. A conversation usually

starts with short, 5 to 8 second questions and answers. After 4 to 6 back and

forths like this, if there is still interest in talking, the questions and

answers get a little lengthier, packed with more information, to about 20

seconds. Here is where the " conversational hog " loses focus and stops playing.

They lengthen their time with the conversational ball immediately from say, 8

seconds to 30. And then from 30 to 3 to 5 minutes, forcing the other person to

interrupt and " get the ball away from them. " Some hogs are so carried away, that

they keep talking, are extremely hard to interrupt, and then only give the ball

back for a few seconds before they take that ball back again by interrupting and

" hi-jacking " the conversation back to themselves. Game over. There's no

conversation here, the game has been shut down. It floors me at how often this

happens in social conversation with people I've never met before.

I think that the art of conversaation was something that was more widely known

back when ladies sipped tea in china cups at bridge games, and up until the

beehive hairdo was still popular at cocktail parties. But it's been lost over

the years. I remember attending a wedding two years ago in Tucson and sat at a

table where a lovely couple in their late seventies sat. They were truly masters

at the art of conversation. Young people came and visited the table and moved

on, and those old folks kept the conversation moving brilliantly, everybody felt

included, and I watched with awe. I wasn't quite astute enough at the time to

analyze what they were doing. I regret that now. But I'm a fast learner and more

aware now, so when I find them again, I'l report back.

Takeaway point that I try to be mindful of: If you're speaking with people new

to you and you've been talking more than 15 seconds, STOP, and let somebody else

pick up the conversational ball. I practiced at home with the second hand on my

watch, so I knew the " feel " of seconds passing and how much talking would fit

into about eight seconds, 20 seconds, and 30 seconds.

I hope this is helpful,

AwayFromBorderland

> >

> > Arianna,

> > That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two groups

of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you do

nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with more

or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people I

have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> > 1. person has no long term friends

> > 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> > 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical questions

and continues on

> > 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> > 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do

deserve compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early

on- especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my

intelligence, career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate

you. Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> > 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

> >

> > Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Becky (and anyone else with asperger's or autism),

I'm sorry if my list seems flippant! I didn't account for this group of people

and I don't mean to imply that people who display those traits have bad

intentions. Unfortunately I have been hurt many many times with bad friendships

so I have had to develop that list to protect me. I realize that having such a

list will preclude me from being friends with some people with very good

intentions, as I can tell you have, Becky.

I don't have much experience with people with asperger's or autism so I will try

to give tips but I apologize if they do not really fill your needs:

1. People LOVE to talk about themselves and walk away happy from a conversation

if they've been able to do that adequately. You can practice a list of

introductory questions that you can ask in a prescribed order:

-What brings you to this function?

-Where are you from?

-What do you do for a living? (this one can be received poorly so you may or may

not want to include it. Definitely ask if they ask you though!)

-Are you new to the area?

-Depending on their age: Tell me about your husband/kids.

-Also depending on where you live, certain areas have hot topics. I'm in a major

city right now so our hot topics are: the recession, how unaffordable housing

still is, new restaurants, museum exhibits, anything current in fashion.

- For women who are engaged: ask about the proposal, how they met, when the

wedding is...

- For men/women with children: ask about ages, schools, summer activities, the

children's interests.

**Keep in mind that after you ask a question they should respond for about a

minute and then return the question to you or ask you a different question. If

you find yourself with someone who isn't asking you questions, you should also

consider walking away.

**While they are talking, it is important to stay engaged. If you find it

difficult to come up with spontaneous questions while they're talking, just make

eye contact the whole time. Also, if you're having trouble hearing, you can make

it up with a lot of eye contact. If you have difficulty making eye contact, you

can lean in a little so you can hear better and keep your head down while the

other person is talking. They will realize that you are trying to hear them and

will be satisfied with that. The only thing that bothers me is when people's

eyes are darting around the room while I'm talking. It makes it seem like they

are not really interested in what I have to say. If they do the- lean in look

down method, it doesn't bother me at all that they're not making eye contact

because by their body language I can tell that they're engaged.

- The most engaging way to handle conversation is to ask one of the above

questions and then follow up with a question related to what the other person

was talking about. It can be a completely random connection, here's an example,

You: I see you have an engagement ring on, are you planning a wedding?

Her: ....going on and on about her wedding....and my husband and I met in Paris.

You: Oh! I've never been to Paris, how is it? What were you both doing there?

Even if it's a random fact that isn't really related to the story, the other

person will realize that you were listening closely to what they were saying by

you asking this follow-up question.

2. When it is your turn to speak, follow the same rules as above. Limit your

answers to about a minute. You can also practice your answers to the above

questions or any other questions you plan on asking as they will most likely be

returned to you. It's ok if you ramble in a monologue for a minute or so, but

try not to go on for much longer and ask a question of the other person at the

end to re-engage them. Becky, it sounds like you have a lot to say about

interesting topics, which is great! A good way to think of how to say it

concisely is: imagine you are writing a journal article and you have to write a

summary or abstract on the article. Practice doing that with your topics so you

can give the other person an overview and they can decide if they want to ask

you more about it.

3. I realize it may be hard to read if the other person is genuinely interested

in talking to you. Here are a couple indications that they are:

- they ask as many questions of you as you do to them

- they are engaged, either with eye contact or the lean in

- they ask you to repeat parts of your story or comment on them

Indications that the other person is not interested:

- their eyes are darting around the room

- their only response to your comments is " mmhmm " .

- they find a way to always bring the conversation back to them.

4. When concluding a conversation, if you were interested in the person you were

talking to, there are a few ways to indicate this to them. For instance, I am

hooorrrible with remembering people's names. At the end of the conversation, if

I didn't really like the person I will say " it was nice to meet you " and move

on. If I did like them, I will say " I'm really sorry but I'm horrible with

names. What was yours again? I'm . " That reinforces that you are

interested in the other person and it politely reminds them of your name to

spare them any embarrassment. Depending on the situation, if you want to get in

touch with them again, you can say " I'm so interested in the gallery you run,

I'd love to meet up for coffee sometime. " Coffee is probably the best proposal-

it's cheap, easy, and can be as fast as you and the other person need. It's best

to exchange email addresses unless the other person offers their phone number

first.

The exceptions to this are: If someone has described to me a very busy career

(neurosurgeon) or has indicated in some way that they are very busy- are a

newlywed, are moving, planning a wedding, have young kids- I tend to let them

ask me first to get together and not approach the topic myself. Sometimes these

people are genuinely interested but do not have the time to meet up.

On the other hand, people who are prime to start developing a friendship with

are: people who have recently moved to the area, people who are newly

unemployed, and anyone who sounds like they have a lot of time!

There are always exceptions and sometimes even if someone falls into the " busy "

category but I really enjoy their company, I will still ask them to get

together. They may say no or may never reply to an email but I can understand

that it isn't personal.

Becky, I can tell that your heart is in the right place and you want to make the

effort! Even with the above tips, make sure that the other person is

reciprocating with you! Just because you have to work a little harder at social

situations does not mean that you deserve sub-par friends. Keep in mind: almost

everyone is nervous when meeting someone new, it isnt just you! if you engage

conversation with someone who isn't interested, the worst thing that can happen

is they will cut it short. If you accidentally ask a question that makes the

other person uncomfortable, don't stress about it! It's unlikely that you could

have known that would happen and if the other person is fair, he/she will

realize this too. Good luck!!

> >

> > Arianna,

> > That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two groups

of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you do

nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with more

or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people I

have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> > 1. person has no long term friends

> > 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> > 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical questions

and continues on

> > 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> > 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do

deserve compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early

on- especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my

intelligence, career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate

you. Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> > 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

> >

> > Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thank You , Away..,and ,

I really appreciate your well thought out answers. They were also very

doable. I plan to copy them in my journal, which will help re-enforce some of

the suggestions. I also will also try working on timing some of my

stories...that was a good suggestion as this is where I run amouk I think.

Simply because I don't know where to start or how much information to tell and

so it gets long winded. I was confused as to how long was too long...and

related to the fact that when the conversation got to interesting this is where

I might start into a monologue.

I was a little afraid to ask, but I am so glad I did.

Becky

> > >

> > > Arianna,

> > > That was a very polite suggestion! I like how you categorized the two

groups of people. I completely agree! Away, I also agree with Arianna that you

do nothing to attract these people, but you may just be willing to put up with

more or let the conversation go on longer than others. I have had several people

I have had to cut out of my life because the friendship went on for too long and

was toxic so be happy that you were perceptive enough to walk away! I have

developed a few " red flags " with my therapist to look out for in a first

conversation. I definitely agree that we probably need these because while

others will realize the person in question is crazy, we will turn it on

ourselves and doubt us. I like having a checklist in mind because it turns the

experience into an objective one. Depending on your interactions and types of

relationships, different items may be useful for you. Here are some of mine:

> > > 1. person has no long term friends

> > > 2. person has not asked anything about me in the first few minutes. or, if

they have, the conversation has immediately switched back to them.

> > > 3. person rambles without asking me for input, or asks rhetorical

questions and continues on

> > > 4. person mentions many times how great they are and flatter themselves

> > > 5. **person flatters me too much: this is a tricky one because you do

deserve compliments but I have found that people who flatter me too much early

on- especially about things that they have no way of knowing (about my

intelligence, career etc), are looking for a way to suck you in and manipulate

you. Compliments about your appearance are slightly more acceptable but still,

beware!

> > > 6. person is always the victim in every story/dilemma

> > >

> > > Arianna suggested a very pleasant way to deal with this but I have learned

that for some reason with me, people don't get subtle hints and still try to

continue being friends. Especially for someone I am only meeting once and never

have to see again I cut them off and say " It was very nice to meet you " and move

away. If they continue to try the conversation I continue to repeat that phrase.

I never every say, " I'm sorry but I'm in a rush " or apologize because people

like this need a clear message that you don't like them. And that's ok!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

GREAT post!!! even if you don't have autism spectrum disorders.

I'm putting it in my " priceless " box to save, as I am shy and none too good in

conversation.

--.