Re: Let's Talk Knees

[Guest guest]

Ronda,

I'm so sorry to hear about your knee problems.

A second opinion would be worth pursuing.

Not an MD

On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:03 AM, Ronda <mamaronda@...> wrote:

> I have been having lots of trouble with my knees lately and I'm wondering if

> anyone has a similar issue and if so, what was helpful to you. I have RA

> and OA in both knees, so there a couple of issues going on in each knee.

> In October, my orthopedic surgeon injected both knees with cortisone and

> Supartz (Hyralonic acid) and said that if it helped, I would get 3 to 6

> months of relief from the knee pain. Well, it worked for maybe a week or 2

> - absolutely not worth it. I went back in to see him yesterday and he took

> another set of x-rays so that he can keep a close eye on some of the

> problems within. Here's where we're stuck. I'm 'only 40' so he is really

> hesitant to do anything aggressive. He feels that because of the

> inflammatory problems, I'm not a great candidate for the normal surgical

> procedures that might help the OA problems. He did say that I'm eventually

> looking at a total knee replacement, but that should be a long term

> consideration. I'm also kind of a surgeon's worst nightmare because of a

> blood clotting disorder and severe allergies to most painkillers. Ugh

>

> In the meantime, he has sort of left me with " learning to cope with it " .

> He did give me a month's worth of Celebrex samples to try and said that he

> will talk to my rheumy about maybe adjusting my RA meds to see if we can

> find a better combo. I'm currently on Plaquenil and injectable MTX. I

> did got to physical therapy and they gave me some things to work on at home,

> but even the therapist wasn't really positive and pretty much told me that

> it won't get better, I will just have to learn to adapt. I do have knee

> braces that I sometimes wear, but I don't think they really help much, so I

> only use them when I'm going to walking a lot.

>

> So.anyone have lots of knee problems at a 'young' age and what did you do?

> Does this all sound right or should I see a second opinion? This surgeon

> is a family friend, and I do trust him, but I hate the idea that there isn't

> really anything I can do to help these dang knees.

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

> Ronda

[Guest guest]

Ronda,

Do you think hyroalonic acid injections would work for jaw lock up? I'm

going bananas here.

My husband has knee pain and he's not yet 40. In his early 20's he had

bursitis that turned deadly septic and nearly lost his whole leg! He kept

his leg but after the surgery, he has had chronic knee pain. As a massage

therapist, I work on his knee pretty much every night before bed. Here's my

routine. I use biofreeze or tigerbalm and massage around the knee cap and

press hard on the trigger points. A trigger point is basically anything

that 'hurts so good'. I hold for 5-20 seconds. After massaging, I take a

paint brush and load it up with paraffin wax from the paraffin wax heater

(Homemedics, Walgreens, $50) and paint his knee with the warm wax. The

Paraffin heat helps break up scar tissue. Then we peel off the paraffin and

massage again. The whole process usually takes up half an episode of

" Bones " . :: Massage will help feed oxygenated blood back into the

knee, which is a big problem with knees and elbows because the circulatory

path narrows and is so flexible (so it is quicker to block up). I wish I

could be there to do an actual 'demo and teach'. You might really consider

going to an LMT for a lesson. Find a medical massage therapist though, not

someone who just does 'spa' work. I wish I could find someone who could

work on my jaw. The irony is I need someone like me who specializes in

chronic pain and surprisingly, there are not many of us around!! Lots of

people say they do chronic pain techniques but when I ask them specifics,

they haven't a clue. ::Sigh::

G

An LMT and PhD but not an MD

_____

From: [mailto: ] On

Behalf Of Ronda

Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 10:04 AM

Subject: [ ] Let's Talk Knees

I have been having lots of trouble with my knees lately and I'm wondering if

anyone has a similar issue and if so, what was helpful to you. I have RA

and OA in both knees, so there a couple of issues going on in each knee.

In October, my orthopedic surgeon injected both knees with cortisone and

Supartz (Hyralonic acid) and said that if it helped, I would get 3 to 6

months of relief from the knee pain. Well, it worked for maybe a week or 2

- absolutely not worth it. I went back in to see him yesterday and he took

another set of x-rays so that he can keep a close eye on some of the

problems within. Here's where we're stuck. I'm 'only 40' so he is really

hesitant to do anything aggressive. He feels that because of the

inflammatory problems, I'm not a great candidate for the normal surgical

procedures that might help the OA problems. He did say that I'm eventually

looking at a total knee replacement, but that should be a long term

consideration. I'm also kind of a surgeon's worst nightmare because of a

blood clotting disorder and severe allergies to most painkillers. Ugh

In the meantime, he has sort of left me with " learning to cope with it " .

He did give me a month's worth of Celebrex samples to try and said that he

will talk to my rheumy about maybe adjusting my RA meds to see if we can

find a better combo. I'm currently on Plaquenil and injectable MTX. I

did got to physical therapy and they gave me some things to work on at home,

but even the therapist wasn't really positive and pretty much told me that

it won't get better, I will just have to learn to adapt. I do have knee

braces that I sometimes wear, but I don't think they really help much, so I

only use them when I'm going to walking a lot.

So.anyone have lots of knee problems at a 'young' age and what did you do?

Does this all sound right or should I see a second opinion? This surgeon

is a family friend, and I do trust him, but I hate the idea that there isn't

really anything I can do to help these dang knees.

Thanks in advance,

Ronda

[Guest guest]

I'd definitely get a second opinion, especially since your case has so many

considerations. How are your current RA meds handling your RA? Are you able to

try any of the biologics to see if they will offer any additional benefits?

Lori

http://home.comcast.net/~queenstitcher/

http://stitchingqueen.multiply.com

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

My understanding is that these injections are only for knees right now - and

really meant to target OA rather than RA. That is why my ortho thinks they

may not have worked for me. Actually, they have a marginal success rate at

best. Looking back, they were so not worth it for me. They were quite

expensive (thank goodness insurance covered most of it), you have to have a

series of 3 - 5 injections each a week apart, and they hurt like *$^#!

After each shot, I had to be non-weight bearing for a good 24-48 hours which

is interesting with 4 kids!

I hope you are able to get some relief soon for your jaws. I feel badly for

you as that must be extraordinarily painful.

Thank you for the tips on the knee massage! I just saw some Biofreeze the

other day at the store and wondered if it would be helpful. Glad to know

that someone " in the know " recommends it. I have to go to the store this

afternoon, so will probably pick some up. I'm also going to look into the

paraffin wax heater - have been toying with that idea for awhile now to help

my hands anyway.

Take care and I'm hoping that you get some help soon for your jaw.

Thanks!

Ronda

[ ] Let's Talk Knees

I have been having lots of trouble with my knees lately and I'm wondering if

anyone has a similar issue and if so, what was helpful to you. I have RA

and OA in both knees, so there a couple of issues going on in each knee.

In October, my orthopedic surgeon injected both knees with cortisone and

Supartz (Hyralonic acid) and said that if it helped, I would get 3 to 6

months of relief from the knee pain. Well, it worked for maybe a week or 2

- absolutely not worth it. I went back in to see him yesterday and he took

another set of x-rays so that he can keep a close eye on some of the

problems within. Here's where we're stuck. I'm 'only 40' so he is really

hesitant to do anything aggressive. He feels that because of the

inflammatory problems, I'm not a great candidate for the normal surgical

procedures that might help the OA problems. He did say that I'm eventually

looking at a total knee replacement, but that should be a long term

consideration. I'm also kind of a surgeon's worst nightmare because of a

blood clotting disorder and severe allergies to most painkillers. Ugh

In the meantime, he has sort of left me with " learning to cope with it " .

He did give me a month's worth of Celebrex samples to try and said that he

will talk to my rheumy about maybe adjusting my RA meds to see if we can

find a better combo. I'm currently on Plaquenil and injectable MTX. I

did got to physical therapy and they gave me some things to work on at home,

but even the therapist wasn't really positive and pretty much told me that

it won't get better, I will just have to learn to adapt. I do have knee

braces that I sometimes wear, but I don't think they really help much, so I

only use them when I'm going to walking a lot.

So.anyone have lots of knee problems at a 'young' age and what did you do?

Does this all sound right or should I see a second opinion? This surgeon

is a family friend, and I do trust him, but I hate the idea that there isn't

really anything I can do to help these dang knees.

Thanks in advance,

Ronda

[Guest guest]

Lori,

Since switching from oral to inj MTX, I'm feeling like the RA is fairly well

controlled. My rheumy has been keeping a close eye on my blood work

because I have mild bone marrow suppression right now, and she wants to

switch me if my numbers get any worse. She has mentioned switching to

either Arava or Enbrel. The ortho said yesterday that he thought Enbrel

might be a good choice and he wanted to talk to rheumy about it, so we'll

see what happens with that.

Ronda

Re: [ ] Let's Talk Knees

I'd definitely get a second opinion, especially since your case has so many

considerations. How are your current RA meds handling your RA? Are you able

to try any of the biologics to see if they will offer any additional

benefits?

Lori

http://home. <http://home.comcast.net/~queenstitcher/>

comcast.net/~queenstitcher/

http://stitchingque <http://stitchingqueen.multiply.com> en.multiply.com

[Guest guest]

I had bilateral knee replacements in July...at the ripe old age of 32....I

needed them at age 25!  My knees were bone on bone, my legs were knock-kneed,

and they HURT.  Cortisone didn't touch them.  I totally disagree with your

orthopedic, depending on what the xrays are saying.  If you have major erosion

or have bone on bone knees, TKR will help...regardless if it is caused by RA or

OA.  It is commonplace for RA patients to have OA...it goes hand in hand many

times.  If you are bone on bone or have major erosion no amount of RA medication

is going to fix that pain...you aren't going to fix the damage already done by

medication and have to rely on pain medication.

It makes me twitch to think we HAVE to cope with it.  Obviously, you have a

strike against you with the clotting disorder but if age is the consideration,

it shouldn't be.  I would get a second opinion..and if you are in the land

area I can give you a grade A orthopedic surgeon.

Shandi

From: Ronda <mamaronda@...>

Subject: [ ] Let's Talk Knees

Date: Tuesday, January 27, 2009, 11:03 AM

I have been having lots of trouble with my knees lately and I'm

wondering if

anyone has a similar issue and if so, what was helpful to you. I have RA

and OA in both knees, so there a couple of issues going on in each knee.

In October, my orthopedic surgeon injected both knees with cortisone and

Supartz (Hyralonic acid) and said that if it helped, I would get 3 to 6

months of relief from the knee pain. Well, it worked for maybe a week or 2

- absolutely not worth it. I went back in to see him yesterday and he took

another set of x-rays so that he can keep a close eye on some of the

problems within. Here's where we're stuck. I'm 'only 40' so he is really

hesitant to do anything aggressive. He feels that because of the

inflammatory problems, I'm not a great candidate for the normal surgical

procedures that might help the OA problems. He did say that I'm eventually

looking at a total knee replacement, but that should be a long term

consideration. I'm also kind of a surgeon's worst nightmare because of a

blood clotting disorder and severe allergies to most painkillers. Ugh

In the meantime, he has sort of left me with " learning to cope with it " .

He did give me a month's worth of Celebrex samples to try and said that he

will talk to my rheumy about maybe adjusting my RA meds to see if we can

find a better combo. I'm currently on Plaquenil and injectable MTX. I

did got to physical therapy and they gave me some things to work on at home,

but even the therapist wasn't really positive and pretty much told me that

it won't get better, I will just have to learn to adapt. I do have knee

braces that I sometimes wear, but I don't think they really help much, so I

only use them when I'm going to walking a lot.

So.anyone have lots of knee problems at a 'young' age and what did you do?

Does this all sound right or should I see a second opinion? This surgeon

is a family friend, and I do trust him, but I hate the idea that there isn't

really anything I can do to help these dang knees.

Thanks in advance,

Ronda

[Guest guest]

I have had knee problems since i was 18 i am now 29.  My problem first came up

when i tore a ligament on the side of my knee cap.  In 200 i had to have that

ligament removed and the other side cut so my knee cap would hold in place. 

The doctor told me after my operation because he had to smooth down my

cartiledge that i would get osteoarthritis in my knee.  This happened in 2007

during the winter when i had more pain than usual in that knee.  I also have

rheumatoid arthritis which is not in my knees but in all of my other major lower

joints.  So i have a wait and see game on when i will need a knee replacement

or what he is willing to do.  If your not happy with the first orthopedics

opinion get another opinion.  It is not worth the pain just because they say

there is nothing they can do. 

> I have been having lots of trouble with my knees lately and I'm wondering if

> anyone has a similar issue and if so, what was helpful to you. I have RA

> and OA in both knees, so there a couple of issues going on in each knee.

> In October, my orthopedic surgeon injected both knees with cortisone and

> Supartz (Hyralonic acid) and said that if it helped, I would get 3 to 6

> months of relief from the knee pain. Well, it worked for maybe a week or 2

> - absolutely not worth it. I went back in to see him yesterday and he took

> another set of x-rays so that he can keep a close eye on some of the

> problems within. Here's where we're stuck. I'm 'only 40' so he is really

> hesitant to do anything aggressive. He feels that because of the

> inflammatory problems, I'm not a great candidate for the normal surgical

> procedures that might help the OA problems. He did say that I'm eventually

> looking at a total knee replacement, but that should be a long term

> consideration. I'm also kind of a surgeon's worst nightmare because of a

> blood clotting disorder and severe allergies to most painkillers. Ugh

>

> In the meantime, he has sort of left me with " learning to cope with it " .

> He did give me a month's worth of Celebrex samples to try and said that he

> will talk to my rheumy about maybe adjusting my RA meds to see if we can

> find a better combo. I'm currently on Plaquenil and injectable MTX. I

> did got to physical therapy and they gave me some things to work on at home,

> but even the therapist wasn't really positive and pretty much told me that

> it won't get better, I will just have to learn to adapt. I do have knee

> braces that I sometimes wear, but I don't think they really help much, so I

> only use them when I'm going to walking a lot.

>

> So.anyone have lots of knee problems at a 'young' age and what did you do?

> Does this all sound right or should I see a second opinion? This surgeon

> is a family friend, and I do trust him, but I hate the idea that there isn't

> really anything I can do to help these dang knees.

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

> Ronda

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[Guest guest]

Rhonda,

 

Get the second opinion. My mother had a car accident during her mid-late 20's

and was given a total hip replacement at that time. She went back in for a

second replacement in her mid-late 40's. She is now 65 and still doing great!

 

Betsy

[Guest guest]

Hi Ronda:

I went through all you are going through. My dr. said you are too young

for a knew replacement. I was 62. My right knee was bone on bone, lots

of Osteo. Arthritis, etc. My leg was deformed and my knee was bending

over, so I was knock kneed. I was in agony. I wore a brace for

support. Finally I had the Arthriscopy surgery. It lasted 1 1/2 years,

and I was in worse shape then before. I had cortisone shots in between

which did nothing. I was in agony, so he did another one. It was a

waste of time also.

When I moved here to Florida, I saw a new Ortho. Dr., he xrayed and

examined my knee, and wanted to know why I waited so long to get my knee

fixed. I told him, " my dr. on Cape Cod said I was too young, and

wouldn 't do a replacement.

I had a total knee replacement done in 3 weeks, and my knee has been

perfect since then. Too me it is a lot of crap we are too young for

surgery. Those other 2 surgery's were a waste of time, etc.

If my left knee gets that way, I will have the replacement done right

away. No more senseless waiting, and having all that terrible pain and

suffering.

Hope this helps you. Maybe try another Ortho. Dr. for a second opinion.

Wishing you pain free days.

Hugs,

Barbara

What a waste of time! It lasted 1 1/2 years, so

> From: Ronda mamaronda@...

> Subject: [ ] Let's Talk Knees

>

> Date: Tuesday, January 27, 2009, 11:03 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> I have been having lots of trouble with my knees lately and I'm

wondering if

>

> anyone has a similar issue and if so, what was helpful to you. I have

RA

>

> and OA in both knees, so there a couple of issues going on in each

knee.

>

> In October, my orthopedic surgeon injected both knees with cortisone

and

>

> Supartz (Hyralonic acid) and said that if it helped, I would get 3 to

6

>

> months of relief from the knee pain. Well, it worked for maybe a week

or 2

>

> - absolutely not worth it. I went back in to see him yesterday and he

took

>

> another set of x-rays so that he can keep a close eye on some of the

>

> problems within. Here's where we're stuck. I'm 'only 40' so he is

really

>

> hesitant to do anything aggressive. He feels that because of the

>

> inflammatory problems, I'm not a great candidate for the normal

surgical

>

> procedures that might help the OA problems. He did say that I'm

eventually

>

> looking at a total knee replacement, but that should be a long term

>

> consideration. I'm also kind of a surgeon's worst nightmare because of

a

>

> blood clotting disorder and severe allergies to most painkillers. Ugh

>

>

>

> In the meantime, he has sort of left me with " learning to cope with

it " .

>

> He did give me a month's worth of Celebrex samples to try and said

that he

>

> will talk to my rheumy about maybe adjusting my RA meds to see if we

can

>

> find a better combo. I'm currently on Plaquenil and injectable MTX. I

>

> did got to physical therapy and they gave me some things to work on at

home,

>

> but even the therapist wasn't really positive and pretty much told me

that

>

> it won't get better, I will just have to learn to adapt. I do have

knee

>

> braces that I sometimes wear, but I don't think they really help much,

so I

>

> only use them when I'm going to walking a lot.

>

>

>

> So.anyone have lots of knee problems at a 'young' age and what did you

do?

>

> Does this all sound right or should I see a second opinion? This

surgeon

>

> is a family friend, and I do trust him, but I hate the idea that there

isn't

>

> really anything I can do to help these dang knees.

>

>

>

> Thanks in advance,

>

>

>

> Ronda

>

>

>

>