vaccines

[Guest guest]

Ok. Still a bit unclear. What exactly are the alternatives here? Do not

Polio and Diphtheria fit the category of 'dire need'?

I agree that in cases like the Chicken Pox vaccine, profit and hysteria are

the motivators, BTW.

And yes, vaccines do take advantage of the body's natural response to

disease. However, in cases like Polio, the body has an insufficient

response, and often succumbs to the disease. That's where a vaccine bolsters

the body's response to the disease.

In cases like Polio, what is worse? A disease running rampant that

definitely causes children to be diseased, or the chance that the vaccine

may trigger a bad body response? Do you have any empirical studies available

supporting this position?

I'm still not getting the direction of all this. Are you advocating not

vaccinating at all? Or just selectively?

Just curious.

--

Robbie in Mass, US

SLE, Reactive Arthritis (Reiter's), AS.

> And yes, there are alternatives to vaccines and to suffering.

> Unfortunately, depending on your position, they do not siphon as much

> money out of the patient's pocket nor is the system for their use

> ingrained in the insurance industry.

>

>> Most of these diseases were developed because the human body couldn't

>> fight them off. What would be the alternative to vaccinations, to

>> protect people from these diseases?

>

> That's not correct at all. In fact, the vaccines themselves attempt to

> take advantage of the immune system's natural reactions.

[Guest guest]

The Hype:

FDA Approves Combined Hepatitis Vaccine

Hepatitis A can be spread in fecally contaminated food and water, and symptoms include nausea, vomiting and sometimes jaundice, a yellowing of the skin due to reduced liver function. Hepatitis B can be spread by infected blood or body fluids, such as during sexual contact, sharing IV needles, or by using contaminated equipment in body piercing or tattooing.The US Food and Drug Administration approved a combination vaccine for hepatitis A and hepatitis B on November 12. The Twinrix vaccine is the world's only combination vaccine for the prevention of hepatitis A and B. Hepatitis A and hepatitis B are viruses that infect the liver. The approval is also especially important for Americans traveling overseas, who often are vaccinated for hepatitis A but not hepatitis B, she said. Each year, an estimated 125,000 to 200,000 Americans are infected with hepatitis A and another 140,000 to 320,000 are infected with hepatitis B. Twinrix currently is approved in 70 markets worldwide, including the European Union, where it was launched in 1996. Glaxo has distributed nearly 12 million doses.Reuters Washington D.C., November 13, 2001

THE TRUTH

DR. MERCOLA'S COMMENT:

While 67% of hepatitis A cases occur in children, over 70% of the deaths occur in those over the age of 49. Even with those risks for adults, complications are rare and infection from hepatitis A is generally followed by complete recovery.

So we have yet another vaccine recommendation with very little benefit.

According to the hepatitis A vaccine manufacturers' own product inserts, the hepatitis A vaccine has NOT been "evaluated or tested for its carcinogenic potential, mutagenic potential, or for impairment of fertility" or "reproductive capacity".

It is irresponsible to recommend this vaccine because there have been NO long term studies on the cumulative effect on the child's developing immune system. Combining this vaccine with all the required vaccines together, the biological mechanism for why some children react to this vaccine is not understood, and there are no genetic or other lab screening tests available to determine which children will react to this vaccine.

Hepatitis B vaccine is associated with its own set of problems, the most significant being brain injury. This was largely related to the common practice of administering this vaccine that has mercury as a preservative, to newborns within a few days of being born.Hepatitis B is a rare, mainly blood-transmitted disease. In 1996 only 54 cases of the disease were reported to the CDC in the 0-1 age group.

Fifty-four cases in the entire United States. 54 out of millions upon millions of babies, yet they want all of them vaccinated. The HepB virus is mandatory in California for entry to 7th grade. Gee, guess who's making out? It certainly isn't the children. Thank you, Dr. Mercola, for stating so clearly and succinctly what many of us on this list have been trying to get across for some time!

Caveat Emptor

Regards, -----------------------Geoff ** Usual Disclaimers ** -----------------------The Formula:Ge12.2+2Sa7.12.13(1Ch17.12.14)+(Ps2+69.4\72/78.2+107.9)+Is2.3/7.14\11.1-5/35.4-6(42.1-4+45.21+50.6+52.13)53+59.16+Je31.15+Mi5.2=SarShalom HaMoshiach

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[Guest guest]

Just curious, I see alot of talk about vaccines and how they

may or may not have some role in our children's speech

delay, and my question is this....Does anyone think that the

fact that some vaccines are given 3 at a time has any role

in Apraxia? I don't mean M-M-R as three, but 3 different

vaccines at once? All of my children were given 3 at once,

the oldest has no delay, my 2nd has Dyspraxia and low muscle

tone, possibly a non progressive muscle disorder and my 3rd

has Verbal Apraxia, slight low upper body strength (this I

think is just hereditary) they are 15,14 and 9 all doing

very well, happy well adjusted kids. The 2 Apraxic kids do

have short term memory, but my 2nd is like an encyclopedia

of very interesting information like " who was president when

the first sound movie was made? " Yes, he knows the answer

too!! We call these things his " Gifts and Talents " Anyhow,

any input on this would be great!! Thanks to all! mom

to 3 great kids!

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I think the main other concern re vaccines is the Thimerosal content

( mercury) .

Your FDA ,and your Govt, now accepts that any child following the

prescribed vaccination programnme receives many times the maximum

acceptable levels of mercury and that this is potentially harmful -

certainly not desirable .

The main group of parents suing the manufacturers for damage from the

multiple injection of thimerosal/mercury are the parents of autistic

children ..but many of them prescribe the apraxia part of their

childs condition to the same cause .

Thimersosal is not permitted in any new vaccines but most of our kids

had the " full hit " . If any of your kids are due any other shots (

excluding the MMR which is live and therefore dosn't contain

thimerosal) you should check as the drugs companies were permitted to

sell existing stock -...so your Doctor may offer you injections with

it in it . I'm not actually clear why any parent aware of the

existence of thimerosal free would accept injections with thimerosal

in ..but the choice is yours !!!

Interestingly the Gulf War veterans attribute many of their symptoms

to the number of injections given in such a short period - as well as

the thimerosal content - and various other issues.

Guess it will all come to light sooner or later !

Regards

Deborah

> Just curious, I see alot of talk about vaccines and how they

> may or may not have some role in our children's speech

> delay, and my question is this....Does anyone think that the

> fact that some vaccines are given 3 at a time has any role

> in Apraxia? I don't mean M-M-R as three, but 3 different

> vaccines at once? All of my children were given 3 at once,

> the oldest has no delay, my 2nd has Dyspraxia and low muscle

> tone, possibly a non progressive muscle disorder and my 3rd

> has Verbal Apraxia, slight low upper body strength (this I

> think is just hereditary) they are 15,14 and 9 all doing

> very well, happy well adjusted kids. The 2 Apraxic kids do

> have short term memory, but my 2nd is like an encyclopedia

> of very interesting information like " who was president when

> the first sound movie was made? " Yes, he knows the answer

> too!! We call these things his " Gifts and Talents " Anyhow,

> any input on this would be great!! Thanks to all! mom

> to 3 great kids!

[Guest guest]

Hi -

I did this for my kids a year or so ago, before the recent shortage

of vaccines. I just called our ped's office to make sure they had

doses of each component. This particular ped would order them

individually upon request.

Take care,

Vicki

> Just wondering if anyone knows how to go about getting the MMR

separately.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I don't think so... I think the vaccines may still contain things

like aluminum, formaldehyde... I am also worried about what the

vaccines " do " when they are in the body. My son's neurologist, a

very prominent seattle neurologist, told me that " we don't really

know WHAT vaccines do to a child's immune system " . He said that

people have hypotheses, and there are certain things you can measure,

but what are the long term effects of the vaccine?? He had no

answer. Anyway, I personally would say NO WAY to any vaccinations,

especially until you feel that your son NO LONGER has any of the

symptoms. I know how you are feeling--torn. My littlest one--I keep

going back and forth on whether or not to vax her, but she has some

very mild symptoms of toxicity and so I am telling myself to wait.

Wait until these are gone to even THINK about it, and then I am not

sure we will vax after that time has passed. Whatever you do, don't

make your decision right there in the docs office. Make your mind up

one way or another. And if your decision going in was NO, then in NO

WAY allow yourself to change your mind right then and there. Make an

appt to reschedule and then think about it some more. They are

really good at making parents feel guilty for not vaxing their kids!

Don't sway to the pressure on the spot--give yourself more time to

think.

W

> All, If you get the No Preservative vaccines are you safe from

further toxicity of metals, Zeb will be due his four year old shots

for school and I'm terrified.

[Guest guest]

> All, If you get the No Preservative vaccines are you safe from

further toxicity of metals,

Depends. Are they truly " no preservative " ? Some vax use aluminum.

Also, many kids regressed after MMR, which contains no thimerosal. So

you might be " safe from further toxicity of metals " , but you might not

be " safe from further problems " .

>>Zeb will be due his four year old shots

for school and I'm terrified.

Ask for titres, or just waive them.

http://www.autismchannel.net/dana/myvaxopn.htm

http://www.access1.net/via/STATES/allstates.htm

Dana

[Guest guest]

I live in Ohio. The school papers all make it sound like you have to have

your children vaccinated. My two youngest have had NO vaccinations. I have

to sign a paper every year that says I have a philosophical objection. I am

probably the only parent who in town who does this. The school system had to

dig to find the paper for me to sign.

After the first three years the nurses lay off with they scare tactics. " You

know if any child in the area comes down with ____ your child will not be

allowed in school. - My kids have not missed any days of school for not

being vaccinated.

barb

---

[This E-mail scanned for viruses by LRBCG.COM, Inc.]

[Guest guest]

<<<"Youknow if any child in the area comes down with ____ your child will not beallowed in school.>>>>

This is my absolutely favorite argument. With shock and horror, I say "But doctor, nurse, teacher, or whoever, if they were vaccinated, how could they get ______????????" hahahahahaaaaaaa

Idiots, ALL of them!!!

Good for you, Barbara. It's not easy to 'go against the flow'.

-----Original Message-----From: Barbara F. [mailto:BF@...] Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 8:24 PMDr Subject: RE: vaccinesI live in Ohio. The school papers all make it sound like you have to haveyour children vaccinated. My two youngest have had NO vaccinations. I haveto sign a paper every year that says I have a philosophical objection. I amprobably the only parent who in town who does this. The school system had todig to find the paper for me to sign.After the first three years the nurses lay off with they scare tactics. "Youknow if any child in the area comes down with ____ your child will not beallowed in school. - My kids have not missed any days of school for notbeing vaccinated.barb---[This E-mail scanned for viruses by LRBCG.COM, Inc.]

[Guest guest]

Here's a link to keep bookmarked, lists how to get exemptions for

vaccinations by state (religious, medical and philosophical exemptions):

<A HREF= " http://www.access1.net/via/STATES/allstates.htm " >Vaccine Exemptions by

State</A>

-BJ in polis, MD

[Guest guest]

> sometime ago on this list someone gave a place to get

> a copy of a form letter (or something) that you could

> give to your school and or doctor regarding refusal to

> get your child vaccinated...am I thinking correct

> here...can I legally refuse when he goes to

> kindergarten to get him vaccinated/?? Does it matter

> what State you live in...

Check here

http://www.access1.net/via/STATES/allstates.htm

Dana

[Guest guest]

,

We followed the recommended vaccine schedule for our son, , who

is 35 months old and has Apraxia. We are, however, altering the

schedule for our daughter, , age 7 and 1/2 months. I am new to

all this vaccine research but have been told to read and foolow Dr.

Cave's suggestions in her book (I think it is " What Doctors

Don't tell you about Vaccines).

Let us know what you find out. I think vaccines are great but need

to be spread out and further studied, personally. What happened to

your son is horrible. I would have freaked out. Feel free to email

me.

Kate

> Does anyone know where I might research or who I should talk to

> about vaccines? We chose to give Nick the vaccines individually

> rather than in clusters and just before he was 6 months old a nurse

> accidently gave him a second dose of the IPV. With me almost

> hysterical and nurses running all around checking in books and

> calling the poison control center a doctor came out and told us

that

> it was fine and would not hurt him. After switching to a new

> doctor's office (can you believe the old one actually called and

> asked WHY we left!) we have always wondered what it might have done

> to him. Now reading here about a possible connection between

> vaccines and speech issues I'm even more driven to research this

> issue.

>

> Thank you!

> - SAHM to Nick 2.5 months

[Guest guest]

What an awful story! I am so sorry that your child had to go through that.

I suppose at this point you are looking more for solutions than sympathy,

but none-the-less...THAT IS HORRIBLE!

Back on topic, a book that I found very helpful is " What your doctor may not

tell you about children's vaccinations " . I must say that it was pretty fair

to both sides of the debate but very helpful and practical.

We have chosen to vaccinate but spread out the vaccinations and do some of

the proactive stuff that is suggested in the book prior to and after the

shots.

Tricia Morin

North Carolina

<Does anyone know where I might research or who I should talk to

about vaccines? We chose to give Nick the vaccines individually

rather than in clusters and just before he was 6 months old a nurse

accidently gave him a second dose of the IPV. With me almost

hysterical and nurses running all around checking in books and

calling the poison control center a doctor came out and told us that

it was fine and would not hurt him. After switching to a new

doctor's office (can you believe the old one actually called and

asked WHY we left!) we have always wondered what it might have done

to him. Now reading here about a possible connection between

vaccines and speech issues I'm even more driven to research this

issue.

[Guest guest]

Hello,

I can recommend an excellent book by Dr. Cave: What Your Doctor May

Not tell you about Children's Vaccinations. I researched extensively and read

every book I could find on the issue. I liked this one best b/c I felt it gave

a fair and accurate representation of BOTH sides, as opposed to being more

one-sided as I found the other books to be. It also is the most up-to-date,

being published in 2001. Of course, there is the classic, A Shot in the Dark,

but it is extremely anti-vaccination, though I would also recommend it. I

hope this helps.

BTW, if it is any consolation, I did not vaccinate CJ (my youngest) at all-

not even the HIB at birth, and he has apraxia. I unfortunately did allow

vaccinations for my two older children until the ages of 2 1/2 and 4. Mikey is

dyslexic, but I don't believeit has anything to do with the vaccines- it is

familial. could not be more linguistically gifted, so... so much for that

theory!:-).

Austin,

Mom to Mikey 6, 4 1/2, and CJ 20 months

[Guest guest]

Doesn't it just " floor " you when parents talk about the ailments

their child has as if it's just all so normal? Like it's normal for

kids to be this sick... normal to have apnea... normal to have

reflux... normal to have asthma... I guess I never fail to be amazed

at the apathy that some people display regarding their child's

health... they never stop to really ask " why does my child have

this? " .

W

She

> has been plagued with ear and bladder infections since those shots

> began. This daughter sees NO connection.

> I work with a lady who lost a child to sids. Her newest little one

> has already had several episodes of apnea. He's on target with all

> his immunizations. She's sees no connection either. I will never

> authorize another vaccine for our teens or myself. I consider this

> the only safe path. B. RN

[Guest guest]

I guess I never fail to be amazed

> at the apathy that some people display regarding their child's

> health... they never stop to really ask " why does my child have

> this? " .

> W

The doctors assure them that this normal and not to worry. And if

you question them too much they start to say the problem is not the

kid, it's the mom.I remember asking why my son had such bad asthma,

AND skin rashes AND loose stools AND wasn't talking. I was assured

that these things " just happen sometime " and I should treat the

symptoms and not worry so much. Even when it was finally obvious

that he was falling off the growth chart and refusing to eat because

of stomach pain, I had to argue to get a referral to a gastro. Not

that he was actually much help either....but looking back it is mind-

boggling to me how casually these symptoms were dismissed! One of my

biggest regrets is that I actually believed those idiots as long as

I did.

Kat

[Guest guest]

> The doctors assure them that this normal and not to worry.

There is a difference between " normal " and " common " . Ask whether the doctor

means it is normal, or common. And then ask the

doctor to describe the difference between those two words.

Dana

[Guest guest]

And, ask the physician what scientific method he is utilizing to

reach that conclusion. Lol.

I remember asking why my son had such bad asthma,

> AND skin rashes AND loose stools AND wasn't talking. I was assured

> that these things " just happen sometime " and I should treat the

> symptoms and not worry so much.

[Guest guest]

she should get a hair test before doing anything.

> On the AM board, someone posted a link to a list which states which

vaccines contain thimerosal and how much. I was actually trying to

get my hands on a list that shows the types with NO (not even a

trace) of thimerosal in it. This list does state the ones with " 0 " ,

but I'm unsure as to whether or not that means NONE at all.

> I didn't get a response, but was wondering if anyone here knows?

Or maybe a place with a link for ones that have none? I have a

friend who is going to vaccinate yet wants to then take all other

precautionary steps. No thimerosal, individual doses, separate

dates, and make sure her child's healthy.

> Thanks,

> Kari

>

> [ ] Vaccine Lots and Information on

Thimerasol

>

>

> While this is not definitive for any particular lot (I believe

you have

> to call the manufacturer) this is a list of thimerasol content in

> certain vaccines.

>

> http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/thi-table.htm

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>>I have a friend who is going to vaccinate yet wants to then take all

other precautionary steps. No thimerosal, individual doses, separate

dates, and make sure her child's healthy.

The best advice that I know of, is to have her read the actual package

insert of the vaccine her child will be receiving. Read it herself,

don't rely on a nurse to do so. See if it contains anything she does

not agree with.

Dana

[Guest guest]

Can I have a copy of the list please.

Migdalia (DEE)

[Guest guest]

Sam,

Each state has exemptions, the details of which you can find on the web.

Religious exemption does not require that you show or prove adherence to any

particular denomination. Some base their religious or philosophical refusal on

" my child's body is a temple and I don't believe in putting garbage (toxins) in

it " others on the fact that many vaccines also contain human fetal tissue. You

can also request titres which shows immunity. While you're at it avoid mercury

amalgam dental fillings.

S

<tt>

<BR>

My 8 year old has PDD with very high levels of mercury in his brain. <BR>

WE know it is from the vaccinnes. My question is this - what do we <BR>

do about the future vaccines required to be given to our children on <BR>

their next wellness checkup? These vaccines still have thermisol in <BR>

them. I don't trust anyone. Any suggestions?<BR>

Sam<BR>

<BR>

<BR>

<BR>

</tt>

<br><br>

<tt>

=======================================================<BR>

[Guest guest]

Get an exemption--either medical or religious. Most states have some form

of this, although the health services will only tell you if you ask.

Barb

[ ] Vaccines

>

>

> My 8 year old has PDD with very high levels of mercury in his brain.

> WE know it is from the vaccinnes. My question is this - what do we

> do about the future vaccines required to be given to our children on

> their next wellness checkup? These vaccines still have thermisol in

> them. I don't trust anyone. Any suggestions?

> Sam

>

>

>

>

>

> =======================================================

>

[Guest guest]

> My 8 year old has PDD with very high levels of mercury in his brain.

> WE know it is from the vaccinnes. My question is this - what do we

> do about the future vaccines required to be given to our children on

> their next wellness checkup?

I don't bring my kids to " wellness checkups " any more, so you can

consider that.

Find your state here, learn how to waive vax

http://home.san.rr.com/via/STATES/allstates.htm

Here are my ideas, plus a book recommendation, on " safer " vax, if you

decide you want to continue vax

http://www.danasview.net/myvaxopn.htm

Here is the table of current vax production, altho you would still

have to check the specific documentation YOURSELF to determine if the

one/s you are allowing contain thimerosal

http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/thi-table.htm

>>These vaccines still have thermisol in

> them. I don't trust anyone. Any suggestions?

Continue to not trust anyone but yourself.

Dana

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/3/2005 8:22:34 AM Eastern Standard Time,

writes:

> Each state has exemptions, the details of which you can find on the web.

> Religious exemption does not require that you show or prove adherence to any

> particular denomination. Some base their religious or philosophical refusal

> on " my child's body is a temple and I don't believe in putting garbage

> (toxins) in it " others on the fact that many vaccines also contain human fetal

> tissue.

The Religious Vaccine Exemption includes: X,Y,Z vaccines are grown on aborted

fetal cells and we believe that this is a violation of God's law on the

grounds that it could justify/promote abortions. P,Q,R vaccines contain live

viruses and we believe that it is a violation of God's law to intentionally

introduce these illnesses into our child. Hepatitis B is genetically engineered,

and

we believe that genetic engineering is a violation of God's law. P, Q, R, S,

T, U, V, W, X, Y, and Z vaccines alter and have been known to cause damage to

the God-given immune system, and contain poisons & known allergens, so we

object to these immunizations on the grounds that it is violation of God's law.

For more info: www.VaccineAwareness.org