Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

[Guest guest]

Dave you are in the position that the majority

of men are after surgery, compounded by the fact that you were have erection

problems prior to surgery. You might find this piece of interest http://www.yananow.net/Stimulate.htm

- but essentially, unless you are prepared to try a variety of optional

therapies, under the guidance of a qualified medical person, including bi-mix

and tri-mix injections, you’re not likely to get anything useful

happening.

All the best

Terry Herbert

I have no medical

qualifications but I was diagnosed in ‘96: and have learned a bit since

then.

My sites are at www.yananow.net and www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

Dr

“Snuffy” Myers : " As a physician, I am painfully aware that most of

the decisions we make with regard to prostate cancer are made with inadequate

data "

From: ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of xenophonami

Sent: Wednesday, 23 December 2009

2:11 PM

To: ProstateCancerSupport

Subject:

Thinking of changing my urologist...

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full

nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but

my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves

replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so

I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and

sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a

crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist

simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be

able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories.

My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it

doesn't seem to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would

be " stuffable " but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a

real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He

doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working

me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds.

He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize

for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I

feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back

to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me

on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really

nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving.

I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

Even if the nerves are spared, there is still damage to the supporting capillary blood vessels. ED meds may or may not help, MUSE is an expensive waste, and though effective, bi-mix or tri-mix injections seem to be effective, but can cause damage over the long term and tend to be painful in its effect. By far, the best option, if ED drugs do not work adequately or have intolerable and possibly dangerous side effects for you (and considering the previous heart condition may be ruled out), penile implant is likely to be best, by far, the best option. The AMS LGX-700 seems to have the highest satisfaction record. Like any procedure, the most experienced and those with the best record of success for the implant surgeon is a requirement.Louis. . . To: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Tue, December 22, 2009 10:10:47 PMSubject: Thinking of changing my urologist...

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be "stuffable" but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a

747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds.

He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving.

I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

Age?Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerryDate: Wed, 23 Dec 2009 03:10:47 -0000To: <ProstateCancerSupport >Subject: Thinking of changing my urologist... I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be " stuffable " but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds.He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving.I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.- Dave

[Guest guest]

I am 56 and despite recent problems basically pretty robust.

Terry, I read your page and it does me no good. My drug plan rations me to six

hard-ons a month from whatever drug and does not recognize post-op treatment as

a reason to change that. I could easily get meds from Canada, but just can't

afford anything not covered right now.

While I know that the odds are against me, I resent that the urologist isn't

willing to try anything else but Muse or injections, isn't willing to consider

discussing my meds with my other docs, doesn't even want to try Viagra, has no

interest in why I started to have problems in the first place, etc..

As for injections, no f***ing way, pun intended! My wife is capable of doing it,

but the thought repels me and the whole thing is even more of a romance killer

than the Muse. " Yes, my love, we'll get it on, just as soon as you shove a

flaming sword into my cock " , right! I'm not cowardly about pain, I once walked a

half mile on a through and through ankle fracture, but not that.

Age? Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

Thinking of changing my urologist...

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery

I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been

falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple

medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having

it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I

have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something

vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I

was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted

erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me

enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything

useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be " stuffable " but they

aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper

airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but

injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my

cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known for his surgical

ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the

surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now

falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he

doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give

me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least

hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any thoughts anyone would

like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

I need to be clear mine prostectic and I wish I had the name is totally implanted. The pump is in the scrotum (sp) sack and the resorvior is in abdominum (sp) and I have never had ant problem. The women like it because even when I cum they can still enjoy ubtil they are finished. They refer to me as a "boy toy".

Tom W.

I have had total prostectomy and radiation.

To: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Wed, December 23, 2009 10:33:02 AMSubject: RE: Thinking of changing my urologist...

Alan:

At the risk of getting personal, I must ask, did your erection pump come with "cock rings"? With mine, the whole idea is to trap the blood in the erection by applying uniform pressure to the base of the penis. After the act, one simply removes the cock ring. I got three different sizes with the pump. I do notice that the pumps are not featured at the local Walgreen's and other pharmacies as they used to be. Perhaps there's a liability issue or a feeling that they just plain don't work. I'm not a big fan but the pumps do work.

From: ProstateCancerSuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com [mailto:ProstateCan cerSupport@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Alan MeyerSent: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 9:59 AMTo: ProstateCancerSuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) comSubject: Re: [ProstateCancerSupp ort] Thinking of changing my urologist...

xenophonami <xenophonami@ yahoo.com> wrote:> ... I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he> doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I> think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really> nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty> minutes less driving.> I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.Dave,On the question of consulting the other urologist, I think theanswer is a definite Yes.It is (or should be) standard medical practice that when apatient has a significant problem a second opinion is desirable.You're clearly having a significant problem. It may not botheryour urologist very much but it's bothering you and a secondopinion seems perfectly reasonable to me. It's not

an insult toyour current urologist to see another one.Now as to the underlying question of what your options are, hereare a few suggestions:1. Viagra/Levitra/ Cialis.If you can't afford these and your insurance won't pay, youcan get generics reasonably cheaply from India. Indian patentlaws don't recognize foreign drug patents and the Indianmanufacturers operate above board, legally (in India) and withwhatever regulation the Indian government provides. What youget is likely to be made in a real drug factory, with properlabeling and packaging, not something cobbled together by apirate in his basement.I haven't bought Viagra from India but my wife did get genericFosamax there and was very satisfied. The source, IIRC, wasoverseasrx.comThey did ask for a prescription, which she had.Will it work?Probably not,

but you never know.2. Vacuum erection device.This is a plastic tube with a hand pump that fits over thepenis and allows you to pump the air out of the tube, drawingblood into the penis and causing a big erection.Will it work?I wasn't able to use it effectively. I deflated as soon as Ipulled away the tube. It was like the story of the guy whohad these magic shorts that attracted women, but if he tookthem off ...But apparently it takes practice and effort with pumps andrings to get it right. Some me are very happy with them.You can buy them off the web, no prescription needed Ibelieve.3. Injections.A lot of men report that these do work. However, like you,I'm squeamish about them. I've never tried and don't plan to.4. Implants.I should think anyone squeamish about injections would beterrified of an implant. I wouldn't consider one under

anycircumstances.In the first place, I wouldn't want the operation. In thesecond place, I would be afraid of very serious long termeffects of having a large foreign body inserted into my penis.And in the third place, psychologically, for me, I think itwould feel like I had turned my penis into a dildo.But that's me.5. Creative sex.We all know that there are many positions in which to havesexual intercourse. Well, there are a great many more ways tohave sex without penetration. Oral sex, manual sex,lubricants, showers, furniture, various ways to hold and worktogether - the possibilities seem almost unlimited.It requires a willing partner. It requires sensitive and opencommunication with your partner. It requires experimentationand learning over time.This is the one that works for me.Best of luck.Alan

[Guest guest]

I need to be clear mine prostectic and I wish I had the name is totally implanted. The pump is in the scrotum (sp) sack and the resorvior is in abdominum (sp) and I have never had ant problem. The women like it because even when I cum they can still enjoy ubtil they are finished. They refer to me as a "boy toy".

Tom W.

I have had total prostectomy and radiation.

To: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Wed, December 23, 2009 10:33:02 AMSubject: RE: Thinking of changing my urologist...

Alan:

At the risk of getting personal, I must ask, did your erection pump come with "cock rings"? With mine, the whole idea is to trap the blood in the erection by applying uniform pressure to the base of the penis. After the act, one simply removes the cock ring. I got three different sizes with the pump. I do notice that the pumps are not featured at the local Walgreen's and other pharmacies as they used to be. Perhaps there's a liability issue or a feeling that they just plain don't work. I'm not a big fan but the pumps do work.

From: ProstateCancerSuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com [mailto:ProstateCan cerSupport@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Alan MeyerSent: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 9:59 AMTo: ProstateCancerSuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) comSubject: Re: [ProstateCancerSupp ort] Thinking of changing my urologist...

xenophonami <xenophonami@ yahoo.com> wrote:> ... I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he> doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I> think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really> nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty> minutes less driving.> I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.Dave,On the question of consulting the other urologist, I think theanswer is a definite Yes.It is (or should be) standard medical practice that when apatient has a significant problem a second opinion is desirable.You're clearly having a significant problem. It may not botheryour urologist very much but it's bothering you and a secondopinion seems perfectly reasonable to me. It's not

an insult toyour current urologist to see another one.Now as to the underlying question of what your options are, hereare a few suggestions:1. Viagra/Levitra/ Cialis.If you can't afford these and your insurance won't pay, youcan get generics reasonably cheaply from India. Indian patentlaws don't recognize foreign drug patents and the Indianmanufacturers operate above board, legally (in India) and withwhatever regulation the Indian government provides. What youget is likely to be made in a real drug factory, with properlabeling and packaging, not something cobbled together by apirate in his basement.I haven't bought Viagra from India but my wife did get genericFosamax there and was very satisfied. The source, IIRC, wasoverseasrx.comThey did ask for a prescription, which she had.Will it work?Probably not,

but you never know.2. Vacuum erection device.This is a plastic tube with a hand pump that fits over thepenis and allows you to pump the air out of the tube, drawingblood into the penis and causing a big erection.Will it work?I wasn't able to use it effectively. I deflated as soon as Ipulled away the tube. It was like the story of the guy whohad these magic shorts that attracted women, but if he tookthem off ...But apparently it takes practice and effort with pumps andrings to get it right. Some me are very happy with them.You can buy them off the web, no prescription needed Ibelieve.3. Injections.A lot of men report that these do work. However, like you,I'm squeamish about them. I've never tried and don't plan to.4. Implants.I should think anyone squeamish about injections would beterrified of an implant. I wouldn't consider one under

anycircumstances.In the first place, I wouldn't want the operation. In thesecond place, I would be afraid of very serious long termeffects of having a large foreign body inserted into my penis.And in the third place, psychologically, for me, I think itwould feel like I had turned my penis into a dildo.But that's me.5. Creative sex.We all know that there are many positions in which to havesexual intercourse. Well, there are a great many more ways tohave sex without penetration. Oral sex, manual sex,lubricants, showers, furniture, various ways to hold and worktogether - the possibilities seem almost unlimited.It requires a willing partner. It requires sensitive and opencommunication with your partner. It requires experimentationand learning over time.This is the one that works for me.Best of luck.Alan

[Guest guest]

Dave,

Is right some think it is time for that to be over and some have moral and ethical views based on a more conservative religious view of sex. Some think since the lady might be slowing down then why should you.

Not their decision for your body.

Tom W.

To: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Wed, December 23, 2009 10:52:15 AMSubject: Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

Dave --Terry's answer was brief, but he's got the two essential points right:1. Since your erectile function wasn't good before surgery, it's likely to be completely gone after surgery.2. If you want to regain erectile function, you'll need aggressive treatment by someone who cares about ED, and who knows what he's doing. MUSE isn't "well-tolerated" by most men; your surgeon should have known that when he prescribed it. But if you started out with a "no injections!" position, it was the only thing remaining in his medicine bag.I suggest reading:. . . "Saving Your Sex Life: A Guide to Men with Prostate Cancer" -- Dr. MulhallInjections are "unacceptable" for a lot of men, until they try them, and they work.>> I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything useful for me

anyway. He told me my erections would be "stuffable" but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds.> He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving.> I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.> - Dave>

[Guest guest]

Dave,

Is right some think it is time for that to be over and some have moral and ethical views based on a more conservative religious view of sex. Some think since the lady might be slowing down then why should you.

Not their decision for your body.

Tom W.

To: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Wed, December 23, 2009 10:52:15 AMSubject: Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

Dave --Terry's answer was brief, but he's got the two essential points right:1. Since your erectile function wasn't good before surgery, it's likely to be completely gone after surgery.2. If you want to regain erectile function, you'll need aggressive treatment by someone who cares about ED, and who knows what he's doing. MUSE isn't "well-tolerated" by most men; your surgeon should have known that when he prescribed it. But if you started out with a "no injections!" position, it was the only thing remaining in his medicine bag.I suggest reading:. . . "Saving Your Sex Life: A Guide to Men with Prostate Cancer" -- Dr. MulhallInjections are "unacceptable" for a lot of men, until they try them, and they work.>> I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything useful for me

anyway. He told me my erections would be "stuffable" but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds.> He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving.> I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.> - Dave>

[Guest guest]

My Dear Dave:

The conservative religious right needs to wake up and smell the coffee. There is absolutely nothing wrong with sex. If two consenting adults want to have sex, then go for it, BABY!! Where the hell is the SIN? I could go on-and-on; I'll stop here.

A Happy Gay Married Man To Another Gay Man,

Doug Archer, San Diego

To: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Wed, December 23, 2009 9:50:19 AMSubject: Re: Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

Dave,

Is right some think it is time for that to be over and some have moral and ethical views based on a more conservative religious view of sex. Some think since the lady might be slowing down then why should you.

Not their decision for your body.

Tom W.

From: C <cpcohen1945@ yahoo.com>To: ProstateCancerSuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) comSent: Wed, December 23, 2009 10:52:15 AMSubject: [ProstateCancerSupp ort] Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

Dave --Terry's answer was brief, but he's got the two essential points right:1. Since your erectile function wasn't good before surgery, it's likely to be completely gone after surgery.2. If you want to regain erectile function, you'll need aggressive treatment by someone who cares about ED, and who knows what he's doing. MUSE isn't "well-tolerated" by most men; your surgeon should have known that when he prescribed it. But if you started out with a "no injections!" position, it was the only thing remaining in his medicine bag.I suggest reading:. . . "Saving Your Sex Life: A Guide to Men with Prostate Cancer" -- Dr. MulhallInjections are "unacceptable" for a lot of men, until they try them, and they work.>> I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything useful for me

anyway. He told me my erections would be "stuffable" but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds.> He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving.> I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.> -

Dave>

[Guest guest]

My Dear Dave:

The conservative religious right needs to wake up and smell the coffee. There is absolutely nothing wrong with sex. If two consenting adults want to have sex, then go for it, BABY!! Where the hell is the SIN? I could go on-and-on; I'll stop here.

A Happy Gay Married Man To Another Gay Man,

Doug Archer, San Diego

To: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Wed, December 23, 2009 9:50:19 AMSubject: Re: Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

Dave,

Is right some think it is time for that to be over and some have moral and ethical views based on a more conservative religious view of sex. Some think since the lady might be slowing down then why should you.

Not their decision for your body.

Tom W.

From: C <cpcohen1945@ yahoo.com>To: ProstateCancerSuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) comSent: Wed, December 23, 2009 10:52:15 AMSubject: [ProstateCancerSupp ort] Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

Dave --Terry's answer was brief, but he's got the two essential points right:1. Since your erectile function wasn't good before surgery, it's likely to be completely gone after surgery.2. If you want to regain erectile function, you'll need aggressive treatment by someone who cares about ED, and who knows what he's doing. MUSE isn't "well-tolerated" by most men; your surgeon should have known that when he prescribed it. But if you started out with a "no injections!" position, it was the only thing remaining in his medicine bag.I suggest reading:. . . "Saving Your Sex Life: A Guide to Men with Prostate Cancer" -- Dr. MulhallInjections are "unacceptable" for a lot of men, until they try them, and they work.>> I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything useful for me

anyway. He told me my erections would be "stuffable" but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds.> He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving.> I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.> -

Dave>

[Guest guest]

I am not sure how the discussion got off onto this tangent.

Doug, I appreciate the sentiments but, while married, I am not gay but bisexual.

I will not get into a discussion about any aspect of that here. I would be

perfectly happy having sex with my wife, but right now I can't even satisfy my

own right hand.

Tom, no one seems to be discouraging me from having sex. I may have differences

with my urologist's way of dealing with me but I don't doubt his good

intentions.

, I think you are missing one important point: my erectile difficulties

started months before my PSA went up and the timeframe points to medications

that I'm on. The surgery didn't change that so the urologist's disinterest in

following that up is wrong. So is his unwillingness to even consider oral meds.

It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen Viagra or Cialis to see

if it works. I wonder whether he would try oral meds first if the alternative

was sticking something into his own penis. I had to use Google to find out about

Trimix gel. You'd think any reasonable GU would consider it or at least explain

why he wouldn't before I raised the question. I mean the guy only does hundreds

of radical prostatectomies a year. You'd think he would have the postop

management down pat and hope not down to a robotic routine.

As for injections, my discomfort with the idea is only half the problem. Having

had allergy shots just about weekly from age 5 to age 17, I have hundreds of

tiny scars on my upper arms. They don't cause me any particular problems, but my

arms are not my penis and I don't see how someone would avoid getting scarred up

and having problems with that. I see on the official Caverject website: " After

you pull the needle out of your penis hold the alcohol swab on the injection

site for about 5 minutes. Or until any bleeding stops. " Bleeding? Scarring? Does

this sound like a good thing to do to yourself? Unless you're a client of Lady

's dungeon it doesn't sound like a way to have fun.

- Dave

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery

I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been

falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple

medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having

it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I

have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something

vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I

was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted

erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me

enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything

useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be " stuffable " but they

aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper

airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but

injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my

cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known for his surgical

ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the

surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now

falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he

doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give

me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least

hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any thoughts anyone would

like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

I am not sure how the discussion got off onto this tangent.

Doug, I appreciate the sentiments but, while married, I am not gay but bisexual.

I will not get into a discussion about any aspect of that here. I would be

perfectly happy having sex with my wife, but right now I can't even satisfy my

own right hand.

Tom, no one seems to be discouraging me from having sex. I may have differences

with my urologist's way of dealing with me but I don't doubt his good

intentions.

, I think you are missing one important point: my erectile difficulties

started months before my PSA went up and the timeframe points to medications

that I'm on. The surgery didn't change that so the urologist's disinterest in

following that up is wrong. So is his unwillingness to even consider oral meds.

It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen Viagra or Cialis to see

if it works. I wonder whether he would try oral meds first if the alternative

was sticking something into his own penis. I had to use Google to find out about

Trimix gel. You'd think any reasonable GU would consider it or at least explain

why he wouldn't before I raised the question. I mean the guy only does hundreds

of radical prostatectomies a year. You'd think he would have the postop

management down pat and hope not down to a robotic routine.

As for injections, my discomfort with the idea is only half the problem. Having

had allergy shots just about weekly from age 5 to age 17, I have hundreds of

tiny scars on my upper arms. They don't cause me any particular problems, but my

arms are not my penis and I don't see how someone would avoid getting scarred up

and having problems with that. I see on the official Caverject website: " After

you pull the needle out of your penis hold the alcohol swab on the injection

site for about 5 minutes. Or until any bleeding stops. " Bleeding? Scarring? Does

this sound like a good thing to do to yourself? Unless you're a client of Lady

's dungeon it doesn't sound like a way to have fun.

- Dave

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery

I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been

falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple

medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having

it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I

have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something

vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I

was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted

erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me

enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything

useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be " stuffable " but they

aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper

airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but

injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my

cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known for his surgical

ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the

surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now

falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he

doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give

me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least

hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any thoughts anyone would

like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

xenophonami wrote:

> ... It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen

> Viagra or Cialis to see if it works. ...

Let's say he's 99% likely to be right, that Viagra won't help

you. Even so, your request seems reasonable to me. Viagra has

had dangerous side effects (blindness) in only an extraordinarily

tiny fraction of men using it. Tens of millions of men have

taken it without problem. So, unless he knows of some special

reason why you shouldn't have it (e.g., conflict with another

medication) why not try it?

I would put it to him just that way. The upside potential is

small but if there's no downside, why not? I'd call on the phone

and leave a message asking for him to call you or just phone in a

prescription to your pharmacy. You shouldn't have to pay for

another office visit for this. If he still won't do it, I'd ask

your GP. Any doc can prescribe it.

That's my two cents worth of advice which, in honor of Christmas,

I'm dispensing for free.

Happy Holidays and good luck with it.

Alan

[Guest guest]

xenophonami wrote:

> ... It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen

> Viagra or Cialis to see if it works. ...

Let's say he's 99% likely to be right, that Viagra won't help

you. Even so, your request seems reasonable to me. Viagra has

had dangerous side effects (blindness) in only an extraordinarily

tiny fraction of men using it. Tens of millions of men have

taken it without problem. So, unless he knows of some special

reason why you shouldn't have it (e.g., conflict with another

medication) why not try it?

I would put it to him just that way. The upside potential is

small but if there's no downside, why not? I'd call on the phone

and leave a message asking for him to call you or just phone in a

prescription to your pharmacy. You shouldn't have to pay for

another office visit for this. If he still won't do it, I'd ask

your GP. Any doc can prescribe it.

That's my two cents worth of advice which, in honor of Christmas,

I'm dispensing for free.

Happy Holidays and good luck with it.

Alan

[Guest guest]

Dave,Merry Christmas and I will put a nickle's worth in. You need to contact your urologist and have them send a letter of need for the meds due to medical necessity. My uro's office does this frequently. As a matter of fact, mine will pick up when I get my next refill. They want me to take a 20 mg Cialis every 3 days. My insurance only allows 6 "pills per month or every 5 days. Right now, I have been splitting a pill and using it on alternating doses. I am 16 months post op and have just started getting automatic erections, not hard enough for sex, but at least where I can get manipulation for an orgasmic feeling. I use a VEP every day and keep the "clamp" on for 15 minutes twice a day (it says no longer than 30 minutes at a time. Tried Muse to no avail. BTW. I had a mishap that set

me back when I had to change a tire and pulled the nerve bundle loose and still have a bit of incontinence as well.Steve S in ArkansasTo: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Fri, December 25, 2009 11:41:54 AMSubject: Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

I am not sure how the discussion got off onto this tangent.

Doug, I appreciate the sentiments but, while married, I am not gay but bisexual. I will not get into a discussion about any aspect of that here. I would be perfectly happy having sex with my wife, but right now I can't even satisfy my own right hand.

Tom, no one seems to be discouraging me from having sex. I may have differences with my urologist's way of dealing with me but I don't doubt his good intentions.

, I think you are missing one important point: my erectile difficulties started months before my PSA went up and the timeframe points to medications that I'm on. The surgery didn't change that so the urologist's disinterest in following that up is wrong. So is his unwillingness to even consider oral meds. It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen Viagra or Cialis to see if it works. I wonder whether he would try oral meds first if the alternative was sticking something into his own penis. I had to use Google to find out about Trimix gel. You'd think any reasonable GU would consider it or at least explain why he wouldn't before I raised the question. I mean the guy only does hundreds of radical prostatectomies a year. You'd think he would have the postop management down pat and hope not down to a robotic routine.

As for injections, my discomfort with the idea is only half the problem. Having had allergy shots just about weekly from age 5 to age 17, I have hundreds of tiny scars on my upper arms. They don't cause me any particular problems, but my arms are not my penis and I don't see how someone would avoid getting scarred up and having problems with that. I see on the official Caverject website: "After you pull the needle out of your penis hold the alcohol swab on the injection site for about 5 minutes. Or until any bleeding stops." Bleeding? Scarring? Does this sound like a good thing to do to yourself? Unless you're a client of Lady 's dungeon it doesn't sound like a way to have fun.

- Dave

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be "stuffable" but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It

hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

Dave,Merry Christmas and I will put a nickle's worth in. You need to contact your urologist and have them send a letter of need for the meds due to medical necessity. My uro's office does this frequently. As a matter of fact, mine will pick up when I get my next refill. They want me to take a 20 mg Cialis every 3 days. My insurance only allows 6 "pills per month or every 5 days. Right now, I have been splitting a pill and using it on alternating doses. I am 16 months post op and have just started getting automatic erections, not hard enough for sex, but at least where I can get manipulation for an orgasmic feeling. I use a VEP every day and keep the "clamp" on for 15 minutes twice a day (it says no longer than 30 minutes at a time. Tried Muse to no avail. BTW. I had a mishap that set

me back when I had to change a tire and pulled the nerve bundle loose and still have a bit of incontinence as well.Steve S in ArkansasTo: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Fri, December 25, 2009 11:41:54 AMSubject: Re: Thinking of changing my urologist...

I am not sure how the discussion got off onto this tangent.

Doug, I appreciate the sentiments but, while married, I am not gay but bisexual. I will not get into a discussion about any aspect of that here. I would be perfectly happy having sex with my wife, but right now I can't even satisfy my own right hand.

Tom, no one seems to be discouraging me from having sex. I may have differences with my urologist's way of dealing with me but I don't doubt his good intentions.

, I think you are missing one important point: my erectile difficulties started months before my PSA went up and the timeframe points to medications that I'm on. The surgery didn't change that so the urologist's disinterest in following that up is wrong. So is his unwillingness to even consider oral meds. It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen Viagra or Cialis to see if it works. I wonder whether he would try oral meds first if the alternative was sticking something into his own penis. I had to use Google to find out about Trimix gel. You'd think any reasonable GU would consider it or at least explain why he wouldn't before I raised the question. I mean the guy only does hundreds of radical prostatectomies a year. You'd think he would have the postop management down pat and hope not down to a robotic routine.

As for injections, my discomfort with the idea is only half the problem. Having had allergy shots just about weekly from age 5 to age 17, I have hundreds of tiny scars on my upper arms. They don't cause me any particular problems, but my arms are not my penis and I don't see how someone would avoid getting scarred up and having problems with that. I see on the official Caverject website: "After you pull the needle out of your penis hold the alcohol swab on the injection site for about 5 minutes. Or until any bleeding stops." Bleeding? Scarring? Does this sound like a good thing to do to yourself? Unless you're a client of Lady 's dungeon it doesn't sound like a way to have fun.

- Dave

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be "stuffable" but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It

hurts, too. He doesn't offer anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any thoughts anyone would like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

Steve,

My urologist's letter of medical necessity might as well have been asking them

to send me a lightly grilled weasel on toast for all the good it did. They don't

recognize the use of any ED meds for rehab. If it's not an FDA approved use in

the package insert it's not going to happen. I filed an appeal but I think I

filed it to the wrong place - the one where they look at it, snort in disgust

and use it to light a Havana cigar that they bought with my spouse's union dues.

The Muse doesn't fail me completely. I get a sort of an erection, not very hard,

not very big and it burns and I get strange pains in the pelvic area. The

erection doesn't last long and doesn't feel like arousal, just like a response

to irritation (like when I got a painful erection a week after the biopsy due to

passing clots). Then for a few hours afterward I get a little bit of stirring

which reminds me of what it felt like to be intact. It's not a sexual feeling at

all, and it's no good to me or my partner for anything but making me feel

depressed all over again.

I'm not going to even start on my partner's intact capability and total lack of

interest coming up against my intact desire and total lack of capability. I get

sick thinking about spending the next 30 years this way.

- Dave.

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the

surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had

been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on

multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to

having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the

RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to

something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me

that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an

unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan

won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem

to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be

" stuffable " but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is

like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer

anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying

to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known

for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another

problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like

my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who

diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I

think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for

me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any

thoughts anyone would like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

Steve,

My urologist's letter of medical necessity might as well have been asking them

to send me a lightly grilled weasel on toast for all the good it did. They don't

recognize the use of any ED meds for rehab. If it's not an FDA approved use in

the package insert it's not going to happen. I filed an appeal but I think I

filed it to the wrong place - the one where they look at it, snort in disgust

and use it to light a Havana cigar that they bought with my spouse's union dues.

The Muse doesn't fail me completely. I get a sort of an erection, not very hard,

not very big and it burns and I get strange pains in the pelvic area. The

erection doesn't last long and doesn't feel like arousal, just like a response

to irritation (like when I got a painful erection a week after the biopsy due to

passing clots). Then for a few hours afterward I get a little bit of stirring

which reminds me of what it felt like to be intact. It's not a sexual feeling at

all, and it's no good to me or my partner for anything but making me feel

depressed all over again.

I'm not going to even start on my partner's intact capability and total lack of

interest coming up against my intact desire and total lack of capability. I get

sick thinking about spending the next 30 years this way.

- Dave.

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before the

surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest had

been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on

multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to

having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the

RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to

something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me

that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an

unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan

won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem

to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be

" stuffable " but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is

like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer

anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying

to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known

for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another

problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like

my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who

diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I

think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for

me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any

thoughts anyone would like to share.

- Dave

[Guest guest]

Hi Dave,

You've received some good advice but I'll put mine in as well. I had my robotic

RP a little over 2 years ago, at 58, and no cancer so far. My nerves were

spared as well. Like you, my surgical Uro was not very good at ED and I changed

to a Uro who is much better.

I've seen guys get their full erections back quickly and others who never do.

I've got a lot of function back after 18 months and still very slow progress but

I still need help.

What I've done:

Pills. Viagra, Levitra, Cialis . . . . . well, at least the Indian version

which is cheaper and just as good. My insurance doesn't cover it and the Indian

stuff (the best is alldaychemist.com) is a fraction of the cost. It helps but

no full erection by itself.

VED. I used it early on and occasionally had erections that were sufficient for

sex. If it weren't for injections, I might still be trying it.

Injections: Surgical Uro would only prescribe Edex which is expensive and

painful. My current uro has me on bimix. There is a one second sting about

half the time, other times no pain at all. I get a very good and long lasting

erection and great sex. My Uro tells me that I can continue indefinitely as

long as their are no bad side effects.

Implant. As my Uro tells me, you burn all of your bridges when you have an

implant, or a penile prosthesis. Lots of guys swear by them but I look at it as

a last resort.

I know you are dead set against injections. I do understand that too. I had

witnessed that before surgery and thought that if I ever had to do that, then

just shoot me. However, 6 months with no erection made me rethink things.

In any case, my only advice is keep your mind open and find you a good ED

specialist, even if it is another Uro. Most of us have gone through some degree

of depression. None of us are young and we often have a hard time changing old

habits and adapting to a new way of doing things and the docs are not a lot of

help in preparing us for the changes we need to make.

So keep in touch here and in Yana and other places and feel free to ask in this

group or any of us individually.

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before

the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest

had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on

multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to

having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the

RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to

something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me

that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an

unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan

won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem

to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be

" stuffable " but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is

like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer

anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying

to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known

for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another

problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like

my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who

diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I

think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for

me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any

thoughts anyone would like to share.

> - Dave

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Dave,

You've received some good advice but I'll put mine in as well. I had my robotic

RP a little over 2 years ago, at 58, and no cancer so far. My nerves were

spared as well. Like you, my surgical Uro was not very good at ED and I changed

to a Uro who is much better.

I've seen guys get their full erections back quickly and others who never do.

I've got a lot of function back after 18 months and still very slow progress but

I still need help.

What I've done:

Pills. Viagra, Levitra, Cialis . . . . . well, at least the Indian version

which is cheaper and just as good. My insurance doesn't cover it and the Indian

stuff (the best is alldaychemist.com) is a fraction of the cost. It helps but

no full erection by itself.

VED. I used it early on and occasionally had erections that were sufficient for

sex. If it weren't for injections, I might still be trying it.

Injections: Surgical Uro would only prescribe Edex which is expensive and

painful. My current uro has me on bimix. There is a one second sting about

half the time, other times no pain at all. I get a very good and long lasting

erection and great sex. My Uro tells me that I can continue indefinitely as

long as their are no bad side effects.

Implant. As my Uro tells me, you burn all of your bridges when you have an

implant, or a penile prosthesis. Lots of guys swear by them but I look at it as

a last resort.

I know you are dead set against injections. I do understand that too. I had

witnessed that before surgery and thought that if I ever had to do that, then

just shoot me. However, 6 months with no erection made me rethink things.

In any case, my only advice is keep your mind open and find you a good ED

specialist, even if it is another Uro. Most of us have gone through some degree

of depression. None of us are young and we often have a hard time changing old

habits and adapting to a new way of doing things and the docs are not a lot of

help in preparing us for the changes we need to make.

So keep in touch here and in Yana and other places and feel free to ask in this

group or any of us individually.

I had a robotic-assisted RP in June with full nerve-sparing. Before

the surgery I had been having some erection problems, but my spouse's interest

had been falling off for some time, I had two heart valves replaced and was on

multiple medications that could cause potency problems, so I never got around to

having it worked up. While I still had some function and sensation before the

RP, I have had none since, though I can masturbate after a crude fashion to

something vaguely reminiscent of an orgasm. My urologist simply keeps telling me

that if I was having problems before surgery I won't be able to have an

unassisted erection after and went right to Muse suppositories. My drug plan

won't give me enough to use as frequently as he recommends and it doesn't seem

to do anything useful for me anyway. He told me my erections would be

" stuffable " but they aren't even that; what I get compared to a real hard-on is

like a wet paper airplane compared to a 747. It hurts, too. He doesn't offer

anything else but injections (No way!)and won't consider working me up or trying

to work with my cardiologist and other docs to modify my meds. He is well-known

for his surgical ability and was gracious enough to apologize for another

problem related to the surgery (but not related to my erections.)I feel he, like

my penis, is now falling down on the job. I would like to go back to the GU who

diagnosed me - he doesn't do robotic-assisted so he referred me on - because I

think he would give me a better hearing and if there is really nothing else for

me, I could at least hear it after forty minutes less driving. I welcome any

thoughts anyone would like to share.

> - Dave

>

[Guest guest]

Dave --

1. You're right about the heart meds being a possible cause for the ED. But

(if I understand the medicine right) they're tricky to adjust. Your urologist

may want your cardiologist to have the _sole_ responsibility for changing them

-- rather like an electrician saying " I won't touch that! " when he finds a

water-pipe that needs cutting.

2. Sorry -- I missed that the uro didn't prescribe oral drugs, after you asked

for them. That fact, alone, suggests that you need a new doctor -- this one

_doesn't care enough_.

2. The diabetic market has grown huge over the past decades, and technology has

improved. BD makes " Ultrafine II " syringes -- 31-gauge needles, 5/16 " long.

With a spring-loaded auto-injector, they're just about painless. You can feel

the needle go in, but " pain " isn't the right word. And the erection is

first-class.

Bleeding? I _do_ keep pressure on the spot for 4 minutes, but I usually see no

blood at all, and never more than a speck on the alcohol pad. As I remember,

Caverject recommends a 26-gauge needle, considerably thicker than the diabetic

needles I use.

The standard sequence of ED treatments is something like:

1. Oral drugs

2. VED with rings (which some docs don't like, and others ignore)

3. Penile drugs (MUSE and injections)

4. Implant

For " penile rehab " (as opposed to having fun!), the standard combo is " 1 + 3 " .

From what I've read on a few lists, MUSE is rejected by a lot of men -- too much

pain, unreliable results. But injections are more popular, among men who try

them, and get their dosage right. I'm sorry about your prior experience. Each

of us starts from where he is.

I'm quite happy that I've found a better-than-decent sex life at stage " 3 " -- I

rejected " 4 " before my prostatectomy. I never thought I'd become an

" injection advocate " . But here I am . . .

>

> I am not sure how the discussion got off onto this tangent.

.. . .

> , I think you are missing one important point: my erectile difficulties

started months before my PSA went up and the timeframe points to medications

that I'm on. The surgery didn't change that so the urologist's disinterest in

following that up is wrong. So is his unwillingness to even consider oral meds.

It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen Viagra or Cialis to see

if it works. I wonder whether he would try oral meds first if the alternative

was sticking something into his own penis. I had to use Google to find out about

Trimix gel. You'd think any reasonable GU would consider it or at least explain

why he wouldn't before I raised the question. I mean the guy only does hundreds

of radical prostatectomies a year. You'd think he would have the postop

management down pat and hope not down to a robotic routine.

> As for injections, my discomfort with the idea is only half the problem.

Having had allergy shots just about weekly from age 5 to age 17, I have hundreds

of tiny scars on my upper arms. They don't cause me any particular problems, but

my arms are not my penis and I don't see how someone would avoid getting scarred

up and having problems with that. I see on the official Caverject website:

" After you pull the needle out of your penis hold the alcohol swab on the

injection site for about 5 minutes. Or until any bleeding stops. " Bleeding?

Scarring? Does this sound like a good thing to do to yourself? Unless you're a

client of Lady 's dungeon it doesn't sound like a way to have fun.

> - Dave

>

[Guest guest]

Dave --

1. You're right about the heart meds being a possible cause for the ED. But

(if I understand the medicine right) they're tricky to adjust. Your urologist

may want your cardiologist to have the _sole_ responsibility for changing them

-- rather like an electrician saying " I won't touch that! " when he finds a

water-pipe that needs cutting.

2. Sorry -- I missed that the uro didn't prescribe oral drugs, after you asked

for them. That fact, alone, suggests that you need a new doctor -- this one

_doesn't care enough_.

2. The diabetic market has grown huge over the past decades, and technology has

improved. BD makes " Ultrafine II " syringes -- 31-gauge needles, 5/16 " long.

With a spring-loaded auto-injector, they're just about painless. You can feel

the needle go in, but " pain " isn't the right word. And the erection is

first-class.

Bleeding? I _do_ keep pressure on the spot for 4 minutes, but I usually see no

blood at all, and never more than a speck on the alcohol pad. As I remember,

Caverject recommends a 26-gauge needle, considerably thicker than the diabetic

needles I use.

The standard sequence of ED treatments is something like:

1. Oral drugs

2. VED with rings (which some docs don't like, and others ignore)

3. Penile drugs (MUSE and injections)

4. Implant

For " penile rehab " (as opposed to having fun!), the standard combo is " 1 + 3 " .

From what I've read on a few lists, MUSE is rejected by a lot of men -- too much

pain, unreliable results. But injections are more popular, among men who try

them, and get their dosage right. I'm sorry about your prior experience. Each

of us starts from where he is.

I'm quite happy that I've found a better-than-decent sex life at stage " 3 " -- I

rejected " 4 " before my prostatectomy. I never thought I'd become an

" injection advocate " . But here I am . . .

>

> I am not sure how the discussion got off onto this tangent.

.. . .

> , I think you are missing one important point: my erectile difficulties

started months before my PSA went up and the timeframe points to medications

that I'm on. The surgery didn't change that so the urologist's disinterest in

following that up is wrong. So is his unwillingness to even consider oral meds.

It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen Viagra or Cialis to see

if it works. I wonder whether he would try oral meds first if the alternative

was sticking something into his own penis. I had to use Google to find out about

Trimix gel. You'd think any reasonable GU would consider it or at least explain

why he wouldn't before I raised the question. I mean the guy only does hundreds

of radical prostatectomies a year. You'd think he would have the postop

management down pat and hope not down to a robotic routine.

> As for injections, my discomfort with the idea is only half the problem.

Having had allergy shots just about weekly from age 5 to age 17, I have hundreds

of tiny scars on my upper arms. They don't cause me any particular problems, but

my arms are not my penis and I don't see how someone would avoid getting scarred

up and having problems with that. I see on the official Caverject website:

" After you pull the needle out of your penis hold the alcohol swab on the

injection site for about 5 minutes. Or until any bleeding stops. " Bleeding?

Scarring? Does this sound like a good thing to do to yourself? Unless you're a

client of Lady 's dungeon it doesn't sound like a way to have fun.

> - Dave

>

[Guest guest]

Are you taking nitrates for your heart? That's a specific, and very strong,

contra-indication for _all_ the oral ED meds.

Mulhall won't prescribe Viagra if the patient has any nitrates _in his house_,

even if he's not currently taking them.

>

> I am not sure how the discussion got off onto this tangent.

> , I think you are missing one important point: my erectile difficulties

started months before my PSA went up and the timeframe points to medications

that I'm on. The surgery didn't change that so the urologist's disinterest in

following that up is wrong. So is his unwillingness to even consider oral meds.

It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen Viagra or Cialis to see

if it works. I wonder whether he would try oral meds first if the alternative

was sticking something into his own penis.

[Guest guest]

Are you taking nitrates for your heart? That's a specific, and very strong,

contra-indication for _all_ the oral ED meds.

Mulhall won't prescribe Viagra if the patient has any nitrates _in his house_,

even if he's not currently taking them.

>

> I am not sure how the discussion got off onto this tangent.

> , I think you are missing one important point: my erectile difficulties

started months before my PSA went up and the timeframe points to medications

that I'm on. The surgery didn't change that so the urologist's disinterest in

following that up is wrong. So is his unwillingness to even consider oral meds.

It costs him nothing to write a scrip for a half-dozen Viagra or Cialis to see

if it works. I wonder whether he would try oral meds first if the alternative

was sticking something into his own penis.

[Guest guest]

Dave --

1. Your reaction to MUSE is (unfortunately) common. Injectable Caverject

causes some pain in a substantial number of men who try it. " Bi-mix " (no

Caverject) and 'tri-mix' (a little Caverject) are tolerated better.

2. Don't ignore the " interpersonal aspects " of what you're going through!

.. . . " Prostate cancer is a couples' disease. "

Most doctors ignore such considerations -- no training, no expertise, and lots

of embarassment around emotional problems. My wife and I were very happy with a

sexual-function specialist we saw. She was concerned with _both of us_

individually, and how we related to each other. [We were also having a good sex

life before surgery, which helped a lot.]

Unlike a surgeon, she had no ego invested in the quality of my surgery. The

motto of some urologists should be:

.. . . " I've done a good job -- what's wrong with _you_ ? "

So she was willing to try stuff until we found something that worked.

>

.. . .

> The Muse doesn't fail me completely. I get a sort of an erection, not very

hard, not very big and it burns and I get strange pains in the pelvic area. The

erection doesn't last long and doesn't feel like arousal, just like a response

to irritation (like when I got a painful erection a week after the biopsy due to

passing clots). Then for a few hours afterward I get a little bit of stirring

which reminds me of what it felt like to be intact. It's not a sexual feeling at

all, and it's no good to me or my partner for anything but making me feel

depressed all over again.

> I'm not going to even start on my partner's intact capability and total lack

of interest coming up against my intact desire and total lack of capability. I

get sick thinking about spending the next 30 years this way.

> - Dave.

>