Re: Courious about rising PSA

[Guest guest]

Larry Helber wrote:

> Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was

> immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of

> February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive

> margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month

> post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the

> low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on

> hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base

> line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after

> my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this

> something to worry about? Should I just wait and see what

> happens after the radiation is over?

Any rise in PSA is worrisome, but there's nothing to do about it

but wait and see.

The fact that you had positive margins actually turns out to be a

good thing. It means that there was cancer in the area

immediately around the prostate. That area will be reached by

your radiation.

If you had negative margins, that would have meant that the PSA

was coming from someplace other than immediately around the

prostate - obviously a bad thing because it might not be within

the radiation field. You may still have cancer in some area

outside the radiation field, in which case the radiation won't

cure you, but at least the evidence suggests that you've got a

fighting chance.

Your doctor may want you to continue the hormone therapy for a

significant time after the radiation ends. You may not want to

do that, but if he recommends it, I would give it very serious

consideration. It is my understanding that statistics show that

radiation plus hormones provides a better shot at salvage than

radiation alone, though the doc should have a better idea about

your specific case.

Best of luck Larry. May all your cancer cells be zapped.

Alan

[Guest guest]

I had the hormone shot in Feb....the radiation ..28 times...has been completed four weeks ago.

I've not had my next psa. It is scheduled in Sept..with a POSSIBLE additional proton shot. I WOULD HOPE I DON"T NEED IT. I would do a wait and see...until six months passes....just my thought. I'm 73...and aside from the two weeks following the end of the radiation and having to pee 30 + times a day..and hurt like hell...no problems. Actually slept thru the nite last nite..and did not have to get up ONCE! THAT IS GOOD! And..the sweats finally slowing down...and I would sure do the same treatment over again!

Subject: Courious about rising PSATo: ProstateCancerSupport Date: Wednesday, August 11, 2010, 3:17 AM

Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this something to worry about? Should I just wait and see what happens after the radiation is over?

[Guest guest]

Thank you Jim for your thoughts. The

doctor had already said that he expected me to be on hormones 1 – 2 years

after radiation. I am not really happy about it but I was willing to go

at least a year. That is a long to wait to see if the salvage worked.

My concern is that .06 rise. I am on hormones now that should (hopefully)

prevent that from happening. At least for me .06 is a doubling in a

couple of months but can .06 also be considered a small normal fluctuation in a

body. I hope to chat with the doctor again today after my treatment to

see what he has to say.

From:

ProstateCancerSupport

[mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of Alan Meyer

Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010

12:49 AM

To: ProstateCancerSupport

Subject: Re:

Courious about rising PSA

Larry Helber wrote:

> Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was

> immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of

> February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive

> margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month

> post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the

> low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on

> hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base

> line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after

> my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this

> something to worry about? Should I just wait and see what

> happens after the radiation is over?

Any rise in PSA is worrisome, but there's nothing to do about it

but wait and see.

The fact that you had positive margins actually turns out to be a

good thing. It means that there was cancer in the area

immediately around the prostate. That area will be reached by

your radiation.

If you had negative margins, that would have meant that the PSA

was coming from someplace other than immediately around the

prostate - obviously a bad thing because it might not be within

the radiation field. You may still have cancer in some area

outside the radiation field, in which case the radiation won't

cure you, but at least the evidence suggests that you've got a

fighting chance.

Your doctor may want you to continue the hormone therapy for a

significant time after the radiation ends. You may not want to

do that, but if he recommends it, I would give it very serious

consideration. It is my understanding that statistics show that

radiation plus hormones provides a better shot at salvage than

radiation alone, though the doc should have a better idea about

your specific case.

Best of luck Larry. May all your cancer cells be zapped.

Alan

[Guest guest]

I'm anxious to see what mine is ....the first time. AND..i would like to HOPE that I won't get shot number two..and more of the sweats. BUT..you hve to do what you have to do. Those .06 numbers seem REALLY LOW TO me...but will have to wait and see. WILL LET YOU KNOW...

and once you have had the radiation...I had 28 sessions...can they RESTART and do more at a later date? I never thought to ask that...> Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was> immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of> February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive> margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month> post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the> low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on> hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base> line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after> my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this> something to worry about? Should I just wait and see

what> happens after the radiation is over?Any rise in PSA is worrisome, but there's nothing to do about itbut wait and see.The fact that you had positive margins actually turns out to be agood thing. It means that there was cancer in the areaimmediately around the prostate. That area will be reached byyour radiation.If you had negative margins, that would have meant that the PSAwas coming from someplace other than immediately around theprostate - obviously a bad thing because it might not be withinthe radiation field. You may still have cancer in some areaoutside the radiation field, in which case the radiation won'tcure you, but at least the evidence suggests that you've got afighting chance.Your doctor may want you to continue the hormone therapy for asignificant time after the radiation ends. You may not want todo that, but if he recommends it, I would give it very

seriousconsideration. It is my understanding that statistics show thatradiation plus hormones provides a better shot at salvage thanradiation alone, though the doc should have a better idea aboutyour specific case.Best of luck Larry. May all your cancer cells be zapped.Alan

[Guest guest]

I regret to see that Jim and Larry are two more brothers on ADT

without, evidently, any support from their medics. Are they uros?

Here are links to two excellent articles on the SEs of ADT,

called Androgen Deprivation Syndrome, and how to cope with them:

>

http://www.prostate-cancer.org/education/andind/Guess_TestosteroneSideEffects.ht\

ml

> or

> http://tinyurl.com/2ymb8f

>

> http://www.prostate-cancer.org/education/sidefx/Strum_ADS.html

> or

> http://tinyurl.com/g6fzp

They are authored by well-qualified people and are very helpful.

Regards,

Steve J

[Guest guest]

Well from what I understand about the

radiation they can re-nuke you if that is what they think it would help.

Chances are it won’t. When they nuke you the first time they take

an educated guess on where the cancer cells reside. (Hint: it is close to the

prostate). So they nuke the prostate bed (carpet bomb was my oncologist’s

term for it). If they think they need it they may nuke your lymph nodes

too. Then it is a waiting game. If the PSA goes up the tendency is

to assume the cancer cells have escaped the pelvic bed and has migrated to the

rest of the body. The $100,000 question is where? You can only nuke

them if you know were they are and then only if it is in an area where they can

safely zap them. The other option is to use a systemic (whole body)

treatment instead of radiation. That is why chemo is the more common “next

step”.

From:

ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ]

On Behalf Of Jim Hoppe

Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010

9:58 PM

To:

ProstateCancerSupport

Subject: RE:

Courious about rising PSA

I'm anxious to see what mine is ....the first

time. AND..i would like to HOPE that I won't get shot number

two..and more of the sweats. BUT..you hve to do what you have to

do. Those .06 numbers seem REALLY LOW TO me...but will have to wait

and see. WILL LET YOU KNOW...

and once you have had the radiation...I had 28

sessions...can they RESTART and do more at a later date? I never

thought to ask that...

> Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was

> immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of

> February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive

> margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month

> post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the

> low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on

> hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base

> line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after

> my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this

> something to worry about? Should I just wait and see what

> happens after the radiation is over?

Any rise in PSA is worrisome, but there's nothing to do about it

but wait and see.

The fact that you had positive margins actually turns out to be a

good thing. It means that there was cancer in the area

immediately around the prostate. That area will be reached by

your radiation.

If you had negative margins, that would have meant that the PSA

was coming from someplace other than immediately around the

prostate - obviously a bad thing because it might not be within

the radiation field. You may still have cancer in some area

outside the radiation field, in which case the radiation won't

cure you, but at least the evidence suggests that you've got a

fighting chance.

Your doctor may want you to continue the hormone therapy for a

significant time after the radiation ends. You may not want to

do that, but if he recommends it, I would give it very serious

consideration. It is my understanding that statistics show that

radiation plus hormones provides a better shot at salvage than

radiation alone, though the doc should have a better idea about

your specific case.

Best of luck Larry. May all your cancer cells be zapped.

Alan

[Guest guest]

With IGRT the claim is that they can pinpoint where the cancer cells are. After 44 treatments, I hope so. All I know is that my PSA has stayed at 0.1 for some number of months after IGRT treatment. But it'll be a long time until I'm "out of the woods."

Very best wishes to all of you whatever solution you choose. Staying positive is the best "cure."

Tom/65/dx 4/09/one malignant sample out of 12/3+3/current PSA 0.1

RE: Courious about rising PSA

Well from what I understand about the radiation they can re-nuke you if that is what they think it would help. Chances are it won’t. When they nuke you the first time they take an educated guess on where the cancer cells reside. (Hint: it is close to the prostate). So they nuke the prostate bed (carpet bomb was my oncologist’s term for it). If they think they need it they may nuke your lymph nodes too. Then it is a waiting game. If the PSA goes up the tendency is to assume the cancer cells have escaped the pelvic bed and has migrated to the rest of the body. The $100,000 question is where? You can only nuke them if you know were they are and then only if it is in an area where they can safely zap them. The other option is to use a systemic (whole body) treatment instead of radiation. That is why chemo is the more common “next step”.

From: ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of Jim HoppeSent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 9:58 PMTo: ProstateCancerSupport Subject: RE: Courious about rising PSA

I'm anxious to see what mine is ....the first time. AND..i would like to HOPE that I won't get shot number two..and more of the sweats. BUT..you hve to do what you have to do. Those .06 numbers seem REALLY LOW TO me...but will have to wait and see. WILL LET YOU KNOW...

and once you have had the radiation...I had 28 sessions...can they RESTART and do more at a later date? I never thought to ask that...> Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was> immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of> February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive> margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month> post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the> low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on> hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base> line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after> my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this> something to worry about? Should I just wait and see what> happens after the radiation is over?Any rise in PSA is worrisome, but there's nothing to do about itbut wait and see.The fact that you had positive margins actually turns out to be agood thing. It means that there was cancer in the areaimmediately around the prostate. That area will be reached byyour radiation.If you had negative margins, that would have meant that the PSAwas coming from someplace other than immediately around theprostate - obviously a bad thing because it might not be withinthe radiation field. You may still have cancer in some areaoutside the radiation field, in which case the radiation won'tcure you, but at least the evidence suggests that you've got afighting chance.Your doctor may want you to continue the hormone therapy for asignificant time after the radiation ends. You may not want todo that, but if he recommends it, I would give it very seriousconsideration. It is my understanding that statistics show thatradiation plus hormones provides a better shot at salvage thanradiation alone, though the doc should have a better idea aboutyour specific case.Best of luck Larry. May all your cancer cells be zapped.Alan

[Guest guest]

My Oncologist told my wife that it happens

pretty quick if the radiation fails. If it doesn’t work your PSA

will “typically” climb soon after the treatment is over. That

may be a good sign for you. Your understanding of IGRT may be a little

off BTW. It is true that with IGRT and IMRT they can pinpoint where they

can send the radiation. What they can’t see is exactly where the

cancer cells are. The only way to do that is look at them through a

microscope. I also understand that from the pathology dept. it s also

best done after they have been frozen. Something you can’t do with

living tissue. You can see a target a tumor but there are often stray

cells outside it. The Oncocologists makes a best guess as to where they

are and targets the IGRT there.

From:

ProstateCancerSupport

[mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of Tom Lauterback

Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010

9:28 AM

To: ProstateCancerSupport

Subject: Re:

Courious about rising PSA

With IGRT the claim is that they can pinpoint where the

cancer cells are. After 44 treatments, I hope so. All I know is that my PSA has

stayed at 0.1 for some number of months after IGRT treatment. But it'll be a

long time until I'm " out of the woods. "

Very best wishes to all of you whatever solution you choose.

Staying positive is the best " cure. "

Tom/65/dx 4/09/one malignant sample out of 12/3+3/current

PSA 0.1

RE:

Courious about rising PSA

I'm anxious to

see what mine is ....the first time. AND..i would like to HOPE

that I won't get shot number two..and more of the sweats. BUT..you hve

to do what you have to do. Those .06 numbers seem REALLY LOW TO

me...but will have to wait and see. WILL LET YOU KNOW...

and once you

have had the radiation...I had 28 sessions...can they RESTART and do

more at a later date? I never thought to ask that...

> Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was

> immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of

> February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive

> margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month

> post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the

> low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on

> hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base

> line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after

> my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this

> something to worry about? Should I just wait and see what

> happens after the radiation is over?

Any rise in PSA is worrisome, but there's nothing to do about it

but wait and see.

The fact that you had positive margins actually turns out to be a

good thing. It means that there was cancer in the area

immediately around the prostate. That area will be reached by

your radiation.

If you had negative margins, that would have meant that the PSA

was coming from someplace other than immediately around the

prostate - obviously a bad thing because it might not be within

the radiation field. You may still have cancer in some area

outside the radiation field, in which case the radiation won't

cure you, but at least the evidence suggests that you've got a

fighting chance.

Your doctor may want you to continue the hormone therapy for a

significant time after the radiation ends. You may not want to

do that, but if he recommends it, I would give it very serious

consideration. It is my understanding that statistics show that

radiation plus hormones provides a better shot at salvage than

radiation alone, though the doc should have a better idea about

your specific case.

Best of luck Larry. May all your cancer cells be zapped.

Alan

[Guest guest]

BTW Tom I hope you didn’t take my

previous note the wrong way. I am having one of those “cancer kicked my

butt” days and haven’t been too pleasant. I try to keep a positive

attitude but it doesn’t always work. My best of luck wishes go out to

you. 3 more weeks of radiation for me and then I can just go back to dealing

with ADT for a while. Who would have thought that was a good thing right? J

From:

ProstateCancerSupport

[mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of Tom Lauterback

Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010

9:28 AM

To:

ProstateCancerSupport

Subject: Re:

Courious about rising PSA

With IGRT the claim is that they can pinpoint where the

cancer cells are. After 44 treatments, I hope so. All I know is that my PSA has

stayed at 0.1 for some number of months after IGRT treatment. But it'll be a

long time until I'm " out of the woods. "

Very best wishes to all of you whatever solution you choose.

Staying positive is the best " cure. "

Tom/65/dx 4/09/one malignant sample out of 12/3+3/current

PSA 0.1

RE:

Courious about rising PSA

I'm anxious to

see what mine is ....the first time. AND..i would like to HOPE

that I won't get shot number two..and more of the sweats. BUT..you hve

to do what you have to do. Those .06 numbers seem REALLY LOW TO

me...but will have to wait and see. WILL LET YOU KNOW...

and once you

have had the radiation...I had 28 sessions...can they RESTART and do

more at a later date? I never thought to ask that...

> Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was

> immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of

> February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive

> margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month

> post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the

> low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on

> hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base

> line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after

> my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this

> something to worry about? Should I just wait and see what

> happens after the radiation is over?

Any rise in PSA is worrisome, but there's nothing to do about it

but wait and see.

The fact that you had positive margins actually turns out to be a

good thing. It means that there was cancer in the area

immediately around the prostate. That area will be reached by

your radiation.

If you had negative margins, that would have meant that the PSA

was coming from someplace other than immediately around the

prostate - obviously a bad thing because it might not be within

the radiation field. You may still have cancer in some area

outside the radiation field, in which case the radiation won't

cure you, but at least the evidence suggests that you've got a

fighting chance.

Your doctor may want you to continue the hormone therapy for a

significant time after the radiation ends. You may not want to

do that, but if he recommends it, I would give it very serious

consideration. It is my understanding that statistics show that

radiation plus hormones provides a better shot at salvage than

radiation alone, though the doc should have a better idea about

your specific case.

Best of luck Larry. May all your cancer cells be zapped.

Alan

[Guest guest]

THANKS..and I'm HOPING they got all the little devils...I sure FEEL GOOD..and if the sweats were done..I'd be in GOOD SHAPE!> Diagnosed with an aggressive case of PCa in October and was> immediately put on hormones. I had my prostatectomy the end of> February. The post operative biopsy showed that I had positive> margins and radiation would be next on the agenda. My 3 month> post-op PSA measurement was 0.05. I was very happy with the> low reading. The low reading was expected since I am still on> hormone therapy. My concern is my Oncologist wanted a base> line PSA just before starting the radiation. 2.5 months after> my last PSA reading the numbers went up to 0.11. Is this> something to worry about? Should I just wait and see what> happens

after the radiation is over?Any rise in PSA is worrisome, but there's nothing to do about itbut wait and see.The fact that you had positive margins actually turns out to be agood thing. It means that there was cancer in the areaimmediately around the prostate. That area will be reached byyour radiation.If you had negative margins, that would have meant that the PSAwas coming from someplace other than immediately around theprostate - obviously a bad thing because it might not be withinthe radiation field. You may still have cancer in some areaoutside the radiation field, in which case the radiation won'tcure you, but at least the evidence suggests that you've got afighting chance.Your doctor may want you to continue the hormone therapy for asignificant time after the radiation ends. You may not want todo that, but if he recommends it, I would give it very

seriousconsideration. It is my understanding that statistics show thatradiation plus hormones provides a better shot at salvage thanradiation alone, though the doc should have a better idea aboutyour specific case.Best of luck Larry. May all your cancer cells be zapped.Alan

[Guest guest]

Jim Hoppe wrote:

> THANKS..and I'm HOPING they got all the little devils...I sure

> FEEL GOOD..and if the sweats were done..I'd be in GOOD SHAPE!

Every time you break into a sweat think: " The treatment is

working, I can feel it! "

It gives you a new perspective on hormone therapy

Alan

[Guest guest]

I have positioned my Lazy Boy right under

the draft from the ceiling fan. Get one of those “the treatment is

working” feelings and set the fan to high kick back and enjoy the ride. J

From:

ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ]

On Behalf Of Alan Meyer

Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2010

10:23 PM

To:

ProstateCancerSupport

Subject: Re:

Courious about rising PSA

Jim Hoppe

wrote:

> THANKS..and I'm HOPING they got all the little devils...I sure

> FEEL GOOD..and if the sweats were done..I'd be in GOOD SHAPE!

Every time you break into a sweat think: " The treatment is

working, I can feel it! "

It gives you a new perspective on hormone therapy

Alan

[Guest guest]

LOL..as a crossword nut...and with my job I spend alot of time on the computer...I also have an AC outlet right above..and it does a WONDERFUL JOB! lol Right now having a GOOD OEN..my arms wet...and dripping. This is the 5th month of the six month shot I got...and they are less that at the start. just HOPE I don't have to get another inSept...but we'll have to wait and see.

JUST ANNOYING..but it sure could be worse/.> THANKS..and I'm HOPING they got all the little devils...I sure> FEEL GOOD..and if the sweats were done..I'd be in GOOD SHAPE!Every time you break into a sweat think: "The treatment isworking, I can feel it!"It gives you a new perspective on hormone therapy :)Alan

[Guest guest]

THANKS..and when I mentioned to the Dr...he said the same thing. GOOOD it is ALL WORKING! lol I could be MUCH MUCH WORSE...so not complaining...and of course my wife and NO WOMEN I know gives ONE BIT OF SYMPATHY! lol> THANKS..and I'm HOPING they got all the little devils...I sure> FEEL GOOD..and if the sweats were done..I'd be in GOOD SHAPE!Every time you break into a sweat think: "The treatment isworking, I can feel it!"It gives you a new perspective on hormone therapy :)Alan