RE: Celebrating my fifteen years

[Guest guest]

Happy Birthday Terry & Congratulations on achieving your goal.

Have a good one!

Malaga, Spain

Celebrating my fifteen years

Well, I made it. It is now 13 minutes past midnight South African time and so technically I and say that I am almost a quarter of an hour into my sixteenth year and have thus achieved my initial target of fifteen years of survival.

How will I celebrate? Well, I’ve finished my morning mail, so I’ll read the newspaper as soon as Anthea has finished it. Then I’ll clip the hedge since it is a glorious sunny but cold day here in our winter. I have to build a stand for the new freezer we bought, get some more music onto my iPod Nano, continue reading my books about the history of dentistry and the development of machine guns. Strange juxtaposition but it is quite amusing to see how both books return again and again to the issue of how slowly medical and military beliefs change even in the face of clear evidence that they need to change being based on old data; while at the same time showing how some of the old data was right when it was assembled!! Those views seem to resonate somewhat with what I have learned over my journey so far. And so my day will go.

Why the somewhat dull “celebration” – and why share it with y’all? Well, what I’m really celebrating is the ordinariness of life, the things I can do and the things I do which I thought I would never do this far away from diagnosis. There IS a life after a prostate cancer diagnosis.

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 7: No treatment. Jun '07 PSA 42.0 - Bony Metastasis: Aug '07: Intermittent ADT: PSA 3.4 May '11

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

[Guest guest]

Congrats Terry

I'm also a few weeks into my 16th year!

Celebrating my fifteen years

Well, I made it. It is now 13 minutes past midnight South African time and so technically I and say that I am almost a quarter of an hour into my sixteenth year and have thus achieved my initial target of fifteen years of survival.

How will I celebrate? Well, I’ve finished my morning mail, so I’ll read the newspaper as soon as Anthea has finished it. Then I’ll clip the hedge since it is a glorious sunny but cold day here in our winter. I have to build a stand for the new freezer we bought, get some more music onto my iPod Nano, continue reading my books about the history of dentistry and the development of machine guns. Strange juxtaposition but it is quite amusing to see how both books return again and again to the issue of how slowly medical and military beliefs change even in the face of clear evidence that they need to change being based on old data; while at the same time showing how some of the old data was right when it was assembled!! Those views seem to resonate somewhat with what I have learned over my journey so far. And so my day will go.

Why the somewhat dull “celebration” – and why share it with y’all? Well, what I’m really celebrating is the ordinariness of life, the things I can do and the things I do which I thought I would never do this far away from diagnosis. There IS a life after a prostate cancer diagnosis.

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 7: No treatment. Jun '07 PSA 42.0 - Bony Metastasis: Aug '07: Intermittent ADT: PSA 3.4 May '11

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

[Guest guest]

Congradulations Terry! You have been

an inspiration to me and I plan on reaching a similar goal.

From: ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of Terry Herbert

Sent: Friday, August 12, 2011 6:26

PM

To: ProstateCancerSupport ;

'NewDx'; ww@...

Subject:

Celebrating my fifteen years

Well,

I made it. It is now 13 minutes past midnight South African time and so

technically I and say that I am almost a quarter of an hour into my sixteenth

year and have thus achieved my initial target of fifteen years of survival.

How

will I celebrate? Well, I’ve finished my morning mail, so I’ll read

the newspaper as soon as Anthea has finished it. Then I’ll clip the hedge

since it is a glorious sunny but cold day here in our winter. I have to build a

stand for the new freezer we bought, get some more music onto my iPod Nano,

continue reading my books about the history of dentistry and the development of

machine guns. Strange juxtaposition but it is quite amusing to see how both

books return again and again to the issue of how slowly medical and military

beliefs change even in the face of clear evidence that they need to change

being based on old data; while at the same time showing how some of the old

data was right when it was assembled!! Those views seem to resonate somewhat

with what I have learned over my journey so far. And so my day will go.

Why

the somewhat dull “celebration” – and why share it with

y’all? Well, what I’m really celebrating is the ordinariness of

life, the things I can do and the things I do which I thought I would never do

this far away from diagnosis. There IS a life after a prostate cancer

diagnosis.

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne

Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age

54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 7: No treatment. Jun '07 PSA 42.0 - Bony

Metastasis: Aug '07: Intermittent ADT: PSA 3.4 May '11

My site is at

www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of

the world that no one knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man

knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

[Guest guest]

Well said, Terry. Here's to many more years of the extraordinary ordinary./stephenTo: ProstateCancerSupport ; newdx@...; ww@...From: ghenesh_49@...Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2011 08:26:27 +1000Subject: Celebrating my fifteen years

Well, I made it. It is now 13 minutes past midnight

South African time and so technically I and say that I am almost a quarter of

an hour into my sixteenth year and have thus achieved my initial target of

fifteen years of survival.

How will I celebrate? Well, I’ve finished my

morning mail, so I’ll read the newspaper as soon as Anthea has finished

it. Then I’ll clip the hedge since it is a glorious sunny but cold day

here in our winter. I have to build a stand for the new freezer we bought, get

some more music onto my iPod Nano, continue reading my books about the history

of dentistry and the development of machine guns. Strange juxtaposition but it

is quite amusing to see how both books return again and again to the issue of

how slowly medical and military beliefs change even in the face of clear

evidence that they need to change being based on old data; while at the same

time showing how some of the old data was right when it was assembled!! Those

views seem to resonate somewhat with what I have learned over my journey so

far. And so my day will go.

Why the somewhat dull “celebration” –

and why share it with y’all? Well, what I’m really celebrating is

the ordinariness of life, the things I can do and the things I do which I thought

I would never do this far away from diagnosis. There IS a life after a prostate

cancer diagnosis.

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age

54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 7: No treatment. Jun '07 PSA 42.0 - Bony

Metastasis: Aug '07: Intermittent ADT: PSA 3.4 May '11

My

site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of

the world that no one knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man

knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

[Guest guest]

Terry:

Congratulations on your milestone!!

But I think it is worthwhile comparing your quality of life having foregone

aggressive treatment vs mine which is based on surgery five years ago. I have

read your medical history which was on your web site.

I was diagnosed with PCa with a biopsy in March, 2006 at the age of 59. I had a

PSA of about 5. After looking at the current options: surgery, brachytherapy,

and beam radiation therapy, I selected surgery and had the prostate removed a

few months later. My PSA has been negligible for 5 years and I consider myself

cured.

Urinary continence is fine although different with one less sphincter and so I

have to be careful. Erections are ok, probably close to where they would have

been without surgery. So my quality of life has been largely unaffected.

You however have had to continuously monitor your PSA, probably have bone mets

now, the size of your prostate gland is certainly affecting urination and you

are on ADT with whatever side effects that causes. You may not die of PCa but

you are going to have to battle it for the rest of your life and the side

effects can only get worse.

I on the other hand can largely forget about it. So I think I made the better

choice. We are all different of course and your experience and mine do not

represent the totality of PCa patients.

I believe that there is a place for watchful waiting, but when it is obvious

that the PCa is progressing to the point where there is a risk of the cancer

extending beyond the gland, it is time to act.

Sorry to have been so brutal particularly on your anniversary. But I had to

respond to your somewhat polyanna view of watchful waiting.

[Guest guest]

Terry:

Congratulations on your milestone!!

But I think it is worthwhile comparing your quality of life having foregone

aggressive treatment vs mine which is based on surgery five years ago. I have

read your medical history which was on your web site.

I was diagnosed with PCa with a biopsy in March, 2006 at the age of 59. I had a

PSA of about 5. After looking at the current options: surgery, brachytherapy,

and beam radiation therapy, I selected surgery and had the prostate removed a

few months later. My PSA has been negligible for 5 years and I consider myself

cured.

Urinary continence is fine although different with one less sphincter and so I

have to be careful. Erections are ok, probably close to where they would have

been without surgery. So my quality of life has been largely unaffected.

You however have had to continuously monitor your PSA, probably have bone mets

now, the size of your prostate gland is certainly affecting urination and you

are on ADT with whatever side effects that causes. You may not die of PCa but

you are going to have to battle it for the rest of your life and the side

effects can only get worse.

I on the other hand can largely forget about it. So I think I made the better

choice. We are all different of course and your experience and mine do not

represent the totality of PCa patients.

I believe that there is a place for watchful waiting, but when it is obvious

that the PCa is progressing to the point where there is a risk of the cancer

extending beyond the gland, it is time to act.

Sorry to have been so brutal particularly on your anniversary. But I had to

respond to your somewhat polyanna view of watchful waiting.

[Guest guest]

wrote:

> Terry:

>

> Congratulations on your milestone!!

>

> But I think it is worthwhile comparing your quality of life having foregone

> aggressive treatment vs mine which is based on surgery five years ago. I have

> read your medical history which was on your web site.

>

> I was diagnosed with PCa with a biopsy in March, 2006 at the age of 59. I had

a

> PSA of about 5. After looking at the current options: surgery, brachytherapy,

> and beam radiation therapy, I selected surgery and had the prostate removed a

> few months later. My PSA has been negligible for 5 years and I consider myself

> cured.

>

> Urinary continence is fine although different with one less sphincter and so I

> have to be careful. Erections are ok, probably close to  where they would have

> been without surgery. So my quality of life has been largely unaffected.

>

> You however have had to continuously monitor your PSA, probably have bone mets

> now, the size of your prostate gland is certainly affecting urination and you

> are on ADT with whatever side effects that causes. You may not die of PCa but

> you are going to have to battle it for the rest of your life and the side

> effects can only get worse.

>

> I on the other hand can largely forget about it. So I think I made the better

> choice. We are all different of course and your experience and mine do not

> represent the totality of PCa patients.

>

> I believe that there is a place for watchful waiting, but when it is obvious

> that the PCa is progressing to the point where there is a risk of the cancer

> extending beyond the gland, it is time to act.

>

> Sorry to have been so brutal particularly on your anniversary. But I had to

> respond to your somewhat polyanna view of watchful waiting.

>

>

,

It's impossible to know what will work out best in PCa treatment.

I think that you and Terry each decided to play the odds in a

different but perfectly rational way.

In your case, you decided to accept the risk of a major surgery,

recovery time, possible long term side effects and possibility of

treatment failure, in order to get a shot at a complete cure.

In Terry's case, he decided to accept the risk that the cancer

would metastasize and become life threatening, that if it did

he'd have to use ADT (the only therapy known at the time), and

the possibility that his cancer would kill him before something

else did, in order to get a shot at an extended life with no

direct treatment effects or side effects.

So far, it looks like both of you got lucky and are winners.

Either one or both of you could have been a big loser.

In your case you could have had a botched surgery (I was in pain

for 10 years after a badly done knee surgery), long term

incontinence and/or impotence (half or more surgery patients do

have long term effects), and to top it off, the surgery might not

have worked - leaving you in worse shape than you were and still

with cancer.

In Terry's case, the cancer might have spread quickly and killed

him in 5 - 10 years in spite of further treatment.

We should be careful not to adopt a Pollyanna view of surgery or

watchful waiting, or any of the other treatment or non-treatment

options.

We each have to play the odds as we see them for our particular

cases and our particular hopes and fears.

But, as I say, things have worked pretty well for both of you,

and I wish you both the best of luck for the future.  I also

recommend that BOTH of you continue getting PSA tests since no

one is ever guaranteed to be out of the woods with this disease.

    Alan

[Guest guest]

wrote:

> Terry:

>

> Congratulations on your milestone!!

>

> But I think it is worthwhile comparing your quality of life having foregone

> aggressive treatment vs mine which is based on surgery five years ago. I have

> read your medical history which was on your web site.

>

> I was diagnosed with PCa with a biopsy in March, 2006 at the age of 59. I had

a

> PSA of about 5. After looking at the current options: surgery, brachytherapy,

> and beam radiation therapy, I selected surgery and had the prostate removed a

> few months later. My PSA has been negligible for 5 years and I consider myself

> cured.

>

> Urinary continence is fine although different with one less sphincter and so I

> have to be careful. Erections are ok, probably close to  where they would have

> been without surgery. So my quality of life has been largely unaffected.

>

> You however have had to continuously monitor your PSA, probably have bone mets

> now, the size of your prostate gland is certainly affecting urination and you

> are on ADT with whatever side effects that causes. You may not die of PCa but

> you are going to have to battle it for the rest of your life and the side

> effects can only get worse.

>

> I on the other hand can largely forget about it. So I think I made the better

> choice. We are all different of course and your experience and mine do not

> represent the totality of PCa patients.

>

> I believe that there is a place for watchful waiting, but when it is obvious

> that the PCa is progressing to the point where there is a risk of the cancer

> extending beyond the gland, it is time to act.

>

> Sorry to have been so brutal particularly on your anniversary. But I had to

> respond to your somewhat polyanna view of watchful waiting.

>

>

,

It's impossible to know what will work out best in PCa treatment.

I think that you and Terry each decided to play the odds in a

different but perfectly rational way.

In your case, you decided to accept the risk of a major surgery,

recovery time, possible long term side effects and possibility of

treatment failure, in order to get a shot at a complete cure.

In Terry's case, he decided to accept the risk that the cancer

would metastasize and become life threatening, that if it did

he'd have to use ADT (the only therapy known at the time), and

the possibility that his cancer would kill him before something

else did, in order to get a shot at an extended life with no

direct treatment effects or side effects.

So far, it looks like both of you got lucky and are winners.

Either one or both of you could have been a big loser.

In your case you could have had a botched surgery (I was in pain

for 10 years after a badly done knee surgery), long term

incontinence and/or impotence (half or more surgery patients do

have long term effects), and to top it off, the surgery might not

have worked - leaving you in worse shape than you were and still

with cancer.

In Terry's case, the cancer might have spread quickly and killed

him in 5 - 10 years in spite of further treatment.

We should be careful not to adopt a Pollyanna view of surgery or

watchful waiting, or any of the other treatment or non-treatment

options.

We each have to play the odds as we see them for our particular

cases and our particular hopes and fears.

But, as I say, things have worked pretty well for both of you,

and I wish you both the best of luck for the future.  I also

recommend that BOTH of you continue getting PSA tests since no

one is ever guaranteed to be out of the woods with this disease.

    Alan

[Guest guest]

I’m behind in e-mails, but you are an inspiration Terry!

Well said, Terry. Here's to many more years of the extraordinary ordinary.

/stephen

To: ProstateCancerSupport ; newdx@...; ww@...

From: ghenesh_49@...

Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2011 08:26:27 +1000

Subject: Celebrating my fifteen years

Well, I made it. It is now 13 minutes past midnight South African time and so technically I and say that I am almost a quarter of an hour into my sixteenth year and have thus achieved my initial target of fifteen years of survival.

How will I celebrate? Well, I’ve finished my morning mail, so I’ll read the newspaper as soon as Anthea has finished it. Then I’ll clip the hedge since it is a glorious sunny but cold day here in our winter. I have to build a stand for the new freezer we bought, get some more music onto my iPod Nano, continue reading my books about the history of dentistry and the development of machine guns. Strange juxtaposition but it is quite amusing to see how both books return again and again to the issue of how slowly medical and military beliefs change even in the face of clear evidence that they need to change being based on old data; while at the same time showing how some of the old data was right when it was assembled!! Those views seem to resonate somewhat with what I have learned over my journey so far. And so my day will go.

Why the somewhat dull “celebration” – and why share it with y’all? Well, what I’m really celebrating is the ordinariness of life, the things I can do and the things I do which I thought I would never do this far away from diagnosis. There IS a life after a prostate cancer diagnosis.

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 7: No treatment. Jun '07 PSA 42.0 - Bony Metastasis: Aug '07: Intermittent ADT: PSA 3.4 May '11

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

[Guest guest]

Congrats,Terry. INSPIRING!tdrTo: ProstateCancerSupport Sent: Friday, September 9, 2011 5:12 PMSubject: Re: Celebrating my fifteen years

I’m behind in e-mails, but you are an inspiration Terry!

Well said, Terry. Here's to many more years of the extraordinary ordinary.

/stephen

To: ProstateCancerSupport ; newdx@...; ww@...

From: ghenesh_49@...

Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2011 08:26:27 +1000

Subject: Celebrating my fifteen years

Well, I made it. It is now 13 minutes past midnight South African time and so technically I and say that I am almost a quarter of an hour into my sixteenth year and have thus achieved my initial target of fifteen years of survival.

How will I celebrate? Well, I’ve finished my morning mail, so I’ll read the newspaper as soon as Anthea has finished it. Then I’ll clip the hedge since it is a glorious sunny but cold day here in our winter. I have to build a stand for the new freezer we bought, get some more music onto my iPod Nano, continue reading my books about the history of dentistry and the development of machine guns. Strange juxtaposition but it is quite amusing to see how both books return again and again to the issue of how slowly medical and military beliefs change even in the face of clear evidence that they need to change being based on old data; while at the same time showing how some of the old data was right when it was assembled!! Those views seem to resonate somewhat with what I have learned over my journey so far. And so my day will go.

Why the somewhat dull “celebration†– and why share it with y’all? Well, what I’m really celebrating is the ordinariness of life, the things I can do and the things I do which I thought I would never do this far away from diagnosis. There IS a life after a prostate cancer diagnosis.

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 7: No treatment. Jun '07 PSA 42.0 - Bony Metastasis: Aug '07: Intermittent ADT: PSA 3.4 May '11

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

[Guest guest]

Thanks Jan. Better late than never!! We’re

still celebrating – off in less than two weeks on our next adventure –

a lovely cruise in the Baltic and Mediterranean.

Seize the day!! There is a life after prostate cancer. A bit more detail here

on my second E-Letter http://www.yananow.org/ELetter2.htm

All the best

Prostate men need enlightening, not frightening

Terry

Herbert - diagnosed in 1996 and

still going strong

Read A Strange Place for unbiased information at http://www.yananow.org/StrangePlace/index.html

From: ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of Jan

Sent: Saturday, 10 September 2011

10:12 AM

To: ProstateCancerSupport

Subject: Re:

Celebrating my fifteen years

I’m behind in e-mails, but

you are an inspiration Terry!

Well said, Terry. Here's to many more years of the extraordinary ordinary.

/stephen

To: ProstateCancerSupport ;

newdx@...; ww@...

From: ghenesh_49@...

Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2011 08:26:27 +1000

Subject: Celebrating my fifteen years

Well, I made it. It is now 13 minutes past midnight South African time

and so technically I and say that I am almost a quarter of an hour into my

sixteenth year and have thus achieved my initial target of fifteen years of

survival.

How will I celebrate? Well, I’ve finished my morning mail, so

I’ll read the newspaper as soon as Anthea has finished it. Then

I’ll clip the hedge since it is a glorious sunny but cold day here in our

winter. I have to build a stand for the new freezer we bought, get some more

music onto my iPod Nano, continue reading my books about the history of

dentistry and the development of machine guns. Strange juxtaposition but it is

quite amusing to see how both books return again and again to the issue of how

slowly medical and military beliefs change even in the face of clear evidence

that they need to change being based on old data; while at the same time

showing how some of the old data was right when it was assembled!! Those views

seem to resonate somewhat with what I have learned over my journey so far. And

so my day will go.

Why the somewhat dull “celebration” – and why share it

with y’all? Well, what I’m really celebrating is the ordinariness

of life, the things I can do and the things I do which I thought I would never

do this far away from diagnosis. There IS a life after a prostate cancer

diagnosis.

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2:

Gleason 7: No treatment. Jun '07 PSA 42.0 - Bony Metastasis: Aug '07: Intermittent

ADT: PSA 3.4 May '11

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one

knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is

that he knows everything. Joyce Carey