Re: 'the death of me'

[Guest guest]

my mom has always threatened me with her death.

whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if anything

ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I lived thru

years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a heart

condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my fears and

in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's impossible. i'm

not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this so many years

ago.

we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at fault

for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their weird

thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints of

how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i cried

at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle got it

back...so can i.

does anyone else feel this way???

amy

Re: ENABLERS... sis and fada

You're the only one who can decide whether the benefits of a visit with your

relatives outweigh the costs; only you know what you can and can't tolerate.

Sometimes it helps me to make a comparison list: " pro " vs " con " , and see which

side has more reasons listed.

You could decide to just have a very, very short visit, like, you arrive

Christmas eve, you're there for Christmas Day dinner and present-opening, and

you leave the next morning, and stay at a nearby hotel. When I was still in

contact with my nada, I found that we could tolerate each other fairly well for

a couple of days, max. After than, we started getting on each others' nerves

and it got bad.

Very short visits worked better, for me.

Are your children old enough to fly by themselves, and if they are, do you trust

your sis and dad to be responsible for them and be kind to them? I think

children are allowed to fly without a parent/guardian once they're, like, 9 or

10 years old (but you'd need to research the airline policies, yourself; I'm

just guessing). If your children are old enough and you feel safe letting them

fly without you, and they think it would be fun, and you trust your sis and dad

to care for them properly, maybe sending the kids to spend a few days with the

relatives while you stay home is an option.

Its totally your call. If being around your relatives for several days will

have a deleterious effect on your mental or physical health, then, I don't think

its worth it. But that's just me; you get to decide what works for you.

-Annie

>

> Thanks Annie! I will do just that. Nobody else really wants to talk about

her anyway, so that should be pretty easy. There is something freeing about

giving up trying to defend myself and explain things.

>

> SHOULD I GO OUT OF STATE TO VISIT THEM? (the enablers)

>

> Christmas vacation possibility. It isolates me and usually results in some

badgering and emotional stress for me. But I would like to do it for my kids.

>

> I think it is just an idealistic idea that doesn't turn out good in the end

anyway. Could I put up with it for the kids so they can see cousins,

grandparents, and have a family Christmas? Or do the indirect effects of my

stress make it hard on them anyway? I want to do the right thing for my kids

and I just want it to be fun. Can I make it fun?

>

[Guest guest]

Yes! My nada blamed me for her depression ect. I always felt like I could

not be heard or could not defend myself. Like I had no voice. Now I

desperately want it back. I am working on it. At the moment I am

struggling with being too honest.

--

“I have a grip on reality, just not this particular one.”-- Author Unknown*

*

[Guest guest]

Yes! My nada blamed me for her depression ect. I always felt like I could

not be heard or could not defend myself. Like I had no voice. Now I

desperately want it back. I am working on it. At the moment I am

struggling with being too honest.

--

“I have a grip on reality, just not this particular one.”-- Author Unknown*

*

[Guest guest]

(((((((Amy))))))))

Saying something like that to your own child *even once* expresses a level of

cruelty that is hard for me to even comprehend. Its just mind-boggling to make

a abjectly trusting little child who only wants to please her parents and

receive love from her parents, to be told over and over that *she* is

responsible if one of her parents *dies*??! A child has no choice but to

believe that what her parents tell her is the truth and very real. Lying to

children is such a betrayal of trust; in my opinion its breaking a sacred bond

to manipulate, lie to, and use a child like that.

Good Lord.

What they did to you is emotional blackmail: " Obey us perfectly or we'll DIE and

it will be YOUR FAULT. " It made you pretty much a hostage; your parents were

holding your caring, tender little heart hostage.

In a similar way, I've read posts in which (various) pd dads threatened to

sexually violate the posters' younger sisters if she didn't keep her mouth shut

about the sexual services he forced her to commit with him. That is pure,

undiluted blackmail also, and the fathers in such cases were/are very likely

psychopathic.

But that's just my opinion, though: I think that only a person who lacks a

conscience, lacks empathy, and lacks remorse, and who views other people as mere

objects (a psychopath) would emotionally blackmail their own child.

I'm glad for you that you are getting your voice back, so to speak.

You can speak the truth out loud, now.

-Annie

>

> my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if anything

ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I lived thru

years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a heart

condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my fears and

in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's impossible. i'm

not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this so many years

ago.

>

>

> we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

>

>

> my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

>

>

> ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

>

>

> does anyone else feel this way???

> amy

[Guest guest]

Annie, thank you for your kind words. I still can't believe it myself and

struggle every day.

I find it hard to comprehend that I am an adult now, with 5 beautiful children,

an amazing husband...and I still open my mouth to speak and sometimes, nothing

comes out. Sometimes only tears.

Amy

Re: 'the death of me'

(((((((Amy))))))))

Saying something like that to your own child *even once* expresses a level of

cruelty that is hard for me to even comprehend. Its just mind-boggling to make

a abjectly trusting little child who only wants to please her parents and

receive love from her parents, to be told over and over that *she* is

responsible if one of her parents *dies*??! A child has no choice but to

believe that what her parents tell her is the truth and very real. Lying to

children is such a betrayal of trust; in my opinion its breaking a sacred bond

to manipulate, lie to, and use a child like that.

Good Lord.

What they did to you is emotional blackmail: " Obey us perfectly or we'll DIE and

it will be YOUR FAULT. " It made you pretty much a hostage; your parents were

holding your caring, tender little heart hostage.

In a similar way, I've read posts in which (various) pd dads threatened to

sexually violate the posters' younger sisters if she didn't keep her mouth shut

about the sexual services he forced her to commit with him. That is pure,

undiluted blackmail also, and the fathers in such cases were/are very likely

psychopathic.

But that's just my opinion, though: I think that only a person who lacks a

conscience, lacks empathy, and lacks remorse, and who views other people as mere

objects (a psychopath) would emotionally blackmail their own child.

I'm glad for you that you are getting your voice back, so to speak.

You can speak the truth out loud, now.

-Annie

>

> my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if anything

ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I lived thru

years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a heart

condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my fears and

in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's impossible. i'm

not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this so many years

ago.

>

>

> we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

>

>

> my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

>

>

> ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

>

>

> does anyone else feel this way???

> amy

[Guest guest]

Annie, thank you for your kind words. I still can't believe it myself and

struggle every day.

I find it hard to comprehend that I am an adult now, with 5 beautiful children,

an amazing husband...and I still open my mouth to speak and sometimes, nothing

comes out. Sometimes only tears.

Amy

Re: 'the death of me'

(((((((Amy))))))))

Saying something like that to your own child *even once* expresses a level of

cruelty that is hard for me to even comprehend. Its just mind-boggling to make

a abjectly trusting little child who only wants to please her parents and

receive love from her parents, to be told over and over that *she* is

responsible if one of her parents *dies*??! A child has no choice but to

believe that what her parents tell her is the truth and very real. Lying to

children is such a betrayal of trust; in my opinion its breaking a sacred bond

to manipulate, lie to, and use a child like that.

Good Lord.

What they did to you is emotional blackmail: " Obey us perfectly or we'll DIE and

it will be YOUR FAULT. " It made you pretty much a hostage; your parents were

holding your caring, tender little heart hostage.

In a similar way, I've read posts in which (various) pd dads threatened to

sexually violate the posters' younger sisters if she didn't keep her mouth shut

about the sexual services he forced her to commit with him. That is pure,

undiluted blackmail also, and the fathers in such cases were/are very likely

psychopathic.

But that's just my opinion, though: I think that only a person who lacks a

conscience, lacks empathy, and lacks remorse, and who views other people as mere

objects (a psychopath) would emotionally blackmail their own child.

I'm glad for you that you are getting your voice back, so to speak.

You can speak the truth out loud, now.

-Annie

>

> my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if anything

ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I lived thru

years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a heart

condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my fears and

in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's impossible. i'm

not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this so many years

ago.

>

>

> we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

>

>

> my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

>

>

> ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

>

>

> does anyone else feel this way???

> amy

[Guest guest]

My nada pretened to be dead until I and my younger sister become hysterical.

Than she stopped and said that she only wanted to know if we love her. We were

few years old. And of course, she see herself like the best mother in the

world:)

Y

..

Sent via BlackBerry from Vodafone

Re: 'the death of me'

(((((((Amy))))))))

Saying something like that to your own child *even once* expresses a level of

cruelty that is hard for me to even comprehend. Its just mind-boggling to make

a abjectly trusting little child who only wants to please her parents and

receive love from her parents, to be told over and over that *she* is

responsible if one of her parents *dies*??! A child has no choice but to

believe that what her parents tell her is the truth and very real. Lying to

children is such a betrayal of trust; in my opinion its breaking a sacred bond

to manipulate, lie to, and use a child like that.

Good Lord.

What they did to you is emotional blackmail: " Obey us perfectly or we'll DIE and

it will be YOUR FAULT. " It made you pretty much a hostage; your parents were

holding your caring, tender little heart hostage.

In a similar way, I've read posts in which (various) pd dads threatened to

sexually violate the posters' younger sisters if she didn't keep her mouth shut

about the sexual services he forced her to commit with him. That is pure,

undiluted blackmail also, and the fathers in such cases were/are very likely

psychopathic.

But that's just my opinion, though: I think that only a person who lacks a

conscience, lacks empathy, and lacks remorse, and who views other people as mere

objects (a psychopath) would emotionally blackmail their own child.

I'm glad for you that you are getting your voice back, so to speak.

You can speak the truth out loud, now.

-Annie

>

> my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if anything

ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I lived thru

years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a heart

condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my fears and

in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's impossible. i'm

not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this so many years

ago.

>

>

> we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

>

>

> my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

>

>

> ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

>

>

> does anyone else feel this way???

> amy

[Guest guest]

OMG!!!!! How cruel !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I hate manipulation of any kind...and that is just disgusting.

I'm soooo sorry you had to go thru that...how wicked.

Re: 'the death of me'

(((((((Amy))))))))

Saying something like that to your own child *even once* expresses a level of

cruelty that is hard for me to even comprehend. Its just mind-boggling to make

a abjectly trusting little child who only wants to please her parents and

receive love from her parents, to be told over and over that *she* is

responsible if one of her parents *dies*??! A child has no choice but to

believe that what her parents tell her is the truth and very real. Lying to

children is such a betrayal of trust; in my opinion its breaking a sacred bond

to manipulate, lie to, and use a child like that.

Good Lord.

What they did to you is emotional blackmail: " Obey us perfectly or we'll DIE and

it will be YOUR FAULT. " It made you pretty much a hostage; your parents were

holding your caring, tender little heart hostage.

In a similar way, I've read posts in which (various) pd dads threatened to

sexually violate the posters' younger sisters if she didn't keep her mouth shut

about the sexual services he forced her to commit with him. That is pure,

undiluted blackmail also, and the fathers in such cases were/are very likely

psychopathic.

But that's just my opinion, though: I think that only a person who lacks a

conscience, lacks empathy, and lacks remorse, and who views other people as mere

objects (a psychopath) would emotionally blackmail their own child.

I'm glad for you that you are getting your voice back, so to speak.

You can speak the truth out loud, now.

-Annie

>

> my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if anything

ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I lived thru

years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a heart

condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my fears and

in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's impossible. i'm

not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this so many years

ago.

>

>

> we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

>

>

> my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

>

>

> ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

>

>

> does anyone else feel this way???

> amy

[Guest guest]

That's just sadistic, to terrify little children into hysterics like that. Pure

cruelty and sadism: she *liked* hurting you, apparently, to do it more than

once. Your mother should have been publicly vilified and disgraced for doing

something like that to you and your little sister. She should feel ashamed of

herself for emotionally torturing her little children like that.

-Annie

> >

> > my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> > whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if

anything ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I

lived thru years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a

heart condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my

fears and in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's

impossible. i'm not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this

so many years ago.

> >

> >

> > we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

> >

> >

> > my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

> >

> >

> > ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

> >

> >

> > does anyone else feel this way???

> > amy

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

My nada did this same thing!

> >

> > my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> > whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if

anything ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I

lived thru years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a

heart condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my

fears and in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's

impossible. i'm not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this

so many years ago.

> >

> >

> > we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

> >

> >

> > my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

> >

> >

> > ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

> >

> >

> > does anyone else feel this way???

> > amy

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I'll say it again, then: such behavior is sadistic and cruel. Tormenting a

little child because its " funny " or to prove to yourself that your tiny children

actually do love you, is beyond comprehension and is reprehensible behavior.

There is a recent NY Times article about recent brain scan studies that would

appear to indicate that bullies actually receive pleasure, a mental " orgasm " if

you will, from watching people who are in pain from accidental causes or from

deliberate cruelty.

" While the study is small, the striking differences shown in the brain scans

suggests that bullies may have major differences in how their brains process

information compared to non-bullies. Dr. Decety said the aggressive adolescents

showed a strong activation of the amygdala and ventral striatum, areas of the

brain that respond to feeling rewarded. The finding " suggested that they enjoyed

watching pain, " he said. "

Here's a link to the article.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/11/12/the-brain-of-a-bully/

From reading the cruel behaviors evidenced in posts here and at other Groups for

the adult children of personality-disordered parents, I think that some of us

were actually raised by psychopaths, or by bpds with psychopathic traits. Its

a wonder we even survived our childhoods!

-Annie

>

> My nada did this same thing!

>

[Guest guest]

Messages in this

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6)

> Yup - my nada did this at least daily. If I did something she didn't like

> (which could be anything and everything), I was killing her. If I disagreed

> with her, I was killing her. If I wanted to go out with my friends instead

> of staying at home, I was killing her. If I didn't want to practice the

> piano one day, I was killing her. When I moved out of the house, I was

> killing her. She told me constantly I was responsible for her heavy

> drinking ( " Well, I'm NOT an alcoholic, but if I take a drink, it's because

> of YOU), her taking narcotics, her health problems, her depression. She

> also told me often that I was killing my father, too.

> Recent Activity:

>

> - New

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>

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> **This group is based on principles in Randi Kreger's new book The

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[Guest guest]

My nada does this in a way to me now. She says that because I don't have a

relationship with her, her life is not worth living anymore. Or she'll say that

she misses me so much that she gets stressed out and her illness(es) such as

hypertension are going to kill her. She doesn't flat out say, " you're killing

me. " She's learned to make it " fancier. " But the message is the same. I've

finally had to accept that one of these days, she may very well commit suicide,

either inadvertently or just out of spite. I will have to learn to live with

it. I don't call her anymore with her suicide threats or deadly close

encounters. I hotline her or call 911. And then I don't call her for days.

I've fulfilled my obligation ethically and legally without giving her the

satisfaction of my attention or affection. The only thing that is my fault at

all is how many times I rewarded her suicidal behavior.

>

> Messages in this

>

topic<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WTOAdultChildren1/message/120342;_ylc=X3oDMT\

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> 6)

>

> > Yup - my nada did this at least daily. If I did something she didn't like

> > (which could be anything and everything), I was killing her. If I disagreed

> > with her, I was killing her. If I wanted to go out with my friends instead

> > of staying at home, I was killing her. If I didn't want to practice the

> > piano one day, I was killing her. When I moved out of the house, I was

> > killing her. She told me constantly I was responsible for her heavy

> > drinking ( " Well, I'm NOT an alcoholic, but if I take a drink, it's because

> > of YOU), her taking narcotics, her health problems, her depression. She

> > also told me often that I was killing my father, too.

> > Recent Activity:

> >

> > - New

Members<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WTOAdultChildren1/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJmaDU\

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> > 16

> >

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[Guest guest]

That is crazy. My mom did that to. Only her response was " I just wanted to see

where your heart was " . WTF?

> >

> > my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> > whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if

anything ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I

lived thru years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a

heart condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my

fears and in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's

impossible. i'm not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this

so many years ago.

> >

> >

> > we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

> >

> >

> > my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

> >

> >

> > ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

> >

> >

> > does anyone else feel this way???

> > amy

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

my mom would fake chest pains when she wanted to keep me home.

so draining and cruel. so manipulating.

amy

Re: 'the death of me'

That is crazy. My mom did that to. Only her response was " I just wanted to see

where your heart was " . WTF?

> >

> > my mom has always threatened me with her death.

> > whatever small, insignificant issue arose, she would tell me that if

anything ever was to happen to her or my father, that it would be my fault. I

lived thru years and years of this nonsense. when my dad found out that he had a

heart condition, she cruelly accused me of bringing it on. i held that in my

fears and in my heart for a very long time until i realized that that's

impossible. i'm not G-d and i can't make that happen. so many tears about this

so many years ago.

> >

> >

> > we are never ultimately responsible for anyone else's life. we are not at

fault for their tragedies, their aches and pains, their obsessiveness, their

weird thoughts and feelings, their manipulations of loved ones, their complaints

of how everything should be their

way...etc...etc...etc....bla...blah...blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

> >

> >

> > my lifetime is about regaining my voice now.

> >

> >

> > ever watch the little mermaid? when the seawitch takes arielle's voice...i

cried at that scene because i could relate. now i want my voice back...arielle

got it back...so can i.

> >

> >

> > does anyone else feel this way???

> > amy

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I don't know I she felt any satisfaction when she did such a thing. I think she

is to occupated with herself to even see she is hurting somebody. My sister

allmost got killed once because of her. Somebody was stalking her and my mother

belived him not her, and she was litteraly helping him. When my fada got cancer

I found some nice lady who is healer. He got help from traditional medicine, but

said this lady help him a lot ( even results on scan showed that..) Nada refuse

to let this lady to our house. There wont't be other woman in our hause - she

said. Fada died soon after that. When my kid was little I had a car who was so

broken it was allready dangerously to drive with it. (And I was a lot on the

road at that time) Nada refused to lend me her car ( she didn't use at all - she

hardly now how to drive) for a week to put my car on service.She refused to

speak to me on telephone until I fixed the car. She rather saw me and my kid

dead in car accident than borow her car for few days. Whenever she gave me

something it was together with a lot of power plays....Now she is old and has no

power anymore, everybody died exept me ( even my sister). You should see her now

when she has no power anymmore ( I'm comletly independent from her) - fragile,

nice, poor old lady - and evil me in her eyes (and everybody else around)

because I don't take care of her like she and others suppose I should.

I'm very LC for a lot of years.

Thanks for listening..:-)

Y

> >

> > My nada did this same thing!

> >

>

[Guest guest]

> There is a recent NY Times article about recent brain scan studies that

would appear to indicate that bullies actually receive pleasure, a mental

" orgasm " if you will, from watching people who are in pain from accidental

causes or from deliberate cruelty.

>

> " While the study is small, the striking differences shown in the brain

scans suggests that bullies may have major differences in how their brains

process information compared to non-bullies. Dr. Decety said the aggressive

adolescents showed a strong activation of the amygdala and ventral striatum,

areas of the brain that respond to feeling rewarded. The finding " suggested

that they enjoyed watching pain, " he said. "

Now, this is really interesting to me! I always felt, even when I was a tiny

child, that my nada got a big kick out of tormenting me. She'd get like this

SMILE on her face when she was doing or saying something awful to me, and

when I reacted, she'd start screaming at me, and keep saying or doing

whatever awful thing she'd been doing, but she'd just keep smiling - it was

so weird - it freaked me out for as long as I can remember.

And also - when I reacted to her abuse by crying or yelling back, she'd

burst out into laughter, and if my father was around, he'd laugh at me, too.

And something which I guess is pretty unusual used to happen in my family (I

was an only child, by the way). I was quite artistic and sensitive, and took

things hard (for instance, I'd start to cry when a teacher reprimanded me,

however mild the reprimand was - I couldn't bear not being a " good girl " )

and found it difficult to tolerate being teased. So my parents often went

out of their way to tease me about things they knew upset me, and they

wouldn't let up, and when I cried, they'd laugh at me. I couldn't stand any

form of prejudice, so my father would start making racist comments just to

watch me get upset and eventually start crying. Weird. Weird. Weird. And he

wasn't BPD. Or maybe he was. I don't know.

One of the things they teased me about was my asthma. I'd get asthma attacks

if I laughed or cried really hard, or if I was around dogs or cats, and I'd

be wheezing and they'd laugh at me. My aunt, uncle and cousin had a dog, and

my uncle was a really funny man and made me laugh a lot, so every time we'd

go visit them (which was only on holidays), I'd spend the whole time

fighting for breath.; The minute my family members would hear me start

wheezing, one of them would say, " Oh! Judy laughed! " - and for some reason

they all thought it was hilarious. I'll never understand that.

About ten years ago, I had a landlord who was a bully, and I truly think she

was BPD - she was always turning against people she had previously " loved "

and starting terrible rumors about them, and she also had a drinking

problem. I truly think she got pleasure out of being so nasty. She'd go out

of her way to create really bad trouble for people. One time she started a

rumor about a really sweet, gentle, devout Orthodox Jewish woman in our

neighborhood who had 10 children of her own and was also a foster care

mother. She had been really close with this Orthodox Jewish woman as well

as the woman's husband and children, and she suddenly starts this totally

false rumor that this woman is having phone sex and going out and having

lots of affairs. She really tried her best to get people to believe it, and

managed to create quite a bit of turmoil in this lovely family.

Yeah - I do think bullies get some sort of " mental orgasm " by causing pain

to people. I am so glad I don't have a " bully brain. "

[Guest guest]

(((((Judy)))))

My god...my nada and fada were often cruel and sadistic with me yet I

cannot *fathom* the mentality of " parents " who would goad a child into crying

knowing it could cause an asthma attack.That is SO egregiously

abusive--truly,you needed to be rescued from that home literally for your own

safety.And to willfully take an asthmatic child to a place where she'd be

fighting for breath...that.is.just.WRONG.And to then laugh about it.The level of

mistreatment you endured is nothing short of sadistic.

I'm also glad that I don't have a " bully brain " .I just don't get how

deriving pleasure from another person's pain is a kick.To me,that is debasing

and low.Vulnerability in any living thing--human or animal--sparks a

*protective* instinct in me,not a predatory one.I feel like crap if I hurt

someone,even unintentionally.

I know that " smile " you mentioned.My nada used to do that,too.With my

nada,it was like this self satisfied gloating smirk.Mine also upped the ante if

I showed that I was upset and she'd just keep driving the knife in again and

again.I have a very hard time now feeling safe if I show anyone that I am upset

by their behavior,especially other women.

My nada used to freely admit that she had no sense of humor--very

true.And that she didn't understand jokes--also very true.My fada was more the

one with the " sense of humor " and like yours this included teasing me *on

purpose* about things that bothered me or frightened me.For example when I was

5/6 I'd get very upset when he was watching " nature shows " on tv with predatory

animals like lions chasing down and slaughtering zebras or gazelles--so he'd put

them on purposefully and then laugh at me while I cried or ran to my room with

my hands over my ears.And yeah,I guess he got a " mental orgasm " out of that but

that is really pathetic--a grown man getting off on tormenting a five year old

little girl.What a coward,what a cheap thrill.

Being laughed at when you are in emotional agony is devastating.I was

sensitive and artistic too and my parents were a couple of primitive BRUTES.We

both deserved so much better than the knuckle draggers we got saddled with as

children.

I will also never understand how a child's pain could possibly be

" hilarious. "

I'm so sorry you were so badly mistreated.

>

> Now, this is really interesting to me! I always felt, even when I was a tiny

> child, that my nada got a big kick out of tormenting me. She'd get like this

> SMILE on her face when she was doing or saying something awful to me, and

> when I reacted, she'd start screaming at me, and keep saying or doing

> whatever awful thing she'd been doing, but she'd just keep smiling - it was

> so weird - it freaked me out for as long as I can remember.

> And also - when I reacted to her abuse by crying or yelling back, she'd

> burst out into laughter, and if my father was around, he'd laugh at me, too.

> And something which I guess is pretty unusual used to happen in my family (I

> was an only child, by the way). I was quite artistic and sensitive, and took

> things hard (for instance, I'd start to cry when a teacher reprimanded me,

> however mild the reprimand was - I couldn't bear not being a " good girl " )

> and found it difficult to tolerate being teased. So my parents often went

> out of their way to tease me about things they knew upset me, and they

> wouldn't let up, and when I cried, they'd laugh at me. I couldn't stand any

> form of prejudice, so my father would start making racist comments just to

> watch me get upset and eventually start crying. Weird. Weird. Weird. And he

> wasn't BPD. Or maybe he was. I don't know.

> One of the things they teased me about was my asthma. I'd get asthma attacks

> if I laughed or cried really hard, or if I was around dogs or cats, and I'd

> be wheezing and they'd laugh at me. My aunt, uncle and cousin had a dog, and

> my uncle was a really funny man and made me laugh a lot, so every time we'd

> go visit them (which was only on holidays), I'd spend the whole time

> fighting for breath.; The minute my family members would hear me start

> wheezing, one of them would say, " Oh! Judy laughed! " - and for some reason

> they all thought it was hilarious. I'll never understand that.

> About ten years ago, I had a landlord who was a bully, and I truly think she

> was BPD - she was always turning against people she had previously " loved "

> and starting terrible rumors about them, and she also had a drinking

> problem. I truly think she got pleasure out of being so nasty. She'd go out

> of her way to create really bad trouble for people. One time she started a

> rumor about a really sweet, gentle, devout Orthodox Jewish woman in our

> neighborhood who had 10 children of her own and was also a foster care

> mother. She had been really close with this Orthodox Jewish woman as well

> as the woman's husband and children, and she suddenly starts this totally

> false rumor that this woman is having phone sex and going out and having

> lots of affairs. She really tried her best to get people to believe it, and

> managed to create quite a bit of turmoil in this lovely family.

> Yeah - I do think bullies get some sort of " mental orgasm " by causing pain

> to people. I am so glad I don't have a " bully brain. "

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Seems to me that pretending to be dead in order to terrify your small child

isn't an " oops " , it is a deliberate, calculated choice. Pretending to be dead

long enough to drive your child into hysterics is deliberately vicious and

psychopathic in my estimate, based on reading the posts of psychopaths at a

website " psychopath blog " that found. That is exactly the kind of

thing these psychopaths do to relieve their inner emptiness and boredom: just

torture something or someone for kicks.

My nada was never as openly sadistic and withholding as you've described your

mother is and was, but my nada nevertheless did a lot of emotional damage to me

and is now the very picture of the sweet, fragile, adorable little old lady.

Its really only Sister and I, now, who know what she's like when the mask is

off.

-Annie

> > >

> > > My nada did this same thing!

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I feel so sad reading what you wrote about your family tormenting you when you

had asthma attacks. I'm so sorry you had to endure that!

I remember my parents smoking and blowing the smoke in my face. I was not

allowed to move or try to get away from it at the table or they would make me

move closer and blow it in my face more. I had what they called bronchitis then

(now it just goes under asthma as a coughing reaction). Anyway, it was terribly

difficult for me to breathe.

The justification for this treatment was that they were teaching us kids to be

polite around smokers and not display disapproval of smoking.

I remember they also yelled " Slave, bring me a cup of coffee. " I'm not sure

what the justification was for calling us slaves, but it was a fitting term for

our indentured servitude.

Coal Miner's Daughter

(still mining away, trying to uncover the core of this depression)

>> One of the things they teased me about was my asthma. I'd get asthma attacks

> if I laughed or cried really hard, or if I was around dogs or cats, and I'd

> be wheezing and they'd laugh at me. My aunt, uncle and cousin had a dog, and

> my uncle was a really funny man and made me laugh a lot, so every time we'd

> go visit them (which was only on holidays), I'd spend the whole time

> fighting for breath.; The minute my family members would hear me start

> wheezing, one of them would say, " Oh! Judy laughed! " - and for some reason

> they all thought it was hilarious. I'll never understand that.

>

[Guest guest]

(((((Judy))))) (((((CMD)))))

I too am just speechless, aghast at parents who deliberately inflict physical

pain and distress and ridicule on their children, particularly in the form of

deliberately triggering asthma attacks.

I... have no words to express the level of horror I feel at that deliberate

sadism. Its simply beyond my comprehension. Children can so easily die from

asthma attacks, and you were both deliberately and repeatedly exposed to asthma

triggers. And then to *laugh* about your distress on top of that.. Holy.

Freaking. Cow. That truly must be psychopathic indicators, what else could it

be?

(Both my parents smoked constantly, and I grew up getting frequent colds,

bronchitis, and had several bouts of pneumonia. I couldn't breath through my

nose, either, because my sinuses were always closed, so I had to develop a

" strategy " to eat without choking. I was in bed with pneumonia every Christmas

for about four years in a row, when I was 11-15.)

I wish that you could have been rescued from that kind of half-life, that

imprisonment, in which your sadistic jailers took pleasure from torturing you.

You're lucky you didn't die.

I'm personally convinced from reading the posts here and at other sites that a

lot of us were raised by psychopaths, or borderlines with a heavy dose of

psychopathy traits. We were raised by bullies.

(Either that, or bpd needs to have " deliberate sadism toward children " added as

a diagnostic trait.)

-Annie

> >> One of the things they teased me about was my asthma. I'd get asthma

attacks

> > if I laughed or cried really hard, or if I was around dogs or cats, and I'd

> > be wheezing and they'd laugh at me. My aunt, uncle and cousin had a dog, and

> > my uncle was a really funny man and made me laugh a lot, so every time we'd

> > go visit them (which was only on holidays), I'd spend the whole time

> > fighting for breath.; The minute my family members would hear me start

> > wheezing, one of them would say, " Oh! Judy laughed! " - and for some reason

> > they all thought it was hilarious. I'll never understand that.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

(((((Judy))))) (((((CMD)))))

I too am just speechless, aghast at parents who deliberately inflict physical

pain and distress and ridicule on their children, particularly in the form of

deliberately triggering asthma attacks.

I... have no words to express the level of horror I feel at that deliberate

sadism. Its simply beyond my comprehension. Children can so easily die from

asthma attacks, and you were both deliberately and repeatedly exposed to asthma

triggers. And then to *laugh* about your distress on top of that.. Holy.

Freaking. Cow. That truly must be psychopathic indicators, what else could it

be?

(Both my parents smoked constantly, and I grew up getting frequent colds,

bronchitis, and had several bouts of pneumonia. I couldn't breath through my

nose, either, because my sinuses were always closed, so I had to develop a

" strategy " to eat without choking. I was in bed with pneumonia every Christmas

for about four years in a row, when I was 11-15.)

I wish that you could have been rescued from that kind of half-life, that

imprisonment, in which your sadistic jailers took pleasure from torturing you.

You're lucky you didn't die.

I'm personally convinced from reading the posts here and at other sites that a

lot of us were raised by psychopaths, or borderlines with a heavy dose of

psychopathy traits. We were raised by bullies.

(Either that, or bpd needs to have " deliberate sadism toward children " added as

a diagnostic trait.)

-Annie

> >> One of the things they teased me about was my asthma. I'd get asthma

attacks

> > if I laughed or cried really hard, or if I was around dogs or cats, and I'd

> > be wheezing and they'd laugh at me. My aunt, uncle and cousin had a dog, and

> > my uncle was a really funny man and made me laugh a lot, so every time we'd

> > go visit them (which was only on holidays), I'd spend the whole time

> > fighting for breath.; The minute my family members would hear me start

> > wheezing, one of them would say, " Oh! Judy laughed! " - and for some reason

> > they all thought it was hilarious. I'll never understand that.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

(((((Judy))))) (((((CMD)))))

I too am just speechless, aghast at parents who deliberately inflict physical

pain and distress and ridicule on their children, particularly in the form of

deliberately triggering asthma attacks.

I... have no words to express the level of horror I feel at that deliberate

sadism. Its simply beyond my comprehension. Children can so easily die from

asthma attacks, and you were both deliberately and repeatedly exposed to asthma

triggers. And then to *laugh* about your distress on top of that.. Holy.

Freaking. Cow. That truly must be psychopathic indicators, what else could it

be?

(Both my parents smoked constantly, and I grew up getting frequent colds,

bronchitis, and had several bouts of pneumonia. I couldn't breath through my

nose, either, because my sinuses were always closed, so I had to develop a

" strategy " to eat without choking. I was in bed with pneumonia every Christmas

for about four years in a row, when I was 11-15.)

I wish that you could have been rescued from that kind of half-life, that

imprisonment, in which your sadistic jailers took pleasure from torturing you.

You're lucky you didn't die.

I'm personally convinced from reading the posts here and at other sites that a

lot of us were raised by psychopaths, or borderlines with a heavy dose of

psychopathy traits. We were raised by bullies.

(Either that, or bpd needs to have " deliberate sadism toward children " added as

a diagnostic trait.)

-Annie

> >> One of the things they teased me about was my asthma. I'd get asthma

attacks

> > if I laughed or cried really hard, or if I was around dogs or cats, and I'd

> > be wheezing and they'd laugh at me. My aunt, uncle and cousin had a dog, and

> > my uncle was a really funny man and made me laugh a lot, so every time we'd

> > go visit them (which was only on holidays), I'd spend the whole time

> > fighting for breath.; The minute my family members would hear me start

> > wheezing, one of them would say, " Oh! Judy laughed! " - and for some reason

> > they all thought it was hilarious. I'll never understand that.

> >

>