Re: BPDs appropriate; NPDs annihilate (tm charlie)

[Guest guest]

I agree with you, I personally believe that the statistics are way off.

Keep in mind that statistics are often just estimates, and according to Randi

Kreger the only pd individuals who make it into the statistics are the ones who

come to the attention of the psychiatric community. Randi speculates that its

only the most low-functioning Cluster Bs who wind up getting counted because

they've been hospitalized for attempted suicide, or gotten arrested and

evaluated for assault and battery, drunk driving, criminal activity, or for

extreme child abuse/neglect, etc., etc., and the higher-functioning bpds are

invisible to statisticians.

At another Internet support group for the adult children of

personality-disordered parents ( " Out of the Fog " ) they have a statistics page,

grouped by different studies/years.

A 2005 study came up with these stats for the Cluster B Group:

Antisocial pd: 1.2%

Borderline pd: 3.9%

Histrionic pd: 0.9%

Narcissistic: 2.2%

And they mention a 2007 study estimating that 9.1% of the US population (about 1

in 11 people) meet the DSM-IV criteria for a personality disorder (including

Cluster A and Cluster C pds also.)

But me personally, I'm willing to bet that if all the higher-functioning Cluster

Bs could be counted, the statistics would be much higher, like maybe 16% instead

of just 8.2% as a Cluster. About double.

Its also my opinion that whoever compiles the statistics on mental illness is

probably under pressure to underestimate, because a more realistic and higher

estimate would be alarming and depressing to the general population.

Here's the link to the Out of the Fog website:

http://www.outofthefog.net/Statistics.html#PDPrevalence

-Annie

>

> Hi everyone,

>

> Does it ever seem like Cluster Bs are way, way more common than mainstream

culture would have us think? I sometimes fear that my meter must be off, I

encounter so many. I recently had a very traumatic encounter with a young man

who turned out to be either a narcissist or an extremely persuasive impression

of one.

>

> This young man happened to be a narcissist on the same theme that my nada is a

bpd, and it helped me to see the difference even more clearly. As you all may

have seen me explain before, I am convinced that both NPDs and BPDs have one or

two 'themes' in their disorders--specific things that they are endlessly greedy

for. When Cluster Bs are artistically inclined, I am finding, their theme-grab

can be a person's desirability, their ability to inspire art, and attract a

mate--thier life's energy, in other words. What drives procreation. My nada,

was obsessed with whether or not I was 'desirable' to men. It was extremely

painful, and of course sexually abusive, since it started the day I was born.

She incessantly picked at it, observed it, denigrated it, commented on it,

interacted with it...Her life's blood depended on her manipulating this aspect

of me.

>

> (You can imagine what a picnic it is now to be a single woman trying to live

through holiday season number 3 of NC.)

>

> So I recently encountered a narcissistic-acting young man who is greedy for

the exact same thing. I was not interested in dating this kid (though he's very

cute), I was trying to be friends with him, but I noticed immediately that when

we hung out, though it seemed very fun in a way, it was leaving me in deathly

despair, feeling completely exiled and undesirable as a woman. Even though we

were not dating, or touching, or anything like this. After awhile, he (like all

Cluster Bs), revealed himself with these out of the blue, extremely abusive,

extremely cruel comments in which he offered--WITHOUT my asking!--how

'undesired' I was by him. Most recently I had sent him a friendly message

describing someone who had asked me out in whom I wasn't interested, and how I

was flattered bks it was a rather exotic sortof situation, and he slammed it

dismissively, even though he had not seen or heard the conversation, insisting

that the person hadn't meant to ask me out.

>

> It had CLEARLY been an invitation to a date. He hadn't even seen the

interchange. He needed to destroy all 'desirability' in me. Not just in me.

In every woman he meets.

>

> It was excruciatingly difficult for me, the whole friendship w/him (even

though it only lasted about a week), because he was doing this mercilessly, even

without words, and I was perceiving it, before I knew it consciously. I knew

that the amount of pain I was feeling was not typical for two people who were

supposed to have expressed mutual friendship, and agreed at the outset to have

only social intentions. He was still 'rejecting' me every time we saw each

other--setting me up for it, and relishing it. And at first I really didn't

know how he was managing this.

>

> I'm sorry I've taken awhile to get to the point here. The point is:

borderlines appropriate. Narcissists annihilate. Nada wanted to merge with me.

She wanted to torture me but to keep my basic Muse energy intact, for the times

I was split good, or maybe just because she wasn't a murderer. Basically she

wanted to BE me--but not destroy me. THIS young genteleman, however, he wanted

all Muse aspects in me completely annihilated. He thinks HE is the Muse to

everyone on earth, he has to have it ALL (the same way some NPDs need all the

money, the political control, or the knowledge/wisdom). I felt like the essence

of the female in me was bleeding after seeing him, precisely because the little

dude had STAKED me in the spirit. He wants it ALL. Nobody else can be

desirable.

>

> It was brutal. I'm glad it's over. But I'm glad to see there was some bit of

desirability, of the Muse's energy, in me--there had to be, right, or else he

wouldn't be trying to destroy it!

>

> Take care everyone,

> Charlie

>

[Guest guest]

That's an interesting thought, Charlie - it never occurred to me, though I see

SO MANY people with similar traits to Mommie Dearest. I kind of always just

assumed I was a drama magnet.

Okay, it sounds weird, I know - but think about it. People who want to control

and manipulate others tend to pick up on the traits that make a person

vulnerable to control, manipulation, FOG, and all the rest. Having been raised

by BPD parents, we're pretty much bred to their specifications!

At the same time, though, what you're saying also makes a TON of sense. BPD is

hard to explain in a sound byte, so it doesn't really appear in mainstream

cultural representations very often. And that could make it even harder to

identify and recognize a disorder that's already pretty slippery to grasp. So

under-representation would make absolute sense. Hmmm . . .

Either way, I guess it's all the more important that we're learning to recognize

it and get healthier, right?

Psyclone

[Guest guest]

I always thought i took the hard way in my life instead of easy paths...but

that's how i justified it.

What really was happening was that my mom took my natural, easy decisions and

twisted them to be acted out in painful, dragged out ways.

So, it wasn't really me who was taking the hard way out in life...it was my mom

who made everything a difficult drama.

Important life lessons for me. Changes how I see myself.

Amy

ugggghhhhh...this mental illness thing has always thrown me for a loop. I wish I

had known what was going on many years ago. So much of my precious time wasted.

What a shame.

Re: BPDs appropriate; NPDs annihilate (tm charlie)

That's an interesting thought, Charlie - it never occurred to me, though I see

SO MANY people with similar traits to Mommie Dearest. I kind of always just

assumed I was a drama magnet.

Okay, it sounds weird, I know - but think about it. People who want to control

and manipulate others tend to pick up on the traits that make a person

vulnerable to control, manipulation, FOG, and all the rest. Having been raised

by BPD parents, we're pretty much bred to their specifications!

At the same time, though, what you're saying also makes a TON of sense. BPD is

hard to explain in a sound byte, so it doesn't really appear in mainstream

cultural representations very often. And that could make it even harder to

identify and recognize a disorder that's already pretty slippery to grasp. So

under-representation would make absolute sense. Hmmm . . .

Either way, I guess it's all the more important that we're learning to recognize

it and get healthier, right?

Psyclone

[Guest guest]

I always thought i took the hard way in my life instead of easy paths...but

that's how i justified it.

What really was happening was that my mom took my natural, easy decisions and

twisted them to be acted out in painful, dragged out ways.

So, it wasn't really me who was taking the hard way out in life...it was my mom

who made everything a difficult drama.

Important life lessons for me. Changes how I see myself.

Amy

ugggghhhhh...this mental illness thing has always thrown me for a loop. I wish I

had known what was going on many years ago. So much of my precious time wasted.

What a shame.

Re: BPDs appropriate; NPDs annihilate (tm charlie)

That's an interesting thought, Charlie - it never occurred to me, though I see

SO MANY people with similar traits to Mommie Dearest. I kind of always just

assumed I was a drama magnet.

Okay, it sounds weird, I know - but think about it. People who want to control

and manipulate others tend to pick up on the traits that make a person

vulnerable to control, manipulation, FOG, and all the rest. Having been raised

by BPD parents, we're pretty much bred to their specifications!

At the same time, though, what you're saying also makes a TON of sense. BPD is

hard to explain in a sound byte, so it doesn't really appear in mainstream

cultural representations very often. And that could make it even harder to

identify and recognize a disorder that's already pretty slippery to grasp. So

under-representation would make absolute sense. Hmmm . . .

Either way, I guess it's all the more important that we're learning to recognize

it and get healthier, right?

Psyclone

[Guest guest]

I always thought i took the hard way in my life instead of easy paths...but

that's how i justified it.

What really was happening was that my mom took my natural, easy decisions and

twisted them to be acted out in painful, dragged out ways.

So, it wasn't really me who was taking the hard way out in life...it was my mom

who made everything a difficult drama.

Important life lessons for me. Changes how I see myself.

Amy

ugggghhhhh...this mental illness thing has always thrown me for a loop. I wish I

had known what was going on many years ago. So much of my precious time wasted.

What a shame.

Re: BPDs appropriate; NPDs annihilate (tm charlie)

That's an interesting thought, Charlie - it never occurred to me, though I see

SO MANY people with similar traits to Mommie Dearest. I kind of always just

assumed I was a drama magnet.

Okay, it sounds weird, I know - but think about it. People who want to control

and manipulate others tend to pick up on the traits that make a person

vulnerable to control, manipulation, FOG, and all the rest. Having been raised

by BPD parents, we're pretty much bred to their specifications!

At the same time, though, what you're saying also makes a TON of sense. BPD is

hard to explain in a sound byte, so it doesn't really appear in mainstream

cultural representations very often. And that could make it even harder to

identify and recognize a disorder that's already pretty slippery to grasp. So

under-representation would make absolute sense. Hmmm . . .

Either way, I guess it's all the more important that we're learning to recognize

it and get healthier, right?

Psyclone

[Guest guest]

I wanted to thank everyone for responding to this thread and thanks Annie esp

for the link & stats. I didn't know there was another great group out there!

This young man has begun to try and initiate social outings, now that I've

stopped doing so, and it's a little stressful trying to figure out the best way

to play it out.

Best,

Charlie

> >

> > Hi everyone,

> >

> > Does it ever seem like Cluster Bs are way, way more common than mainstream

culture would have us think? I sometimes fear that my meter must be off, I

encounter so many. I recently had a very traumatic encounter with a young man

who turned out to be either a narcissist or an extremely persuasive impression

of one.

> >

> > This young man happened to be a narcissist on the same theme that my nada is

a bpd, and it helped me to see the difference even more clearly. As you all may

have seen me explain before, I am convinced that both NPDs and BPDs have one or

two 'themes' in their disorders--specific things that they are endlessly greedy

for. When Cluster Bs are artistically inclined, I am finding, their theme-grab

can be a person's desirability, their ability to inspire art, and attract a

mate--thier life's energy, in other words. What drives procreation. My nada,

was obsessed with whether or not I was 'desirable' to men. It was extremely

painful, and of course sexually abusive, since it started the day I was born.

She incessantly picked at it, observed it, denigrated it, commented on it,

interacted with it...Her life's blood depended on her manipulating this aspect

of me.

> >

> > (You can imagine what a picnic it is now to be a single woman trying to live

through holiday season number 3 of NC.)

> >

> > So I recently encountered a narcissistic-acting young man who is greedy for

the exact same thing. I was not interested in dating this kid (though he's very

cute), I was trying to be friends with him, but I noticed immediately that when

we hung out, though it seemed very fun in a way, it was leaving me in deathly

despair, feeling completely exiled and undesirable as a woman. Even though we

were not dating, or touching, or anything like this. After awhile, he (like all

Cluster Bs), revealed himself with these out of the blue, extremely abusive,

extremely cruel comments in which he offered--WITHOUT my asking!--how

'undesired' I was by him. Most recently I had sent him a friendly message

describing someone who had asked me out in whom I wasn't interested, and how I

was flattered bks it was a rather exotic sortof situation, and he slammed it

dismissively, even though he had not seen or heard the conversation, insisting

that the person hadn't meant to ask me out.

> >

> > It had CLEARLY been an invitation to a date. He hadn't even seen the

interchange. He needed to destroy all 'desirability' in me. Not just in me.

In every woman he meets.

> >

> > It was excruciatingly difficult for me, the whole friendship w/him (even

though it only lasted about a week), because he was doing this mercilessly, even

without words, and I was perceiving it, before I knew it consciously. I knew

that the amount of pain I was feeling was not typical for two people who were

supposed to have expressed mutual friendship, and agreed at the outset to have

only social intentions. He was still 'rejecting' me every time we saw each

other--setting me up for it, and relishing it. And at first I really didn't

know how he was managing this.

> >

> > I'm sorry I've taken awhile to get to the point here. The point is:

borderlines appropriate. Narcissists annihilate. Nada wanted to merge with me.

She wanted to torture me but to keep my basic Muse energy intact, for the times

I was split good, or maybe just because she wasn't a murderer. Basically she

wanted to BE me--but not destroy me. THIS young genteleman, however, he wanted

all Muse aspects in me completely annihilated. He thinks HE is the Muse to

everyone on earth, he has to have it ALL (the same way some NPDs need all the

money, the political control, or the knowledge/wisdom). I felt like the essence

of the female in me was bleeding after seeing him, precisely because the little

dude had STAKED me in the spirit. He wants it ALL. Nobody else can be

desirable.

> >

> > It was brutal. I'm glad it's over. But I'm glad to see there was some bit

of desirability, of the Muse's energy, in me--there had to be, right, or else he

wouldn't be trying to destroy it!

> >

> > Take care everyone,

> > Charlie

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I wanted to thank everyone for responding to this thread and thanks Annie esp

for the link & stats. I didn't know there was another great group out there!

This young man has begun to try and initiate social outings, now that I've

stopped doing so, and it's a little stressful trying to figure out the best way

to play it out.

Best,

Charlie

> >

> > Hi everyone,

> >

> > Does it ever seem like Cluster Bs are way, way more common than mainstream

culture would have us think? I sometimes fear that my meter must be off, I

encounter so many. I recently had a very traumatic encounter with a young man

who turned out to be either a narcissist or an extremely persuasive impression

of one.

> >

> > This young man happened to be a narcissist on the same theme that my nada is

a bpd, and it helped me to see the difference even more clearly. As you all may

have seen me explain before, I am convinced that both NPDs and BPDs have one or

two 'themes' in their disorders--specific things that they are endlessly greedy

for. When Cluster Bs are artistically inclined, I am finding, their theme-grab

can be a person's desirability, their ability to inspire art, and attract a

mate--thier life's energy, in other words. What drives procreation. My nada,

was obsessed with whether or not I was 'desirable' to men. It was extremely

painful, and of course sexually abusive, since it started the day I was born.

She incessantly picked at it, observed it, denigrated it, commented on it,

interacted with it...Her life's blood depended on her manipulating this aspect

of me.

> >

> > (You can imagine what a picnic it is now to be a single woman trying to live

through holiday season number 3 of NC.)

> >

> > So I recently encountered a narcissistic-acting young man who is greedy for

the exact same thing. I was not interested in dating this kid (though he's very

cute), I was trying to be friends with him, but I noticed immediately that when

we hung out, though it seemed very fun in a way, it was leaving me in deathly

despair, feeling completely exiled and undesirable as a woman. Even though we

were not dating, or touching, or anything like this. After awhile, he (like all

Cluster Bs), revealed himself with these out of the blue, extremely abusive,

extremely cruel comments in which he offered--WITHOUT my asking!--how

'undesired' I was by him. Most recently I had sent him a friendly message

describing someone who had asked me out in whom I wasn't interested, and how I

was flattered bks it was a rather exotic sortof situation, and he slammed it

dismissively, even though he had not seen or heard the conversation, insisting

that the person hadn't meant to ask me out.

> >

> > It had CLEARLY been an invitation to a date. He hadn't even seen the

interchange. He needed to destroy all 'desirability' in me. Not just in me.

In every woman he meets.

> >

> > It was excruciatingly difficult for me, the whole friendship w/him (even

though it only lasted about a week), because he was doing this mercilessly, even

without words, and I was perceiving it, before I knew it consciously. I knew

that the amount of pain I was feeling was not typical for two people who were

supposed to have expressed mutual friendship, and agreed at the outset to have

only social intentions. He was still 'rejecting' me every time we saw each

other--setting me up for it, and relishing it. And at first I really didn't

know how he was managing this.

> >

> > I'm sorry I've taken awhile to get to the point here. The point is:

borderlines appropriate. Narcissists annihilate. Nada wanted to merge with me.

She wanted to torture me but to keep my basic Muse energy intact, for the times

I was split good, or maybe just because she wasn't a murderer. Basically she

wanted to BE me--but not destroy me. THIS young genteleman, however, he wanted

all Muse aspects in me completely annihilated. He thinks HE is the Muse to

everyone on earth, he has to have it ALL (the same way some NPDs need all the

money, the political control, or the knowledge/wisdom). I felt like the essence

of the female in me was bleeding after seeing him, precisely because the little

dude had STAKED me in the spirit. He wants it ALL. Nobody else can be

desirable.

> >

> > It was brutal. I'm glad it's over. But I'm glad to see there was some bit

of desirability, of the Muse's energy, in me--there had to be, right, or else he

wouldn't be trying to destroy it!

> >

> > Take care everyone,

> > Charlie

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I wanted to thank everyone for responding to this thread and thanks Annie esp

for the link & stats. I didn't know there was another great group out there!

This young man has begun to try and initiate social outings, now that I've

stopped doing so, and it's a little stressful trying to figure out the best way

to play it out.

Best,

Charlie

> >

> > Hi everyone,

> >

> > Does it ever seem like Cluster Bs are way, way more common than mainstream

culture would have us think? I sometimes fear that my meter must be off, I

encounter so many. I recently had a very traumatic encounter with a young man

who turned out to be either a narcissist or an extremely persuasive impression

of one.

> >

> > This young man happened to be a narcissist on the same theme that my nada is

a bpd, and it helped me to see the difference even more clearly. As you all may

have seen me explain before, I am convinced that both NPDs and BPDs have one or

two 'themes' in their disorders--specific things that they are endlessly greedy

for. When Cluster Bs are artistically inclined, I am finding, their theme-grab

can be a person's desirability, their ability to inspire art, and attract a

mate--thier life's energy, in other words. What drives procreation. My nada,

was obsessed with whether or not I was 'desirable' to men. It was extremely

painful, and of course sexually abusive, since it started the day I was born.

She incessantly picked at it, observed it, denigrated it, commented on it,

interacted with it...Her life's blood depended on her manipulating this aspect

of me.

> >

> > (You can imagine what a picnic it is now to be a single woman trying to live

through holiday season number 3 of NC.)

> >

> > So I recently encountered a narcissistic-acting young man who is greedy for

the exact same thing. I was not interested in dating this kid (though he's very

cute), I was trying to be friends with him, but I noticed immediately that when

we hung out, though it seemed very fun in a way, it was leaving me in deathly

despair, feeling completely exiled and undesirable as a woman. Even though we

were not dating, or touching, or anything like this. After awhile, he (like all

Cluster Bs), revealed himself with these out of the blue, extremely abusive,

extremely cruel comments in which he offered--WITHOUT my asking!--how

'undesired' I was by him. Most recently I had sent him a friendly message

describing someone who had asked me out in whom I wasn't interested, and how I

was flattered bks it was a rather exotic sortof situation, and he slammed it

dismissively, even though he had not seen or heard the conversation, insisting

that the person hadn't meant to ask me out.

> >

> > It had CLEARLY been an invitation to a date. He hadn't even seen the

interchange. He needed to destroy all 'desirability' in me. Not just in me.

In every woman he meets.

> >

> > It was excruciatingly difficult for me, the whole friendship w/him (even

though it only lasted about a week), because he was doing this mercilessly, even

without words, and I was perceiving it, before I knew it consciously. I knew

that the amount of pain I was feeling was not typical for two people who were

supposed to have expressed mutual friendship, and agreed at the outset to have

only social intentions. He was still 'rejecting' me every time we saw each

other--setting me up for it, and relishing it. And at first I really didn't

know how he was managing this.

> >

> > I'm sorry I've taken awhile to get to the point here. The point is:

borderlines appropriate. Narcissists annihilate. Nada wanted to merge with me.

She wanted to torture me but to keep my basic Muse energy intact, for the times

I was split good, or maybe just because she wasn't a murderer. Basically she

wanted to BE me--but not destroy me. THIS young genteleman, however, he wanted

all Muse aspects in me completely annihilated. He thinks HE is the Muse to

everyone on earth, he has to have it ALL (the same way some NPDs need all the

money, the political control, or the knowledge/wisdom). I felt like the essence

of the female in me was bleeding after seeing him, precisely because the little

dude had STAKED me in the spirit. He wants it ALL. Nobody else can be

desirable.

> >

> > It was brutal. I'm glad it's over. But I'm glad to see there was some bit

of desirability, of the Muse's energy, in me--there had to be, right, or else he

wouldn't be trying to destroy it!

> >

> > Take care everyone,

> > Charlie

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I love your analysis of the bpd vs the npd, charlie! I think that is a profound

and accurate observation, that they are both greedy for things we nons have. In

my case, my bpd nada wanted to " be " me (or for me to be her) sometimes, and at

other times the npd in her wanted to utterly crush me.

However, if this young man is a narcissist and being around him makes you feel

like this: " I noticed immediately that when we hung out, though it seemed very

fun in a way, it was leaving me in deathly despair, feeling completely exiled

and undesirable as a woman " then I'm puzzled as to why you'd even consider

spending any time with him again, ever? (Unless perhaps its to study him, like

he's a rare, poisonous, predatory species of creature you're doing a paper on,

lol!)

-Annie

> > >

> > > Hi everyone,

> > >

> > > Does it ever seem like Cluster Bs are way, way more common than mainstream

culture would have us think? I sometimes fear that my meter must be off, I

encounter so many. I recently had a very traumatic encounter with a young man

who turned out to be either a narcissist or an extremely persuasive impression

of one.

> > >

> > > This young man happened to be a narcissist on the same theme that my nada

is a bpd, and it helped me to see the difference even more clearly. As you all

may have seen me explain before, I am convinced that both NPDs and BPDs have one

or two 'themes' in their disorders--specific things that they are endlessly

greedy for. When Cluster Bs are artistically inclined, I am finding, their

theme-grab can be a person's desirability, their ability to inspire art, and

attract a mate--thier life's energy, in other words. What drives procreation.

My nada, was obsessed with whether or not I was 'desirable' to men. It was

extremely painful, and of course sexually abusive, since it started the day I

was born. She incessantly picked at it, observed it, denigrated it, commented

on it, interacted with it...Her life's blood depended on her manipulating this

aspect of me.

> > >

> > > (You can imagine what a picnic it is now to be a single woman trying to

live through holiday season number 3 of NC.)

> > >

> > > So I recently encountered a narcissistic-acting young man who is greedy

for the exact same thing. I was not interested in dating this kid (though he's

very cute), I was trying to be friends with him, but I noticed immediately that

when we hung out, though it seemed very fun in a way, it was leaving me in

deathly despair, feeling completely exiled and undesirable as a woman. Even

though we were not dating, or touching, or anything like this. After awhile, he

(like all Cluster Bs), revealed himself with these out of the blue, extremely

abusive, extremely cruel comments in which he offered--WITHOUT my asking!--how

'undesired' I was by him. Most recently I had sent him a friendly message

describing someone who had asked me out in whom I wasn't interested, and how I

was flattered bks it was a rather exotic sortof situation, and he slammed it

dismissively, even though he had not seen or heard the conversation, insisting

that the person hadn't meant to ask me out.

> > >

> > > It had CLEARLY been an invitation to a date. He hadn't even seen the

interchange. He needed to destroy all 'desirability' in me. Not just in me.

In every woman he meets.

> > >

> > > It was excruciatingly difficult for me, the whole friendship w/him (even

though it only lasted about a week), because he was doing this mercilessly, even

without words, and I was perceiving it, before I knew it consciously. I knew

that the amount of pain I was feeling was not typical for two people who were

supposed to have expressed mutual friendship, and agreed at the outset to have

only social intentions. He was still 'rejecting' me every time we saw each

other--setting me up for it, and relishing it. And at first I really didn't

know how he was managing this.

> > >

> > > I'm sorry I've taken awhile to get to the point here. The point is:

borderlines appropriate. Narcissists annihilate. Nada wanted to merge with me.

She wanted to torture me but to keep my basic Muse energy intact, for the times

I was split good, or maybe just because she wasn't a murderer. Basically she

wanted to BE me--but not destroy me. THIS young genteleman, however, he wanted

all Muse aspects in me completely annihilated. He thinks HE is the Muse to

everyone on earth, he has to have it ALL (the same way some NPDs need all the

money, the political control, or the knowledge/wisdom). I felt like the essence

of the female in me was bleeding after seeing him, precisely because the little

dude had STAKED me in the spirit. He wants it ALL. Nobody else can be

desirable.

> > >

> > > It was brutal. I'm glad it's over. But I'm glad to see there was some

bit of desirability, of the Muse's energy, in me--there had to be, right, or

else he wouldn't be trying to destroy it!

> > >

> > > Take care everyone,

> > > Charlie

> > >

> >

>