Re: can bpd's really love?

[Guest guest]

My nada also thinks nice presents is the same as love. That's why giving gifts

to her was always hard, if it wasn't some expensive thing that she really liked

then we must not love her! (She's gotten a little better with that, I usually

just get her flowers and she knows I don't have much money. She likes flowers.

But she still doesn't like anything my dad gives her.)

I remember as a kid a lot of my friend were jealous of all the nice things I

had. But I was jealous of the real MOTHER they had. I couldn't explain that the

toys I had were not important at all - other kids didn't understand. They

thought my parents were awesome because they would spend lots of money on me.

I may have had lots of toys, but I didn't feel loved.

As an adult, I don't really like getting gifts. I'd much prefer a hug.

Casey

> > >

> > > >I know this could probably be debated and discussed until the

> > > >end of time, but I do have to question whether my mother ever

> > > >truly loved me. On the one hand, as a child, she was

> > > >emotionally absent from me. Then when I became an adult, she

> > > >wanted to control me to the point that she was killing me,

> > > >destroyed my friendships and relationships with her " craziness "

> > > >and did it in the " name of love. " " I am destroying you because

> > > >I love you. "

> > > >

> > > >I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that trying to rationalize

> > > >the irrational behavior of a BPD is completely futile, but I

> > > >continue to do it week after week while sitting in therapy. My

> > > >therapist says, " well, your mom loved you in her own

> > > >way. " Umm, what is THAT anyway? I mean, do pedophiles " love

> > > >in their own way " too? It's just as logical. Sometimes loving

> > > >someone in YOUR own way is the WRONG way.

> > > >

> > > >At some point, I'm going to have to let it go, but I guess I'm

> > > >still in the " why did she do this to me? " phase.

> > > >

> > > >Because I struggle now...a lot. With relationships, with

> > > >abandonment issues, with trust issues, with confidence issues.

> > > >I am struggling with the holidays approaching. Trying so hard

> > > >to put on a happy face and force myself to enjoy it for my

> > > >husband, for my friends, for my kids. And for my therapist not

> > > >to think all her hard work with me is just throwing feathers in

> > > >the wind. I just want to be okay with things and right now,

> > > >while it's better than the years before, I'm not okay with

> > > >things STILL.

> > > >

> > > >I want to enjoy Christmas without remembering my mother tried

> > > >to shoot herself on Christmas Eve. Well, hmm, let me rephrase

> > > >that. My mother grabbed the gun and ran into the bathroom

> > > >threatening to shoot herself on Christmas Eve to get my father

> > > >to break the door down and make it all about her and " rescue "

> > > >her. I was 7. I remember it like it was yesterday. I

> > > >remember all day on Christmas was spent with my uncle and my

> > > >grandmother consoling my suicidal mother. The suicidal mother

> > > >who never actually did attempt suicide, but whatever.

> > > >

> > > >I was reading online about BPD this morning and I just thought

> > > >to myself....I hate this disorder. I hate, hate, hate it and

> > > >the horse it rode in on. I think my mother could have been a

> > > >serial killer or the unibomber and I wouldn't have been this

> > > >affected by it.

> > > >

> > > >(

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > --

> > > Katrina

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Same here--fada thinks presents = love. That way he can claim I'm being a

spoiled brat if I'm not " behaving " and starts to list all the expensive

stuff he did for me, and goes on to explain how expensive it was, before

launching into a list of all my expensive health care stuff (hearing aids,

CI surgery, bout of asthma-like stuff, etc). He did the same thing to my

siblings--they had TONS of toys, and every now and then he'd threaten to go

in there with a trashbag and throw away the toys if they weren't " behaving. "

A couple of times he actually did. Even threw away a brand new Little People

toy set that the little ones had gotten only days before at Christmas.

And same here--I always wished that we didn't have all this stuff, but

instead had a normal dad instead.

Took a while to try to get out of the phobia of gifts--subconciously or

conciously, I would always be a bit skittish when I got gifts, because I was

afraid it'd be used against me again.

Sometimes it's amazing at just how similar our nadas and fadas are.

On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 12:23 PM, slingshot2hell

wrote:

>

>

> My nada also thinks nice presents is the same as love. That's why giving

> gifts to her was always hard, if it wasn't some expensive thing that she

> really liked then we must not love her! (She's gotten a little better with

> that, I usually just get her flowers and she knows I don't have much money.

> She likes flowers. But she still doesn't like anything my dad gives her.)

>

> I remember as a kid a lot of my friend were jealous of all the nice things

> I had. But I was jealous of the real MOTHER they had. I couldn't explain

> that the toys I had were not important at all - other kids didn't

> understand. They thought my parents were awesome because they would spend

> lots of money on me.

>

> I may have had lots of toys, but I didn't feel loved.

>

> As an adult, I don't really like getting gifts. I'd much prefer a hug.

>

> Casey

>

>

> > > >

> > > > >I know this could probably be debated and discussed until the

> > > > >end of time, but I do have to question whether my mother ever

> > > > >truly loved me. On the one hand, as a child, she was

> > > > >emotionally absent from me. Then when I became an adult, she

> > > > >wanted to control me to the point that she was killing me,

> > > > >destroyed my friendships and relationships with her " craziness "

> > > > >and did it in the " name of love. " " I am destroying you because

> > > > >I love you. "

> > > > >

> > > > >I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that trying to rationalize

> > > > >the irrational behavior of a BPD is completely futile, but I

> > > > >continue to do it week after week while sitting in therapy. My

> > > > >therapist says, " well, your mom loved you in her own

> > > > >way. " Umm, what is THAT anyway? I mean, do pedophiles " love

> > > > >in their own way " too? It's just as logical. Sometimes loving

> > > > >someone in YOUR own way is the WRONG way.

> > > > >

> > > > >At some point, I'm going to have to let it go, but I guess I'm

> > > > >still in the " why did she do this to me? " phase.

> > > > >

> > > > >Because I struggle now...a lot. With relationships, with

> > > > >abandonment issues, with trust issues, with confidence issues.

> > > > >I am struggling with the holidays approaching. Trying so hard

> > > > >to put on a happy face and force myself to enjoy it for my

> > > > >husband, for my friends, for my kids. And for my therapist not

> > > > >to think all her hard work with me is just throwing feathers in

> > > > >the wind. I just want to be okay with things and right now,

> > > > >while it's better than the years before, I'm not okay with

> > > > >things STILL.

> > > > >

> > > > >I want to enjoy Christmas without remembering my mother tried

> > > > >to shoot herself on Christmas Eve. Well, hmm, let me rephrase

> > > > >that. My mother grabbed the gun and ran into the bathroom

> > > > >threatening to shoot herself on Christmas Eve to get my father

> > > > >to break the door down and make it all about her and " rescue "

> > > > >her. I was 7. I remember it like it was yesterday. I

> > > > >remember all day on Christmas was spent with my uncle and my

> > > > >grandmother consoling my suicidal mother. The suicidal mother

> > > > >who never actually did attempt suicide, but whatever.

> > > > >

> > > > >I was reading online about BPD this morning and I just thought

> > > > >to myself....I hate this disorder. I hate, hate, hate it and

> > > > >the horse it rode in on. I think my mother could have been a

> > > > >serial killer or the unibomber and I wouldn't have been this

> > > > >affected by it.

> > > > >

> > > > >(

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > --

> > > > Katrina

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Same here--fada thinks presents = love. That way he can claim I'm being a

spoiled brat if I'm not " behaving " and starts to list all the expensive

stuff he did for me, and goes on to explain how expensive it was, before

launching into a list of all my expensive health care stuff (hearing aids,

CI surgery, bout of asthma-like stuff, etc). He did the same thing to my

siblings--they had TONS of toys, and every now and then he'd threaten to go

in there with a trashbag and throw away the toys if they weren't " behaving. "

A couple of times he actually did. Even threw away a brand new Little People

toy set that the little ones had gotten only days before at Christmas.

And same here--I always wished that we didn't have all this stuff, but

instead had a normal dad instead.

Took a while to try to get out of the phobia of gifts--subconciously or

conciously, I would always be a bit skittish when I got gifts, because I was

afraid it'd be used against me again.

Sometimes it's amazing at just how similar our nadas and fadas are.

On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 12:23 PM, slingshot2hell

wrote:

>

>

> My nada also thinks nice presents is the same as love. That's why giving

> gifts to her was always hard, if it wasn't some expensive thing that she

> really liked then we must not love her! (She's gotten a little better with

> that, I usually just get her flowers and she knows I don't have much money.

> She likes flowers. But she still doesn't like anything my dad gives her.)

>

> I remember as a kid a lot of my friend were jealous of all the nice things

> I had. But I was jealous of the real MOTHER they had. I couldn't explain

> that the toys I had were not important at all - other kids didn't

> understand. They thought my parents were awesome because they would spend

> lots of money on me.

>

> I may have had lots of toys, but I didn't feel loved.

>

> As an adult, I don't really like getting gifts. I'd much prefer a hug.

>

> Casey

>

>

> > > >

> > > > >I know this could probably be debated and discussed until the

> > > > >end of time, but I do have to question whether my mother ever

> > > > >truly loved me. On the one hand, as a child, she was

> > > > >emotionally absent from me. Then when I became an adult, she

> > > > >wanted to control me to the point that she was killing me,

> > > > >destroyed my friendships and relationships with her " craziness "

> > > > >and did it in the " name of love. " " I am destroying you because

> > > > >I love you. "

> > > > >

> > > > >I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that trying to rationalize

> > > > >the irrational behavior of a BPD is completely futile, but I

> > > > >continue to do it week after week while sitting in therapy. My

> > > > >therapist says, " well, your mom loved you in her own

> > > > >way. " Umm, what is THAT anyway? I mean, do pedophiles " love

> > > > >in their own way " too? It's just as logical. Sometimes loving

> > > > >someone in YOUR own way is the WRONG way.

> > > > >

> > > > >At some point, I'm going to have to let it go, but I guess I'm

> > > > >still in the " why did she do this to me? " phase.

> > > > >

> > > > >Because I struggle now...a lot. With relationships, with

> > > > >abandonment issues, with trust issues, with confidence issues.

> > > > >I am struggling with the holidays approaching. Trying so hard

> > > > >to put on a happy face and force myself to enjoy it for my

> > > > >husband, for my friends, for my kids. And for my therapist not

> > > > >to think all her hard work with me is just throwing feathers in

> > > > >the wind. I just want to be okay with things and right now,

> > > > >while it's better than the years before, I'm not okay with

> > > > >things STILL.

> > > > >

> > > > >I want to enjoy Christmas without remembering my mother tried

> > > > >to shoot herself on Christmas Eve. Well, hmm, let me rephrase

> > > > >that. My mother grabbed the gun and ran into the bathroom

> > > > >threatening to shoot herself on Christmas Eve to get my father

> > > > >to break the door down and make it all about her and " rescue "

> > > > >her. I was 7. I remember it like it was yesterday. I

> > > > >remember all day on Christmas was spent with my uncle and my

> > > > >grandmother consoling my suicidal mother. The suicidal mother

> > > > >who never actually did attempt suicide, but whatever.

> > > > >

> > > > >I was reading online about BPD this morning and I just thought

> > > > >to myself....I hate this disorder. I hate, hate, hate it and

> > > > >the horse it rode in on. I think my mother could have been a

> > > > >serial killer or the unibomber and I wouldn't have been this

> > > > >affected by it.

> > > > >

> > > > >(

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > --

> > > > Katrina

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

I had the opposite story. My nada bribes with giving things to. But she is

extremely cheapskate. When I was living at my primary home and I was a teenager

i literally had not enough clothes, my shoes were with holes I probably looked

like a beggar....but it was better that than to let her manipulate with me if I

need something. She could manipulate for months ( I would give you...if you

would) for a pair of shoes. We where middle class family ( both of parents where

in high position in a little town) with enough money but I had to live and sleep

in the room without the heat ( winters here can be very cold) because it was not

worth to worm up my room. They put my sister and me in a small room in the attic

( inside the big house with 3 floors) and if I wanted to be warm or do anything

else ( when it was 10 degrees minus) I had to go downstairs to the flat where my

parents lived. Not to mention she bribes me with food too.....So I had spended

all winter under the pillow - literally -because I hate to go downstairs and

they where happy not to see me anyway.

The same nada has called me today ( with help of the nurse who felt in nada

trap) that she needs some clothes. She came to hospital with emergency car (

after she was trying to make suicide with 10 Valiums....) and after the

observation they have put her in open department when you have your own clothes

not hospital ones. I don't have keys to her house ( she doesn't trust me), she

doesn't allow social worker who has a key and who voluntarily take care for nada

house momentary ( another victim of nada manipulation) to take some clothes and

send it to her. She doesn't want to buy new clothes - she would really needed

them anyway ( she claimes she has no money - she has a looot of money) And I

lived in place A, hospital is in place B and her house is in place C. And there

is a lot of miles to drive....So she came out with the idea and told the

nurse to call me if I could bring some of MY clothes to her????!!!!!!!!

She really is inventive with finding ways to get me and my energy. Now I don't

know what to do (exept I would never enver put anything which is mine into her

hands---yak!!) . She is the only one in the group who has no private clothes and

she probably take full advantage of that. Poor old abandoned lady wandering

around in hospital with poor hospital clothes- nowbody takes care for her.... I

could buy her some clothes, but isn't that be her victory? I don't want to

reward her manipulative behavior. I was thinking to tell her if she would like

to have her clothes she has to except help from social worker. But she would

probably not ibecause it is too good for her to play victim. I'm really bored

with that.......

I'm sorry I was long...:-( but I have to vent at least a bit...:-)

> > > >

> > > > >I know this could probably be debated and discussed until the

> > > > >end of time, but I do have to question whether my mother ever

> > > > >truly loved me. On the one hand, as a child, she was

> > > > >emotionally absent from me. Then when I became an adult, she

> > > > >wanted to control me to the point that she was killing me,

> > > > >destroyed my friendships and relationships with her " craziness "

> > > > >and did it in the " name of love. " " I am destroying you because

> > > > >I love you. "

> > > > >

> > > > >I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that trying to rationalize

> > > > >the irrational behavior of a BPD is completely futile, but I

> > > > >continue to do it week after week while sitting in therapy. My

> > > > >therapist says, " well, your mom loved you in her own

> > > > >way. " Umm, what is THAT anyway? I mean, do pedophiles " love

> > > > >in their own way " too? It's just as logical. Sometimes loving

> > > > >someone in YOUR own way is the WRONG way.

> > > > >

> > > > >At some point, I'm going to have to let it go, but I guess I'm

> > > > >still in the " why did she do this to me? " phase.

> > > > >

> > > > >Because I struggle now...a lot. With relationships, with

> > > > >abandonment issues, with trust issues, with confidence issues.

> > > > >I am struggling with the holidays approaching. Trying so hard

> > > > >to put on a happy face and force myself to enjoy it for my

> > > > >husband, for my friends, for my kids. And for my therapist not

> > > > >to think all her hard work with me is just throwing feathers in

> > > > >the wind. I just want to be okay with things and right now,

> > > > >while it's better than the years before, I'm not okay with

> > > > >things STILL.

> > > > >

> > > > >I want to enjoy Christmas without remembering my mother tried

> > > > >to shoot herself on Christmas Eve. Well, hmm, let me rephrase

> > > > >that. My mother grabbed the gun and ran into the bathroom

> > > > >threatening to shoot herself on Christmas Eve to get my father

> > > > >to break the door down and make it all about her and " rescue "

> > > > >her. I was 7. I remember it like it was yesterday. I

> > > > >remember all day on Christmas was spent with my uncle and my

> > > > >grandmother consoling my suicidal mother. The suicidal mother

> > > > >who never actually did attempt suicide, but whatever.

> > > > >

> > > > >I was reading online about BPD this morning and I just thought

> > > > >to myself....I hate this disorder. I hate, hate, hate it and

> > > > >the horse it rode in on. I think my mother could have been a

> > > > >serial killer or the unibomber and I wouldn't have been this

> > > > >affected by it.

> > > > >

> > > > >(

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > --

> > > > Katrina

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

It sure is amazing how similar they are. It's amazing how much BPD is their

identity. I worry how much having a BPD parent influences MY identity.

My nada also liked to call me a " spoiled brat " . One of her favorites. Which is

weird, because if I was spoiled, wouldn't that be an insult to her more than

anything?

>

> Same here--fada thinks presents = love. That way he can claim I'm being a

> spoiled brat if I'm not " behaving " and starts to list all the expensive

> stuff he did for me, and goes on to explain how expensive it was, before

> launching into a list of all my expensive health care stuff (hearing aids,

> CI surgery, bout of asthma-like stuff, etc). He did the same thing to my

> siblings--they had TONS of toys, and every now and then he'd threaten to go

> in there with a trashbag and throw away the toys if they weren't " behaving. "

> A couple of times he actually did. Even threw away a brand new Little People

> toy set that the little ones had gotten only days before at Christmas.

>

> And same here--I always wished that we didn't have all this stuff, but

> instead had a normal dad instead.

>

> Took a while to try to get out of the phobia of gifts--subconciously or

> conciously, I would always be a bit skittish when I got gifts, because I was

> afraid it'd be used against me again.

>

> Sometimes it's amazing at just how similar our nadas and fadas are.

>

[Guest guest]

It sure is amazing how similar they are. It's amazing how much BPD is their

identity. I worry how much having a BPD parent influences MY identity.

My nada also liked to call me a " spoiled brat " . One of her favorites. Which is

weird, because if I was spoiled, wouldn't that be an insult to her more than

anything?

>

> Same here--fada thinks presents = love. That way he can claim I'm being a

> spoiled brat if I'm not " behaving " and starts to list all the expensive

> stuff he did for me, and goes on to explain how expensive it was, before

> launching into a list of all my expensive health care stuff (hearing aids,

> CI surgery, bout of asthma-like stuff, etc). He did the same thing to my

> siblings--they had TONS of toys, and every now and then he'd threaten to go

> in there with a trashbag and throw away the toys if they weren't " behaving. "

> A couple of times he actually did. Even threw away a brand new Little People

> toy set that the little ones had gotten only days before at Christmas.

>

> And same here--I always wished that we didn't have all this stuff, but

> instead had a normal dad instead.

>

> Took a while to try to get out of the phobia of gifts--subconciously or

> conciously, I would always be a bit skittish when I got gifts, because I was

> afraid it'd be used against me again.

>

> Sometimes it's amazing at just how similar our nadas and fadas are.

>

[Guest guest]

Thats their crazy-making. My mother used to say I was spoiled too.

Ri.dic.u.lous. They do it to make themselves feel better, I think.

Re: can bpd's really love?

It sure is amazing how similar they are. It's amazing how much BPD is their

identity. I worry how much having a BPD parent influences MY identity.

My nada also liked to call me a " spoiled brat " . One of her favorites. Which is

weird, because if I was spoiled, wouldn't that be an insult to her more than

anything?

>

> Same here--fada thinks presents = love. That way he can claim I'm being a

> spoiled brat if I'm not " behaving " and starts to list all the expensive

> stuff he did for me, and goes on to explain how expensive it was, before

> launching into a list of all my expensive health care stuff (hearing aids,

> CI surgery, bout of asthma-like stuff, etc). He did the same thing to my

> siblings--they had TONS of toys, and every now and then he'd threaten to go

> in there with a trashbag and throw away the toys if they weren't " behaving. "

> A couple of times he actually did. Even threw away a brand new Little People

> toy set that the little ones had gotten only days before at Christmas.

>

> And same here--I always wished that we didn't have all this stuff, but

> instead had a normal dad instead.

>

> Took a while to try to get out of the phobia of gifts--subconciously or

> conciously, I would always be a bit skittish when I got gifts, because I was

> afraid it'd be used against me again.

>

> Sometimes it's amazing at just how similar our nadas and fadas are.

>

[Guest guest]

Thats their crazy-making. My mother used to say I was spoiled too.

Ri.dic.u.lous. They do it to make themselves feel better, I think.

Re: can bpd's really love?

It sure is amazing how similar they are. It's amazing how much BPD is their

identity. I worry how much having a BPD parent influences MY identity.

My nada also liked to call me a " spoiled brat " . One of her favorites. Which is

weird, because if I was spoiled, wouldn't that be an insult to her more than

anything?

>

> Same here--fada thinks presents = love. That way he can claim I'm being a

> spoiled brat if I'm not " behaving " and starts to list all the expensive

> stuff he did for me, and goes on to explain how expensive it was, before

> launching into a list of all my expensive health care stuff (hearing aids,

> CI surgery, bout of asthma-like stuff, etc). He did the same thing to my

> siblings--they had TONS of toys, and every now and then he'd threaten to go

> in there with a trashbag and throw away the toys if they weren't " behaving. "

> A couple of times he actually did. Even threw away a brand new Little People

> toy set that the little ones had gotten only days before at Christmas.

>

> And same here--I always wished that we didn't have all this stuff, but

> instead had a normal dad instead.

>

> Took a while to try to get out of the phobia of gifts--subconciously or

> conciously, I would always be a bit skittish when I got gifts, because I was

> afraid it'd be used against me again.

>

> Sometimes it's amazing at just how similar our nadas and fadas are.

>

[Guest guest]

Nadas do love to put us in no-win situations. I think that is my nada's

favorite hobby, or used to be when I was still in contact with her. That's one

of the reasons I needed to go No Contact: no more of her mind-f**king games.

-Annie

> > > > >

> > > > > >I know this could probably be debated and discussed until the

> > > > > >end of time, but I do have to question whether my mother ever

> > > > > >truly loved me. On the one hand, as a child, she was

> > > > > >emotionally absent from me. Then when I became an adult, she

> > > > > >wanted to control me to the point that she was killing me,

> > > > > >destroyed my friendships and relationships with her " craziness "

> > > > > >and did it in the " name of love. " " I am destroying you because

> > > > > >I love you. "

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that trying to rationalize

> > > > > >the irrational behavior of a BPD is completely futile, but I

> > > > > >continue to do it week after week while sitting in therapy. My

> > > > > >therapist says, " well, your mom loved you in her own

> > > > > >way. " Umm, what is THAT anyway? I mean, do pedophiles " love

> > > > > >in their own way " too? It's just as logical. Sometimes loving

> > > > > >someone in YOUR own way is the WRONG way.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >At some point, I'm going to have to let it go, but I guess I'm

> > > > > >still in the " why did she do this to me? " phase.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >Because I struggle now...a lot. With relationships, with

> > > > > >abandonment issues, with trust issues, with confidence issues.

> > > > > >I am struggling with the holidays approaching. Trying so hard

> > > > > >to put on a happy face and force myself to enjoy it for my

> > > > > >husband, for my friends, for my kids. And for my therapist not

> > > > > >to think all her hard work with me is just throwing feathers in

> > > > > >the wind. I just want to be okay with things and right now,

> > > > > >while it's better than the years before, I'm not okay with

> > > > > >things STILL.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I want to enjoy Christmas without remembering my mother tried

> > > > > >to shoot herself on Christmas Eve. Well, hmm, let me rephrase

> > > > > >that. My mother grabbed the gun and ran into the bathroom

> > > > > >threatening to shoot herself on Christmas Eve to get my father

> > > > > >to break the door down and make it all about her and " rescue "

> > > > > >her. I was 7. I remember it like it was yesterday. I

> > > > > >remember all day on Christmas was spent with my uncle and my

> > > > > >grandmother consoling my suicidal mother. The suicidal mother

> > > > > >who never actually did attempt suicide, but whatever.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I was reading online about BPD this morning and I just thought

> > > > > >to myself....I hate this disorder. I hate, hate, hate it and

> > > > > >the horse it rode in on. I think my mother could have been a

> > > > > >serial killer or the unibomber and I wouldn't have been this

> > > > > >affected by it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >(

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > --

> > > > > Katrina

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Nadas do love to put us in no-win situations. I think that is my nada's

favorite hobby, or used to be when I was still in contact with her. That's one

of the reasons I needed to go No Contact: no more of her mind-f**king games.

-Annie

> > > > >

> > > > > >I know this could probably be debated and discussed until the

> > > > > >end of time, but I do have to question whether my mother ever

> > > > > >truly loved me. On the one hand, as a child, she was

> > > > > >emotionally absent from me. Then when I became an adult, she

> > > > > >wanted to control me to the point that she was killing me,

> > > > > >destroyed my friendships and relationships with her " craziness "

> > > > > >and did it in the " name of love. " " I am destroying you because

> > > > > >I love you. "

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that trying to rationalize

> > > > > >the irrational behavior of a BPD is completely futile, but I

> > > > > >continue to do it week after week while sitting in therapy. My

> > > > > >therapist says, " well, your mom loved you in her own

> > > > > >way. " Umm, what is THAT anyway? I mean, do pedophiles " love

> > > > > >in their own way " too? It's just as logical. Sometimes loving

> > > > > >someone in YOUR own way is the WRONG way.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >At some point, I'm going to have to let it go, but I guess I'm

> > > > > >still in the " why did she do this to me? " phase.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >Because I struggle now...a lot. With relationships, with

> > > > > >abandonment issues, with trust issues, with confidence issues.

> > > > > >I am struggling with the holidays approaching. Trying so hard

> > > > > >to put on a happy face and force myself to enjoy it for my

> > > > > >husband, for my friends, for my kids. And for my therapist not

> > > > > >to think all her hard work with me is just throwing feathers in

> > > > > >the wind. I just want to be okay with things and right now,

> > > > > >while it's better than the years before, I'm not okay with

> > > > > >things STILL.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I want to enjoy Christmas without remembering my mother tried

> > > > > >to shoot herself on Christmas Eve. Well, hmm, let me rephrase

> > > > > >that. My mother grabbed the gun and ran into the bathroom

> > > > > >threatening to shoot herself on Christmas Eve to get my father

> > > > > >to break the door down and make it all about her and " rescue "

> > > > > >her. I was 7. I remember it like it was yesterday. I

> > > > > >remember all day on Christmas was spent with my uncle and my

> > > > > >grandmother consoling my suicidal mother. The suicidal mother

> > > > > >who never actually did attempt suicide, but whatever.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I was reading online about BPD this morning and I just thought

> > > > > >to myself....I hate this disorder. I hate, hate, hate it and

> > > > > >the horse it rode in on. I think my mother could have been a

> > > > > >serial killer or the unibomber and I wouldn't have been this

> > > > > >affected by it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >(

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > --

> > > > > Katrina

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Nadas do love to put us in no-win situations. I think that is my nada's

favorite hobby, or used to be when I was still in contact with her. That's one

of the reasons I needed to go No Contact: no more of her mind-f**king games.

-Annie

> > > > >

> > > > > >I know this could probably be debated and discussed until the

> > > > > >end of time, but I do have to question whether my mother ever

> > > > > >truly loved me. On the one hand, as a child, she was

> > > > > >emotionally absent from me. Then when I became an adult, she

> > > > > >wanted to control me to the point that she was killing me,

> > > > > >destroyed my friendships and relationships with her " craziness "

> > > > > >and did it in the " name of love. " " I am destroying you because

> > > > > >I love you. "

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that trying to rationalize

> > > > > >the irrational behavior of a BPD is completely futile, but I

> > > > > >continue to do it week after week while sitting in therapy. My

> > > > > >therapist says, " well, your mom loved you in her own

> > > > > >way. " Umm, what is THAT anyway? I mean, do pedophiles " love

> > > > > >in their own way " too? It's just as logical. Sometimes loving

> > > > > >someone in YOUR own way is the WRONG way.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >At some point, I'm going to have to let it go, but I guess I'm

> > > > > >still in the " why did she do this to me? " phase.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >Because I struggle now...a lot. With relationships, with

> > > > > >abandonment issues, with trust issues, with confidence issues.

> > > > > >I am struggling with the holidays approaching. Trying so hard

> > > > > >to put on a happy face and force myself to enjoy it for my

> > > > > >husband, for my friends, for my kids. And for my therapist not

> > > > > >to think all her hard work with me is just throwing feathers in

> > > > > >the wind. I just want to be okay with things and right now,

> > > > > >while it's better than the years before, I'm not okay with

> > > > > >things STILL.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I want to enjoy Christmas without remembering my mother tried

> > > > > >to shoot herself on Christmas Eve. Well, hmm, let me rephrase

> > > > > >that. My mother grabbed the gun and ran into the bathroom

> > > > > >threatening to shoot herself on Christmas Eve to get my father

> > > > > >to break the door down and make it all about her and " rescue "

> > > > > >her. I was 7. I remember it like it was yesterday. I

> > > > > >remember all day on Christmas was spent with my uncle and my

> > > > > >grandmother consoling my suicidal mother. The suicidal mother

> > > > > >who never actually did attempt suicide, but whatever.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I was reading online about BPD this morning and I just thought

> > > > > >to myself....I hate this disorder. I hate, hate, hate it and

> > > > > >the horse it rode in on. I think my mother could have been a

> > > > > >serial killer or the unibomber and I wouldn't have been this

> > > > > >affected by it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >(

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > --

> > > > > Katrina

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Yenaine,your nada tried to " commit suicide " with Valium? Lol...does she know

that you can't kill yourself with Valium?

Well,I'm sure her doctors know that...

Would it be possible for you (if you haven't already) to tell the head nurse

on your nada's ward about her social worker and to give her some general

instruction to inform any of the other nurses on the ward that if nada is

requesting something from " the outside " that she needs,such as (her own)

clothing,that her social worker should be contacted? And that if nada refuses

the assistance of the social worker,then oh well,she had a chance to get what

she requested but she herself refused it.Tell the mental ward staff that in the

interests of having your nada learn how to get her needs met that you want her

to learn how to avail herself of the assistance the social worker is there to

provide as a sort of training exercize for your nada so that she will continue

to independently help herself after she is relased.Something like that.Then let

*them* see when she refuses to.

Just a thought...No,don't buy her any clothes! She's really manipulative!

And asking for *your* clothes after she left you dressed like a beggar in your

youth..what can I say...yes,it sounds like another " attempted energy theft " ...

>

> I had the opposite story. My nada bribes with giving things to. But she is

extremely cheapskate. When I was living at my primary home and I was a teenager

i literally had not enough clothes, my shoes were with holes I probably looked

like a beggar....but it was better that than to let her manipulate with me if I

need something. She could manipulate for months ( I would give you...if you

would) for a pair of shoes. We where middle class family ( both of parents where

in high position in a little town) with enough money but I had to live and sleep

in the room without the heat ( winters here can be very cold) because it was not

worth to worm up my room. They put my sister and me in a small room in the attic

( inside the big house with 3 floors) and if I wanted to be warm or do anything

else ( when it was 10 degrees minus) I had to go downstairs to the flat where my

parents lived. Not to mention she bribes me with food too.....So I had spended

all winter under the pillow - literally -because I hate to go downstairs and

they where happy not to see me anyway.

>

> The same nada has called me today ( with help of the nurse who felt in nada

trap) that she needs some clothes. She came to hospital with emergency car (

after she was trying to make suicide with 10 Valiums....) and after the

observation they have put her in open department when you have your own clothes

not hospital ones. I don't have keys to her house ( she doesn't trust me), she

doesn't allow social worker who has a key and who voluntarily take care for nada

house momentary ( another victim of nada manipulation) to take some clothes and

send it to her. She doesn't want to buy new clothes - she would really needed

them anyway ( she claimes she has no money - she has a looot of money) And I

lived in place A, hospital is in place B and her house is in place C. And there

is a lot of miles to drive....So she came out with the idea and told the

nurse to call me if I could bring some of MY clothes to her????!!!!!!!!

>

> She really is inventive with finding ways to get me and my energy. Now I don't

know what to do (exept I would never enver put anything which is mine into her

hands---yak!!) . She is the only one in the group who has no private clothes and

she probably take full advantage of that. Poor old abandoned lady wandering

around in hospital with poor hospital clothes- nowbody takes care for her.... I

could buy her some clothes, but isn't that be her victory? I don't want to

reward her manipulative behavior. I was thinking to tell her if she would like

to have her clothes she has to except help from social worker. But she would

probably not ibecause it is too good for her to play victim. I'm really bored

with that.......

>

> I'm sorry I was long...:-( but I have to vent at least a bit...:-)

[Guest guest]

Ha,Casey,that's an excellent turn around and it's so true: it *would* be an

insult to her more than anything if you were so spoiled! Looking at it that

way,it really does make no sense for her to say that like an accusation.Since

who is she accusing,anyway?!

Holly,my nada did the garbage bag throwing away toys routine,too.When I was

a teenager she stuffed most of my clothes in a garbage bag as well and threw

them out because,she said,I walked through the house " stomping my

feet " .Oops,forgot to tip toe on those eggshells,lol.

> >

> > Same here--fada thinks presents = love. That way he can claim I'm being a

> > spoiled brat if I'm not " behaving " and starts to list all the expensive

> > stuff he did for me, and goes on to explain how expensive it was, before

> > launching into a list of all my expensive health care stuff (hearing aids,

> > CI surgery, bout of asthma-like stuff, etc). He did the same thing to my

> > siblings--they had TONS of toys, and every now and then he'd threaten to go

> > in there with a trashbag and throw away the toys if they weren't " behaving. "

> > A couple of times he actually did. Even threw away a brand new Little People

> > toy set that the little ones had gotten only days before at Christmas.

> >

> > And same here--I always wished that we didn't have all this stuff, but

> > instead had a normal dad instead.

> >

> > Took a while to try to get out of the phobia of gifts--subconciously or

> > conciously, I would always be a bit skittish when I got gifts, because I was

> > afraid it'd be used against me again.

> >

> > Sometimes it's amazing at just how similar our nadas and fadas are.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Ha,Casey,that's an excellent turn around and it's so true: it *would* be an

insult to her more than anything if you were so spoiled! Looking at it that

way,it really does make no sense for her to say that like an accusation.Since

who is she accusing,anyway?!

Holly,my nada did the garbage bag throwing away toys routine,too.When I was

a teenager she stuffed most of my clothes in a garbage bag as well and threw

them out because,she said,I walked through the house " stomping my

feet " .Oops,forgot to tip toe on those eggshells,lol.

> >

> > Same here--fada thinks presents = love. That way he can claim I'm being a

> > spoiled brat if I'm not " behaving " and starts to list all the expensive

> > stuff he did for me, and goes on to explain how expensive it was, before

> > launching into a list of all my expensive health care stuff (hearing aids,

> > CI surgery, bout of asthma-like stuff, etc). He did the same thing to my

> > siblings--they had TONS of toys, and every now and then he'd threaten to go

> > in there with a trashbag and throw away the toys if they weren't " behaving. "

> > A couple of times he actually did. Even threw away a brand new Little People

> > toy set that the little ones had gotten only days before at Christmas.

> >

> > And same here--I always wished that we didn't have all this stuff, but

> > instead had a normal dad instead.

> >

> > Took a while to try to get out of the phobia of gifts--subconciously or

> > conciously, I would always be a bit skittish when I got gifts, because I was

> > afraid it'd be used against me again.

> >

> > Sometimes it's amazing at just how similar our nadas and fadas are.

> >

>