Guest guest Posted December 16, 2010 Report Share Posted December 16, 2010 > > > For example, lately I've been having arguments (unintentionally) with a " friend; " I'll call him Arnold. Arnold is a very conservative christian and seems to go out of his way to butt heads with me (I imagine he sees it as defending what it's important to him, though it makes no difference to me or anyone else's opinion on the matter) on various issues that hit home with me a well, including women's rights and my agnosticism. We are typically most friendly during 3 minute conversations. > > I'm a very introverted person, so I prefer to have only a few very close friends, rather than a wide range of acquaintances; too much socializing wears me out. However, I find that I tend to " cut people out " of my life/drop them compeletely when I have fundamental disagreements like this, often unconsciously concluding that they are " stupid, " " mean, " or maybe " inconsiderate. " Elle, I will say that splitting is a flea I picked up from my parents, too, but after a lot of work it's much better for me. I think a lot of us KOs split our BP parent, interpreting every single annoying thing they do as a sign that they are from the devil and don't deserve our attention. It can be hard to see that some of the things they do are because of the BP, and some are just annoying things that any healthier person might do, too. It's still challenging for me to discern between the two with my mom sometimes, and decide which ones need really firm boundaries. Anyway, re: your friend " Arnold " ...There are some people who just have an unending need to be right about everything, and they will argue and debate with everyone they possibly can in order to make themselves feel better. To me, it sounds like you are perceiving this trait (which, BTW, is very common among the Narcissists I know). It might not be necessary to cut him out of your life completely, if he has other good qualities that you would like to keep him as a friend. Perhaps you can just consider that when he does this, it bothers you, and set boundaries about it. I have an acquaintance at church (a NPD) who sent out an email forward about the last presidential election. I wrote him back to ask him not to send me any more. He asked who I was voting for, and I told him I like to make a decision that considers all social issues and not just abortion. This he took as an invitation to tell me how surprised he was that I could consider voting for a pro-abortion candidate and gave me a treatise on all of the reasons I should vote for his candidate. I wrote back to say I was not interested in debating him and that I would be doing my own research, and please do not write back about it again. And he did not. So, you might just consider telling Arnold the next time he brings something up that you'll just have to " agree to disagree, " or " I don't really enjoy these debates, " or, " I guess we have very different ways of looking at that. " and then not enter into the debate with him. It sounds like he feeds off of them, but they drain you. I don't think you are necessarily splitting him for no reason, you are just being triggered by the behavior that reminds you of not being heard by your BP parent. If he does not respect the boundary you set, then that would be a very good reason to consider limiting contact. KT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2010 Report Share Posted December 16, 2010 > > > For example, lately I've been having arguments (unintentionally) with a " friend; " I'll call him Arnold. Arnold is a very conservative christian and seems to go out of his way to butt heads with me (I imagine he sees it as defending what it's important to him, though it makes no difference to me or anyone else's opinion on the matter) on various issues that hit home with me a well, including women's rights and my agnosticism. We are typically most friendly during 3 minute conversations. > > I'm a very introverted person, so I prefer to have only a few very close friends, rather than a wide range of acquaintances; too much socializing wears me out. However, I find that I tend to " cut people out " of my life/drop them compeletely when I have fundamental disagreements like this, often unconsciously concluding that they are " stupid, " " mean, " or maybe " inconsiderate. " Elle, I will say that splitting is a flea I picked up from my parents, too, but after a lot of work it's much better for me. I think a lot of us KOs split our BP parent, interpreting every single annoying thing they do as a sign that they are from the devil and don't deserve our attention. It can be hard to see that some of the things they do are because of the BP, and some are just annoying things that any healthier person might do, too. It's still challenging for me to discern between the two with my mom sometimes, and decide which ones need really firm boundaries. Anyway, re: your friend " Arnold " ...There are some people who just have an unending need to be right about everything, and they will argue and debate with everyone they possibly can in order to make themselves feel better. To me, it sounds like you are perceiving this trait (which, BTW, is very common among the Narcissists I know). It might not be necessary to cut him out of your life completely, if he has other good qualities that you would like to keep him as a friend. Perhaps you can just consider that when he does this, it bothers you, and set boundaries about it. I have an acquaintance at church (a NPD) who sent out an email forward about the last presidential election. I wrote him back to ask him not to send me any more. He asked who I was voting for, and I told him I like to make a decision that considers all social issues and not just abortion. This he took as an invitation to tell me how surprised he was that I could consider voting for a pro-abortion candidate and gave me a treatise on all of the reasons I should vote for his candidate. I wrote back to say I was not interested in debating him and that I would be doing my own research, and please do not write back about it again. And he did not. So, you might just consider telling Arnold the next time he brings something up that you'll just have to " agree to disagree, " or " I don't really enjoy these debates, " or, " I guess we have very different ways of looking at that. " and then not enter into the debate with him. It sounds like he feeds off of them, but they drain you. I don't think you are necessarily splitting him for no reason, you are just being triggered by the behavior that reminds you of not being heard by your BP parent. If he does not respect the boundary you set, then that would be a very good reason to consider limiting contact. KT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2010 Report Share Posted December 16, 2010 KT, Thank you so much for your helpful and insightful advice. I think you're very right, and I appreciate your sincere interpretation. I will definitely be trying that next time, because, as you said, he seems to feed off of it while it exhausts me and causes me anxiety. It certainly does remind me of not being heard, being invalidated, or being dismissed by my nada, that's for sure. Thank you, and best wishes, Elle > > > > > > For example, lately I've been having arguments (unintentionally) with a " friend; " I'll call him Arnold. Arnold is a very conservative christian and seems to go out of his way to butt heads with me (I imagine he sees it as defending what it's important to him, though it makes no difference to me or anyone else's opinion on the matter) on various issues that hit home with me a well, including women's rights and my agnosticism. We are typically most friendly during 3 minute conversations. > > > > I'm a very introverted person, so I prefer to have only a few very close friends, rather than a wide range of acquaintances; too much socializing wears me out. However, I find that I tend to " cut people out " of my life/drop them compeletely when I have fundamental disagreements like this, often unconsciously concluding that they are " stupid, " " mean, " or maybe " inconsiderate. " > > Elle, I will say that splitting is a flea I picked up from my parents, too, but after a lot of work it's much better for me. I think a lot of us KOs split our BP parent, interpreting every single annoying thing they do as a sign that they are from the devil and don't deserve our attention. It can be hard to see that some of the things they do are because of the BP, and some are just annoying things that any healthier person might do, too. It's still challenging for me to discern between the two with my mom sometimes, and decide which ones need really firm boundaries. > > Anyway, re: your friend " Arnold " ...There are some people who just have an unending need to be right about everything, and they will argue and debate with everyone they possibly can in order to make themselves feel better. To me, it sounds like you are perceiving this trait (which, BTW, is very common among the Narcissists I know). It might not be necessary to cut him out of your life completely, if he has other good qualities that you would like to keep him as a friend. Perhaps you can just consider that when he does this, it bothers you, and set boundaries about it. > > I have an acquaintance at church (a NPD) who sent out an email forward about the last presidential election. I wrote him back to ask him not to send me any more. He asked who I was voting for, and I told him I like to make a decision that considers all social issues and not just abortion. This he took as an invitation to tell me how surprised he was that I could consider voting for a pro-abortion candidate and gave me a treatise on all of the reasons I should vote for his candidate. I wrote back to say I was not interested in debating him and that I would be doing my own research, and please do not write back about it again. And he did not. > > So, you might just consider telling Arnold the next time he brings something up that you'll just have to " agree to disagree, " or " I don't really enjoy these debates, " or, " I guess we have very different ways of looking at that. " and then not enter into the debate with him. It sounds like he feeds off of them, but they drain you. I don't think you are necessarily splitting him for no reason, you are just being triggered by the behavior that reminds you of not being heard by your BP parent. If he does not respect the boundary you set, then that would be a very good reason to consider limiting contact. > > KT > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2010 Report Share Posted December 17, 2010 Elle I am rather far to one side of the political spectrum. Some of my posts my indicate my religious orientation. These things are usually no part of what I say here, and so I don t bring them up. I have a friend who is as far to the other extreme as you can get. We have some lively, heated , exchanges on Facebook. But at the end, we agree that we disagree, and he is still my friend, and my insurance agent! Friends Can disagree. But people, friends or no, must respect your boundaries as well. Just as good fences make good neighbors, so good boundaries make good friends. J and I are never likely to agree on politics. Yet, we have been friends and share interests in music and arts going back 35 years. We can bluster and storm at each other about how utterly ridiculous our views are, and in the next breath, talk about a concert we played in together. I think he s very naive, and he thinks I m very deluded, and we are friends in spite of it! Our FB friends get a kick out of our debates. There are a couple books I can recommend for you, that might help you in establishing your boundaries, and in maintaining safe relationships. These books are written from a Christian perspective, by 2 christian psychologists, but still have good, sound, counsel that applies to anyone , without insisting that you adhere to a particular set of beliefs. I m not trying to proselytize you! But I have found these helpful, as have a number of our other KO kinfolk on this group. The books are Boundaries Safe People By Dr s Townsend and Henry Cloud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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