Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Flo, I hope you have a new MD if you canned the old! If your rashes persist I'd ask the new doc to try PTU instead of the Tap. At least you'd then know if it's the medication or the disease itself causing the rashes. I have had lots of rashes with GD myself, though none so severe as yours sounds. Once stabilized on Tap (methimazole, the generic, is MUCH cheaper btw), they stopped. Your dramatic weight gain makes me wonder if they didn't over-do the Tap for you. I'd look for new bloodwork ASAP as a way to judge, they may be turning you hypo. Seems like some people react more strongly than others to the ATD's, depending on the severity of the GD when they start. Good luck, don't worry at all about the rage--we're here, and we've all been there. Terry > > Reply-To: graves_support > Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 23:30:17 -0000 > To: graves_support > Subject: back again > > Been reading but haven't posted for a week. Whew! What a lot to learn! > You are more helpful than my MD has been! > 3 weeks now on Tap and here's the scorecard...chest, back and neck > covered with rash...swelling in legs and ankles to the point where > they look deformed...18 pound weight gain in 2 1/2 weeks, goiter has > shrunk but feeling like I have a hand around my neck. Good > news...resting heart rate back down to 69 after 3 weeks of atenolol - > Yeah! > Canned doctor for wanting to put me on RAI so quickly after I > complained of side effects of Tap (thanks Jody!) > MD had me on thee Tap pills a day and now have dropped to two so > we'll see. Want my old body back, want my energy back, hate this > AHHHHHHHH. (Jody said I could rage if I needed to) > Am starting a light weight training routine today...slowly but > surely....need to see some muscle tone again or I'll scream! I feel > like Ive aged 10 years in 2 months. Im glad I have you guys to share > this with. > Thanks - that was my GD outburst for the day > > > > > ------------------------------------- > The Graves' list is intended for informational purposes only and is not > intended to replace expert medical care. > Please consult your doctor before changing or trying new treatments. > ---------------------------------------- > DISCLAIMER > > Advertisments placed on this yahoo groups list does not have the endorsement > of > the listowner. I have no input as to what ads are attached to emails. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -------- > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Flo, I hope you have a new MD if you canned the old! If your rashes persist I'd ask the new doc to try PTU instead of the Tap. At least you'd then know if it's the medication or the disease itself causing the rashes. I have had lots of rashes with GD myself, though none so severe as yours sounds. Once stabilized on Tap (methimazole, the generic, is MUCH cheaper btw), they stopped. Your dramatic weight gain makes me wonder if they didn't over-do the Tap for you. I'd look for new bloodwork ASAP as a way to judge, they may be turning you hypo. Seems like some people react more strongly than others to the ATD's, depending on the severity of the GD when they start. Good luck, don't worry at all about the rage--we're here, and we've all been there. Terry > > Reply-To: graves_support > Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 23:30:17 -0000 > To: graves_support > Subject: back again > > Been reading but haven't posted for a week. Whew! What a lot to learn! > You are more helpful than my MD has been! > 3 weeks now on Tap and here's the scorecard...chest, back and neck > covered with rash...swelling in legs and ankles to the point where > they look deformed...18 pound weight gain in 2 1/2 weeks, goiter has > shrunk but feeling like I have a hand around my neck. Good > news...resting heart rate back down to 69 after 3 weeks of atenolol - > Yeah! > Canned doctor for wanting to put me on RAI so quickly after I > complained of side effects of Tap (thanks Jody!) > MD had me on thee Tap pills a day and now have dropped to two so > we'll see. Want my old body back, want my energy back, hate this > AHHHHHHHH. (Jody said I could rage if I needed to) > Am starting a light weight training routine today...slowly but > surely....need to see some muscle tone again or I'll scream! I feel > like Ive aged 10 years in 2 months. Im glad I have you guys to share > this with. > Thanks - that was my GD outburst for the day > > > > > ------------------------------------- > The Graves' list is intended for informational purposes only and is not > intended to replace expert medical care. > Please consult your doctor before changing or trying new treatments. > ---------------------------------------- > DISCLAIMER > > Advertisments placed on this yahoo groups list does not have the endorsement > of > the listowner. I have no input as to what ads are attached to emails. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -------- > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Hi Flo, Glad to see your back! Did the insurance thing get straightened around so you can see someone else? You can't be without a doctor, not even for a little while. It is very important that you are monitored properly for all kinds of reasons, the first being that they are doing WBC's and liver panels on you, at the very least, monthly in the beginning as TAP can affect the liver. So please, tell me you have a new doc and that the insurance has been straightened out! Talk to you soon, Jody _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Hi Flo, Glad to see your back! Did the insurance thing get straightened around so you can see someone else? You can't be without a doctor, not even for a little while. It is very important that you are monitored properly for all kinds of reasons, the first being that they are doing WBC's and liver panels on you, at the very least, monthly in the beginning as TAP can affect the liver. So please, tell me you have a new doc and that the insurance has been straightened out! Talk to you soon, Jody _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Hi Flo, Glad to see your back! Did the insurance thing get straightened around so you can see someone else? You can't be without a doctor, not even for a little while. It is very important that you are monitored properly for all kinds of reasons, the first being that they are doing WBC's and liver panels on you, at the very least, monthly in the beginning as TAP can affect the liver. So please, tell me you have a new doc and that the insurance has been straightened out! Talk to you soon, Jody _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Hi Flo. Are you still on the betablocker? I have no idea if you need to be weaned off it or if you can just stop but it sounds like you don't need it anymore and that may alleviate your symptoms. A sudden 18 lb. gain is not a common effect of ATD's (though you might see such a gradual gain). Good luck, Fay Terry, thanks for the trans fat info. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Hi Flo. Are you still on the betablocker? I have no idea if you need to be weaned off it or if you can just stop but it sounds like you don't need it anymore and that may alleviate your symptoms. A sudden 18 lb. gain is not a common effect of ATD's (though you might see such a gradual gain). Good luck, Fay Terry, thanks for the trans fat info. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Beta Blockers will also cause weight gain as they lower the metabolism also...it is one of the 'side effects' listed in the paperwork on the one I used for blood pressure years ago called Corgard. Jody _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Beta Blockers will also cause weight gain as they lower the metabolism also...it is one of the 'side effects' listed in the paperwork on the one I used for blood pressure years ago called Corgard. Jody _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 Beta Blockers will also cause weight gain as they lower the metabolism also...it is one of the 'side effects' listed in the paperwork on the one I used for blood pressure years ago called Corgard. Jody _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2002 Report Share Posted January 31, 2002 I missed the original question, but yes...you have to be weaned off of beta blockers... this is in bold print on all package inserts and my doctor repeated it over and over to be really sure I would not make any mistakes. -Pam- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2002 Report Share Posted February 1, 2002 Oh my. You should call your doctor about your rash and swelling! That's a sign that you can't take the Tapazole. And I've never heard of anyone taking 3 taps a day. Normally tapazole is only taken once a day because it has a longer half-life than PTU. It sounds like you've gone hypO, as well as not being able to handle the tapazole. Maybe they can try PTU. Definately check with your doctor! Holly back again Been reading but haven't posted for a week. Whew! What a lot to learn! You are more helpful than my MD has been! 3 weeks now on Tap and here's the scorecard...chest, back and neck covered with rash...swelling in legs and ankles to the point where they look deformed...18 pound weight gain in 2 1/2 weeks, goiter has shrunk but feeling like I have a hand around my neck. Good news...resting heart rate back down to 69 after 3 weeks of atenolol - Yeah! Canned doctor for wanting to put me on RAI so quickly after I complained of side effects of Tap (thanks Jody!) MD had me on thee Tap pills a day and now have dropped to two so we'll see. Want my old body back, want my energy back, hate this AHHHHHHHH. (Jody said I could rage if I needed to) Am starting a light weight training routine today...slowly but surely....need to see some muscle tone again or I'll scream! I feel like Ive aged 10 years in 2 months. Im glad I have you guys to share this with. Thanks - that was my GD outburst for the day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2002 Report Share Posted February 1, 2002 Oh my. You should call your doctor about your rash and swelling! That's a sign that you can't take the Tapazole. And I've never heard of anyone taking 3 taps a day. Normally tapazole is only taken once a day because it has a longer half-life than PTU. It sounds like you've gone hypO, as well as not being able to handle the tapazole. Maybe they can try PTU. Definately check with your doctor! Holly back again Been reading but haven't posted for a week. Whew! What a lot to learn! You are more helpful than my MD has been! 3 weeks now on Tap and here's the scorecard...chest, back and neck covered with rash...swelling in legs and ankles to the point where they look deformed...18 pound weight gain in 2 1/2 weeks, goiter has shrunk but feeling like I have a hand around my neck. Good news...resting heart rate back down to 69 after 3 weeks of atenolol - Yeah! Canned doctor for wanting to put me on RAI so quickly after I complained of side effects of Tap (thanks Jody!) MD had me on thee Tap pills a day and now have dropped to two so we'll see. Want my old body back, want my energy back, hate this AHHHHHHHH. (Jody said I could rage if I needed to) Am starting a light weight training routine today...slowly but surely....need to see some muscle tone again or I'll scream! I feel like Ive aged 10 years in 2 months. Im glad I have you guys to share this with. Thanks - that was my GD outburst for the day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2002 Report Share Posted February 1, 2002 Oh my. You should call your doctor about your rash and swelling! That's a sign that you can't take the Tapazole. And I've never heard of anyone taking 3 taps a day. Normally tapazole is only taken once a day because it has a longer half-life than PTU. It sounds like you've gone hypO, as well as not being able to handle the tapazole. Maybe they can try PTU. Definately check with your doctor! Holly back again Been reading but haven't posted for a week. Whew! What a lot to learn! You are more helpful than my MD has been! 3 weeks now on Tap and here's the scorecard...chest, back and neck covered with rash...swelling in legs and ankles to the point where they look deformed...18 pound weight gain in 2 1/2 weeks, goiter has shrunk but feeling like I have a hand around my neck. Good news...resting heart rate back down to 69 after 3 weeks of atenolol - Yeah! Canned doctor for wanting to put me on RAI so quickly after I complained of side effects of Tap (thanks Jody!) MD had me on thee Tap pills a day and now have dropped to two so we'll see. Want my old body back, want my energy back, hate this AHHHHHHHH. (Jody said I could rage if I needed to) Am starting a light weight training routine today...slowly but surely....need to see some muscle tone again or I'll scream! I feel like Ive aged 10 years in 2 months. Im glad I have you guys to share this with. Thanks - that was my GD outburst for the day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 20, 2002 Report Share Posted October 20, 2002 Welcome back, Laa!!! : ) Hooray!!! I'm curious about your revision... if you care to share details, I would be interested. I'm considering it, myself. Will you still have the revision sometime post-partum? The fears of weight gain are SOOOOOO normal, and they are tormenting!!! I remember so vividly. Make sure you take your calcium and prenatals, and get plenty to drink, and don't go berserk with stuff you know isn't good for you anyway. -- K " Parents don't want justice, they want quiet. " -Bill Cosby Ready to FLY? Try http://www.flylady.net Sick of FLYing? http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~pyang/flash/miniputt.swf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 20, 2002 Report Share Posted October 20, 2002 Welcome back, Laa!!! : ) Hooray!!! I'm curious about your revision... if you care to share details, I would be interested. I'm considering it, myself. Will you still have the revision sometime post-partum? The fears of weight gain are SOOOOOO normal, and they are tormenting!!! I remember so vividly. Make sure you take your calcium and prenatals, and get plenty to drink, and don't go berserk with stuff you know isn't good for you anyway. -- K " Parents don't want justice, they want quiet. " -Bill Cosby Ready to FLY? Try http://www.flylady.net Sick of FLYing? http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~pyang/flash/miniputt.swf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2002 Report Share Posted October 21, 2002 Thanks :-) My OB is presently trying to schedule my revision to be done at the same time they do the c-section (the hospital is bringing WLS surgery as part of one of their programs). If that is not possible then the surgeon that was scheduled to do my revision will do it 8 weeks after delivery. I realized something was wrong around Jan. or Feb. when I all of a sudden had a 20 pound weight gain. Paranoid as most of us get over gaining weight I had to first find a new surgeon (mine had retired) that would see me without automatically wanting to do a revision because they were comfortable with a RNY versus a VBG. I had to demand an upper GI so that someone could look and see and while having the test the radiologist told me then that it looked like the staple lining a partially ruptured. I would feel much better about the whole thing if I had it fixed because it does worry me about staples moving around in there on their own. I really hope that I can get both done at the same time. Hope this answered your question about my revision if not please feel free to email me. Thanks Laa Re: Back again > Welcome back, Laa!!! : ) Hooray!!! > > I'm curious about your revision... if you care to share details, I would be > interested. I'm considering it, myself. Will you still have the revision > sometime post-partum? > > The fears of weight gain are SOOOOOO normal, and they are tormenting!!! I > remember so vividly. Make sure you take your calcium and prenatals, and get > plenty to drink, and don't go berserk with stuff you know isn't good for you > anyway. > > > -- K > > " Parents don't > want justice, > they want > quiet. " > -Bill Cosby > > Ready to FLY? Try http://www.flylady.net > Sick of FLYing? http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~pyang/flash/miniputt.swf > > > > Children are a blessing, and a gift from the Lord. -Psalm 127:3 > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Hi there! welcome back!! I don't agree with your therapist. There is something incredibly strong about deciding to say nothing - because you have nothing left to say. That's what I did when I went NC, and by saying nothing I sent the strongest message of my entire life. Believe me - they got the message. As if I'd sent it certified mail. Think of the religious and political leaders who have made their most powerful stands by saying nothing - Jesus, Ghandi, Buddah. . .. I wonder if your therapist doesn't know BPDs? Why put yourself through the rage? They stir up all that emotion and then they forget what they do. . . and probably won't even remember it anyway. Remember, the emotional levels they live with destroys their memory (to put it simply) and the rest they distort. You might say I don't want to talk to you anymore, and the next thing you know she's telling the cops you threatened her life. I've seen it happen a million times. . . I'm entrigued by this charismatic BPD you guys are familiar with. My nada is the opposite of charisma. She's unsophisicated but puts on a faux sophistication act, unintelligent but pseudo intellectual, unattractive, enormously overweight, and has a super bizarre way of dressing/styling her hair that pretty much defies gravity. Still, she draws people into her trap - I'm like, how did you miss the 300 pound woman with bright red hair sticking out all over her head every direction like a wanna be punk rocker - in a small town in the great american west? How did you not notice something different about her? I'm so confused... Hugs and welcome back, girlscout > > > no, I really don't think it's necessary at all to take a stand, but that is > just me.i was thinking tonight about how i would like to just disappear out > of here one day. everything that needs to be said has been said a thousand > times. they don't see boundaries as real so to them it would just be an > excuse to flip out and have a meltdown, say a bunch of things that would get > in your head and you would have to hear over and over in there and then you > might get tempted to be hoovered back in. it might not work out very well > for you. > > I think being avoidant is what LC/NC is all about. If it's working for you > I don't see the point in stirring up a big confrontation. Hugs. > > > > > > > Hi everyone! > > You may or may not remember me. I stopped posting about a year ago when > my life got super busy (but in a good way). > > > > For those of you who don't remember me I'll try to sum it up. > > I'm a 27 yr old sort of single mom (I'll get to that) of an 8 yr old DD. > I will graduate with my BA in psych in December and then am going for my MA > in counseling. > > I raised my sister from the time she was 15. She's now 21 and LC with our > BP Nada. We have a 24 yr old brother who just got out of prison last month. > I tried to do the same for him that I did for my sister but he stole from me > and lied when he lived in my home. He moved out at 17, left for hawaii, > stole a car, and has been in and out of jail since. > > > > Our Nada is mostly Queen/Waif, but can pull out the Witch at any given > moment. The story of my Nada is too long to detail. I suppose the key points > are that she is still married to her most recent husband(#5) but has been > separated for 2 yrs when she moved across the state to be closer to me. I > did NOT want her to move closer. She believes she is destined to have a > career in music and is actively pursuing it. She always blamed her children > for her lack of success and that is still the case. She is highly jealous of > me as the oldest daughter. She's always been super critical of her daughters > weight/ hair/ appearance/ you name it. The odd thing, that I'm sure you are > all familiar with, is that despite her nastiness she is a very charismatic > charming woman. > > > > I've been trying for as long as I can remember to find balance between > limiting contact but still keeping her in my life. > > > > About 2 years ago I ended a relationship with a man who has NPD. That > relationship made me realize just how deeply my Nada had programmed me to > destroy myself for the benefit of others. Even with that realization I > didn't cut her out completely. I wanted to be forgiving and mature. > > > > So now for the new stuff and the things I'd like advice on: > > > > I'm now in the most wonderful relationship of my life. This man is truly > so wonderful. He knows about Nada and is nothing but supportive. I plan to > marry him but am still working on what a marriage is supposed to look like > and how to let him take care of me without feeling I am taking advantage of > him as I saw Nada do with every man she ever encountered. > > The longer I'm with him the nastier Nada becomes. I haven't spoken to her > in 2 months. She calls and I just don't answer. I want to go NC now. I > finally want to cut all ties and let her go. My therapist is telling me I am > being avoidant and that if I'm truly going NC I need to be assertive about > it. I'm not really sure what if anything I should do. I know the fury I will > be met with if I tell her anything and I know that she won't hear anything I > have to say. I also know that if I don't make it clear she will continue to > guilt me into speaking to her eventually. > > > > Do you think that " taking a stand " so to speak is a good way to go NC? If > you didn't tell your individual with BPD that you were going NC how do you > deal with the attempts to contact and the flying monkies? > > > > Sorry for the long post. > > Thanks in advance for any thoughts > > Riah > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Hi there! welcome back!! I don't agree with your therapist. There is something incredibly strong about deciding to say nothing - because you have nothing left to say. That's what I did when I went NC, and by saying nothing I sent the strongest message of my entire life. Believe me - they got the message. As if I'd sent it certified mail. Think of the religious and political leaders who have made their most powerful stands by saying nothing - Jesus, Ghandi, Buddah. . .. I wonder if your therapist doesn't know BPDs? Why put yourself through the rage? They stir up all that emotion and then they forget what they do. . . and probably won't even remember it anyway. Remember, the emotional levels they live with destroys their memory (to put it simply) and the rest they distort. You might say I don't want to talk to you anymore, and the next thing you know she's telling the cops you threatened her life. I've seen it happen a million times. . . I'm entrigued by this charismatic BPD you guys are familiar with. My nada is the opposite of charisma. She's unsophisicated but puts on a faux sophistication act, unintelligent but pseudo intellectual, unattractive, enormously overweight, and has a super bizarre way of dressing/styling her hair that pretty much defies gravity. Still, she draws people into her trap - I'm like, how did you miss the 300 pound woman with bright red hair sticking out all over her head every direction like a wanna be punk rocker - in a small town in the great american west? How did you not notice something different about her? I'm so confused... Hugs and welcome back, girlscout > > > no, I really don't think it's necessary at all to take a stand, but that is > just me.i was thinking tonight about how i would like to just disappear out > of here one day. everything that needs to be said has been said a thousand > times. they don't see boundaries as real so to them it would just be an > excuse to flip out and have a meltdown, say a bunch of things that would get > in your head and you would have to hear over and over in there and then you > might get tempted to be hoovered back in. it might not work out very well > for you. > > I think being avoidant is what LC/NC is all about. If it's working for you > I don't see the point in stirring up a big confrontation. Hugs. > > > > > > > Hi everyone! > > You may or may not remember me. I stopped posting about a year ago when > my life got super busy (but in a good way). > > > > For those of you who don't remember me I'll try to sum it up. > > I'm a 27 yr old sort of single mom (I'll get to that) of an 8 yr old DD. > I will graduate with my BA in psych in December and then am going for my MA > in counseling. > > I raised my sister from the time she was 15. She's now 21 and LC with our > BP Nada. We have a 24 yr old brother who just got out of prison last month. > I tried to do the same for him that I did for my sister but he stole from me > and lied when he lived in my home. He moved out at 17, left for hawaii, > stole a car, and has been in and out of jail since. > > > > Our Nada is mostly Queen/Waif, but can pull out the Witch at any given > moment. The story of my Nada is too long to detail. I suppose the key points > are that she is still married to her most recent husband(#5) but has been > separated for 2 yrs when she moved across the state to be closer to me. I > did NOT want her to move closer. She believes she is destined to have a > career in music and is actively pursuing it. She always blamed her children > for her lack of success and that is still the case. She is highly jealous of > me as the oldest daughter. She's always been super critical of her daughters > weight/ hair/ appearance/ you name it. The odd thing, that I'm sure you are > all familiar with, is that despite her nastiness she is a very charismatic > charming woman. > > > > I've been trying for as long as I can remember to find balance between > limiting contact but still keeping her in my life. > > > > About 2 years ago I ended a relationship with a man who has NPD. That > relationship made me realize just how deeply my Nada had programmed me to > destroy myself for the benefit of others. Even with that realization I > didn't cut her out completely. I wanted to be forgiving and mature. > > > > So now for the new stuff and the things I'd like advice on: > > > > I'm now in the most wonderful relationship of my life. This man is truly > so wonderful. He knows about Nada and is nothing but supportive. I plan to > marry him but am still working on what a marriage is supposed to look like > and how to let him take care of me without feeling I am taking advantage of > him as I saw Nada do with every man she ever encountered. > > The longer I'm with him the nastier Nada becomes. I haven't spoken to her > in 2 months. She calls and I just don't answer. I want to go NC now. I > finally want to cut all ties and let her go. My therapist is telling me I am > being avoidant and that if I'm truly going NC I need to be assertive about > it. I'm not really sure what if anything I should do. I know the fury I will > be met with if I tell her anything and I know that she won't hear anything I > have to say. I also know that if I don't make it clear she will continue to > guilt me into speaking to her eventually. > > > > Do you think that " taking a stand " so to speak is a good way to go NC? If > you didn't tell your individual with BPD that you were going NC how do you > deal with the attempts to contact and the flying monkies? > > > > Sorry for the long post. > > Thanks in advance for any thoughts > > Riah > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Hi there! welcome back!! I don't agree with your therapist. There is something incredibly strong about deciding to say nothing - because you have nothing left to say. That's what I did when I went NC, and by saying nothing I sent the strongest message of my entire life. Believe me - they got the message. As if I'd sent it certified mail. Think of the religious and political leaders who have made their most powerful stands by saying nothing - Jesus, Ghandi, Buddah. . .. I wonder if your therapist doesn't know BPDs? Why put yourself through the rage? They stir up all that emotion and then they forget what they do. . . and probably won't even remember it anyway. Remember, the emotional levels they live with destroys their memory (to put it simply) and the rest they distort. You might say I don't want to talk to you anymore, and the next thing you know she's telling the cops you threatened her life. I've seen it happen a million times. . . I'm entrigued by this charismatic BPD you guys are familiar with. My nada is the opposite of charisma. She's unsophisicated but puts on a faux sophistication act, unintelligent but pseudo intellectual, unattractive, enormously overweight, and has a super bizarre way of dressing/styling her hair that pretty much defies gravity. Still, she draws people into her trap - I'm like, how did you miss the 300 pound woman with bright red hair sticking out all over her head every direction like a wanna be punk rocker - in a small town in the great american west? How did you not notice something different about her? I'm so confused... Hugs and welcome back, girlscout > > > no, I really don't think it's necessary at all to take a stand, but that is > just me.i was thinking tonight about how i would like to just disappear out > of here one day. everything that needs to be said has been said a thousand > times. they don't see boundaries as real so to them it would just be an > excuse to flip out and have a meltdown, say a bunch of things that would get > in your head and you would have to hear over and over in there and then you > might get tempted to be hoovered back in. it might not work out very well > for you. > > I think being avoidant is what LC/NC is all about. If it's working for you > I don't see the point in stirring up a big confrontation. Hugs. > > > > > > > Hi everyone! > > You may or may not remember me. I stopped posting about a year ago when > my life got super busy (but in a good way). > > > > For those of you who don't remember me I'll try to sum it up. > > I'm a 27 yr old sort of single mom (I'll get to that) of an 8 yr old DD. > I will graduate with my BA in psych in December and then am going for my MA > in counseling. > > I raised my sister from the time she was 15. She's now 21 and LC with our > BP Nada. We have a 24 yr old brother who just got out of prison last month. > I tried to do the same for him that I did for my sister but he stole from me > and lied when he lived in my home. He moved out at 17, left for hawaii, > stole a car, and has been in and out of jail since. > > > > Our Nada is mostly Queen/Waif, but can pull out the Witch at any given > moment. The story of my Nada is too long to detail. I suppose the key points > are that she is still married to her most recent husband(#5) but has been > separated for 2 yrs when she moved across the state to be closer to me. I > did NOT want her to move closer. She believes she is destined to have a > career in music and is actively pursuing it. She always blamed her children > for her lack of success and that is still the case. She is highly jealous of > me as the oldest daughter. She's always been super critical of her daughters > weight/ hair/ appearance/ you name it. The odd thing, that I'm sure you are > all familiar with, is that despite her nastiness she is a very charismatic > charming woman. > > > > I've been trying for as long as I can remember to find balance between > limiting contact but still keeping her in my life. > > > > About 2 years ago I ended a relationship with a man who has NPD. That > relationship made me realize just how deeply my Nada had programmed me to > destroy myself for the benefit of others. Even with that realization I > didn't cut her out completely. I wanted to be forgiving and mature. > > > > So now for the new stuff and the things I'd like advice on: > > > > I'm now in the most wonderful relationship of my life. This man is truly > so wonderful. He knows about Nada and is nothing but supportive. I plan to > marry him but am still working on what a marriage is supposed to look like > and how to let him take care of me without feeling I am taking advantage of > him as I saw Nada do with every man she ever encountered. > > The longer I'm with him the nastier Nada becomes. I haven't spoken to her > in 2 months. She calls and I just don't answer. I want to go NC now. I > finally want to cut all ties and let her go. My therapist is telling me I am > being avoidant and that if I'm truly going NC I need to be assertive about > it. I'm not really sure what if anything I should do. I know the fury I will > be met with if I tell her anything and I know that she won't hear anything I > have to say. I also know that if I don't make it clear she will continue to > guilt me into speaking to her eventually. > > > > Do you think that " taking a stand " so to speak is a good way to go NC? If > you didn't tell your individual with BPD that you were going NC how do you > deal with the attempts to contact and the flying monkies? > > > > Sorry for the long post. > > Thanks in advance for any thoughts > > Riah > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Just because you don't respond or say the same thing for the 10 billionth time does not mean you are not taking a stand! You are very clearly taking a stand by not answering to her. If you feel compelled by all means tell her your intentions, but my guess is it wont be anything that you haven't already said. As for the flying monkeys, same thing, ignore them if necessary. If they cannot accept and respect your choice then bye bye flying monkeys and no you don't have to give them a reason either. At least this is what I would do/have done. Congratulations on your new and improved relationship! I am very happy for you. It can only get better now with nada gone. LB > > > > Hi everyone! > > You may or may not remember me. I stopped posting about a year ago when my life got super busy (but in a good way). > > > > For those of you who don't remember me I'll try to sum it up. > > I'm a 27 yr old sort of single mom (I'll get to that) of an 8 yr old DD. I will graduate with my BA in psych in December and then am going for my MA in counseling. > > I raised my sister from the time she was 15. She's now 21 and LC with our BP Nada. We have a 24 yr old brother who just got out of prison last month. I tried to do the same for him that I did for my sister but he stole from me and lied when he lived in my home. He moved out at 17, left for hawaii, stole a car, and has been in and out of jail since. > > > > Our Nada is mostly Queen/Waif, but can pull out the Witch at any given moment. The story of my Nada is too long to detail. I suppose the key points are that she is still married to her most recent husband(#5) but has been separated for 2 yrs when she moved across the state to be closer to me. I did NOT want her to move closer. She believes she is destined to have a career in music and is actively pursuing it. She always blamed her children for her lack of success and that is still the case. She is highly jealous of me as the oldest daughter. She's always been super critical of her daughters weight/ hair/ appearance/ you name it. The odd thing, that I'm sure you are all familiar with, is that despite her nastiness she is a very charismatic charming woman. > > > > I've been trying for as long as I can remember to find balance between limiting contact but still keeping her in my life. > > > > About 2 years ago I ended a relationship with a man who has NPD. That relationship made me realize just how deeply my Nada had programmed me to destroy myself for the benefit of others. Even with that realization I didn't cut her out completely. I wanted to be forgiving and mature. > > > > So now for the new stuff and the things I'd like advice on: > > > > I'm now in the most wonderful relationship of my life. This man is truly so wonderful. He knows about Nada and is nothing but supportive. I plan to marry him but am still working on what a marriage is supposed to look like and how to let him take care of me without feeling I am taking advantage of him as I saw Nada do with every man she ever encountered. > > The longer I'm with him the nastier Nada becomes. I haven't spoken to her in 2 months. She calls and I just don't answer. I want to go NC now. I finally want to cut all ties and let her go. My therapist is telling me I am being avoidant and that if I'm truly going NC I need to be assertive about it. I'm not really sure what if anything I should do. I know the fury I will be met with if I tell her anything and I know that she won't hear anything I have to say. I also know that if I don't make it clear she will continue to guilt me into speaking to her eventually. > > > > Do you think that " taking a stand " so to speak is a good way to go NC? If you didn't tell your individual with BPD that you were going NC how do you deal with the attempts to contact and the flying monkies? > > > > Sorry for the long post. > > Thanks in advance for any thoughts > > Riah > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Just because you don't respond or say the same thing for the 10 billionth time does not mean you are not taking a stand! You are very clearly taking a stand by not answering to her. If you feel compelled by all means tell her your intentions, but my guess is it wont be anything that you haven't already said. As for the flying monkeys, same thing, ignore them if necessary. If they cannot accept and respect your choice then bye bye flying monkeys and no you don't have to give them a reason either. At least this is what I would do/have done. Congratulations on your new and improved relationship! I am very happy for you. It can only get better now with nada gone. LB > > > > Hi everyone! > > You may or may not remember me. I stopped posting about a year ago when my life got super busy (but in a good way). > > > > For those of you who don't remember me I'll try to sum it up. > > I'm a 27 yr old sort of single mom (I'll get to that) of an 8 yr old DD. I will graduate with my BA in psych in December and then am going for my MA in counseling. > > I raised my sister from the time she was 15. She's now 21 and LC with our BP Nada. We have a 24 yr old brother who just got out of prison last month. I tried to do the same for him that I did for my sister but he stole from me and lied when he lived in my home. He moved out at 17, left for hawaii, stole a car, and has been in and out of jail since. > > > > Our Nada is mostly Queen/Waif, but can pull out the Witch at any given moment. The story of my Nada is too long to detail. I suppose the key points are that she is still married to her most recent husband(#5) but has been separated for 2 yrs when she moved across the state to be closer to me. I did NOT want her to move closer. She believes she is destined to have a career in music and is actively pursuing it. She always blamed her children for her lack of success and that is still the case. She is highly jealous of me as the oldest daughter. She's always been super critical of her daughters weight/ hair/ appearance/ you name it. The odd thing, that I'm sure you are all familiar with, is that despite her nastiness she is a very charismatic charming woman. > > > > I've been trying for as long as I can remember to find balance between limiting contact but still keeping her in my life. > > > > About 2 years ago I ended a relationship with a man who has NPD. That relationship made me realize just how deeply my Nada had programmed me to destroy myself for the benefit of others. Even with that realization I didn't cut her out completely. I wanted to be forgiving and mature. > > > > So now for the new stuff and the things I'd like advice on: > > > > I'm now in the most wonderful relationship of my life. This man is truly so wonderful. He knows about Nada and is nothing but supportive. I plan to marry him but am still working on what a marriage is supposed to look like and how to let him take care of me without feeling I am taking advantage of him as I saw Nada do with every man she ever encountered. > > The longer I'm with him the nastier Nada becomes. I haven't spoken to her in 2 months. She calls and I just don't answer. I want to go NC now. I finally want to cut all ties and let her go. My therapist is telling me I am being avoidant and that if I'm truly going NC I need to be assertive about it. I'm not really sure what if anything I should do. I know the fury I will be met with if I tell her anything and I know that she won't hear anything I have to say. I also know that if I don't make it clear she will continue to guilt me into speaking to her eventually. > > > > Do you think that " taking a stand " so to speak is a good way to go NC? If you didn't tell your individual with BPD that you were going NC how do you deal with the attempts to contact and the flying monkies? > > > > Sorry for the long post. > > Thanks in advance for any thoughts > > Riah > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Riah - Hi, and welcome back! I do remember your posts. It sounds counter-intuitive to just go NC without some kind of confrontation, especially when Nadas are persistent and keep coming after you. I can see how therapists who haven't really " been there " would tell you to stand up to them, voice your intention, etc. And normally, that would make a lot of sense, both for you and for Nada. But what is missing is this concept of Nada as a toddler. When taking some action that toddlers will resist, you can make some " transitional " announcements (after you finish lunch, it will be naptime), but then you don't spend a lot of time discussing or explaining that it's naptime. You just say, " Naptime! " and pick up the child and put him in bed with his blanket. The most effective way to deal with the crying and refusal to nap is to become completely boring and repetitive - " Naptime! " - then you leave the room, and repeat as often as necessary until the toddler finally gives up and takes a nap. If we were able to explain what we plan to do (NC/LC) and why, and have Nada accept and understand it, we wouldn't be having these problems, because we'd be dealing with a rational adult. Since Nada is neither rational nor grown-up, it's just easier to announce the boundaries, then enforce them with no further explanation. At some point, you just want the toddler to take the damned nap. > > Hi everyone! > You may or may not remember me. I stopped posting about a year ago when my life got super busy (but in a good way). > > For those of you who don't remember me I'll try to sum it up. > I'm a 27 yr old sort of single mom (I'll get to that) of an 8 yr old DD. I will graduate with my BA in psych in December and then am going for my MA in counseling. > I raised my sister from the time she was 15. She's now 21 and LC with our BP Nada. We have a 24 yr old brother who just got out of prison last month. I tried to do the same for him that I did for my sister but he stole from me and lied when he lived in my home. He moved out at 17, left for hawaii, stole a car, and has been in and out of jail since. > > Our Nada is mostly Queen/Waif, but can pull out the Witch at any given moment. The story of my Nada is too long to detail. I suppose the key points are that she is still married to her most recent husband(#5) but has been separated for 2 yrs when she moved across the state to be closer to me. I did NOT want her to move closer. She believes she is destined to have a career in music and is actively pursuing it. She always blamed her children for her lack of success and that is still the case. She is highly jealous of me as the oldest daughter. She's always been super critical of her daughters weight/ hair/ appearance/ you name it. The odd thing, that I'm sure you are all familiar with, is that despite her nastiness she is a very charismatic charming woman. > > I've been trying for as long as I can remember to find balance between limiting contact but still keeping her in my life. > > About 2 years ago I ended a relationship with a man who has NPD. That relationship made me realize just how deeply my Nada had programmed me to destroy myself for the benefit of others. Even with that realization I didn't cut her out completely. I wanted to be forgiving and mature. > > So now for the new stuff and the things I'd like advice on: > > I'm now in the most wonderful relationship of my life. This man is truly so wonderful. He knows about Nada and is nothing but supportive. I plan to marry him but am still working on what a marriage is supposed to look like and how to let him take care of me without feeling I am taking advantage of him as I saw Nada do with every man she ever encountered. > The longer I'm with him the nastier Nada becomes. I haven't spoken to her in 2 months. She calls and I just don't answer. I want to go NC now. I finally want to cut all ties and let her go. My therapist is telling me I am being avoidant and that if I'm truly going NC I need to be assertive about it. I'm not really sure what if anything I should do. I know the fury I will be met with if I tell her anything and I know that she won't hear anything I have to say. I also know that if I don't make it clear she will continue to guilt me into speaking to her eventually. > > Do you think that " taking a stand " so to speak is a good way to go NC? If you didn't tell your individual with BPD that you were going NC how do you deal with the attempts to contact and the flying monkies? > > Sorry for the long post. > Thanks in advance for any thoughts > Riah > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Riah - Hi, and welcome back! I do remember your posts. It sounds counter-intuitive to just go NC without some kind of confrontation, especially when Nadas are persistent and keep coming after you. I can see how therapists who haven't really " been there " would tell you to stand up to them, voice your intention, etc. And normally, that would make a lot of sense, both for you and for Nada. But what is missing is this concept of Nada as a toddler. When taking some action that toddlers will resist, you can make some " transitional " announcements (after you finish lunch, it will be naptime), but then you don't spend a lot of time discussing or explaining that it's naptime. You just say, " Naptime! " and pick up the child and put him in bed with his blanket. The most effective way to deal with the crying and refusal to nap is to become completely boring and repetitive - " Naptime! " - then you leave the room, and repeat as often as necessary until the toddler finally gives up and takes a nap. If we were able to explain what we plan to do (NC/LC) and why, and have Nada accept and understand it, we wouldn't be having these problems, because we'd be dealing with a rational adult. Since Nada is neither rational nor grown-up, it's just easier to announce the boundaries, then enforce them with no further explanation. At some point, you just want the toddler to take the damned nap. > > Hi everyone! > You may or may not remember me. I stopped posting about a year ago when my life got super busy (but in a good way). > > For those of you who don't remember me I'll try to sum it up. > I'm a 27 yr old sort of single mom (I'll get to that) of an 8 yr old DD. I will graduate with my BA in psych in December and then am going for my MA in counseling. > I raised my sister from the time she was 15. She's now 21 and LC with our BP Nada. We have a 24 yr old brother who just got out of prison last month. I tried to do the same for him that I did for my sister but he stole from me and lied when he lived in my home. He moved out at 17, left for hawaii, stole a car, and has been in and out of jail since. > > Our Nada is mostly Queen/Waif, but can pull out the Witch at any given moment. The story of my Nada is too long to detail. I suppose the key points are that she is still married to her most recent husband(#5) but has been separated for 2 yrs when she moved across the state to be closer to me. I did NOT want her to move closer. She believes she is destined to have a career in music and is actively pursuing it. She always blamed her children for her lack of success and that is still the case. She is highly jealous of me as the oldest daughter. She's always been super critical of her daughters weight/ hair/ appearance/ you name it. The odd thing, that I'm sure you are all familiar with, is that despite her nastiness she is a very charismatic charming woman. > > I've been trying for as long as I can remember to find balance between limiting contact but still keeping her in my life. > > About 2 years ago I ended a relationship with a man who has NPD. That relationship made me realize just how deeply my Nada had programmed me to destroy myself for the benefit of others. Even with that realization I didn't cut her out completely. I wanted to be forgiving and mature. > > So now for the new stuff and the things I'd like advice on: > > I'm now in the most wonderful relationship of my life. This man is truly so wonderful. He knows about Nada and is nothing but supportive. I plan to marry him but am still working on what a marriage is supposed to look like and how to let him take care of me without feeling I am taking advantage of him as I saw Nada do with every man she ever encountered. > The longer I'm with him the nastier Nada becomes. I haven't spoken to her in 2 months. She calls and I just don't answer. I want to go NC now. I finally want to cut all ties and let her go. My therapist is telling me I am being avoidant and that if I'm truly going NC I need to be assertive about it. I'm not really sure what if anything I should do. I know the fury I will be met with if I tell her anything and I know that she won't hear anything I have to say. I also know that if I don't make it clear she will continue to guilt me into speaking to her eventually. > > Do you think that " taking a stand " so to speak is a good way to go NC? If you didn't tell your individual with BPD that you were going NC how do you deal with the attempts to contact and the flying monkies? > > Sorry for the long post. > Thanks in advance for any thoughts > Riah > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2010 Report Share Posted September 1, 2010 Joe - How much longer until you finish school? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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