Re: Gender attack ---- and how does nada choose the golden

[Guest guest]

Mia wrote:

I've often wondered - am I the only KO who had no desire to reproduce? I

> > know a lot of that came from my nada. But am I really the only one?

> >

Mia, I'm sure there are a lot of KO's who do not wish to reproduce. I was not

one of them, but I repeatedly find myself asking my sons if they were abused as

children. They say no. I had a good husband and when he caught me repeating

patterns of abuse that I experienced he put a stop to it. What strikes me as

uncanny is how many times I've come across a post on this site from other KO's

who intimate that their BP parents shouldn't have had children. I thought I was

the only one who wished I hadn't been born, but I come across this on our site a

lot. One time I made the comment to my mother-in-law that Fada should never have

had children and (she never raised her voice, but she did this times) she yelled

at me and said don't ever say that, what would we have done without you and your

three boys. I am crying now as I think of it. So if many of us feel our parents

shouldn't have procreated I'm sure there is nothing wrong with being afraid to

procreate yourself.

Remember we are all working towards healing. If you don't feel that you have

healed enough it is understandable and commendable that you do not want

children. I work with a woman who was abused as a child and she never wanted

children for fear that she would abuse them, but she is a wonderful teacher and

has helped hundreds of kids.

When my sons were in school I practically adopted one of their friends who I now

know is a fellow KO, and quite frankly now that he is an adult is my friend not

my son's. There are a thousand opportunities to reach out to children without

having one of your own and you may find that even small kindnesses can make a

difference.

Just don't beat yourself up!

Love, love, love and remember we are all healing here!

Kay

[Guest guest]

Mia wrote:

I've often wondered - am I the only KO who had no desire to reproduce? I

> > know a lot of that came from my nada. But am I really the only one?

> >

Mia, I'm sure there are a lot of KO's who do not wish to reproduce. I was not

one of them, but I repeatedly find myself asking my sons if they were abused as

children. They say no. I had a good husband and when he caught me repeating

patterns of abuse that I experienced he put a stop to it. What strikes me as

uncanny is how many times I've come across a post on this site from other KO's

who intimate that their BP parents shouldn't have had children. I thought I was

the only one who wished I hadn't been born, but I come across this on our site a

lot. One time I made the comment to my mother-in-law that Fada should never have

had children and (she never raised her voice, but she did this times) she yelled

at me and said don't ever say that, what would we have done without you and your

three boys. I am crying now as I think of it. So if many of us feel our parents

shouldn't have procreated I'm sure there is nothing wrong with being afraid to

procreate yourself.

Remember we are all working towards healing. If you don't feel that you have

healed enough it is understandable and commendable that you do not want

children. I work with a woman who was abused as a child and she never wanted

children for fear that she would abuse them, but she is a wonderful teacher and

has helped hundreds of kids.

When my sons were in school I practically adopted one of their friends who I now

know is a fellow KO, and quite frankly now that he is an adult is my friend not

my son's. There are a thousand opportunities to reach out to children without

having one of your own and you may find that even small kindnesses can make a

difference.

Just don't beat yourself up!

Love, love, love and remember we are all healing here!

Kay

[Guest guest]

" I thought I was the only one who wished I hadn't been born "

Yes, exactly exactly exactly exactly.

In fact, when I lived with my FOO, my brother would attack me and I'd say

" what did I do? " He would say every time " You were born. " Its kind of

chilling to imagine this coming out of a 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 year olds mouth

while he beats on another, younger, more vulnerable kid.Maybe you had to

hear the hatred in the way he said it.

And that was pretty damn accurate. To hear my mother tell it, it was very

offensive to him when i came home from the hospital so she " gave me to my

dad " that day and never looked back. And then instead of working with my

brother to accept me, she fed his negative feelings toward me and used him

as a weapon to beat me down. Why? Because I was born.

It is so confusing to me. i'm not the one who wanted a child. I'm not the

one who had sex and got knocked up. She was. So why did I have to pay for

it? She is the one who made me be born, not me. It was her choice and not

something I have ever wanted.

UGH. I think this will be a topic to discuss with my T.

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 10:27 PM, anuria67854 wrote:

>

>

> I just didn't trust myself enough to have children; I was too afraid that I

> was too much like my nada, or that I'd " turn into " my nada and abuse a

> husband and a child the way I was abused, and maybe even worse! The thought

> of turning into my nada sickened me, and I believed for most of my life that

> it was inevitable. So, if it was inevitable, the least I could do was not

> repeat the cycle of abuse.

>

> Yet, my younger Sister (the mostly scapegoated sib) wanted very strongly to

> have a child, and she did, and she did a great job with him. She was a darn

> good Mom. And guess what?

> I made a darn good Auntie!

>

> So, it worked out OK.

>

> -Annie

>

>

>

> >

> > I've often wondered - am I the only KO who had no desire to reproduce? I

> > > > know a lot of that came from my nada. But am I really the only one?

> > > >

> > Mia, I'm sure there are a lot of KO's who do not wish to reproduce. I was

> not one of them, but I repeatedly find myself asking my sons if they were

> abused as children. They say no. I had a good husband and when he caught me

> repeating patterns of abuse that I experienced he put a stop to it. What

> strikes me as uncanny is how many times I've come across a post on this site

> from other KO's who intimate that their BP parents shouldn't have had

> children. I thought I was the only one who wished I hadn't been born, but I

> come across this on our site a lot. One time I made the comment to my

> mother-in-law that Fada should never have had children and (she never raised

> her voice, but she did this times) she yelled at me and said don't ever say

> that, what would we have done without you and your three boys. I am crying

> now as I think of it. So if many of us feel our parents shouldn't have

> procreated I'm sure there is nothing wrong with being afraid to procreate

> yourself.

> > Remember we are all working towards healing. If you don't feel that you

> have healed enough it is understandable and commendable that you do not want

> children. I work with a woman who was abused as a child and she never wanted

> children for fear that she would abuse them, but she is a wonderful teacher

> and has helped hundreds of kids.

> > When my sons were in school I practically adopted one of their friends

> who I now know is a fellow KO, and quite frankly now that he is an adult is

> my friend not my son's. There are a thousand opportunities to reach out to

> children without having one of your own and you may find that even small

> kindnesses can make a difference.

> > Just don't beat yourself up!

> > Love, love, love and remember we are all healing here!

> > Kay

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

" I thought I was the only one who wished I hadn't been born "

Yes, exactly exactly exactly exactly.

In fact, when I lived with my FOO, my brother would attack me and I'd say

" what did I do? " He would say every time " You were born. " Its kind of

chilling to imagine this coming out of a 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 year olds mouth

while he beats on another, younger, more vulnerable kid.Maybe you had to

hear the hatred in the way he said it.

And that was pretty damn accurate. To hear my mother tell it, it was very

offensive to him when i came home from the hospital so she " gave me to my

dad " that day and never looked back. And then instead of working with my

brother to accept me, she fed his negative feelings toward me and used him

as a weapon to beat me down. Why? Because I was born.

It is so confusing to me. i'm not the one who wanted a child. I'm not the

one who had sex and got knocked up. She was. So why did I have to pay for

it? She is the one who made me be born, not me. It was her choice and not

something I have ever wanted.

UGH. I think this will be a topic to discuss with my T.

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 10:27 PM, anuria67854 wrote:

>

>

> I just didn't trust myself enough to have children; I was too afraid that I

> was too much like my nada, or that I'd " turn into " my nada and abuse a

> husband and a child the way I was abused, and maybe even worse! The thought

> of turning into my nada sickened me, and I believed for most of my life that

> it was inevitable. So, if it was inevitable, the least I could do was not

> repeat the cycle of abuse.

>

> Yet, my younger Sister (the mostly scapegoated sib) wanted very strongly to

> have a child, and she did, and she did a great job with him. She was a darn

> good Mom. And guess what?

> I made a darn good Auntie!

>

> So, it worked out OK.

>

> -Annie

>

>

>

> >

> > I've often wondered - am I the only KO who had no desire to reproduce? I

> > > > know a lot of that came from my nada. But am I really the only one?

> > > >

> > Mia, I'm sure there are a lot of KO's who do not wish to reproduce. I was

> not one of them, but I repeatedly find myself asking my sons if they were

> abused as children. They say no. I had a good husband and when he caught me

> repeating patterns of abuse that I experienced he put a stop to it. What

> strikes me as uncanny is how many times I've come across a post on this site

> from other KO's who intimate that their BP parents shouldn't have had

> children. I thought I was the only one who wished I hadn't been born, but I

> come across this on our site a lot. One time I made the comment to my

> mother-in-law that Fada should never have had children and (she never raised

> her voice, but she did this times) she yelled at me and said don't ever say

> that, what would we have done without you and your three boys. I am crying

> now as I think of it. So if many of us feel our parents shouldn't have

> procreated I'm sure there is nothing wrong with being afraid to procreate

> yourself.

> > Remember we are all working towards healing. If you don't feel that you

> have healed enough it is understandable and commendable that you do not want

> children. I work with a woman who was abused as a child and she never wanted

> children for fear that she would abuse them, but she is a wonderful teacher

> and has helped hundreds of kids.

> > When my sons were in school I practically adopted one of their friends

> who I now know is a fellow KO, and quite frankly now that he is an adult is

> my friend not my son's. There are a thousand opportunities to reach out to

> children without having one of your own and you may find that even small

> kindnesses can make a difference.

> > Just don't beat yourself up!

> > Love, love, love and remember we are all healing here!

> > Kay

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Girlscout,yeah,I've also felt like I have a gender identity problem.And not

because I'd rather be a man.I'm a girly girl too and my issue has also been

that there was something wrong with that.

I was not allowed to actually *be* a little girl.I wasn't allowed to

cry.I wasn't allowed to show it if my feelings were hurt.I'd be threatened by

nada or ridiculed by fada and it's like in both cases they were treating me like

a boy who was acting like a " sissy " if I ever showed I was upset.

Nada's just freaking weird.Even when I briefly took ballet classes she

sent me to them in a t shirt and leggings,with my cut short hair,so I was like

the " boy " dancer in a class of girls in pink tutus.

My brother was allowed to be sensitive and to cry.He got hugs and was

indulged.

By the time I was seven,the vast majority of time,it didn't even occur

to me to cry.I cut open the bottom of my foot on a broken bottle the summer I

was seven walking barefoot in the field behind our house.My brother was with me

because I was taking him to the corner store to buy him a birthday toy with my

own money.*He* screamed and cried at my injury so loudly a neighbor thought he

was the one who was hurt.I was merely fascinated with the bloody footprints I

was making in the sand...At the hospital I insisted on watching as the doctor

stitched up my foot and he gave me a handful of lollipops for being so brave,he

said to nada that he'd never seen such a " completely rational " kid.

After I left home I wanted to reclaim my femininity because I *could*!

It felt liberating to buy myself dresses and heels and make up.But I often felt

strangely creepy dressed " girlie " out in public,like I wasn't supposed to be

doing that somehow but that only applied somehow to me.Other women doing the

same thing was all fine and normal *for them* but I felt this strange shame

about *me* that I couldn't understand.Like I was doing something " wrong " --I

rationalized that I was just afraid that if I was attacked that I'd be blamed

for " advertizing " although I knew that wasn't quite it.Then I'd get angry and

think: Eff that,if a guy attacks me I'll kick the shit out of him and if I get

blamed for the whole thing I will fight back against that too.Those thoughts

didn't resolve it for me though or do much to reduce that strange creepy

feeling.

To make things worse,when I was 18-22,I had joined a feminist collective

because I wanted to do political actions.This was in Paris where they love their

" manifestations " and the collective also did lots of protest actions against

various injustices.Most of the women in the collective,like 98 percent of

them,were as they called themselves " militant lesbians " ...This relates also to

what you were saying about people being weird and " attacking for any old

trait " ....I needed that collective to be a place where I found a sense of

belonging,as a young " lesbian " (which is how I identified at the time--not now

though).There were other young women in that collective who did find that sense

of " coming home " I wanted,but me...I was told *by all of them* that I was just

" going through a phase* (by lesbians! not by straight people!) and that I wasn't

" really a lesbian " .

" 's just hanging out here until she finds a husband " ,they

joked.

Why? Because I was too feminine.Because I wore eyeliner and mascara

and lipstick.Because I had long hair and was " pretty " .Because I wore dresses and

heels...To them,that was me capitulating to the dictates of the " patriarchy " in

some mindless fashion.For me,being able to *choose* to be feminine was

liberation,not " oppressing " myself.The opposite!!!!

And there was no effing way I was going to conform to some ridiculous

standard that someone else was imposing on me by giving in and dressing like

them.I'd rather stick out like a sore thumb than go along with the herd like

that...But it's just so ironic that I got revictimized for my femininity *by

women* when I had originally been victimized by nada who hates her own

femaleness so much she tried to obliterate mine.

Do you feel like it's easier for you to " be yourself " with men than with

women? Just curious.I do.For the longest time I was terrified of women but I've

mostly gotten over that.They can still strike fear in my heart,though,in a way

that no man can.And the other irony is that most of those " militant lesbians "

who thought they were so tough were pansies and whiners who went around feeling

like the " victims " of men while I wasn't afraid and refused in any circumstance

to become a victim (as I was in childhood).I was actually more " militant " than

they were.

This judging by appearances junk issues forth from the reptilian part

of our brains and it's a damned shame so many people function on a daily basis

from their reptile brain---but I think it's the origin of all the being damned

for being either attractive or unattractive and the damning is from so many

people only focusing on the surface and not seeing through to the deeper

truth.It can be crazy making to be bombarded like this with other people's

unreality.Especially for KO's who never got a break from it since we were born!

I think that as women we just cop more of it,too,being perceived more as

appearance than as who we are or what we do.I hate it when people " out in the

world " remind me of my nada traumas like that.